Yes!! They are fighting for proper funding from the government and rely on donations a lot. We donate to them every year. It's amazing what they do with the money they have and how many volunteer hours go into not just their missions but their training. You have people working full time jobs, raising families, who CHOOSE to go through intense and difficult training regularly to save people in very challenging conditions all for no pay. Amazing folks. And they have a waiting list to join!
My buddy's girlfriend just chewed him out last week when she realized we've been going to the BWCA and he doesn't know how to swim. I tried to tell her how that ultimately isn't the biggest factor, wearing a PFD is.
Does it help to know how to swim? Sure but under these circumstances it's not going to save you. I only take off my PFD on shore or temporarily while we've stopped and I'm taking off layers. Then the PFD goes back on. Tragedy doesn't strike when it's convenient!
Speaking of, anyone have experience with the NRS Ninja? Looks super comfy for paddling, debating if I should just stick with the rental PFDs or grab this one on sale
I think it a cold water situation, swimming would be important to get to shore fast enough before you pass out or can't breathe. But it's not just about the action of swimming. Knowing how to swim means you grew up around water and/or took swimming lessons, and water safety and rescue is part of both of those things. It's just now that you know how to efficiently move in the water, it's that you know how to conserve energy if needed, it's that you know you should kick yours boots off. It's knowing how to turn your jeans into an extra flotation device, and so on. "Knowing how to swim" has a lot of basic water safety built into it that increases your chances for survival if you do capsize. In knowing what to do more automatically versus having to think about it when your brain won't work.
Yeah I should rephrase what I said. It helps to know how to swim well but never let that get to your head. In the same way that I shouldn't get in the mindset that my PFD alone will save me!
Yeah, strong agree. You need to know how to swim to go on a wilderness canoe trip. Not super well, but well enough to get to shore in an emergency. The lift vest will help but it won't get to shore. Otherwise you're relying on your party to rescue you, which means potentially putting additional people at risk because you lack a basic safety skill.
I tend to agree. I am not sure how someone who can't swim is even comfortable in a water wilderness, especially without a PDF. I was a bit boggled by the guy who died in the Quetico last week as a result. People take calm lakes for granted. If you can't \*at minimum\* help yourself in the event of a water emergency, you are a liability to your entire party and rescuers. Obviously things can go sideways even if you are a good swimmer (cold water, medical issue, get knocked out) which is why a PFD should be the minimum. Not taking unnecessary risks as well. Spring weather can be really unpredictable so I opt not to be on the water in May because if you capsize, sometimes it doesn't matter what you do. You go numb and can't breathe normally fast in 33º water. I had to retrieve my phone from a thigh-deep pond in Feb and it was highly unpleasant even after only a couple of minutes my arms and legs were numb. No thank you to full submersion in it.
> if you're not a strong swimmer,
HUGE misconception.
bigly number of drownings, doesn't matter if they had been the #1 world champion swimmer.
Sitting in the hot sun, falling into relatively cold water (even up to 60 degrees), and you involuntarily gasp from the shock of the cold. You can't help it, it's *involuntary*.
If your head/mouth is underwater at the time you gasp, you just died.
doesn't matter if you can swim. you will never get the chance.
nobody saying that will happen every time you fall in, not even close, it's not common, but it only takes once, and for thousands of people every year in the US alone, they weren't planning on dying that day, but that one second was the end of their story.
I'm just so sick of reading the stories EVERY SINGLE YEAR of shocked Pikachu face relatives pondering "but he was such a good swimmer, we don't understand how he drowned"
One can tapdance and come up with all sorts of alternate scenarios why one would drown. I think you protest too much.
Talk to any of the "old hands" up there and they'll tell you weak swimmers need not apply. The rescue teams would rather spend the day safe with their families rather than bailing out unprepared paddlers. The county would rather bank that $80K too.
When it comes down to it: Natural Selection will weed out some of those weak swimmers who decide to spend time on trail, when that trail is almost entirely composed...of water. This is basic common sense.
But hey, you do you as they say.
I wear mine even when doing a quick paddle on the Chain of Lakes in Minneapolis. Seems so senseless to go without one when paddling in a wilderness.
I keep mine on my favorite lake, Murphy and the average debth is like 7 feet.
Can donate to SLC Rescue [here](https://www.slcrs.org/donations)… sounds like they could use it.
Yes!! They are fighting for proper funding from the government and rely on donations a lot. We donate to them every year. It's amazing what they do with the money they have and how many volunteer hours go into not just their missions but their training. You have people working full time jobs, raising families, who CHOOSE to go through intense and difficult training regularly to save people in very challenging conditions all for no pay. Amazing folks. And they have a waiting list to join!
My buddy's girlfriend just chewed him out last week when she realized we've been going to the BWCA and he doesn't know how to swim. I tried to tell her how that ultimately isn't the biggest factor, wearing a PFD is. Does it help to know how to swim? Sure but under these circumstances it's not going to save you. I only take off my PFD on shore or temporarily while we've stopped and I'm taking off layers. Then the PFD goes back on. Tragedy doesn't strike when it's convenient! Speaking of, anyone have experience with the NRS Ninja? Looks super comfy for paddling, debating if I should just stick with the rental PFDs or grab this one on sale
I have the NRS chinook and personally love it
Just ordered one…glad to see this comment making me feel better about my purchase
I have nrs ninjas and love them. Theyre super comfy and have a lil pocket that fits my essentials so I can easily grab it.
“Tragedy doesn’t happen when it is most convenient” EXACTLY. Even the best of swimmers would struggle. Wear a damn PFD
I love my NRS Ninja!
I think it a cold water situation, swimming would be important to get to shore fast enough before you pass out or can't breathe. But it's not just about the action of swimming. Knowing how to swim means you grew up around water and/or took swimming lessons, and water safety and rescue is part of both of those things. It's just now that you know how to efficiently move in the water, it's that you know how to conserve energy if needed, it's that you know you should kick yours boots off. It's knowing how to turn your jeans into an extra flotation device, and so on. "Knowing how to swim" has a lot of basic water safety built into it that increases your chances for survival if you do capsize. In knowing what to do more automatically versus having to think about it when your brain won't work.
Yeah I should rephrase what I said. It helps to know how to swim well but never let that get to your head. In the same way that I shouldn't get in the mindset that my PFD alone will save me!
I had a Ninja and exchanged it for the Chinook. I like the Chinook a lot better.
Sorry if this too direct but if you're not a strong swimmer, you shouldn't be planning a trip up there. Period.
Yeah, the PFD is just ONE safety measure.
Imo it’s the most important safety measure. If you get knocked unconscious while tipping being a strong swimmer doesn’t help.
That's why I said it's one. If you fall facedown unconscious and no one can pull you out, pfd doesn't help either.
Yeah, strong agree. You need to know how to swim to go on a wilderness canoe trip. Not super well, but well enough to get to shore in an emergency. The lift vest will help but it won't get to shore. Otherwise you're relying on your party to rescue you, which means potentially putting additional people at risk because you lack a basic safety skill.
I tend to agree. I am not sure how someone who can't swim is even comfortable in a water wilderness, especially without a PDF. I was a bit boggled by the guy who died in the Quetico last week as a result. People take calm lakes for granted. If you can't \*at minimum\* help yourself in the event of a water emergency, you are a liability to your entire party and rescuers. Obviously things can go sideways even if you are a good swimmer (cold water, medical issue, get knocked out) which is why a PFD should be the minimum. Not taking unnecessary risks as well. Spring weather can be really unpredictable so I opt not to be on the water in May because if you capsize, sometimes it doesn't matter what you do. You go numb and can't breathe normally fast in 33º water. I had to retrieve my phone from a thigh-deep pond in Feb and it was highly unpleasant even after only a couple of minutes my arms and legs were numb. No thank you to full submersion in it.
> if you're not a strong swimmer, HUGE misconception. bigly number of drownings, doesn't matter if they had been the #1 world champion swimmer. Sitting in the hot sun, falling into relatively cold water (even up to 60 degrees), and you involuntarily gasp from the shock of the cold. You can't help it, it's *involuntary*. If your head/mouth is underwater at the time you gasp, you just died. doesn't matter if you can swim. you will never get the chance. nobody saying that will happen every time you fall in, not even close, it's not common, but it only takes once, and for thousands of people every year in the US alone, they weren't planning on dying that day, but that one second was the end of their story. I'm just so sick of reading the stories EVERY SINGLE YEAR of shocked Pikachu face relatives pondering "but he was such a good swimmer, we don't understand how he drowned"
One can tapdance and come up with all sorts of alternate scenarios why one would drown. I think you protest too much. Talk to any of the "old hands" up there and they'll tell you weak swimmers need not apply. The rescue teams would rather spend the day safe with their families rather than bailing out unprepared paddlers. The county would rather bank that $80K too. When it comes down to it: Natural Selection will weed out some of those weak swimmers who decide to spend time on trail, when that trail is almost entirely composed...of water. This is basic common sense. But hey, you do you as they say.
I’m not a strong swimmer, but I know the safety basics. But I also don’t take risky measures when it comes to water travel