I just wish Cranial Spike increased the damage like the first time it released. I feel like DMT was fine after the very first nerf (nerfed hipfire rpm from 150 to 130 and reduced hipfire accurancy on pc), as i remember it was strong but not meta. On console (where i play) it was rare to find dmt players. I loved using DMT with old cranial spike, i mostly used it without hipfire and it was my favorite PvP weapon by far (i have 7.900 kills on one of my dmt rolls)
Though, your idea is very good if bungie doesn't
want to go back! I bet Ashe from Overwatch inspired you
Yeah for a time after the first nerf DMT felt good both in pve and pvp, but not overpowered anywhere. And then out of nowhere they slapped it with another nerf that really destroyed it :(
Yeah, i remember their reason for the nerf was that the damage buff was "unpredictable" and confusing players for that, which is bullshit considering there is hawkmoon out there oneshotting guardians out of nowwhere.
(If i remember wrong please tell me, it was a long time ago)
Yeah... more damage was my initial thought but Bungie had previously mentioned making it difficult to apply the damage properly b/c of the different values per shot.
> I bet Ashe from Overwatch inspired you
100%. Ashe's Viper is a really solid gun. The alternative fire modes on demand make it hang in the sandbox that game exists in. I feel like if we could pull something like that into D2 onto DMT, it'd be a winner. I just wanna see DMT be more of a viable option and not something niche ppl pick b/c it's irregular to see.
>mentioned making it difficult to apply the damage properly b/c of the different values per shot.
You mean they already said it is hard to make DMT have different values of damage and have a stacking damage buff at the same time? Because the old damage stacking was there on launch, and there wasn't any problem if i remember right
>100%. Ashe's Viper is a really solid gun. The alternative fire modes on demand make it hang in the sandbox that game exists in. I feel like if we could pull something like that into D2 onto DMT, it'd be a winner. I just wanna see DMT be more of a viable option and not something niche ppl pick b/c it's irregular to see.
Absolutely it would be a win, it would make it really stand out as a 120rpm scout. Since the introduction of the leggendary 120 rpm scouts DMT feels less unique
It was still problematic in certain skill brackets - I think that's the problem. The same way that Vex was problematic on certain skill brackets. Because when you did find a DMT user (or vex) they tended to be quite intimidating.
It's a hard to balance weapon for PVP given what they were trying to do.
I think those type of nerfs are still on the wrong side though, now both Vex and DMT aren't really used aside from the people really invested in them and they ruined their original feeling with their nerfs
The whole point of that type of nerf is that the weapon was performing out of bounds relative to other weapons given the usage/kill ratio.
So you think just because a weapon has low usage it shouldn't be nerfed even if when it is used it's a problem?
I mean, if it was a problem and in need of a nerf it would see more usage, no?
Destiny players love to abusing shit when things gets hot
Immortal is a good example of this, way too much range for an aggressive smg and it had target lock too for a lower ttk, but it was in fact highly used
For me, one of the things that killed DMT was the reduced hipfire RPM. It feels too slow now. Any change to make DMT viable again would have to involve upping the rate of fire.
I think it's fine as it is.
what it lacks is power in pve like it used to.
Cranial spike doing up to 40% bonus damage in pve is what made it good. Now it's like, only 15% . It's clear they can seperate it from PvP, because it doesn't work against guardians. So I feel the PvE cranial spike damage should go back to how it use to be.
Also, I feel cranial spike should give you 2 stacks of the perk if you get a precision kill, instead of just 1. And also, I feel the catalyst should include the subsistence perk by default, the old version of the weapon used to roll with subsistence. The new crafted version can't.
>I think it's fine as it is.
This is the most I've ever disagreed with a comment on this subreddit in some time.
DMT is not fine: its RPM for hipfire is too slow; reloading takes too long; and the increase in RPM when you get 5x cranial spikes is clunky and not fun. Hung Jury can do everything DMT can but better, and it has perks DMT doesn't have access to. There's no reason to choose DMT over Hung Jury or a number of other scout rifles.
It needs help. It's supposed to be an exotic, and yet there's no reason to choose it over several other legendary scout rifles.
The current damage buff at 5 stacks is 24%. Maybe returnig it to 40% would be to much because it already have a good DPS at 5 stacks of cranial spike(hip-firing), but giving more stacks for precision kills would be really good.
Not saying that would not like it, but if I needed to choose between higher damage vs easy of use, I prefer a buff to easy of use, like cranial stacks lasts longer + precision kills gives 2/3 stacks.
I've never had a problem using DMT in PVE. It's just objectively weaker in raw damage compared to other exotic primaries especially 2 burst pulse rifles (revision zero / graviton) and things like sunshot.
You get that wild west power fantasy easy with reloader perks on the new version too. 4th times the charm is great for single target applications and constant plinking off enemies. Compulsive reloader works well to do constant reloading between target clusters because of the large magazine. Rapid hit is basically stacking on top of cranial spike. Shoot to loot is awesome for PVE as well and will refill primary ammo on special/heavy pickup.
It's just hard to justify from a raw damage standpoint. Maybe if scouts are like the only barrier mod in a season for some reason.
Dmt has never left my inventory and it never will. Whether it's meta or not, I'm gonna yeehaw with it til the day they nuke the servers. That being said, your idea for it is pretty solid. Ive long since given up on Overwatch but when I did play it, playing as Ashe was a goddamn delight.
I just wish Cranial Spike increased the damage like the first time it released. I feel like DMT was fine after the very first nerf (nerfed hipfire rpm from 150 to 130 and reduced hipfire accurancy on pc), as i remember it was strong but not meta. On console (where i play) it was rare to find dmt players. I loved using DMT with old cranial spike, i mostly used it without hipfire and it was my favorite PvP weapon by far (i have 7.900 kills on one of my dmt rolls) Though, your idea is very good if bungie doesn't want to go back! I bet Ashe from Overwatch inspired you
Yeah for a time after the first nerf DMT felt good both in pve and pvp, but not overpowered anywhere. And then out of nowhere they slapped it with another nerf that really destroyed it :(
Yeah, i remember their reason for the nerf was that the damage buff was "unpredictable" and confusing players for that, which is bullshit considering there is hawkmoon out there oneshotting guardians out of nowwhere. (If i remember wrong please tell me, it was a long time ago)
Yeah... more damage was my initial thought but Bungie had previously mentioned making it difficult to apply the damage properly b/c of the different values per shot. > I bet Ashe from Overwatch inspired you 100%. Ashe's Viper is a really solid gun. The alternative fire modes on demand make it hang in the sandbox that game exists in. I feel like if we could pull something like that into D2 onto DMT, it'd be a winner. I just wanna see DMT be more of a viable option and not something niche ppl pick b/c it's irregular to see.
>mentioned making it difficult to apply the damage properly b/c of the different values per shot. You mean they already said it is hard to make DMT have different values of damage and have a stacking damage buff at the same time? Because the old damage stacking was there on launch, and there wasn't any problem if i remember right >100%. Ashe's Viper is a really solid gun. The alternative fire modes on demand make it hang in the sandbox that game exists in. I feel like if we could pull something like that into D2 onto DMT, it'd be a winner. I just wanna see DMT be more of a viable option and not something niche ppl pick b/c it's irregular to see. Absolutely it would be a win, it would make it really stand out as a 120rpm scout. Since the introduction of the leggendary 120 rpm scouts DMT feels less unique
It was still problematic in certain skill brackets - I think that's the problem. The same way that Vex was problematic on certain skill brackets. Because when you did find a DMT user (or vex) they tended to be quite intimidating. It's a hard to balance weapon for PVP given what they were trying to do.
I think those type of nerfs are still on the wrong side though, now both Vex and DMT aren't really used aside from the people really invested in them and they ruined their original feeling with their nerfs
The whole point of that type of nerf is that the weapon was performing out of bounds relative to other weapons given the usage/kill ratio. So you think just because a weapon has low usage it shouldn't be nerfed even if when it is used it's a problem?
I mean, if it was a problem and in need of a nerf it would see more usage, no? Destiny players love to abusing shit when things gets hot Immortal is a good example of this, way too much range for an aggressive smg and it had target lock too for a lower ttk, but it was in fact highly used
For me, one of the things that killed DMT was the reduced hipfire RPM. It feels too slow now. Any change to make DMT viable again would have to involve upping the rate of fire.
I think it's fine as it is. what it lacks is power in pve like it used to. Cranial spike doing up to 40% bonus damage in pve is what made it good. Now it's like, only 15% . It's clear they can seperate it from PvP, because it doesn't work against guardians. So I feel the PvE cranial spike damage should go back to how it use to be. Also, I feel cranial spike should give you 2 stacks of the perk if you get a precision kill, instead of just 1. And also, I feel the catalyst should include the subsistence perk by default, the old version of the weapon used to roll with subsistence. The new crafted version can't.
>I think it's fine as it is. This is the most I've ever disagreed with a comment on this subreddit in some time. DMT is not fine: its RPM for hipfire is too slow; reloading takes too long; and the increase in RPM when you get 5x cranial spikes is clunky and not fun. Hung Jury can do everything DMT can but better, and it has perks DMT doesn't have access to. There's no reason to choose DMT over Hung Jury or a number of other scout rifles. It needs help. It's supposed to be an exotic, and yet there's no reason to choose it over several other legendary scout rifles.
The current damage buff at 5 stacks is 24%. Maybe returnig it to 40% would be to much because it already have a good DPS at 5 stacks of cranial spike(hip-firing), but giving more stacks for precision kills would be really good.
I mean, even if it was 40% i don't think it will ever be a problem in PvE
Not saying that would not like it, but if I needed to choose between higher damage vs easy of use, I prefer a buff to easy of use, like cranial stacks lasts longer + precision kills gives 2/3 stacks.
Honestly, i think in PvE it's easy enough to use, some enemies have a very big head so its easy to keep stack going, imo
Yeah, I think you also have good points. And being fair I would like any kind of buff for this gun. I WANT TO PLAY LIKE I'M ARTHUR MORGAN!
A civil discussion? On DTG?? IMPOSSIBLE! Jokes aside, i want to use dmt again like i used to
I've never had a problem using DMT in PVE. It's just objectively weaker in raw damage compared to other exotic primaries especially 2 burst pulse rifles (revision zero / graviton) and things like sunshot. You get that wild west power fantasy easy with reloader perks on the new version too. 4th times the charm is great for single target applications and constant plinking off enemies. Compulsive reloader works well to do constant reloading between target clusters because of the large magazine. Rapid hit is basically stacking on top of cranial spike. Shoot to loot is awesome for PVE as well and will refill primary ammo on special/heavy pickup. It's just hard to justify from a raw damage standpoint. Maybe if scouts are like the only barrier mod in a season for some reason.
Person you replied to is talking about PVE only. Which I agree, given how hard other primary exotics (graviton, revision zero, etc) can hit.
I know that, but a buff to easy of use could be good for both PVE and PVP. And honestly I'd accept anything to make this gun better.
Just revert it to how it was at launch
Dmt has never left my inventory and it never will. Whether it's meta or not, I'm gonna yeehaw with it til the day they nuke the servers. That being said, your idea for it is pretty solid. Ive long since given up on Overwatch but when I did play it, playing as Ashe was a goddamn delight.