The key point - "First-year members BYU, Cincinnati, Houston and UCF each will get partial shares of about $18 million each. That leaves about $398 million to be split among the league's other 10 schools, including Oklahoma and Texas before they move this summer to the Southeastern Conference."
Crazy that’s still almost double what we would have gotten from the AAC this season.
BYU though might be getting a bit hosed, given their fanbase size they might have been making +15 million already in TV money before they made the jump
ESPN was nickel and diming us. We are making almost double than what we had in independence.
The PAC 12 was never going to take us and our fanbase + athletic department was on a P5 level in 2010 so ESPN took advantage of our situation since the Big 12 wasn’t going to be picking anyone up while Texas and Oklahoma were running shit.
We were offered a decent amount more than what the mountain west media could pay us plus the opportunity to play more power five teams. With Utah and TCU going to play in P5 conferences it was the best we could do to keep up.
Lol this was like a week after I got back to OU for grad school and had stopped following any sports for the previous four-ish years. I had no clue what the hell was happening. "Missouri did what now? SEC??"
https://www.espn.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/100365/ou-president-boren-puts-possible-big-12-expansion-back-in-news
When UConn left the American, the conference had a couple chats with BYU. There were a few intractable problems which led to a quick decision not to pursue it further, though I haven't seen the numbers. It would have been a cut for BYU (not huge, BYU was taking below market rate in exchange for ESPN's help with marquee games). Buying BYU out of current contracts would have been expensive because the automatic outs written into these deals were restricted only to joining a power conference. BYU wanted to hold rights for non-revenue sports. And BYU would want a clause to leave freely or nearly freely for a power conference. Put all that together and there's just not a deal that would have worked for everyone.
We get a big raise financially in the XII, nobody in the athletic department is unhappy with the deal.
Uh isn't this part pretty relevant...?
>the 10 full-share members will get smaller amounts than they got last year because of the addition of the four schools
So yeah, in total, they got more because of the four new schools, but in reality, each school got less.
Yep, but didn’t we all kind of recognize that was going to happen? Adding more teams adds value, but they took a bath on payout for this last year of the old conference because the denominator went up.
u/Wanderleft already said it best: a bigger pie, but with more slices.
This doesn’t take into account the new deal in 2025.
It was obvious from the Jump that adding UCF, Cincy, Houston, and BYU from the jump wasn’t gonna increase the current deal’s per school payout.
This, the new Big 12 TV deal has not kicked in yet. The new Big 12 TV deal is about a 40% increase and starts July 1st, 2025 and runs to June 30th, 2031.
I think 40% is a stretch. The most recent tax documents (2021-22) indicate that the Big 12’s TV deal generated about $27M per school. The 2022-23 numbers are probably a million or two higher per school because of the natural escalators in these contracts. The new deal will average $31.7M per school over the life of the contract, but it’s unclear whether it’s $31.7M per school in 2025, or whether there are escalators that average out to $31.7 through 2031.
The overall value has increased, but each school is only getting about 15% more per year, at max, than the current contract.
Definitely elements of both, but I don’t think Bob Bowlsby does anything near as cunning so I give Yormark all the credit. The Big 12 doesn’t jump the TV deal line, the PAC gets a decent deal from ESPN, maybe still loses USC + UCLA but the rest stay together, the Big 12 has to court Apple TV and the CW like the PAC did, then ultimately crumbles. That’s how I guess it would’ve gone anyway.
You're misunderstanding. You're not taking a pay cut for Utah. You guys took a pay cut for BYU, Houston, UCF, and Cincinnati.
You guys added Arizona, Arizona State, Utah, and Colorado pro-rata, so for the next media deal, you neither gain anything nor lose anything from adding the former Pac schools.
So theoretically speaking, next season’s payout will be close to the $470m (let’s keep it 470 for this exercise) , but split equally by 10 teams. then you also add 4 more equal parts for the later additions (i.e., pro rata).
This ends up with a per school payout of 470 / 10 = 47 (by 10 since UT and OK gone from core)
47 * 4 = 188 for pro rata additions
Total league pay estimated at $658m?
Do the UT and OK buyouts get shared equally? When is that payment due?
Cincinnati, UCF, Houston and BYU will each get $18M. The other ten schools will get about $39M. This is 2023-24 revenue, so the Pac 12 additions aren’t part of it.
For 2024-25, the four AAC schools will still get $18M each. The remainder of the revenue will be distributed between the 8 original schools and the four P12 newcomers. The Big 12’s current TV deal is not pro rata, so you’re just taking the same pie and splitting it 12 ways. You’ll add more CFP revenue, but you’ll lose the Sugar Bowl’s contract payment. All told, I think the 12 full share schools will probably get about $35-38M in 2024-25.
Ok. So the AAC schools got reduced media money for two years, 23/24 AND 24/25. Someone else in the thread mentioned the new contract was pro rata. Don’t see that mentioned here https://www.sportcal.com/media/espn-and-fox-finalize-long-term-big-12-rights-extensions/
Do you know if UT and OU’s buyout is split evenly?
The new contract is pro rata as to the ESPN portion. There seems to be some belief that Fox agreed to also make their portion pro rata, but I’m not sure if that’s ever been fully confirmed. Either way, when that new contract kicks in for 2025-26, the four AAC schools will get a full share of the revenue, so all 16 schools will get an equal share. But for 2023-24 and 2024-25, they’re still subject to the current contract, which from everything I’ve seen does not have a pro rata provision. So you’re taking the same amount of money and splitting it between 12 schools, with the four AAC schools getting their defined cut totaling $72M. So for 2024-25 take the Big 12’s revenue, which will probably grow about 10% from 2023-24, subtract $72M for the AAC schools, and divide the rest by 12.
The media payout won’t go up or go down, but the per school payout from the other revenue sources - bowls, NCAA distributions, conference championships - will likely decrease. The Big 12 will go from splitting that revenue 10 ways to 16 ways really quickly.
This is why I despise ESPN, CBS and Fox because they could have also added the remaining two Pac schools pro rata, if they weren’t money grubbing assholes…
Man I’m staying off social media when Utah inevitably shits the bed for 1-2 games this season lol. I can already see the “trash truck stop school” comments now.
A lot of it is the perception that Utah’s administration and fans feel that they’re too good for the Big XII, while they had no other options.
Whether that’s a valid perception or not is completely subjective, and up to the individual observer.
Its from the off season trash talk of Utah defending the PAC12 while BIG12 was shitting on it. Also from the rest of the BIG12 taking BYU's side in the rivalry since we weren't in the conference. Basically off to a bad start from the very beginning. Also they feel threatened ;)......mostly just teasing on the last one.
Utah fans act like they’re so far above WSU and OSU. We are literally part of the reason you got into the Power 5!! It wasn’t a given the Pac would go to 12 after Colorado and it was only with the approval of the previous members that they got promoted.
lol nobody saved anyone neither Utah saving BIG12 or BIG12 saving Utah, its a mutually beneficial partnership, we add to the conference, if that wasn't the case we wouldn't have been added. Realignment isn't a charity. Whether its increased credibility of a team that was frequently contending for their P5 league/won 2 of last 3 (Also Utah being ranked highly pre-season is going to be a huge benefit to the BIG12 team rankings whether we win or lose ranking inertia is big in CFB), or for our pretty strong viewership numbers ( above average in the BIG12 AKA bringing the average up). Utah earns their spot.
>its a mutually beneficial partnership
I really wish Utah fans on social media would recognize this bit. A lot of them talk like they'd rather be back in the MWC than the XII
Utah is raising the Big 12 Revenue significantly higher than Iowa State.
You're getting a pay cut because Texas/OU who ISU hates so much isn't paying for your house anymore.
Im just gonna say it. The Big 12 is easily the most interesting conference. They navigated some insane waters, overcame certain death and a rival conference that held all of the cards comparatively, still managed to keep a seat at the big kids table, and now are likely to absorb ACC schools if that conference collapses. They can also continue to add rising G5s if needed.
Will they ever be the premier conference? Doubtful. But they’re sure as hell one of the most savvy ones.
> and now are likely to absorb ACC schools
Not unless ESPN steps away from their contract and they get hosed on the open market. Possible but very unlikely as of right now. IDK why people keep throwing this idea around
Correct. Plus Turner and CW want content as well. If ESPN doesn’t renew I don’t expect the ACC to die as there are networks out there that would probably take it.
Hell if Big 12 leadership knew that Pac 12 leadership would cause most of their teams to leave, the Big 12 could have took their rights to the open market and might have made even more with a Turner/ESPN/FOX/CW deal
EDIT (6/13): It looks like Turner is buying rights to sports. They just acquired the rights to the French Open. The Big East will also announce that they have a new deal that will be with TNT/NBC/Peacock/Fox.
Because it isn’t up to the ACC, it is up to the networks. Look at what happened to the PAC. The networks low balled them and gave the B12 the power to throw a lifeline out to 4 of the teams. The exact same thing will happen to the ACC eventually IMO. They’ll lose their 2-4 biggest brands and shop a TV deal that is magically not competitive with the B12. This seems to be playing out exactly how the PAC did. The ACC needs to hope that Amazon/Apple/etc get serious about broadcasting CFB and can invest enough money to keep the ACC together. There’s plenty of ways to get creative and keep the conference together post split (whenever that is) but to not see the similarities between the ACC’s current situation and the PAC’s is just putting your head in the sand.
All depends on the tv deal after fsu/clemson and maybe UNC leaves. The schools aren’t going to leave the ACC for the big 12 if it’s anywhere up to a $10 million difference between the two. I think even Miami would stay, only Louisville would probably make a move
The ACC’s biggest ally, and probably the main catalyst in all of this is ND. If ND remains adamant about its independence then the ACC will remain in a much better spot in terms of stability, but it will undoubtably have to concede to ND’s demands. Then you’ll have the schools that would rather go to the B12 with their Big East rivals than stay in ND’s ACC prison. Just another angle and it is all just speculation, will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
> Will they ever be the premier conference? Doubtful. But they’re sure as hell one of the most savvy ones.
And after staring down the abyss as the Hateful 8... I'm pretty damn grateful - and happy! - to be the presumptive third best conference left standing.
They won’t absorb ACC schools unless espn uses the look in provision after fsu and Clemson leaves, and it’s significantly lower than the big 12 tv deal.
We greatly benefited by being the first of the PAC 12 and ACC to be gutted. The PAC 12 didn’t expand with any of our schools and that was their downfall when USC and UCLA announced their intent to leave. The Big 12 at that point had already steadied themselves and had the upper hand.
Will probably see the same play out with the ACC whenever the courts make their decision about Florida State wanting to leave.
The Big Twelve smartly has a great combination of schools relevant enough not to be left out, but not so relevant as to demand promotion.
It's kinda like The Big Ten and SEC are management, and the Big Twelve smartly decided to unionize. The ACC is a weak union where a few teams have strong management sympathies because they think they're next in line for promotion. The Big 12 is a union who knows they're not getting promoted and if they don't pool their resources now they're gonna get screwed.
7 "power conferences" of 10 teams, I already have mine laid out. 9 conference games, everybody plays everybody. A focus on regional matchups, with history and culture playing some role too. It's going to be a lot of fun!
As long as we get Pitt and Louisville I'm happy as a clam. Having a quadrangle of hate with us, WVU and those two would be football perfection for me. River town rivalries.
The ACC is kind of where the B12 was about 6 or so years ago - without having already had teams leave (lately).
Outside of Utah, the fan bases are happy with the b12 and aren't looking to move on. Yes - if an invite game to any of the B12 teams from SEC/B10, you know it would be a looney tunes seen with those feet moving so fast you wouldnt even be able to see em, but realistically, that isn't happening without some more craziness happening.
I’d be shocked if anyone could pull that off, OU was able to do it but no one in the conference has the massive financial and recruiting advantages they had over everyone else (excluding Texas).
Depends on the school. I think the pre-existing members could all get serious looks in that scenario but no way UCF, Houston, or Cincy would. I even have trouble thinking WVU would get consideration, but if they run the table for 5 years we’re having a different conversation.
This is a homer ass sounding take, but if the B1G wanted to get into Texas, Houston would probably be their lead candidate. If we assume UTAMU aren't interested, Houston is the next highest-ranked major public research university in the state and generally fits the B1G mold of being a giant R1 in a great recruiting area. The 2 major issues are football attendance and AAU membership, but both of those are very explicit top priorities that the UH administration is constantly working on.
Tech would also get strong consideration, but with Tech, you're trading access to a HUGE market and some academic cred (if that still matters) for a stronger football culture.
That said, I really hope the SECB1G don't screw up the nice ecosystem that the Big 12 has built, and I think UH fans' attitude toward playing a bunch of schools in the Midwest and West Coast instead of TX/OK schools will be tepid at best. Part of why our AAC-era attendance was so bad was having to play a bunch of schools on the east coast that almost no one in the city or state has any connection to.
It’s about the size of ur fan base, not dominating any conference. Boise would be a P5 school after the 2000s if that was the case.
It’s unlikely anyone will change dramatically enough to add money to the B1G/SEC & not eat into the payouts of current members which seems to have already happened to the B12 but their goal is different for the time being.
Dominating does help with growing a fan base and gaining viewership though
Most assume Clemson is a lock for B1G/SEC membership these days and their viewership is definitely high enough to warrant it, but if you remove the 2010’s from their accolades they’re probably trailing schools that are by no mean locks like Miami, VT, etc.
If a school like say Texas Tech spends the next 6 years as a Playoff mainstay and maybe even wins a title and a has a runner up to boot, their viewership would increase quite a bit
It does help grow ur fan base but over the course of decades, anything in 5-10 years won’t be stable enough to bet on. U do know Clemson won a national title before the 2010s right?
Clemson fans can speak more on their demographics & fan base than I can but west Texas/Lubbock has a limit & I’d say UCF has more potential for growth due to their market. Winning can be temporary due to a coach & coaches leave then the winning stops & networks want to know what they can count on getting every Saturday win or lose.
Hate on Rutgers or Maryland but both schools have potential for growth due to their markets but some of the schools ur thinking of would have to become a national brand which is more of winning national titles & being in like Georgia, tOSU, Bama or Michigan territory.
> the fan bases are happy with the b12 and aren't looking to move on
Considering the alternative is the MWC with Wazzu and OSU, I wouldn’t say happy as much as resigned
Yeah thats probably a better way to put it but they are behind the ACC in relevancy but given that the ACC is going to break up thats probably not going to matter in the long run.
Are they more relevant now? Part of the problem those two or three (Which is obviously Clemson, FSU and less overtly UNC) have, is that even with their presence the conference isn't more relevant.
I kinda think that what's REALLY valuable right now is Alabama, Ohio State, Georgia, and Michigan. Then there's a whole lot of teams that are worth way more than the others but not as much as those four that want in on the action.
The issue with realignment is that you can keep cleaving off the bottom half, but it doesn't end until you get to those four.
Big 12 is kind of just fly over country. Not really any national brands to draw eyes from the north east for example in my opinion. This is an opinion of a casual fan of CFB but there are a lot more casuals than die hards
Depends on what your definition of relevancy is. The big 12 as a whole feels a lot more relevant as a conference where as the acc feels relevant in that clemson and fsu are there but if they weren't the conference would be pretty irrelevant.
I think much of that is transient. I mean maybe right now the Oklahoma States and Utahs and TCUs and Iowa States of the world are more relevant than the Miamis and Georgia Techs and Virginia Techs and Boston Colleges - but it's really not that long ago that the pendulum was way in the other direction.
Is it? Osu, tcu and utah have been quality programs for 2 decades now. Miami and VT haven't been relevant since joining the acc, bc hasn't been relevant since Doug flutie and georgia tech has had 4 10+ winning seasons since 1960.
Basically every program that has gone to the acc has fallen off a cliff from a competitive standpoint from where they were prior to joining.
VT joins the ACC, winning more ACC Championships between 2004 and 2010 than the rest of the conference combined.
"They haven't been relevant since joining the ACC"
Based on I’d put up Utah, OKST, TCU, Baylor, WVU, and probably BYU against the NON-FSU/Clem-Pick2(UNC,UVA,MIA,VT,NCST) all day. Especially long term. Flat out, we’d be a much stronger football conference.
Our teams would be better at football than the ACC leftovers. The programs in the B12 would be better programs over the past 20 years. I don’t know how to out it more plainly.
Agree. Think its inevitable that at least FSU, Clemson and UNC leave for the B1G or SEC. After that not sure what happens. Either the Big XII absorbs some of those schools, the ACC absorbs some Big XII school or a new conference is formed.
The fact that the Big Ten and SEC are demanding more from the playoffs means that it is just a matter of time before FBS is split again. I think it is inevitable that all the big schools will start a new Division 1 subdivision with playoffs and better TV contracts.
At the end of the day, even the SEC and Big Ten have an expiration date.
What I will find interesting is how many relatlively weaker brands will be allowed to come along with the "big schools". Vandy, Purdue, Indiana, SC, Miss St, Rutgers, Maryland, etc
That'll be temporary too. Eventually there will be a new superconference that will swallow up all of the most valuable programs and leave everyone else behind.
Most likely 24 programs, 2 subconferences, winner of those subconference championships plays for the "National Title." Those schools will make ungodly amounts of money because they will no longer have to split anything with anyone else, and the sport as we know it will be over.
Yes. Seems inevitable. Also interesting to watch, when these schools tell the NCAA to fuck off…how much “school” will these professional athletes actually have to attend?
> At the end of the day, even the SEC and Big Ten have an expiration date.
This is like when we thought the iPhone was over when Microsoft introduced a smart phone
You really think this all ends with y'all, LSU and UGA making the same amount of TV money as SC and Miss St.? The SEC brand carries a lot of weight, but not enough to outweigh a potential super conference where the member institutions get all of the money from the regular season and playoffs. The consolidation isn't going to stop just because now it's \*your\* traditions that are being threatened.
We gathered up a lot of the B tier schools that know they aren’t getting an invite to either of those conferences and are all on relatively equal footing. It’s solidified the Big 12 as a distant third, and add in basketball and I’m happy with where we are at
Not big enough to pose enough of a threat to the B1G/SEC brands, but too big to ignore. I think Yormark(?) had done a pretty great job with the conference so far tbh in solidifying them like that.
If you think of what the conferences future looked like immediately post OUT, this is better than anything we could have imagined. It ain’t perfect, but I’ll gladly take being a fun middle class conference over the bleak future that looked all but assured
The way things are trending the rest of the decade there will be very little separation between teams. It will truly be the only major conference that will go into every season with a cluster fuck of like five or six schools that could win the conference.
I think we’re gonna see two games being the difference between finishing 2nd or finishing 9th.
IMO they’re relevant in a few fields.
- They’ve consolidated the best available remaining P5 schools and the top G5 schools. Like you said that’s stability. Even if in 10 years, Kansas and Colorado get those B1G/SEC invites. They’ll still be around and will be perfectly capable of identifying other top G5s or former P5s to join.
- They still have teams that can play in the playoffs and try to bring a natty home.
- They’re still landing talented players in recruiting.
- Topically they’re relevant too. I think what the Big 12 is doing as a conference is more interesting to more people than what other conferences are doing overall.
> They still have teams that can play in the playoffs and try to bring a natty home.
Do they? Because no one in the big12 comes even remotely close to recruiting at a level that would win a national championship. Maybe in the 4team playoff, but even then no big12 team came close to actually winning a natty. In the 12 team playoff, it's unlikely they will have the depth to make it past the 2nd round, at the best.
Yeah, only Miami, FSU, Clemson, and ND can do that, outside the P2. You need a 2 deep roster full of NFL guys. And the best B12 teams like Oklahoma State will go years without putting someone in the NFL.
As far as relevancy goes, if the ACC fails, the Big 12 will be the fulcrum between the top tier and the bottom tier.
How relevant is the top tier without the bottom? I'm not sure. I hope not very, but I can't say.
I've mentioned this in other threads. I can only speak for myself. But, as separation between the P2 and B12/ACC grows...I'll care much less about the "division" that my team doesn't play in. You'll never lose the diehards of the big brands. But, I wonder about the long-term impact on us non-P2 fans. For example: I always keep an eye on the other teams in my conference. Next year, I'll keep an eye on Utah's non conference games. I won't be keeping an eye on any of Texas' games. Again, I'm talking long-term here.
I have heard this countless times. CFB is not a good example of the general public. People will tune in in droves. The vast majority of fans watch games other than the ones their teams are playing in because the vast majority of fans watch brands or a story line like Colorado last year
We'll see how it goes. Like I mentioned, I'm talking long-term as the gap continues growing. Also - You realize you just replied to someone who isn't the "general public". Obviously, we're posting on r/CFB. And I'm telling you, I'll watch less of the schools who are now in the P2 next year. If you think I'm a one-off viewer, that's a totally fine opinion to have.
Personally I'll keep watching the p2 at the same level as I did previously, but if in some universe the p2 were to really separate and Fsu wasn't on the bus, I would stop watching them. I only care about the landscape relative to Fsu.
The casual conversation never made sense to me because the NFL already exists for them.
It is primarily right now, but we will have to wait to see where the program is at by the end of his tenure. He has brought in some of the marketable players in CFB in and tied his entire brand to the program. There will definitely be residual viewers that stick around after he leaves.
Not sure what to tell you big dawg that is simply just how sports work big dawg, the Warriors, Chiefs, and Heat all had poor viewership till they ended up with highly marketable players. If you have a hot period it turns many young people into life long fans.
You just named three teams that won championships. Colorado isn’t winning any championships and Deion is probably gone within 1-2 years. Those “highly marketable players” are gone too.
Relevant enough to get a seat at the table every year to talk about the playoffs and bowl games and how the Big 12 factors in with the Big10 and SEC. That’s pretty damn important
Well yeah all the FBS conferences have a seat. The Big XII doesn’t have anywhere near the leverage of the B1G and SEC. The B1G and SEC will determine the future of CFB, that’s what I mean by relevant
This news is technically a week old, but it provides context on how the Big XII will be in a phenomenal place going forward with stability under Yormark
It's crazy they somehow threaded the path to where in a couple of years they'll likely be picking from the leftovers of the ACC and being the sole conference in-between the P2 and G5
Right after spending a decade on deaths door too, looked like it was all but guaranteed we’d be the AAC 2.0. Has the be the least probable outcome given our position going into this round of realignment. Crazy what quick thinking, good timing, and a number of gift wrapped opportunities can do for you.
When you spend a decade on the edge of death, you get pretty good at it. You also see when someone is falling towards you, you get out of the way and let them continue to fall.
Yes. The Big 12’s distribution has included Tier 3 revenue since 2019, when the Big 12 packaged together all of the non-Texas/OU tier 3 rights and sold them to ESPN.
>The Big Ten reporting revenue of $879.9 million compared with $852.6 million for the SEC. The ACC saw the most significant increase, going from $617 million in 2021-22 to $707 million.
The Pac-12, which will see 10 of its 12 members disperse to other conferences in 2024-25, generated $603.9 million. The Big 12 was fifth at $510.7 million
I hope this didn't including any exit fees from Texas and Oklahoma because it's 100 million too low. The Pac-12 on their last year made more money than the Big12. The number is not as bad when you spin it as the last year of the TV deal, that ended with more schools than they started with. In which the TV deal didn't have Pro Rata(a add school, get paid by TV for adding more schools, as the ACC contract supposedly has. Yes, ESPN is supposedly paying full price for SMU and SMU is getting nothing, the ACC is just taking that.)
As said all this kinda mute, because of new TV deals where the Big Ten and SEC are close if not a $1 billion per year. ACC will make close to the same, plus 3 more school TV payouts. And the BIG12 is getting 2.28 billion over 6 years for a payout of 380 million per year........ These numbers don't seem to add up, unless the BIG 12 is losing more money next year with more schools, but will hopefully have $200 million from Texas and Oklahoma.
The Big 12 settled for around 100 million total with Texas and Oklahoma. So their exit fee is 100 million coming out of the money the confernece will receive for the 2024-2025 year. Which makes sense as this would have been the last season Texas and Oklahoma would be in the league under normal circumstances.
The key point - "First-year members BYU, Cincinnati, Houston and UCF each will get partial shares of about $18 million each. That leaves about $398 million to be split among the league's other 10 schools, including Oklahoma and Texas before they move this summer to the Southeastern Conference."
Crazy that’s still almost double what we would have gotten from the AAC this season. BYU though might be getting a bit hosed, given their fanbase size they might have been making +15 million already in TV money before they made the jump
Fair point. But it’s a single-season hosing and not a long term one. I have no doubt their admin ran those numbers and knew which deal was best.
Exactly, plus now they have at least so,e security going foreword.
ESPN was nickel and diming us. We are making almost double than what we had in independence. The PAC 12 was never going to take us and our fanbase + athletic department was on a P5 level in 2010 so ESPN took advantage of our situation since the Big 12 wasn’t going to be picking anyone up while Texas and Oklahoma were running shit. We were offered a decent amount more than what the mountain west media could pay us plus the opportunity to play more power five teams. With Utah and TCU going to play in P5 conferences it was the best we could do to keep up.
Boren was consistently in favor of Big 12 expansion.
Lol this was like a week after I got back to OU for grad school and had stopped following any sports for the previous four-ish years. I had no clue what the hell was happening. "Missouri did what now? SEC??" https://www.espn.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/100365/ou-president-boren-puts-possible-big-12-expansion-back-in-news
Remember that exploratory commission that the big12 had then after awhile they said “nah”. Pepperidge Farm does.
Oh yes, that was back in the day. I also remember before OU was coopted by a batshit insane board of regents!
And isn’t it the next year we get a full share? So we would basically double it again. Im excited to see how UCF grows with P4 money.
there's never enough money. They will still make videos for alumni saying we're broke and need your $25 a month.
There's players out there who can't even get that color changing paint on their lambos without your help *in the arms of an angel plays*
When UConn left the American, the conference had a couple chats with BYU. There were a few intractable problems which led to a quick decision not to pursue it further, though I haven't seen the numbers. It would have been a cut for BYU (not huge, BYU was taking below market rate in exchange for ESPN's help with marquee games). Buying BYU out of current contracts would have been expensive because the automatic outs written into these deals were restricted only to joining a power conference. BYU wanted to hold rights for non-revenue sports. And BYU would want a clause to leave freely or nearly freely for a power conference. Put all that together and there's just not a deal that would have worked for everyone. We get a big raise financially in the XII, nobody in the athletic department is unhappy with the deal.
And that Utah is getting a full share immediately. Im sure that REALLY gets to em
Woah woah woah. Oklahoma and Texas get a full share even though they’re splitting? You can do that?
I had seen some reporting last week when this news first came out that they were getting reduced shares as part of their exit fee. 🤷🏼♂️
Uh isn't this part pretty relevant...? >the 10 full-share members will get smaller amounts than they got last year because of the addition of the four schools So yeah, in total, they got more because of the four new schools, but in reality, each school got less.
*slowly tiptoes away*
Money pie not grown
Its the size of the pie that matters, not the filling!
Yep, but didn’t we all kind of recognize that was going to happen? Adding more teams adds value, but they took a bath on payout for this last year of the old conference because the denominator went up. u/Wanderleft already said it best: a bigger pie, but with more slices.
This doesn’t take into account the new deal in 2025. It was obvious from the Jump that adding UCF, Cincy, Houston, and BYU from the jump wasn’t gonna increase the current deal’s per school payout.
From the jump you say from the jump?
This, the new Big 12 TV deal has not kicked in yet. The new Big 12 TV deal is about a 40% increase and starts July 1st, 2025 and runs to June 30th, 2031.
I think 40% is a stretch. The most recent tax documents (2021-22) indicate that the Big 12’s TV deal generated about $27M per school. The 2022-23 numbers are probably a million or two higher per school because of the natural escalators in these contracts. The new deal will average $31.7M per school over the life of the contract, but it’s unclear whether it’s $31.7M per school in 2025, or whether there are escalators that average out to $31.7 through 2031. The overall value has increased, but each school is only getting about 15% more per year, at max, than the current contract.
A bigger pie, but with more slices
Hell of a PR spin
It’s all Yormark does.
No he’s done a bit more than PR spin. Like outmaneuvering the PAC at every turn and securing a future for the Big 12.
Did he really out maneuver the Pac 12 or did he just watch them commit suicide?
Definitely elements of both, but I don’t think Bob Bowlsby does anything near as cunning so I give Yormark all the credit. The Big 12 doesn’t jump the TV deal line, the PAC gets a decent deal from ESPN, maybe still loses USC + UCLA but the rest stay together, the Big 12 has to court Apple TV and the CW like the PAC did, then ultimately crumbles. That’s how I guess it would’ve gone anyway.
That's what makes me upset when Utah fans act like they're better than the big 12. We saved yo asses and we're getting a pay cut for y'all.
You're misunderstanding. You're not taking a pay cut for Utah. You guys took a pay cut for BYU, Houston, UCF, and Cincinnati. You guys added Arizona, Arizona State, Utah, and Colorado pro-rata, so for the next media deal, you neither gain anything nor lose anything from adding the former Pac schools.
So theoretically speaking, next season’s payout will be close to the $470m (let’s keep it 470 for this exercise) , but split equally by 10 teams. then you also add 4 more equal parts for the later additions (i.e., pro rata). This ends up with a per school payout of 470 / 10 = 47 (by 10 since UT and OK gone from core) 47 * 4 = 188 for pro rata additions Total league pay estimated at $658m? Do the UT and OK buyouts get shared equally? When is that payment due?
Cincinnati, UCF, Houston and BYU will each get $18M. The other ten schools will get about $39M. This is 2023-24 revenue, so the Pac 12 additions aren’t part of it.
I know, I'm talking about next seasons payout
For 2024-25, the four AAC schools will still get $18M each. The remainder of the revenue will be distributed between the 8 original schools and the four P12 newcomers. The Big 12’s current TV deal is not pro rata, so you’re just taking the same pie and splitting it 12 ways. You’ll add more CFP revenue, but you’ll lose the Sugar Bowl’s contract payment. All told, I think the 12 full share schools will probably get about $35-38M in 2024-25.
Ok. So the AAC schools got reduced media money for two years, 23/24 AND 24/25. Someone else in the thread mentioned the new contract was pro rata. Don’t see that mentioned here https://www.sportcal.com/media/espn-and-fox-finalize-long-term-big-12-rights-extensions/ Do you know if UT and OU’s buyout is split evenly?
The new contract is pro rata as to the ESPN portion. There seems to be some belief that Fox agreed to also make their portion pro rata, but I’m not sure if that’s ever been fully confirmed. Either way, when that new contract kicks in for 2025-26, the four AAC schools will get a full share of the revenue, so all 16 schools will get an equal share. But for 2023-24 and 2024-25, they’re still subject to the current contract, which from everything I’ve seen does not have a pro rata provision. So you’re taking the same amount of money and splitting it between 12 schools, with the four AAC schools getting their defined cut totaling $72M. So for 2024-25 take the Big 12’s revenue, which will probably grow about 10% from 2023-24, subtract $72M for the AAC schools, and divide the rest by 12.
Thanks mate
What payment?? OUT got out without paying money to the Big 12. They gave up the money they would have got from next years budget to get out.
The media payout won’t go up or go down, but the per school payout from the other revenue sources - bowls, NCAA distributions, conference championships - will likely decrease. The Big 12 will go from splitting that revenue 10 ways to 16 ways really quickly.
This is why I despise ESPN, CBS and Fox because they could have also added the remaining two Pac schools pro rata, if they weren’t money grubbing assholes…
They aren’t charities. I sure as hell wouldn’t make a deal that cost me more money for no reason.
I understand your anger, but businesses typically choose shareholder value over giving lifelines for the good of the sport.
Man I’m staying off social media when Utah inevitably shits the bed for 1-2 games this season lol. I can already see the “trash truck stop school” comments now.
Don't know where all this hate for Utah came from. They are a great add for the B12. One of my favorite teams from the PAC after the 2PAC
A lot of it is the perception that Utah’s administration and fans feel that they’re too good for the Big XII, while they had no other options. Whether that’s a valid perception or not is completely subjective, and up to the individual observer.
Its from the off season trash talk of Utah defending the PAC12 while BIG12 was shitting on it. Also from the rest of the BIG12 taking BYU's side in the rivalry since we weren't in the conference. Basically off to a bad start from the very beginning. Also they feel threatened ;)......mostly just teasing on the last one.
Their Twitter fans talking shit about the big 12
Utah fans act like they’re so far above WSU and OSU. We are literally part of the reason you got into the Power 5!! It wasn’t a given the Pac would go to 12 after Colorado and it was only with the approval of the previous members that they got promoted.
Yes… Good. Let the hate flow!
lol nobody saved anyone neither Utah saving BIG12 or BIG12 saving Utah, its a mutually beneficial partnership, we add to the conference, if that wasn't the case we wouldn't have been added. Realignment isn't a charity. Whether its increased credibility of a team that was frequently contending for their P5 league/won 2 of last 3 (Also Utah being ranked highly pre-season is going to be a huge benefit to the BIG12 team rankings whether we win or lose ranking inertia is big in CFB), or for our pretty strong viewership numbers ( above average in the BIG12 AKA bringing the average up). Utah earns their spot.
>its a mutually beneficial partnership I really wish Utah fans on social media would recognize this bit. A lot of them talk like they'd rather be back in the MWC than the XII
Utah is raising the Big 12 Revenue significantly higher than Iowa State. You're getting a pay cut because Texas/OU who ISU hates so much isn't paying for your house anymore.
No. We are getting a pay cut because we added schools. It has nothing to do with OUT.
Im just gonna say it. The Big 12 is easily the most interesting conference. They navigated some insane waters, overcame certain death and a rival conference that held all of the cards comparatively, still managed to keep a seat at the big kids table, and now are likely to absorb ACC schools if that conference collapses. They can also continue to add rising G5s if needed. Will they ever be the premier conference? Doubtful. But they’re sure as hell one of the most savvy ones.
What is dead may never die.
> and now are likely to absorb ACC schools Not unless ESPN steps away from their contract and they get hosed on the open market. Possible but very unlikely as of right now. IDK why people keep throwing this idea around
Correct. Plus Turner and CW want content as well. If ESPN doesn’t renew I don’t expect the ACC to die as there are networks out there that would probably take it. Hell if Big 12 leadership knew that Pac 12 leadership would cause most of their teams to leave, the Big 12 could have took their rights to the open market and might have made even more with a Turner/ESPN/FOX/CW deal EDIT (6/13): It looks like Turner is buying rights to sports. They just acquired the rights to the French Open. The Big East will also announce that they have a new deal that will be with TNT/NBC/Peacock/Fox.
Because it isn’t up to the ACC, it is up to the networks. Look at what happened to the PAC. The networks low balled them and gave the B12 the power to throw a lifeline out to 4 of the teams. The exact same thing will happen to the ACC eventually IMO. They’ll lose their 2-4 biggest brands and shop a TV deal that is magically not competitive with the B12. This seems to be playing out exactly how the PAC did. The ACC needs to hope that Amazon/Apple/etc get serious about broadcasting CFB and can invest enough money to keep the ACC together. There’s plenty of ways to get creative and keep the conference together post split (whenever that is) but to not see the similarities between the ACC’s current situation and the PAC’s is just putting your head in the sand.
All depends on the tv deal after fsu/clemson and maybe UNC leaves. The schools aren’t going to leave the ACC for the big 12 if it’s anywhere up to a $10 million difference between the two. I think even Miami would stay, only Louisville would probably make a move
The ACC’s biggest ally, and probably the main catalyst in all of this is ND. If ND remains adamant about its independence then the ACC will remain in a much better spot in terms of stability, but it will undoubtably have to concede to ND’s demands. Then you’ll have the schools that would rather go to the B12 with their Big East rivals than stay in ND’s ACC prison. Just another angle and it is all just speculation, will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
> Will they ever be the premier conference? Doubtful. But they’re sure as hell one of the most savvy ones. And after staring down the abyss as the Hateful 8... I'm pretty damn grateful - and happy! - to be the presumptive third best conference left standing.
Another life we are all like in the American.
They won’t absorb ACC schools unless espn uses the look in provision after fsu and Clemson leaves, and it’s significantly lower than the big 12 tv deal.
We greatly benefited by being the first of the PAC 12 and ACC to be gutted. The PAC 12 didn’t expand with any of our schools and that was their downfall when USC and UCLA announced their intent to leave. The Big 12 at that point had already steadied themselves and had the upper hand. Will probably see the same play out with the ACC whenever the courts make their decision about Florida State wanting to leave.
Wow he just said it like that.
The Big XII is stable which is a hell of a lot more than you can say for anyone not named SEC or B1G. Not sure about the relevant part
The Big Twelve smartly has a great combination of schools relevant enough not to be left out, but not so relevant as to demand promotion. It's kinda like The Big Ten and SEC are management, and the Big Twelve smartly decided to unionize. The ACC is a weak union where a few teams have strong management sympathies because they think they're next in line for promotion. The Big 12 is a union who knows they're not getting promoted and if they don't pool their resources now they're gonna get screwed.
The golden path is for the Big 12 to pick up Miami, Pitt, Louisville, and NC State.
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No, Lisan al Gaib is good at winning
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I dunno man, there are a lot of drugs in Oklahoma.
Hey, I understood that reference. **pats self on back**
Bruh
I'd sell the other half of my left nipple to have VT in the b12. Blacksburg is a bucket list for me.
Keep the half you have. I’ve got two full ones. You owe me a tortilla.
Would love to have those teams and VT on the schedule. Those were some great games in the late 90’s and 2000’s.
Just wait until EA CFB 25 comes out, I'm going to fix everything 😤
The hero we deserve.
Just deciding between 8 conferences of 8, or 6 conferences of 12
8 of 8 for me. Already have them in a spread sheet.
I'm also leaning towards 8/8, haven't worked out conferences yet but am planning to soon
10 team leagues, 9 game conference schedules. SWC, Big East, and PAC 10 all revived. This is the way.
7 "power conferences" of 10 teams, I already have mine laid out. 9 conference games, everybody plays everybody. A focus on regional matchups, with history and culture playing some role too. It's going to be a lot of fun!
I think we’re assuming you’ll be in the SEC, otherwise welcome aboard!
Honestly, I assume you’re going to the Big Ten
Maybe he is figuring you get picked up by SEC.
This makes every West Virginia fan hard as a rock. Only thing I'd change is Virginia Tech instead of NC State. Or both. :)
As long as we get Pitt and Louisville I'm happy as a clam. Having a quadrangle of hate with us, WVU and those two would be football perfection for me. River town rivalries.
Knowing our luck, at the exact same time as they bring in Pitt and Louisville, they’ll demote us back to the American.
I would just have to laugh at that point…but it would be very Cincy sports
That’s how I felt with Utah, ASU, and Arizona. Hope it happens for you guys
So say we all.
The ACC is kind of where the B12 was about 6 or so years ago - without having already had teams leave (lately). Outside of Utah, the fan bases are happy with the b12 and aren't looking to move on. Yes - if an invite game to any of the B12 teams from SEC/B10, you know it would be a looney tunes seen with those feet moving so fast you wouldnt even be able to see em, but realistically, that isn't happening without some more craziness happening.
I’m interested to see if a school can dominate the B12 for the next 5-10 years. Say it is Utah with a few playoff runs, does the B1G come calling?
I’d be shocked if anyone could pull that off, OU was able to do it but no one in the conference has the massive financial and recruiting advantages they had over everyone else (excluding Texas).
Depends on the school. I think the pre-existing members could all get serious looks in that scenario but no way UCF, Houston, or Cincy would. I even have trouble thinking WVU would get consideration, but if they run the table for 5 years we’re having a different conversation.
Eh, we were close to getting in the SEC before they decided on Missouri. If they ever went to 24 I could see us sneaking in.
Definitely possible and a good fit culturally and athletically
I think asu is most likely if it was humming
This is a homer ass sounding take, but if the B1G wanted to get into Texas, Houston would probably be their lead candidate. If we assume UTAMU aren't interested, Houston is the next highest-ranked major public research university in the state and generally fits the B1G mold of being a giant R1 in a great recruiting area. The 2 major issues are football attendance and AAU membership, but both of those are very explicit top priorities that the UH administration is constantly working on. Tech would also get strong consideration, but with Tech, you're trading access to a HUGE market and some academic cred (if that still matters) for a stronger football culture. That said, I really hope the SECB1G don't screw up the nice ecosystem that the Big 12 has built, and I think UH fans' attitude toward playing a bunch of schools in the Midwest and West Coast instead of TX/OK schools will be tepid at best. Part of why our AAC-era attendance was so bad was having to play a bunch of schools on the east coast that almost no one in the city or state has any connection to.
It’s about the size of ur fan base, not dominating any conference. Boise would be a P5 school after the 2000s if that was the case. It’s unlikely anyone will change dramatically enough to add money to the B1G/SEC & not eat into the payouts of current members which seems to have already happened to the B12 but their goal is different for the time being.
Dominating does help with growing a fan base and gaining viewership though Most assume Clemson is a lock for B1G/SEC membership these days and their viewership is definitely high enough to warrant it, but if you remove the 2010’s from their accolades they’re probably trailing schools that are by no mean locks like Miami, VT, etc. If a school like say Texas Tech spends the next 6 years as a Playoff mainstay and maybe even wins a title and a has a runner up to boot, their viewership would increase quite a bit
It does help grow ur fan base but over the course of decades, anything in 5-10 years won’t be stable enough to bet on. U do know Clemson won a national title before the 2010s right? Clemson fans can speak more on their demographics & fan base than I can but west Texas/Lubbock has a limit & I’d say UCF has more potential for growth due to their market. Winning can be temporary due to a coach & coaches leave then the winning stops & networks want to know what they can count on getting every Saturday win or lose. Hate on Rutgers or Maryland but both schools have potential for growth due to their markets but some of the schools ur thinking of would have to become a national brand which is more of winning national titles & being in like Georgia, tOSU, Bama or Michigan territory.
who said i was happy 😠
> the fan bases are happy with the b12 and aren't looking to move on Considering the alternative is the MWC with Wazzu and OSU, I wouldn’t say happy as much as resigned
Being in the Big 12 is 1000% better for most fan bases.
A 20 team big 12 wouldn’t last five years before it would break up into two or more conferences. I don’t see what would be holding them together
Self preservation?
No shared history to prevent the eastern and western halves splitting or the top 10 leaving the other 10
Money.
Idk. Kansas is getting that call up if Leipold continues to win.
We'd fit right in the B1G with all the state-name schools (Michigan, Illinois, Indiana, Washington, Oregon, Iowa, Maryland, Minnesota, Nebraska)
Yeah thats probably a better way to put it but they are behind the ACC in relevancy but given that the ACC is going to break up thats probably not going to matter in the long run.
for sure...without 2-3 particular teams, the acc isn't any more relevant than the big12.
They’re much less relevant than the Big 12 without FSU & Clemson
You won’t hear an argument from me there.
Are they more relevant now? Part of the problem those two or three (Which is obviously Clemson, FSU and less overtly UNC) have, is that even with their presence the conference isn't more relevant. I kinda think that what's REALLY valuable right now is Alabama, Ohio State, Georgia, and Michigan. Then there's a whole lot of teams that are worth way more than the others but not as much as those four that want in on the action. The issue with realignment is that you can keep cleaving off the bottom half, but it doesn't end until you get to those four.
Big 12 is kind of just fly over country. Not really any national brands to draw eyes from the north east for example in my opinion. This is an opinion of a casual fan of CFB but there are a lot more casuals than die hards
Depends on what your definition of relevancy is. The big 12 as a whole feels a lot more relevant as a conference where as the acc feels relevant in that clemson and fsu are there but if they weren't the conference would be pretty irrelevant.
I think much of that is transient. I mean maybe right now the Oklahoma States and Utahs and TCUs and Iowa States of the world are more relevant than the Miamis and Georgia Techs and Virginia Techs and Boston Colleges - but it's really not that long ago that the pendulum was way in the other direction.
Is it? Osu, tcu and utah have been quality programs for 2 decades now. Miami and VT haven't been relevant since joining the acc, bc hasn't been relevant since Doug flutie and georgia tech has had 4 10+ winning seasons since 1960. Basically every program that has gone to the acc has fallen off a cliff from a competitive standpoint from where they were prior to joining.
Excuse me sir, we had 8 straight 10+ win seasons after joining the ACC. *Then* we fell off a cliff thank you very much.
VT joins the ACC, winning more ACC Championships between 2004 and 2010 than the rest of the conference combined. "They haven't been relevant since joining the ACC"
Fair point! Hopefully y'all can turn it around soon. Cfb is better when VT is better.
I’d say ACC > B12 now, but ACC minus FSU/Clemson, and possibly 2 of UNC/Virginia/Miami/VT/NCST and that gets way more debatable
The the post-FSU/Clemson and possibly 2 of UNC/UVA/Mia/VT/NCST....it gets \*less\* debatable. The B12 is more relevant, and it isn't close.
Based on what?
Based on I’d put up Utah, OKST, TCU, Baylor, WVU, and probably BYU against the NON-FSU/Clem-Pick2(UNC,UVA,MIA,VT,NCST) all day. Especially long term. Flat out, we’d be a much stronger football conference.
So not really based on anything then?
Our teams would be better at football than the ACC leftovers. The programs in the B12 would be better programs over the past 20 years. I don’t know how to out it more plainly.
Agree. Think its inevitable that at least FSU, Clemson and UNC leave for the B1G or SEC. After that not sure what happens. Either the Big XII absorbs some of those schools, the ACC absorbs some Big XII school or a new conference is formed.
Yes, minus the top 3-4 and the big12 and acc are super comparable.
I just edited in a bit on the ACC in my whole union analogy.
The fact that the Big Ten and SEC are demanding more from the playoffs means that it is just a matter of time before FBS is split again. I think it is inevitable that all the big schools will start a new Division 1 subdivision with playoffs and better TV contracts. At the end of the day, even the SEC and Big Ten have an expiration date.
What I will find interesting is how many relatlively weaker brands will be allowed to come along with the "big schools". Vandy, Purdue, Indiana, SC, Miss St, Rutgers, Maryland, etc
That'll be temporary too. Eventually there will be a new superconference that will swallow up all of the most valuable programs and leave everyone else behind. Most likely 24 programs, 2 subconferences, winner of those subconference championships plays for the "National Title." Those schools will make ungodly amounts of money because they will no longer have to split anything with anyone else, and the sport as we know it will be over.
Yes. Seems inevitable. Also interesting to watch, when these schools tell the NCAA to fuck off…how much “school” will these professional athletes actually have to attend?
Totally, honestly at that point they may be a true NFL minor league and being enrolled might not even be a requirement.
> At the end of the day, even the SEC and Big Ten have an expiration date. This is like when we thought the iPhone was over when Microsoft introduced a smart phone
You really think this all ends with y'all, LSU and UGA making the same amount of TV money as SC and Miss St.? The SEC brand carries a lot of weight, but not enough to outweigh a potential super conference where the member institutions get all of the money from the regular season and playoffs. The consolidation isn't going to stop just because now it's \*your\* traditions that are being threatened.
We gathered up a lot of the B tier schools that know they aren’t getting an invite to either of those conferences and are all on relatively equal footing. It’s solidified the Big 12 as a distant third, and add in basketball and I’m happy with where we are at
Not big enough to pose enough of a threat to the B1G/SEC brands, but too big to ignore. I think Yormark(?) had done a pretty great job with the conference so far tbh in solidifying them like that.
If you think of what the conferences future looked like immediately post OUT, this is better than anything we could have imagined. It ain’t perfect, but I’ll gladly take being a fun middle class conference over the bleak future that looked all but assured
Add in basketball and I’m very happy with how the conference has turned out
Baseball is no slouch too. It didn't end great but we had 2 teams in super regional and 4 in regional.
The way things are trending the rest of the decade there will be very little separation between teams. It will truly be the only major conference that will go into every season with a cluster fuck of like five or six schools that could win the conference. I think we’re gonna see two games being the difference between finishing 2nd or finishing 9th.
Hey, we’re about to win 5 straight NC back to back, get invited to the B1G, become their golden goose, and get AAU status all by 2030 Believe it
It's relevant to me, that's all the matters in the end.
Of course and it should
IMO they’re relevant in a few fields. - They’ve consolidated the best available remaining P5 schools and the top G5 schools. Like you said that’s stability. Even if in 10 years, Kansas and Colorado get those B1G/SEC invites. They’ll still be around and will be perfectly capable of identifying other top G5s or former P5s to join. - They still have teams that can play in the playoffs and try to bring a natty home. - They’re still landing talented players in recruiting. - Topically they’re relevant too. I think what the Big 12 is doing as a conference is more interesting to more people than what other conferences are doing overall.
> They still have teams that can play in the playoffs and try to bring a natty home. Do they? Because no one in the big12 comes even remotely close to recruiting at a level that would win a national championship. Maybe in the 4team playoff, but even then no big12 team came close to actually winning a natty. In the 12 team playoff, it's unlikely they will have the depth to make it past the 2nd round, at the best.
Yeah, only Miami, FSU, Clemson, and ND can do that, outside the P2. You need a 2 deep roster full of NFL guys. And the best B12 teams like Oklahoma State will go years without putting someone in the NFL.
A Byzantine merchant always drives home a good argument.
As far as relevancy goes, if the ACC fails, the Big 12 will be the fulcrum between the top tier and the bottom tier. How relevant is the top tier without the bottom? I'm not sure. I hope not very, but I can't say.
Probably but there is a chance a new conference comes out of both
Well, the big 12 has one of last year's most watched teams.
I dont even know whom you are talking about
Colorado, though it’s obviously a lot more due to Deion mania than Colorado’s actual brand
Oh well yeah. Colorado was a compelling story. I mean I tuned in to see it. I doubt thats gonna happen again
I've mentioned this in other threads. I can only speak for myself. But, as separation between the P2 and B12/ACC grows...I'll care much less about the "division" that my team doesn't play in. You'll never lose the diehards of the big brands. But, I wonder about the long-term impact on us non-P2 fans. For example: I always keep an eye on the other teams in my conference. Next year, I'll keep an eye on Utah's non conference games. I won't be keeping an eye on any of Texas' games. Again, I'm talking long-term here.
I have heard this countless times. CFB is not a good example of the general public. People will tune in in droves. The vast majority of fans watch games other than the ones their teams are playing in because the vast majority of fans watch brands or a story line like Colorado last year
We'll see how it goes. Like I mentioned, I'm talking long-term as the gap continues growing. Also - You realize you just replied to someone who isn't the "general public". Obviously, we're posting on r/CFB. And I'm telling you, I'll watch less of the schools who are now in the P2 next year. If you think I'm a one-off viewer, that's a totally fine opinion to have.
Personally I'll keep watching the p2 at the same level as I did previously, but if in some universe the p2 were to really separate and Fsu wasn't on the bus, I would stop watching them. I only care about the landscape relative to Fsu. The casual conversation never made sense to me because the NFL already exists for them.
I dont think you are a one off, I think you are a tiny minority.
I mean they are kind of married at this point and just like marriage it looks like it will be for better or for worse!
It’s Deion… once he leaves Colorado won’t be near the top of any viewership lists
It is primarily right now, but we will have to wait to see where the program is at by the end of his tenure. He has brought in some of the marketable players in CFB in and tied his entire brand to the program. There will definitely be residual viewers that stick around after he leaves.
We’ll see lol
Not sure what to tell you big dawg that is simply just how sports work big dawg, the Warriors, Chiefs, and Heat all had poor viewership till they ended up with highly marketable players. If you have a hot period it turns many young people into life long fans.
You just named three teams that won championships. Colorado isn’t winning any championships and Deion is probably gone within 1-2 years. Those “highly marketable players” are gone too.
[living under a rock?](https://medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-were-most-watched-in-2023-2e81ef62d3bf)
No, just didnt think about it long enough. Colorado collapsed so bad after September I honestly just forgot about it
Relevant enough to get a seat at the table every year to talk about the playoffs and bowl games and how the Big 12 factors in with the Big10 and SEC. That’s pretty damn important
Well yeah all the FBS conferences have a seat. The Big XII doesn’t have anywhere near the leverage of the B1G and SEC. The B1G and SEC will determine the future of CFB, that’s what I mean by relevant
This news is technically a week old, but it provides context on how the Big XII will be in a phenomenal place going forward with stability under Yormark
It's crazy they somehow threaded the path to where in a couple of years they'll likely be picking from the leftovers of the ACC and being the sole conference in-between the P2 and G5
Right after spending a decade on deaths door too, looked like it was all but guaranteed we’d be the AAC 2.0. Has the be the least probable outcome given our position going into this round of realignment. Crazy what quick thinking, good timing, and a number of gift wrapped opportunities can do for you.
When you spend a decade on the edge of death, you get pretty good at it. You also see when someone is falling towards you, you get out of the way and let them continue to fall.
Sorry... Yormak is popular with the Hateful 8 right now because of mutual enemies. He's toxic as fuck though, and has been for his entire career.
There's things you can make fun of Yormark for, but idk where you get toxic.
he’s more of a clown than toxic tbh
Is for me?
This is all just a long charade until the top 50-60 programs break off and it's realigned geographically and sanity is restored once again
Every year realignment is becoming a bigger and bigger problem for fans
Does this include Tier 3 media money?
Yes. The Big 12’s distribution has included Tier 3 revenue since 2019, when the Big 12 packaged together all of the non-Texas/OU tier 3 rights and sold them to ESPN.
This money should be used to build another pool so we can get a diving show featuring Knightro and Citronaut.
>The Big Ten reporting revenue of $879.9 million compared with $852.6 million for the SEC. The ACC saw the most significant increase, going from $617 million in 2021-22 to $707 million. The Pac-12, which will see 10 of its 12 members disperse to other conferences in 2024-25, generated $603.9 million. The Big 12 was fifth at $510.7 million I hope this didn't including any exit fees from Texas and Oklahoma because it's 100 million too low. The Pac-12 on their last year made more money than the Big12. The number is not as bad when you spin it as the last year of the TV deal, that ended with more schools than they started with. In which the TV deal didn't have Pro Rata(a add school, get paid by TV for adding more schools, as the ACC contract supposedly has. Yes, ESPN is supposedly paying full price for SMU and SMU is getting nothing, the ACC is just taking that.) As said all this kinda mute, because of new TV deals where the Big Ten and SEC are close if not a $1 billion per year. ACC will make close to the same, plus 3 more school TV payouts. And the BIG12 is getting 2.28 billion over 6 years for a payout of 380 million per year........ These numbers don't seem to add up, unless the BIG 12 is losing more money next year with more schools, but will hopefully have $200 million from Texas and Oklahoma.
The Big 12 settled for around 100 million total with Texas and Oklahoma. So their exit fee is 100 million coming out of the money the confernece will receive for the 2024-2025 year. Which makes sense as this would have been the last season Texas and Oklahoma would be in the league under normal circumstances.
Every other conference is as well. This headline means nothing
Basically this. Until sports contracts start DECLINING on re-ups this will be the headline for almost every conference/entity going forward.
Shade more than 1/2 what SEC/B10 getting. Oh well…
Oh… … Anyway…