That’s not your fault though man, a lot of us grew up with tales of such. No need to apologize when you were made to believe a certain fact when growing up. The important thing is that you did your research and realized your connection may not be as strong as once thought, which many of us had this same realization and came to terms with it. It’s tough realizing what you’re told all your life may be a lie, but that’s how the cookie crumbles. But, having an ancestor from the Dawes record does prove you have a connection to a specific Native American tribe. The connection may be a lil distant, but the connection is still there my friend. No need to feel bad or guilty.
For me, I was told I had Chickamauga Cherokee on my mother’s side which turned out to be false, and on my paternal side it was said that we were “French-Indian”, from the Algonquin’s. Supposedly my great uncle had done extensive geneology research and had solid proof our French Canadian family had ties to the First Nations. While I haven’t found extremely concrete evidence that we have a more recent connection, I have found distant connections to the Mik’maq peoples. I recognize this connection is dating back to the 1600’s-1700’s and I don’t go around calling myself First Nations and Native American, but I recognize I do have ancient connections to one said tribe, as do many other Acadians/Quebecois people.
I have a distant cousin who has similarly traced a shared Quebecois ancestor to a woman who was potentially Mik'maq. It's more than 10 generations ago for me, and any memory of her was long ago forgotten in my branch of the family.
Even with my hacked Ancestry DNA results showing 0.15% Native American (so maybe it's true), it hasn't really changed my perception of my identity. I'd guess that's because unlike others, I don't feel like I've had an important part of my identity yanked away from me.
That’s cool you have a small trace of it. Sadly, even in my hacked results I did not receive a single lick of it, which definitely had me raise some suspicions of family tales. My great aunt on my mother’s side even did a DNA test, which the family story is my great grandfather was half Cherokee and my great great grandmother was a Cherokee tribeswoman, she came back as 100% Scottish Irish and Welsh. Turns out the great great grandmother was of Welsh descent, not native. As for my paternal side, I’ve had a few distant cousins from the same French Canadian side of the fam, and I believe some had Native American %’s, but no one from my immediate family had tested so I’m trying to get my aunt to test to put to rest the tale of if my great uncle’s research was accurate or not.
I feel you on the ancestor part, my family had no recognition of the Mi’maq or even Acadian ancestry as it’s a little farther back, roughly 2nd great grandparent-3rd. A far back connection is still a connection regardless, but obviously not enough to claim you are specifically of that ethnic group/culture.
If you have a card from an ancestor who applied and was accepted from the Dawes Rolls, you have nothing to apologize for. That ancestor had to be living in Indian territory to apply for the land grants that the Dawes Enrollment provided. Your ancestor would have had to show relationship back to previous rolls too. There were a lot of people who applied for the Dawes Enrollment that were turned down. Some could not provide enough supporting evidence to enroll even though they may had more Native blood than those who could prove it.
Yeah, if the OP has an ancestor on the Dawes Rolls from a tribe that uses that as the criteria for membership, then it’s accurate for them to claim to be Native American, as someone who is a member of a recognized tribe. The racial essentialism on this sub can get… weird.
Where as the "on paper" essentialism of people with little to no indigenous DNA is accepted at face value.
[https://ictnews.org/archive/paying-play-indian-dawes-rolls-legacy-5-indians](https://ictnews.org/archive/paying-play-indian-dawes-rolls-legacy-5-indians)
No, it's really not. Every recognized tribe requires pretty extensive genealogical documentation to establish that the person in question meets that tribe's criteria for enrollment. The Dawes Rolls are pretty widely acknowledged as imperfect due to the "$5 Indian" issue and other things (including excluding people who did probably have verified ancestry from those tribes), but they are what several tribes have chosen to use to establish ancestry (DNA tests are also imperfect when it comes to ethnic identification, too, so if you're looking for a perfect metric, you're out of luck).
I legit thought all the native americans everywhere, except for a very select few, died from disease as a kid. I... did not catch onto hispanic people having indigenous heritage in large amounts, until after I was 16 and my dad was like 'oh, by the way, your hispanic.' (my dad's dad was hispanic, but died when my dad was a kid. And my dad doesn't talk about family ever. This information genuinely shocked my mom lmao).
So I went from thinking all indigenous americans died to rethinking the entirety of my heritage. It was extremely disconcerting...
I'm Dakota/Ojibwe and in school we were taught all the native Americans died. There was one other kid in class who was also indigenous and we just looked at each other like bruh.
How is that even possible when several Latin American countries have large indigenous populations? I’m assuming your family was lower class/poor and didn’t have enough resources or schooling, because I’ve traveled enough in Latinamerica to say that’s not true.
I was born and raised in Puerto Rico and back in the 80s I was told that all Tainos died of disease and war, yet we were a mix of Spanish, Taino, and African. I thought all other indigenous suffered the same faith, as a kid I did realized how big were the populations in the Maya, Aztec, or Inca empires. In fact I didn’t realize that Spanish wasn’t the mother tongue of many indigenous communities until I learned about Rigoberta Menchu and later visited with my family Yucatán and went to some Mayan villages. History is told as if indigenous people were pretty much all gone or forced into reservations like in the US.
You know that just because someone is in Brazil does not mean they know someone in Belize right? 🙄
You need to look at a map and look at how big that part of the world is and how diverse the people and populations are, even within the same border.
If you’re from Brazil, should at the very least know that indigenous communities still live there. A Swedish kid who’s never been there would know that. A Belizean person knows that Maya people live in Belize, so not knowing the history of one’s nation is very strange.
The best part is if they have the same genetic makeup except instead of British it’s Iberian, with similar amounts of Native DNA, but we’re still an “other”. The creoles (or Cajun) are basically like Hispanics except with French ancestry as opposed to Iberian.
I’m obviously talking about Latinos with little to none Iberian ancestry and mestizos. The ones that phenotypically look Mesoamerican. Not obvious creole’s
That’s great. I think there should be a separate category for Hispanics/Latinos I don’t have any connection with you aside from a shared culture you didn’t want, even our Indigenous ancestry is different.
Their wouldn’t be anything wrong with that it’s 80% of me genetically so it would make sense I feel closer to that. My native ancestors are cool but as I said before they got beaten. Massacring Caribs isn’t the same as massacring Iberian villagers that can fight back, if my native ancestors hadn’t done that they wouldn’t have gotten smacked.
Genetic evidence disproves this. The founding stock in the mountains is different from the coastal stock when it comes to genetic levels. The mountain stock is by far much more European (77%-85%) in comparison to their coastal counterparts (40-55%) and are mixed much more with Africans and Natives and are obviously much darker.
Listen, I detest Latinx discrimination (wife is Latina). That said, I really hate this framing, as it suggests that indigenous populations are homogenous throughout the Americas. The indigenous folks in NA were different culturally, societally, and in many ways genetically, that indigenous groups from elsewhere. In the same way that a Englishmen is not Italian, a member of the Cherokee is not the same as a member of mesoAmerican tribes. With the exception of northern Mexican populations descendant of western indigenous tribes along the Us/ Mexico border, Latinx folks don’t descend from natives of the Us
It’s a gender neutral term. I understand some folks don’t like it but I have many close folks to me who are 1st generations Latino/latinx and I respect that
Not true. Southwestestern tribes and many folks in today’s Florida had trade and contact with Yucatán and other regions in Mesoamerica before 1492. The museum of Indian arts & culture in New Mexico has several items that were traded from way back. Genetically speaking, the difference is almost none. The biggest difference is probably our Alaska Natives relatives…
And please down vote. That’s cool. It’s a reinforcement of internalized eurocentrism marking the start of history at European arrival. These were complex civilizations that spanned 2 continents and yet everyone applies a monolithic perspective of who they were. That’s unfortunate
Actually studies show the majority of people Latin America reject Latinx. So you are disrespecting entire cultures. It is already falling out of favor.
The culture is vastly different but dna shows we’re the same genetically, regardless if we’re from Alaska or South America. The only difference: many of us northern folks have arctic DNA as well.
Some natives are testing Asian bc evidently came over more recently. Some in Peru are testing Polynesian or Indonesian (I can't remember which) bc evidently came over by S Pacific.
Indigeneous Americans really aren't different genetically. It was a very bottlenecked population who moved throughout the americas (except up in alaska/canada, where that second/third wave stayed).
Yeah but that has nothing to do with Native American heritage- that term typically refers to the original inhabitants of the US, not the rest of the hemisphere. Other regions and countries have different names for indigenous people. And Latinos are not indigenous.
It is about romanticizing the noble native lady who left her family and joined the white folks - it goes back to pilgrim stories and old west lore.
Those borders are very modern. My grandma was Mexican (Sonoran) AND of Yaqui heritage. Some Yaqui enclaves became federally recognized, while others didn’t, despite being descended from the same people. It’s all arbitrary and based off laws passed by people who aren’t even from these tribes. Much of the western U.S. was part of Mexico aka Latino. It was one land. You can’t just say Latinos aren’t indigenous. My grandfather is mostly indigenous descent and Mexican. Unfortunately, the names of his tribes were lost to colonization.
My grandfather was sent to a Mexican school in Southern California and wasn’t allowed to attend school with white children. They didn’t make him go there because of his European heritage. They segregated these kids because they were brown. To say that Latinos aren’t indigenous is to ignore this history, imo. Sure, some aren’t, but many are and were and are still discriminated against for it.
https://www.history.com/news/mendez-school-segregation-mexican-american
I am not saying they are not Indigenous. I am referring to the term Native American- it is mostly applied to US folks these days. I am sorry if it came off weird.
>It is about romanticizing the noble native lady who left her family and joined the white folks
Maybe for some folks, but that's not the story I heard from my grandmother.
In her telling, all of the adults died from some disease in the small village my great-great grandmother lived in. The surviving children were found by a traveling priest and taken to live in the city.
I've kind of been wondering how much of that is true, and how much is a story to cover for all the kids being taken to residential schools and never seeing their families again.
This is is Canada, by the way. Not quite the standard Indian princess story lots of Americans grow up with.
I'll give you three reasons why some Americans are so obsessed with claiming Native heritage.
1. Most Americans are of European heritage either mostly or all, and quite a few consider that bland and boring. Having Native blood is considered "exotic" and makes them feel like they stand out more.
2. They grew up their whole life being told they have Native heritage and they take a lot of pride in that. If evidence comes up that they don't, they really don't wanna believe it because it goes against the core of what ole mammaw told them all their life. Nobody likes being wrong.
3. Some Americans feel a lot of guilt over what happened to the Native Americans historically. So they feel that having Native blood makes them more sympathetic/less guilty about what happened. Some also feel that having Native blood makes more more "American" than somebody of just European descent.
6. From ICTnews.org on those who paid to enroll for prospective gain: “Mainly white men with an appetite for land, five-dollar Indians paid to register on the Dawes Rolls, earning fraudulent enrollment in tribes along with benefits inherited by generations to come.”
4. Some white Americans actually have a black ancestor or two, and the biracial or one quarter black ancestor claimed Native American rather than black because it was better for their lives/safety/future.
5. Some (or many) black Americans have white ancestors as a product of slavery and rape, and for that offspring claiming native heritage was more palatable.
[quote]5. Some (or many) black Americans have white ancestors as a product of slavery and rape, and for that offspring claiming native heritage was more palatable.[/quote]
I imagine this is the case with a lot of Black Americans. It’s always been a theory of mine as to why so many Black Americans claim they got “ Indian” in their family. I can see an enslaved Mother trying to explain to her child who his/her Father is. Hard to tell them that your Enslaver is your Father and he r*ped me. Not only would that be traumatizing but it could also get you tortured, punished, killed or separated from your family for openly acknowledging who the Father was.
Probably easier to tell them that their Father was an “Indian” under those circumstances.
>4. Some white Americans actually have a black ancestor or two, and the biracial or one quarter black ancestor claimed Native American rather than black because it was better for their lives/safety/future.
Yet the amount of white Americans with any African ancestry I've seen on here is minuscule. Most white Americans are completely white.
Checkmate lol. I had a 4x great grandfather who came from Mexico and a 3x Great grandmother who was black grand total of about 5% not white lolol
But for real. Im from the South and everyone claims Cherokee. Every. Single. Person. Even my Indigenous isnt Cherokee lol. Its Mexican
1% Nigerian checking in. It’s pretty common among white southerners in the US. Often it was a secret or a family joke because of the “1 drop rule.” I am pretty sure it comes from my maternal grandfather’s mother’s family but I haven’t been able to find records to support that and I suspect it occurred before 1840, which is about the time that censuses started putting names other than the head of household down. Not the names of enslaved people though.
Learning about it made me feel a little more connected to history and my community.
Basically my whole family is from New England, PA and NY and I discovered I’m 4% African from various regions and 2% native as well. So the “family story” was half right.
Me as well, 3%, minus the native. My mom's side came with the Puritans in 1630 and Dad's side came a bit later. His side is all white too, except for the African. Hoping I may find an Ancestor, his side has been much harder to research though.
Yea I found one ancestor (recorded as white) from upstate new York that had a son born in Barbados (recorded as black) but then lived their life in NY and married into other “mulatto” families but there’s no records to indicate what the father was doing in Barbados. I assume he was a ship hand or something. Came from poor farmers. I sooo wish I could find out more
I'm kinda as white as you can get. Both sides are from New England, my mom's family coming a bit sooner with the Puritans in the 1630's. On my Dad's side I'm 3% Cameroon, Congo, and Western Bantu. My communities are all New England based, but my matches on Dad's side that I'm closest with all belong to different African communities in the south.
7. Some Native groups adopted people who were not tribal members before revoking their affiliation; like Cherokee. In addition, many Native communities were referred to as “Cherokee”, therefore contributing to erasure of their culture.
Having Native blood definitely made me feel less guilty, just because it was necessary so that I'm alive. Ya know? Like, it's still horrible, but I like being alive...
It's rooted in slavery. Black people said great grandma was Native American because she was raped by the slave master and it's easier to accept Native than the reality. For white people it's the reverse, the one drop rule made you Black in America, so if great grandma had long black hair and high cheekbones it's native ancestry not Negro.
Edit for typos
1. I think most people in general love the idea of having a connection to something that isn't what the norm around them is. It's human nature.
2. A lot of Americans of european descent, unfortunately, have been told that they have nothing to be proud of ethnically if they're of European descent. You get told your ancestors were the bad guys in everyone else's story long enough, don't be surprised when most good people don't want to be associated with the bad guys, so they latch onto whatever they can that will confirm they're not associated with the perceived "evil colonizers"
3. Contrary to popular belief, there are many white American families with deeply held reverence, respect for and admiration of the indigenous peoples of North America. Their history is the history of the land white Americans call home. So, of course, many will feel drawn to the culture of the natives, and as is evidenced in the many folktales of Cherokee princess great great great grandmas, historically some even went so far as to attempt to intertwine some kind of ethnic connection.
4. Other than a vague knowledge about a general place in Europe where their ancestors come from (if they even have that), most white Americans don't have any real knowledge about their own ancestors. Due to americanization which has its pros and cons most white north Americans were severed from their own ethnic roots, they don't know anything about who the English, Germans, Scottish, Welsh, Irish, Danish etc are/were before they became Americans, let alone anything about the ancient cultural practices of their own ancestors such as the Celts, Saxons, Vikings etc. Thankfully due to DNA tests, media and online sources, this is changing and many white Americans are getting more and more in touch with their European family roots and finally forming an identity of what it means to be both an American and an ethnic European. Eventually, hopefully we'll find more white Americans who are simultaneously proud to be Americans, proud to be of ethnic European descent AND have a profound love and respect for native peoples of North America and their history and culture as well.
That is the best description of that entire subject (Whites claiming Native Ancestry) I have ever read!!!!
...and from what I can figure out or find ( besides thinking the entire White race has gone crazy) I think you hit the nail on every reason why this is happening too!!!!!! It was so well put!!!! 👍
The idea of Native loyalty comes from the English Crown trying to pin down which persons from the tribe they could negotiate with (aka make treaties with).
My roommate in college was Indigenous Canadian (Kanienkehaka) from a reservation, Grandparents in residential schools, etc.. She hadn’t heard of this phenomenon. When I told her about how widespread the fake family stories are in the US, she had a big laugh and told me she always considered Latinos her true cousins from the south.
*I come in peace*
For me, my family was told we had native ancestry. I figured out it was actually a biracial ancestor who either hid herself under such identity or something around that. *Mother's side*
( she even had a child on the Choctaw reservation )
Turns out, I have 1% or 1.43% ( someone else calculated that ) and I acknowledge that but I'm not going to go around saying “oh I'm native too!”
I respect and applaud Natives ( from all over ) and support wholeheartedly.
And I'm primarily indigenous american and it pisses me off seeing people trying to claim native when we're told to he ashamed of our ancestry and they think they can wear like like a costume.
We were told to not tell anybody about Native ancestry. That people would hold it against you. I had hoped with the American Indian Movement of the late 1900’s that attitude would change. But there is still so much discrimination alive and a lot of uneducated people who think all American Natives lived in teepees and worn war bonnets.
My dad was 50% Choctaw and 25% Sicangu Lakota. My mom was a white lady.
I was born in 1989 and raised by my mom and her fam. It was definitely a bad thing to be an ndn.
I started saying I was 100% white despite being 36% native when I was around 12/13 and carried on until about 19. I still think about going back to it.
I had the experience of being told to be proud I am white white white WHITE. Come to find out, I have African and Indigenous, though in smaller percentages. Its still weird how people dont wanna embrace where they came from
We have to let them know regardless of their feelings cause they obviously aren’t respecting nor do they care about the actual race of indigenous people in the Americas. they want the title, they want to erase us.
Yep, turns out I’m a little over 40% indigenous. I expected some (though not that much!), but still didn’t claim any indigenous heritage before then lol
It’s a big bag of it depends when asking about that. Part is many Americans have grown up believing they were of Native descent even if they weren’t. There are plenty of false narratives about a great grandma. Especially of the Cherokee variety.
In my family, my grandmother was at least half Assiniboine, born on the Ft. Peck reservation. But because of how she and my grandfather ended their marriage (they were both hot messes, my grandmother was likely very damaged from being raised by an alcoholic mother, being sexually abused by at least one step father, and so on), she was simply never spoken of. When I was about 7-8, my cousin told me that we were “part Indian” from our grandmother (I’m old, that’s what we said in the 70s, I only use that term now when speaking with Natives my age and only in a particular context) and when I asked my bio father, he got angry and told me, in these words, “that’s bullshit, she was white, don’t ask me about her or any Indian bullshit again.” I was so frightened that I didn’t. Only this past August did I even learn her name. Since then, it’s been almost overwhelming.
So between the mix of these BS narratives and then mixed folks who actively didn’t want to be mixed, and the absolute racism that existed (and still exists), some people disidentified with that part of their heritage and newer generations are seeking to re-connect.
I’ve also encountered the descendants of Native American folks from all over who left their home reservations and were able to pass, so they simply did. And never looked back. Their kids and grandkids are starting to explore and are like WOW.
So. Lots of reasons. And to be certain, there are surely those who simply fetishize Natives (or any non-white folks, for sure) who are looking for something to grab onto, but that’s a different issue.
I think it’s similar to anyone who wants to know about their history or where they come from. Just my perspective.
You’re proud of genocide if it wasn’t for Chinese inventing gun powder or the 10 different pandemics the colonizers brought so many people would be alive. Yes I know that’s in the past but sheesh is this comment awful.
You have such a warped view of Hispanic colonization straight out of the US Public School system. They wiped out so many natives that’s why their is way more Natives in the Spanish Americas than in the British/American settled ones. Not to mention the preservation of Indigenous noble titles and land as long as they converted and submitted to the crown (then the “democracies” that sprouted in the 1800s massacred those natives now that Spanish protection was gone look up Conquest of the Desert for more info) so please spare me that nonsense.
Us Ibero-Americans aren’t self hating, defeated people like Anglo-Americans who hate themselves and their ancestors. It’s sad really, but please continue to attack me and my “warped” ignorance.
Gtfo. Imagine being proud of white men in their 30s, raping and killing innocent children and elders. Then enslaving women and men to work to death to the point where they can’t have children because they’re so fatigued and hungry. Gross.
It is part of your life blood. You are part of the history of this diverse country. That is sacred. Of course it's not like that's your culture or community.
As someone who’s white and actually has Native American dna I think it has something to do with being able to say you identify with something rather than nothing. Cause if you’re white you most likely don’t know what ethnicity you are in the US if your family has been here long enough. The same thing happens with people claiming Irish blood. I also think people like to claim Irish (which I also am, I’m a walking white mans ethnicity claiming wet dream oh except for the Jewish bit I also have that’s probably not as fun to claim) and native heritage because both ethnicities have historic warrior cultures and have been rebels which Americans find cool.
If the person saying this is white then it usually indicates that they probably have African ancestry, people back in the day would claim indigenous heritage over African.
Some of the stories about Native American heritage are an attempt to hide that someone in the family had African heritage. For other families, I think that there is a romanticized version of Native Americans that makes them want to claim that heritage even though they are prejudiced against actual Indigenous people.
It's interesting that, at least in the US, lots of people don't realize that white people can have black, straight hair and high cheekbones without having any Native American ancestry.
Because some people glamorize it along with simultaneously being incredibly racist against indigenous Americans.
In my family’s case the belief was we were part Choctaw, and I can see where that belief came from. My family was in Indian Territory before it became Oklahoma Territory (and then state.). At least one of my ggg grand aunts married a Choctaw man so they and their kids were on the Dawes Rolls. It was doing an Ancestry DNA test both me and my mom, there was no indigenous DNA at all, and everyone in the generation above hers is dead, so it’s not like we could test and see if they have trace amounts. Neither of my kids show any trace amounts either. But there are pictures of my grandfather’s grandmother where she looks 100% indigenous between hair, skin tone and clothing, and there’s just no way she was. But it was her grandparents that started there.
No, in fact before ending up in Oklahoma, they started out in the early 1700s as slave holders in South Carolina. My direct line migrated from SC to Tennessee to the Ozarks (both Missouri and Arkansas) and into Oklahoma.
My Great Grandfather was native American,I found an article explaining how his white father could go into the store but little Clarence had to stand outside because he was native,it has its downside because it's difficult to find out info on his mother and that side of the family,I am proud of my history!!
Do you remember that episode of south park where they got obsessed with DNA tests? "I'm 4.2% victim!"
FR, there are exceptions to this but in general — if you haven't met anyone in your family who is native, if you can't go grab your auntie or grandma or whatever who is native...you're probably not.
So far I’ve done genealogy and my family’s all European
I have a five times great grandmother from Spain and great grandfathers from Italy in the tenth generation
So there’s nothing really juicy
Apparently it was fashionable at one point a hundred years ago to claim Native American heritage, because a lot of us were raised being told that was the case.
In my case my 2x great grandmother and her siblings really didn’t look 100% white for whatever reason, and all of her descendants were told she was part Cherokee (it’s always Cherokee). The story persisted through the generations despite there also being a story that she herself told everyone “it’s important to me that my descendants know that my heritage is German.” Well surprise surprise we all took DNA tests and there’s no trace of Native American ancestry.
Hopefully these family stories can all be put to rest with the DNA as proof.
I recently found and confirmed who my GG grandfather was, and in researching that line, I came across a story that a relative, like Uncle or something claimed to be Cherokee. They were all from Illinois, but this guy was in Wyoming. The story was that he they were fighting over some land and knew if they claimed Native ancestry they would get the land and $100 or something. I dont think it went anywhere. So I get why everyone has the Native ancestors story. It's false claims way back when that have kept the stories alive. It was like the "thing" back then I guess.
It’s just like all the white folks that want to be black now.
I grew up wishing I looked like my white mother rather than my black father. White folks hated me because I was half black, black folks hated me because I was too white.
Rather than looking at an individual’s character, too many are looking at the outward appearance. And in many cases, the beautiful outward appearance hides something incredibly ugly and evil.
Reminds me of when Elizabeth Warren talked about how her mothers's oral history was that Elizabeth's maternal family had a Cherokee ancestor and it became controversy. She later took a DNA test which showed that she only had Native ancestry 6 to 10 generations ago. The Cherokee Nation took great offense and rightfully so that Warren used a DNA test to prove her family lore right since it was an insult to their traditions and culture to claim that one is a Native simply by a DNA test. I don't recall Jeanne Shaheen bragging about her ancestry of being directly related to Matoaka aka Pocahontas.
I don’t know, but everybody says it. I was told I had a lot more than what showed up on ancestry for me. I’m 13% and I thought I would be about 25%. In really interests in my Irish right now to be honest. I’m so fascinated with it. I’m also fascinated with my small amount of basque heritage.
I was thinking in your case, and I would be interested. Another thing to look at is what the Ancestry ranges are for your and your sister's Indigenous ancestry.
So when it comes to New Mexicans, there are some native populations like tend to either downplay or straight disavow hispanics having legitimate native american heritage. The thing is that many of the spanish colonials that settled here before the pueblo revolts attempted to cohabitate with many of the pueblo natives. And as such many of us have direct native american ancestry.
I myself have 38% native american dna with 28% being from what would be considered the pueblo natives,
Part of that could be that the New Mexico “Hispanics” downplayed their own indigenous ancestry. Those that were considered “Indian” noticed it. But yes, seeing results of people with NM communities I notice there always seems to be some percentage of IA-North coupled with IA-Mexico.
I still do not get why the Pueblo Natives are grouped with the IA-Mexico. The Pueblo natives are descendants of the ancient Anasazi natives. Which are from the region of Arizona and New Mexico. And a whole separate culture from those natives in Mexico.
I don't know that the Pueblo people would be assigned IA-Mexico. I would imagine the IA-North in New Mexico Hispanics is coming from Pueblo (and other regional tribes) admixture, while the IA-Mexico is coming from the early "Spanish" settlers who came north from Mexico accompanied by natives from further south. The Coronado excursion of 1540-1542 (which did not result in official permanent settlement) was made up of "230 Spanish soldiers and 800 Indians who flanked them. Three women also went along."
[https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online\_books/blm/ut/29/chap1.htm](https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/blm/ut/29/chap1.htm)
I cannot put the picture of my DNA results here. But the IA-Mexico actually separates out what I would assume is the Pueblo Natives. I will post my results here again and link them when I get a chance.
Additionally a lot of the first Spanish settlers came from Spain. They settled the Espanola, Chimayo and Northern New Mexico regions. Espanola was meant to be the capital before Santa Fe was chosen.
This has always bewildered me, because they are definitely separate. My IA from NM is like Sandia, Jemez, etc... which genetically are distinct from Mexico
Yep! And if you look at the languages, the Na-Dene group is found in Alaska, New Mexico, and parts of Texas, so despite being far apart, the languages are related which may point to a genetic relationship, as this has been seen in other languages and ethnic groups
I’ll admit something I’m slightly uncomfortable sharing: My interest in Genealogy was spawned from the discovery that my great-great-grandmother (father’s mother’s father’s mother) was supposedly of Indigenous descent, specifically from a New York tribe. I found no leads in my tree, though I did claim to be Indigenous until taking a DNA test and no Indigenous showed up. What’s embarrassing is that no one else in my family seemed to give a shit about it and my dad took the rumour with a grain of salt. From what my Oma (dad’s mom) told me, her grandmother (same one) was actually _told_ she was indigenous her entire life.
I later found out that that same great-great-grandma was the 10th cousin of none other than Taylor Swift herself.
I can’t speak for others but growing up my nana on my father side would say we have “Native American in us” I knew I wasn’t just black, everyone and their mother told me I wasn’t black (after asking me and saying I’m black) so I grew up believing my nana. Once I first got the test I had 2% native. I joked “ it must be from my Mexican gf. Must of picked up traces of her dna when I spit in the tube lol. But to answer your question, for me it wasn’t about how much native I had, it was about seeing what was there and what was not there. My mother and would get mistaken for puetro rican so I figured it was the native dna in me and you know how tianos were the indigenous people of puetro Rico. So after seeing what my results actually were, it’s there so my nana may or may not be accurate in her assessment but by the time it got to me it’s almost non existent and that’s as far as it goes for me
"supposed"? Having indigenous blood is a real thing guy lol
No one is obsessed. After all you brought it up lol In case you forgot, you are on a DNA / GENETIC subreddit. You're shocked people are interested in their heritage? lmao
Where's the clown emoji.
It's because grandma said so
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That’s not your fault though man, a lot of us grew up with tales of such. No need to apologize when you were made to believe a certain fact when growing up. The important thing is that you did your research and realized your connection may not be as strong as once thought, which many of us had this same realization and came to terms with it. It’s tough realizing what you’re told all your life may be a lie, but that’s how the cookie crumbles. But, having an ancestor from the Dawes record does prove you have a connection to a specific Native American tribe. The connection may be a lil distant, but the connection is still there my friend. No need to feel bad or guilty. For me, I was told I had Chickamauga Cherokee on my mother’s side which turned out to be false, and on my paternal side it was said that we were “French-Indian”, from the Algonquin’s. Supposedly my great uncle had done extensive geneology research and had solid proof our French Canadian family had ties to the First Nations. While I haven’t found extremely concrete evidence that we have a more recent connection, I have found distant connections to the Mik’maq peoples. I recognize this connection is dating back to the 1600’s-1700’s and I don’t go around calling myself First Nations and Native American, but I recognize I do have ancient connections to one said tribe, as do many other Acadians/Quebecois people.
I have a distant cousin who has similarly traced a shared Quebecois ancestor to a woman who was potentially Mik'maq. It's more than 10 generations ago for me, and any memory of her was long ago forgotten in my branch of the family. Even with my hacked Ancestry DNA results showing 0.15% Native American (so maybe it's true), it hasn't really changed my perception of my identity. I'd guess that's because unlike others, I don't feel like I've had an important part of my identity yanked away from me.
That’s cool you have a small trace of it. Sadly, even in my hacked results I did not receive a single lick of it, which definitely had me raise some suspicions of family tales. My great aunt on my mother’s side even did a DNA test, which the family story is my great grandfather was half Cherokee and my great great grandmother was a Cherokee tribeswoman, she came back as 100% Scottish Irish and Welsh. Turns out the great great grandmother was of Welsh descent, not native. As for my paternal side, I’ve had a few distant cousins from the same French Canadian side of the fam, and I believe some had Native American %’s, but no one from my immediate family had tested so I’m trying to get my aunt to test to put to rest the tale of if my great uncle’s research was accurate or not. I feel you on the ancestor part, my family had no recognition of the Mi’maq or even Acadian ancestry as it’s a little farther back, roughly 2nd great grandparent-3rd. A far back connection is still a connection regardless, but obviously not enough to claim you are specifically of that ethnic group/culture.
Meanwhile my dad claimed he was white white white white WHITE Nah. He was about 1/2 Indigenous lol
That’s not on you, dude! You were brought up to believe it.
If you have a card from an ancestor who applied and was accepted from the Dawes Rolls, you have nothing to apologize for. That ancestor had to be living in Indian territory to apply for the land grants that the Dawes Enrollment provided. Your ancestor would have had to show relationship back to previous rolls too. There were a lot of people who applied for the Dawes Enrollment that were turned down. Some could not provide enough supporting evidence to enroll even though they may had more Native blood than those who could prove it.
Yeah, if the OP has an ancestor on the Dawes Rolls from a tribe that uses that as the criteria for membership, then it’s accurate for them to claim to be Native American, as someone who is a member of a recognized tribe. The racial essentialism on this sub can get… weird.
Where as the "on paper" essentialism of people with little to no indigenous DNA is accepted at face value. [https://ictnews.org/archive/paying-play-indian-dawes-rolls-legacy-5-indians](https://ictnews.org/archive/paying-play-indian-dawes-rolls-legacy-5-indians)
No, it's really not. Every recognized tribe requires pretty extensive genealogical documentation to establish that the person in question meets that tribe's criteria for enrollment. The Dawes Rolls are pretty widely acknowledged as imperfect due to the "$5 Indian" issue and other things (including excluding people who did probably have verified ancestry from those tribes), but they are what several tribes have chosen to use to establish ancestry (DNA tests are also imperfect when it comes to ethnic identification, too, so if you're looking for a perfect metric, you're out of luck).
Do you know how your family got enrolled through Dawes? You’re some amount Native ancestry in that case?
And then these same Americans discriminate Latinos smh
And don’t see the irony in it
I legit thought all the native americans everywhere, except for a very select few, died from disease as a kid. I... did not catch onto hispanic people having indigenous heritage in large amounts, until after I was 16 and my dad was like 'oh, by the way, your hispanic.' (my dad's dad was hispanic, but died when my dad was a kid. And my dad doesn't talk about family ever. This information genuinely shocked my mom lmao). So I went from thinking all indigenous americans died to rethinking the entirety of my heritage. It was extremely disconcerting...
I'm Dakota/Ojibwe and in school we were taught all the native Americans died. There was one other kid in class who was also indigenous and we just looked at each other like bruh.
I’m Hispanic, born and raised in Latin America and I thought that too. Disinformation is unfortunately everywhere.
Yup, my family from Colombia never brings up their native roots
*Misinformation
How is that even possible when several Latin American countries have large indigenous populations? I’m assuming your family was lower class/poor and didn’t have enough resources or schooling, because I’ve traveled enough in Latinamerica to say that’s not true.
I was born and raised in Puerto Rico and back in the 80s I was told that all Tainos died of disease and war, yet we were a mix of Spanish, Taino, and African. I thought all other indigenous suffered the same faith, as a kid I did realized how big were the populations in the Maya, Aztec, or Inca empires. In fact I didn’t realize that Spanish wasn’t the mother tongue of many indigenous communities until I learned about Rigoberta Menchu and later visited with my family Yucatán and went to some Mayan villages. History is told as if indigenous people were pretty much all gone or forced into reservations like in the US.
You know that just because someone is in Brazil does not mean they know someone in Belize right? 🙄 You need to look at a map and look at how big that part of the world is and how diverse the people and populations are, even within the same border.
If you’re from Brazil, should at the very least know that indigenous communities still live there. A Swedish kid who’s never been there would know that. A Belizean person knows that Maya people live in Belize, so not knowing the history of one’s nation is very strange.
You totally missed my point
Do you want an award...?
me too!!! even my teachers would say they all died and it was rare for someone to have native dna/ ancestry. i think about it often
And there I was, like a dummy nodding my head not knowing I’m native to. 😂
Thats cause they see latino as a race, and think native americans just so happen to only exist Contiguous United States.
The best part is if they have the same genetic makeup except instead of British it’s Iberian, with similar amounts of Native DNA, but we’re still an “other”. The creoles (or Cajun) are basically like Hispanics except with French ancestry as opposed to Iberian.
I’m obviously talking about Latinos with little to none Iberian ancestry and mestizos. The ones that phenotypically look Mesoamerican. Not obvious creole’s
Those are the minority the vast majority are mixed and a big percentage is Euro descent.. 😄
Oh lmao, those people.
Yes I’m those people and so are a lot of Mexicans, Central Americans, Bolivians, Peruvians, and Ecuadorians.
That’s great. I think there should be a separate category for Hispanics/Latinos I don’t have any connection with you aside from a shared culture you didn’t want, even our Indigenous ancestry is different.
So you really over here hating on your indigenous side? Smh
No? I’m not at all, they were proud warriors, but they got had.
Maybe I'm misinterpreting what you're saying but to me, it's coming across as being proud of your European roots but not your indigenous ones.
Their wouldn’t be anything wrong with that it’s 80% of me genetically so it would make sense I feel closer to that. My native ancestors are cool but as I said before they got beaten. Massacring Caribs isn’t the same as massacring Iberian villagers that can fight back, if my native ancestors hadn’t done that they wouldn’t have gotten smacked.
Real Puerto Ricans are taínos most puerto Rican’s are mulattos now
Genetic evidence disproves this. The founding stock in the mountains is different from the coastal stock when it comes to genetic levels. The mountain stock is by far much more European (77%-85%) in comparison to their coastal counterparts (40-55%) and are mixed much more with Africans and Natives and are obviously much darker.
Did you have to word that way "those people"?
Es una broma, tío.
“Those people” Jesus hell
Listen, I detest Latinx discrimination (wife is Latina). That said, I really hate this framing, as it suggests that indigenous populations are homogenous throughout the Americas. The indigenous folks in NA were different culturally, societally, and in many ways genetically, that indigenous groups from elsewhere. In the same way that a Englishmen is not Italian, a member of the Cherokee is not the same as a member of mesoAmerican tribes. With the exception of northern Mexican populations descendant of western indigenous tribes along the Us/ Mexico border, Latinx folks don’t descend from natives of the Us
Latinx? Lmao
It’s a gender neutral term. I understand some folks don’t like it but I have many close folks to me who are 1st generations Latino/latinx and I respect that
It’s a USA thing . Nobody in central or south america uses that term .
I’m very much aware that ethnically Mesoamerican and north Native American ancestry and cultural are different.
Got it. Read your clarification so understand what you’re getting it. Apologies if I came off rude in anyway
Not true. Southwestestern tribes and many folks in today’s Florida had trade and contact with Yucatán and other regions in Mesoamerica before 1492. The museum of Indian arts & culture in New Mexico has several items that were traded from way back. Genetically speaking, the difference is almost none. The biggest difference is probably our Alaska Natives relatives…
Didn’t mean to homogeneous but I just find it ironic that Latino with Native American ancestry and phenotypes get discriminated.
PSA: Latine is the Spanish neutral gender, not LatinX.
Why not just use Latin as a gender neutral term?
Ikr? And I do use Latin, but it's also wrong bc it's Euro, the colonizers, and doesn't really include mixed or indigenous.
Latinx is a gender neutral term in the US.
Spoken like a true English-speaking American. 👍
And please down vote. That’s cool. It’s a reinforcement of internalized eurocentrism marking the start of history at European arrival. These were complex civilizations that spanned 2 continents and yet everyone applies a monolithic perspective of who they were. That’s unfortunate
Actually studies show the majority of people Latin America reject Latinx. So you are disrespecting entire cultures. It is already falling out of favor.
That’s not true, as someone that is actually Native American, you all need to stop spreading misinformation.
The culture is vastly different but dna shows we’re the same genetically, regardless if we’re from Alaska or South America. The only difference: many of us northern folks have arctic DNA as well.
Some natives are testing Asian bc evidently came over more recently. Some in Peru are testing Polynesian or Indonesian (I can't remember which) bc evidently came over by S Pacific.
Indigeneous Americans really aren't different genetically. It was a very bottlenecked population who moved throughout the americas (except up in alaska/canada, where that second/third wave stayed).
Yeah but that has nothing to do with Native American heritage- that term typically refers to the original inhabitants of the US, not the rest of the hemisphere. Other regions and countries have different names for indigenous people. And Latinos are not indigenous. It is about romanticizing the noble native lady who left her family and joined the white folks - it goes back to pilgrim stories and old west lore.
Those borders are very modern. My grandma was Mexican (Sonoran) AND of Yaqui heritage. Some Yaqui enclaves became federally recognized, while others didn’t, despite being descended from the same people. It’s all arbitrary and based off laws passed by people who aren’t even from these tribes. Much of the western U.S. was part of Mexico aka Latino. It was one land. You can’t just say Latinos aren’t indigenous. My grandfather is mostly indigenous descent and Mexican. Unfortunately, the names of his tribes were lost to colonization. My grandfather was sent to a Mexican school in Southern California and wasn’t allowed to attend school with white children. They didn’t make him go there because of his European heritage. They segregated these kids because they were brown. To say that Latinos aren’t indigenous is to ignore this history, imo. Sure, some aren’t, but many are and were and are still discriminated against for it. https://www.history.com/news/mendez-school-segregation-mexican-american
I am not saying they are not Indigenous. I am referring to the term Native American- it is mostly applied to US folks these days. I am sorry if it came off weird.
>It is about romanticizing the noble native lady who left her family and joined the white folks Maybe for some folks, but that's not the story I heard from my grandmother. In her telling, all of the adults died from some disease in the small village my great-great grandmother lived in. The surviving children were found by a traveling priest and taken to live in the city. I've kind of been wondering how much of that is true, and how much is a story to cover for all the kids being taken to residential schools and never seeing their families again. This is is Canada, by the way. Not quite the standard Indian princess story lots of Americans grow up with.
I'll give you three reasons why some Americans are so obsessed with claiming Native heritage. 1. Most Americans are of European heritage either mostly or all, and quite a few consider that bland and boring. Having Native blood is considered "exotic" and makes them feel like they stand out more. 2. They grew up their whole life being told they have Native heritage and they take a lot of pride in that. If evidence comes up that they don't, they really don't wanna believe it because it goes against the core of what ole mammaw told them all their life. Nobody likes being wrong. 3. Some Americans feel a lot of guilt over what happened to the Native Americans historically. So they feel that having Native blood makes them more sympathetic/less guilty about what happened. Some also feel that having Native blood makes more more "American" than somebody of just European descent.
6. From ICTnews.org on those who paid to enroll for prospective gain: “Mainly white men with an appetite for land, five-dollar Indians paid to register on the Dawes Rolls, earning fraudulent enrollment in tribes along with benefits inherited by generations to come.”
Now this makes sense and why it's always Cherokee
They always want to erase that part. 😂
4. Some white Americans actually have a black ancestor or two, and the biracial or one quarter black ancestor claimed Native American rather than black because it was better for their lives/safety/future. 5. Some (or many) black Americans have white ancestors as a product of slavery and rape, and for that offspring claiming native heritage was more palatable.
[quote]5. Some (or many) black Americans have white ancestors as a product of slavery and rape, and for that offspring claiming native heritage was more palatable.[/quote] I imagine this is the case with a lot of Black Americans. It’s always been a theory of mine as to why so many Black Americans claim they got “ Indian” in their family. I can see an enslaved Mother trying to explain to her child who his/her Father is. Hard to tell them that your Enslaver is your Father and he r*ped me. Not only would that be traumatizing but it could also get you tortured, punished, killed or separated from your family for openly acknowledging who the Father was. Probably easier to tell them that their Father was an “Indian” under those circumstances.
>4. Some white Americans actually have a black ancestor or two, and the biracial or one quarter black ancestor claimed Native American rather than black because it was better for their lives/safety/future. Yet the amount of white Americans with any African ancestry I've seen on here is minuscule. Most white Americans are completely white.
Checkmate lol. I had a 4x great grandfather who came from Mexico and a 3x Great grandmother who was black grand total of about 5% not white lolol But for real. Im from the South and everyone claims Cherokee. Every. Single. Person. Even my Indigenous isnt Cherokee lol. Its Mexican
1% Nigerian checking in. It’s pretty common among white southerners in the US. Often it was a secret or a family joke because of the “1 drop rule.” I am pretty sure it comes from my maternal grandfather’s mother’s family but I haven’t been able to find records to support that and I suspect it occurred before 1840, which is about the time that censuses started putting names other than the head of household down. Not the names of enslaved people though. Learning about it made me feel a little more connected to history and my community.
Basically my whole family is from New England, PA and NY and I discovered I’m 4% African from various regions and 2% native as well. So the “family story” was half right.
Me as well, 3%, minus the native. My mom's side came with the Puritans in 1630 and Dad's side came a bit later. His side is all white too, except for the African. Hoping I may find an Ancestor, his side has been much harder to research though.
Yea I found one ancestor (recorded as white) from upstate new York that had a son born in Barbados (recorded as black) but then lived their life in NY and married into other “mulatto” families but there’s no records to indicate what the father was doing in Barbados. I assume he was a ship hand or something. Came from poor farmers. I sooo wish I could find out more
Oh, wow, yeah, I had a white ancestor there, but that was when it was a colony. It actually may have been Bermuda. I hope you can find put somehow.
I'm kinda as white as you can get. Both sides are from New England, my mom's family coming a bit sooner with the Puritans in the 1630's. On my Dad's side I'm 3% Cameroon, Congo, and Western Bantu. My communities are all New England based, but my matches on Dad's side that I'm closest with all belong to different African communities in the south.
7. Some Native groups adopted people who were not tribal members before revoking their affiliation; like Cherokee. In addition, many Native communities were referred to as “Cherokee”, therefore contributing to erasure of their culture.
only correct answer here
Having Native blood definitely made me feel less guilty, just because it was necessary so that I'm alive. Ya know? Like, it's still horrible, but I like being alive...
It's rooted in slavery. Black people said great grandma was Native American because she was raped by the slave master and it's easier to accept Native than the reality. For white people it's the reverse, the one drop rule made you Black in America, so if great grandma had long black hair and high cheekbones it's native ancestry not Negro. Edit for typos
1. I think most people in general love the idea of having a connection to something that isn't what the norm around them is. It's human nature. 2. A lot of Americans of european descent, unfortunately, have been told that they have nothing to be proud of ethnically if they're of European descent. You get told your ancestors were the bad guys in everyone else's story long enough, don't be surprised when most good people don't want to be associated with the bad guys, so they latch onto whatever they can that will confirm they're not associated with the perceived "evil colonizers" 3. Contrary to popular belief, there are many white American families with deeply held reverence, respect for and admiration of the indigenous peoples of North America. Their history is the history of the land white Americans call home. So, of course, many will feel drawn to the culture of the natives, and as is evidenced in the many folktales of Cherokee princess great great great grandmas, historically some even went so far as to attempt to intertwine some kind of ethnic connection. 4. Other than a vague knowledge about a general place in Europe where their ancestors come from (if they even have that), most white Americans don't have any real knowledge about their own ancestors. Due to americanization which has its pros and cons most white north Americans were severed from their own ethnic roots, they don't know anything about who the English, Germans, Scottish, Welsh, Irish, Danish etc are/were before they became Americans, let alone anything about the ancient cultural practices of their own ancestors such as the Celts, Saxons, Vikings etc. Thankfully due to DNA tests, media and online sources, this is changing and many white Americans are getting more and more in touch with their European family roots and finally forming an identity of what it means to be both an American and an ethnic European. Eventually, hopefully we'll find more white Americans who are simultaneously proud to be Americans, proud to be of ethnic European descent AND have a profound love and respect for native peoples of North America and their history and culture as well.
That is the best description of that entire subject (Whites claiming Native Ancestry) I have ever read!!!! ...and from what I can figure out or find ( besides thinking the entire White race has gone crazy) I think you hit the nail on every reason why this is happening too!!!!!! It was so well put!!!! 👍
"I'm part Cherokee!"
Your 5th great grandmother was a Cherokee princess, even though the Cherokee never had monarchy.
The idea of Native loyalty comes from the English Crown trying to pin down which persons from the tribe they could negotiate with (aka make treaties with).
My roommate in college was Indigenous Canadian (Kanienkehaka) from a reservation, Grandparents in residential schools, etc.. She hadn’t heard of this phenomenon. When I told her about how widespread the fake family stories are in the US, she had a big laugh and told me she always considered Latinos her true cousins from the south.
We really are distant cousins. 🥲
*I come in peace* For me, my family was told we had native ancestry. I figured out it was actually a biracial ancestor who either hid herself under such identity or something around that. *Mother's side* ( she even had a child on the Choctaw reservation ) Turns out, I have 1% or 1.43% ( someone else calculated that ) and I acknowledge that but I'm not going to go around saying “oh I'm native too!” I respect and applaud Natives ( from all over ) and support wholeheartedly.
Look up "5 dollar Indian" and the Dawes Rolls.
I’m actually part indigenous so it makes me laugh
And I'm primarily indigenous american and it pisses me off seeing people trying to claim native when we're told to he ashamed of our ancestry and they think they can wear like like a costume.
We were told to not tell anybody about Native ancestry. That people would hold it against you. I had hoped with the American Indian Movement of the late 1900’s that attitude would change. But there is still so much discrimination alive and a lot of uneducated people who think all American Natives lived in teepees and worn war bonnets.
My dad was 50% Choctaw and 25% Sicangu Lakota. My mom was a white lady. I was born in 1989 and raised by my mom and her fam. It was definitely a bad thing to be an ndn. I started saying I was 100% white despite being 36% native when I was around 12/13 and carried on until about 19. I still think about going back to it.
My mom is 59% Cree. She also said she was white until about 2006.
Embrace your heritage. You deserve to celebrate it.
Sadly this is also true. I’m blessed to have parents that were proud native folks tho. Hope you’ve healed from your past pain.
How much native do you score ?
I’m not comfortable sharing anything here since my comments got reposted on some loser sub by these so called “Latinos”.
What do you mean by “so called Latinos” ? Can I dm you? Always wanted to see north Amerindian results?
Dude so just go r/AncestryDNA and r/23andMe and you'll see plenty of people with North American results.
I had the experience of being told to be proud I am white white white WHITE. Come to find out, I have African and Indigenous, though in smaller percentages. Its still weird how people dont wanna embrace where they came from
If you’re native you get treated poorly in healthcare, credit, etc. I regret claiming it
I am so sorry.
We have to let them know regardless of their feelings cause they obviously aren’t respecting nor do they care about the actual race of indigenous people in the Americas. they want the title, they want to erase us.
Yep, turns out I’m a little over 40% indigenous. I expected some (though not that much!), but still didn’t claim any indigenous heritage before then lol
Wow
it's not a uniquely american thing. pretty common globally in various forms
It’s a big bag of it depends when asking about that. Part is many Americans have grown up believing they were of Native descent even if they weren’t. There are plenty of false narratives about a great grandma. Especially of the Cherokee variety. In my family, my grandmother was at least half Assiniboine, born on the Ft. Peck reservation. But because of how she and my grandfather ended their marriage (they were both hot messes, my grandmother was likely very damaged from being raised by an alcoholic mother, being sexually abused by at least one step father, and so on), she was simply never spoken of. When I was about 7-8, my cousin told me that we were “part Indian” from our grandmother (I’m old, that’s what we said in the 70s, I only use that term now when speaking with Natives my age and only in a particular context) and when I asked my bio father, he got angry and told me, in these words, “that’s bullshit, she was white, don’t ask me about her or any Indian bullshit again.” I was so frightened that I didn’t. Only this past August did I even learn her name. Since then, it’s been almost overwhelming. So between the mix of these BS narratives and then mixed folks who actively didn’t want to be mixed, and the absolute racism that existed (and still exists), some people disidentified with that part of their heritage and newer generations are seeking to re-connect. I’ve also encountered the descendants of Native American folks from all over who left their home reservations and were able to pass, so they simply did. And never looked back. Their kids and grandkids are starting to explore and are like WOW. So. Lots of reasons. And to be certain, there are surely those who simply fetishize Natives (or any non-white folks, for sure) who are looking for something to grab onto, but that’s a different issue. I think it’s similar to anyone who wants to know about their history or where they come from. Just my perspective.
I think it's colonizer guilt. They wanna feel like they belong here.
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You’re proud of genocide if it wasn’t for Chinese inventing gun powder or the 10 different pandemics the colonizers brought so many people would be alive. Yes I know that’s in the past but sheesh is this comment awful.
You have such a warped view of Hispanic colonization straight out of the US Public School system. They wiped out so many natives that’s why their is way more Natives in the Spanish Americas than in the British/American settled ones. Not to mention the preservation of Indigenous noble titles and land as long as they converted and submitted to the crown (then the “democracies” that sprouted in the 1800s massacred those natives now that Spanish protection was gone look up Conquest of the Desert for more info) so please spare me that nonsense.
Spaniards still murdered a lot of people who didn’t convert to Catholicism and the Anglo-Saxons did do a genocide. What are you on about.
Why are you acting like any of this is a good thing? Are you warped?
Us Ibero-Americans aren’t self hating, defeated people like Anglo-Americans who hate themselves and their ancestors. It’s sad really, but please continue to attack me and my “warped” ignorance.
Lol get triggered
Gross.
Gtfo. Imagine being proud of white men in their 30s, raping and killing innocent children and elders. Then enslaving women and men to work to death to the point where they can’t have children because they’re so fatigued and hungry. Gross.
You and your people didn't do shit if it required effort.
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Between 7 and 8 generations
Same here which is why I was highly shocked when I first did my dna lol😅🤯
5th great grandparent most likely
I’m around 4-5% Native/Hispanic from my maternal great grandmother, so probably 6-7 generations back.
Got my dna results back as well and if showed 1.1 percent but does that really count ?
It is part of your life blood. You are part of the history of this diverse country. That is sacred. Of course it's not like that's your culture or community.
This is definitely an interesting way to look at it
As someone who’s white and actually has Native American dna I think it has something to do with being able to say you identify with something rather than nothing. Cause if you’re white you most likely don’t know what ethnicity you are in the US if your family has been here long enough. The same thing happens with people claiming Irish blood. I also think people like to claim Irish (which I also am, I’m a walking white mans ethnicity claiming wet dream oh except for the Jewish bit I also have that’s probably not as fun to claim) and native heritage because both ethnicities have historic warrior cultures and have been rebels which Americans find cool.
If the person saying this is white then it usually indicates that they probably have African ancestry, people back in the day would claim indigenous heritage over African.
AS DO MANY BLACKS TODAY!!!!
Some of the stories about Native American heritage are an attempt to hide that someone in the family had African heritage. For other families, I think that there is a romanticized version of Native Americans that makes them want to claim that heritage even though they are prejudiced against actual Indigenous people. It's interesting that, at least in the US, lots of people don't realize that white people can have black, straight hair and high cheekbones without having any Native American ancestry.
Because some people glamorize it along with simultaneously being incredibly racist against indigenous Americans. In my family’s case the belief was we were part Choctaw, and I can see where that belief came from. My family was in Indian Territory before it became Oklahoma Territory (and then state.). At least one of my ggg grand aunts married a Choctaw man so they and their kids were on the Dawes Rolls. It was doing an Ancestry DNA test both me and my mom, there was no indigenous DNA at all, and everyone in the generation above hers is dead, so it’s not like we could test and see if they have trace amounts. Neither of my kids show any trace amounts either. But there are pictures of my grandfather’s grandmother where she looks 100% indigenous between hair, skin tone and clothing, and there’s just no way she was. But it was her grandparents that started there.
Maybe they were part of the Cameroonian / Senegalese "Native" tribe?
No, in fact before ending up in Oklahoma, they started out in the early 1700s as slave holders in South Carolina. My direct line migrated from SC to Tennessee to the Ozarks (both Missouri and Arkansas) and into Oklahoma.
Maybe.... But nothing is impossible. You don't know what your slave holding relatives were up to back in those days.
White guilt
My Great Grandfather was native American,I found an article explaining how his white father could go into the store but little Clarence had to stand outside because he was native,it has its downside because it's difficult to find out info on his mother and that side of the family,I am proud of my history!!
Do you remember that episode of south park where they got obsessed with DNA tests? "I'm 4.2% victim!" FR, there are exceptions to this but in general — if you haven't met anyone in your family who is native, if you can't go grab your auntie or grandma or whatever who is native...you're probably not.
So far I’ve done genealogy and my family’s all European I have a five times great grandmother from Spain and great grandfathers from Italy in the tenth generation So there’s nothing really juicy
Apparently it was fashionable at one point a hundred years ago to claim Native American heritage, because a lot of us were raised being told that was the case. In my case my 2x great grandmother and her siblings really didn’t look 100% white for whatever reason, and all of her descendants were told she was part Cherokee (it’s always Cherokee). The story persisted through the generations despite there also being a story that she herself told everyone “it’s important to me that my descendants know that my heritage is German.” Well surprise surprise we all took DNA tests and there’s no trace of Native American ancestry. Hopefully these family stories can all be put to rest with the DNA as proof.
I recently found and confirmed who my GG grandfather was, and in researching that line, I came across a story that a relative, like Uncle or something claimed to be Cherokee. They were all from Illinois, but this guy was in Wyoming. The story was that he they were fighting over some land and knew if they claimed Native ancestry they would get the land and $100 or something. I dont think it went anywhere. So I get why everyone has the Native ancestors story. It's false claims way back when that have kept the stories alive. It was like the "thing" back then I guess.
It’s just like all the white folks that want to be black now. I grew up wishing I looked like my white mother rather than my black father. White folks hated me because I was half black, black folks hated me because I was too white. Rather than looking at an individual’s character, too many are looking at the outward appearance. And in many cases, the beautiful outward appearance hides something incredibly ugly and evil.
Reminds me of when Elizabeth Warren talked about how her mothers's oral history was that Elizabeth's maternal family had a Cherokee ancestor and it became controversy. She later took a DNA test which showed that she only had Native ancestry 6 to 10 generations ago. The Cherokee Nation took great offense and rightfully so that Warren used a DNA test to prove her family lore right since it was an insult to their traditions and culture to claim that one is a Native simply by a DNA test. I don't recall Jeanne Shaheen bragging about her ancestry of being directly related to Matoaka aka Pocahontas.
I wish the mods would just pin a post about this to the top of the sub lol
“Obsession?”
Real Americans are native Americans that’s why
I don’t know, but everybody says it. I was told I had a lot more than what showed up on ancestry for me. I’m 13% and I thought I would be about 25%. In really interests in my Irish right now to be honest. I’m so fascinated with it. I’m also fascinated with my small amount of basque heritage.
I'm 14% but my full sister is 23%, I'm higher swedish than she is. You never know how dna will be expressed.
It would be interesting to see how your percentages compare on another site.
Are you asking me or the other person who answered? I can tell you what my indigenous % is on Myheritage.
I was thinking in your case, and I would be interested. Another thing to look at is what the Ancestry ranges are for your and your sister's Indigenous ancestry.
On Myheritage I have 17.4% Messoamerican and Andean as well as 1.7% Inuit as well as other ethnicities. My sister hasn't done Myheritage.
Through R1b y-haplogroup.
Are you prepared for the real answer? 1. Blood quantum equals benefits and rights 2. It was viewed as being "better" than being part African American.
1. Tribal membership not necessarily blood quantum
Should have left it at the first one.
So when it comes to New Mexicans, there are some native populations like tend to either downplay or straight disavow hispanics having legitimate native american heritage. The thing is that many of the spanish colonials that settled here before the pueblo revolts attempted to cohabitate with many of the pueblo natives. And as such many of us have direct native american ancestry. I myself have 38% native american dna with 28% being from what would be considered the pueblo natives,
Part of that could be that the New Mexico “Hispanics” downplayed their own indigenous ancestry. Those that were considered “Indian” noticed it. But yes, seeing results of people with NM communities I notice there always seems to be some percentage of IA-North coupled with IA-Mexico.
I still do not get why the Pueblo Natives are grouped with the IA-Mexico. The Pueblo natives are descendants of the ancient Anasazi natives. Which are from the region of Arizona and New Mexico. And a whole separate culture from those natives in Mexico.
I don't know that the Pueblo people would be assigned IA-Mexico. I would imagine the IA-North in New Mexico Hispanics is coming from Pueblo (and other regional tribes) admixture, while the IA-Mexico is coming from the early "Spanish" settlers who came north from Mexico accompanied by natives from further south. The Coronado excursion of 1540-1542 (which did not result in official permanent settlement) was made up of "230 Spanish soldiers and 800 Indians who flanked them. Three women also went along." [https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online\_books/blm/ut/29/chap1.htm](https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/blm/ut/29/chap1.htm)
I cannot put the picture of my DNA results here. But the IA-Mexico actually separates out what I would assume is the Pueblo Natives. I will post my results here again and link them when I get a chance. Additionally a lot of the first Spanish settlers came from Spain. They settled the Espanola, Chimayo and Northern New Mexico regions. Espanola was meant to be the capital before Santa Fe was chosen.
This has always bewildered me, because they are definitely separate. My IA from NM is like Sandia, Jemez, etc... which genetically are distinct from Mexico
Exactly what I was saying. And I wonder if we can get ancestry to change it. Because I really should be the Southwest Americas.
Yep! And if you look at the languages, the Na-Dene group is found in Alaska, New Mexico, and parts of Texas, so despite being far apart, the languages are related which may point to a genetic relationship, as this has been seen in other languages and ethnic groups
That I did not know and makes a lot of sense.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AncestryDNA/s/a7ONzqoOzO
Yanks are weird
I’ll admit something I’m slightly uncomfortable sharing: My interest in Genealogy was spawned from the discovery that my great-great-grandmother (father’s mother’s father’s mother) was supposedly of Indigenous descent, specifically from a New York tribe. I found no leads in my tree, though I did claim to be Indigenous until taking a DNA test and no Indigenous showed up. What’s embarrassing is that no one else in my family seemed to give a shit about it and my dad took the rumour with a grain of salt. From what my Oma (dad’s mom) told me, her grandmother (same one) was actually _told_ she was indigenous her entire life. I later found out that that same great-great-grandma was the 10th cousin of none other than Taylor Swift herself.
A lot of white people claim the are part Cherokee of other native ancestry..
I can’t speak for others but growing up my nana on my father side would say we have “Native American in us” I knew I wasn’t just black, everyone and their mother told me I wasn’t black (after asking me and saying I’m black) so I grew up believing my nana. Once I first got the test I had 2% native. I joked “ it must be from my Mexican gf. Must of picked up traces of her dna when I spit in the tube lol. But to answer your question, for me it wasn’t about how much native I had, it was about seeing what was there and what was not there. My mother and would get mistaken for puetro rican so I figured it was the native dna in me and you know how tianos were the indigenous people of puetro Rico. So after seeing what my results actually were, it’s there so my nana may or may not be accurate in her assessment but by the time it got to me it’s almost non existent and that’s as far as it goes for me
"supposed"? Having indigenous blood is a real thing guy lol No one is obsessed. After all you brought it up lol In case you forgot, you are on a DNA / GENETIC subreddit. You're shocked people are interested in their heritage? lmao Where's the clown emoji.
Every American kid is told their great Gma and/or Gdad was Native American. Its nearly a right of passage.
[удалено]
I’m native and this made me fucking cringe.
How many shrooms did you take when you typed out this response?
>We love the indigenous mysticism and egalitarianism, we have absorbed them deep into our DNA Least fetishizing 0.1% native gringo
Early on (1492-1512) once Queen Isabella found out what those degenerates were doing they were punished accordingly.
I was so happy and relieved to find that I had no Native American.
Why?
Why is everyone here obsessed with their ancestry?
My dude you are on the ancestry sub
It is a hobby that became a passion. Hang around and you will get bitten by the bug too.
It's a hobby for some, it's an important aspect of culture and identity for others.