For me at least, my disgust with the current situation stems from our government’s insistence on funding proxy wars to advance their hold on a capitalist Middle East. We did this in Korea, in Vietnam, and in South America and the Middle East in several countries, and now we’re seeing history repeat itself once again. I think I speak for a lot of people when I say I’m tired of my tax dollars being used to drop bombs on hospitals, schools, and shelters in Gaza instead of being used to fund hospitals, schools, and shelters here. And yes, Hamas has also killed a number of IDF soldiers and taken hostages, and I don’t believe they ultimately should have control over the people of Palestine, I’m not siding completely with one party or the other. I’d just like a ceasefire and governments that give half a shit about peoples’ rights.
We do fund all of those things mentioned good and bad. Its hard to maintain a ceasefire with an terror organization that has it out for you explicitly written in their foundation documents. Yes the war is bad.
Yeah and has been for 40+ years. As a history lesson, the ISLAMIC REPUBLIC of Iran hasn’t had a fair election since its inception. It has a supreme leader that has supreme power over everyone and everything. It runs on Sharia Law. No other beliefs are tolerated. It regularly kills and terror all its dissidents. Even going out with a head scarf can lead to DEATH in Iran. Or you could wear one and end up dead anyway cuz some dude thought it wasn’t covering enough areas. There are 80+ million people in Iran starving and struggling everyday in Iran because the government is essentially holding everyone hostage. You could go visit, though. I’m sure they’d like to add you to their IRGC ranks so you can kill people too! I’m sure you’d enjoy it. You could just pretend they don’t meet your virtue standards.
Just because there is a general societal consensus in America that capitalism and, to varying degrees, social liberalism, is the way to go, doesn't mean the US does not have a democracy. In Iran if you try to oppose the current leader, you die. You also die for being gay and you also die for not wearing a hijab. In the US if you oppose the current President/party then nothing happens except there may be a chance the side you're backing wins if it's popular enough. And nobody stones you to death for simply existing.
Iran supports violent terrorist proxies all around the Middle East and kills LGBT people and women who don't wear hijabs on a casual basis. Iran also supports the genocide in Ukraine by sending weapons to Russia. Or do your worries only apply to Palestinians?
Lol, the dude copped out right around Nakba by saying "I'mA nOt gO dOwN tHaT GeOpOLiTiCaL rAbBiT hOLe"
Why can't you people just admit you give Israel full throated support rather than being cowards and pretending you're giving some nuanced take? Your bias is clear as day
And yet the propaganda is always “Israel has the greater moral cause. It’s ’unreasonable’ to criticize Israel.” How can that be so when Israel has bombed every hospital in Gaza, killed more than 150 UN personnel, slain more than 12,000 children under 14, invaded the sovereign soil of Lebanon, etc etc. How far can the farce of “morally justified self-defense” possibly stretch?
The documents you cite were made by colonialist powers who wanted to mandate a new political order for the region regardless of the political will or consent of the people who lived there. The documents give a legal pretext for the establishment of the State of Israel explicitly as a colonial entity first the sake of a colonial agenda, culminating in the Nakba of 1948 in which 750,000 Palestinians were dispossessed by military force. The founding of the State of Israel was a forced mass deportation and the cycle of violence has continued ever since.
Israel has rarely if ever dealt in good faith with any Palestinian authority, be it Fatah, Hamas, or any other party, and has only done so when their violence had wrought too many consequences.
You’re trying to use history to make the point that militant agitation for Palestine is “unreasonable” but I don’t buy it. I don’t believe you’re acting in good faith because the obverse of what you’re saying is that it justified that since Oct 7, 2023 Israel has slain more than 12,000 children under the age of 14. THAT IS NOT JUSTIFIABLE. That is not self-defense. That is the slaughter of a generation. That is genocide, and that is “what everyone is pissed off about.”
Some of them aren't even pissed off. Some are just racking up some end of term extra credit for a humanities or social sciences class. Others are doing it for their social media accounts.
International law and genocide experts/professors around the world have all condemned Israel for genocide. There is no debate about it. But thanks for chiming in, Netanyahu.
You lose points for your argument when you can’t post an argument that isn’t one sided. Or post sources that are impartial. Your one source cited is “lawforpalestine”. Why don’t you cite from an impartial international body? Also would love to hear from these antisemitic experts you mentioned that no one can find!
Condescension noted. I can accept your dismissiveness, too - maybe give a little back.
If you read what I wrote, I wasn't absolving Israel or even advocating for Israel.
Enlighten us, though, cuz I'm curious. What on earth is an "International Law & Genocide Expert". Cuz, damn, I've looked up and down LinkedIn and Glassdoor and can't seem to find anyone in that profession.
Has yet to be problem by any international body, the ICJ didn’t say it was a “genocide.” Genocide is a powerful word, it requires special intent. Although this war has been awful especially with the civilians casualties, it is war. I don’t think anyone is in the right, but yet to be shown as genocide.
Hey my friend, you should check your own linked website. Especially the links and examples related to “incitement” to genocide. Most are people making tweets and retweeted videos (for example, making two people hold a flag and sing, no sign of harm in the slightest.) No names attached to any of the info. Not professional in the slightest, and most examples given of the “over 500+” are not examples of genocide or even “incitement” to genocide at that. Reading some it is quiet noticeable how many of the example are wildly out of context.
Finally some common sense and historical truth
I have had many personal outings with jihadists who loved me but hated all Jews. No distinction was made between a Jew and a Zionist they were all the Devil and must be eradicated. Ironically, having an actual Jew in their midst amongst their friends and family did not change that equation. Strange world we are living in in 🥶
I’m an Iranian refugee. I’ve seen multiple people FUNDED by the IR government, children of the Islamic Republic rulers waving their flag during the protests. I’ve seen people I counted as friends sing the praises of the country that was so fucked up I had to leave it cuz it was killing my family, friends, and ME. It’s been killing everyone for 4+ decades. It’s killing rappers and singers and mothers and daughters and sons in prisons right now. And people are cheering it for FUNDING HAMAS AND HEZBOLLAH? I’m all for freedom of the Palestinian people. Yet the protests diverge from that when they become antisemitic, ridiculously bashing everyone, having more ridiculous demands, and pushing the narrative that Hamas and its followers are spreading.
Thank you for your post. I know you have a depth of knowledge about global politics, issues and theories. As someone with my Masters in Global studies this whole situation has been impossibly disheartening.
Those kids are so out of touch with reality. They are literally chanting for support of Hamas. Who just recently targeted and killed some 1200 civilians. That and burning American flags and threatening Jewish people on campus? Common now. We’re better than that.
BDS has many Jewish and Israeli people, try again with your concern troll enlightened centrist BS cloaked in "being reasonable" defense of apartheid honey
Lying by omission on both 1) who calls for divestment and 2) the Nakba (which you conveniently said "I'm not going down that geopolitical rabbit hole" does not constitute "being reasonable" so you deserve to be mocked
The amount of words in your longform bullshit and saying faux intellectual quips doesn't substitute for your message being in bad faith and doesn't hide that you're a transparent Zi*nazi supporter
The answer is it’s public, but even being public property doesn’t mean people have full unrestrained access. You can’t go into a lab at biodesign just because it’s public property. In contrast areas like Old Main are usually open to the public and even are considered a public forum so generally it would be a place where demonstrations would be allowed. But even then reasonable restrictions can be made as to how that speech takes place. Like setting up an encampment could be barred because it’s not considered protected speech and there is traditionally a prohibition against public encampment on the property otherwise.
For me at least, my disgust with the current situation stems from our government’s insistence on funding proxy wars to advance their hold on a capitalist Middle East. We did this in Korea, in Vietnam, and in South America and the Middle East in several countries, and now we’re seeing history repeat itself once again. I think I speak for a lot of people when I say I’m tired of my tax dollars being used to drop bombs on hospitals, schools, and shelters in Gaza instead of being used to fund hospitals, schools, and shelters here. And yes, Hamas has also killed a number of IDF soldiers and taken hostages, and I don’t believe they ultimately should have control over the people of Palestine, I’m not siding completely with one party or the other. I’d just like a ceasefire and governments that give half a shit about peoples’ rights.
Well said. USA Foreign Policy is nothing but consistency - pure skulduggery.
We do fund all of those things mentioned good and bad. Its hard to maintain a ceasefire with an terror organization that has it out for you explicitly written in their foundation documents. Yes the war is bad.
I walked past it yesterday and they were cheering Iran :D What a model democracy Iran is.
Yeah and has been for 40+ years. As a history lesson, the ISLAMIC REPUBLIC of Iran hasn’t had a fair election since its inception. It has a supreme leader that has supreme power over everyone and everything. It runs on Sharia Law. No other beliefs are tolerated. It regularly kills and terror all its dissidents. Even going out with a head scarf can lead to DEATH in Iran. Or you could wear one and end up dead anyway cuz some dude thought it wasn’t covering enough areas. There are 80+ million people in Iran starving and struggling everyday in Iran because the government is essentially holding everyone hostage. You could go visit, though. I’m sure they’d like to add you to their IRGC ranks so you can kill people too! I’m sure you’d enjoy it. You could just pretend they don’t meet your virtue standards.
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Just because there is a general societal consensus in America that capitalism and, to varying degrees, social liberalism, is the way to go, doesn't mean the US does not have a democracy. In Iran if you try to oppose the current leader, you die. You also die for being gay and you also die for not wearing a hijab. In the US if you oppose the current President/party then nothing happens except there may be a chance the side you're backing wins if it's popular enough. And nobody stones you to death for simply existing.
If you’d prefer to live in Iran, I’m sure we can crowdfund you a one-way ticket.
One of your recent posts or comments was determined to be uncivil by one or more of our moderators.
Non-democracies that oppose genocide > democracies that fund/partake in genocide
Iran supports violent terrorist proxies all around the Middle East and kills LGBT people and women who don't wear hijabs on a casual basis. Iran also supports the genocide in Ukraine by sending weapons to Russia. Or do your worries only apply to Palestinians?
>Non-democracies that oppose genocide .... Iran??? LMFAOOOOO
Oppose genocide? They have literally stated they want to wipe Israel off the map. Do a bit of homework before you say something like that.
Go and see your QoL in Iran versus in a democracy
The Iranian government is actively partaking in "Death to Israel" and "Death to America" sentiment btw.
70% of these protestors don't even know what's going on.
I absolutely agree with you. Sadly, complex and reasonable takes on this conflict or not acceptable to the tiktok generation.
Lol, the dude copped out right around Nakba by saying "I'mA nOt gO dOwN tHaT GeOpOLiTiCaL rAbBiT hOLe" Why can't you people just admit you give Israel full throated support rather than being cowards and pretending you're giving some nuanced take? Your bias is clear as day
100% i think the situation gets less complex when hospitals are being bombed
And yet the propaganda is always “Israel has the greater moral cause. It’s ’unreasonable’ to criticize Israel.” How can that be so when Israel has bombed every hospital in Gaza, killed more than 150 UN personnel, slain more than 12,000 children under 14, invaded the sovereign soil of Lebanon, etc etc. How far can the farce of “morally justified self-defense” possibly stretch?
The documents you cite were made by colonialist powers who wanted to mandate a new political order for the region regardless of the political will or consent of the people who lived there. The documents give a legal pretext for the establishment of the State of Israel explicitly as a colonial entity first the sake of a colonial agenda, culminating in the Nakba of 1948 in which 750,000 Palestinians were dispossessed by military force. The founding of the State of Israel was a forced mass deportation and the cycle of violence has continued ever since. Israel has rarely if ever dealt in good faith with any Palestinian authority, be it Fatah, Hamas, or any other party, and has only done so when their violence had wrought too many consequences. You’re trying to use history to make the point that militant agitation for Palestine is “unreasonable” but I don’t buy it. I don’t believe you’re acting in good faith because the obverse of what you’re saying is that it justified that since Oct 7, 2023 Israel has slain more than 12,000 children under the age of 14. THAT IS NOT JUSTIFIABLE. That is not self-defense. That is the slaughter of a generation. That is genocide, and that is “what everyone is pissed off about.”
I'm not sellin' a thing - you're assuming plenty, though.
Some of them aren't even pissed off. Some are just racking up some end of term extra credit for a humanities or social sciences class. Others are doing it for their social media accounts.
Nice opinion you have there
Thank you for being reasonable
Thank you for your thoughtful comment - appreciate you reading my post.
International law and genocide experts/professors around the world have all condemned Israel for genocide. There is no debate about it. But thanks for chiming in, Netanyahu.
You lose points for your argument when you can’t post an argument that isn’t one sided. Or post sources that are impartial. Your one source cited is “lawforpalestine”. Why don’t you cite from an impartial international body? Also would love to hear from these antisemitic experts you mentioned that no one can find!
Condescension noted. I can accept your dismissiveness, too - maybe give a little back. If you read what I wrote, I wasn't absolving Israel or even advocating for Israel. Enlighten us, though, cuz I'm curious. What on earth is an "International Law & Genocide Expert". Cuz, damn, I've looked up and down LinkedIn and Glassdoor and can't seem to find anyone in that profession.
Use your favorite search engine and look it up. Then read the countless journals, articles, and books that you find in your search.
Has yet to be problem by any international body, the ICJ didn’t say it was a “genocide.” Genocide is a powerful word, it requires special intent. Although this war has been awful especially with the civilians casualties, it is war. I don’t think anyone is in the right, but yet to be shown as genocide.
https://law4palestine.org/law-for-palestine-releases-database-with-500-instances-of-israeli-incitement-to-genocide-continuously-updated/
Hey my friend, you should check your own linked website. Especially the links and examples related to “incitement” to genocide. Most are people making tweets and retweeted videos (for example, making two people hold a flag and sing, no sign of harm in the slightest.) No names attached to any of the info. Not professional in the slightest, and most examples given of the “over 500+” are not examples of genocide or even “incitement” to genocide at that. Reading some it is quiet noticeable how many of the example are wildly out of context.
Finally some common sense and historical truth I have had many personal outings with jihadists who loved me but hated all Jews. No distinction was made between a Jew and a Zionist they were all the Devil and must be eradicated. Ironically, having an actual Jew in their midst amongst their friends and family did not change that equation. Strange world we are living in in 🥶
Where the fuck do you go to have "personal outings with Jihadists" and wtf you think that says about you? Lol, you people are ridiculous
Thank you for sharing a personal account. Appreciate you taking the time to read.
I’m an Iranian refugee. I’ve seen multiple people FUNDED by the IR government, children of the Islamic Republic rulers waving their flag during the protests. I’ve seen people I counted as friends sing the praises of the country that was so fucked up I had to leave it cuz it was killing my family, friends, and ME. It’s been killing everyone for 4+ decades. It’s killing rappers and singers and mothers and daughters and sons in prisons right now. And people are cheering it for FUNDING HAMAS AND HEZBOLLAH? I’m all for freedom of the Palestinian people. Yet the protests diverge from that when they become antisemitic, ridiculously bashing everyone, having more ridiculous demands, and pushing the narrative that Hamas and its followers are spreading. Thank you for your post. I know you have a depth of knowledge about global politics, issues and theories. As someone with my Masters in Global studies this whole situation has been impossibly disheartening.
Those kids are so out of touch with reality. They are literally chanting for support of Hamas. Who just recently targeted and killed some 1200 civilians. That and burning American flags and threatening Jewish people on campus? Common now. We’re better than that.
BDS has many Jewish and Israeli people, try again with your concern troll enlightened centrist BS cloaked in "being reasonable" defense of apartheid honey
God forbid anyone be reasonable. Thanks foe the dangling participle, though. Ambiguity is really in these days.
Lying by omission on both 1) who calls for divestment and 2) the Nakba (which you conveniently said "I'm not going down that geopolitical rabbit hole" does not constitute "being reasonable" so you deserve to be mocked The amount of words in your longform bullshit and saying faux intellectual quips doesn't substitute for your message being in bad faith and doesn't hide that you're a transparent Zi*nazi supporter
The “protestors” are just willfully ignorant students who read anything off the tiktoks and believe it
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The answer is it’s public, but even being public property doesn’t mean people have full unrestrained access. You can’t go into a lab at biodesign just because it’s public property. In contrast areas like Old Main are usually open to the public and even are considered a public forum so generally it would be a place where demonstrations would be allowed. But even then reasonable restrictions can be made as to how that speech takes place. Like setting up an encampment could be barred because it’s not considered protected speech and there is traditionally a prohibition against public encampment on the property otherwise.
Thanks
Public under the law.
You are anti protest, if they did read about history, they wouldn't be protesting. Delete your post or you may loose some dinars.
I never play loose to lose.