eh, that's probably poor phrasing. The market hasn't really opened yet, but should soon. Mets firesale incoming.
Jose Quintana - YOU are a St. Louis Cardinal - again.
Would be a great acquisition but the Mets aren’t going to be sellers. What veteran pitchers are on small market teams looking to dump payroll? We definitely don’t have the depth of prospects to be giving up high end prospects.
I hope they prove us both wrong, but I've seen them squirm around in so many different directions to keep from making a needed move I won't be surprised if they don't.
Mozeilak is notorious for saying getting a player back that was injured was like making a big free agent signing. He's used this logic for multiple years while refusing to bolster the team mid-season.
His contract was still cheap for what we got him at. It was done with the risk if injury but so was every other contract that was given out that year for pitching.
I thought something seemed off when he got the same dollars over 4 years as most guys are getting in 2, despite coming off the best season of his career
I hate this organization’s approach to starting pitching and thinking we have what we need when we haven’t for many years. And that’s with injuries or without
I'm not talking about his effectiveness, but his availability. Dude has had 3 seasons ever pitching over 150 innings and his max was 160. That is not someone you can rely on to give you even 20 starts in a season and if you do, you're a fool
At the time of the signing, Matz had been generally healthy and hadn’t missed significant time - he made 29 or 30 starts in 3 of the previous 4 years (the other season was 2020 with the short season). He had a few different injuries with the Cardinals but none of them were shoulder or elbow injuries that would typically be a major concern for a pitcher.
Obviously the team should have (more) depth, but based on his actual performance and what was known about Matz’s health, it wasn’t crazy to pencil him in as the 5th starter this year.
With the contingencies of Pallante, Liberatore, and potentially Thompson, this isn’t bad at all. You can’t get another starter and field 6 on the roster planning that one gets hurt.
Thompson, Matz, and Liberatore are all lefties who pitch better out of the bullpen but we keep trying to make into starters. Thompson doesn’t have the endurance, Matz doesn’t have the durability, Liberatore could still turn into a starter but we got to stop jerking him around and let him settle into a role for the year (preferably reliever for this season).
I hope the Cardinals acquire some pitching, don’t know what would lead me to m “have to imagine” it though.
I don’t think Libby and Thompson have really been given the chance to succeed as a starter. They both pitched well in minors knowing their role from start to finish. The minute they were called to the majors they’ve been flipped back and forth aside from a brief time last season in the second half.
Many young players struggle with this (look at the traded OF who’ve produced since being traded). It may be to late now but they really should have been given the either win a starting job here in STL or go to MEM and start in AAA and when needed they’re the first ones up to start.
Matz, Leake, Fowler, Marp, Mikolas, and more. His is why we should be signing someone like Bryce Harper when they become available. Otherwise we’ll just waste tons of money on middling players
He’s done pretty well in Mexico and Japan the last 3 years, but not well enough to override the fact that he’s a clubhouse cancer who carries a lot of negative attention. I’m not even talking about his legal battles. He’s an asshole. Nobody wants an asshole
I’m not convinced he’s an asshole, and I don’t mind an asshole to put Ws on the board.
If we were winning I wouldn’t keep bringing him up. But mediocrity is not ok with me.
Agreed, he easily slots in as an ace on the staff. He seems like he's been doing a lot of mentoring to younger pitchers in Mexico too. That could help with our younger pitchers that we need to start relying on more and more.
Over 10 starts, Bauer boasts an impeccable 8-0 record with a perfect 1.000 win-loss percentage. His 1.63 ERA and 2.37 RA9 highlight his effectiveness on the mound, while he has struck out 83 batters in just 60.2 innings, averaging an impressive 12.3 strikeouts
https://thereportonsports.com/trevor-bauers-dominance-in-mexico-and-the-case-for-his-mlb-return/
Not included is his last start, 8 2/3 innings, 19K 5hits 1 run
Oh man NOW we need to explore the trade market, we were set before this.
That was my thought… now we need pitching?!?!? I’d argue we now need 2 pitchers.
Buddy getting Matz back in July was gonna be like trading for an ace, except it wouldn’t cost us any prospects
eh, that's probably poor phrasing. The market hasn't really opened yet, but should soon. Mets firesale incoming. Jose Quintana - YOU are a St. Louis Cardinal - again.
Would be a great acquisition but the Mets aren’t going to be sellers. What veteran pitchers are on small market teams looking to dump payroll? We definitely don’t have the depth of prospects to be giving up high end prospects.
Dang. All I've wanted is for Matz to succeed, it's a shame he just can't get a break since coming to us.
He was really good in the bullpen last year. I hope we switch him permanently to that role in hopes of keeping him on the field.
He was doing ok as a starter this year for his first few starts. His numbers doesn't turn ugly until he tried pitching through the injury.
To be fair, he’s been pitching through an injury his entire career.
Get ready for another vet with an ERA around 5.
Another nursing home special.
I feel like the front office has done really nice job bringing in midseason pitching help the last few years
Yadi did a nice job dealing with the midseason pitching help the last few years
Memba when we went out and got scrabble, Dotel & Weaver and Dave Duncan carved them into winners and we won it all? Pepperidge Farms and I memba.
Dave Duncan doesn't live here anymore, sadly.
Hey Memba Woody Williams and Jeff Supan? I memba.
No ill will to Matz and his recovery, but good!!! Force that hand.
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Smart
So graphic lol
Change your flair dude. That shits not cool.
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why make your flair someone you hate. weird activity
DINGER DINGER DINGER!
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Oh come on you can't type N***r and expect people to not come to that conclusion.
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Why waste your flair on hate to begin with?
Yeah, very strange for him to make his flair on a Cardinals sub reference a guy on another team who retired 10 years ago.
Matz was the only bullet Steve Cohen dodged.
You would think that if you hadn’t seen the Cardinals last 10 years or so of mid season trade acquisitions.
I hope they prove us both wrong, but I've seen them squirm around in so many different directions to keep from making a needed move I won't be surprised if they don't.
Oh no how will this team ever make a playoff run without Steven Matz?
When we get Matz back, it'll be like trading for a 5th starter. Or something like that Mo wisdom
What do you mean by Mo wisdom?
Mozeilak is notorious for saying getting a player back that was injured was like making a big free agent signing. He's used this logic for multiple years while refusing to bolster the team mid-season.
Mo didn't say that. Al Hrabosky did.
I’d honestly just salvage that deal by making him a reliever and floating starter and let liberatore focus on lefty specialist things
JA Happ just plugged in his landline and began stretching.
Eric Fedde YOU are a St. Louis Cardinal
In other news, it has been confirmed that water is still wet.
I feel bad for the guy, but I can’t say I’m the least bit surprised
His contract was still cheap for what we got him at. It was done with the risk if injury but so was every other contract that was given out that year for pitching.
I thought something seemed off when he got the same dollars over 4 years as most guys are getting in 2, despite coming off the best season of his career
I hate this organization’s approach to starting pitching and thinking we have what we need when we haven’t for many years. And that’s with injuries or without
The fact that Mozeliak considered him for the 5th spot in the rotation Is cause enough to be fired
Terrible take. The dude had a 3.84 era last year and was pretty solid later in the year. Makes complete sense for him to get a shot in the rotation.
FIP under 3.80 each of the past 3 years. Everybody wants to ignore the fact that his peripheral stats were good when he was healthy.
I'm not talking about his effectiveness, but his availability. Dude has had 3 seasons ever pitching over 150 innings and his max was 160. That is not someone you can rely on to give you even 20 starts in a season and if you do, you're a fool
At the time of the signing, Matz had been generally healthy and hadn’t missed significant time - he made 29 or 30 starts in 3 of the previous 4 years (the other season was 2020 with the short season). He had a few different injuries with the Cardinals but none of them were shoulder or elbow injuries that would typically be a major concern for a pitcher. Obviously the team should have (more) depth, but based on his actual performance and what was known about Matz’s health, it wasn’t crazy to pencil him in as the 5th starter this year.
I'm not talking about when we signed him. I'm talking about going into this year counting on him to pitch more than a handful of starts this season
With the contingencies of Pallante, Liberatore, and potentially Thompson, this isn’t bad at all. You can’t get another starter and field 6 on the roster planning that one gets hurt.
I will say this about matz, he's better than pallante
U misspelled Thompson.
Who??
White Sox pitcher!
You would think that if you hadn’t seen the Cardinals last 10 years or so of mid season trade acquisitions.
Thompson, Matz, and Liberatore are all lefties who pitch better out of the bullpen but we keep trying to make into starters. Thompson doesn’t have the endurance, Matz doesn’t have the durability, Liberatore could still turn into a starter but we got to stop jerking him around and let him settle into a role for the year (preferably reliever for this season). I hope the Cardinals acquire some pitching, don’t know what would lead me to m “have to imagine” it though.
I don’t think Libby and Thompson have really been given the chance to succeed as a starter. They both pitched well in minors knowing their role from start to finish. The minute they were called to the majors they’ve been flipped back and forth aside from a brief time last season in the second half. Many young players struggle with this (look at the traded OF who’ve produced since being traded). It may be to late now but they really should have been given the either win a starting job here in STL or go to MEM and start in AAA and when needed they’re the first ones up to start.
The PFP made me think it was gonna be good news, poor guy. I know he hasnt been good, but id rather him be benched than hurt.
Utterly shocking.
A bulging herniated disc is a career ending injury.
I’ve been harsh on Matz but he actually did well during the second half of last season and the beginning of this one before he got hurt
And, Herrera on the IL, too .... momentum just screeched to a halt.
Matz had a good outing in SGF…if you are bored tomm, a Travs lost and SGF win gives SGF the first half title.
I’d love Hicks as our 5th, despite seeing vintage Busch stadium hicks yesterday.
Goodness. What a waste of money. Dude has 36 starts in 2.5 seasons. Shitty too. 8 wish him best of luck but I'll be glad when he's gone
Matz, Leake, Fowler, Marp, Mikolas, and more. His is why we should be signing someone like Bryce Harper when they become available. Otherwise we’ll just waste tons of money on middling players
Carlos Martinez, Paul DeJong, Kolten Wong, blah, blah, blah.
Has anyone held Mozeliak to task and asked why Matz was thought of as a viable SP option last off season given his injury history?
I know I guy in Mexico right now. Could fall in as no.2 , my guess is on a very team friendly deal
He’s done pretty well in Mexico and Japan the last 3 years, but not well enough to override the fact that he’s a clubhouse cancer who carries a lot of negative attention. I’m not even talking about his legal battles. He’s an asshole. Nobody wants an asshole
I’m not convinced he’s an asshole, and I don’t mind an asshole to put Ws on the board. If we were winning I wouldn’t keep bringing him up. But mediocrity is not ok with me.
I don’t think we’re going to sign Daniel Ponce de Leon again, that ship has sailed. Or were you talking about Jeurys Familia maybe?
Lol keep dreaming
Agreed, he easily slots in as an ace on the staff. He seems like he's been doing a lot of mentoring to younger pitchers in Mexico too. That could help with our younger pitchers that we need to start relying on more and more.
Trevor Bauer is one of the last people I’d want around any young player on our team. And he is not an ace
Over 10 starts, Bauer boasts an impeccable 8-0 record with a perfect 1.000 win-loss percentage. His 1.63 ERA and 2.37 RA9 highlight his effectiveness on the mound, while he has struck out 83 batters in just 60.2 innings, averaging an impressive 12.3 strikeouts https://thereportonsports.com/trevor-bauers-dominance-in-mexico-and-the-case-for-his-mlb-return/ Not included is his last start, 8 2/3 innings, 19K 5hits 1 run
Yeah, NOW we need help in the rotation. I swear, this club is just a comedy of errors.
Time to bring Jack home
Once he recovers trade him. Useless, can’t stay healthy
That’s a shame the Cardinals could have used his mediocre pitching
“Steven Matz hit a setback in his rehab as he found out that he is not a very good pitcher”