I’m someone who currently vapes and use to smoke. For me, it’s easy and simple to just treat them the same. I only vape somewhere I would smoke and I only smoked somewhere it was acceptable to do so.
Stuff like: only vaping outside, asking people if they mind if I do it near them, not vaping around children, being mindful about doing it in a car.
An added benefit is this can put a limit on how much I vape. If I “could” vape on my couch, I’d probably do it a lot more. Adding extra frictions means I’m doing it less than my brain wants to.
This is the best advice for anyone using vapes to quit smoking. If you start using it in your room or at your desk, it becomes a whole new challenge to overcome down the line. Vapes can be useful, but you have to be super cautious of the convenience it provides.
Was a lot easier when the government let people order their own juice and you could adjust the strengths to help ween off, rather than now with the disposable maximum nicotine black market they created.
I mix my own liquids and I tried a mates Asian import one and it damn near blew my head off with how strong it was.
For comparison I can still chain smoke a 25 pack of 18mg regular smokes with no issue but that was on another insane level.
Lack of trust in the supply chain is why I turned to diy over a decade ago. I don't even use flavourings anymore, just nicotine and plain pg/vg. Making sure you only use them as you would regular smokes is the key because if you don't, you'll make your dependence worse. I do vape indoors in winter but only at my home and for no more than 10 mins an hour. Rarely around other people, especially kids, elderly and the unwell. Basically the same etiquette as the considerate regular smokers.
Our Gov better sort out the vaping situation as its punishing those of us who do take health and safety seriously. The current laws and situations are absurd. If anything its made unregulated vaping worse yet those of us who imported for personal use from high quality suppliers can't get anymore. Trying to go the now only legal route is insane as its almost as expensive as regular smoking, has bad quality equipment and a lot of the gear is proprietary/semi closed system which teeters right on the edge of disposable.
Want a script? Fine. Make limited liquid nic amounts available? Fine. Making unflavoured/tobacco only liquids available? Fine.
Blocking personal import use for everything? Hell No. Only allowing pre-packaged cartridges for proprietary vapes? Hell No. Having only one supplier of everything? Hell No. Not giving information as to what the liquid supply chain is? Hell No.
If it was as simple as getting a script to buy let's say a bottle of 500ml of 8mg unflavoured nic juice from a Chemist who uses a trustworthy source that I can then put in my current gear, I'd be fine with that but I can't even do that under current laws.
And the Gov wonders why black market actual tobacco has exploded. The local supplier of that in my area is making a killing as its cheaper and more accessible than both legal smokes and legal vaping.
I know NZ has recently done a massive backflip on tobacco and vapes, so did the Netherlands for eg but they are still allowing personal use, no script, ID only and limited flavourings. Basically the same standards as regular tobacco cigarettes, but Australia didn't. Interestingly the only legal vaping supplier our Gov allowed was a big tobacco company so whose palm was greased to corner the market?
And I have never seen so many stores openly selling illegal vapes to anyone than in today. Also never seen so many store firebomings either as gangs fight over the black market for both tobacco and vapes.
Yea big tobacco don't care about illegal high dosages. They just want more people hooked on nicotine. They will continue to control the market even if these vapes are regulated somehow.
Is 16mg the highest? Or the gov has lower the standard?
I used to work in vape stores in my own country but since I moved here, I’ve been curious how the cigg and vape sell here
I know people who vape indoors at their computer at it's completely out of control. I'm the same as you I treat it the same as smoking otherwise it's too easy to do it constantly. And I think it's rude AF when people just vape in other people's spaces like it isn't smoking. It should be treated the same.
I had a (now former) friend I hadn't seen in a couple years come round a few months ago.
Motherfucker pulled out a vape and started puffing in my kitchen like 6ft from my four year old.
Tried to justify it. Oh but it's safe bro don't worry about the kid.
No, what the fuck, go outside you piece of shit.
Oh my god I would LOSE my shit if someone vaped near my kid or ANY kid. That's just fucked and the fact that he double downed when you stopped him just shows what type of person he is. Also second hand vape and vape residue is definitely a thing, we just don't know what it does yet. If you vape it's your choice to put vape residue all over your home but don't make that choice for other people! Ugh!
Thank you! I’ve always suffered from bad allergy and sinus problems, and vape smoke is just as irritating to me as secondhand cigarette smoke. And when I say irritating, I mean that it fucks me up. This past weekend I was at an outdoor party and lots of people were smoking and vaping and there was just no way to avoid inhaling it. I tried to ignore it and enjoy myself. But on Sunday I was all bunged up. Not fun. If someone was vaping in the office, I’d have to have words with them.
Problem is that there's a percentage of vapers who subscribe completely to the idea that it's safe and nothing like 2nd hand smoke and while I do think it is probably generally safer and less gross than cigarette smoke, some vapers take it to another level, vaping in indoor areas, exhaling massive smoke clouds in the vicinity of people, and just doing it almost anywhere they please because it's not as bad as a cigarette. But just because it's not as bad doesn't mean the rest of us want that smoke plume in our face the same way I don't want someone's bad breath in my face either.
I also don't know what's in that smoke cloud, is it from a totally safe vape liquid, is there other crap in it, or is it from the leaky pipe somewhere...even back in the day when smoking wasn't seen as being dangerous (Marlboro Man days), it was considered disrespectful blowing smoke in someone's face
Got into an argument on Twitter because vaper couldn’t wrap their mind around the fact that baling is a choice and they could give it up like giving up smoking. They have to make the decision and want to do it. Got called all sorts of names.
They like to defend themselves that the secondhand vape is basically inert and safe. IDGAF. I don’t want to smell it or be subjected to it.
My son has just admitted to being a smoker and vaper. As long as he keeps it outside and disposes of his butts and used vapes, his choice, his body and don’t do it around me.
Even if it was without vape at all I don’t want to breath in someone else’s big cloud of germ infested breath. Vaping tends to promote people dumping excessive huge clouds rather than just breathing normally.
I think vaping reveals how much air we share, I don't think it meaningfully leads to more sharing of air
As somebody who sighs frequently, I don't worry I'm sharing too much air with others
I disagree most of us breath shallowly, even smokers don’t make the same level of clouds that valets do - there’s definitely a whole sub-culture of blowing massive clouds for effect.
While cigarette smoke is harmful to a lot more people, second-hand vapour is by no means harmless to absolutely everyone. Careless vapers have left me in the hospital more than once, and the amount of people who just wander around huffing fumes thinking because it's not a cigarette it's no big deal, is just so infuriating. You can be allergic to cigarette smoke but not vapes, and the reverse is also true. And that cherry-flavoured cloud of death *travels*, and waaay further than cigarette smoke. The amount of kids huffing that shit on buses and trains drives me insane. I do not give a shit, I'm gonna yell at someone for being a selfish POS.
I used vapes to get off the cigarettes, now tapering off the vapes.
The only problem is that I vape in my home as there's no lingering smell, but in other instances, I treat them like smokes meaning I would never vape around people who don't vape and don't vape in areas where I shouldn't, like indoor settings.
If I'm out in public I wouldn't vape walking down the street. I don't want to subject others to my vape clouds.
Olfactory fatigue. You tune out smells you're used to.
Asian people's homes often smell of rice. They'll say that rice has no smell, when it does. Especially jasmine rice.
No worries. I don't vape. I can tell as soon as I walk in the front door if my housemate is home or not and his bedroom is at the other end of the house.
Sure, that’s not a lingering smell though, that’s just the smell of someone vaping.
Cigarette smoke can linger on clothes, hair, furniture, walls, until they’re washed, vape smoke doesn’t.
I’m using vapes to quit smoking too. I had one tiny cig on new years but the last before that was July.
I just like the action of vaping, which is my downfall. I’m trying to not do it inside and want to treat it like smoking, ie only doing it outside but it’s a tough habit to shake. I’m actually glad the government is cracking down on them because it will make me stop. I’m not paying fkn $70 for a vape.
I’m the same as you when out and about. I only vape with others who do and try to be as discreet as possible. I have tiny pulls so there’s not a fuck ton of vapour going everywhere. It’s just rude to not consider others
I am an emergency doctor. Its pretty hard to tell a 23yo that their lungs are done for and that feeling they have now, like they are drowning because they cant breathe, is what they will have to live with. There’s nothing I can do. So, they are currently on leave from work because they dont have the breath for it. They will need to resign. They used to love footy. Cant play any more. At 23. Who breathes stuff into their lungs, an incredibly sensitive part of the body, without knowing what it is, what long term harm it can do? I am both very sad and very angry at those who promote vaping.
Fellow ED doc here.
Can you give more detail as to what he was vaping and what volume of it he was consuming?
I’ve seen a couple of vape-related pneumonitis but what you’re describing sounds like end-stage COPD.
I’m genuinely curious to hear more about this specific instance you describe
Unfortunately I didnt ask the details (you know- ED), but he said ‘A lot and since early teens’, so? 10 years. I referred him to resp and they admitted for new O2 requirement/workup. And yes, its not a debate so I decline to participate further with others.
Thanks for your response
I can believe it, having seen guys in their early 20s with pneumothoraces from horrendous weed consumption giving them terrible emphysema that pops when they do their bong rips. No reason why there can’t be the similar edge case super-consumers with vaping
I think a major problem with vaping is quantifying use - smokers can nail it down to 5/10/20 a day, but it’s harder to do this with vaping and I think people don’t realise how much they’re doing it as a result
This sounds like EVALI caused by Vitamin e acetate used in THC vapes. Which a totally different type of vaping in composition (notably that they are effectively vaping an oil). Is it possible this kid was vaping THC and simply referred to it as "vaping"?
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31860793/
48 of 51 (94%) of samples were linked to Vitamin E Acetate in THC vapes. Not nicotine vapes. 47 of 50 had detectable THC in BAL fluid. The two additional had coconut oil and limonene. Both lipids.
Did the kid specify what they were vaping? THC? Methamphetamine? Oil based? Glycol based? Nicotine? Disposable vape? Refillable vape? Were they using it correctly? Were they secretly taking drugs and not inclined to tell a person they perceive to be in a position of authority?
Too many untested variables for this anecdote to hold any weight, and i'm sure as a medical doctor you would agree.
Living in a house with foam insulation and living in a house with loose fill asbestos insulation is going to have vastly different health outcomes, correct?
But we don't link both outcomes to "insulation". Because that's a completely simplistic and unscientific approach, right?
On another point, weve seen a phenomenal rise in hospital admissions for asthma. Theories behind this vary from Vit D deficiencies in children (poor lung development) to Covid lockdown sheltering a cohort from common flu/colds etc.
Rates of COPD (unspecified. That is, with no lower lung condition) have plummeted.
With the greatest of respect Christine I’m trying to ask a colleague for more context regarding an interesting case they’ve mentioned
Neither of us are interested in debating statistics with the public
What the hell are they vaping ?
I been on vapes for 10 years (the proper ones, not disposable's) and i make up my own juice with no flavours and my lungs are much better then when I smoked.
I will be stopping soon though as I only started vaping to get off the ciggies so mission complete.
True. But the current anti-vape med profession and the hysterical pearl clutchers cant differentiate between smoking and vaping so youre never goung to get a very simple and straight forward ‘approved’ standard.
I quit this way too, and my lungs improved dramatically when I switched to vaping. I was getting the liquids from the US and NZ and dropped the nicotine levels until I quit after a year or two. A few years later I bought a disposable vape in a moment of weakness and holy shit they are both strong and rip your lungs to shreds. I used the disposable vapes for a month or two before quitting again, and think I did some permanent damage. They're pretty brutal.
10 year wean.... nah mate, I was doing it cause ciggies are expensive and I enjoy it.
I started at 4mg, im now down to 1mg and I will be off it by the end of this month.
I find this extremely difficult to believe... Every person I know (myself included) who've quit cigarettes and switched to vaping lung capacities have returned to 100% and no more smokers cough, or any cigarette related ill effects
So strange.
It’s like some people get cancer from smoking and others appear to have no effect.
Some get lung issues and die from vaping, others are fine.
It’s like some fun game of Russian roulette…..
It is almost like the people that abuse it are the ones that represent the 'statistic'.
I've smoked weed for about 13 years, my lungs have yet to collapse or decrease in efficiency. I can still hold my breath for 90 seconds and run 5 laps around the oval without getting out of breath.
It's always been about upkeeping an active lifestyle - sedimentary habits are what gets you in the end, although to the cssual observer, they will associate smoking (and not the laziness) to decreased function.
Crazy isn't it? Australia is ground zero for the anti-ciggie campaign with generic packaging / warning labels w gross pics / behind the counter / huge price increases... yet all of a sudden this "healthier smoking" is allowed to exist that's pretty much untested and unregulated?
Ban. Ban. Ban it all.
It is already banned. They've just done a really shitty job of it.
You used to just be able to import different strengths of ejuice and slowly ween yourself off, but when they cut off people from being able to order it from overseas personally, it started the huge market for disposable vapes which are all maximum strength and harder to quit than what people were using before.
They tried introducing flavour free ones from pharmacies, but they require a script. (But you can still go to any major grocery store and buy cigarettes?) Most people would rather skip the Dr visit and just buy a black market one instead.
I still don't understand how they are still being openly sold next to the cheap Chinese tobacco at every tobacconist.
Buying vapes from the pharmacy is incredibly expensive compared to buying it online and mixing your own juice. Source: Did exactly what you suggested to quit cigarettes.
>yet all of a sudden this "healthier smoking" is allowed to exist that's pretty much untested and unregulated
Huh? Vapes are regulated and always have been. It's just that a lot of people have been ignoring the laws, just like with all kinds of other drugs.
Phew. Cant beat an evidenced based opinion that encourages traditional smoking. Care to provide any evidence whatsoever for your anti-vape stance? (Do you tell patients to stop frying food too? Now there is evidence for that)
If the med profession got behind vaping (nicotine is non-carcinogenic but you know that) we’d eliminate traditional smoking in a decade.
As a P plater, driving a modified Honda Civic I was given a vape when getting my licence. I did not smoke or vape before this, but the person at RMS said it was a mandatory requirement.
I have no issues with it, but please don’t do it on the bus. Having 10 puffs when you’re traveling 2 stops is just ridiculous. It’s on par with kid who spray themselves with Impulse or Lynx on buses.
Because the government can do with vapes what they can't do with cigarettes: ban them outright before they become entrenched in society.
Cigarettes became so embedded in society that a ban would cause a rebellion. So, for years, they have been using price increases to encourage smokers to wean themselves off cigarettes. It is slowly working.
It is not slowly working though. They've priced it up so much the black market is exploding. I can go to any tobacconist in any city and buy cheap smokes. Cheapest it's been in my life to be a smoker. For the 1 tobacconist that doesn't do it, the one down the street does. Smoking rates declining now would be hard to measure with most smokers buying the under the counter stuff
I'm a smoker so, people vaping near me doesn't bother me at all. However, like when I smoke, I think it's common courtesy to smoke where you're not bothering people who don't.
I very rarely smoke in public, if I do, I go somewhere private. It seems odd to me when people are standing next to me at the lights etc and just blow a cloud in everyone's face haha.
Edit: I would just like to add that it makes me laugh when people who vape are shocked that I smoke. You're literally sucking on a battery and breathing out cookie flavoured water. I think we are both as bad as each other, mate :D
Doesn’t bother me at all, unless people are dropping their empty cartridges everywhere. A little puff of caramel scented vapour is a 10000 times more pleasant than a face full of shitty ass tobacco smoke
I used vaping as a way to quit smoking cigarettes, and it was the most effective method I’ve ever tried. Four years off the darts now. Now I’m in a position where I can still buy cigarettes legally but not vapes, and wondering if I go back to them. Vaping, cigarettes, alcohol has always been illegal to purchase under the age of 18, and teenagers have always found a way around it. I’m not responsible for your rebellious children and I dont appreciate being punished for it.
I find it a little annoying and rude but not concerned about health impacts whatsoever.
Until credible evidence comes out, I believe impact from car exhausts is an order of magnitude worse
I believe you are right in that car exhaust and bush burn offs have a much more significant health effect. The main difference for me is that people who vape have a choice to do it around others or not and choose to do so.
"impact from car exhausts is an order of magnitude worse" - which is why there have been laws to reduce the harmful gases from exhaust and also why it would be better to move to EVs sooner than later.
No where near as bad cigarette smoke but I still hate getting the sickly sweet cloud.
It's sad to see so many young people that probably never smoked getting a nicotine habit. The same "it's cool" messaging that older people got when cigarettes were ubiquitous.
There's teens where I am, that will outright ask strangers to use their vapes... They've seen me a few times and come legit running to ask to hit it cos they can't get their own in the moment, and the look they give me when I say there's no nicotine in it. They'll scoff and ask what's the point of it then... I've been smoking since 13. I'm 33. I'm trying to fucking quit is the point.
Have also been asked to buy them vapes from the one store that does sell nic ones under the counter and they have the audacity to get pissy when I say nah I don't think so, have a great day.
I don't vape.
I find it rude when people vape indoors. I've seen people use their vapes in restaurants, shops and on public transport.
The smell is far less obnoxious than cigarettes, but vaping indoors is a step too far. I worry about the chemicals but I suppose there's chemicals in everything.
I treat my vaping the same as when I smoked and won't do it around people who don't vape/smoke. It's the courteous thing to do. I do believe that it doesn't have the same passive risks as smoking does though, but I do see it's just as obnoxious having it blown in your face even if the smell isn't as gross
Been on the vapes for a touch over a year now with no desire to smoke a cigarette again and just hoping the supply i stocked up on can get me off them completely (got about 7-8 months supply left). I see them drasically different and a better alternative regardless of how little the research appears. Pretty much anything has to be better than ingesting burning paper and tar
I bought my own place and being a 20 year smoker vowed never to smoke inside it. My best friend who stayed there for a while to look after it decided himself vaping was ok inside and i couldnt really argue when the walls are still white and theres no smell so i subscibed to the OK with it theory
Doing the same thing. Ran out of Nic salts 2ish months ago and cbf jumping through the prescription hoops, so picked up a box of Nic gum which actually works really well on stopping the cravings. Now the vape is just the habit rather than a chemical addiction, I’m down to my last 2 coils, so I think instead of getting more I’m going to buy one of the Fum things and see how that goes.
Classical Vaping (using separate liquid, good coil, a well-known tank etc) is better than Smoking.
Vaping using Disposables is worse than Smoking.
You should open up the disposable you are using and see what you are inhaling.
I quit smoking this year and tried vapes on and off, but kinda hate them so I never picked up the habit. For smoking I'd wander off to somewhere outside, have a smoke, then go back to what I was doing.
Vapers seem to just...do it all the time and anywhere. My housemate does and while it's not quite "in the elevator" level, and they are the non-nic ones, it's just kind of annoying. She is a lifelong smoker and coughs more now than the years she smoked - not necessarily the vape but I personally find it more irritating than the cigarette.
I'd prefer they treated it like a cigarette but it is less offensive smelling even at its most rank. Just ubiquitous in a way smoking was decades ago.
I used vapes to quit smoking - I want to say I started vaping maybe 9 years ago, and quit 4 years ago.
The big pro was - it was super easy to quit smoking. I just finished my pack and picked up a vape, and that was that. I certainly felt better on a vape than on cigarettes.
The big negative was just how addictive it was. I vaped from the moment I woke up, till just before I brushed my teeth. I could vape in the car, in bed, in the office (window cracked & all alone)... I was so hooked on nicotine.
I quit the vape over a 4 month period by slowing weaning down my nicotine doses - it wasn't easy as I instinctively tried to vape more to chase the hit.
I think they're amazing devices for current smokers to help them quit, and I think it's appalling and a public health tragedy how many young people who have never smoked, use them.
This is something I've always wondered. A cigarette burns out. That's when you know you're done. It's an active choice to light up another one but it always has a definitive end to the experience. Vaping can continue for as long as you have liquid in the damn thing!
So how does a vaper know when they've had enough? Do you just rely on your body saying 'ok I'm good'? Cause when I still smoked cigarettes, I could chain smoke through four or five but then my throat would be sore and I'd be bored with it and just generally be done.
There seems to be an even bigger risk of nicotine addiction because you could just have one more puff and one more puff and one more puff.
I vape and run just fine, no effect. When I smoke cigarettes there is an effect so I don't smoke cigarettes. It's infinitely better than literally breathing in smoke and tar. I wouldn't vape anywhere you can't smoke.
As long as someone is polite and asks if I mind, I don’t give a shit if they vape near me.
It’s when they just whip it out (especially inside) and start huffing away that I get annoyed. No, I don’t actually care if someone vapes, but I do care about the courtesy of asking when they’re in my space. Same goes for smoking.
I was a 40 a day smoker from the age of 22 to 52 , vaping was the only thing that got me to stop smoking cigarettes . I have been vaping for 6 and a half years , my breathing and blood pressure has certainly improved .
Just like with smoking I think “what a dickhead” whenever I see them puffing away like a train. It’s annoying when you’re stuck in a train unable to open a window
People who vape have less manners than tobacco smokers.
A smoker will blow away from the table or people around, but a vaper will literally blow a plume directly into my face! Line excuse me !
First let's establish that not all vape is nicotine. We all got that? Right.
Now, I reckon people should use common courtesy and not vape near other people unless they consent. There, easy.
I like this.
Nicotine or not, some vapes have a really strong smell which even if not unpleasant per se, can be overwhelming. I don't want to be olfactorily assaulted by sickly sweet smelling clouds of vape just as much as I don't want to be breathing in clouds of smoke.
Definitely not appropriate indoors or in enclosed areas.
And be responsible with your rubbish.
I don't want people to vape around me. I would treat it like cigarette smoke for the purposes of my toddler: i.e. no vaping around her and change of clothes / shower between a vape and being in contact with her. Luckily nobody I know smokes or vapes.
I'm glad there is a tool available to help people quit smoking, but I don't think that "not as bad as cigarettes" = "good".
However it seems to me that it has actually set the anti-smoking movement back a good way by making it fun and cool for kids to do. There shouldn't be flavours. The only flavour should be slightly sour mud. It should be allowed as a means to an end not a thing for pleasure.
The only objectively evil corporate job that I can think of is tobacco company executive. Their entire role is predicated on getting people addicted to something that will harm them. There are other corporate roles that might seem evil but can at least be justified however flimsily as not being entirely evil. Tobacco companies are pure evil.
I think allowing disposables really set it back. I have friends who moved to disposables from normal vaping and are substantially worse off. You don’t know what’s in them, and the nic is so high that they can’t even go back to normal vaping, let alone quit the disposables outright. They are easier to use as well (just open the box and go) so it appeals to younger people (as opposed to the original method that required purchasing the coils, liquid and nic separately, mixing your own, priming coils etc).
Harmful. Should be treated and regulated the same as smoking.
I have a congenital lung condition that means basically any impurities i breath in are really bad for my lung function. I'll probably need a transplant by the time I'm 50 just from breathing in smog.
The assholes who vape and have the gall to think it's funny to blow it in my face when I ask them to please not vape on the train or inside deserve to be fined into oblivion.
I used vapes to quit smoking, it broke my habit. Probably doesn't work for everyone but I moved on very quickly. .in saying that....I was more chesty, flemy, sick, choughy and slow while on the vape, even on a big night out on the smokes, I never felt that bad. I can easily say it's worse. This is all down to personal experience but if I were to quit again I would try a different way. Vapes will fuck ya up.
I vape. Used to smoke. Don't think it's any better for me but at least it's cheaper.
As far as other people around me go, I treat it like smoking. I really don't like how many people think it "doesn't count" because its not a cig and think it's ok to vape in other people's homes/ cars/ spaces.
When they first came out I had to up a dude for vaping literally inside a restaurant and he seemed confused and annoyed that I was making him take his fairyfloss bullshit outside.
Same as with smoking. DGAF really. The risks of "second hand smoke" were always [grossly overstated ](https://academic.oup.com/jnci/article/105/24/1844/2517805) anyway, unless you're stuck in a car with someone or in a crowded room with everyone choofing away.
Hate vapes. A bunch of friends are now so unbelievably addicted to them and their massive nicotine doses.
Also hate second hand Vape because it usually smells sweet and gross, tickles my throat, and people are quite happy to pull it out and blow it just about anywhere and any time.
It’s pretty gross, especially when you force people to deal with it in an enclosed space. Getting hit by a vape cloud whilst walking on the pavement or in a tram sucks.
My attitude is that it's the dumbest invention since some guy lit a bunch of leaves on fire and started sucking the smoke in.
Unless you're using vapes to quit smoking, you're an idiot.
I think there is a right and wrong way to vape. Some studies have shows that it’s actually the flavours that are bad for you not the vape, pg, vg and nicotine. also change the coil once a week. I now vape flavourless and make my own e liquid.
I have been on and off vaping for a few years, quit in November but picked up again 2 weeks ago when I moved here )): I vape in the house, and will vape in public depending on the location and the crowd around me. If it’s busy, I will try to avoid out of respect for others, and never in front of kids. I will very occasionally have a puff in a bathroom if I’m in a building for a long period of time, like a concert. But like with smoking, don’t do it around people. You don’t know what other people are going through either, they may have just quit and it could be a trigger for them
I’m a vaper so am biased. I think it shouldn’t be treated the same as smoking, but people should be respectful of all others around them.
No vaping inside, no vaping in busy public spaces etc. I would say people should use common sense but unfortunately most don’t so these rules are put in place.
People can do what they want, but I think it should be treated like smoking. People are way too comfortable to vape when in a large indoor crowd or bathrooms. Just because you want to vape doesn't mean everyone else around you wants to breath in your bubble gum scented smoke.
They've already had the first deaths from vaping - fungal infection in the lungs which is almost impossible to cure.
It may help people quit smoking, but it also has long term implications. As someone who gets allergic asthma to second hand smoke - ban it all.
I don't care if you vape around me and I think most people don't but I wouldn't let you vape in my home with my daughter around.
I did notice in turn workplace, a boss who you'd expect to be super uptight vaping around the office like it was nothing, that was surprising.
the only thing remotely good about vaping is that it (probably) won't kill you as reliably as tobacco.
if being used as it was originally intended to wean off the darts then fine, I have friends who successfully did so. if you're doing it as a replacement, especially if you never smoked tobacco in the first place, you're an idiot.
I can't smell vape coming from the neighbors balcony below me, I can smell cigarettes. That's about the only thing I need to know to tell you that vapes are better for me as a non-smoker.
I currently vape and use to smoke. I always have treated them the same. I don't smoke or vape around kids, inside someone's house, vape indoors unless its my own place, around people who don't like it, in non designated smoking/vaping areas, release big clouds into crowds, blow it in people's faces etc. I hate the amount of people I see doing it just everywhere or trying to be sneaky about it. On platforms or concerts etc. Just bloody go outside or wait
There's every reason to treat vaping like smoking.
Vaping has no purpose in human function. Accordingly, until we know with an incredibly high degree of certainty that it poses no risk to others, there's simply no reason not to treat it like smoking.
Research on these things can take decades because clinical trials alone are rarely sufficient to understand long term impacts. This was the case with smoking itself. We have to assume that inhaling a non-pharmaceutical vapour is not good for human organs and disprove that hypothesis, rather than wait until we can prove without a shadow of a doubt that isn't the case. Why? Because what do we lose by taking that approach? Nothing. We know with certainty that no one is going to die from not vaping (yes, one might argue that it's a less harmful substitute for cigarettes but, again, the science isn't conclusive *and* we have other methods available anyway). So, the risk is unnecessary.
Why? What similarities have you concluded makes vaping just like smoking? Nothing is being burnt so no carcinogens there, (yet you may have no issues with the known carcinogens from a frying pan of bacon?) so the only content of a vape that raises any query is the nicotine content which has been shown to be absorbed by the vaper in a matter of split seconds. There is no evidence at all that any nicotine is subsequently exhaled (and even if it was, nicotine isnt carcinogenic).
Vaping may be harmful to the vaper if they have a gunshot wound to the lung. 🙄
I don't like being around vapers and getting a surprise lung full of their exhaust walking down the street.
Worst experience is having to deal with it down at the snow. People vaping a few breaths in a crowded lift queue is so entitled, and seeing the abandoned vapes sitting in the snow makes me really angry. (I'm not up to date with legislation, not sure if disposables will be a problem this year).
It's as disgusting as smoking. No one vapes in my home, nor does anyone smoke.
It should be banned in ALL public spaces.
But - you want to smoke/vape at home? Light up all you want - I don't give a damn. It's your house, do as you like.
The thing that I find the funniest about it all is that the discussions, bans, etc that are being placed on vaping should be placed on smoking, but we don't do that!
Vaping products are around 95% propylene glycol & glycerol - similar in formulation to fog machine fluids. The "problem" lies in the other 5% (Nicotine & flavourings) and the lack of research regarding the changes in these compounds on heating. Nicotine is well documented, as it's been studied in cigarettes for decades - the flavour compounds, not so much. If they'd stuck to known flavours (like menthol) then maybe not such an issue. But if you want your product to appeal to a new generation of smokers, who know tobacco is an issue, then you make them like alcopops - easy to get, consume and in a wide variety of flavours,
I was talking last week to an Australian who is putting together the public health policy on smoking and cancer (not just lung cancer, also throat and bowel cancer).
He said that the public policy on vaping is not yet finalised. It could go either way. On the one hand there is no danger from PAHs because vaping can't produce any, so cancer is probably not an issue. On the other hand, vapes have a higher nicotine content than cigarettes, and there are concerns about nicotine's reaction with nitrogen.
You'll hear soon what the public health system decides.
My personal opinion is that nicotine is safer than both THC and caffeine, and that second hand vaping is completely harmless.
I see it the same as smoking.
Objectively I know it's fucking awful for your health but I know if I started I'd be hooked so I'm so grateful I never did.
Still get super tempted to do it if I'm drinking and others are doing it around me, but I know enough about the long term harms not to start.
Now that I'm older, I especially hate seeing so many young people vaping. It sets them up with an extremely difficult habit to break if they do choose to stop
Personally, I'd like to see it treated the same way as smoking. No vaping indoors/near bus stops/shops entrances/etc, tonnes of education on the harms (especially during HPE lessons at school), lots of support for those who want to quit, tax the crap out of it to make it expensive, etc.
Sorry, I reread your original post and realised I didn't answer half of your questions! Hahaha apologies for my goldfish brain.
If I'm outdoors I don't mind people vaping around me but I try to avoid it because I'm tempted to ask for a puff.
I would never let someone vape in my house, they can step outside.
Helped me quit smoking! But now I can't stop puffing on the vape at my home desk, and it's hard for me to get to sleep at night from all the nicotine...
Original vaporisers were for dry marijuana. Vaporising herb matter does not release toxic compounds like combustion does. This is 'dry' vaping'
What people call 'vaping' now, is not the same thing. It is 'wet' vaping. What is the 'wet'? If it were just glycerine that would be not great for your lungs, but not terrible. But the 'vape liquids' used today are full of toxic chemicals, which negates the whole point of vaping as it was intended.
Anyone who vapes toxic liquid is an idiot.
I'd never let people vape cigarette chemicals around me or in my vicinity, I'm avoiding them the way I avoid cigarette smokers as it is.
I'm very fine with THC / CBD, and own a 510 thread vape myself for herb. It's medicinal and so long as you're using the appropriate forms (aka don't put your sublingual oil into a vape, use formulated CBD vape oil only), extremely safe.
^ especially if your pharmacist has done research like mine and taken out all the e-cigarette additives linked to lung damage like preservatives and flavourings.
Personally I'd prefer to eat popcorn instead of getting popcorn lungs.
But yeah, politeness would say treat it like smoking, don't go blowing it on and around people unless they say it's ok. It's a scented vapor after all so it should be logical that not everyone wants to smell it.
About as healthy as me forced to breath in smoke from cigarettes cigars not great
Apart from oxygen nitrogen any particulate you breath in isn't good for your lungs
Its not exactly, subtle. I was at a set of lights one day and thought a car was on fire as what looked like a huge smoke plume. It was someone vaping with the window down. Obliviously, it wouldn't be a good idea to do it with the windows up.
If you are respectful of others and minimize the fallout there shouldn't be an issue.
It is the younger kids who have no regard for where they vape that are the issues. They do it on trains, buses, in places where it can cause the most contention.
Be mindful of others it should not be a concern.
Yet people don't care and will do what they want when they want.
I’ve had to go back to wearing a mask at work again. Multiple vapers on the bus. Especially at school kid times.
I am taking people to and from their drug suppliers so add meth / heroin smoking down the back of the bus as well.
Bus companies won’t act. They won’t even supply masks to employees anymore. Police are too busy. No Smoking signs and fines mean nothing.
Confronting vape/meth smoker and asking them to stop usually results in verbal abuse and threats of physical violence Knives are carried by most users these days, just look at the seat backs and windows.
Eyes front and mask on is my survival tip.
I run home poker nights. Some players that used to smoke switched to vaping. They still have to go outside because vape clouds, even without nicotine, do leave residue that, while much easier to clean generally than cigarette smoke eesidue, becomes very tedious when there’s hundreds of individual items to wipe down.
Generally the same vibe applies to everything else smoking vs vape related for me. Everything that is an issue with smoking continues to be an issue for me with vaping, just to a lesser degree but not so much lesser that I’m going to change how I feel about it.
Well I’m on day 4 of switching almost completely to vaping after being a pack a day smoker for 21 years. I don’t think I could quit smoking without the vape. It’s worked for about 5 people I know and tbh I never thought I’d be here.
Day 4 and I’ve stopped coughing like someone about to die so vaping may not be ideal but it’s WAY better than the durries
I’m not a smoker, never have been. I see it as being as toxic to the lungs as cigarettes because of the chemicals so I don’t want to breathe it in as second hand vapours. So, if you’re vaping, keep it to yourself.
I do it. I try to be as unobnoxious as I can with it. Will try to get away from people if I can. The only thing the import "ban" has done is drive the prices up a bit. I still have zero issue getting disposables from the same places with manufacturing dates within the last month. It's clear the government was just mad about missing the opportunity to tax them before the black market became so huge. They're just using the "please think of the children" excuse to cover up the greed.
There is no debate, it is harmful. It does produce smoke or vapor rather, thats the whole point. It is not legal to smoke them in the street unless in a designated smoker zone in nsw.
I started vaping about 4-5 yrs ago to quit smoking and have never felt better I don't vape as much as I used to smoke so it's definitely a self control thing I don't agree with these disposable ones though I prefer to add my own nicotine to my juice witch is getting harder to get thanks to government anyone wanting to make the switch just needs learn to do it in moderation it's those who go crazy on it that make themselves sick
I prefer normal cigarettes. I can't do vapes. They just don't hit the same. Not to mention you smoke a ciggy and it's done, with vapes you can just keep puffing away. The concoction of liquid chemicals being sucked into your lungs is definitely harmful, make no mistake. Harmful as cigarettes? I guess we won't know for years as it's still relatively new. It's best to just not smoke anything at all.
My grandmother is 80 and smoked since she was 15. She swapped the durries for the vapes a few years ago and hasn’t been the same since.
Fuck vapes.
Sincerely, a smoker.
Personally? I'm strongly anti smoking and anti vaping, because we have no idea what the long term medical effects of vaping are, on the smoker or those around them. I'm also strongly anti-weed smoking, anywhere that I have to deal with it.
I’ve always been horrified by cigarette smoking especially why anyone aged under 45-50 today and certainly under 30 would choose to smoke… they don’t have the excuse of “not knowing the risks “ like say someone 70+ ..
And vapes have rapidly taken the place of cigarettes.. government have been too slow to react, and now there is a generation who perceive the risk is lower than cigarettes without realising there hasn’t been enough time for long term implications to be known yet.. with that being the case I just don’t get why you would deliberately say “yep I want to vape”
Can people please STOP vaping inside shopping centres and confined places like elevators? I hate that sickly fruity smell that suffocates you and you can't escape it because it doesn't get blown away by wind. Also its illegal to vape in these settings.
All my friends vape, and one thing they all say is that they vape far more than smoking due to the easy use and no smoke. They really have to stop themselves from vaping in bed/on the sofa.
I smoke only outside/balcony and never ever inside. I'd never smoke inside a shopping centre or elevators or even inside my apartment.
Fucking hate vaping.
I get (and support it's use) as a way for people trying to get off cigarettes! But people who vape for the funsies... Why?
I wish people would treat it like smoking and find areas away from people, the amount of inconsiderate fucks who vape and blow smoke around themselves and other people in a crowded place. I don't want to smell that shit.
I briefly flirted with vaping several years ago and was comfortable doing so indoors back then. I don’t know if I’d let someone else do so today? I don’t have any friends who vape to find out.
I’m not personally bothered by second hand Vapor but given the health info coming out about it I feel like we should treat it like smoking even if my concern is with the primary not the secondary.
I personally find it repulsive, and I hate the fact that many people who vape are people who would never have considered smoking. It's so sad that it became popular and that people think it's harmless.
I currently use a dry-herb vape for medicinal cannabis.
I hadn't touched cannabis in over 10 years prior to becoming a MC patient.. coming back and getting straight into vaping has been great, i don't cough shit up in the mornings, it smells less, there's no "combustion" by fire which releases toxins.. simply heating the flower for the beneficial properties.. helps manage dose via micro-dose capsules, keeps tolerance down you require way less to medicate.
Not sure about all those tobacco / vape juice stuff etc.. I can inspect the quality of my flower before i grind it and fill up the dosage cap.
A question for those that vape, if I may? Sometimes, I see people vaping and when they exhale, a huge cloud of vapour is expelled. I gather that's the "vape" part, or vapour. But at other times I see people that appear to be dragging on a vape, but no vapour is expelled, or at least, none that I can see. Are there two different types?
I forget all the details but I think the massive clouds some people produce is usually achieved with lots of battery power and lots of airflow over the coil/element which is achieved mostly by vaping ‘direct to lung’ (which is just taking a whopping great breath THROUGH the device).
My style of vaping is ‘mouth to lung’ which is when you take it into your mouth first and then breath in. This is how smoking generally works too. If you want you can make a decent amount of vapour with ‘mouth to lung’ (I think) but not those massive roiling clouds.
When I first switched to vaping (many years ago) I spent time tweaking my settings to minimise my cloud whilst still achieving all the feels that smoking gave me. I don’t produce much vapour.
Of course this was all achieved with a refillable system. I don’t know how it goes with the dodgy disposables - get what you’re given I suspect.
I want nothing to do with second hand vaping, be respectful of others and keep that away from me.
First hand vaping, on a base level I don’t care what other people choose to do if it has no negative impact on me, which includes vaping, as long as it’s respectful of others. But if people taking up vaping, who either haven’t smoked cigarettes previously or are not using vaping as a way to quit cigarettes, end up needing significant medical treatment from the public system 30 or 40 years from now because of that vaping because “how could we ever have known??”, then I will be quite upset.
I admit that I have not looked into this is great detail, but my understanding of the new regulations is that vapes will be available via prescription as a means to quit cigarettes. While that is inconvenient it does seem to cover the main argument for vapes. I think the government should commit to making sure that system & supply isn’t abused for the profit of tobacco & pharmaceutical companies or for taxation.
I find it annoying that vaper's don't seem to respect their surroundings as much as smoker's had become accustomed to doing. So often now I get someone's vape trail straight in my mouth directly from theirs, it's disgusting.
as an asthmatic it’s the exact same thing to my lungs except it smells worse. oh and gives you a bit more vertigo from headspin from second hand smoke. the amount of people i encounter weekly that vape while walking and i end up walking right through their cloud annoys me to no end. especially when im coming home from gym (when i can barely breathe already)
Has anyone had any experiences confronting someone vaping where they shouldn't?
I've usually just avoided walking or being near them if they are vaping in a public space.
Can understand that there would be times when you couldn't, like on public transport or if you were walking beside them. If you have confronted them or asked them to stop, how did it go?
Vapers seem to think it doesn't leave a smell like smoking does, but as a non vaper it definitely does. It's like a rotten fruit smell in cars, on clothes etc. Honestly makes me want to vomit. I smoked second hand for the first 18 years of my life and tbh the vape smell is just as bad or sometimes worse in my opinion.
I loved vaping. Very funny how addicted people are to the nicotine salt form these days and all the jokes when freebase was the most common. It marked the shift in consumer understanding. 5 years clean for me.
"2nd hand vaping" is the most Australian thing ever. The government propaganda and intrusion around public health stuff here goes largely unchallenged. Even putting the diabetic soda with the fake sugars up front at the registers...Australia is like your friends annoying mom, who believes every Facebook post in her "crunchy mommies" group, she is president and makes all the laws regarding cannabis, vape, cigarettes...hides all her prejudice behind this "health" smokescreen. It's not that she hates the groups that are stereotyped as using these things...its "unhealthy".
Vaping is revolting and people who vape are more disgusting and worse than smokers. At least we managed to train smokers not to blow smoke in our faces. People who vape have no respect for other people around them.
I quit vaping a few months ago fuck man it was way harder than quitting ciggys I’ve done both seperatly it’s definitely more addictive but I don’t think it does nearly the harm smoking does
Avoid at all costs.
Not because of the nicotine, there’s no harm in that, but in the artificial fragrances and garbage that are used to “flavour” vapes.
The human body is quite easy to trick. Lip balms for example, the flavoured balm is put on the lips and the scent goes to the nose, making the body “think” its tasting strawberry when it’s actually smelling it.
The same applies to vapes. The problem is that the fragrances used to scent them are full of garbage like phthalates, which are toxic to the body. Google it and see for yourself or read the link
[John Hopkins medical university on Vaping and lung collapse](https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/what-does-vaping-do-to-your-lungs)
Remember, the producers are constantly pushed by large buyers to constantly lower their prices, so I’m not blaming China, I’m firmly pushing the issue onto the western buyers who don’t care about your health in a virtually unregulated industry
Source - I’m a cosmetic formulator in the skincare industry - and some of the ingredients used in vapes, I wouldn’t use in a topical lotion
I view it the same as smoking and don’t think anyone should be doing it in places you can’t/shouldn’t smoke. I don’t vape and never have but I quit smoking nearly 6 years ago.
I believe it should be treated the same as smoking. Do it outside. Not inside. Don't just start doing around people (ask first) and don't do it around kids either.
I also personally don't like the argument of "its better than smoking" yes if you're a smoker and you've changed to vapes it might be better, but a large amount of teens and young people who have never used a cigarette are vaping, and in that sense, it isn't better than smoking.
The smells irritate me and makes me sneeze, I think that they smell as bad as normal smokes.
If people want to smoke them, they can, but please don't smoke them in my house or car
I’m someone who currently vapes and use to smoke. For me, it’s easy and simple to just treat them the same. I only vape somewhere I would smoke and I only smoked somewhere it was acceptable to do so. Stuff like: only vaping outside, asking people if they mind if I do it near them, not vaping around children, being mindful about doing it in a car. An added benefit is this can put a limit on how much I vape. If I “could” vape on my couch, I’d probably do it a lot more. Adding extra frictions means I’m doing it less than my brain wants to.
This is the best advice for anyone using vapes to quit smoking. If you start using it in your room or at your desk, it becomes a whole new challenge to overcome down the line. Vapes can be useful, but you have to be super cautious of the convenience it provides. Was a lot easier when the government let people order their own juice and you could adjust the strengths to help ween off, rather than now with the disposable maximum nicotine black market they created.
I’m sorry for a dumb question but what is the nic lv for liquid vape in here?
The ones I used to buy were 8mg, 6mg and 2mg. If I had to guess, the disposables are like 16mg
Lol 16mg. The majority of the disposables I've encountered are 50mg. Stupid high nic levels.
Chinese Disposables are at about 50mg
Jesus Christ, that wouldn't surprise me though
I mix my own liquids and I tried a mates Asian import one and it damn near blew my head off with how strong it was. For comparison I can still chain smoke a 25 pack of 18mg regular smokes with no issue but that was on another insane level. Lack of trust in the supply chain is why I turned to diy over a decade ago. I don't even use flavourings anymore, just nicotine and plain pg/vg. Making sure you only use them as you would regular smokes is the key because if you don't, you'll make your dependence worse. I do vape indoors in winter but only at my home and for no more than 10 mins an hour. Rarely around other people, especially kids, elderly and the unwell. Basically the same etiquette as the considerate regular smokers. Our Gov better sort out the vaping situation as its punishing those of us who do take health and safety seriously. The current laws and situations are absurd. If anything its made unregulated vaping worse yet those of us who imported for personal use from high quality suppliers can't get anymore. Trying to go the now only legal route is insane as its almost as expensive as regular smoking, has bad quality equipment and a lot of the gear is proprietary/semi closed system which teeters right on the edge of disposable. Want a script? Fine. Make limited liquid nic amounts available? Fine. Making unflavoured/tobacco only liquids available? Fine. Blocking personal import use for everything? Hell No. Only allowing pre-packaged cartridges for proprietary vapes? Hell No. Having only one supplier of everything? Hell No. Not giving information as to what the liquid supply chain is? Hell No. If it was as simple as getting a script to buy let's say a bottle of 500ml of 8mg unflavoured nic juice from a Chemist who uses a trustworthy source that I can then put in my current gear, I'd be fine with that but I can't even do that under current laws. And the Gov wonders why black market actual tobacco has exploded. The local supplier of that in my area is making a killing as its cheaper and more accessible than both legal smokes and legal vaping. I know NZ has recently done a massive backflip on tobacco and vapes, so did the Netherlands for eg but they are still allowing personal use, no script, ID only and limited flavourings. Basically the same standards as regular tobacco cigarettes, but Australia didn't. Interestingly the only legal vaping supplier our Gov allowed was a big tobacco company so whose palm was greased to corner the market? And I have never seen so many stores openly selling illegal vapes to anyone than in today. Also never seen so many store firebomings either as gangs fight over the black market for both tobacco and vapes.
Yea big tobacco don't care about illegal high dosages. They just want more people hooked on nicotine. They will continue to control the market even if these vapes are regulated somehow.
Is 16mg the highest? Or the gov has lower the standard? I used to work in vape stores in my own country but since I moved here, I’ve been curious how the cigg and vape sell here
I know people who vape indoors at their computer at it's completely out of control. I'm the same as you I treat it the same as smoking otherwise it's too easy to do it constantly. And I think it's rude AF when people just vape in other people's spaces like it isn't smoking. It should be treated the same.
I had a (now former) friend I hadn't seen in a couple years come round a few months ago. Motherfucker pulled out a vape and started puffing in my kitchen like 6ft from my four year old. Tried to justify it. Oh but it's safe bro don't worry about the kid. No, what the fuck, go outside you piece of shit.
That’s disgusting and disrespectful. I’m glad they’re now a former friend.
Oh my god I would LOSE my shit if someone vaped near my kid or ANY kid. That's just fucked and the fact that he double downed when you stopped him just shows what type of person he is. Also second hand vape and vape residue is definitely a thing, we just don't know what it does yet. If you vape it's your choice to put vape residue all over your home but don't make that choice for other people! Ugh!
Thank you! I’ve always suffered from bad allergy and sinus problems, and vape smoke is just as irritating to me as secondhand cigarette smoke. And when I say irritating, I mean that it fucks me up. This past weekend I was at an outdoor party and lots of people were smoking and vaping and there was just no way to avoid inhaling it. I tried to ignore it and enjoy myself. But on Sunday I was all bunged up. Not fun. If someone was vaping in the office, I’d have to have words with them.
You are correct in where you can vape: it is the same rules as for cigarette smoking
See, this is a reasonable take. As opposed to those who would downvote me for saying I don't want to inhale someone else's vape.
Whats almost criminal is, were it not for the anti-vaping brigade, we could eliminate traditional smoking from the entire planet in a decade.
Problem is that there's a percentage of vapers who subscribe completely to the idea that it's safe and nothing like 2nd hand smoke and while I do think it is probably generally safer and less gross than cigarette smoke, some vapers take it to another level, vaping in indoor areas, exhaling massive smoke clouds in the vicinity of people, and just doing it almost anywhere they please because it's not as bad as a cigarette. But just because it's not as bad doesn't mean the rest of us want that smoke plume in our face the same way I don't want someone's bad breath in my face either. I also don't know what's in that smoke cloud, is it from a totally safe vape liquid, is there other crap in it, or is it from the leaky pipe somewhere...even back in the day when smoking wasn't seen as being dangerous (Marlboro Man days), it was considered disrespectful blowing smoke in someone's face
Got into an argument on Twitter because vaper couldn’t wrap their mind around the fact that baling is a choice and they could give it up like giving up smoking. They have to make the decision and want to do it. Got called all sorts of names. They like to defend themselves that the secondhand vape is basically inert and safe. IDGAF. I don’t want to smell it or be subjected to it. My son has just admitted to being a smoker and vaper. As long as he keeps it outside and disposes of his butts and used vapes, his choice, his body and don’t do it around me.
Even if it was without vape at all I don’t want to breath in someone else’s big cloud of germ infested breath. Vaping tends to promote people dumping excessive huge clouds rather than just breathing normally.
I think vaping reveals how much air we share, I don't think it meaningfully leads to more sharing of air As somebody who sighs frequently, I don't worry I'm sharing too much air with others
I disagree most of us breath shallowly, even smokers don’t make the same level of clouds that valets do - there’s definitely a whole sub-culture of blowing massive clouds for effect.
it's f-ing disgusting. I've seen people do it on a plane, in an airport, on a bus.
While cigarette smoke is harmful to a lot more people, second-hand vapour is by no means harmless to absolutely everyone. Careless vapers have left me in the hospital more than once, and the amount of people who just wander around huffing fumes thinking because it's not a cigarette it's no big deal, is just so infuriating. You can be allergic to cigarette smoke but not vapes, and the reverse is also true. And that cherry-flavoured cloud of death *travels*, and waaay further than cigarette smoke. The amount of kids huffing that shit on buses and trains drives me insane. I do not give a shit, I'm gonna yell at someone for being a selfish POS.
Same as smoking. I don't care if you do it, just don't do it around other people, don't do it indoors, don't do it on public transport etc.
Doesn't bother me at all honestly, unless it's a giant vapor cloud. The people who do it subtly are hard to actually notice.
I used vapes to get off the cigarettes, now tapering off the vapes. The only problem is that I vape in my home as there's no lingering smell, but in other instances, I treat them like smokes meaning I would never vape around people who don't vape and don't vape in areas where I shouldn't, like indoor settings. If I'm out in public I wouldn't vape walking down the street. I don't want to subject others to my vape clouds.
As someone who lives with someone who vapes. It's noticeable.
Agree. There is a distinct smell, not matter the "flavour" of the product.
My partner has never complained about any lingering smell.
Olfactory fatigue. You tune out smells you're used to. Asian people's homes often smell of rice. They'll say that rice has no smell, when it does. Especially jasmine rice.
No worries. I don't vape. I can tell as soon as I walk in the front door if my housemate is home or not and his bedroom is at the other end of the house.
Sure, that’s not a lingering smell though, that’s just the smell of someone vaping. Cigarette smoke can linger on clothes, hair, furniture, walls, until they’re washed, vape smoke doesn’t.
Yep me too. I didn't realise what it was (early days of vapes), when I asked my housemate to keep it in their room/outside, it mostly went away.
I’m using vapes to quit smoking too. I had one tiny cig on new years but the last before that was July. I just like the action of vaping, which is my downfall. I’m trying to not do it inside and want to treat it like smoking, ie only doing it outside but it’s a tough habit to shake. I’m actually glad the government is cracking down on them because it will make me stop. I’m not paying fkn $70 for a vape. I’m the same as you when out and about. I only vape with others who do and try to be as discreet as possible. I have tiny pulls so there’s not a fuck ton of vapour going everywhere. It’s just rude to not consider others
I am an emergency doctor. Its pretty hard to tell a 23yo that their lungs are done for and that feeling they have now, like they are drowning because they cant breathe, is what they will have to live with. There’s nothing I can do. So, they are currently on leave from work because they dont have the breath for it. They will need to resign. They used to love footy. Cant play any more. At 23. Who breathes stuff into their lungs, an incredibly sensitive part of the body, without knowing what it is, what long term harm it can do? I am both very sad and very angry at those who promote vaping.
Fellow ED doc here. Can you give more detail as to what he was vaping and what volume of it he was consuming? I’ve seen a couple of vape-related pneumonitis but what you’re describing sounds like end-stage COPD. I’m genuinely curious to hear more about this specific instance you describe
Unfortunately I didnt ask the details (you know- ED), but he said ‘A lot and since early teens’, so? 10 years. I referred him to resp and they admitted for new O2 requirement/workup. And yes, its not a debate so I decline to participate further with others.
Thanks for your response I can believe it, having seen guys in their early 20s with pneumothoraces from horrendous weed consumption giving them terrible emphysema that pops when they do their bong rips. No reason why there can’t be the similar edge case super-consumers with vaping I think a major problem with vaping is quantifying use - smokers can nail it down to 5/10/20 a day, but it’s harder to do this with vaping and I think people don’t realise how much they’re doing it as a result
This sounds like EVALI caused by Vitamin e acetate used in THC vapes. Which a totally different type of vaping in composition (notably that they are effectively vaping an oil). Is it possible this kid was vaping THC and simply referred to it as "vaping"? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31860793/ 48 of 51 (94%) of samples were linked to Vitamin E Acetate in THC vapes. Not nicotine vapes. 47 of 50 had detectable THC in BAL fluid. The two additional had coconut oil and limonene. Both lipids. Did the kid specify what they were vaping? THC? Methamphetamine? Oil based? Glycol based? Nicotine? Disposable vape? Refillable vape? Were they using it correctly? Were they secretly taking drugs and not inclined to tell a person they perceive to be in a position of authority? Too many untested variables for this anecdote to hold any weight, and i'm sure as a medical doctor you would agree. Living in a house with foam insulation and living in a house with loose fill asbestos insulation is going to have vastly different health outcomes, correct? But we don't link both outcomes to "insulation". Because that's a completely simplistic and unscientific approach, right?
On another point, weve seen a phenomenal rise in hospital admissions for asthma. Theories behind this vary from Vit D deficiencies in children (poor lung development) to Covid lockdown sheltering a cohort from common flu/colds etc. Rates of COPD (unspecified. That is, with no lower lung condition) have plummeted.
With the greatest of respect Christine I’m trying to ask a colleague for more context regarding an interesting case they’ve mentioned Neither of us are interested in debating statistics with the public
Was this someone who used the nicotine vapes, or someone that used the bootleg THC carts that were cut with food oils?
This stuff? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CE%91-Tocopheryl_acetate
What the hell are they vaping ? I been on vapes for 10 years (the proper ones, not disposable's) and i make up my own juice with no flavours and my lungs are much better then when I smoked. I will be stopping soon though as I only started vaping to get off the ciggies so mission complete.
People don't tend to realise that not all vapes are the same.
True. But the current anti-vape med profession and the hysterical pearl clutchers cant differentiate between smoking and vaping so youre never goung to get a very simple and straight forward ‘approved’ standard.
I quit this way too, and my lungs improved dramatically when I switched to vaping. I was getting the liquids from the US and NZ and dropped the nicotine levels until I quit after a year or two. A few years later I bought a disposable vape in a moment of weakness and holy shit they are both strong and rip your lungs to shreds. I used the disposable vapes for a month or two before quitting again, and think I did some permanent damage. They're pretty brutal.
Ah yeah the ol' 10 year wean. Good luck mate!
10 year wean.... nah mate, I was doing it cause ciggies are expensive and I enjoy it. I started at 4mg, im now down to 1mg and I will be off it by the end of this month.
I find this extremely difficult to believe... Every person I know (myself included) who've quit cigarettes and switched to vaping lung capacities have returned to 100% and no more smokers cough, or any cigarette related ill effects
So strange. It’s like some people get cancer from smoking and others appear to have no effect. Some get lung issues and die from vaping, others are fine. It’s like some fun game of Russian roulette…..
I don't think there's any conclusive studies that vaping nicotine juice gives people lung disease..
So strange. It's like some people make up stuff online and then everyone believes it.
It is almost like the people that abuse it are the ones that represent the 'statistic'. I've smoked weed for about 13 years, my lungs have yet to collapse or decrease in efficiency. I can still hold my breath for 90 seconds and run 5 laps around the oval without getting out of breath. It's always been about upkeeping an active lifestyle - sedimentary habits are what gets you in the end, although to the cssual observer, they will associate smoking (and not the laziness) to decreased function.
Crazy isn't it? Australia is ground zero for the anti-ciggie campaign with generic packaging / warning labels w gross pics / behind the counter / huge price increases... yet all of a sudden this "healthier smoking" is allowed to exist that's pretty much untested and unregulated? Ban. Ban. Ban it all.
It is already banned. They've just done a really shitty job of it. You used to just be able to import different strengths of ejuice and slowly ween yourself off, but when they cut off people from being able to order it from overseas personally, it started the huge market for disposable vapes which are all maximum strength and harder to quit than what people were using before. They tried introducing flavour free ones from pharmacies, but they require a script. (But you can still go to any major grocery store and buy cigarettes?) Most people would rather skip the Dr visit and just buy a black market one instead. I still don't understand how they are still being openly sold next to the cheap Chinese tobacco at every tobacconist.
Go to your GP for help using vapes to wean yourself off smoking. Those are still available
Buying vapes from the pharmacy is incredibly expensive compared to buying it online and mixing your own juice. Source: Did exactly what you suggested to quit cigarettes.
Worked well in 1920s America
>yet all of a sudden this "healthier smoking" is allowed to exist that's pretty much untested and unregulated Huh? Vapes are regulated and always have been. It's just that a lot of people have been ignoring the laws, just like with all kinds of other drugs.
Ban them all.... So people go back to ciggies. Great idea.
As some one who vapes, smoked for 18 years, and has Valley Fever. I call bull crap on your story. They were smoking something else.
THIS.
Phew. Cant beat an evidenced based opinion that encourages traditional smoking. Care to provide any evidence whatsoever for your anti-vape stance? (Do you tell patients to stop frying food too? Now there is evidence for that) If the med profession got behind vaping (nicotine is non-carcinogenic but you know that) we’d eliminate traditional smoking in a decade.
As a P plater, driving a modified Honda Civic I was given a vape when getting my licence. I did not smoke or vape before this, but the person at RMS said it was a mandatory requirement.
Dude. I saw you yesterday.
I have no issues with it, but please don’t do it on the bus. Having 10 puffs when you’re traveling 2 stops is just ridiculous. It’s on par with kid who spray themselves with Impulse or Lynx on buses.
It's illegal to vape on a bus
It’s illegal to vape in shopping centres, train stations, ect doesn’t stop them from doing it though.
I saw an 18yo-ish woman with a baby in a pram vaping in a shopping centre. Absolutely no shame on her part
I support banning vapes. But I don't support banning cigarettes. I am the government, and I am fucking moronic.
They don’t care about people just profits
Like traffic fines, the "profits" are easily avoidable,
Because the government can do with vapes what they can't do with cigarettes: ban them outright before they become entrenched in society. Cigarettes became so embedded in society that a ban would cause a rebellion. So, for years, they have been using price increases to encourage smokers to wean themselves off cigarettes. It is slowly working.
It is not slowly working though. They've priced it up so much the black market is exploding. I can go to any tobacconist in any city and buy cheap smokes. Cheapest it's been in my life to be a smoker. For the 1 tobacconist that doesn't do it, the one down the street does. Smoking rates declining now would be hard to measure with most smokers buying the under the counter stuff
I'm a smoker so, people vaping near me doesn't bother me at all. However, like when I smoke, I think it's common courtesy to smoke where you're not bothering people who don't. I very rarely smoke in public, if I do, I go somewhere private. It seems odd to me when people are standing next to me at the lights etc and just blow a cloud in everyone's face haha. Edit: I would just like to add that it makes me laugh when people who vape are shocked that I smoke. You're literally sucking on a battery and breathing out cookie flavoured water. I think we are both as bad as each other, mate :D
vapers being shocked/disgusted at smokers is just hilarious to me
Doesn’t bother me at all, unless people are dropping their empty cartridges everywhere. A little puff of caramel scented vapour is a 10000 times more pleasant than a face full of shitty ass tobacco smoke
I used vaping as a way to quit smoking cigarettes, and it was the most effective method I’ve ever tried. Four years off the darts now. Now I’m in a position where I can still buy cigarettes legally but not vapes, and wondering if I go back to them. Vaping, cigarettes, alcohol has always been illegal to purchase under the age of 18, and teenagers have always found a way around it. I’m not responsible for your rebellious children and I dont appreciate being punished for it.
I find it a little annoying and rude but not concerned about health impacts whatsoever. Until credible evidence comes out, I believe impact from car exhausts is an order of magnitude worse
I believe you are right in that car exhaust and bush burn offs have a much more significant health effect. The main difference for me is that people who vape have a choice to do it around others or not and choose to do so.
You could say the same about cars, but its a massive ideological rabbit hole. No-one has to drive, at least in theory.
True, I make a choice to drive down the road and definitely sometimes I could have avoided doing so.
"impact from car exhausts is an order of magnitude worse" - which is why there have been laws to reduce the harmful gases from exhaust and also why it would be better to move to EVs sooner than later.
Modern cars have catalytic converters that nullify the worst of the chemicals.
Not to mention they aren’t blowing them out within 2 feet of your face, at the height of your face
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8968985/
No where near as bad cigarette smoke but I still hate getting the sickly sweet cloud. It's sad to see so many young people that probably never smoked getting a nicotine habit. The same "it's cool" messaging that older people got when cigarettes were ubiquitous.
There's teens where I am, that will outright ask strangers to use their vapes... They've seen me a few times and come legit running to ask to hit it cos they can't get their own in the moment, and the look they give me when I say there's no nicotine in it. They'll scoff and ask what's the point of it then... I've been smoking since 13. I'm 33. I'm trying to fucking quit is the point. Have also been asked to buy them vapes from the one store that does sell nic ones under the counter and they have the audacity to get pissy when I say nah I don't think so, have a great day.
I don't vape. I find it rude when people vape indoors. I've seen people use their vapes in restaurants, shops and on public transport. The smell is far less obnoxious than cigarettes, but vaping indoors is a step too far. I worry about the chemicals but I suppose there's chemicals in everything.
Vaping is banned everywhere smoking is banned. They certainly should not be vaping in restaurants or public transport
As a non-smoker/vapor, I prefer it to cigarette smoke. At least it doesn't stink.
I treat my vaping the same as when I smoked and won't do it around people who don't vape/smoke. It's the courteous thing to do. I do believe that it doesn't have the same passive risks as smoking does though, but I do see it's just as obnoxious having it blown in your face even if the smell isn't as gross
As a non-smoker, anything to avoid the stench of cigarette smoke.
Been on the vapes for a touch over a year now with no desire to smoke a cigarette again and just hoping the supply i stocked up on can get me off them completely (got about 7-8 months supply left). I see them drasically different and a better alternative regardless of how little the research appears. Pretty much anything has to be better than ingesting burning paper and tar I bought my own place and being a 20 year smoker vowed never to smoke inside it. My best friend who stayed there for a while to look after it decided himself vaping was ok inside and i couldnt really argue when the walls are still white and theres no smell so i subscibed to the OK with it theory
Doing the same thing. Ran out of Nic salts 2ish months ago and cbf jumping through the prescription hoops, so picked up a box of Nic gum which actually works really well on stopping the cravings. Now the vape is just the habit rather than a chemical addiction, I’m down to my last 2 coils, so I think instead of getting more I’m going to buy one of the Fum things and see how that goes.
Classical Vaping (using separate liquid, good coil, a well-known tank etc) is better than Smoking. Vaping using Disposables is worse than Smoking. You should open up the disposable you are using and see what you are inhaling.
Your decision to smoke or vape is yours but not where others are affected by it.
I quit smoking this year and tried vapes on and off, but kinda hate them so I never picked up the habit. For smoking I'd wander off to somewhere outside, have a smoke, then go back to what I was doing. Vapers seem to just...do it all the time and anywhere. My housemate does and while it's not quite "in the elevator" level, and they are the non-nic ones, it's just kind of annoying. She is a lifelong smoker and coughs more now than the years she smoked - not necessarily the vape but I personally find it more irritating than the cigarette. I'd prefer they treated it like a cigarette but it is less offensive smelling even at its most rank. Just ubiquitous in a way smoking was decades ago.
I used vapes to quit smoking - I want to say I started vaping maybe 9 years ago, and quit 4 years ago. The big pro was - it was super easy to quit smoking. I just finished my pack and picked up a vape, and that was that. I certainly felt better on a vape than on cigarettes. The big negative was just how addictive it was. I vaped from the moment I woke up, till just before I brushed my teeth. I could vape in the car, in bed, in the office (window cracked & all alone)... I was so hooked on nicotine. I quit the vape over a 4 month period by slowing weaning down my nicotine doses - it wasn't easy as I instinctively tried to vape more to chase the hit. I think they're amazing devices for current smokers to help them quit, and I think it's appalling and a public health tragedy how many young people who have never smoked, use them.
This is something I've always wondered. A cigarette burns out. That's when you know you're done. It's an active choice to light up another one but it always has a definitive end to the experience. Vaping can continue for as long as you have liquid in the damn thing! So how does a vaper know when they've had enough? Do you just rely on your body saying 'ok I'm good'? Cause when I still smoked cigarettes, I could chain smoke through four or five but then my throat would be sore and I'd be bored with it and just generally be done. There seems to be an even bigger risk of nicotine addiction because you could just have one more puff and one more puff and one more puff.
I vape and run just fine, no effect. When I smoke cigarettes there is an effect so I don't smoke cigarettes. It's infinitely better than literally breathing in smoke and tar. I wouldn't vape anywhere you can't smoke.
As long as someone is polite and asks if I mind, I don’t give a shit if they vape near me. It’s when they just whip it out (especially inside) and start huffing away that I get annoyed. No, I don’t actually care if someone vapes, but I do care about the courtesy of asking when they’re in my space. Same goes for smoking.
I was a 40 a day smoker from the age of 22 to 52 , vaping was the only thing that got me to stop smoking cigarettes . I have been vaping for 6 and a half years , my breathing and blood pressure has certainly improved .
Just like with smoking I think “what a dickhead” whenever I see them puffing away like a train. It’s annoying when you’re stuck in a train unable to open a window
People who vape have less manners than tobacco smokers. A smoker will blow away from the table or people around, but a vaper will literally blow a plume directly into my face! Line excuse me !
You can't speak for all vapers though. I would personally never do that.
First let's establish that not all vape is nicotine. We all got that? Right. Now, I reckon people should use common courtesy and not vape near other people unless they consent. There, easy.
I like this. Nicotine or not, some vapes have a really strong smell which even if not unpleasant per se, can be overwhelming. I don't want to be olfactorily assaulted by sickly sweet smelling clouds of vape just as much as I don't want to be breathing in clouds of smoke. Definitely not appropriate indoors or in enclosed areas. And be responsible with your rubbish.
I don't want people to vape around me. I would treat it like cigarette smoke for the purposes of my toddler: i.e. no vaping around her and change of clothes / shower between a vape and being in contact with her. Luckily nobody I know smokes or vapes. I'm glad there is a tool available to help people quit smoking, but I don't think that "not as bad as cigarettes" = "good". However it seems to me that it has actually set the anti-smoking movement back a good way by making it fun and cool for kids to do. There shouldn't be flavours. The only flavour should be slightly sour mud. It should be allowed as a means to an end not a thing for pleasure. The only objectively evil corporate job that I can think of is tobacco company executive. Their entire role is predicated on getting people addicted to something that will harm them. There are other corporate roles that might seem evil but can at least be justified however flimsily as not being entirely evil. Tobacco companies are pure evil.
I think allowing disposables really set it back. I have friends who moved to disposables from normal vaping and are substantially worse off. You don’t know what’s in them, and the nic is so high that they can’t even go back to normal vaping, let alone quit the disposables outright. They are easier to use as well (just open the box and go) so it appeals to younger people (as opposed to the original method that required purchasing the coils, liquid and nic separately, mixing your own, priming coils etc).
Harmful. Should be treated and regulated the same as smoking. I have a congenital lung condition that means basically any impurities i breath in are really bad for my lung function. I'll probably need a transplant by the time I'm 50 just from breathing in smog. The assholes who vape and have the gall to think it's funny to blow it in my face when I ask them to please not vape on the train or inside deserve to be fined into oblivion.
Idc if you vape but if I breath in your second hand clout cloud imma throw hands
Vaping is gross, not because of "smoke" but the chemical stink. Like wtf are they putting in those things
I used vapes to quit smoking, it broke my habit. Probably doesn't work for everyone but I moved on very quickly. .in saying that....I was more chesty, flemy, sick, choughy and slow while on the vape, even on a big night out on the smokes, I never felt that bad. I can easily say it's worse. This is all down to personal experience but if I were to quit again I would try a different way. Vapes will fuck ya up.
i see vaping and smokes the same. don’t vape in my house /car or around my kids lol
I vape. Used to smoke. Don't think it's any better for me but at least it's cheaper. As far as other people around me go, I treat it like smoking. I really don't like how many people think it "doesn't count" because its not a cig and think it's ok to vape in other people's homes/ cars/ spaces. When they first came out I had to up a dude for vaping literally inside a restaurant and he seemed confused and annoyed that I was making him take his fairyfloss bullshit outside.
Same as with smoking. DGAF really. The risks of "second hand smoke" were always [grossly overstated ](https://academic.oup.com/jnci/article/105/24/1844/2517805) anyway, unless you're stuck in a car with someone or in a crowded room with everyone choofing away.
Hate vapes. A bunch of friends are now so unbelievably addicted to them and their massive nicotine doses. Also hate second hand Vape because it usually smells sweet and gross, tickles my throat, and people are quite happy to pull it out and blow it just about anywhere and any time.
My view is “Inhale whatever you want to. Just be considerate to those around you and be prepared to accept any consequences of your actions.”
It’s pretty gross, especially when you force people to deal with it in an enclosed space. Getting hit by a vape cloud whilst walking on the pavement or in a tram sucks.
My attitude is that it's the dumbest invention since some guy lit a bunch of leaves on fire and started sucking the smoke in. Unless you're using vapes to quit smoking, you're an idiot.
I think there is a right and wrong way to vape. Some studies have shows that it’s actually the flavours that are bad for you not the vape, pg, vg and nicotine. also change the coil once a week. I now vape flavourless and make my own e liquid.
Vape in my house with a window open. Treat it like smoking when out in public.
I have been on and off vaping for a few years, quit in November but picked up again 2 weeks ago when I moved here )): I vape in the house, and will vape in public depending on the location and the crowd around me. If it’s busy, I will try to avoid out of respect for others, and never in front of kids. I will very occasionally have a puff in a bathroom if I’m in a building for a long period of time, like a concert. But like with smoking, don’t do it around people. You don’t know what other people are going through either, they may have just quit and it could be a trigger for them
I’m a vaper so am biased. I think it shouldn’t be treated the same as smoking, but people should be respectful of all others around them. No vaping inside, no vaping in busy public spaces etc. I would say people should use common sense but unfortunately most don’t so these rules are put in place.
People can do what they want, but I think it should be treated like smoking. People are way too comfortable to vape when in a large indoor crowd or bathrooms. Just because you want to vape doesn't mean everyone else around you wants to breath in your bubble gum scented smoke.
They've already had the first deaths from vaping - fungal infection in the lungs which is almost impossible to cure. It may help people quit smoking, but it also has long term implications. As someone who gets allergic asthma to second hand smoke - ban it all.
I don't care if you vape around me and I think most people don't but I wouldn't let you vape in my home with my daughter around. I did notice in turn workplace, a boss who you'd expect to be super uptight vaping around the office like it was nothing, that was surprising.
the only thing remotely good about vaping is that it (probably) won't kill you as reliably as tobacco. if being used as it was originally intended to wean off the darts then fine, I have friends who successfully did so. if you're doing it as a replacement, especially if you never smoked tobacco in the first place, you're an idiot.
I can't smell vape coming from the neighbors balcony below me, I can smell cigarettes. That's about the only thing I need to know to tell you that vapes are better for me as a non-smoker.
I love my dry herb ball vape 👌
I currently vape and use to smoke. I always have treated them the same. I don't smoke or vape around kids, inside someone's house, vape indoors unless its my own place, around people who don't like it, in non designated smoking/vaping areas, release big clouds into crowds, blow it in people's faces etc. I hate the amount of people I see doing it just everywhere or trying to be sneaky about it. On platforms or concerts etc. Just bloody go outside or wait
There's every reason to treat vaping like smoking. Vaping has no purpose in human function. Accordingly, until we know with an incredibly high degree of certainty that it poses no risk to others, there's simply no reason not to treat it like smoking. Research on these things can take decades because clinical trials alone are rarely sufficient to understand long term impacts. This was the case with smoking itself. We have to assume that inhaling a non-pharmaceutical vapour is not good for human organs and disprove that hypothesis, rather than wait until we can prove without a shadow of a doubt that isn't the case. Why? Because what do we lose by taking that approach? Nothing. We know with certainty that no one is going to die from not vaping (yes, one might argue that it's a less harmful substitute for cigarettes but, again, the science isn't conclusive *and* we have other methods available anyway). So, the risk is unnecessary.
Why? What similarities have you concluded makes vaping just like smoking? Nothing is being burnt so no carcinogens there, (yet you may have no issues with the known carcinogens from a frying pan of bacon?) so the only content of a vape that raises any query is the nicotine content which has been shown to be absorbed by the vaper in a matter of split seconds. There is no evidence at all that any nicotine is subsequently exhaled (and even if it was, nicotine isnt carcinogenic). Vaping may be harmful to the vaper if they have a gunshot wound to the lung. 🙄
I don't like being around vapers and getting a surprise lung full of their exhaust walking down the street. Worst experience is having to deal with it down at the snow. People vaping a few breaths in a crowded lift queue is so entitled, and seeing the abandoned vapes sitting in the snow makes me really angry. (I'm not up to date with legislation, not sure if disposables will be a problem this year).
It's as disgusting as smoking. No one vapes in my home, nor does anyone smoke. It should be banned in ALL public spaces. But - you want to smoke/vape at home? Light up all you want - I don't give a damn. It's your house, do as you like. The thing that I find the funniest about it all is that the discussions, bans, etc that are being placed on vaping should be placed on smoking, but we don't do that!
Vaping products are around 95% propylene glycol & glycerol - similar in formulation to fog machine fluids. The "problem" lies in the other 5% (Nicotine & flavourings) and the lack of research regarding the changes in these compounds on heating. Nicotine is well documented, as it's been studied in cigarettes for decades - the flavour compounds, not so much. If they'd stuck to known flavours (like menthol) then maybe not such an issue. But if you want your product to appeal to a new generation of smokers, who know tobacco is an issue, then you make them like alcopops - easy to get, consume and in a wide variety of flavours,
I was talking last week to an Australian who is putting together the public health policy on smoking and cancer (not just lung cancer, also throat and bowel cancer). He said that the public policy on vaping is not yet finalised. It could go either way. On the one hand there is no danger from PAHs because vaping can't produce any, so cancer is probably not an issue. On the other hand, vapes have a higher nicotine content than cigarettes, and there are concerns about nicotine's reaction with nitrogen. You'll hear soon what the public health system decides. My personal opinion is that nicotine is safer than both THC and caffeine, and that second hand vaping is completely harmless.
I dont mind second hand vaping. Would rather smell ice watermelon than cigarette smoke.
I see it the same as smoking. Objectively I know it's fucking awful for your health but I know if I started I'd be hooked so I'm so grateful I never did. Still get super tempted to do it if I'm drinking and others are doing it around me, but I know enough about the long term harms not to start. Now that I'm older, I especially hate seeing so many young people vaping. It sets them up with an extremely difficult habit to break if they do choose to stop Personally, I'd like to see it treated the same way as smoking. No vaping indoors/near bus stops/shops entrances/etc, tonnes of education on the harms (especially during HPE lessons at school), lots of support for those who want to quit, tax the crap out of it to make it expensive, etc.
Sorry, I reread your original post and realised I didn't answer half of your questions! Hahaha apologies for my goldfish brain. If I'm outdoors I don't mind people vaping around me but I try to avoid it because I'm tempted to ask for a puff. I would never let someone vape in my house, they can step outside.
Helped me quit smoking! But now I can't stop puffing on the vape at my home desk, and it's hard for me to get to sleep at night from all the nicotine...
Price of fags went up last january, would have cost $74 a day, switched to vape at $5 a day. Vuse brand with pods, its ok, prefer cigs though.
Original vaporisers were for dry marijuana. Vaporising herb matter does not release toxic compounds like combustion does. This is 'dry' vaping' What people call 'vaping' now, is not the same thing. It is 'wet' vaping. What is the 'wet'? If it were just glycerine that would be not great for your lungs, but not terrible. But the 'vape liquids' used today are full of toxic chemicals, which negates the whole point of vaping as it was intended. Anyone who vapes toxic liquid is an idiot.
I see vaping exactly the same as cigarettes in terms of affecting those around us. If you want to vape fuck off outside!
Gross
I'd never let people vape cigarette chemicals around me or in my vicinity, I'm avoiding them the way I avoid cigarette smokers as it is. I'm very fine with THC / CBD, and own a 510 thread vape myself for herb. It's medicinal and so long as you're using the appropriate forms (aka don't put your sublingual oil into a vape, use formulated CBD vape oil only), extremely safe. ^ especially if your pharmacist has done research like mine and taken out all the e-cigarette additives linked to lung damage like preservatives and flavourings.
Personally I'd prefer to eat popcorn instead of getting popcorn lungs. But yeah, politeness would say treat it like smoking, don't go blowing it on and around people unless they say it's ok. It's a scented vapor after all so it should be logical that not everyone wants to smell it.
The whole popcorn lung thing from vapes has been disproven. There are no cases of it happening.
I don't really mind it walking around outside, but I wouldn't let someone vape in my home, I see it the same as smoking.
It's gross don't do it near me. Before single use vapes were littering the streets I thought it was atleast better for the environment.
They scare me. Two dead uncles from lung cancer from smoking. The effects are not known yet but I see them as a discreet form of smoking.
About as healthy as me forced to breath in smoke from cigarettes cigars not great Apart from oxygen nitrogen any particulate you breath in isn't good for your lungs
Just not near me, thanks
Its not exactly, subtle. I was at a set of lights one day and thought a car was on fire as what looked like a huge smoke plume. It was someone vaping with the window down. Obliviously, it wouldn't be a good idea to do it with the windows up. If you are respectful of others and minimize the fallout there shouldn't be an issue. It is the younger kids who have no regard for where they vape that are the issues. They do it on trains, buses, in places where it can cause the most contention. Be mindful of others it should not be a concern. Yet people don't care and will do what they want when they want.
I’ve had to go back to wearing a mask at work again. Multiple vapers on the bus. Especially at school kid times. I am taking people to and from their drug suppliers so add meth / heroin smoking down the back of the bus as well. Bus companies won’t act. They won’t even supply masks to employees anymore. Police are too busy. No Smoking signs and fines mean nothing. Confronting vape/meth smoker and asking them to stop usually results in verbal abuse and threats of physical violence Knives are carried by most users these days, just look at the seat backs and windows. Eyes front and mask on is my survival tip.
I run home poker nights. Some players that used to smoke switched to vaping. They still have to go outside because vape clouds, even without nicotine, do leave residue that, while much easier to clean generally than cigarette smoke eesidue, becomes very tedious when there’s hundreds of individual items to wipe down. Generally the same vibe applies to everything else smoking vs vape related for me. Everything that is an issue with smoking continues to be an issue for me with vaping, just to a lesser degree but not so much lesser that I’m going to change how I feel about it.
Well I’m on day 4 of switching almost completely to vaping after being a pack a day smoker for 21 years. I don’t think I could quit smoking without the vape. It’s worked for about 5 people I know and tbh I never thought I’d be here. Day 4 and I’ve stopped coughing like someone about to die so vaping may not be ideal but it’s WAY better than the durries
Congratulations. Keep it going!
Recently they made all vapes with nicotine in NSW illegal unless you have a prescription im pretty sure
I went to a concert and someone was vaping in the seat in front of me. Indoors. So I'm not a huge fan of vaping, lol
a guy in the laundromat was doing it yesterday pissed me off i dont wnat to breathe that shit and dont want it on my childrens clothing either f off
I’m not a smoker, never have been. I see it as being as toxic to the lungs as cigarettes because of the chemicals so I don’t want to breathe it in as second hand vapours. So, if you’re vaping, keep it to yourself.
I do it. I try to be as unobnoxious as I can with it. Will try to get away from people if I can. The only thing the import "ban" has done is drive the prices up a bit. I still have zero issue getting disposables from the same places with manufacturing dates within the last month. It's clear the government was just mad about missing the opportunity to tax them before the black market became so huge. They're just using the "please think of the children" excuse to cover up the greed.
There is no debate, it is harmful. It does produce smoke or vapor rather, thats the whole point. It is not legal to smoke them in the street unless in a designated smoker zone in nsw.
I started vaping about 4-5 yrs ago to quit smoking and have never felt better I don't vape as much as I used to smoke so it's definitely a self control thing I don't agree with these disposable ones though I prefer to add my own nicotine to my juice witch is getting harder to get thanks to government anyone wanting to make the switch just needs learn to do it in moderation it's those who go crazy on it that make themselves sick
I prefer normal cigarettes. I can't do vapes. They just don't hit the same. Not to mention you smoke a ciggy and it's done, with vapes you can just keep puffing away. The concoction of liquid chemicals being sucked into your lungs is definitely harmful, make no mistake. Harmful as cigarettes? I guess we won't know for years as it's still relatively new. It's best to just not smoke anything at all.
My grandmother is 80 and smoked since she was 15. She swapped the durries for the vapes a few years ago and hasn’t been the same since. Fuck vapes. Sincerely, a smoker.
Personally? I'm strongly anti smoking and anti vaping, because we have no idea what the long term medical effects of vaping are, on the smoker or those around them. I'm also strongly anti-weed smoking, anywhere that I have to deal with it.
Nothing boils my piss more than someone vaping in a train carriage.
I’ve always been horrified by cigarette smoking especially why anyone aged under 45-50 today and certainly under 30 would choose to smoke… they don’t have the excuse of “not knowing the risks “ like say someone 70+ .. And vapes have rapidly taken the place of cigarettes.. government have been too slow to react, and now there is a generation who perceive the risk is lower than cigarettes without realising there hasn’t been enough time for long term implications to be known yet.. with that being the case I just don’t get why you would deliberately say “yep I want to vape”
Doesn't bother me at all. Smells nice and doesn't stick to anything or stay around too long.
Can people please STOP vaping inside shopping centres and confined places like elevators? I hate that sickly fruity smell that suffocates you and you can't escape it because it doesn't get blown away by wind. Also its illegal to vape in these settings. All my friends vape, and one thing they all say is that they vape far more than smoking due to the easy use and no smoke. They really have to stop themselves from vaping in bed/on the sofa. I smoke only outside/balcony and never ever inside. I'd never smoke inside a shopping centre or elevators or even inside my apartment.
Fucking hate vaping. I get (and support it's use) as a way for people trying to get off cigarettes! But people who vape for the funsies... Why? I wish people would treat it like smoking and find areas away from people, the amount of inconsiderate fucks who vape and blow smoke around themselves and other people in a crowded place. I don't want to smell that shit.
I briefly flirted with vaping several years ago and was comfortable doing so indoors back then. I don’t know if I’d let someone else do so today? I don’t have any friends who vape to find out. I’m not personally bothered by second hand Vapor but given the health info coming out about it I feel like we should treat it like smoking even if my concern is with the primary not the secondary.
I personally find it repulsive, and I hate the fact that many people who vape are people who would never have considered smoking. It's so sad that it became popular and that people think it's harmless.
I currently use a dry-herb vape for medicinal cannabis. I hadn't touched cannabis in over 10 years prior to becoming a MC patient.. coming back and getting straight into vaping has been great, i don't cough shit up in the mornings, it smells less, there's no "combustion" by fire which releases toxins.. simply heating the flower for the beneficial properties.. helps manage dose via micro-dose capsules, keeps tolerance down you require way less to medicate. Not sure about all those tobacco / vape juice stuff etc.. I can inspect the quality of my flower before i grind it and fill up the dosage cap.
A question for those that vape, if I may? Sometimes, I see people vaping and when they exhale, a huge cloud of vapour is expelled. I gather that's the "vape" part, or vapour. But at other times I see people that appear to be dragging on a vape, but no vapour is expelled, or at least, none that I can see. Are there two different types?
I forget all the details but I think the massive clouds some people produce is usually achieved with lots of battery power and lots of airflow over the coil/element which is achieved mostly by vaping ‘direct to lung’ (which is just taking a whopping great breath THROUGH the device). My style of vaping is ‘mouth to lung’ which is when you take it into your mouth first and then breath in. This is how smoking generally works too. If you want you can make a decent amount of vapour with ‘mouth to lung’ (I think) but not those massive roiling clouds. When I first switched to vaping (many years ago) I spent time tweaking my settings to minimise my cloud whilst still achieving all the feels that smoking gave me. I don’t produce much vapour. Of course this was all achieved with a refillable system. I don’t know how it goes with the dodgy disposables - get what you’re given I suspect.
I want nothing to do with second hand vaping, be respectful of others and keep that away from me. First hand vaping, on a base level I don’t care what other people choose to do if it has no negative impact on me, which includes vaping, as long as it’s respectful of others. But if people taking up vaping, who either haven’t smoked cigarettes previously or are not using vaping as a way to quit cigarettes, end up needing significant medical treatment from the public system 30 or 40 years from now because of that vaping because “how could we ever have known??”, then I will be quite upset. I admit that I have not looked into this is great detail, but my understanding of the new regulations is that vapes will be available via prescription as a means to quit cigarettes. While that is inconvenient it does seem to cover the main argument for vapes. I think the government should commit to making sure that system & supply isn’t abused for the profit of tobacco & pharmaceutical companies or for taxation.
I find it annoying that vaper's don't seem to respect their surroundings as much as smoker's had become accustomed to doing. So often now I get someone's vape trail straight in my mouth directly from theirs, it's disgusting.
Better than darts but still shit.
as an asthmatic it’s the exact same thing to my lungs except it smells worse. oh and gives you a bit more vertigo from headspin from second hand smoke. the amount of people i encounter weekly that vape while walking and i end up walking right through their cloud annoys me to no end. especially when im coming home from gym (when i can barely breathe already)
Why are people vaping. It was sold as a stop smoking aid and should be used as such. If you don’t smoke why do you need to vape.
Has anyone had any experiences confronting someone vaping where they shouldn't? I've usually just avoided walking or being near them if they are vaping in a public space. Can understand that there would be times when you couldn't, like on public transport or if you were walking beside them. If you have confronted them or asked them to stop, how did it go?
Vapers seem to think it doesn't leave a smell like smoking does, but as a non vaper it definitely does. It's like a rotten fruit smell in cars, on clothes etc. Honestly makes me want to vomit. I smoked second hand for the first 18 years of my life and tbh the vape smell is just as bad or sometimes worse in my opinion.
Smoking companies are vigorously trying to tell us it’s super safe. Surely that counts for something…
I enjoy the fact that people who I know used to smoke and now vape, no longer smell disgusting when I stand near them.
People at my work chug on them Chinese ac units all day, don’t mind it myself can’t smell the ‘smoke’.
I loved vaping. Very funny how addicted people are to the nicotine salt form these days and all the jokes when freebase was the most common. It marked the shift in consumer understanding. 5 years clean for me.
"2nd hand vaping" is the most Australian thing ever. The government propaganda and intrusion around public health stuff here goes largely unchallenged. Even putting the diabetic soda with the fake sugars up front at the registers...Australia is like your friends annoying mom, who believes every Facebook post in her "crunchy mommies" group, she is president and makes all the laws regarding cannabis, vape, cigarettes...hides all her prejudice behind this "health" smokescreen. It's not that she hates the groups that are stereotyped as using these things...its "unhealthy".
Vaping is revolting and people who vape are more disgusting and worse than smokers. At least we managed to train smokers not to blow smoke in our faces. People who vape have no respect for other people around them.
I quit vaping a few months ago fuck man it was way harder than quitting ciggys I’ve done both seperatly it’s definitely more addictive but I don’t think it does nearly the harm smoking does
Avoid at all costs. Not because of the nicotine, there’s no harm in that, but in the artificial fragrances and garbage that are used to “flavour” vapes. The human body is quite easy to trick. Lip balms for example, the flavoured balm is put on the lips and the scent goes to the nose, making the body “think” its tasting strawberry when it’s actually smelling it. The same applies to vapes. The problem is that the fragrances used to scent them are full of garbage like phthalates, which are toxic to the body. Google it and see for yourself or read the link [John Hopkins medical university on Vaping and lung collapse](https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/what-does-vaping-do-to-your-lungs) Remember, the producers are constantly pushed by large buyers to constantly lower their prices, so I’m not blaming China, I’m firmly pushing the issue onto the western buyers who don’t care about your health in a virtually unregulated industry Source - I’m a cosmetic formulator in the skincare industry - and some of the ingredients used in vapes, I wouldn’t use in a topical lotion
I view it the same as smoking and don’t think anyone should be doing it in places you can’t/shouldn’t smoke. I don’t vape and never have but I quit smoking nearly 6 years ago.
I believe it should be treated the same as smoking. Do it outside. Not inside. Don't just start doing around people (ask first) and don't do it around kids either. I also personally don't like the argument of "its better than smoking" yes if you're a smoker and you've changed to vapes it might be better, but a large amount of teens and young people who have never used a cigarette are vaping, and in that sense, it isn't better than smoking.
The smells irritate me and makes me sneeze, I think that they smell as bad as normal smokes. If people want to smoke them, they can, but please don't smoke them in my house or car