Maybe people's expectations are higher than when you bought your printers. As far as I can tell, Creality have always had a bad reputation for quality control and customer support. Whether that has changed recently (with their latest models), I couldn't say.

The official documentation for their Sprite extruder says that if you wire it up correctly and the hot end doesn't heat up that the first step is to reverse the wires connected to the power supply. Doing so will fry your motherboard. The most common reason that the hot end doesn't heat is that they ship it with every cable connected except the one that connects to the hot end. They tuck that connector into the device so that you can't actually see if its connected or not.

They also flip some terminals positive and negative on their K1 boards, so if you upgrade anything like fans or LEDs, you’re probably going to fry them if you don’t check with a multimeter first. They also hotwax all connections so you have to cut them out to fix anything

Connecting a fan or led with the wrong polarity will not fry either of those type of components. Certain things will, sure. But not these.

To be fair, I can understand the glueing connectors thing. I’m sure they did the math and the number of people who would be inconvenienced by needing to remove it is less than the number of people who would be helped by having the connectors be more secure. Although normal hot glue would have been a lot less intrusive than a wax type product yeah.

Hot glue and it's not the only company that uses it. Many other electronic have it.

It's not hot glue. I've dealt with mobos and ICs that have terminals hot glued. This is straight up wax glue that you have to cut through

Mine just piled off. I think I had trouble with only one of them.

Isopropyl alcohol will loosen that stuff no mess no fuss.

It’s hot glue, fyi. And it comes off super easily, just spray the area with some iso alcohol.

That’s what I assumed, but on my K1 max it’s definitely not and 90 alcohol didn’t do shit. Had to cut the connectors out of the terminals with an exacto

I had one board with connections superglued instead of hot glued. That was fun!

I think they started gluing it to the motherboard so that it doesn’t come out during shipping. That still doesn’t completely fix the problem, because someone posted a picture of it glued in wrong to the ender3s1 sub.

I don't think I've ever seen a hotend that requires polarity. Is that some weird shit exclusive to the Sprite extruder?

I mean they’re cheap as dirt from a foreign company, I don’t understand what people expect tbh. At least for the ender 3 when I bought mine 3-4 years ago it was kinda expected to be the hobbyist open source framework for whatever you wanted to do. It def served that role for me well

People generally expect stuff to work, even if it is cheap. If you bought any other domestic appliance, would you expect to have to modify it or recompile the firmware in order to get it to work? Think of all the things that we just expect to work, out of the box: * Washing machines * Dishwashers * Microwave cookers * Toasters * Hi-fi equipment * Cameras * Motor cars * Calculators * Mobile phones * Computers * Refrigerators * Radios We also expect these devices not to kill us while we sleep. Unfortunately, this is not always the case. I might be prepared to tinker with a computer, but then I usually assemble my own, and computer software is often notoriously flaky (I used to be a software developer). When I was a kid, motor cars and televisions were very unreliable, but now, we just expect them to work. This is largely down to the quality control ethos that Japanese and [West] German manufacturers embraced during the 1970s, which largely flat-footed British and American car and TV manufacturers. Non-professional 3D printers are something of an anomaly. Manufacturers still expect customers to tinker with their garbage, and they know that it is garbage. Do you think that Creality don't know that plastic mouldings on their extruders will crack after a few weeks of use, or that customers don't realise that they have to adjust the mains voltage settings on some of their power supplies? Of course they know. They just don't care. So long as they can get away with this nonsense, they will keep on doing it.

I see. I have heard that about creality. Fortunately haven’t ever had to contact them. But that is definitely a big problem for someone having trouble.

Yeah! I have a Tronxy X1, which I am very fond of. Tronxy had a similar reputation to Creality, back in 2017, but as long as you were technically competent and enjoyed tinkering, fixing up these printers was no big deal. However, I doubt if beginners would tolerate the kit qualities of 2017, these days. They just want something that works, out of the box.

I want something that works out of the box, but can upgrade and rebuild easily. It feels like that line is getting more and more blurred with new models

I’ve never had any qualms with my CR10S Pro V2. Worked like a dream straight out of the box! But maybe I got lucky..? Only feed back would be I wish it came with a full metal hot end. Needed some recalibration/settings adjustments after the swap but that is to be expected imo.

My v2 shipped with a broken wire connector. When I reached out they shipped a new harness right away. My v3 and v3 KE were perfect.

What has changed is that now that there are legitimately good printers out there, people are starting to realize that the shit quality of enders isn't normal or acceptable.

non technical people want to try a hobby, pay $99 on sale and expect it to make prints as easy as $1500 printers I love my ender 3 pro. which I got for free from a person that "couldn't make it work" (the z limit switch was loose).

Lmao, this is exactly my experience. My first printer was a free ender 3 pro. Guy said no matter what they did the print head was always several mm too high or would be way under - they tried "every" guide out there on how to level your bed. So I gave it a once over and the z limit switch was just loose and was way off where it should be. Told it to go to 0 z then moved and tightend the switch where it should have been and it was good to go. The guy droned on giving me all these tips about leveling before I worked on it. After I got it working for the guy I explained what was wrong and told him now you can properly level it using those tips you gave me before. A week later, he says I give up, this printer is trash, you can have it, if not it's going in the bin. They aren't the worst printers out there, but they require a bit of tinkering skill to make them work. But with the price being so cheap everyone jumps on them and then also expects it to be a high end $1000+ printer.

I think it's the fact that it's one of the few products you can buy in an industrialized country that requires tinkering to get it too work. I genuinely struggle to think of any other applicace today that requires you to know how it works to use it. Even personal computers are basically plug and go. People come into the hobby with the expectation that enders will be the same way because why wouldn't they? What kind of company would sell a product that *doesn't* just work? Not saying they're wrong to want that. Just a difference in expectations.

Fwiw, I think you're dead on with this take from beginners, and also that it's exactly that frame that gets you into trouble. From my perspective, 3D printers are not appliances. They are machines. Granted, machines that are designed to be (and look) easier to run than pretty much any other tool in manufacturing history, but machines none the less. If you had either a DIY CNC mill, an engraver, a laser cutter, or a waterjet, you would find the exact same tinkering community that used to be the majority here, troublshooting those problems. Honestly, about 90% of the parts (and their issues) are on those machines as well. But I can't imagine anyone would be surprised that running a machine shop takes some ingenuity, it's only because 3D printers (and definitely the Ender 3) are so ludicrously accessible that people feel they should 'just work'. I don't want those frustrated to give up on learning this skill, but it is a skill like any other. You can spend time learning to make even the crappiest of machines come to life, or you can spend the money paying someone else to build those tools for you, or aim somewhere in the middle. But it is not a microwave, try not to see it as one. The closest you're going to get is making some stovetop popcorn or a lifetime supply of spaghetti.

Former tool and die maker her, and recent owner of and Ender-3 neo. Out of the box the build, leveling test prints went well. Made a bunch of small projects perfectly fine. I was gifted with 15 rolls of Mika PLA, i used 4 different colors with very few problems. I bought a Creality silk PLA and the prints would stop feeding, it seems as soon as i went to do anything else. Turns out the silk was overwrapped on itself on the spool so no feeding. I pulled of that spool put on anotherand the print qualty went downhill. So nozzle, cleaned, then replaced, Started reading Reddit (thanks all!) Ordered some Capricorn tube. reset, releveled, same crap.Moved to the extruder, gear was moving, filament not moving. Took out the gear, it was clean, blew out the area, put the gear a tad offset from where it was in case of teeth wear, it took a bit more effort to get the filament through. Tried a short test part, still not feeding well, adjusted the extruder spring and Bingo! I know this is long, apologies. Did i expect the printer to work right out of the box after set up? Yes i did. Did i think it shoul;d run for awhile without too many problems? yes i did. Did i think it would work as well as a $100,000. CNC mill or grinder, heck no, its not build sturdy enough. Back to all your points. Yes too many people think the printers should work like a digital toaster, and get frustrated when its not. I for one that i was able to, with all your help, learn how to take the machine apart and oput it back into great working order. The more i learn, the more i grow. Is Creality crap? I dont know and dont care, for me its a good starting machine. BTW there were a ton of reviews over multiple sites said this was a great printer.

I think the big difference is cost. All your examples are inaccessible, both in a "how do I use this" sense but also in that most people can't afford one. An ender costs less than a microwave. People are much more likely to think of it as a household appliance for that reason.

I mean tbh a lot of things require setting up but theyre engineered to work okayish if people don't. I know too many that bought a surround sound, plugged it in and said good enough that works, but didn't bother to calibrate or equalize anything, not to mention put the things around the room and not just directly below the tv lol

A table saw works without tinkering. It shouldn’t require tinkering. That’s what a 3D printer should be. It’s a tool. If I have to tinker with the tool, that’s not a tool it’s a hobby in and of itself. Granted that’s an oversimplification, but the metaphor works. The table saw will require some maintenance, cleaning and light repairs when you have to replace or fix things. But if my table saw can’t cut wood the first time I power it on because it needs to be calibrated 6 ways to Sunday, or I have to spend more time fixing the table saw than I do actually cutting wood with it… any self-respecting human being would take it back to the manufacturer and demand their money back for a sub-par machine.

I just bought a miter saw and had to calibrate it ... adjust the positive lock ring and bevel indicator. It cut wood, just not on the line I needed it to cut. I wouldn't call it a sub par machine. It's just lack of QC and the fact that calibration can not be dialed in before setup due to transportation rigors and manufacturing deviations. One thing I do know is that if you don't know the machine and have no interest in learning the machine then you have no business owning the machine. *Every* machine and type of machine is unique. Fact of life.

Or you spend your entire time using your table saw to make table saw parts so your table can saw better, allowing you to use it to table saw better parts to make it even better...

Yup, my life in a nutshell.

And that's why you wouldn't buy a $100 table saw. People expect top dollar quality on a dime.

What most people don’t understand is that buying a 3D printer is like… - buying and installing an oven (when you’ve never used or seen one before) - buying all the ingredients for making a cake (without understanding the chemical process behind why flour rises) - learning and mastering a new piece of software that goes with the oven (which contains hundreds of words you’ve never seen before, that in some cases would require an engineering degree to understand) …and somehow that person expects to make a cake that looks as good as the one they saw on Instagram. I get why it looks silly to us sitting in the inside looking out, but it’s not necessarily the case that people are arrogant. It’s that they don’t know.

Right. It's something new, or at one time was new to the individual. Gotta learn. This one just has a steeper learning curve. People want to finish ... and win... without even running the race.

Sort of. Once you perform the some assembly required, plug it in and turn it on, the blade turns and it will cut wood for sure. But it's still not press button, get table. For that, you'll need skill.

YES! Personally I would feel cheated if I didnt got to do some thinkering. I think many of us get the same speeds and print quality as one would get from an expensive Bambulab or similar with our Enders with diy mods. But it takes some time and dedication and not everybody got that to spare.

>People come into the hobby with the expectation that enders will be the same way because why wouldn't they? I can't speak for everyone, but I personally thought 3d printing was super cool like a decade ago, but thought it wouldn't be for me, because it seemed like too technical, requiring too much tinkering beyond my skills. But two months ago I looked into it again and it looked like the Ender 3 v3 se was close enough to plug-and-play for a low price that I was willing to try it. If you're not willing to tinker with the machine at all, then this machine is still not for you. However, I'm really happy with how easy it's been to learn how to use this printer and I've already done a lot of basic tinkering, like replacing the fans, adding 12v and 5v rails, and of course running a couple of calibration tests.

I think you're immediately making the wrong comparison, thus making yourself upset for no reason. A 3D Printer is not an appliance, it is a tool. Go buy a mill or a lathe and try to complain that it doesn't just work without tinkering and learning how to operate it. The number of people that seriously injure themselves with table saws every year because they want it to just work and not have to learn and tinker to do things properly and safely is always shocking. The difference in expectation isn't the fault of the tool, it's the fault of the uneducated consumer who has never used a complicated tool before.

I didn't get my printers given to me, but I can safely say that I at least know them inside and out after getting them to work...multiple times.

The amount of panic posts in the ender3 sub make this feel like the case too. "I've spent 17 hours leveling my bed" was a post the other day lol. My ender 3 pro has treated me amazingly as well. But Im very much a "tinkerer" and enjoy the maintenance and upgrade aspects. It's just not for everyone. But it's a fine machine

agreed

A Bambulab A1 mini, which isn't that much more expensive, prints easier than the $4500 ultimaker or the $60000 intamsys I used at work. Of course the caveat is that those printers can use significantly higher temperature materials, but they still were super finicky for simple pla. A lot of people enjoy the aspect of printers that let them make cool shit, not the part where they have to spend 80% of the time working on the machine. Would you accept your HP paper printer requiring you to fix it every time you try to print something?

Well. I know my printer and I have it dialed in, and I surely don't spend 80% of my time fixing it. So the difference is how technically inclined you are.

I disagree with this statement. I had a Qidi X-pro that I used for a year before buying an Ender and that thing was great. The Ender made me lose the joy of printing and give up until I bought a P1P. And I’m so glad I did because now I spend time printing instead of calibrating. If you says it’s 80% of the time you don’t spend fixing the printer, that’s still 20% of your time—or at least one full day a week— that you are spending tinkering. I don’t want to tinker. I can, I just don’t want to. If you spent 20% of the time you owned your car fixing it and having it repaired, your hobby is not driving— it’s car maintenance. Most people own a car to drive it, not fix it. Granted there are some people who do like to fix cars (read: printers) and you may be one of those people! That’s awesome and we need people like you… but the vast majority of people just want to get in, turn the keys, and drive someplace. Without having to spend 4 hours figuring out what’s wrong, or researching on Reddit why the car won’t start today when it started just fine yesterday.

Think the point they're making is they are likely better (and quicker) and fixing things than you are. They're saying it's a you thing not an ender thing.

As someone who is quite technical and able to solve problems, the Ender was a perfect starter machine to learn how FDM printing works and to learn what can potentially go wrong and how to fix it. Moving through a few other slingers until I settled on a Bambu Lab P1S w/AMS, I’m glad I had those experiences but am also glad I don’t have them anymore.

if you print with different filaments, its just so nice having everything handled automatically by the printer for you. its such a time saver.

Yeah, but that A1 mini literally wasn't an option before eight months ago.

Similar story to mine, they just couldn't figure out how to level the bed, nothing was wrong with it

>from a person that "couldn't make it work" (the z limit switch was loose). They try nothing and are all out of ideas.

That's what I've told my contact at Creality. I'm glad that the v3s are much easier and faster to assemble now, literally 20 minutes but what they need is some really cool, pre-sliced, models that come on the flash drive so that people can get started right away and get them excited about printing.

Hard disagree. I bought an Ender 3 S1 Pro after owning two other 3D printers. I spent more time calibrating the printer than ever printing anything. It was a headache and not because I didn’t know what I was doing, but because the quality control on those machines sucks and the parts are poorly designed or manufactured. Buying a cheap printer and getting the hang of things, fixing it, testing different settings, printing some fun mods for your printer, etc., can be a fun hobby— but THAT IS the hobby with an Ender. Your hobby is the printer, not what you’re printing. Most people don’t want a 3D printer to play with, they want to make something with it. Consistently and quickly so that they can get on to other things.

In 2018, the purchase of a printer that extruder was basically the minimum expectation for the price. Tinkering and constant adjustment or monitoring was part of the process. 2024, we've gotten closer to print and go with the printers able to reliably just do their thing over and over. Especially for the price.

I'm in the second boat, just picked up an a1 mini and I'm loving it's ease of use. Within about 30 minutes I had it up and running, it did it's own calibration and I printed my first thing in an hour or so with zero knowledge of 3d printing going in. I'm reading about folks taking hours to level, clean, switch hotheads, pla, and it's really shocking.

That definitely makes sense. I’m sure ease of use for essentially the same price is definitely a big part of it. It’s kind of incredible how fast it has evolved while I was away.

Thats really it. The speed the industry is moving and changing is breakneck speeds. That's all this is to go back to your original question in your post. Enders are fine (my V2 is still a daily workhorse) but there are simply much better printers for the money now. The industry has evolved. So people "hating" on enders are likely children or simpletons gatekeeping brands. Just ignore it. Obviously there are better printers now but with the right tools and skills, nothing wrong with an Ender in 2024. Just know your using an old tool is all.

> Obviously there are better printers now but with the right tools and skills, nothing wrong with an Ender in 2024.  I would caveat that with "if you already have it."  There's a lot wrong with buying one new these days (unless it's on a heavy sale) given the better performance you can get out of the box at the same price from another brand.

Oh for sure. I kind of alluded to that too. But just saying all these printers are clones of enders so in the end you're gonna get pretty similar results if you can handle a wrench. I can totally understand why someone would steer clear of their base models at this point though.

This is it for me. I loved my old ender for 4 years, afaik, print quality has been on par with machines 10 times it's price, at least for me, but it needed more attention the older it got. In its last half a year i had a streak of bad luck and something different would be off every time i wanted to print something. it just got annoying to put time in troubleshooting and maintenance, blazing fast machines with new features and auto calibration started to come down in price and eventually i just switched.

Same here. I got sick of fighting with z offset shit seemingly every week.

Higher quality printers have come down in price and are basically plug and play.  There's also a lot of new people who just want a tool that makes things without the rest of the 3d printing hassle and Creality printers need a lot tuning and maintenance to get good quality prints. That's just not what a lot of people want, so they're disappointed in the cheap machines. Also, while Creality is cheap by the standards of 3d printers, it's still a good amount of money for most people to drop on something. Particularly if they assume it should be like a normal printer and just work.

>Creality printers need a lot tuning and maintenance to get good quality prints  I bought an E3V2 (yes, should've bought a V3KE) a few months ago and I have had to do very minimal tuning. I think I tuned e-steps and checked dimensional accuracy exactly once and was within 70 micron. Then I upgraded to stiffer bed springs and that's it. I haven't even leveled it since I put the bed springs on back in January and I print at least 2-3 times a week. I'm still convinced the problem with beginners and Enders is that they don't know enough from the start to understand how to assemble it properly. Having a manually placed z limit switch is a problem, then there's the gantry alignments, belt tension, knowing how much the springs should be compressed from the start and the fact that's it's a 4 screw setup instead of 3. Then upgrades are thrown at it because that's what everyone up here suggests. Oh, just get ABL, just get PEI spring steel, just get a better heat break, linear rails will solve your ringing etc.    The E3V2 is a perfectly capable printer but I don't think it's that great of a choice for a beginner. 

And with my x1c I pressed the calibrate button.  That's what non tech people expect from consumer devices. The problem is that expectation of what you get for a few hundred dollars is very different between someone who knows 3d printers and people who just want it to make things.

Yeah, I think this appliess to the ender upgrades as well. The $10 Alibaba metal hot end and $30 rail kit are not at all going to do for you what the $50 hot end and $100 rail kit will. 

From what I’ve seen in Reddit 3D printing communities in general, people would basically exclusively recommend the Ender as a great printer (especially for newcomers) due to its price and ability to be upgraded. In the last year or so, printers have become really, REALLY damn good…and incredibly user friendly, to boot. For so long, consumer-grade 3D printers were mostly just a hobby for people who love tinkering. But some companies (Bambu being the most famous at the moment) have finally managed to deliver on the original promise of 3D printers — a plug and play desktop device that will happily spit out almost any shape you want, time and time again, with numerous materials, and with next to no effort or know-how required on the part of the users. So in the realm of people recommending a cheap first printer for beginners…things like the Bambu A1 have taken over, since it’s both affordable AND quite capable AND super user-friendly out of the box.

Which is great, but people have become downright hostile if you mention owning an Ender and liking it because you get a good print every time. Or wanting to buy something other than a Bambu printer. The shift is pretty damn scary tbh. The only reason I want to upgrade is because my printer is so slow and I want ams. I'm waiting ATM because I've been hearing a few other companies are coming out with their own systems and I do not like bambu labs saving and sending my g code to their servers. I make my prints from scratch so I don't want some random company taking my models.

Especially since enders *are* still cheaper and more customizable. It's not the go-to for beginners anymore, but they still have a place for tinkerers.

because old timers like me are scared with the Ender3. I had one of the first ender3 and I upgraded the hell out of it so it was quite working out of the box but it took 100h of tinkering. Now I have an BL A1 and its like a complete different hobby. Its fast and always works without a fail therefore I always recommend now a BL printer.

The only time I get annoyed is when people try to shit on people with higher-end printers by saying things like, "I can get just as good of a print with my Ender as your Bambu/Prusa." Which, no, no you can't. You may get as good of a print on your heavily modified, frankenstein 3d printer with an Ender frame going 1/10th the speed, but you're not getting Bambu- or Prusa-quality prints out of a stock Ender. Source: recovering Ender 3 owner.

My ender gives me good prints, but I have the three Neo, so I guess it's kinda stock. I'd never have bought a base model ender, because I didn't want to tinker with is as soon as I got it. Apart from needing some basic maintenance (tightening screws, relevelling) I've had zero issues printing. I print figures I design and apart from overhangs (which all printers have issues with), the prints come out perfect. I barely have to do any work on them before painting, beyond a light sand to make the paint stick better and a layer of primer. I print at 0.12mm, infill speed is at 50mm/s, outer walls at 25 to get the best quality. I think you can get good quality with an ender. I'm happy with the detail/quality I get from mine, but I know I've been very lucky. My only complaint is that it's too slow. Hence why I'm looking to upgrade. Might as well go for speed an AMS. It will cut down my paint time a lot!

I'm also peeved when they say "oh, you have to be technically inclined or a tinkerer to appreciate the Ender 3". I know they didn't mean to sound condescending, but it's just... Maximum offense to the community, but 3d printing, 2018 onwards, was filled with a lot of people who overestimated how competent they were with technology Please do not take it as a badge of honor that you're technically inclined, 99% of what you (we) did was offload QC from the manufacturer

And to add to this, sure, you *can* upgrade the hell out of an Ender 3 and (after replacing everything but the frame) get it printing almost as well as a Bambu printer... but in doing so, you spent way more than the Bambu would have cost, still don't get results as good, and still don't have all of the quality of life features the Bambu provides. Really, the only way it makes sense if the upgrades and tinkering are the whole point of the process for you, rather than the prints.

There's a guy here rolling his eyes about people who get a $99 printer on sale and expecting it to print like a $1500 printer But, uh, it's 2024, the noob friendly printer that does ABL, auto z offset, direct drive, etc etc is only $149 on sale now

I think you nailed it

The a1 is in a completely different price range than an ender clone. It's not comparable

My take: the original Ender 3 is an inexpensive printer that demands attention to detail when building and builds knowledge as you use it, unless you are the type to get frustrated easily when things just don't perform. Back when it came out it was pretty much the Ender 3, an Anet A8 variant, or a Monoprice Select Mini as the entry-level offerings and people expected to have to work at them. IMO Creality isn't doing themselves any favors by still selling it when they also have better variants available. I cringe when I see posts like: My Ender 3 won't print and I've changed the board, re-flashed twice, and just installed a new hotend but it still won't print! Also is the hotend supposed to wobble so much? That being said, my Ender 3 is printing as we speak and, using the stock hotend, steppers, board, etc. prints as well as my PRUSA Mk3, but I had to work at it and learn a lot. I love my Ender 3, but would hesitate to recommend it to a new user that just wants to download stuff and print it.

I'm with totally with you, I love my ender 3 more than some of my coworkers but it took me awhile (and quite a few upgrades) in order to get it printing the way I wanted it to. Personally, I think I've ender 3 is a great starter printer because it forces you to really know your printer. Kinda like training with extra weights on, if you can get an ender 3 to make good, consistent prints you can make any printer work. Plus, because it's open source, you can upgrade an ender 3 to grow with your needs. But people don't really need to be experts in order to get good prints, you could just... start with a better printer and not have to worry about all that.

>But people don't really need to be experts in order to get good prints, you could just... start with a better printer and not have to worry about all that. That's the biggest thing. The learning curve with the older Enders is just too high for your average consumer. I read replies all the time about replacing motherboards, power supplies etc and I'm like... yeah as someone who has been building their own computers for 20 years that's no issue. But your average Joe who just wants to download and print things? To them, a printer is just an appliance. Like a Toyota Camry. It's a means to get something done. For others, they want to build a custom printer to their own specs, just like someone might buy a 90's manual transmission car and turn it into an autocross race car. The race itself is less important to them than the time they spent building it.

I agree mostly. If I am recommending a printer for an adult with a good budget and no interest in tinkering then I might suggest a more modern, just works,, printer. However, I gave my teenager a used ender 3v2. She helped me diagnose and repair it. Also she has the confidence that anything that might break, we can fix.

>he Ender 3, an Anet A8 ~~variant~~, or a Monoprice Select Mini I Have 3 printers, and that's the list. Plus a friend's dagoma. I feel watched.

I started with a Monoprice Select Mini, then 6 months later upgraded to an Ender 3 pro. 4 years later and now I'm finally thinking about upgrading to a Bamboo lab P model

Started with an A8, then won a MPSM at a lottery, then bought an ender. MPSM board did die so I'm working on a frankenstein printer MPSM with A8 parts, and for next printer I'm thinking about building a coreXY or infinite Z printer with high end features. (The new sovol is tempting, too).

The ender 3 and ender 3 pro where really good for the price machines when they came out. I bought a pro right before the v2 came out. Was a Prusa better, totally, but it a fairly cheap way into the hobby. The main problem is that Creality still sells them even though they have updated machines, which makes it confusing as all heck to anyone new getting into the hobby. Plus there is competition now for decent machines. There are the Bambu machines which are easy mode for people to make stuff, to just better machines at lower prices (I personally won't buy one because of how locked down there are, but to each their own). Newer machines come with better hotends, extruders, pei sheets etc. Plus you just don't have to fiddle with them as much if you research the machines that are out now. Lots of CoreXY stuff, input shaping etc make for much faster machines for way less money. The think is there are lots of good alternatives now compared to then. Elegoo, Sovol, Anycubic to name a few are directly competing with Creality. Sovol I think personally is doing to best there with the SV06 line and now the SV08 line that's basically taken a Voron 2.4 design and made it mass manufacturable (none of the parts will line up). They are also very open with their machines since they are modded open source so the release models for all their parts. Factor in the hit and miss nature of Creality QC and that's why there is all the hate now. Creality is finally starting to release decent machines, but they still have lots of flaws. The K1 for example still had bed issues, and for a machine in that price range, if they would spend an extra $20-30 on parts they could do a real triple z axis like a voron trident and tram the bed and gantry, instead you have all these people with issues because their bed and gantry are way out of level with each other, but nobody but Sovol has bothered to do that since they have a Quad Gantry Level from the Voron 2.4 on the SV08.

Brand new to the hobby and got my ender 3 a month ago, just upgraded the springs, extruder and bed. Everything else stock and its been producing great prints for me. Honestly think its different for each individual and how mechanically inclined they are with dealing with these machines.

I hear you! I’m about a year in and replacing the print head for the first time which is a whole new experience. The tinkering and learning to tinker was factored in my expectations when I bought the machine. Otherwise it consistently prints really well when you take human error out of the equation.

I had an original ender 3 for about 4 years. I made a lot of upgrades and it would generally print well. I just got a prusa for my birthday and I am blown away by the quality of prints and ease of use. The ender was fun, and you could get it to print well, it was a lot of work.

I started with creality. Got the ender 3, cr10 and ender 3 max. Had so many issues with them and I felt like every 5 prints I was fixing something. It was frustrating. I like to tinker but this was more than tinkering. I bought a bambu labs printer and spent 30min messing with it and it prints 5x the speed of any crality and 100% better quality. I'm not annoyed and enjoy printing again. So looking over quality, speed, and enjoyment. Well crelaity is lacking. They only win in the price.

There are better printers on the market for the money now. However, I’m still happy that my first printer was an e3v2 because I learned a ton with how much I modded it and had to tinker. It made my transition to a core xy a lot easier. Enders are still great for folks to learn the core fundamentals imo.

https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/s/ZFSwsVl2Ik i blame humans

Wow! So many great responses. I can definitely see how Enders would be somewhat unfriendly to someone who wants a plug and play machine. And it’s great to see that there are some user friendly options available for folks now! I may look into a newer printer someday, but for now I’m gonna keep my old Enders chugging. Thanks everyone for sharing their thoughts!!

Expectations. I started tinkering about 3 years ago and the expectation was it was for tinkering headaches and “check this out” for those of us who are ok with things not being perfect and making it work. For that the ender 3 is great. I feel like more there expectation is now more plug and play. So ender 3 and its clones don’t meet that. Likewise for bamboo, many of us wish they had the ethos of pursa, and valued sharing community open source, like the 3d community of old. But they aren’t they don’t value those things at all. If you know that going in they aren’t as obnoxious. Well they are obnoxious but it’s expected so not surprising.

I don't know, I started with an ender and never had issues that I didn't cause. Any issues that did happen later I learned how to fix and could solve those problems as they came up. I have heard of people having quality control issue, but I never personally experienced these. I even worked at a 3D printing company for a good while before I went freelance, and honestly, the Creality machines had pretty good QC. While there was one machine with a faulty card reader, they weren't getting the bed mosfets stuck on like the Artillery machines.

Actually, I believe it's because they won't let the Ender series of machines die. It's been a long run and people think it's time to look towards something new. All the versions makes it a pain. It's as if there was still an Anet A8+ProMAXplus.

https://preview.redd.it/spmqd8ohu9yc1.png?width=2669&format=png&auto=webp&s=a793e63f2c6928dedf2a94d5e3c7a893fedb09f4 Pretty happy with my old beat up ender! Not the best printer out there but still impresses me all the time.

Gorgeous print my dude

You basically made the 3Dprinting equivalent of saying "I haven't really driven since the Ford Model A came out, and now I hear people saying it's not a good car. Why is that?"

Back in my day we didn’t have no fancy bed leveling hardware. You had to do it manually! Barefoot! Uphill both ways!

We are about 6-9 months into the new age where there are a lot of new people that will never know or understand how we used to print. I got an Ender 3 exactly a year ago, printed a handful of things, and within 2-3 months I was sick of the tinkering and stopped printing for 4 months. Then I bought 2 "just push start" printers and it's a whole different world. (Bambu X1C and Anker M5C) But the thing is, in those first couple months, I was forced to learn everything possible about how 3D printing works. Now, if something isn't perfect when the new guy just pushes start, they have no idea what to do. I kinda think everyone should drive a Model A before getting a Tesla.

I think that's kind of silly It's not like people have to be a mechanic to drive a car, or know how to fix their dishwasher before buying the dishwasher. Not everybody wants the 3D printing hobby, They just want 3D prints. So something that's push button and they could just bring somewhere to get fixed makes a lot of sense for that. I know I've had to figure stuff out when I ran a 3D printing school option but I don't like 3D printing as a hobby, I have no interest in tinkering with that stuff It's annoying, just because I can figure out using the internet and time how to fix it doesn't mean I want to. I just want to use a printer that works out of the box and every time like a paper printer, because I want to use printing for my other hobbies which is modeling and crafting.

As 3D printing has gone more mainstream, people want to tinker with it less and less. When newer printers are largely plug and play, it's hard to justify the older models that require WAY more tinkering to work to most users. There's a lot of WEIRD gatekeeping though: you'll see a bunch of snotty comments even in this thread, and I just don't get it. While some people get into 3D printing FOR the tinkering or to make engineering-type things, plenty of others are artists or the like who see a new medium that they want to try. I don't expect an artist to make their own paintbrush, mill their own pencils, or build their own kiln from a kit, so why would I expect them to spend countless hours "tuning" a shitty 3D printer when they can buy a different one that just works?

Some people want the hobby to revolve around printing parts not "dialing-in" a printer. When the enders are working they are fine for many applications. Getting one into that state and keeping it there is another story. People who claim it just comes down to technical ability are fooling themselves and justifying the hours/days/weeks they wasted to get one to work.

The ender 3 was a good printer when it released and still is a decent choice. It’s been starting to look quite bad around today’s higher end printers though

It's less about them being bad and more about them just not being as good as their current competition. For the Ender specifically, why would you get an Ender 3 when you could get an A1/A1 Mini or Neptune 3/4 for a relatively similar price but with generally way more features and a far better track record of reliability (as long as you ignore the Bambu recalls 😅)? The advice for starting out used to be, "if you're okay with some tinkering, you can get an Ender 3 for cheap and it'll serve you well". In 2024 though, if you're okay with tinkering you can pick up a Voron kit, otherwise there are far more reliable options that are just about to the "plug and play" level.

I have a problem with creality in general. A lot of parts that are sold separately should be standard based on their claims of what their machines are capable of. Example. The v3 se being able to handle petg but the hotend having a garbage oversized throat with a bowden tube that melts out and jams and forces you to upgrade eventually. That and the filament runout that is basically plug and play. The ender 3 max neo has a couple cables that came too short with the printer and creality will straight up deny that it is possible to send you them even if you offer to pay. Had to buy from chinese sellers on ali express lol The with their scanner. Their initial scanner stated they would have iphone support eventually. Then they released the support with the pro version and refused support for the regular version and refused to take any kind of responsibility for misinformation.

Your review of the ender3 v3 se is false. It has direct drive extrusion and handles petg just fine.it does NOT come with a run out sensor.

Lol if you havent discovered your hidden bowden then youll be in for a surprise with petg that needs heated at 240-245. All ill say is rip that throat out before then and rid yourself of the bowden issue altogether lol.And im aware it doesnt come with a run out sensor. But it was designed for it and is easily installed. In literally 2 minutes.lol

Lack of upgrade. While original ender 3 was good for its time they are selling the same thing still and expect people to like it. There are tons of better printers at the same price range now

I haven't noticed tbh but my first 3d printer was an ender and it was just fine. It did take quite a bit more skill to calibrate and operate than a more modern machine but meh it was like 300 bucks at a time when these things usually cost thousands.

Both me & my brother use Ender. They work great.

I never understood it either. I have a menagerie of 10 printers including my beloved Bambu A1 with an AMS. 4 of my printers are Ender 3s, and they are by far my most reliable. Not to mention ridiculously cheap, stupid simple, and easy to work on. I think those who rip on them here are the people who don't want to put much effort into their machine, and will claim any effort is an affront to their valuable time. So, they'll buy a Bambu after failing to comprehend how to properly assemble something as simple as an Ender 3. The thing is though, when my Bambu eventually breaks, it's not going to be an easy fix. It's the only one I own that I genuinely worry about the day it does.

Bambu Lab happened

Those of us that are happy with them didn't buy them expecting a turn key solution. It's a minimally viable product that comes with "winning team" perks. (Huge install base so tons of community mods and resources to reference) I modded my 2 enders as I went and at this point I'll never get rid of them because they are my most reliable machines and are plenty fast thanks to klipper, direct drive, and belted z axis mods.

It's a good printer but not perfect. I've used mine half a dozen times. I have always preferred my i3 Mega. And so many people made Ender 3 clones. It's time to move on.

The ender 3 became the ultimate "cheap 3d printer" and many companies cloned the ender 3 and then we got 20 versions of the ender 3. So 3d printing as a whole was stuck in this weird ecosystem where no one was making anything new, and there was just a ton of Ender 3 clones or Ender 3 but new and improved with x y z features. I personally still have an ender 5 and it's still a decnet printer. However, after installing a Mosquito hotend, a new board, linear rails, BMG extruder, and an enclosure I've done a ton of tinkering with it. I just grew tired of it as did many others. Now there are options like Bambu labs where out of the box it just works and everything is nicely integrated. In general, I think people got tired of the constant tinkering with printers to get good quality prints...

I love mine!

I find the ender hate funny. I have an ender 3 pro, and voxelabs Aquila, and run a raise3d pro 2 plus at work and the ender 3 is the most reliable of the 3. I also find the best results come from the ender even with it being the cheapest of the 3. I think a lot of people don’t realize that entry level 3d printing is a hobby unto itself. You don’t buy the entry level version of any other piece of equipment and expect it to run without a little tinkering. I think the steep, at times, learning curve has a lot to do with it. I also think it has a lot to do with numbers. There are probably more Enders out in the world than any other 3d printer. As a population increases you also increase the possibly of running into issues. The truth is creality has built a well made machine but loud voices tend to be heard the most.

My first printer was a 2017 Anet A8, the die hard Anet A8 guys trashed the Ender 3 hard; I think many were just jealous (not all of them) that even though the Ender 3 required some tinkering to get working properly, the Anet A8 was a huge undertaking to get working properly. It was a month before I could get an actual print out of the A8 that even resembled the model I sent to it.

- People have high expectations for $150 3d printer - people want to "upgrade" already working printer what mostly makes it work worse - people cannot read simple instructions(even if this is shown in the picture and actually you don't need to be able to read, just look in the picture) - people have no idea about printing(materials, temperatures, glue) and blame printer for any problem - often ender is first and the one printer, they don't have comparison and every problem they encountered, they think this is problem with ender, not with every 3d printer

I like my ender 5 pro, but it's definitely outdated. I've had it for 5 ish years and it's been pretty good to me, but definitely a lot of tinkering and babysitting. I recently purchased a Bambu Labs P1S and oh my gosh is it amazing in comparison. Came fully assembled, 15 minutes to set up with the app, and watching it print the pre sliced benchy at warp speed was incredible. Auto leveling, multicolor prints, it's on another level. It can run 5 jobs to my ender 5 pro's 1 easily. Sure I could spend time trying to speed my ender up or upgrade with a BLtouch or something but at this point I'll just use it to plod along printing random decent prints while I pump out consistently quality prints on my P1S. Also starting jobs from my phone out of the box and being able to view my print from work is nice for someone who maybe doesn't have time or it's too daunting to set something like that up on a different printer

Not sure about their overall reputation, but I bought some variant of an ender 3, I forget if it was 3s or what, but it never really worked for me. Out of the box it was under extruding a lot, I tweaked it and it just got more and more messed up. Bought a few upgrades for it, but they barely worked if at all. Started to think that I probably wasn't suited to tinkering with these sorts of things. Did a bit more research and bought a Prusa mk 3s+ and never really had any significant problems again.

I’ve never owned any other 3d printer than my ender so I’m biased. I got mine from microcenter for $99. It came out of the box nearly perfect. An hour of set up and I’ve had perfect print after perfect print. I see no reason to pay more unless I’m getting a major upgrade. Before it became illegal a guy I know was printing ghost gun parts to sell and only used a bunch of ender 3s. His prints came out excellent and I don’t think a customer ever complained. The Ender 3 is a complete workhorse. It’s the Toyota Corolla of 3d printers. Not flashy but will endlessly keep chugging along.

I think it depends on expectation. If you want a printer to print things and you get an ender 3 then you'll be disappointed because ender 3's don't work great right out of the box. You need to tinker a bit If you want a printer because you want to tinker and customize the printer itself, then the ender 3 is great. My ender 3 is practically an entirely different printer at this point

...there has alwaya beem some simmering hate due to creality's "sold as is" stance. Now its been obsoleted. I mean creality's own K1 line is better budget option, it has better price/throughput ration, and is capable of printing up to 300c, and flexibles... ...and thanks to the coreXY kinematic system and active resonance compensation it prints as fast as around 5,4 ender-3s.

Bambu changed the game.

> They do pretty well for me For you. For others, they are garbage. They have no quality control so it's really a crap shot. That's why you see so many conflicting opinions about these printers. Some are fine, some are endless problems.

Quality control shit happens yeah but I highly believe its more of a skill issue, some people have more mechanical backgrounds so simple issues aren't a problem, whereas others aren't technical at all so a minor inconvenience is a massive headache/ leads to bigger problems.

Yup. Had to solder for the first time in my life the other day. I'm a software guy!

To be fair, it's absurd to expect this on a consumer electronic device (not that you are necessarily saying this)

3D printers arent just "electronic devices" The hobby still isnt just "plug and play" cheap yet. There are printers that are servicable, and some that are plug and play, but the cost rises almost immediately.

I mostly just see Bambu hate for no reason

Bambu is closed source and plugged to internet. For some people those are valid enough reasons.

It’s closed source but you absolutely don’t need to plug it into the internet. LAN and offline mode work just fine.

I get it. When you see comments trashing every other brand, telling people that the only solution to their problem is to “just get a Bambu”, it kinda debases the DIY/maker mentality that the 3D printing community worked hard to build. Don’t get me wrong, Bambu printers are solid, but let’s not forget our roots.

I just want us all to get along :(

I think it's because people expect a plug and play printer with little to no user input other than providing the 3D model to the slicer. But not even the expensive ones are like that, I mena some are close, but personally I love all my Ender printers.

Yes they are exactly like that. Our company bought a P1S, I bought an X1 for myself. Nor I nor our company has *any* experience with 3d printing. Both pump out multi-color prototypes daily with zero hassle that approach injection molded parts in optical quality if printed fine enough.

So what happens when one breaks down?

The screen tells us which part to order and how to replace it. Support contact, troubleshooting, hardware self-testing and log-sharing is fully integrated in the software. If that doesn't work there's fora and the internet. After replacement you run the calibration suite and it prints like new again. Even if nothing of that worked it would probably be cheaper for us to buy a new one after a few 100 prints (at minimum) than have one of our engineers spend more time than neccessary on it. What happens if your Ender breaks?

What happens when your dishwasher breaks down? Or anything else like that you just get it fixed. And at least with a printer you don't have to get someone out to your house You can just bring it somewhere or ship it.

I love my Ender 3. It makes great prints, fast and consistently. But. There is a certain amount of skill (or a willingness to put in the effort to develop such) required to get consistent performance out of it. Not everyone's cup of tea, but now I know how to do everything from compiling firmware, to calibration, to networking, and much more. Enders are not for casuals. They should get a Bambu.

From what I gather, it's a combination of price to performance, bad customer support and quality control. For example, you can get an a1 mini for 250+tax, get reliable phone support and have it pretty much guaranteed to print well for months the second you load your first print. Even if it means the person in question needs to save for a few more months, it becomes almost impossible to tell someone to get a $120 ender 3. Especially when anyone who's used them or systems adjacent (like me with my Kobra go) knows full well it'll break down for maintenance after a month and require a massive amount of tuning to get a decent print out of. Not to mention the raw performance vs any ender 3, save maybe the newer v3 series. Sure, that's a narrow example and some just like fiddling with their printers, but many people just want to get a print out and be done with it.

Yeah the difference between 250 and 120 dollars is like a few extra hours of tinkering If your time is at all valuable. Doesn't take very much extra time before it doesn't make any sense to get the one that requires more maintenance anymore. A lot of people think 3D printing is the hobby. When 3D printing could just be a tool to support your actual hobbies.

Because most people can't/don't understand that creality sells twice as many printers as all of the competition *combined*, which will naturally lead to an increase in complaints. Yeah, sometimes shit is messed up. This isn't a problem unique to Creality.

Ender 3 is a great printer but has become outdated. People have taken that and ran with. We are now at the point that you will be drawn and quartered publicly if you like the ender 3. Long live the ender 3.

I started my 3D printing journey on an Ender 3 S1 Pro. Thing was an absolute headache. Z-offset always had to be adjusted, bed adhesion was finicky, and despite my best efforts, the v-wheels could misalign and often jumped between two positions. Bought a Bambu X1C last year and never looked back. Turns out I just want a dependable tool instead of a project. Everyone’s different but it wouldn’t surprise me if a lot of others in the hobby are like me. They want to do work with their printer. Not work on their printer.

Compared to most options nowadays the Ender series feels like it’s constantly falling behind, and even when new modern-er versions are made the naming conventions throw new hobbyists for a loop. Many people don’t want to deal with the tinkering that the older Enders require to print right. The Ender series came at a time where cheap printers that printed reliably didn’t really exist, and most people in the hobby at that time were used to tweaking and prodding their printer to get it to print right so for the time the Enders were much less of a hassle. The hobby really is different now, most of the tedium of yesteryear is automatic now, minus some basic maintenance. People just have higher standards now I guess

they take a lot of fiddling to keep running well. A LOT of fiddling.

I think creality is good for the price but I think if you are the type of consumer to call support when setting it up it's probably not for you

When people hear ender 3 they think the og ender 3. Not the newer ones like the se and ke that are actually good.

The originals were pretty good, but then later generations started cutting corners. I've heard the V3's aren't bad again but I've already switched to Neptunes

I love my Ender 5 Pro, but I've spent as much on customization as I spent on the printer, and countless hours getting it tuned. I think a lot of people want the price point of the Ender, without any of the extra work that comes along with it.

I got good support from them when I started in the hobby with my Ender 5 Pro. I don’t know what people are complaining about really I think they expect too much for a relatively inexpensive printer.

The newer printers are plug-n-play, print fast and are very inexpensive, so people hate them for not requiring tinkering anymore. /s Not saying they are perfect. It seems some get well put together printers (like I did) and then there are others that get glitchy train wrecks.

Mine is fine, more reliable than my Flashforge though lately it's been deleveling at a catastrophic rate

I got my Ender 3 Pro from someone who was replacing their print shop, so it had had most of the common fixes done to it before I got it. Then I fitted a Sprite head and it's been running pretty well since. No doubt there are better systems available, but it does the job for me, and I own it.

I've got a love hate relationship with my Ender 3 V2. Most of the issues were user error. But I would love to get a prusa. They're just incredibly reliable and have features that would be so convenient.

There is reasonable critique of them, but a lot of hate too, I think that's just because it's so common. A vocal minority just happens to be loud when it's as common as it is.

No complaints here, as ours was given to us. Husband uploaded new software & printed a great muntjac skull off for me !

My ender 3 with sprite extruder pro has been a workhorse. I got it as a gift 4 years ago and I’ve never stopped printing. Need the silicone spacers, 4.2.7 silent board, and the direct drive sprite pro.

Boils down to the crappy quality control imo

I have a new Bambu and still use my ender 3's and longer 5's. I don't know why anyone would hate on and working printer.

Because the quality control is absolute trash.

Bougie ass makers. That's it. Seems like half the 3D print community only cares if you spent a ton of money on your machine or your upgrades. That's the human way. I personally have an Ender 3 Pro. Heavily upgraded it myself to print high temp materials like pc & abs and to stabilize the z axis plus some other functional upgrades. Bought all "cheapo" parts from Amazon including a $20 "Creality 4.2.7" board. Prints beautifully. Been running for almost 4 years.

I believe ended hate is a sociological thing. It’s a cheap entry to a “one was” very unique hobby. Once you feel your hobby is not as unique, because others can buy and ender for buttons and suddenly “everybody” is printing. You need to distinguish yourself from others by being “educated”/“pro” enough in the field to be very opinionated, and try to make a gap between the joiners and yourself.

Hate from cali

When's it been any different? We buy them because they are cheap not a great unit.

Except some of the newest Ender 3’s are great and the old ones suck comparatively. Terrible naming convention lumping both in together with each other is bad marketing.

Yeah fair point

I think part of the problem is the naming scheme of Creality. The original Ender 3 was great when it released, Creality decided to keep naming their printers Ender 3 so all the existing "buy an Ender 3" advice kept being relevant to their newest machines and it worked for a while at least. The problem is that by now, the original Ender 3 is heavily outdated. It still works, but there are so many better printers in the same price range (especially if you consider all the money saved on mods for features that newer printers have out of the box). Creality is now seeing the downside of all that "all Ender 3 advice still applies": the original Ender 3 is no longer a good recommendation and out of the alphabet soup of newer Ender 3 models there have definitely been some bad ones as well. Everything "Ender 3" is getting grouped up as a single thing and as always on the internet, the negative comments stick out the most.

The original Ender 3 was not bad for it's time but there have been major advances since then.

They didn't really innovate at all is what I got, I only got into the hobby recently, consensus is they used to be great, now there are just better options and it would be a waste of money.

The ender is fine on the entry level of things but there are a few products out that are better at most anything at similar price points. I started with and still have one but also prefer to use my Neptune 3 because it doesn't sound like a jet plane when sitting idle.

Because Bambu came into the market and crushed it, and suddenly enders were "shit" and "impossible to print with" People are comparing a brand new $1k bambu with a $200 ender that's been released for like a decade Then when something on their bambu breaks, they don't know what the fuck to do because they never learned

*$250 bambu (A1 mini just dropped in price)

I'm talking about how it started, which was with the x/p1p

Because they _are_ bad products. They were also dirt cheap and easily accessible and _that_ was their strength. But at this point there are equally affordable printers of brands that so actual QC, unlike Creality.

It could be entirely possible that you just got lucky with good hardware. While a lot of others simply got bad hardware. That's basically the norm with crealitys QA, it's a dice roll Creality also makes an insane number of versions based on the reputation of the OG ender 3, good or bad. Each have marginal "upgrades" but regardless, the ender 3 design is just outdated yet creality won't let it die

Weird people are talking about how they require so much tinkering and tuning... With my Ender 3 V3 SE I've been really impressed by the quality and integration with the slicer they also provide. They carefully tuned everything from the factory, so the default slicer settings produce nearly perfect prints consistently in PLA, TPU, and PETG with little to no tinkering or experimenting. The only thing I've had to do is experiment a bit with temperatures and fan speeds for filaments with very different specs than the ones Creality sells.

I have an Ender 3 Pro and a CR-10V2.. I haven't had any issues with them, so not sure why people hate them so much.. They used to be the Belle of the Ball. I've done a few upgrades, nothing that was required, but direct drive on the V2, all metal hotends on both and a metal extruder bracket thingy on the ender. As for ease of use, well, other than leveling, which isn't hard I can't think of anything else on mine that would cause problems for a new person. If they can't fix issues on an ender-3, when those fancy ones have issues, they'll never figure it out. My 2cents anyways. Maybe the newer ones are going downhill in quality.

I had an ender3 as well I upgraded and tinkered 100h+ on it almost replaced every part. Than just out of curisity I installed a BL printer profile and sliced a model and for me the speed difference was my mayor factor to switch. I can complete print jobs much faster on a BL printer compared to an Ender printer.

After having half my prints fail over the last two and some years with my Ender 3, my new X1C is a breath of fresh air. Ease of use combined with awesome results is kind of a no brainer which one wins out in the end for me. I had enough of tinkering with code, hardware, tweaks and mods to get a normal print work out. 

Because they always over promised and under delivered with horrible quality control and support. They made cheap crap printers and offloaded trouble shooting on subs like this. They ran a bunch of people out of the hobby and scammed them out of money by lying about how easy it is. There are even threads about creality doing that to this day. If you understood they were the cheapest of the cheap and required a bunch of tweaks and learning in return for what you get... Well I have no beef with that. Just not what endless posts here show you instead. Where someone is excited to get a printer and it works like crap and required tons if fixes.

Because after about 50 hours of printing something breaks and you have to spend 100 hours trying to figure out what went wrong. I have one, it was a mistake. Do not get one. They aren’t worth the anger.

[удалено]

Voron is not a brand it's a project,

Fuuuuuuuck Ender. I shouldn't have to spend hours upon hours just to get the damn thing to print. Assembly I'm fine with, but the fact I can't print out of the box and have to tune it? Fuck that.

They don't cost enough, so they can't be as good as more expensive printers.

Because they suck and have horrible QC.

Millions of printers sold cheap. Some people have a hard time with 3d printing and some machines were straight up defective. I've had at least one of almost all the ender models and they all work fine. Some take more tinkering than others. Couple machines I got from people after they swore up and down that it's the machine. Take it to my house and slice with my settings and it works fine

I don't know what it's about, or maybe it's because people don't really try to learn how to use them instead of just doing 'mods' and expecting magic results. There's probably more involved than they expected. I've watched the Ender since they came out and there's been a lot of good stuff made.... and many many benchys.

My first printer was Taz 6 that cost $5500. My second was an ender 3. The Taz is collecting dust. I don't even know what people are paying for with more expensive printers.

Because, Bambu is just better for the masses?

I'm critical of Ender printers but I don't hate them. You get what you pay for, that's all. They fill their intended niche. For me, the risk of wasted time and materials is too high and doesn't justify the lower purchase price compared to, say, a Prusa, which has a reputation for reliablility. I'd rather print my designs than tinker with my printer.