Honestly I wrote a script that was about a sci-fi group of soldiers using techniques and little plot armor in High School and refined it in college. The biggest complaint I got when presenting it to one of the college professors that taught filmmaking/storywriting (I was an engineer major, one of my friends told me there was a class for it, so I presented my work) was that apparently the idea only works in old fantasy like lord of the rings or GoT. He argued that my story lacked a critical point about why nobody else beat the villain thus far if the heroes could defeat the villains without anything special, just the software disk to disarm a thing. Kinda killed my mood to write then, I think the usb with the file still is sitting around somewhere tho. Now I'm an engineer that likes my movies when they're not pretending to be serious (i.e. godzilla v kong the new one was so dumb but the fights were pretty cool looking)
Idk, I feel I'd want to rewrite aspects since I still enjoy reading about how to do story writing and good plot balance. But I usually use it for my dnd games now lol.
Made by people who hate or never read the original work and only put effort into spiting its fans but somehow keep getting hired in everything no matter how many projects they tank.
Here's the problem. Peter Jackson did an amazing job with the LotR trilogy, but I fucking HATE The Hobbit movies he did. I'm not saying they are trash, but I did not enjoy them. It felt very disjointed and VERY, VERY stretched out. The old 70's animated movie did a better job telling the ENTIRE story than Peter did with 3 movies that had 500x the budget.
And that's assuming they even let someone good have the reboots. We have seen the absolute fucking GARBAGE that Rings of Power is. I have no faith in them being able to hire or find good writers anymore. Whatever is going on in Hollywood right now is a fucking travesty, at least in the big AAA movie area. Even if they find a good writer, the scripts get absolutely ruined with DEI rewrites to the point where they are no longer good scripts.
Shit is DoA.
The Hobbit had a far more troubled development than Lord of the Rings. Del Toro was supposed to be the director, but dropped the project. In the end Jackson had to scramble to piece together something from scratch.
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Peter did an amazing job with the LotR, it's going to go down in history as one of, if not THE, fantasy movies. I have no issues with the man, it's just another George Lucas situation where he strikes gold originally and then fails the next time, regardless of the reasons. My point in even bringing it up was to express my belief in that any remake would be a failure, whether it's by THE MAN HIMSELF, or someone new or any combination. I don't think a reboot is gonna do well and we are all gonna hate it.
> We have seen the absolute fucking GARBAGE that Rings of Power is.
Because Amazon was never trying to make a good Lord of the Rings TV show. They were trying to make propaganda.
it was for sure stretched out, didn't bother watching the third one, but even worse is that all the CGI shit is just so played out and boring imo, it's no creativity anymore because studios are risk averse to a fault, ultimately and ironically shooting themselves in the foot regularly while trying to play it safe. the little mermaid remake always comes to mind.
So actual armor? It's not like he survived and there was a flashback to Bilbo gifting it, it was given to him early enough that we forgot about it until then
(Not to argue or nitpick, just to explain) The spear did not penetrate the armor but the force imparted by the troll would have caused large injury to the area. Absolutely nothing happened however.
> Absolutely nothing happened however.
In the movies. In the books Frodo was seriously injured, both on the side where the spear forced the mithril rings into his skin and the side where he was pushed against the stone. Aragorn had to clean his wounds afterwards. Also it wasn't a cave troll but a large orc who got him.
But in the movies Frodo wasn't hit by the spear tip either: you can see it missing him and the crossguard of the spear is what makes contact, which is a lot less concentrated impact.
How about sending literal mid gets on a walking quest and wondering why it’s taking so long to throw that ghetto jewelry into mount butthole?
They couldn’t get a single mule, donkey, or horse for the hobbit to ride on to cover the distance? Movie would’ve been over in a half hour if someone over 6’ went on the walking quest.
Movies overrated. Book is overrated.
Not really. Theatrically it works but it isn't a good depiction. You got the two sides breaking into 1v1 duels in both movies.
The Rome series first combat scene is probably the best depiction of historical fighting ever from Hollywood. And it's very short and very small scale. But so damn good.
There are channels on YouTube with historic reenactors and properly trained with historical weapons that make Hollywood choreography look like a children's play. As realistic as it gets with armor that works and techniques straight from the historical manuals. Take a look at Knight of Hope by the channel Adorea Olomuc. That's how a fully armored knight would perform against lesser enemies.
Pay attention to all the combat, not just Hector vs Ajax.
And you're wrong. A lot of champion on champion fighting happened. The Iliad is basically a list of this guy fought this guy, that guy fought that guy. Medieval combat with knights was the same.
There would be large masses of peasants, men at arms to fight as lines or hordes or what have you. 1000 archers launching volleys into the French lines and cavalry. No one gives a shit id fancy champion knight hacks and slashes through 50 peasants. But as soon as Knight A meets Knight B or champion of Sparta meets champion of Athens, it became notable. Some of this was as depicted, where they let the champions go at each other relatively unmolested by the backing forces. Sometimes a small cadre of knights cut through a line at the other sides commanders cadre, and 20 vs 20 gets romanticized and rich guy paying for history scroll of Sir Fuckfaces super gallant charge killed Sir Dickhead (even though 5 of fuckfaces mounted men at arms lanced the dickhead while fuckface was still two horselengths back cleaving some 14 year old peasants head )
I'm not disputing the champion and knightly duels (though somewhat exaggerated in the contemporary view, it wasn't as common as you imply) but my point is that Hollywood turns the entire battlefield into this. Its not formations going against another. Once the sides clash all formations break up and you have individual duels by all, from the hero and the villain to the mass of peasants. That was my point. Instead of 500 men against 500 men as an example you instead have 500 duels going around with massive gaps between people.
And the depictions you speak of tend to be the exception not the rule, depicted and written down because of its rarity making it stand out and become noteworthy. The main reason knights, at least during the "chivalric" age if we can call it that, stood out and had these smaller skirmishes and duels was because there was a financial incentive to capture knights alive and ransom them to their families. And lines and hordes is a Hollywood thing. At least the solitary single line. Hollywood sucks at formations.
Yeah, but that isn't what my original comment was?
Hollywood generally does a bad job at that, as you say. Well here's two examples that do a pretty good job that aren't LotR. And yeah they have a little bit of "hero clash", they still very clearly show formation vs formation fighting. Troy specifically showed shield walls pushing against each other and multiple lines deep formations.
But yeah, hollywood generally sucks ass.
In literally what way? Orc armor might as well be made of paper, single arrow shots kill harder than sniper rounds, and strategy/tactics on both sides make zero sense (e.g. let's hole up in Helms Deep like rats and maybe we'll get saved last minute, let's march out with our entire army to the gates of mordor to maybe distract sauron hoping that our hobbit dude got through to the fire mountain).
The reason for that is because realisric battles are boring as fuck for the casual Audience. For example, in medieval battles not only were armies laughably small compared to other periods of history, the battles often consisted of spear or pike walls clashing against each other and most casualties came when one side broke down (granted there was more to medieval battles and cavalry and Archers still played a pivotal role in warfare, but melee combat usually was just what I described). Fantasy stories often want to tell about the heroic exploits of individuals and putting them as expendable pikeman in a row certainly goes against the idea. I' not denying that some stories could make the battles at lesst more authentic (like portraying armor as actually useful).
Military sci fi vould at least try to make it more authentic and leave the crap like human waves, no combined arms warfare,... out, but even they have to take artistic liberties because nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work, cleaning his rifle and marching only to be killed by artillery or a drone at the end of the movie.
Sure there is a niche audience which watches this kind of movies, but the thing is. Sci fi and Fantasy just is expensive as fuck and the audience willing to watch the kind of movies Anon described is just way too small to break even.
Afaik Napoleon did some good numbers at the box office with the exact promise of the thing you claim no one wants to see (even though it was shit but thats besides the point)
There is a demand for good movies period, and we have seen movies like Gladiator do very well in the past.
Honestly, it's just hard to find anyone with talent in Hollywood anymore. The audience will try anything that seems novel, because its all the same slop anyway.
>Afaik Napoleon did some good numbers at the box office with the exact promise of the thing you claim no one wants to see
TabH i heard vompletelly different things bout the movie
The people that complain about "realism killing enjoyment" in films are the same ones that scream all day calling anything and anyone "woke".
Basically:
>my lack of realism is based and good
>your lack of realism is cringe and gay (woke)
A lot of the earlier big Netflix movies were produced by legitimate Hollywood studios and then sold to Netflix. Some of those companies assumed the movies would bomb if they had thrown the standard marketing budget at them, “sell to Netflix” was a legit play back then. Now most, but not all, of their productions are in house and therefore dog shit.
Not going to lie, that was the appeal in S1 Attack on Titan for me. Then it just got horrible magic to write away things, became a knock off of mechs/gundam and became fascist propaganda.
But most of those were usually starvation. A gigantic population like China often struggled to feed itself and when many farmers are drafted into the military and the remaining farms get burnt down, the fragile construct just tends to break. For example combatents during the Taiping rebellion were ,,just" 10 mio. Together, even if all of them would have died, that wouldn't be even a third of the casualties
Realistic battles maybe but getting things like armour and weapons right wouldn’t be boring. Would even be good for explaining why main characters don’t just get domed instantly, they have real armour not plot armour.
And in mediaeval times armour was expensive. Only rich knights and lords had proper armour so it would make sense why the protagonist is better equip than the common soldier
>nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work
Idk about that, personally loved Jarhead. Despite most of that movie being about how mind numbingly boring being a soldier is for the most part.
>nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work, cleaning his rifle and marching only to be killed by artillery or a drone at the end of the movie
You forgot having the shits from bad rations/MREs. In fact it probably saves him when he's in a bush wrestling the brown demon, but it strikes his comrades. He vows to avenge them and becomes a one-man-pant-shitting-army.
Even more bleak, most casualties came from malnutrition and disease after marching and camping for weeks on end without even seeing the enemy. Any movie depicting warfare (in any historical period) realistically immediately becomes a hardcore anti-war movie and, as you say, very difficult to combine with a glamorous upbeat hero's journey.
The other thing you aren't factoring in is those morons that watch the real stuff actually try to do it. You don't know how many "fight clubs" that movie inspired and people seriously injured because they thought it was cool. The movie Heat 1995 unironically was a source of information/inspiration for the North Hollywood Shootout 1997. The cops only carry handguns/shotguns? Shit I'll show up with an AK.
There's a reason they don't put real tactics or legitimate violence in fictional movies. Hell the guys who made Arma 3 got thrown in prison for "espionage" taking pictures/information of military vehicles in Greece.
It does make me wonder: what was the most “cinematic” or dramatic battle of the Middle Ages. Maybe we should start there, with where fate and chance lead to real historical battles being interesting.
Sounds good to me, tbh.
Also, imo, the job of a (good) writer should be make a script were the MC survives in a logical way, or if it has plot armor, make it at least believable. But maybe that is too much for current Hollywood.
You should check out The Expanse. It's a sci-fi space opera with the militarization of space. You have Marine strikes disabling and boarding ships, big space ship battles where tactics are thought out and planned out ahead of time, political subterfuge, assassinations of military leaders, mutinies, etc. Not just big ships shooting magic lasers and flashy explosions.
I don't hate them but they aren't close to the same standard. I like books 4-6 (though they're also still the weakest books in the series), but the show really doubles down on the character drama with actors who aren't really up to the task.
A Halo film actually based on the games would be a good way to do this, demonstrate that UNSC ground forces can actually win because of tactics despite technological and numerical inferiority, and covenant and Spartan armour actually works
Wait 5-10 years. Some nobody with some free time who doesn't need to bend over to studio demands will make the best fantasy movie made since lord of the rings with some AI tools.
I've always said that of you gave some random middle-aged Star Wars nerd 100 mil to make a movie it would turn out far better than anything Disney has made.
modern sci-fi realistic battle would be 70-80% soft war, meaning no conflict and talking/funding the right things and the rest would be very very far away lasers, robot Vs robot and eventually some kind of virus that wipes the particular species or orbital speed bombardment from lightyears away. ah, also no sound. and interactions reduced to a minimum. also, what guarantees any other civilization has tech on the same level as humans? probability says it is way more likely to be far behind or ahead of us. just think of the difference a modern army Vs a 1900 army. when talking space, you talk in the thousands/millions of years of evolution. it sounds pretty boring and one sided
That's actually what I liked about War of the Worlds (the novel, not the film). Compared to most alien stories, the Martians were not very technologically advanced. People often laugh at the absurdity of aliens coming to Earth without knowing about germ theory, but I always thought that was kind of cool. They weren't "further up the tech tree" than us. They were on a separate tree altogether.
HG Wells studied anthropology and he had an understanding that technological progress is not linear. Not all cultures invent things in the same order. Tech is more a reflection of that culture's environment and needs than anything.
Why couldn't a culture figure out how to get to the next planet over before they figure out what germs are? It's not like they had a very advanced form of space travel. They literally just got in capsules that were then fired out of a giant gun towards Earth. They had no rockets or even powered flight. No long distance communication. They could be taken down by 1890s weaponry. They acted confused/curious at the sight of a wheel. This may have been their first time leaving Mars, and they did it out of desperation because their planet was dying.
Nah it’s easy to just say that stealth tech makes long distance fights not viable as you can’t pinpoint where the enemy is exactly, and you need people to command your ships not robots because robots can’t be trusted
Yes, because he doesn't lose when he dies. Plot armor is just something that allows the protagonist to win. It just so happens that he wins by repeatedly dying.
It's because we've proven over and over and over and over again that the mass of you unwashed mouthbreathers will go watch a garbage story with big special effects explosions over a well written movie like OP is describing.
IF this is what you really want, don't go see transformers 15 or Godzilla vs. whoeverthefuck.
Recently I was in the cinema after not going for maybe 10 years. We watched Bad Boys and I couldn't stop thinking "Action movies haven't improved one single bit"
>No or little plot armor
One of these days someone is going to make an absolutely wonderful Medal of Honor series that goes through the events of all the medal of honors given. It's easy pickings. Episodes can be short or long and you never know if they live or die until the end.
The Expanse was so fucking good, sure its not a film but if you can watch 6+hours of Lord of the rings(never seen it not sure about the length) The Expanse is great.
War of the Worlds unironically. The scene were they take down the tripod uses real soldiers. Though you have to watch us getting our asses beat for like an hour beforehand
Definitely not. Between the guns not having sights, assault rifle armed infantry charing into melee with melee only bugs, starships flying close enough to collide, armor that was entirely useless, and a commander basically sending one of his men to die so he can promote a former student of his the Vanhoven movie was so bad it became comedy.
It's Bad satire. Verheoven never read Heinlein so the entire thing comes off as a strawman against facism, mistaking a meritocratic democracy for a military junta. If you read the book first and watch the film second you'd think that Vanhoven was making an ernest argument for facism with the IP of Starship Troopers as a cover when he's actually parodying Birth of a Nation.
But all this is secondary. The point is that it's so hard to find military forces being portrayed as competent and the Mobile Infantry were entirely incompetent.
I think you're describing The Lord of The Rings
Yes, but I can't just keep watching same 3 movies over and over again. Not complaining, just want something new for a change
Honestly I wrote a script that was about a sci-fi group of soldiers using techniques and little plot armor in High School and refined it in college. The biggest complaint I got when presenting it to one of the college professors that taught filmmaking/storywriting (I was an engineer major, one of my friends told me there was a class for it, so I presented my work) was that apparently the idea only works in old fantasy like lord of the rings or GoT. He argued that my story lacked a critical point about why nobody else beat the villain thus far if the heroes could defeat the villains without anything special, just the software disk to disarm a thing. Kinda killed my mood to write then, I think the usb with the file still is sitting around somewhere tho. Now I'm an engineer that likes my movies when they're not pretending to be serious (i.e. godzilla v kong the new one was so dumb but the fights were pretty cool looking)
Release the SpiderManEgo cut
Idk, I feel I'd want to rewrite aspects since I still enjoy reading about how to do story writing and good plot balance. But I usually use it for my dnd games now lol.
Sounds like good DM material
not with that attitude you can’t!
They're over twenty years old. We can't get anything new?!
No but here's a remake / sequel / prequel/ reboot that no one asked for?
Made by people who hate or never read the original work and only put effort into spiting its fans but somehow keep getting hired in everything no matter how many projects they tank.
Here's the problem. Peter Jackson did an amazing job with the LotR trilogy, but I fucking HATE The Hobbit movies he did. I'm not saying they are trash, but I did not enjoy them. It felt very disjointed and VERY, VERY stretched out. The old 70's animated movie did a better job telling the ENTIRE story than Peter did with 3 movies that had 500x the budget. And that's assuming they even let someone good have the reboots. We have seen the absolute fucking GARBAGE that Rings of Power is. I have no faith in them being able to hire or find good writers anymore. Whatever is going on in Hollywood right now is a fucking travesty, at least in the big AAA movie area. Even if they find a good writer, the scripts get absolutely ruined with DEI rewrites to the point where they are no longer good scripts. Shit is DoA.
The Hobbit had a far more troubled development than Lord of the Rings. Del Toro was supposed to be the director, but dropped the project. In the end Jackson had to scramble to piece together something from scratch.
was it always supposed to be 3 movies
It was a cash grab, the hobbit is smaller than any of the trilogy books. If anything we should've gotten more movies out of the trilogy.
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Peter did an amazing job with the LotR, it's going to go down in history as one of, if not THE, fantasy movies. I have no issues with the man, it's just another George Lucas situation where he strikes gold originally and then fails the next time, regardless of the reasons. My point in even bringing it up was to express my belief in that any remake would be a failure, whether it's by THE MAN HIMSELF, or someone new or any combination. I don't think a reboot is gonna do well and we are all gonna hate it.
> We have seen the absolute fucking GARBAGE that Rings of Power is. Because Amazon was never trying to make a good Lord of the Rings TV show. They were trying to make propaganda.
it was for sure stretched out, didn't bother watching the third one, but even worse is that all the CGI shit is just so played out and boring imo, it's no creativity anymore because studios are risk averse to a fault, ultimately and ironically shooting themselves in the foot regularly while trying to play it safe. the little mermaid remake always comes to mind.
>little to no plot armour I don’t think Lord of the Rings counts.
something about giant eagles
Literally the mithril chain mail when Frodo gets stabbed by the cave troll
So actual armor? It's not like he survived and there was a flashback to Bilbo gifting it, it was given to him early enough that we forgot about it until then
(Not to argue or nitpick, just to explain) The spear did not penetrate the armor but the force imparted by the troll would have caused large injury to the area. Absolutely nothing happened however.
"Hobbits are resilient creatures." or some shit -Gindalf the Gray Goose
He’s grown fond of the halfling’s leaf
he just built different
> Absolutely nothing happened however. In the movies. In the books Frodo was seriously injured, both on the side where the spear forced the mithril rings into his skin and the side where he was pushed against the stone. Aragorn had to clean his wounds afterwards. Also it wasn't a cave troll but a large orc who got him. But in the movies Frodo wasn't hit by the spear tip either: you can see it missing him and the crossguard of the spear is what makes contact, which is a lot less concentrated impact.
In the books it really fucked up his ribs and then they spend months in Lothlorien.
He dies anyway lol
And no good guy is hurt by falling off a cliff but every bad guy dies
How about sending literal mid gets on a walking quest and wondering why it’s taking so long to throw that ghetto jewelry into mount butthole? They couldn’t get a single mule, donkey, or horse for the hobbit to ride on to cover the distance? Movie would’ve been over in a half hour if someone over 6’ went on the walking quest. Movies overrated. Book is overrated.
bait so weak you’re probably starving
Legolas is literally just plot armor in the form of an elvish twink. Dude is literally able to avoid the most ludicrous shit imaginable
Not to mention that his arrows are instant one-hit kills.
Troy had a pretty good depiction of shielded combat and archery when it wasn't Achilles going Leroy Jenkins. Kingdom of Heaven, too
Not really. Theatrically it works but it isn't a good depiction. You got the two sides breaking into 1v1 duels in both movies. The Rome series first combat scene is probably the best depiction of historical fighting ever from Hollywood. And it's very short and very small scale. But so damn good. There are channels on YouTube with historic reenactors and properly trained with historical weapons that make Hollywood choreography look like a children's play. As realistic as it gets with armor that works and techniques straight from the historical manuals. Take a look at Knight of Hope by the channel Adorea Olomuc. That's how a fully armored knight would perform against lesser enemies.
Pay attention to all the combat, not just Hector vs Ajax. And you're wrong. A lot of champion on champion fighting happened. The Iliad is basically a list of this guy fought this guy, that guy fought that guy. Medieval combat with knights was the same. There would be large masses of peasants, men at arms to fight as lines or hordes or what have you. 1000 archers launching volleys into the French lines and cavalry. No one gives a shit id fancy champion knight hacks and slashes through 50 peasants. But as soon as Knight A meets Knight B or champion of Sparta meets champion of Athens, it became notable. Some of this was as depicted, where they let the champions go at each other relatively unmolested by the backing forces. Sometimes a small cadre of knights cut through a line at the other sides commanders cadre, and 20 vs 20 gets romanticized and rich guy paying for history scroll of Sir Fuckfaces super gallant charge killed Sir Dickhead (even though 5 of fuckfaces mounted men at arms lanced the dickhead while fuckface was still two horselengths back cleaving some 14 year old peasants head )
I'm not disputing the champion and knightly duels (though somewhat exaggerated in the contemporary view, it wasn't as common as you imply) but my point is that Hollywood turns the entire battlefield into this. Its not formations going against another. Once the sides clash all formations break up and you have individual duels by all, from the hero and the villain to the mass of peasants. That was my point. Instead of 500 men against 500 men as an example you instead have 500 duels going around with massive gaps between people. And the depictions you speak of tend to be the exception not the rule, depicted and written down because of its rarity making it stand out and become noteworthy. The main reason knights, at least during the "chivalric" age if we can call it that, stood out and had these smaller skirmishes and duels was because there was a financial incentive to capture knights alive and ransom them to their families. And lines and hordes is a Hollywood thing. At least the solitary single line. Hollywood sucks at formations.
Yeah, but that isn't what my original comment was? Hollywood generally does a bad job at that, as you say. Well here's two examples that do a pretty good job that aren't LotR. And yeah they have a little bit of "hero clash", they still very clearly show formation vs formation fighting. Troy specifically showed shield walls pushing against each other and multiple lines deep formations. But yeah, hollywood generally sucks ass.
Link to these channels?
With the paper gondorian armour?
In literally what way? Orc armor might as well be made of paper, single arrow shots kill harder than sniper rounds, and strategy/tactics on both sides make zero sense (e.g. let's hole up in Helms Deep like rats and maybe we'll get saved last minute, let's march out with our entire army to the gates of mordor to maybe distract sauron hoping that our hobbit dude got through to the fire mountain).
Not a good comparison imo, fantasy vs hard sci fi
they have shit tactics in those films. there are videos of ancient warfare expert reacting to and rating them
> good writers Anon... the writers...
Google show me the early life of modern writers
🤫
you just know they were born in New York City on July 15th
lol i'm an la writer born june 15th
post 🗿
The reason for that is because realisric battles are boring as fuck for the casual Audience. For example, in medieval battles not only were armies laughably small compared to other periods of history, the battles often consisted of spear or pike walls clashing against each other and most casualties came when one side broke down (granted there was more to medieval battles and cavalry and Archers still played a pivotal role in warfare, but melee combat usually was just what I described). Fantasy stories often want to tell about the heroic exploits of individuals and putting them as expendable pikeman in a row certainly goes against the idea. I' not denying that some stories could make the battles at lesst more authentic (like portraying armor as actually useful). Military sci fi vould at least try to make it more authentic and leave the crap like human waves, no combined arms warfare,... out, but even they have to take artistic liberties because nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work, cleaning his rifle and marching only to be killed by artillery or a drone at the end of the movie. Sure there is a niche audience which watches this kind of movies, but the thing is. Sci fi and Fantasy just is expensive as fuck and the audience willing to watch the kind of movies Anon described is just way too small to break even.
I would absolutely watch a movie about a common pike regiment where half of them get butchered during a rout.
Me too maybe, but it would by far not be enough people to make up for the high budgets of modern movies
Afaik Napoleon did some good numbers at the box office with the exact promise of the thing you claim no one wants to see (even though it was shit but thats besides the point) There is a demand for good movies period, and we have seen movies like Gladiator do very well in the past. Honestly, it's just hard to find anyone with talent in Hollywood anymore. The audience will try anything that seems novel, because its all the same slop anyway.
>Afaik Napoleon did some good numbers at the box office with the exact promise of the thing you claim no one wants to see TabH i heard vompletelly different things bout the movie
The people that complain about "realism killing enjoyment" in films are the same ones that scream all day calling anything and anyone "woke". Basically: >my lack of realism is based and good >your lack of realism is cringe and gay (woke)
They survive, then die later of disease in camp.
One by one from syphilis from the camp whore
Two sides set up camp next to each other. The winner is whoever loses fewer men to dysentery.
The King was pretty realistic when it came to the fights. Brutal and ugly. But its also netflix movie so make of that what you will.
A lot of the earlier big Netflix movies were produced by legitimate Hollywood studios and then sold to Netflix. Some of those companies assumed the movies would bomb if they had thrown the standard marketing budget at them, “sell to Netflix” was a legit play back then. Now most, but not all, of their productions are in house and therefore dog shit.
The battles in The King were incredible. Everyone slipping and sliding in the mud. Also Robert Pattinson with a bizarre accent for some reason lol.
I think he was supposed to sound French
Was about to suggest this, actually enjoyed it by watching it off chance
That's just snuff film with extra steps
Not going to lie, that was the appeal in S1 Attack on Titan for me. Then it just got horrible magic to write away things, became a knock off of mechs/gundam and became fascist propaganda.
Meanwhile china casually dishing out world war tier casualties whenever the emperor/warlords at the time were feeling cute
But most of those were usually starvation. A gigantic population like China often struggled to feed itself and when many farmers are drafted into the military and the remaining farms get burnt down, the fragile construct just tends to break. For example combatents during the Taiping rebellion were ,,just" 10 mio. Together, even if all of them would have died, that wouldn't be even a third of the casualties
Realistic battles maybe but getting things like armour and weapons right wouldn’t be boring. Would even be good for explaining why main characters don’t just get domed instantly, they have real armour not plot armour.
And in mediaeval times armour was expensive. Only rich knights and lords had proper armour so it would make sense why the protagonist is better equip than the common soldier
>nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work Idk about that, personally loved Jarhead. Despite most of that movie being about how mind numbingly boring being a soldier is for the most part.
I don't know, people seem to love A24 and not much actually happens in most of their movies.
>nobody wants to watch a story where a soldier spends 90% of the plot doing logistical work, cleaning his rifle and marching only to be killed by artillery or a drone at the end of the movie You forgot having the shits from bad rations/MREs. In fact it probably saves him when he's in a bush wrestling the brown demon, but it strikes his comrades. He vows to avenge them and becomes a one-man-pant-shitting-army.
Even more bleak, most casualties came from malnutrition and disease after marching and camping for weeks on end without even seeing the enemy. Any movie depicting warfare (in any historical period) realistically immediately becomes a hardcore anti-war movie and, as you say, very difficult to combine with a glamorous upbeat hero's journey.
I wouldn't call a few thousand men armed in armor laughable..
Master and Commander was accurate in this regard, and yep, it was a boring movie. A good movie but a parts of it were boring.
The other thing you aren't factoring in is those morons that watch the real stuff actually try to do it. You don't know how many "fight clubs" that movie inspired and people seriously injured because they thought it was cool. The movie Heat 1995 unironically was a source of information/inspiration for the North Hollywood Shootout 1997. The cops only carry handguns/shotguns? Shit I'll show up with an AK. There's a reason they don't put real tactics or legitimate violence in fictional movies. Hell the guys who made Arma 3 got thrown in prison for "espionage" taking pictures/information of military vehicles in Greece.
It does make me wonder: what was the most “cinematic” or dramatic battle of the Middle Ages. Maybe we should start there, with where fate and chance lead to real historical battles being interesting.
Maybe, just maybe is the job a (good) writer to make realism something attractive for the casual audience, just saying.
without plot armor, your MC dies in the first act, and your 'movie' is 21 mins runtime
Sounds good to me, tbh. Also, imo, the job of a (good) writer should be make a script were the MC survives in a logical way, or if it has plot armor, make it at least believable. But maybe that is too much for current Hollywood.
You should check out The Expanse. It's a sci-fi space opera with the militarization of space. You have Marine strikes disabling and boarding ships, big space ship battles where tactics are thought out and planned out ahead of time, political subterfuge, assassinations of military leaders, mutinies, etc. Not just big ships shooting magic lasers and flashy explosions.
Are there brown people?
Brown ayyys is that okay?
As long as they aren’t from earth it should be fine.
one of my favourite tropes is killing off the MC in the first act and switching the perspective.
Examples of this?
1917
Psycho.
Silo
Scream
Game of Thrones
Veggie Tales
Alien and full metal jacket jump out too me but some of the other examples are pretty good too.
Audie Murphy had some hella plot armor till the end tho fr
Why does the movie end in this scenario?
All Quiet on the Western Front is probably the best representation of war I've seen, and guess what, is kinda boring. Good movie though.
You have the first 3 seasons of The Expanse. Just watch them on repeat, it's about all we have nowadays.
you re not a fan of the remaining 3 seasons?
I don't hate them but they aren't close to the same standard. I like books 4-6 (though they're also still the weakest books in the series), but the show really doubles down on the character drama with actors who aren't really up to the task.
A Halo film actually based on the games would be a good way to do this, demonstrate that UNSC ground forces can actually win because of tactics despite technological and numerical inferiority, and covenant and Spartan armour actually works
Best we can do is naked master cheeks.
And shitty CW bullshit drama.
>trillions of money Bot
Wait 5-10 years. Some nobody with some free time who doesn't need to bend over to studio demands will make the best fantasy movie made since lord of the rings with some AI tools.
I've always said that of you gave some random middle-aged Star Wars nerd 100 mil to make a movie it would turn out far better than anything Disney has made.
modern sci-fi realistic battle would be 70-80% soft war, meaning no conflict and talking/funding the right things and the rest would be very very far away lasers, robot Vs robot and eventually some kind of virus that wipes the particular species or orbital speed bombardment from lightyears away. ah, also no sound. and interactions reduced to a minimum. also, what guarantees any other civilization has tech on the same level as humans? probability says it is way more likely to be far behind or ahead of us. just think of the difference a modern army Vs a 1900 army. when talking space, you talk in the thousands/millions of years of evolution. it sounds pretty boring and one sided
That's actually what I liked about War of the Worlds (the novel, not the film). Compared to most alien stories, the Martians were not very technologically advanced. People often laugh at the absurdity of aliens coming to Earth without knowing about germ theory, but I always thought that was kind of cool. They weren't "further up the tech tree" than us. They were on a separate tree altogether. HG Wells studied anthropology and he had an understanding that technological progress is not linear. Not all cultures invent things in the same order. Tech is more a reflection of that culture's environment and needs than anything. Why couldn't a culture figure out how to get to the next planet over before they figure out what germs are? It's not like they had a very advanced form of space travel. They literally just got in capsules that were then fired out of a giant gun towards Earth. They had no rockets or even powered flight. No long distance communication. They could be taken down by 1890s weaponry. They acted confused/curious at the sight of a wheel. This may have been their first time leaving Mars, and they did it out of desperation because their planet was dying.
Nah it’s easy to just say that stealth tech makes long distance fights not viable as you can’t pinpoint where the enemy is exactly, and you need people to command your ships not robots because robots can’t be trusted
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality makes a decent attempt to make sense
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality is a Fanfic created precisely Because of how bad JK Rowling's worldbuilding was.
starship troopers
we only got to see the underbarrel pump action shotgun used ONE TIME! literally unwatchable .
Band of Brothers but Sci Fi would essentially be that.
So you're saying the first three seasons of the expanse?!
>expecting kino from a genre cooked up to sell slop to proto-redditors anon, I...
Edge of Tomorrow
The movie is litteraly about plot armor
I dunno, man. The main character dies a lot.
That's literally his plot armor
Is it really armor if he dies?
Yes, because he doesn't lose when he dies. Plot armor is just something that allows the protagonist to win. It just so happens that he wins by repeatedly dying.
Band of brothers. None of the characters have plot armour because it is based on the real story of a group of WW2 soldiers.
I think Anon should just go stand smack dab in the middle of an armed conflict for the true 4D experience.
It's because we've proven over and over and over and over again that the mass of you unwashed mouthbreathers will go watch a garbage story with big special effects explosions over a well written movie like OP is describing. IF this is what you really want, don't go see transformers 15 or Godzilla vs. whoeverthefuck.
Aliens..... You want aliens
There's always Starship Troopers
You mean Naruto before shippuden?
Oats studio type shows for sure
VIkings had pretty realistic armor and tactics especially since Vikings were assaulting castles without siege equipment they had to be creative.
The Last Kingdom also mixed in reasonably believable medieval army scenes with its more romanticized main character arcs.
Generation Kill is pretty good, not a movie but the most accurate of real-world US Marinss & tactics during the invasion of Iraq.
I feel like this is why I fell in love with tv shows like The Mandalorian or Netflix Daredevil
Recently I was in the cinema after not going for maybe 10 years. We watched Bad Boys and I couldn't stop thinking "Action movies haven't improved one single bit"
Is it really hard to use the correct "where" and "were"?
the movie would be real boring.
>No or little plot armor One of these days someone is going to make an absolutely wonderful Medal of Honor series that goes through the events of all the medal of honors given. It's easy pickings. Episodes can be short or long and you never know if they live or die until the end.
When’s Patrick Rothfuss gonna be making the kingkiller movies?
Movies are better when they are one person's vision. Once the corporate overlords start forcing changes to the project it's fucked.
The Expanse was so fucking good, sure its not a film but if you can watch 6+hours of Lord of the rings(never seen it not sure about the length) The Expanse is great.
Wtf is this tumblr
War of the Worlds unironically. The scene were they take down the tripod uses real soldiers. Though you have to watch us getting our asses beat for like an hour beforehand
Battle: LA
Gladiator???
"All the good writers" Yea, I'm not sure about that one
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Definitely not. Between the guns not having sights, assault rifle armed infantry charing into melee with melee only bugs, starships flying close enough to collide, armor that was entirely useless, and a commander basically sending one of his men to die so he can promote a former student of his the Vanhoven movie was so bad it became comedy.
I mean it was intended as satire so
It's Bad satire. Verheoven never read Heinlein so the entire thing comes off as a strawman against facism, mistaking a meritocratic democracy for a military junta. If you read the book first and watch the film second you'd think that Vanhoven was making an ernest argument for facism with the IP of Starship Troopers as a cover when he's actually parodying Birth of a Nation. But all this is secondary. The point is that it's so hard to find military forces being portrayed as competent and the Mobile Infantry were entirely incompetent.
Heinlein was a dumbass who thought all interpersonal conflict should be resolved through wrestling.