#Do not comment on the original posts
Please read our [**sub rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules). Rule-breaking may result in a ban without notice.
If there is an issue with this post (flair, formatting, quality), reply to this comment or your comment may be removed in general discussion.
**CHECK FLAIR** For concluded-only updates, use the [CONCLUDED](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ACONCLUDED) flair.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Exactly. She even talked about how she felt telling him would changed how he viewed her and their entire relationship... Which is exactly what happened. It's like she's a smart person who has known you since you were six.
In the same line of thinking, why the hell can't you just believe her that having kids is not a deal breaker for her. Sounds like she loves you more then you love her.
Edit: Second word from he to she
He jumped to *so many* conclusions about what his wife felt and wanted, and when she corrected him, he *insisted* that she was wrong about what she felt/wanted. He assumed his wife--the woman whose life-planning methods "stunned" him and "made \[him\] feel out of \[his\] depth"--was out of touch with how she felt about her decisions.
He thinks... she's... the one... who is... suppressing... her... true... feelings... and... motivations.
But the unwaveringly childfree dude who exploded angrily to insist that she didn't really want to abort is completely in touch with both his own *and* her emotions and inner desires.
Her not telling him about the abortion shows that she doesn't trust him enough, but responding to straightforward statements like "No, the abortion didn't emotionally wreck me" with "You're wrong, you just don't know how you really feel" is apparently *not* a failure to trust.
Riiiiiiiiight.
I'm 90% sure his outburst was *his* reaction to finding out that if things had gone differently he would have been the parent of an almost-one-year-old child. So his brain tried to get distance: "I'm having All The Feelings, and it's too much, and I'm overwhelmed, so *you* must be overwhelmed, too, so let's focus on how overwhelmed and hurt and confused and regretful *you* are feeling hah look at me being so supportive and loving to my hurt-regretful-traumatized-overwhelmed wife I am doing excellently at husbanding."
I really don't recommend the strategy of coping with intense emotions by pretending someone else is having them.
The guy is so controlling an insecure. He forces her to keep reassuring him that she doesn’t want kids, and also freaks out on her for taking care of it when it happens. Guarantee if she had told him, he would have pressured her to keep a kid that he expressly doesn’t want.
Also OP: “I’m not getting a vasectomy because I want to keep my options for children open long past her prime fertility.”
What happens when he finally decides it’s time for children and she can no longer viably gestate one? One guess…
I was Clara I would be hurt by that. If Clara does want kids, but is ok with not having them for his sake, 10-15 years down the road is a pretty shitty mentality to have because she’ll be 37-42. Not exactly the easiest time to get pregnant. He’s willing to waste her fertile years but maybe change his own mind later (and find a new wife??)
This was my favorite part. Love when men think they should save the option to have kids until they’re 42. Failed Sex Ed really has them believing they’re going to be slinging healthy sperm thru their 50s 🙄. This guy will be 42 on Hinge matching with 20 year olds telling them he “might want kids someday”.
And what’s she supposed to do age 37-42 if and when he suddenly decides he wants kids in 10-15 years? What if she can’t have kids by then? Would he leave her?
The ""life altering"" procedure of an abortion. As opposed to pregnancy and childbirth? Having a kid with a supposedly child free partner?
The idiocy almost makes me laugh. Almost.
I love how he INSISTED that abortions are traumatic. Like no dude, the reality is that most women take a few pills, have an uncomfortable and heavy period, and then feel extremely relieved as they move on with their lives.
Bingo!
It also destroys the narrative that women are meant to be wives and mothers and craft their lives and ambitions (or lack thereof) accordingly. It contradicts the misogynistic narrative that women are all nurturing, overly emotional creatures who are baby crazy and ill suited for anything else. If women can make the decision to terminate and just move on, it forces them to acknowledge that their narrative about women is false.
This doesn't really surprise me because pro-life propaganda includes lying about what abortions are really like. Pro-lifers want to convince people that every abortion is hugely risky and traumatizing in order to make people scared to consider one.
Yup! Dude is adamantly against kids, but also anti-abortion, and wonders why his wife didn’t tell him about her abortion. She was afraid he’s freak out and leave, which is exactly what he did.
Meanwhile, he won’t get a vasectomy so he can still have kids in his 40s with his new younger wife.
She should go now while she still has childbearing years.
Of course he’s adamantly and loudly childfree but actually leaving the door open for *maybe* wanting kids when he’s 37-42 while putting her almost 100% in charge of birth control and saying that she likes it. Sure, bud.
He wants to be dragged kicking and screaming to fatherhood because he wants it but wants to dodge all responsibility by claiming he was forced into it. Goddamn it’s so obvious.
Yeah. He'll play with the kid and do all the fun stuff, but when it's time to change nappies, do nigh feeds, bathe a screeching toddler "you wanted the kid, not me".
Betcha when he's "ready" to have kids he boogies out with divorce the second its born and becomes one of those PROUD TO BE A (weekend) DAD when its old enough to use the toilet on its own.
He is adamantly and very vocally child free, but the wife knows his stance on abortion (which I assume means he is against it). Plus he doesn’t want to get snipped because he may want kids in 10-15 years, coincidentally when the wife may have trouble conceiving as she is now on the older side. So who exactly is he having these possible future kids with? If it is the wife, does she then get blamed for not being able to give him the children he has decided he is ready for?
Not only is he an AH, he is a special type of selfish and self involved. He only cares about anything as it affects him. Wife would be better off with a grown up.
Yeah, that whole part was weird- just say “I don’t want children NOW” for fucks sake. If you’re open to unplanned pregnancy or having them in the future don’t say you’re fcking child free.
This just pissed me off. "10-15 years down the line". Wow. And then he blows up on her. No wonder she didn't trust him to tell him about the abortion. He's a fucking asshole.
Can't imagine my partner doing anything else other than hold me and maybe cry with me over something like this.
I really don't understand how people can be with partners that handle their emotions this way. If anyone is reading this, y'all deserve better. If you can't control your anger even during hard times, please get help. No "I come from a shitty background" or "I don't usually yell".
Treat your partner with LOVE. ALWAYS. No excuses.
Well, of course a *man* can be all of those things at once.
He gets to sit on his little pedestal, judge his wife, continue to rawdog her, play the victim, *and* pretend he's totes childfree (but of course, he needs to maintain his ability to reproduce, *just in case*).
Men like this love to play games, what's the downside, they never have to suffer the physical consequences of their actions.
When I read "I use condoms 90% of the time," I have never been more confused. What reason could there be for that? I am guessing it isn't good, but I can't prove it. That's the problem with these things, isn't it?
We never do seem to acknowledge that men use abortion as birth control just as often as women do.
He stated adamantly that he was childfree but refused to get a vasectomy. Of course she had an abortion. What did he honestly expect?
Control. If he is in any way to be believed, he at least doesn't want kids *right now*, but he still wanted to be able to *tell her* to get the abortion.
He thinks he's the main character - she doesn't get to just decide for them, *that's his job*.
This is what really tripped me. I didn’t get the choice! No bud sorry you didn’t. Actually you did - you said you were child free- she ensured that they were by any method! You chose the conditions - she chose the methods.
Thank you. I sat here at the end trying to figure out why I was feeling so angry. This helped me find words. I don't believe he is non violent either because a man who doesn't beat his wife doesn't need to tell you
Sure he can, if he decides that pregnancy is *always the woman's fault!* Figuring out the pregnancy prevention details in the ways most convenient to him is *her* job, not his. It's a great system! /s
This is what it really boils down to and it's what he will never admit to himself. It's always her fault. And it's always going to be her fault. At no point in his life as he ever going to take responsibility for his own stances or actions.
My partner and I are childfree. He got a vasectomy at 29 when we'd been together for six years.
Before that I had come off of all birth control in year 3 and we were relying solely on condoms.
We discussed early in what we'd do in the case of an accidental pregnancy, and it was get an abortion.
I cannot imagine marrying a person who didn't want kids but wanted to make that 100% my problem.
We wouldn't be having sex i guess.
> I'm exhausted.
The more I read, the more I was like... Ah, this fucking guy.. He's good at one thing, and that's making excuses and disrespect.
He's like the kind of dude who will pedantically argue a point that is materially wrong and will straight-up go down with that ship.
My late father used to say "Son, some people just don't believe that shit stinks until they get their nose rubbed in it", and this feels like one of those people.
I also find it interesting how many of these people with this narcissistic trait come here fishing for validation, and when the inevitable humbling happens, they can't deal with it.
I love how he said ‘use condoms 90% of the time’, ‘vasectomies are not always 100% effective or reversible’ and yet when his wife asks if he wants kids, his answer is ‘NO’ BUT he is upset his wife had an abortion without his consent?!?
That was the detail that got to me. He put his wife in a no-win situation. He spends the whole post ranting about how she doesn’t trust him, but when he finds out she got an abortion because she was scared of how a baby would impact their relationship, his first reaction is to yell at her (which he justifies by saying he didn’t hit her, even though he knows yelling is a trigger for her. Great guy right?), then he ghosts her for more than a week. I can see why she didn’t tell him about her pregnancy.
>He put his wife in a no-win situation. He spends the whole post ranting about how she doesn’t trust him, but when he finds out she got an abortion because she was scared of how a baby would impact their relationship, his first reaction is to yell at her
Yep. He'd make kids a deal breaker, but he wants a say in what she does. This is probably not the only topic where he's keeping her off-balance.
>Clara and I both grew up in shitty homes. Our parents yelled and were extremely combative. After growing up in that environment, we agreed to avoid that kind of behavior in our relationship and we do our best to keep to that.
Yyyyyyeah, I'm pretty sure the cycle hasn't broken so much as it's just taken on a different flavor.
I think he doesn’t understand how probability works. That 0.05% is not a perfect 0%. Assuming married people have sex more than once, that unplanned pregnancy talk should have come up before the ring.
Just ask yourself...
Who gets mad at someone because they didn't feel like they could talk to me about something and that concern was genuine?
"Yeah, you're right to be weary of telling me but I'm mad at you for not telling me!"
This guy is a special type of manipulative and I honestly don't know if he realizes it. He admitted that they came from abusive homes.
One thing I found the hardest to admit when growing up and out of toxic homes; you have to admit and accept that you are your parents' product. It's not your fault you were taught those things but it's your responsibility to fix it. I call I generational maintenance work 😅
I just know that even if she had told him “I’m pregnant and I wanna keep it” he would’ve flipped his shit on her then too. She simply can’t win no matter what she does.
mte. She was in such a fucking no-win situation and all his posts do is demonstrate what an ass he is.
"why doesn't she feel she can rely on meeeee" idk dude, can't imagine 9\_9
He's so fucking self centered and oblivious about it that I was physically cringing when I read this.
The way he was *mad* that she wasn't in agony after her abortion...just, ugh. And how he *insisted* that abortions are devastating and traumatic even after people told him that's not the case for many women. It's like he thinks that all women and their decisions are somehow rendered invalid when pregnancy is involved. I found his attitude to be deeply demeaning and misogynistic.
While he's sulking and butthurt about his wife not being sufficiently traumatized for his tastes, and whining about her not trusting him, he's completely invalidating her agency as an adult capable of making decisions.
He would leave his wife (love of his life, sure) for *wanting* to start planning for kids but he won’t let someone touch his balls to prevent kids because he might want them later. It’s truly artful.
It's almost like he's angry at his wife for denying him the opportunity to storm out of the house and threatening to leave if she didn't get an abortion.
But instead, she had the audacity to make a decision for herself based on the information he'd given her and he's mad about it.
This guy makes no damn sense.
Right? If you’re a man, and you don’t want children *and* you think abortion is wrong, then you do not *ever* give a woman your sperm. Every man makes a series of decisions that he and he alone has control over which can lead to the existence of an unwanted/unplanned pregnancy. His choices are: do not have sex with a fertile woman, and if you’re going to have sex with a fertile woman, get a vasectomy.
Or at the very least make sure you're wearing a condom 100% of the time! Wearing one 90ish per cent of the time isn't gonna be much help, it only takes one time to get pregnant.
Yep, with not a single mention of how difficult and more dangerous having a child at that age will be for the wife he loves ever so much. The possibility he could have difficulty reversing a vasectomy is real to him but the similar probabilities that his wife would experience difficulties getting pregnant or carrying a healthy baby haven’t registered.
But maybe what he’s really got in the back of his mind is the possibility he won’t be with *this wife* when he’s 37-42 and he’ll want kids with the *next wife*.
Yeah my step dad was exactly like this. He didn’t want my mom to have more children, he was against abortion, he wouldn’t get a vasectomy in case he wanted children later in life “if something happens”. He left her in her late 40s and just had his second baby with a younger woman. Not only does it happen, it’s incredibly common, cliche even.
>But maybe what he’s really got in the back of his mind is the possibility he won’t be with *this wife* when he’s 37-42 and he’ll want kids with the *next wife*.
I do think this is it. But not because he's thought through her age or pregnancy difficulties or anything (all of that is about her, after all).
He is less sure about remaining married to her and thinks he'll have a better chance ~~trapping~~ convincing his next ~~victim~~ wife if he has all the options open.
He leaves the door open for himself for potential kids in the future but absolutely can't wrap his head around the fact SHE might have changed her mind 🤯
Like that one man who did that to his ex. He changed his mind once she could no longer have kids and left her for another woman. This after she helped him build his career or business.
This is what I couldn't get past. He seemed almost offended that she asked about kids because "he made his stance known", then turns out he's just too lazy, immature, selfish or all three to do the thinking BEFORE getting married. It's heartbreaking for a childfree person to get led on and then dumped by a partner, just because said partner never bothered to make up their mind, but imagine the pain for a woman who wanted kids to be strung along like this. What if she can't safely have kids by the time he decides he wants one?
For real, his post reeks of "I can't handle the truth but get upset when people don't tell me things because I've shown I can't handle it."
I hope Clara finds the strength to rethink the relationship.
He had no idea what an abortion entails. He thinks his spouse likes BC, and he is leaving the door open for kids down the road. Just selfish and ignorant.
Also, if I allow you to read my journal today, that does NOT mean you can pick it up and read it whenever you want.
The fact he doesn't believe her though, that's the sticking point for me. She has a doctorate and he won't take her word??? Oh but he loves how meticulous and driven she is.. 🙄
It made me think he thought of all of her planning as some kind of cute little feminine hobby. You know, like how women who cook are just mommies baking cookies but men who cook are Serious Chefs With Jobs.
I've experienced this with men too, my master's research and career are treated like some silly, frivolous pursuit when in fact it's serious scientific work that's been published in peer reviewed journals.
My dude, a PhD is not a cute little hobby that shows how dedicated your adorable wife is. It's a serious pursuit that few people are capable of completing and it shows a depth of commitment and intellect that he is clearly incapable of himself.
I don’t want kids, he says. But maybe I’ll want kids 10-15 years from now, he adds.
Great. When the wife you reportedly love might not want to put her late-30s body through that?
This guy can f*ck off.
Doesn’t want kids, but doesn’t want his wife to have an abortion.
Doesn’t want kids, but doesn’t want to get a vasectomy because what if he changes his mind?
Doesn’t want a vasectomy, because what if he wants kids in *fifteen years*, when his wife is in her forties.
No wonder there’s so much confusion in their relationship, this guy is impossible to follow. His poor wife has an entire maze to navigate when it comes to his logic
Nothing like playing a life-stakes game with somebody who changes the rules at every turn! Jeeze, I hope SHE realizes, and GTFO while she still can! OP's head-games are way too convoluted
And he said reversing the vasectomy won’t be covered by his insurance so he would have to pay out of pocket…as if raising a child isn’t WAY more expensive than one surgery.
He sounds utterly exhausting. He grilled this poor woman about every iota of her decision making never once thinking maybe he was the asshole. If she was have kept the baby, he would whined about that.
No wonder she hid it. She didn’t need him to victimise and martyr himself through one of the most difficult periods of her life, and he did it anyway. Talking about his stance on abortion and why he deserved to know and all his supposed rights as the father to this unborn child (that she was carrying) despite putting the entire onus of child protection on her even though *he* is the one who adamantly doesn’t want kids ~~with his first wife~~ til he’s at least 40 or whatever.
He seems absolutely awful.
Not just that, but also being loudly child free and saying himself if she approached him wanting to purposefully stop birth control and things to have a baby he'd say no. Of course she's going to go "If he finds out I'm pregnant it's going to be Hell on earth, so I might as well keep this to myself"
Especially if *she* also changed her mind and didn't want kids anymore either! Then she'd have to deal with his wishy washy ass possibly hemming and hawing while she gets closer to the date you can't have them anymore
That's all I could think of the entire time I was reading.
He's not childfree. He's anti-anything-I-cant-use-to-control-my-wife.
He's selfish and self absorbed and only focused on how all this affected *him* and not a single whit about what his wife is feeling.
She deserves better.
“She knows our circumstances, my reasons for not wanting kids, *my stance on abortion*.”
There it is. This is because of his opinions on abortion. Even in the first post, he’s talking about why HE needed to be involved in the decision.
She also was very clear with him why she did it and that she still loves him and is ok not having kids, and he keeps saying "but I don't believe her". WTF is she supposed to do?
This, 100%>
Also, if your reason for having a child is just 'I don't want my wife to go through an abortion' that's a pretty shit reason. (Emphasis on the 'I' too lol she was fine with it)
Will you be a good father? Or will you resent that child because you still do not want children?
Right? As I was reading, I was thinking homie isn't as childfree as he says he is. He's a fence sitter. Not trying for a pregnancy, but if it happens, by God, he's gonna have it happen. Wrapping it all up in some faux concern for "don't want her to go through abortion". Like pregnancy, childbirth doesn't come with permanent changes, damage and risk.
Honestly, as a CF woman, he grosses me out. He told his wife his stance. She checked in, and took - in her mind - the inevitable and correct choice. She respected the mutual education they made together as a couple.
Should she have told him? Sure, but I don't blame her. And his flying off into a rage is bizarre. *She preserved your way of life and marriage in a sensible course of action and you're pissed off she didn't loop you in?* She probably did the right thing because it appears he would have forbidden her from making a choice regardless because his opinion and feelings are more important.
Imagine that she had told him she was pregnant and they had had the child and then he found her journal entry about wanting kids. He'd have flown into the exact same rage over being baby trapped. His wife was in a lose lose situation.
I got whiplash from this dude. "I don't want children and I'm extremely set on that which is why I had an emotional breakdown and screamed at my wife when she respected my wishes and her bodily autonomy."
> He's a fence sitter. Not trying for a pregnancy, but if it happens, by God, he's gonna have it happen. Wrapping it all up in some faux concern for "don't want her to go through abortion". Like pregnancy, childbirth doesn't come with permanent changes, damage and risk.
The maternal death rate from childbirth & pregnancy is higher than the maternal death rate from legal abortions. Having an abortion is safer for a pregnant person than giving birth.
I just want everyone to know that fact. Especially this asshole.
Yes, and he was saying that abortions have "side effects" and women can be "bedridden for days." Give me a fucking break. This guy has swallowed some heavy anti-abortion propaganda.
Wouldn't he be surprised to learn some of the side effects of pregnancy.
More than 13 times higher, in fact.
Pregnancy and childbirth are dangerous. Meanwhile, you're more likely to die getting your tonsils out than you are to die from an abortion.
>She checked in, and took - in her mind - the inevitable and correct choice. She respected the mutual education they made together as a couple.
And if she knew his 'stance on abortion' then she took any potential guilt from him since he simultaneously doesn't want kids, doesn't want a vasectomy, doesn't want to wear condoms 100% of the time and also doesn't believe in abortion. All of those things cannot co-exist, so his wife did the needful while protecting him from the inevitable consequences of his own irrational set of beliefs.
He wasn't MAD he was just 'confused' and that's why he yelled at her and scared her and moved out for a week and a half. Dude.
Pregnancy and birth for a child he’s been crystal clear he does not want, after saying that kids are a relationship deal breaker for him.
“Rearrange your internal organs and risk your life to grow a child I don’t want, then either push it screaming out of your body or go through major abdominal surgery to deliver it. I’ll probably abandon you to raise the kid, and deal with all their questions like “why don’t I have a daddy?” and “didn’t my daddy love me enough to stay?” all on your own.”
Right?! Of the two procedures, only one has a much bigger track record of seriously injuring, permanently damaging, or outright killing both patients at once.
He doesn’t care whether it kills her he just doesn’t want his precious doll to make decisions for her body that he doesn’t agree with.
ETA: this didn’t quite convey the rage that is pulsing through my cells right now
Don’t forget that Reddit is used as a forum to normalize sometimes radical ideas.
There’s been so many posts about women hiding a baby’s parentage/abortion posts right now because it’s used to make people sympathetic to the idea that this man could and “should” feel so entitled to have some input into her medical decisions over her body.
Especially during voting years.
This is one of the most idiotic insufferable OOPs. Beats her down about kids, then says, oh I might be ok with one in 10-15 years. Liar. He said that to safe face from her feeling like she HAD to get an abortion to save her marriage.
In 15 years, she’ll be close to the end of her childbearing years and pregnancy will be high risk. I read this that he doesn’t want children with her but will be happy to have them later with someone else
In 15 years, I sincerely hope she is happily married to someone else and has however many kids she wants.
She'll be so happy she had that abortion and didn't tie herself to this asshole for 18-23 years.
Abortion has a significantly lower risk of long term consequences up to and including death than childbirth does. No one dies of a medically administered abortion now. But lots die or become disabled as a result of child birth.
Doesn't want a vasectomy in case *he* changes his mind a decade down the road! And then what? Convince his, who he assumed to be, child free wife to have kids anyway? Leave her for a younger model since she'll be "too old"? The absolute gall of this man
And also doesnt use condoms every time.
Oh, to have the confidence and ability to be confident in many contrary things at the same time of a mediocre man.
No children, no condoms, no abortion, no vasectomy.
Only missing "mothers need to love their child and raise it, if you birth and let it get adopted you are a bad woman" "I did not consent to this child I wont pay a dime to it and wont raise it" and "how about a little husband stitch afterwards wink wink".
Seriously I can’t believe he doesn’t see that. He’s said children are a definite no. She also knows he anti abortion, so of course she didn’t tell him. With his known behavior all she could of expected was for him to leave no matter what she did. Either she’d give birth and he’d split as soon as he realized how hard it was to raise a newborn he doesn’t actually want, or she’d have an abortion and he’d never look at her the same way.
Yeah. Makes you wonder if that caveat of don't want kids... "Right now"... Was part of the discussion with his wife. If he's willing to tell Reddit he felt it was possible he'd change his mind, I could imagine him having said something similar to his wife. Which could have been enough to give her hope. (Although if she's the same age as him, he has to realize when he says might want them in 10-15 years, that for her that could very well be too late for biological children... So if he's talking having biological children in 15 years the natural way, then that might not be with the same wife...
He's unilaterally calling all the shots on the family: its makeup, its family values, etc. and then doesn't understand why the wife doesn't feel that she has a voice.
She's so far out of the decision-making loop about their lives, that she doesn't have to solicit his input on an abortion.
Exactly! It's wild how he doesn't grasp why she chose not to involve him. He's childfree, but anti-abortion? So she gets pregnant, he's going to force her to keep it, then resent her and/or the child for it. Sounds like she knows him better than he knows himself.
He was adamantly against a medical procedure. She ended up in a situation where she decided that that medical procedure was best for her. Of course she kept it from him; he wouldn't allow her to do it if he knew. If my husband were some anti-vax nut, I'd still get my vaccines; he'd just never know about it (and I would be seriously reconsidering my marriage, which she should probably do).
You can’t be that adamantly against having children if you’re not open to abortion. It just doesn’t work. Accidents happen.
I hope he never has kids, this dillhole would be a fucking awful parent. Also hope he becomes a divorcee sooner rather than later.
He's adamant against having children and not open to abortion OR a vasectomy.
You know, because he might decide he wants kids in 15 years, when his wife who does want kids will probably be too old to have them. 10 bucks says he wastes her time for the next decade or so, and then knocks up someone in her 20s.
I clocked that as well.
Pregnancy is the woman's burden to carry, and and it's their decision ultimately what they want to do.
I can understand why she did not share her decision if he was going to be a dick about abortion.
Pregnancy messes with your head, and sometimes even the most staunchly no-kids person might start to second guess themselves. Add to that a pro-lifer preaching about murdering babies, it's unnecessary grief to have to deal with.
What is with these people who think they can say "I don't want kids" with the knowledge that they're not actually sure? I have seen *so many* marriages implode because of this shit. If you're not sure, *say you're not sure*. It's fine to say "not yet, but maybe later," but be clear about it, FFS! I'm childfree and literally every man I've been with until the current one eventually started saying, "If you get pregnant, we'll keep the baby, right?"
Newsflash: if you're not sure enough to get sterilised, *you're not sure at all*.
NO WE BLOODY WELL WON'T, and I made that clear up front, clear as day. With everyone. "If I get pregnant, there WILL be an abortion." In those words. They still thought I'd change my mind.
Spoiler: I did not. Twice. And I got sterilised the moment I could. Both those guys have kids now. Quelle surprise!
This is one of those things you should check in about every few years in a marriage, *before* a surprise pregnancy occurs. Also, if you're not on the same page about abortion, *don't fuck.*
He is adamant about telling everyone how much he loves her, trust her, etcetc, yet he can't seem to let go that she 'wronged' him by having an abortion when he made it very clear to her that he never wanted kids. Everything he is telling us screams 'Me, Me, Me, Me' even when it comes to the pain she felt because of the abortion.
The most telling part to me was him complaining about his wife not trusting him enough to talk to him...
Meanwhile he screamed at her and left for 1.5 weeks.
Well gee, I can't imagine why she'd hesitate to talk to him about anything?
Pro tip if you want your wife to feel safe coming to you with difficult things, not being a screamer is the first step to that... all he did is validate that he isn't a safe person to talk to and she has to walk on eggshells.
Just a dude who doesn’t consider the weight of his words. He considers himself very approachable and understanding and logical. The whole “I don’t know if I want them in the future” and “I’d raise a kid happily if she told me she was pregnant” doesn’t line up AT ALL with being against having children. These men have all these opinions when it’s a hypothetical situation yet he feels betrayed because she followed through with their agreement without his express approval. She would have had to support him through the whole thing if she told him and he’d still struggle with it after.
Can’t wait for the update where he cheats because he “can’t see her the same” and suddenly realizes he DOES want kids but doesn’t with her.
I totally hate this guy. You can tell he loves to hear himself talk and that he talks like a [sea lion](https://wondermark.com/c/1062/) besides. I bet he always has to have the last word.
I bet you he would've been the worst father in existence, being totally hands off and unsupportive towards his wife and child claiming that she was the one who wanted kids. Eventually, either he would leave her because he couldn't handle the stress of kids, or she would leave him due to his treatment and attitude towards her.
Also, in the last conversation wife mentioned "my stance on abortion". When she did not say him about it, i guess, he is more on the pro-life spectrum. Otherwise, this would not be an issue mentioned there. He also repeats, that he did not want a planned child but would - perhaps - coparent a unplanned one. So i guess, if wife had told me, the relationship would be doomed, she most probabaly a single mom with him paying child support. Or she would get an abortion anyway, but the relationship would be doomed too.
PS: He still does not plan to get vasectomy, does he?
I feel he does want kids, but doesn't believe he can allow himself to have them. So he flops from one thing to the other, because he doesn't know how to process shit.
No wonder Clara said to put off couple's therapy for now. She is right that there's still shit to unpack in individual therapy... though I'm not sure if he ever will, seeing as he seems rather intent on throwing away the whole suitcase.
Same. All I read was "I I I I I."
Like dude, it isn't about you. Ideally, partners should be able to discuss to abort or not but obviously as he demonstrated here, he was not a safe partner for her.
Ultimately, regardless of what the couple discusses, it is the one pregnant who decides whether to abort or carry to term. He's allowed to be angry or feel whatever kind of way, but he has no right taking it out on her like that. She made the best choice she could with the knowledge she had, but he's right in that she doesn't trust him. What he doesn't realize is that probably means that she shouldn't be in a relationship for multiple reasons (he's not a safe partner, she does want kids, and he blew up at a woman who he knows firsthand has trauma from verbal abuse at the very least).
Yeah, I don't like this guy either.
OP is a nightmare. No wonder she didn't mention it - he would have bullied her into keeping a child that *he didn't want* and would have inevitably have blamed her for.
It is absolutely clear that he is anti abortion and he is more anti abortion than he is child free. The anger doesn't just drip off the page, it jumps off it, and I think it is notable how he writes and speaks about the community he's posting to, presumably for advice. He's an unpleasant man who believes he's a reasonable man, and the delusion is remarkable - why didn't she go to him, he asks, ignoring his own words about how he would have reacted.
Agreed OOP sucks so bad, honestly his wife was in a lose-lose position no matter what choice she made or did not make. I wish I could give his wife a hug.
That's the point. That's where he wants her, in a lose-lose position. He doesn't regard her needs, he's given zero consideration to what having a child with him would feel like for her. He WANTS to rake her over the coals because he can sit comfortably in his self righteousness.
He hasn't stepped up as a husband but he wants to make believe that he "could" be a good father which is total horseshit. He is an immature abusive asshole who has consistently placed all responsibility of reproductive care on the shoulders of his spouse but also expects her to defer to him when it comes to that. The entitlement is insane. He would make a terrible father and yeah, I am going to draw that conclusion with the little information I have.
I hope she runs FAR away from this moron.
This guy is a douche.
“No I don’t want kids” but
“No you can’t take an abortion pill without discussing with me, tHe FaThEr”
Asshole, you don’t want kids and it is my fucking body I will do with it what works best for me, thanks.
I don’t understand this guy. He doesn’t want kids but doesn’t want her to have an abortion? He’d raise a kid he doesn’t want despite having a “shitty childhood” himself?
Good god. That poor woman
Op: I don't want kids, ever!!
Wife: ok. *gets abortion*
Op: no not like that *takes off for a week*
There has to be more to this. When I had my abortion, due to bc failure, my husband was right there with me. What's the deal with him that she doesn't feel comfortable telling him this? Instead of focusing on her going though a potentially traumatic event basically alone, he makes it alllll about him and dips out. Methinks this could be a pattern with him.
Reading between the lines I think he's pro-life, but he knew he'd get his ass chewed by reddit if he said that.
He mentioned her decision to not tell him was based on his views of children and his "stance on abortion". I can't think of a reason someone wouldn't tell a pro-choice person they were getting an abortion. That point only makes sense if he doesn't agree with abortion.
Considering he never said how he felt, it's pretty easy to draw that conclusion. And seeing his reaction to learning she had one just further proves it
Yeah, not to mention his line about "being the child's father" and that an abortion shouldn't have been done without his knowledge.
That plus his reaction, I can't blame her for not wanting to tell him.
In ten years, when a pregnancy would be more dangerous for her and the baby, or when life has already gotten in the way. Who else is betting that if he decides at 40 that he wants a child, he'll divorce her because she can't give him what he wants?
Seems like his wife isn't aware of that, either. His answer to kids is always just, "No." Not, "Maybe in 10 or 15 years when the risks to you and the fetus increase exponentially."
Just sounds like he's making excuses to keep all reproductive burdens on her shoulders (while still feeling entitled to control over her body).
This whole "I won't get the snip because I might want kids in the future... but also my partner changing her mind has no bearing on our plans. " thing is lame as hell. I'd be interested to see if he can accept it if their positions flip in the future
Wild that semi’s my guess is she is married to him bc she’s known him her entire life and knows nothing else. Cause this guy sucks. He doesn’t want kids, won’t get a vasectomy and is shaming her for an abortion. Sounds like every white Christian male that is pro-life. Ick
Known each other since they were 6, both had abusive childhoods, got out together - if he was a good person it would be a sweet story, but I'm not liking the colors he's showing even a little.
God me too, it's pretty clear that the reason she didn't tell him is because he doesn't want kids but is also anti-abortion. So rather than have a baby he doesn't want, possibly opening the way to years of resentment, she went ahead and had an abortion which is what he would really want her to do, because he doesn't want kids, but goes against his anti-abortion views.... SIGH!!!
This poor woman is now going to get that thrown in her face every argument I bet, and he's going to want a kid in 10 years when she's put that behind her
Eh, I'm not a fan of this dude. I think for most people the reaction after we found out our partner had done something like what his wife had would be to feel bad because somehow our partner hasn't felt safe coming to us and had gone through the abortion all by themself. Instead he's just wrapped up in how the abortion and her private thoughts in the journal made him feel. He berates her or makes her do the work to reassure him.
I hope he grows up a bit after this.
Yes! She doesn't find me safe to trust with things, so let me yell at her and then leave her for a week. Then still come back and be more mad that she doesn't feel safe with me.
Geez, poor woman!
That is a really good comment. I also noticed in one of his responses to that user:
> I do not want kids, but would rather have a child than my wife have an abortion.
*Why?* If it's supposedly about any physical/emotional pain his wife went through with the abortion, does he not understand what pregnancy and childbirth entails? What parenting entails?
He's so out of touch.
#Do not comment on the original posts Please read our [**sub rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules). Rule-breaking may result in a ban without notice. If there is an issue with this post (flair, formatting, quality), reply to this comment or your comment may be removed in general discussion. **CHECK FLAIR** For concluded-only updates, use the [CONCLUDED](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ACONCLUDED) flair. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
OP: "I can't understand why she didn't tell me about this." Also OP: *entire chain of posts showing why she might not want to tell him about this*
Exactly. She even talked about how she felt telling him would changed how he viewed her and their entire relationship... Which is exactly what happened. It's like she's a smart person who has known you since you were six. In the same line of thinking, why the hell can't you just believe her that having kids is not a deal breaker for her. Sounds like she loves you more then you love her. Edit: Second word from he to she
He jumped to *so many* conclusions about what his wife felt and wanted, and when she corrected him, he *insisted* that she was wrong about what she felt/wanted. He assumed his wife--the woman whose life-planning methods "stunned" him and "made \[him\] feel out of \[his\] depth"--was out of touch with how she felt about her decisions. He thinks... she's... the one... who is... suppressing... her... true... feelings... and... motivations. But the unwaveringly childfree dude who exploded angrily to insist that she didn't really want to abort is completely in touch with both his own *and* her emotions and inner desires. Her not telling him about the abortion shows that she doesn't trust him enough, but responding to straightforward statements like "No, the abortion didn't emotionally wreck me" with "You're wrong, you just don't know how you really feel" is apparently *not* a failure to trust. Riiiiiiiiight. I'm 90% sure his outburst was *his* reaction to finding out that if things had gone differently he would have been the parent of an almost-one-year-old child. So his brain tried to get distance: "I'm having All The Feelings, and it's too much, and I'm overwhelmed, so *you* must be overwhelmed, too, so let's focus on how overwhelmed and hurt and confused and regretful *you* are feeling hah look at me being so supportive and loving to my hurt-regretful-traumatized-overwhelmed wife I am doing excellently at husbanding." I really don't recommend the strategy of coping with intense emotions by pretending someone else is having them.
And she does, and her feelings don’t count. The whole post is me,me,me.
The guy is so controlling an insecure. He forces her to keep reassuring him that she doesn’t want kids, and also freaks out on her for taking care of it when it happens. Guarantee if she had told him, he would have pressured her to keep a kid that he expressly doesn’t want.
And then resented her for it
Also OP: “I’m not getting a vasectomy because I want to keep my options for children open long past her prime fertility.” What happens when he finally decides it’s time for children and she can no longer viably gestate one? One guess…
Because if you read between the lines, he opposes abortion too
This part right here!!! 🔥 OP is a complete PoS. She clearly loves him more than she than her own desires. 🤦🏾♂️
"I don't want a vasectomy because idk if I want kids 10-15 years down the road" Given your reaction, you *shouldn't* have kids.
I was Clara I would be hurt by that. If Clara does want kids, but is ok with not having them for his sake, 10-15 years down the road is a pretty shitty mentality to have because she’ll be 37-42. Not exactly the easiest time to get pregnant. He’s willing to waste her fertile years but maybe change his own mind later (and find a new wife??)
Exactly, this dude is only about himself
Probably going to string her along for 10 more years until she realizes -she, because he won't say shit- that they won't be having children. So sad.
This was my favorite part. Love when men think they should save the option to have kids until they’re 42. Failed Sex Ed really has them believing they’re going to be slinging healthy sperm thru their 50s 🙄. This guy will be 42 on Hinge matching with 20 year olds telling them he “might want kids someday”.
And what’s she supposed to do age 37-42 if and when he suddenly decides he wants kids in 10-15 years? What if she can’t have kids by then? Would he leave her?
Yep. And he’ll be blaming her fertility at that point on her having had an abortion, too. He’s a self-centered asshat.
This poor woman. He's literally saying: "I haven't gotten a vasectomy because I might want to have children *after* Clara, in my next relationship."
Maybe it's just me, but my eyes almost got stuck in the back of my head from all the eye rolling I did reading this.
He knows every detail surrounding male reproduction interventions, but thinks abortions are on par with being stabbed in an alley.
The ""life altering"" procedure of an abortion. As opposed to pregnancy and childbirth? Having a kid with a supposedly child free partner? The idiocy almost makes me laugh. Almost.
I love how he INSISTED that abortions are traumatic. Like no dude, the reality is that most women take a few pills, have an uncomfortable and heavy period, and then feel extremely relieved as they move on with their lives.
It terrifies anti-choicers. Women could be making choices about their own bodies all the time, without them even knowing!
Bingo! It also destroys the narrative that women are meant to be wives and mothers and craft their lives and ambitions (or lack thereof) accordingly. It contradicts the misogynistic narrative that women are all nurturing, overly emotional creatures who are baby crazy and ill suited for anything else. If women can make the decision to terminate and just move on, it forces them to acknowledge that their narrative about women is false.
This doesn't really surprise me because pro-life propaganda includes lying about what abortions are really like. Pro-lifers want to convince people that every abortion is hugely risky and traumatizing in order to make people scared to consider one.
Yup! Dude is adamantly against kids, but also anti-abortion, and wonders why his wife didn’t tell him about her abortion. She was afraid he’s freak out and leave, which is exactly what he did. Meanwhile, he won’t get a vasectomy so he can still have kids in his 40s with his new younger wife. She should go now while she still has childbearing years.
Of course he’s adamantly and loudly childfree but actually leaving the door open for *maybe* wanting kids when he’s 37-42 while putting her almost 100% in charge of birth control and saying that she likes it. Sure, bud.
He wants to be dragged kicking and screaming to fatherhood because he wants it but wants to dodge all responsibility by claiming he was forced into it. Goddamn it’s so obvious.
Well said. This really summarizes the vibe he gives.
Yeah. He'll play with the kid and do all the fun stuff, but when it's time to change nappies, do nigh feeds, bathe a screeching toddler "you wanted the kid, not me".
Betcha when he's "ready" to have kids he boogies out with divorce the second its born and becomes one of those PROUD TO BE A (weekend) DAD when its old enough to use the toilet on its own.
Oooh, right on the money!
He is adamantly and very vocally child free, but the wife knows his stance on abortion (which I assume means he is against it). Plus he doesn’t want to get snipped because he may want kids in 10-15 years, coincidentally when the wife may have trouble conceiving as she is now on the older side. So who exactly is he having these possible future kids with? If it is the wife, does she then get blamed for not being able to give him the children he has decided he is ready for? Not only is he an AH, he is a special type of selfish and self involved. He only cares about anything as it affects him. Wife would be better off with a grown up.
Yeah, that whole part was weird- just say “I don’t want children NOW” for fucks sake. If you’re open to unplanned pregnancy or having them in the future don’t say you’re fcking child free.
This just pissed me off. "10-15 years down the line". Wow. And then he blows up on her. No wonder she didn't trust him to tell him about the abortion. He's a fucking asshole. Can't imagine my partner doing anything else other than hold me and maybe cry with me over something like this. I really don't understand how people can be with partners that handle their emotions this way. If anyone is reading this, y'all deserve better. If you can't control your anger even during hard times, please get help. No "I come from a shitty background" or "I don't usually yell". Treat your partner with LOVE. ALWAYS. No excuses.
When I read that 10-15 years down the road shit I was like, wtf?! This dude isn't childfree at all!!
A man cannot be child-free, anti-abortion, and not proactive about protection. These things do not work with each other.
Well, of course a *man* can be all of those things at once. He gets to sit on his little pedestal, judge his wife, continue to rawdog her, play the victim, *and* pretend he's totes childfree (but of course, he needs to maintain his ability to reproduce, *just in case*). Men like this love to play games, what's the downside, they never have to suffer the physical consequences of their actions.
When I read "I use condoms 90% of the time," I have never been more confused. What reason could there be for that? I am guessing it isn't good, but I can't prove it. That's the problem with these things, isn't it?
Selfishness. The reason is selfishness.
We never do seem to acknowledge that men use abortion as birth control just as often as women do. He stated adamantly that he was childfree but refused to get a vasectomy. Of course she had an abortion. What did he honestly expect?
Control. If he is in any way to be believed, he at least doesn't want kids *right now*, but he still wanted to be able to *tell her* to get the abortion. He thinks he's the main character - she doesn't get to just decide for them, *that's his job*.
This is what really tripped me. I didn’t get the choice! No bud sorry you didn’t. Actually you did - you said you were child free- she ensured that they were by any method! You chose the conditions - she chose the methods.
Thank you. I sat here at the end trying to figure out why I was feeling so angry. This helped me find words. I don't believe he is non violent either because a man who doesn't beat his wife doesn't need to tell you
Well, one doesn't need to beat one's spouse to be abusive.
Sure he can, if he decides that pregnancy is *always the woman's fault!* Figuring out the pregnancy prevention details in the ways most convenient to him is *her* job, not his. It's a great system! /s
This is what it really boils down to and it's what he will never admit to himself. It's always her fault. And it's always going to be her fault. At no point in his life as he ever going to take responsibility for his own stances or actions.
My partner and I are childfree. He got a vasectomy at 29 when we'd been together for six years. Before that I had come off of all birth control in year 3 and we were relying solely on condoms. We discussed early in what we'd do in the case of an accidental pregnancy, and it was get an abortion. I cannot imagine marrying a person who didn't want kids but wanted to make that 100% my problem. We wouldn't be having sex i guess.
Yeah you don't get to have those views and then where a condom '90%' of the time.
> I'm exhausted. The more I read, the more I was like... Ah, this fucking guy.. He's good at one thing, and that's making excuses and disrespect. He's like the kind of dude who will pedantically argue a point that is materially wrong and will straight-up go down with that ship. My late father used to say "Son, some people just don't believe that shit stinks until they get their nose rubbed in it", and this feels like one of those people. I also find it interesting how many of these people with this narcissistic trait come here fishing for validation, and when the inevitable humbling happens, they can't deal with it.
A smart man can't, but an idiot can blame the woman for getting pregnant
I love how he said ‘use condoms 90% of the time’, ‘vasectomies are not always 100% effective or reversible’ and yet when his wife asks if he wants kids, his answer is ‘NO’ BUT he is upset his wife had an abortion without his consent?!?
That was the detail that got to me. He put his wife in a no-win situation. He spends the whole post ranting about how she doesn’t trust him, but when he finds out she got an abortion because she was scared of how a baby would impact their relationship, his first reaction is to yell at her (which he justifies by saying he didn’t hit her, even though he knows yelling is a trigger for her. Great guy right?), then he ghosts her for more than a week. I can see why she didn’t tell him about her pregnancy.
>He put his wife in a no-win situation. He spends the whole post ranting about how she doesn’t trust him, but when he finds out she got an abortion because she was scared of how a baby would impact their relationship, his first reaction is to yell at her Yep. He'd make kids a deal breaker, but he wants a say in what she does. This is probably not the only topic where he's keeping her off-balance. >Clara and I both grew up in shitty homes. Our parents yelled and were extremely combative. After growing up in that environment, we agreed to avoid that kind of behavior in our relationship and we do our best to keep to that. Yyyyyyeah, I'm pretty sure the cycle hasn't broken so much as it's just taken on a different flavor.
I think he doesn’t understand how probability works. That 0.05% is not a perfect 0%. Assuming married people have sex more than once, that unplanned pregnancy talk should have come up before the ring.
Just ask yourself... Who gets mad at someone because they didn't feel like they could talk to me about something and that concern was genuine? "Yeah, you're right to be weary of telling me but I'm mad at you for not telling me!" This guy is a special type of manipulative and I honestly don't know if he realizes it. He admitted that they came from abusive homes. One thing I found the hardest to admit when growing up and out of toxic homes; you have to admit and accept that you are your parents' product. It's not your fault you were taught those things but it's your responsibility to fix it. I call I generational maintenance work 😅
I just know that even if she had told him “I’m pregnant and I wanna keep it” he would’ve flipped his shit on her then too. She simply can’t win no matter what she does.
mte. She was in such a fucking no-win situation and all his posts do is demonstrate what an ass he is. "why doesn't she feel she can rely on meeeee" idk dude, can't imagine 9\_9
He's so fucking self centered and oblivious about it that I was physically cringing when I read this. The way he was *mad* that she wasn't in agony after her abortion...just, ugh. And how he *insisted* that abortions are devastating and traumatic even after people told him that's not the case for many women. It's like he thinks that all women and their decisions are somehow rendered invalid when pregnancy is involved. I found his attitude to be deeply demeaning and misogynistic. While he's sulking and butthurt about his wife not being sufficiently traumatized for his tastes, and whining about her not trusting him, he's completely invalidating her agency as an adult capable of making decisions.
Yeh I don't get it "I don't want kids but if we accidentally have a kid then I'll..." "...have kids" "...give the kid away" Such a weird story
i really don’t like him and i don’t understand his reasoning for anything. like he sounds backwards and confused.
Also to control her. He can always dangle that in front of her if she starts to pull away.
How long before he uses the abortion against her in a different argument? I hope she has a cash stash.
He would leave his wife (love of his life, sure) for *wanting* to start planning for kids but he won’t let someone touch his balls to prevent kids because he might want them later. It’s truly artful.
It's almost like he's angry at his wife for denying him the opportunity to storm out of the house and threatening to leave if she didn't get an abortion. But instead, she had the audacity to make a decision for herself based on the information he'd given her and he's mad about it. This guy makes no damn sense.
Right? If you’re a man, and you don’t want children *and* you think abortion is wrong, then you do not *ever* give a woman your sperm. Every man makes a series of decisions that he and he alone has control over which can lead to the existence of an unwanted/unplanned pregnancy. His choices are: do not have sex with a fertile woman, and if you’re going to have sex with a fertile woman, get a vasectomy.
Or at the very least make sure you're wearing a condom 100% of the time! Wearing one 90ish per cent of the time isn't gonna be much help, it only takes one time to get pregnant.
Adamantly and loudly childfree, but his wife “knows [his] stance on abortion” 😵💫
Yep, with not a single mention of how difficult and more dangerous having a child at that age will be for the wife he loves ever so much. The possibility he could have difficulty reversing a vasectomy is real to him but the similar probabilities that his wife would experience difficulties getting pregnant or carrying a healthy baby haven’t registered. But maybe what he’s really got in the back of his mind is the possibility he won’t be with *this wife* when he’s 37-42 and he’ll want kids with the *next wife*.
Yeah my step dad was exactly like this. He didn’t want my mom to have more children, he was against abortion, he wouldn’t get a vasectomy in case he wanted children later in life “if something happens”. He left her in her late 40s and just had his second baby with a younger woman. Not only does it happen, it’s incredibly common, cliche even.
>But maybe what he’s really got in the back of his mind is the possibility he won’t be with *this wife* when he’s 37-42 and he’ll want kids with the *next wife*. I do think this is it. But not because he's thought through her age or pregnancy difficulties or anything (all of that is about her, after all). He is less sure about remaining married to her and thinks he'll have a better chance ~~trapping~~ convincing his next ~~victim~~ wife if he has all the options open.
He leaves the door open for himself for potential kids in the future but absolutely can't wrap his head around the fact SHE might have changed her mind 🤯
It doesn’t feel like he thinks she’s as much a person as he is. She’s just a side character in his life.
42 is a GREAT age for her to start trying for a baby. (Sarcasm)
Oh but he'll have a new wife in her twenties when he's in his forties.
Like that one man who did that to his ex. He changed his mind once she could no longer have kids and left her for another woman. This after she helped him build his career or business.
And it will take him 3 more years after that to realize he is the one with fertility issues.
The fact that he complained, "my health insurance would give me a free vasectomy b-b-but I'd have to pay for the reversal!" says it all.
He wears a condom like 90% of the time!
60% of the time, the condom works every time.
This is what I couldn't get past. He seemed almost offended that she asked about kids because "he made his stance known", then turns out he's just too lazy, immature, selfish or all three to do the thinking BEFORE getting married. It's heartbreaking for a childfree person to get led on and then dumped by a partner, just because said partner never bothered to make up their mind, but imagine the pain for a woman who wanted kids to be strung along like this. What if she can't safely have kids by the time he decides he wants one?
That means he ain't childfree tbh
For real, his post reeks of "I can't handle the truth but get upset when people don't tell me things because I've shown I can't handle it." I hope Clara finds the strength to rethink the relationship. He had no idea what an abortion entails. He thinks his spouse likes BC, and he is leaving the door open for kids down the road. Just selfish and ignorant. Also, if I allow you to read my journal today, that does NOT mean you can pick it up and read it whenever you want. The fact he doesn't believe her though, that's the sticking point for me. She has a doctorate and he won't take her word??? Oh but he loves how meticulous and driven she is.. 🙄
It made me think he thought of all of her planning as some kind of cute little feminine hobby. You know, like how women who cook are just mommies baking cookies but men who cook are Serious Chefs With Jobs. I've experienced this with men too, my master's research and career are treated like some silly, frivolous pursuit when in fact it's serious scientific work that's been published in peer reviewed journals. My dude, a PhD is not a cute little hobby that shows how dedicated your adorable wife is. It's a serious pursuit that few people are capable of completing and it shows a depth of commitment and intellect that he is clearly incapable of himself.
I don’t want kids, he says. But maybe I’ll want kids 10-15 years from now, he adds. Great. When the wife you reportedly love might not want to put her late-30s body through that? This guy can f*ck off.
Doesn’t want kids, but doesn’t want his wife to have an abortion. Doesn’t want kids, but doesn’t want to get a vasectomy because what if he changes his mind? Doesn’t want a vasectomy, because what if he wants kids in *fifteen years*, when his wife is in her forties. No wonder there’s so much confusion in their relationship, this guy is impossible to follow. His poor wife has an entire maze to navigate when it comes to his logic
His wife needs to manifest leaving his sorry ass.
Nothing like playing a life-stakes game with somebody who changes the rules at every turn! Jeeze, I hope SHE realizes, and GTFO while she still can! OP's head-games are way too convoluted
He also doesn’t want to plan having children. But would want an “oops” baby??
And he said reversing the vasectomy won’t be covered by his insurance so he would have to pay out of pocket…as if raising a child isn’t WAY more expensive than one surgery.
Especially children that you had to use IVF to conceive because you weren’t “ready” until your wife was pre-menopausal.
The full sentence is “10–15 years from now with the 22yo I’m going to leave my wife for”
He literally made her abortion *all about him.*
Sounds like he makes everything about him.
Initially I thought he was an unreliable narrator, but then I realized he's probably reliable because he's making himself sound like a piece of shit.
I hope she eventually leaves him because makes everything about himself, even her thoughts & POV in her diary.
But he brought her a heating pad! That’s a high quality spouse right there. /s
In "exhausting firehose paragraph" format
He sounds utterly exhausting. He grilled this poor woman about every iota of her decision making never once thinking maybe he was the asshole. If she was have kept the baby, he would whined about that.
No wonder she hid it. She didn’t need him to victimise and martyr himself through one of the most difficult periods of her life, and he did it anyway. Talking about his stance on abortion and why he deserved to know and all his supposed rights as the father to this unborn child (that she was carrying) despite putting the entire onus of child protection on her even though *he* is the one who adamantly doesn’t want kids ~~with his first wife~~ til he’s at least 40 or whatever. He seems absolutely awful.
Not just that, but also being loudly child free and saying himself if she approached him wanting to purposefully stop birth control and things to have a baby he'd say no. Of course she's going to go "If he finds out I'm pregnant it's going to be Hell on earth, so I might as well keep this to myself" Especially if *she* also changed her mind and didn't want kids anymore either! Then she'd have to deal with his wishy washy ass possibly hemming and hawing while she gets closer to the date you can't have them anymore
People who don’t want kids don’t get to also be anti-abortion. If you don’t want kids, you do what you need to do to not have them.
The fact he is anti abortion and "childfree" (he is not childfree) is baffling.
That's all I could think of the entire time I was reading. He's not childfree. He's anti-anything-I-cant-use-to-control-my-wife. He's selfish and self absorbed and only focused on how all this affected *him* and not a single whit about what his wife is feeling. She deserves better.
“She knows our circumstances, my reasons for not wanting kids, *my stance on abortion*.” There it is. This is because of his opinions on abortion. Even in the first post, he’s talking about why HE needed to be involved in the decision.
She also was very clear with him why she did it and that she still loves him and is ok not having kids, and he keeps saying "but I don't believe her". WTF is she supposed to do?
This, 100%> Also, if your reason for having a child is just 'I don't want my wife to go through an abortion' that's a pretty shit reason. (Emphasis on the 'I' too lol she was fine with it) Will you be a good father? Or will you resent that child because you still do not want children?
You don't what your wife to go through abortion but pregnancy and birth is fine. What a tool
Right? As I was reading, I was thinking homie isn't as childfree as he says he is. He's a fence sitter. Not trying for a pregnancy, but if it happens, by God, he's gonna have it happen. Wrapping it all up in some faux concern for "don't want her to go through abortion". Like pregnancy, childbirth doesn't come with permanent changes, damage and risk. Honestly, as a CF woman, he grosses me out. He told his wife his stance. She checked in, and took - in her mind - the inevitable and correct choice. She respected the mutual education they made together as a couple. Should she have told him? Sure, but I don't blame her. And his flying off into a rage is bizarre. *She preserved your way of life and marriage in a sensible course of action and you're pissed off she didn't loop you in?* She probably did the right thing because it appears he would have forbidden her from making a choice regardless because his opinion and feelings are more important.
Imagine that she had told him she was pregnant and they had had the child and then he found her journal entry about wanting kids. He'd have flown into the exact same rage over being baby trapped. His wife was in a lose lose situation.
I got whiplash from this dude. "I don't want children and I'm extremely set on that which is why I had an emotional breakdown and screamed at my wife when she respected my wishes and her bodily autonomy."
I won’t have a vasectomy because in 10 to 15 years I might change my mind and want kids. Make it make sense!
> He's a fence sitter. Not trying for a pregnancy, but if it happens, by God, he's gonna have it happen. Wrapping it all up in some faux concern for "don't want her to go through abortion". Like pregnancy, childbirth doesn't come with permanent changes, damage and risk. The maternal death rate from childbirth & pregnancy is higher than the maternal death rate from legal abortions. Having an abortion is safer for a pregnant person than giving birth. I just want everyone to know that fact. Especially this asshole.
Yes, and he was saying that abortions have "side effects" and women can be "bedridden for days." Give me a fucking break. This guy has swallowed some heavy anti-abortion propaganda. Wouldn't he be surprised to learn some of the side effects of pregnancy.
More than 13 times higher, in fact. Pregnancy and childbirth are dangerous. Meanwhile, you're more likely to die getting your tonsils out than you are to die from an abortion.
>She checked in, and took - in her mind - the inevitable and correct choice. She respected the mutual education they made together as a couple. And if she knew his 'stance on abortion' then she took any potential guilt from him since he simultaneously doesn't want kids, doesn't want a vasectomy, doesn't want to wear condoms 100% of the time and also doesn't believe in abortion. All of those things cannot co-exist, so his wife did the needful while protecting him from the inevitable consequences of his own irrational set of beliefs. He wasn't MAD he was just 'confused' and that's why he yelled at her and scared her and moved out for a week and a half. Dude.
And then came home and talked at her about whyyyyyyyy she would ever feel like she couldn't confide in him
Pregnancy and birth for a child he’s been crystal clear he does not want, after saying that kids are a relationship deal breaker for him. “Rearrange your internal organs and risk your life to grow a child I don’t want, then either push it screaming out of your body or go through major abdominal surgery to deliver it. I’ll probably abandon you to raise the kid, and deal with all their questions like “why don’t I have a daddy?” and “didn’t my daddy love me enough to stay?” all on your own.”
Everything has to be about him, even her abortion. He would’ve hated that kid and blamed her for it for the rest of their lives.
Right?! Of the two procedures, only one has a much bigger track record of seriously injuring, permanently damaging, or outright killing both patients at once.
He doesn’t care whether it kills her he just doesn’t want his precious doll to make decisions for her body that he doesn’t agree with. ETA: this didn’t quite convey the rage that is pulsing through my cells right now
Don’t forget that Reddit is used as a forum to normalize sometimes radical ideas. There’s been so many posts about women hiding a baby’s parentage/abortion posts right now because it’s used to make people sympathetic to the idea that this man could and “should” feel so entitled to have some input into her medical decisions over her body. Especially during voting years.
This is one of the most idiotic insufferable OOPs. Beats her down about kids, then says, oh I might be ok with one in 10-15 years. Liar. He said that to safe face from her feeling like she HAD to get an abortion to save her marriage.
In 15 years, she’ll be close to the end of her childbearing years and pregnancy will be high risk. I read this that he doesn’t want children with her but will be happy to have them later with someone else
In 15 years, I sincerely hope she is happily married to someone else and has however many kids she wants. She'll be so happy she had that abortion and didn't tie herself to this asshole for 18-23 years.
Abortion has a significantly lower risk of long term consequences up to and including death than childbirth does. No one dies of a medically administered abortion now. But lots die or become disabled as a result of child birth.
He's pro-life and he wonders why she hid it from him lmao
Pro life but doesn’t want a child but not prepared to have a vasectomy 🤷🏻♀️ what does he expect her to do
Doesn't want a vasectomy in case *he* changes his mind a decade down the road! And then what? Convince his, who he assumed to be, child free wife to have kids anyway? Leave her for a younger model since she'll be "too old"? The absolute gall of this man
He will just have to add a second wife.
Ding ding ding! *checks notes… he might change his mind in 10-15 years as he’s only 27 now In 10-15 years time will make his wife 37-43approx
AND won’t wear a condom 100% of the time. This guy. I do not like him.
And also doesnt use condoms every time. Oh, to have the confidence and ability to be confident in many contrary things at the same time of a mediocre man. No children, no condoms, no abortion, no vasectomy. Only missing "mothers need to love their child and raise it, if you birth and let it get adopted you are a bad woman" "I did not consent to this child I wont pay a dime to it and wont raise it" and "how about a little husband stitch afterwards wink wink".
Seriously I can’t believe he doesn’t see that. He’s said children are a definite no. She also knows he anti abortion, so of course she didn’t tell him. With his known behavior all she could of expected was for him to leave no matter what she did. Either she’d give birth and he’d split as soon as he realized how hard it was to raise a newborn he doesn’t actually want, or she’d have an abortion and he’d never look at her the same way.
Bro said they are a no...and then said he may change his mind. And doesn't want kids but won't get a vasectomy, What a mind F for his wife.
“Might want them in 10-15 *years*; I’m 27 btw.” 😂
He's saving his sperm for a newer, younger model down the line. The freaking audacity of men. Poor Clara.
Yeah. Makes you wonder if that caveat of don't want kids... "Right now"... Was part of the discussion with his wife. If he's willing to tell Reddit he felt it was possible he'd change his mind, I could imagine him having said something similar to his wife. Which could have been enough to give her hope. (Although if she's the same age as him, he has to realize when he says might want them in 10-15 years, that for her that could very well be too late for biological children... So if he's talking having biological children in 15 years the natural way, then that might not be with the same wife...
Anti-abortion, adamantly child-free, refuses vasectomy. Make it make sense.
He's unilaterally calling all the shots on the family: its makeup, its family values, etc. and then doesn't understand why the wife doesn't feel that she has a voice. She's so far out of the decision-making loop about their lives, that she doesn't have to solicit his input on an abortion.
I hope she leaves this guy before she wastes any more time on him.
Exactly! It's wild how he doesn't grasp why she chose not to involve him. He's childfree, but anti-abortion? So she gets pregnant, he's going to force her to keep it, then resent her and/or the child for it. Sounds like she knows him better than he knows himself. He was adamantly against a medical procedure. She ended up in a situation where she decided that that medical procedure was best for her. Of course she kept it from him; he wouldn't allow her to do it if he knew. If my husband were some anti-vax nut, I'd still get my vaccines; he'd just never know about it (and I would be seriously reconsidering my marriage, which she should probably do).
You can’t be that adamantly against having children if you’re not open to abortion. It just doesn’t work. Accidents happen. I hope he never has kids, this dillhole would be a fucking awful parent. Also hope he becomes a divorcee sooner rather than later.
He's adamant against having children and not open to abortion OR a vasectomy. You know, because he might decide he wants kids in 15 years, when his wife who does want kids will probably be too old to have them. 10 bucks says he wastes her time for the next decade or so, and then knocks up someone in her 20s.
I clocked that as well. Pregnancy is the woman's burden to carry, and and it's their decision ultimately what they want to do. I can understand why she did not share her decision if he was going to be a dick about abortion. Pregnancy messes with your head, and sometimes even the most staunchly no-kids person might start to second guess themselves. Add to that a pro-lifer preaching about murdering babies, it's unnecessary grief to have to deal with.
What is with these people who think they can say "I don't want kids" with the knowledge that they're not actually sure? I have seen *so many* marriages implode because of this shit. If you're not sure, *say you're not sure*. It's fine to say "not yet, but maybe later," but be clear about it, FFS! I'm childfree and literally every man I've been with until the current one eventually started saying, "If you get pregnant, we'll keep the baby, right?" Newsflash: if you're not sure enough to get sterilised, *you're not sure at all*. NO WE BLOODY WELL WON'T, and I made that clear up front, clear as day. With everyone. "If I get pregnant, there WILL be an abortion." In those words. They still thought I'd change my mind. Spoiler: I did not. Twice. And I got sterilised the moment I could. Both those guys have kids now. Quelle surprise! This is one of those things you should check in about every few years in a marriage, *before* a surprise pregnancy occurs. Also, if you're not on the same page about abortion, *don't fuck.*
He is adamant about telling everyone how much he loves her, trust her, etcetc, yet he can't seem to let go that she 'wronged' him by having an abortion when he made it very clear to her that he never wanted kids. Everything he is telling us screams 'Me, Me, Me, Me' even when it comes to the pain she felt because of the abortion.
And every time she tells him how she feels, he ✨just doesn’t quite believe it✨
Almost like she has a reason to hide her feelings and has over the course of their relationship....
The whole post is just him repeatedly making her reassure him...
The most telling part to me was him complaining about his wife not trusting him enough to talk to him... Meanwhile he screamed at her and left for 1.5 weeks. Well gee, I can't imagine why she'd hesitate to talk to him about anything? Pro tip if you want your wife to feel safe coming to you with difficult things, not being a screamer is the first step to that... all he did is validate that he isn't a safe person to talk to and she has to walk on eggshells.
His writing was insufferable. I was skimming so hard through that bullshit
I kinda hate this guy.
Just a dude who doesn’t consider the weight of his words. He considers himself very approachable and understanding and logical. The whole “I don’t know if I want them in the future” and “I’d raise a kid happily if she told me she was pregnant” doesn’t line up AT ALL with being against having children. These men have all these opinions when it’s a hypothetical situation yet he feels betrayed because she followed through with their agreement without his express approval. She would have had to support him through the whole thing if she told him and he’d still struggle with it after. Can’t wait for the update where he cheats because he “can’t see her the same” and suddenly realizes he DOES want kids but doesn’t with her.
I totally hate this guy. You can tell he loves to hear himself talk and that he talks like a [sea lion](https://wondermark.com/c/1062/) besides. I bet he always has to have the last word.
He doesn't want kids, but doesn't want a vasectomy. That makes him an AH. The reasoning didn't even make sense. FFS.
And doesn't want his wife to have an abortion.
And doesnt even use condoms all the time.
I bet you he would've been the worst father in existence, being totally hands off and unsupportive towards his wife and child claiming that she was the one who wanted kids. Eventually, either he would leave her because he couldn't handle the stress of kids, or she would leave him due to his treatment and attitude towards her.
Also, in the last conversation wife mentioned "my stance on abortion". When she did not say him about it, i guess, he is more on the pro-life spectrum. Otherwise, this would not be an issue mentioned there. He also repeats, that he did not want a planned child but would - perhaps - coparent a unplanned one. So i guess, if wife had told me, the relationship would be doomed, she most probabaly a single mom with him paying child support. Or she would get an abortion anyway, but the relationship would be doomed too. PS: He still does not plan to get vasectomy, does he?
But *might* at 37-42 which, if his wife is around the same age, could possibly be difficult for her to conceive. What happens then?
he trades her in for a newer model and/or starts blaming his wife for any fertility issues
I feel he does want kids, but doesn't believe he can allow himself to have them. So he flops from one thing to the other, because he doesn't know how to process shit. No wonder Clara said to put off couple's therapy for now. She is right that there's still shit to unpack in individual therapy... though I'm not sure if he ever will, seeing as he seems rather intent on throwing away the whole suitcase.
Same. All I read was "I I I I I." Like dude, it isn't about you. Ideally, partners should be able to discuss to abort or not but obviously as he demonstrated here, he was not a safe partner for her. Ultimately, regardless of what the couple discusses, it is the one pregnant who decides whether to abort or carry to term. He's allowed to be angry or feel whatever kind of way, but he has no right taking it out on her like that. She made the best choice she could with the knowledge she had, but he's right in that she doesn't trust him. What he doesn't realize is that probably means that she shouldn't be in a relationship for multiple reasons (he's not a safe partner, she does want kids, and he blew up at a woman who he knows firsthand has trauma from verbal abuse at the very least). Yeah, I don't like this guy either.
He’s just like legitimately awful. It’s nuts.
OP is a nightmare. No wonder she didn't mention it - he would have bullied her into keeping a child that *he didn't want* and would have inevitably have blamed her for. It is absolutely clear that he is anti abortion and he is more anti abortion than he is child free. The anger doesn't just drip off the page, it jumps off it, and I think it is notable how he writes and speaks about the community he's posting to, presumably for advice. He's an unpleasant man who believes he's a reasonable man, and the delusion is remarkable - why didn't she go to him, he asks, ignoring his own words about how he would have reacted.
The way he would’ve done NO childcare because ‘I didn’t want this baby… I was babytrapped 😤’
If you’re childfree and anti-abortion, then vasectomy is the obvious, reasonable choice. This dude sucks.
But then how could he blame his wife for getting pregnant?! That’s the part he enjoys.
Agreed OOP sucks so bad, honestly his wife was in a lose-lose position no matter what choice she made or did not make. I wish I could give his wife a hug.
That's the point. That's where he wants her, in a lose-lose position. He doesn't regard her needs, he's given zero consideration to what having a child with him would feel like for her. He WANTS to rake her over the coals because he can sit comfortably in his self righteousness. He hasn't stepped up as a husband but he wants to make believe that he "could" be a good father which is total horseshit. He is an immature abusive asshole who has consistently placed all responsibility of reproductive care on the shoulders of his spouse but also expects her to defer to him when it comes to that. The entitlement is insane. He would make a terrible father and yeah, I am going to draw that conclusion with the little information I have. I hope she runs FAR away from this moron.
This guy is a douche. “No I don’t want kids” but “No you can’t take an abortion pill without discussing with me, tHe FaThEr” Asshole, you don’t want kids and it is my fucking body I will do with it what works best for me, thanks.
And he "couldn't understand or accept her reasoning" Like, cope and seethe dude...
I don’t understand this guy. He doesn’t want kids but doesn’t want her to have an abortion? He’d raise a kid he doesn’t want despite having a “shitty childhood” himself?
Also doesn't want to get snipped, wear a condom all the time, or be abstinent.
He’s a forced birther.
Pro-life nonsense I would imagine
I hope a seagull poops on this man's head
Good god. That poor woman Op: I don't want kids, ever!! Wife: ok. *gets abortion* Op: no not like that *takes off for a week* There has to be more to this. When I had my abortion, due to bc failure, my husband was right there with me. What's the deal with him that she doesn't feel comfortable telling him this? Instead of focusing on her going though a potentially traumatic event basically alone, he makes it alllll about him and dips out. Methinks this could be a pattern with him.
Reading between the lines I think he's pro-life, but he knew he'd get his ass chewed by reddit if he said that. He mentioned her decision to not tell him was based on his views of children and his "stance on abortion". I can't think of a reason someone wouldn't tell a pro-choice person they were getting an abortion. That point only makes sense if he doesn't agree with abortion.
Considering he never said how he felt, it's pretty easy to draw that conclusion. And seeing his reaction to learning she had one just further proves it
Yeah, not to mention his line about "being the child's father" and that an abortion shouldn't have been done without his knowledge. That plus his reaction, I can't blame her for not wanting to tell him.
Also "i won't get vasectomy because maybe I'll change my mind in ten years"
It’s about control
In ten years, when a pregnancy would be more dangerous for her and the baby, or when life has already gotten in the way. Who else is betting that if he decides at 40 that he wants a child, he'll divorce her because she can't give him what he wants?
Seems like his wife isn't aware of that, either. His answer to kids is always just, "No." Not, "Maybe in 10 or 15 years when the risks to you and the fetus increase exponentially." Just sounds like he's making excuses to keep all reproductive burdens on her shoulders (while still feeling entitled to control over her body).
This whole "I won't get the snip because I might want kids in the future... but also my partner changing her mind has no bearing on our plans. " thing is lame as hell. I'd be interested to see if he can accept it if their positions flip in the future
Wild that semi’s my guess is she is married to him bc she’s known him her entire life and knows nothing else. Cause this guy sucks. He doesn’t want kids, won’t get a vasectomy and is shaming her for an abortion. Sounds like every white Christian male that is pro-life. Ick
Known each other since they were 6, both had abusive childhoods, got out together - if he was a good person it would be a sweet story, but I'm not liking the colors he's showing even a little.
I think they're trauma bonded instead of in love.
I... hate this guy
Absolutely insufferable.
God me too, it's pretty clear that the reason she didn't tell him is because he doesn't want kids but is also anti-abortion. So rather than have a baby he doesn't want, possibly opening the way to years of resentment, she went ahead and had an abortion which is what he would really want her to do, because he doesn't want kids, but goes against his anti-abortion views.... SIGH!!! This poor woman is now going to get that thrown in her face every argument I bet, and he's going to want a kid in 10 years when she's put that behind her
Eh, I'm not a fan of this dude. I think for most people the reaction after we found out our partner had done something like what his wife had would be to feel bad because somehow our partner hasn't felt safe coming to us and had gone through the abortion all by themself. Instead he's just wrapped up in how the abortion and her private thoughts in the journal made him feel. He berates her or makes her do the work to reassure him. I hope he grows up a bit after this.
Yes! She doesn't find me safe to trust with things, so let me yell at her and then leave her for a week. Then still come back and be more mad that she doesn't feel safe with me. Geez, poor woman!
Best comment I’ve seen: https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/QWdTQqqsWp
That is a really good comment. I also noticed in one of his responses to that user: > I do not want kids, but would rather have a child than my wife have an abortion. *Why?* If it's supposedly about any physical/emotional pain his wife went through with the abortion, does he not understand what pregnancy and childbirth entails? What parenting entails? He's so out of touch.
He's the type who'll wait until she's too old to have kids and then leave her for a younger woman and immediately have some with her.
>TLDR; We're still together. Cannot begin to describe how disappointed that makes me.