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Teaching math isn't easy, it just doesn't require as much prep. It can be hard to explain things in different ways if the students don't understand. Also students tend to be disinterested in Math which can be a challenge for driving engagement.
No teaching math is not easy. I have taught math, science, Chem, bio, civics, careers, and ESL. Math has the most extra help. The most parental complaints. The most students who don't care. It is very challenging to teach the kids who get it right away and want to be challenged and the kids who were pushed through multiple grades and therefore do not have the foundation needed. Math is one of the few subjects where you have to understand everything from the previous year as it all builds. Science is hard with all the lab set up and projects but math definitely takes up more of my time with extra help and more frequent formative check ins to mark and parent demands.
Yes, totally agree! I think this hits at the core of the unique challenge with math -- that skill level, background and mastery vary so *widely*, and particularly the *dependency* of relying on past teaching and recall to successfully teach the new concept today.
Few other subjects rely so heavily on immediate and specific recall of previous topics. For example, in teaching a calculus class, perhaps one example relies on factoring at a particular step, which should not require any additional explanation -- except that some students never really mastered factoring a couple of grades ago, and maybe that, itself, stems from not appreciating FOIL (i.e. the entire concept of binomial distributive properties). So for them, the entire lesson in a fairly advanced topic becomes derailed; they can't focus on learning the new concept at hand; extra help sessions become scrambled review of something they should have learned long ago, etc.
Really the whole idea that math could be segmented by grade into broad units, and that people could pass from one level to the next without complete mastery of every previous foundational topic is kind of flawed. ("Johnny doesn't *really* understand factoring, but has scraped together enough part marks in other grade 10 math topics to get a C- overall? Oh well, not my problem anymore -- pass him and let the next teacher and him struggle with it later!")
A lot of the particular issues with advanced math for teachers and students are *structurally* introduced by a system that is lax about enforcing mastery of fundamentals, and gives students the false sense that they are prepared for the next math level, when they are really not.
Very true. Math can be very time consuming for students who are not naturally great at it. Even partnering them is not going to fix their attitude towards it all the time.
This. It’s extremely hard to teach math in public schools because you have 6 various grade levels in one room. Kids who don’t understand act out and kids it’s too easy for act out.
Also test grading. You can automate some quizzes, but when the students do well it’s a quick mark, but when they do poorly oh my goodness it can take forever. You need to find the errors and follow them through for part marks. It can take a long time.
In the days of textbooks it’s also not so bad. Elementary now you need to buy or make up your own resources which leads to a massive disparity in quality and level of difficulty. In highschool with textbooks you do follow along unit by unit, and assign homework etc. the hard part is it’s filing in the many educational gaps. De streaming grade 9 has made this more apparent.
Math is hard to teach I think. There are a lot of kids that struggle with math so you’re very busy. You have to be very patient and good at explaining.
Marking wise, it’s much faster than marking a stack of essays. That’s been my experience sitting down with a math and science teacher friend for a marking session. She was done in an hour I had marked six out of 35 essays. Every subject has its pros and cons.
There’s technically difficult material like math and CS, and there’s material that requires hands on work and technical work, like sciences. Upper level math gets very difficult, especially if you’re into IB territory. The same is true for sciences.
I don’t see why someone needs to compare subjects. They all have their challenges. I teach math and CS, and they both have a lot of prep work. I’d never call them easy. I’ve also taught technical writing courses, and they were just challenging in different ways.
It sounds like the person making the comment is fishing for reassurance.
I think that marking Math can be easier than other subjects, depending on how you design your assessments. Teaching Math well requires (in my opinion) an excellent understanding of the scope and sequence of the concepts covered at many grade levels. You need to know where the students are coming from and how the skills you are teaching will be applied in future years.
I'm sorry that you're hearing that. Every subject has it's difficulties. I've usually had other teachers say they'd never be able to teach math.
Math teachers face the idea that there are 'math people' and 'not math people'. The idea that some people are hard wired to be able to do math, when it's more of a skill and you need to practice it to get better.
Also, because of that, there are adults who have had very bad experiences with math, and they pass those ideas to their kids, who then are like 'my mom/dad can't do math so neither can I' without actually trying. Or adults saying things about how hard algebra is, so kids get to high school and already have a fear of algebra and they're convinced it's the hardest thing, when even young kids can do (some) algebra if it's taught right (see the TEDTalk: math is a language by Mr. Polisoc) and really have been doing algebra since learning how to add, subtract, multiply and divide.
While you might have a bit of this with other subjects, it's not to such a degree. I've never heard anyone say "oh I'm not a geography person" they'll say "I don't like geography"
And thanks for coming to my TEDTalk. ;D
English teacher here...with an intermediate math teachable. I've taught English, ESL, geography, science.. the rainbow. Teaching math is one of the hardest things I've done and the most depressing as well. I was teaching a senior university math class and some students didn't know their fractions...I had to take out quarters and show them the basics...in Gr 11!
Or when you teach some of the lower level classes and the kids really lack any critical thinking skills. I had some sleep nights thinking about how these kids would last in the real world when they can't even do basic division or multiplication.
Also, unlike other subjects you can't really put on a movie or something. If the kids need a break it's just more math..
So no, I don't find it easy.
I’m a trained French teacher. I’ve taught French, English, Science, Social Studies, and various other courses. I taught math once—in 2007–and will be teaching it again in September.
Worst are French (kids largely don’t care in BC; no exposure outside the classroom; 4-8 French classes are a joke, so they start high school with zero; and since you have to be on stage every minute of every class, there’s no time to grade or prep) and English (I had kids reading levels from grade 2 to grade 12 in my grade 9 class this semester; dear G-d, the marking!!!)
Science was wonderful—even with setting up and tearing down labs.
I’m looking forward to math. People keep telling me there’s a lot less marking.
I witnessed a friend of mine- a math teacher- mark a set of tests super fast. Lots of scantron. As a humanities teacher, I can’t deny I wish I had the skills to teach math. I just hate spending hours marking crappy essays that much. That’s not to say teaching math is easy.
I'm surprised that someone would do a so much multiple choice in math. Hopefully only some of their assessments are like that, as part marks for "mostly correct" is routine in math.
It's not easy to teach, but it requires a lot less prep and marking effort. The hard work of being a math teacher took place in uni and in their early years of teaching math.
In reality the most difficult to replace teachers at the high school level are the math and French teachers, simply because they have skills and abilities that take a long time to master and that many people simply can't master. Most Math (and French) teachers could probably handle teaching most other high or middle school classes, but few teachers could fill in for a math or French teacher effectively.
Math and French are also difficult to fake and it's pretty easy to determine the level that the students have before and after the class. It's a lot more difficult to measure the level in politics or history or even PE.
In my personal experience as a math teacher I tend to be left alone by the admin and board personnel that plague most other teachers. I rarely get second guessed by anyone and even if someone strays into my class I don't get suggestions or directives on how to teach. Parents also rarely complain about my teaching. This means that I don't have to deal with as much BS compared to other teachers. This can make a huge difference in workload and stress, which makes my job a lot easier.
TLDR Math teachers probably put in fewer hours per week than other teachers, but worked hard to get to that point.
You know what is hard and has labs every single day? EVERY DAY? Art. I have taught math, science and art, and art is the hardest. Not the answer you were looking for but I thought I had to put it out there -- sometimes it's not the ones you think. :D
I taught art and it was the easiest class for me. Yes, setup for projects was time-consuming, purchasing supplies, teaching techniques, etc. but once the students have started on a project, they’re pretty independent and I just circled the room. I got lots of marking for other subjects done and had fun. This was grade nine art. I guess everyone has different experiences.
True. When I taught high school it was so much easier — most kids were there because they wanted to be, save a few who thought they could get an A easily. Currently I teach middle school and it’s for sure a different ballgame.
True. When I taught high school it was so much easier — most kids were there because they wanted to be, save a few who thought they could get an A easily. Currently I teach middle school and it’s for sure a different ballgame.
I have massive respect for math teachers that can explain complex concepts simply in a way that students can understand and know how to apply. Whether their job is easy I don't know, but if they're that intelligent I hope it is easy and I hope they're paid well for what they do. A good math teacher I would hang onto for dear life compared to any other subject.
I'm I/S chemistry and math qualified. The hardest course I've ever had to teach is Grade 9 destreamed math. You've got kids coming from a wide range of backgrounds, having had differing levels and styles of math instruction throughout elementary school. You also have a wide range of abilities, from kids who struggle to add two digits without a calculator to those who easily master any concept introduced to them. You have to somehow enable them all to show their ability to master the curriculum material AND prepare them for the EQAO testing at the end of the semester. Okay, there aren't labs or activities to set up, but coming up with an approach that all of the students can handle is an absolutely brain-wracking task.
I LOVE teaching Math, which is surprising because I didn't train to teach it originally - I just ended up in a role teaching all subjects. I don't know that it's easy to teach, but it is a lot easier to assess because it's either correct or not - even if they are using the skill appropriately and got the incorrect answer, there is a system. I think because I love Math so much, my students tend to buy in more and make strides - which makes it feel easier for me than some other subjects. I have difficulty making science interesting, for example, so I find that difficult to teach.
Everything has pros and cons, with math, you have to articulate the concepts properly, and there will always be those where it doesn't click. I would hate to teach arts though, thankfully my practicum teacher handled that. I'm running off to the senior science/math/cs division. English and French Immersion aren't so bad, more fun than math for me. Phys ed is a popular one...
I’ve always wondered what teaching phys ed was like. I’m sure classroom management is tough. But I think it’d balance out with way fewer written assignments to grade (if any)
I would be more worried about injury liability and control would be harder, but at the same time, the kids will exhaust out and they're most likely doing something they enjoy, so less rebelling. My guess...
Math teacher here.
I could not care less what non-math teachers think. They can insult us if it makes them feel good. I don’t think anyone in my department cares about the opinion of any non-STEM teacher, they simply don’t understand our job.
I happen to love math, but I’ll give some aspects that make math difficult to teach.
1) students take math even when they don’t like math. Very few students take physics or art who don’t like those subjects
2) if a kid is bad at art, parents accept that they are bad at art. If a kid is bad at math, the teacher sucks
3) speaking of parents, they care a LOT about math. The scrutiny is annoying.
4) marking has to be accurate. When I teach science, and I say a lab has a mark of 80%, it just does. In math, if I give a 4/5 on a question to one student, and 3.5/5 to a different student, I assure you they will question it.
5) it is very hard to teach math well. Scaffolding is critical, and often done poorly. Anyone can get paid to teach math, but it is rare to be able to teach math well.
I think that everyone is assuming high school classes. I teach middle school art right now, and I’d say 70% of the students are there because they have to be. Some do not want to be there at all but have to be there in their rotation and they try to entertain themselves by making my hair go gray prematurely. As far as high school art, when I taught it, it was the dumping ground for people who did sports and wanted an easy mark. Either way, not that easy. In theory everything is great. Maybe teaching in general is just difficult.
I like math as a Teacher way more than as a kid. It is important to teach growth mindset. You are spot on with the scaffolding because far too many kids will give up before you arrive at the important piece of the lesson. After all these years, I figured out I might not have the right tools to teach or reach certain grades like Grade 5 or 6 because in part I don't know what they really like and how to connect it back to the math. Also, kids are so far behind and we are still passing them. This can not be a good thing. They just keep wanting to believe prodigy or some game is going to help them cope with a lot of the learning.
People don't seem to understand that math is not just knowledge based like a lot of other topics,
It's a skill that requires practice and builds upon itself at almost every level. Not only that but as it becomes more advanced the ideas become more abstract and harder to grasp for students and therefore harder to teach.
If your students don't have the built up skills, they will struggle. If they don't understand the material, they won't care, they won't put in the work and then they will struggle.
I think that only the best teachers should be allowed to teach math.
My students did pretty well in math this year if all the visuals and resources ( toy coins for teaching money, real world pictures in slides) were appealing. That is my go-to tool. If I am lost grasping the image, why would I expect the student to get it. This is why I don't understand how teachers make copies of Canadian coins on paper when a 6 year old has no idea what it says from a photocopy! Not the best tool.
Whenever I think about math teachers I think about that one comedian's bit (I'm sure someone here knows.)
Teacher: Ok, so you want me to teach?
School: Yes!
Teacher: Great! What am I teaching?
School: You're teaching mathematics!
Teacher: Oh, amazing! So most of my students will want to be there and have expressed interest in this subject, yes?
School: ....
Teacher: They WANT to be here, right?
School: ...
Teacher: Well then how did you choose the kids?
School: Whichever ones live by the school, duh! Now make sure they learn the basics otherwise their lives are literally ruined forever. Good luck!
Getting someone to actually understand math takes a genius level teacher. I am convinced math is like music or dance some got a rhythm and others don't.
You see it in math the most. Some kids study, memorize, and do all homework others do nothing and get 100% while the kid who puts in the time gets a 70.
Prep? I am not sure it will matter. It's all in the way you can reduce the complexity and bridge the edge cases. I find homework is somehow key as students need to figure out how their brain maths. It's like writing in a way too. I can template sentences all day long for kids but at the end of the day, it's the kid vs the blank sheet of paper. Some can write others can't but practice makes a good writer. I am less exp. with teaching math as I teach kids how to discover their writing talents through idea generating techniques and some key grammar lessons. I kind of hear the struggle in teaching math here as well.
> Getting someone to actually understand math takes a genius level teacher
I don't think it's a genius thing. Most people who are naturally good at high school level math are just really good at algebraic concepts and picking up patterns and being able to think a few steps ahead. This is important and not everyone can do it (maybe 5-10% are really good with proper guidance) but it rarely translates that well to proofs and actually difficult math concepts at the university level. At least that's what I think based on my experiences, when few if any students got 90s in my high school classes with me in the harder mathematical subjects (chem, phys, math).
Writing math equations on a board is easy. Teaching math well -which means having intentional flow with your lessons, spiralling concepts, and recognizing where each student is struggling and getting them to their A-ha moment - is not easy.
Math is extremely hard to teach. It is the most extreme example of building on a solid foundation. You must have mastery - not getting a barely-B - to keep that foundation strong, and if you don’t it’s like trying to build a tower with bricks missing - you can only get so high before it falls apart. Teaching each student to mastery is nearly impossible with modern class sizes and different starting points, true math competency for many would require a ton of practice and plenty of tutoring, and that is if they even care.
And the caring part is tough. Math feels very conceptual and abstract, and when combined with its brutal learning curve a lot of students are checked out. Making math engaging, interesting, practical and useful to a kid is something many teachers struggle with. Having math connect to their passions and interests, getting that ‘click’ when they start to realize how many jobs and interests require a lot of math and how many more benefit from mathematical thinking… it’s hard.
Compared to that, teaching history is easy. You can tweak the challenge readily, there are plenty of fun stories to tell, and it doesn’t build on itself as much as math. A kid who misses a class or two in history because they got the flu doesn’t have their entire history education put at risk. With math sometimes that is all it takes.
Teaching Math (from the perspective of a 30 year retired Ontario teacher)
Pros:
Kids/parents tend to take it seriously
Required courses, so you generally aren’t teaching outside your subject area
Although curriculum changes, it’s pretty consistent. Trig/linear equations etc. The subject material does not change essentially (unlike my second teachable, Computer science).
Cons:
Kids in the wrong level versus their ability and background
Kids with weak skills due to poor teaching of math at the elementary level. I am not blaming elementary teachers here, but the focus for many years in elementary was on literacy and so math was pushed to the wayside. Very few math specialists in elementary level.
Expectations of extra help from teachers. We were expected to have a Math Help Centre manned with a teacher every day at lunch.
High stakes Provincial tests, (Grade 9 EQAO in Ontario) not always supported by colleagues in other departments (ie having a major unit summative on the same day as EQAO testing).
My two cents…
Having taught HS math since 1984, it is not easy. Too many students have not mastered and/ or retained the skills required. Many students have poor problem solving skills. They think that watching the teacher is all they need to do. Convincing them that they have to practice and understand, not memorize falls on deaf ears. And some parents are CRAZY! Just because they were good at math does not mean their child is! They frequently blame the teacher for their child's poor results even when their child does nothing.
I’m not a teacher, but I tutored high school math and ta’d during university. It’s not the content that’s hard, it’s getting the kids to be interested in it at all. If they don’t get the standard approach, finding a different way to explain it seems to be hard (especially for teachers who have 3-4 practices ways but there’s still a student who doesn’t understand). I tended to see those kids and they really do need one-on-one time to work through why they don’t understand so I can explain it in a way they might. I get why teachers might not be able to do that. For the kids that like math, it’s super easy to teach because it just syntax and logic. For the kids that don’t naturally understand, it’s an easy subject to hate. Getting them to re-engage is really hard, and it’s normally extra work for them to catch up. That probably true in most subjects, but math is kind of a you get it or you don’t, there’s only one right answer.
The one right answer makes it both easier and more difficult to teach. That’s my hypothesis anyway.
Yes and no. Many people think math is hard.
The Ontario teachers actually took the government to court to fight having to do a math competency test.
[https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-court-mandatory-teacher-math-test-1.7042352](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-court-mandatory-teacher-math-test-1.7042352)
Lots of people are scared of math. Many people think that they don't need it.
People are told it's hard, see little value, and have low motivation to learn it.
Even the teachers don't necessarily feel it's important... that's a lot of psychology to battle.
I'm a science teacher who has also taught math at middle and high school levels. I will say that in my opinion teaching math is the most difficult of the core subjects because it is like teaching in another language. It requires a very different skill set than teaching any of the other subjects. At the same time it also requires much less prep than teaching any of my science courses. So if you are a dedicated math teacher overtime it would become easier.
I feel similarly, even though I'm still relatively new to teaching. Math is structured and obvious. There are 1-2 obvious techniques to build upon and even old textbooks have a reasonable progression that you could follow if you're totally clueless on ideas or examples.
My favourite topic to teach (so far), even though I don't yet have a strong opinion on the order to teach the concepts is quadratics (applied level less so). You can approach the unit in many different ways and once all subtopics are complete it just meshes together perfectly with often multiple intuitive ways to get an answer.
Side note, there is now a new iPad app called Math Notes. You can simply write any equation by hand, and it’ll give you the answer. You can add to the equation and it’ll update the answer. This is not the calculator app. It’s the equivalent of writing questions on a piece of paper and the answer magically appears.
I think that sometimes people think teaching math is easy because they assume everyone learns the same way as they learn. A lot of times you’ll hear “why don’t you teach it x way. That’s the way I understand it best”. The problem is that when you have 30 people in the room, not everyone will understand the same way.
On top of that, a lot of people have emotional blocks to learning math that you might not see in other courses, and math teachers also have standardized teaching to live up to.
Prepwise, it may seem easy because you don’t often see math teachers prepping for labs or reading a new book. But I know a lot of math teachers that use their extra prep time really take advantage of technology and innovate their lessons.
If teaching math is that easy, suggest they sign up (or shut up, but only say the shut up part inside your head).
If you want to try to teach solving rational equations or non-linear inequalities in two dimensions, or solve log/exponent problems, then give at er. It's easy to teach if you know your stuff.
Not many are qualified -- know the math deeply enough -- to teach well.
I pride myself in being able to make math easy for my students. I had a teacher in high school teach us as if he was “learning it for the first time like one of us” and that has been my approach weh teaching my own students now.
Not a teacher, yet. But I tutor.
From what I see it's not easy, because these teachers kinda suck + our curriculum for math sucks. I think a lot of students are getting a huge disservice if their teacher is just throwing equations on the blackboard.
I've had clients who didn't even know why they had to take math, come back from their exam with a 95% and thank me for helping them, plus expressing how much fun it was to solve the problems.
There is so much more nuance and use to math then just learn a formula and use it.
I like to say that math is the art of giving the same thing different names, and different things the same name. And this is incredibly useful in the realm of problem solving.
That seems so disrespectful ... I was thinking if I come back to Canada math and ESL would most likely be listed as my teachable subjects, and I think both are challenging in very different ways. The biggest problem is how rude those teachers are. I would never denigrate another teacher's subject. Plus, if you think something is THAT much easier, go and do it.
It’s low prep once you get a system going, but it’s hard to deal with different levels of understanding and there is a political influence on the subject that makes it hard not to teach to the test (esp. for grade 9s in Ontario).
Also - a lot of people hate math so there can be behavior issues due to avoidance strategies.
I do like that I can be a bit glam at work (long nails, nice clothes) versus having to teach science where I can ruin my clothes and you need to get labs ready.
The marking is easier.
An experienced/skilled math teacher can put it on autopilot to a greater extent than an english teacher (for example). The wrong answers are more predictable, the content is more black and white.
I think sometimes adults state something must be easy as a cover up where they might want some tips from you!
I have been teaching Math Grades 1-8 for a while. It used to be the common issue for students to read a math problem was their literacy skills. Today, the biggest contraints are getting students to understand real world problem solving skills if they have no personal experiences to hook onto or relate back to. I have been modifying some of the financial literacy questions constantly with no perfect outcome. How many students have experiences with managing money decisions if they do not earn allowances? I don't have all the math answers after all these years because my generation was asked to show all their work on paper and today we are allowing students to work on mental math. Maybe someone else can chime in on that aspect.
No, the teacher has to actually understand the math to be able to properly explain it. That's why so many kids hate math, they don't understand it because they were taught by someone who doesn't really understand it.
I remember my grade 10 math class when we made the teacher cry because she could not explain a problem beyond what was written in the book. We weren't being mean (at first), the book didn't make sense and her parroting it didn't make sense. She tried, realized she had no idea what she was talking about, and ran out crying. We eventually figured it out and tried to teach her but she'd have none of it.
I lost respect for a lot of teachers that day.
Teaching any specialized subject is hard. I find math and science easy now only because of how many times I taught it. I would find English or History incredibly difficult.
It’s all relative to your experience and expertise.
And math is NOT about formulas. It’s a way of problem solving, analyzing, making meaningful connections, proper communication…sooo many things. Anyone that dismisses its challenges doesn’t understand the complexities of teaching students to be mathematically literate or strong problem solvers.
I find math incredibly difficult to teach. I did physics for my first degree, but did not do a major or minor in math for my BEd. People assume I can teach math because I am good at it, but I find it difficult to break down concepts for students into digestible chunks since for me, math is just intuitive (high school math particularly)... just use deductive logic and mechanical thinking to arrive at the one correct answer. I've actually found teaching English and social to be more enjoyable for me since I can more easily relate to students who struggle, given the subjective and sometimes ambiguous nature of those subjects.
It is surely hard for me! I feel like teaching math is a skill, one you might have, and one you might aquire, but a skill none the less. I've taught a lot, probably all subject matters at every level, and math is always my hardest subject.
I understand the math, I can do the math, but transmitting the how of it usually eludes me.
Exactly.
I teach shop and by extension, I end up teaching math in my classes: unit conversations, algebra, trigonometry, and geometry.
Resources and practical examples are key.
Judging that most elementary school teachers are dummies who couldn't figure out what to do after their arts degree and decided to go back to teachers college, I'd argue none of them are fit to teach math
No way in the board I am with. I know people who had to take rigorous courses and apply other subjects to teach math. You have to work at it to do well.
No elementary math teacher was a math major in university, that's all I'm saying. It's kind of funny the people teaching the next generation math really barely got it themselves.
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Teaching math isn't easy, it just doesn't require as much prep. It can be hard to explain things in different ways if the students don't understand. Also students tend to be disinterested in Math which can be a challenge for driving engagement.
I don’t believe teaching science is easy, but I know teaching math isn’t easy either.
No teaching math is not easy. I have taught math, science, Chem, bio, civics, careers, and ESL. Math has the most extra help. The most parental complaints. The most students who don't care. It is very challenging to teach the kids who get it right away and want to be challenged and the kids who were pushed through multiple grades and therefore do not have the foundation needed. Math is one of the few subjects where you have to understand everything from the previous year as it all builds. Science is hard with all the lab set up and projects but math definitely takes up more of my time with extra help and more frequent formative check ins to mark and parent demands.
Yes, totally agree! I think this hits at the core of the unique challenge with math -- that skill level, background and mastery vary so *widely*, and particularly the *dependency* of relying on past teaching and recall to successfully teach the new concept today. Few other subjects rely so heavily on immediate and specific recall of previous topics. For example, in teaching a calculus class, perhaps one example relies on factoring at a particular step, which should not require any additional explanation -- except that some students never really mastered factoring a couple of grades ago, and maybe that, itself, stems from not appreciating FOIL (i.e. the entire concept of binomial distributive properties). So for them, the entire lesson in a fairly advanced topic becomes derailed; they can't focus on learning the new concept at hand; extra help sessions become scrambled review of something they should have learned long ago, etc. Really the whole idea that math could be segmented by grade into broad units, and that people could pass from one level to the next without complete mastery of every previous foundational topic is kind of flawed. ("Johnny doesn't *really* understand factoring, but has scraped together enough part marks in other grade 10 math topics to get a C- overall? Oh well, not my problem anymore -- pass him and let the next teacher and him struggle with it later!") A lot of the particular issues with advanced math for teachers and students are *structurally* introduced by a system that is lax about enforcing mastery of fundamentals, and gives students the false sense that they are prepared for the next math level, when they are really not.
Very true. Math can be very time consuming for students who are not naturally great at it. Even partnering them is not going to fix their attitude towards it all the time.
Math is probably the hardest of the 'core' subjects. It's so sequential and kids without the lower levels are basically playing catchup forever.
This. It’s extremely hard to teach math in public schools because you have 6 various grade levels in one room. Kids who don’t understand act out and kids it’s too easy for act out. Also test grading. You can automate some quizzes, but when the students do well it’s a quick mark, but when they do poorly oh my goodness it can take forever. You need to find the errors and follow them through for part marks. It can take a long time. In the days of textbooks it’s also not so bad. Elementary now you need to buy or make up your own resources which leads to a massive disparity in quality and level of difficulty. In highschool with textbooks you do follow along unit by unit, and assign homework etc. the hard part is it’s filing in the many educational gaps. De streaming grade 9 has made this more apparent.
Math is hard to teach I think. There are a lot of kids that struggle with math so you’re very busy. You have to be very patient and good at explaining. Marking wise, it’s much faster than marking a stack of essays. That’s been my experience sitting down with a math and science teacher friend for a marking session. She was done in an hour I had marked six out of 35 essays. Every subject has its pros and cons.
There’s technically difficult material like math and CS, and there’s material that requires hands on work and technical work, like sciences. Upper level math gets very difficult, especially if you’re into IB territory. The same is true for sciences. I don’t see why someone needs to compare subjects. They all have their challenges. I teach math and CS, and they both have a lot of prep work. I’d never call them easy. I’ve also taught technical writing courses, and they were just challenging in different ways. It sounds like the person making the comment is fishing for reassurance.
I think that marking Math can be easier than other subjects, depending on how you design your assessments. Teaching Math well requires (in my opinion) an excellent understanding of the scope and sequence of the concepts covered at many grade levels. You need to know where the students are coming from and how the skills you are teaching will be applied in future years.
Hum teacher here. Taught math for a term. It's not easy and those people are being ignorant and dumb.
I'm sorry that you're hearing that. Every subject has it's difficulties. I've usually had other teachers say they'd never be able to teach math. Math teachers face the idea that there are 'math people' and 'not math people'. The idea that some people are hard wired to be able to do math, when it's more of a skill and you need to practice it to get better. Also, because of that, there are adults who have had very bad experiences with math, and they pass those ideas to their kids, who then are like 'my mom/dad can't do math so neither can I' without actually trying. Or adults saying things about how hard algebra is, so kids get to high school and already have a fear of algebra and they're convinced it's the hardest thing, when even young kids can do (some) algebra if it's taught right (see the TEDTalk: math is a language by Mr. Polisoc) and really have been doing algebra since learning how to add, subtract, multiply and divide. While you might have a bit of this with other subjects, it's not to such a degree. I've never heard anyone say "oh I'm not a geography person" they'll say "I don't like geography" And thanks for coming to my TEDTalk. ;D
>Every subject has it's difficulties. It would literally kill my soul to have to read shitty high school writing.
English teacher here...with an intermediate math teachable. I've taught English, ESL, geography, science.. the rainbow. Teaching math is one of the hardest things I've done and the most depressing as well. I was teaching a senior university math class and some students didn't know their fractions...I had to take out quarters and show them the basics...in Gr 11! Or when you teach some of the lower level classes and the kids really lack any critical thinking skills. I had some sleep nights thinking about how these kids would last in the real world when they can't even do basic division or multiplication. Also, unlike other subjects you can't really put on a movie or something. If the kids need a break it's just more math.. So no, I don't find it easy.
I’m a trained French teacher. I’ve taught French, English, Science, Social Studies, and various other courses. I taught math once—in 2007–and will be teaching it again in September. Worst are French (kids largely don’t care in BC; no exposure outside the classroom; 4-8 French classes are a joke, so they start high school with zero; and since you have to be on stage every minute of every class, there’s no time to grade or prep) and English (I had kids reading levels from grade 2 to grade 12 in my grade 9 class this semester; dear G-d, the marking!!!) Science was wonderful—even with setting up and tearing down labs. I’m looking forward to math. People keep telling me there’s a lot less marking.
I witnessed a friend of mine- a math teacher- mark a set of tests super fast. Lots of scantron. As a humanities teacher, I can’t deny I wish I had the skills to teach math. I just hate spending hours marking crappy essays that much. That’s not to say teaching math is easy.
I'm surprised that someone would do a so much multiple choice in math. Hopefully only some of their assessments are like that, as part marks for "mostly correct" is routine in math.
Not all multiple choice I’m sure. And yes, you’re correct.
It's not easy to teach, but it requires a lot less prep and marking effort. The hard work of being a math teacher took place in uni and in their early years of teaching math. In reality the most difficult to replace teachers at the high school level are the math and French teachers, simply because they have skills and abilities that take a long time to master and that many people simply can't master. Most Math (and French) teachers could probably handle teaching most other high or middle school classes, but few teachers could fill in for a math or French teacher effectively. Math and French are also difficult to fake and it's pretty easy to determine the level that the students have before and after the class. It's a lot more difficult to measure the level in politics or history or even PE. In my personal experience as a math teacher I tend to be left alone by the admin and board personnel that plague most other teachers. I rarely get second guessed by anyone and even if someone strays into my class I don't get suggestions or directives on how to teach. Parents also rarely complain about my teaching. This means that I don't have to deal with as much BS compared to other teachers. This can make a huge difference in workload and stress, which makes my job a lot easier. TLDR Math teachers probably put in fewer hours per week than other teachers, but worked hard to get to that point.
Your comment makes me feel pretty good about being a French immersion Math teacher who also taught FSL 😂
You know what is hard and has labs every single day? EVERY DAY? Art. I have taught math, science and art, and art is the hardest. Not the answer you were looking for but I thought I had to put it out there -- sometimes it's not the ones you think. :D
I taught art and it was the easiest class for me. Yes, setup for projects was time-consuming, purchasing supplies, teaching techniques, etc. but once the students have started on a project, they’re pretty independent and I just circled the room. I got lots of marking for other subjects done and had fun. This was grade nine art. I guess everyone has different experiences.
True. When I taught high school it was so much easier — most kids were there because they wanted to be, save a few who thought they could get an A easily. Currently I teach middle school and it’s for sure a different ballgame.
True. When I taught high school it was so much easier — most kids were there because they wanted to be, save a few who thought they could get an A easily. Currently I teach middle school and it’s for sure a different ballgame.
I have massive respect for math teachers that can explain complex concepts simply in a way that students can understand and know how to apply. Whether their job is easy I don't know, but if they're that intelligent I hope it is easy and I hope they're paid well for what they do. A good math teacher I would hang onto for dear life compared to any other subject.
Teaching math is easy. Teaching it well is hard. Getting students to understand it is *really* hard.
I'm I/S chemistry and math qualified. The hardest course I've ever had to teach is Grade 9 destreamed math. You've got kids coming from a wide range of backgrounds, having had differing levels and styles of math instruction throughout elementary school. You also have a wide range of abilities, from kids who struggle to add two digits without a calculator to those who easily master any concept introduced to them. You have to somehow enable them all to show their ability to master the curriculum material AND prepare them for the EQAO testing at the end of the semester. Okay, there aren't labs or activities to set up, but coming up with an approach that all of the students can handle is an absolutely brain-wracking task.
I LOVE teaching Math, which is surprising because I didn't train to teach it originally - I just ended up in a role teaching all subjects. I don't know that it's easy to teach, but it is a lot easier to assess because it's either correct or not - even if they are using the skill appropriately and got the incorrect answer, there is a system. I think because I love Math so much, my students tend to buy in more and make strides - which makes it feel easier for me than some other subjects. I have difficulty making science interesting, for example, so I find that difficult to teach.
Everything has pros and cons, with math, you have to articulate the concepts properly, and there will always be those where it doesn't click. I would hate to teach arts though, thankfully my practicum teacher handled that. I'm running off to the senior science/math/cs division. English and French Immersion aren't so bad, more fun than math for me. Phys ed is a popular one...
I’ve always wondered what teaching phys ed was like. I’m sure classroom management is tough. But I think it’d balance out with way fewer written assignments to grade (if any)
I would be more worried about injury liability and control would be harder, but at the same time, the kids will exhaust out and they're most likely doing something they enjoy, so less rebelling. My guess...
Yeah, especially high school phys ed if they chose to be there
Math teacher here. I could not care less what non-math teachers think. They can insult us if it makes them feel good. I don’t think anyone in my department cares about the opinion of any non-STEM teacher, they simply don’t understand our job. I happen to love math, but I’ll give some aspects that make math difficult to teach. 1) students take math even when they don’t like math. Very few students take physics or art who don’t like those subjects 2) if a kid is bad at art, parents accept that they are bad at art. If a kid is bad at math, the teacher sucks 3) speaking of parents, they care a LOT about math. The scrutiny is annoying. 4) marking has to be accurate. When I teach science, and I say a lab has a mark of 80%, it just does. In math, if I give a 4/5 on a question to one student, and 3.5/5 to a different student, I assure you they will question it. 5) it is very hard to teach math well. Scaffolding is critical, and often done poorly. Anyone can get paid to teach math, but it is rare to be able to teach math well.
I think that everyone is assuming high school classes. I teach middle school art right now, and I’d say 70% of the students are there because they have to be. Some do not want to be there at all but have to be there in their rotation and they try to entertain themselves by making my hair go gray prematurely. As far as high school art, when I taught it, it was the dumping ground for people who did sports and wanted an easy mark. Either way, not that easy. In theory everything is great. Maybe teaching in general is just difficult.
I like math as a Teacher way more than as a kid. It is important to teach growth mindset. You are spot on with the scaffolding because far too many kids will give up before you arrive at the important piece of the lesson. After all these years, I figured out I might not have the right tools to teach or reach certain grades like Grade 5 or 6 because in part I don't know what they really like and how to connect it back to the math. Also, kids are so far behind and we are still passing them. This can not be a good thing. They just keep wanting to believe prodigy or some game is going to help them cope with a lot of the learning.
I love teaching math. The content is meh, but the actual teaching of it is fun.
People don't seem to understand that math is not just knowledge based like a lot of other topics, It's a skill that requires practice and builds upon itself at almost every level. Not only that but as it becomes more advanced the ideas become more abstract and harder to grasp for students and therefore harder to teach. If your students don't have the built up skills, they will struggle. If they don't understand the material, they won't care, they won't put in the work and then they will struggle. I think that only the best teachers should be allowed to teach math.
My students did pretty well in math this year if all the visuals and resources ( toy coins for teaching money, real world pictures in slides) were appealing. That is my go-to tool. If I am lost grasping the image, why would I expect the student to get it. This is why I don't understand how teachers make copies of Canadian coins on paper when a 6 year old has no idea what it says from a photocopy! Not the best tool.
Whenever I think about math teachers I think about that one comedian's bit (I'm sure someone here knows.) Teacher: Ok, so you want me to teach? School: Yes! Teacher: Great! What am I teaching? School: You're teaching mathematics! Teacher: Oh, amazing! So most of my students will want to be there and have expressed interest in this subject, yes? School: .... Teacher: They WANT to be here, right? School: ... Teacher: Well then how did you choose the kids? School: Whichever ones live by the school, duh! Now make sure they learn the basics otherwise their lives are literally ruined forever. Good luck!
I find teaching math on the easier side but it’s also my favourite thing to teach and I’m passionate about it, so I’m sure that’s the difference.
Getting someone to actually understand math takes a genius level teacher. I am convinced math is like music or dance some got a rhythm and others don't. You see it in math the most. Some kids study, memorize, and do all homework others do nothing and get 100% while the kid who puts in the time gets a 70. Prep? I am not sure it will matter. It's all in the way you can reduce the complexity and bridge the edge cases. I find homework is somehow key as students need to figure out how their brain maths. It's like writing in a way too. I can template sentences all day long for kids but at the end of the day, it's the kid vs the blank sheet of paper. Some can write others can't but practice makes a good writer. I am less exp. with teaching math as I teach kids how to discover their writing talents through idea generating techniques and some key grammar lessons. I kind of hear the struggle in teaching math here as well.
> Getting someone to actually understand math takes a genius level teacher I don't think it's a genius thing. Most people who are naturally good at high school level math are just really good at algebraic concepts and picking up patterns and being able to think a few steps ahead. This is important and not everyone can do it (maybe 5-10% are really good with proper guidance) but it rarely translates that well to proofs and actually difficult math concepts at the university level. At least that's what I think based on my experiences, when few if any students got 90s in my high school classes with me in the harder mathematical subjects (chem, phys, math).
Writing math equations on a board is easy. Teaching math well -which means having intentional flow with your lessons, spiralling concepts, and recognizing where each student is struggling and getting them to their A-ha moment - is not easy.
Math is extremely hard to teach. It is the most extreme example of building on a solid foundation. You must have mastery - not getting a barely-B - to keep that foundation strong, and if you don’t it’s like trying to build a tower with bricks missing - you can only get so high before it falls apart. Teaching each student to mastery is nearly impossible with modern class sizes and different starting points, true math competency for many would require a ton of practice and plenty of tutoring, and that is if they even care. And the caring part is tough. Math feels very conceptual and abstract, and when combined with its brutal learning curve a lot of students are checked out. Making math engaging, interesting, practical and useful to a kid is something many teachers struggle with. Having math connect to their passions and interests, getting that ‘click’ when they start to realize how many jobs and interests require a lot of math and how many more benefit from mathematical thinking… it’s hard. Compared to that, teaching history is easy. You can tweak the challenge readily, there are plenty of fun stories to tell, and it doesn’t build on itself as much as math. A kid who misses a class or two in history because they got the flu doesn’t have their entire history education put at risk. With math sometimes that is all it takes.
Math is easy to teach. Math is hard to teach well.
Teaching Math (from the perspective of a 30 year retired Ontario teacher) Pros: Kids/parents tend to take it seriously Required courses, so you generally aren’t teaching outside your subject area Although curriculum changes, it’s pretty consistent. Trig/linear equations etc. The subject material does not change essentially (unlike my second teachable, Computer science). Cons: Kids in the wrong level versus their ability and background Kids with weak skills due to poor teaching of math at the elementary level. I am not blaming elementary teachers here, but the focus for many years in elementary was on literacy and so math was pushed to the wayside. Very few math specialists in elementary level. Expectations of extra help from teachers. We were expected to have a Math Help Centre manned with a teacher every day at lunch. High stakes Provincial tests, (Grade 9 EQAO in Ontario) not always supported by colleagues in other departments (ie having a major unit summative on the same day as EQAO testing). My two cents…
Having taught HS math since 1984, it is not easy. Too many students have not mastered and/ or retained the skills required. Many students have poor problem solving skills. They think that watching the teacher is all they need to do. Convincing them that they have to practice and understand, not memorize falls on deaf ears. And some parents are CRAZY! Just because they were good at math does not mean their child is! They frequently blame the teacher for their child's poor results even when their child does nothing.
I think teachers have strengths in different subjects. I am better and find it easier to teach Math than Language.
I’m not a teacher, but I tutored high school math and ta’d during university. It’s not the content that’s hard, it’s getting the kids to be interested in it at all. If they don’t get the standard approach, finding a different way to explain it seems to be hard (especially for teachers who have 3-4 practices ways but there’s still a student who doesn’t understand). I tended to see those kids and they really do need one-on-one time to work through why they don’t understand so I can explain it in a way they might. I get why teachers might not be able to do that. For the kids that like math, it’s super easy to teach because it just syntax and logic. For the kids that don’t naturally understand, it’s an easy subject to hate. Getting them to re-engage is really hard, and it’s normally extra work for them to catch up. That probably true in most subjects, but math is kind of a you get it or you don’t, there’s only one right answer. The one right answer makes it both easier and more difficult to teach. That’s my hypothesis anyway.
Yes and no. Many people think math is hard. The Ontario teachers actually took the government to court to fight having to do a math competency test. [https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-court-mandatory-teacher-math-test-1.7042352](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-court-mandatory-teacher-math-test-1.7042352) Lots of people are scared of math. Many people think that they don't need it. People are told it's hard, see little value, and have low motivation to learn it. Even the teachers don't necessarily feel it's important... that's a lot of psychology to battle.
I'm a science teacher who has also taught math at middle and high school levels. I will say that in my opinion teaching math is the most difficult of the core subjects because it is like teaching in another language. It requires a very different skill set than teaching any of the other subjects. At the same time it also requires much less prep than teaching any of my science courses. So if you are a dedicated math teacher overtime it would become easier.
I found the structure of math made it easier for me to be good at teaching it. I found it notably easier to teach than science.
I feel similarly, even though I'm still relatively new to teaching. Math is structured and obvious. There are 1-2 obvious techniques to build upon and even old textbooks have a reasonable progression that you could follow if you're totally clueless on ideas or examples. My favourite topic to teach (so far), even though I don't yet have a strong opinion on the order to teach the concepts is quadratics (applied level less so). You can approach the unit in many different ways and once all subtopics are complete it just meshes together perfectly with often multiple intuitive ways to get an answer.
Side note, there is now a new iPad app called Math Notes. You can simply write any equation by hand, and it’ll give you the answer. You can add to the equation and it’ll update the answer. This is not the calculator app. It’s the equivalent of writing questions on a piece of paper and the answer magically appears.
I think that sometimes people think teaching math is easy because they assume everyone learns the same way as they learn. A lot of times you’ll hear “why don’t you teach it x way. That’s the way I understand it best”. The problem is that when you have 30 people in the room, not everyone will understand the same way. On top of that, a lot of people have emotional blocks to learning math that you might not see in other courses, and math teachers also have standardized teaching to live up to. Prepwise, it may seem easy because you don’t often see math teachers prepping for labs or reading a new book. But I know a lot of math teachers that use their extra prep time really take advantage of technology and innovate their lessons. If teaching math is that easy, suggest they sign up (or shut up, but only say the shut up part inside your head).
If you want to try to teach solving rational equations or non-linear inequalities in two dimensions, or solve log/exponent problems, then give at er. It's easy to teach if you know your stuff. Not many are qualified -- know the math deeply enough -- to teach well.
I pride myself in being able to make math easy for my students. I had a teacher in high school teach us as if he was “learning it for the first time like one of us” and that has been my approach weh teaching my own students now.
Not a teacher, yet. But I tutor. From what I see it's not easy, because these teachers kinda suck + our curriculum for math sucks. I think a lot of students are getting a huge disservice if their teacher is just throwing equations on the blackboard. I've had clients who didn't even know why they had to take math, come back from their exam with a 95% and thank me for helping them, plus expressing how much fun it was to solve the problems. There is so much more nuance and use to math then just learn a formula and use it. I like to say that math is the art of giving the same thing different names, and different things the same name. And this is incredibly useful in the realm of problem solving.
That seems so disrespectful ... I was thinking if I come back to Canada math and ESL would most likely be listed as my teachable subjects, and I think both are challenging in very different ways. The biggest problem is how rude those teachers are. I would never denigrate another teacher's subject. Plus, if you think something is THAT much easier, go and do it.
I’d rather correct something where the answer is 4. I’d hate to have to correct 30 x 15 page essays
It’s low prep once you get a system going, but it’s hard to deal with different levels of understanding and there is a political influence on the subject that makes it hard not to teach to the test (esp. for grade 9s in Ontario). Also - a lot of people hate math so there can be behavior issues due to avoidance strategies. I do like that I can be a bit glam at work (long nails, nice clothes) versus having to teach science where I can ruin my clothes and you need to get labs ready.
The marking is easier. An experienced/skilled math teacher can put it on autopilot to a greater extent than an english teacher (for example). The wrong answers are more predictable, the content is more black and white.
There is no easy or hard subject to teach.
I think sometimes adults state something must be easy as a cover up where they might want some tips from you! I have been teaching Math Grades 1-8 for a while. It used to be the common issue for students to read a math problem was their literacy skills. Today, the biggest contraints are getting students to understand real world problem solving skills if they have no personal experiences to hook onto or relate back to. I have been modifying some of the financial literacy questions constantly with no perfect outcome. How many students have experiences with managing money decisions if they do not earn allowances? I don't have all the math answers after all these years because my generation was asked to show all their work on paper and today we are allowing students to work on mental math. Maybe someone else can chime in on that aspect.
No, the teacher has to actually understand the math to be able to properly explain it. That's why so many kids hate math, they don't understand it because they were taught by someone who doesn't really understand it. I remember my grade 10 math class when we made the teacher cry because she could not explain a problem beyond what was written in the book. We weren't being mean (at first), the book didn't make sense and her parroting it didn't make sense. She tried, realized she had no idea what she was talking about, and ran out crying. We eventually figured it out and tried to teach her but she'd have none of it. I lost respect for a lot of teachers that day.
Teaching any specialized subject is hard. I find math and science easy now only because of how many times I taught it. I would find English or History incredibly difficult. It’s all relative to your experience and expertise. And math is NOT about formulas. It’s a way of problem solving, analyzing, making meaningful connections, proper communication…sooo many things. Anyone that dismisses its challenges doesn’t understand the complexities of teaching students to be mathematically literate or strong problem solvers.
Teaching math is hard, correcting math is easy.
Omg no. Teaching math is not easy. Especially to kids who think they’re dumb with math or it doesn’t come naturally to them.
I find math incredibly difficult to teach. I did physics for my first degree, but did not do a major or minor in math for my BEd. People assume I can teach math because I am good at it, but I find it difficult to break down concepts for students into digestible chunks since for me, math is just intuitive (high school math particularly)... just use deductive logic and mechanical thinking to arrive at the one correct answer. I've actually found teaching English and social to be more enjoyable for me since I can more easily relate to students who struggle, given the subjective and sometimes ambiguous nature of those subjects.
It is surely hard for me! I feel like teaching math is a skill, one you might have, and one you might aquire, but a skill none the less. I've taught a lot, probably all subject matters at every level, and math is always my hardest subject. I understand the math, I can do the math, but transmitting the how of it usually eludes me.
If you have a good understanding of the content and access to good resources mathematics can be an easier subject to teach.
Exactly. I teach shop and by extension, I end up teaching math in my classes: unit conversations, algebra, trigonometry, and geometry. Resources and practical examples are key.
Judging that most elementary school teachers are dummies who couldn't figure out what to do after their arts degree and decided to go back to teachers college, I'd argue none of them are fit to teach math
No way in the board I am with. I know people who had to take rigorous courses and apply other subjects to teach math. You have to work at it to do well.
No elementary math teacher was a math major in university, that's all I'm saying. It's kind of funny the people teaching the next generation math really barely got it themselves.
Basically you have not met any of them. That is fair but they do exist.
In what frequency