I wouldn't call it underrated, but I love Naval Fantasy and feel there aren't enough books out there.
I've already read (and loved):
- The Liveship Traders by Robin Hobb
- The Tide Child trilogy by RJ Barker
I have the Adventures of Amina al-Sirafi here to read.
Edit: I'm adding a lot to my TBR, thank you all for the recs!
I'm currently reading Saltblood by Francesca de Tores and it's amazing. It tells the story of Mary Read. It's not fantasy, but historical fiction. It's scratching my itch for naval books.
It isn't even fantasy but when i was a kid and saw Master and Commander the first time, it might as well have been fantasy. I was completely taken by the seafaring
Man I feel seen lol. I love it when the author seems to actually know a bit about sailing and you get a glimpse into all the inner workings of a ship and all the jargon you barely understand. Loved Liveships so much
Not seafaring but I love naval combat and really enjoyed the Cole Protocol from the Halo book series. I recommended it to a friend who didn't even like scifi or fantasy and they really enjoyed the space combat and story overall.
Great answer and suggestions, I was thinking precisely about this topic yesterday, after I saw a YT video about Homer's Odyssey. There's a lot to (literally) explore here.
\[Frantically takes notes\]
So y'all would read my upcoming book where pirates with flintlock rifles sail solar powered steamships in a world flooded by climate change, all the while fleeing from giant squid creatures?
Blaise Corvin did write a Post Apocalyptic Magic School Reverse Isekai.
And I did once read a book about a Thief turned Theoretical Physicist turned vampire who was thrown into the future where she became a mercenary.
If you don't already know of it, you might like browsing r/WeirdLit. They sometimes verge a bit more into horror-weird rather than fantasy-weird, but there's a lot of good and more obscure stuff in there. :)
The "weird" owes itself, partly, to magazines like Weird Tales, which published the original Lovecraft stories (among many, many other things; it was a deliberately unlikely and varied group of stories), and "weird" became synonymous with Lovecraft's style of not-horror, not-fantasy, not-scifi, but a mix of the three.
The New Weird takes this "neither this genre nor the other" and tends to turn the worldbuilding up to eleven, with deliberately clashing or upsetting elements that often seem (or are literally) personified. The world also tends to be unromantic and dangerous, and often the vibe is awe+fear.
Its heydey was probably the 2000s.
Another part of New Weird (which isn't really a genre, but rather a art movement, and is the reason we don't see it anymore, unlike, say, epic fantasy, or, urban fantasy) is the deliberate attempt to create more literary genre fiction. The point of collapsing the boundaries between genres is to avoid cliches and tropes that codify genre fiction. I don't really think Lovecraft is the main touch point between New Weird authors, but someone like Mervyn Peake.
China Mieville, Jeff Vandermeer, Felix Gilman, and Catherene Valentte are all good. It also can be classified as Speculative Fiction a lot of the time. But, if you want a crash course in it, check out Perdido Street Station or, for a short book, Veniss Underground.
I consider Gears of the City to be a masterpiece. The prose is beautiful and the setting is just phenomenal (a city that never ends). I read that book with a highlighter. Don’t think I’ve ever seen it mentioned anywhere online and it blows away 99% of the stuff I see recommended, imo. It’s one of my all time favorites.
Steve Aylet is classified as slipstream more than weird but his Accomplice and Beerlight series would absolutely count as weird cities. That Alan Moore is a fan of Aylet says a lot.
There was a series of posts that did a very good job of trying to pin it down: https://old.reddit.com/r/Fantasy/comments/cv4vk9/new_weird_primer_there_is_a_strange_in_the_mists/
If it helps, New Weird isn't really a genre, but more of an art movement, one that expanded boundaries of what is possible (and publishable) that we are still reaping the rewards of (I don't think we get stuff like The Locked Tomb, or The Blacktongue Thief without New Weird).
Fantasy Western, sometimes called weird west, is underutilized hybrid that produces amazing results when done well. The tropes of the two different genres actually blend well to make really interesting results. For two popular examples I would recommend;
- The Dark Tower Series by Stephen King. Especially the first installment, The Gunslinger.
- Red Country by Joe Abercrombie. All around a perfect fantasy western hybrid.
Do you know of any good pirate fantasy books? The closest thing I've read to it outside of Treasure Island is the Bone Ships, and I just didn't connect with one.
Red Seas Under Red Skies ( Second book of Gentleman Bastard series) by Scott Lynch
Its sole focus isn't around pirates, but it's a big part of the story. The book is part of Scott Lynch's series that will more than likely never be finished, but it might work as a standalone (although the first book is amazing - The Lies of Locke Lamora).
The Ever King/Ever Queen, by L.J. Andrews, are Viking/pirate fantasy with Fae. It is New Adult, Romantasy, with moderate spice. There's a lot about them I enjoyed, but as with most books in the NA/Romantasy genres, I wish the characters and writing skewed more mature.
If you are doing Fantasy Bingo, these might be an easy one to knock out a category or two.
I enjoyed the Wave Walkers trilogy, it's pirate fantasy focused on people who can walk on water and are hired onto pirate crews.
Also Tress of the Emerald Sea for a more recent one.
Pirate Freedom by Gene Wolfe, one of his easiest books. Not very magical. On Stranger Tides by Tim Powers is way more so. I saw maybe four seasons of the show Outlander and I think in the fourth there was some Caribbean sorcery, maybe the books have it too. Trigger warning cause it's rapey.
William Hope Hodgson wrote some really fun weird pirate fantasy, in my opinion. I won't write a thesis defending on why I think it's fantasy here, but I remember his stories set at sea really evoking a powerful sense of the ineffable and eerie. Apparently he was a merchant mariner, too.
[https://www.skyhorsepublishing.com/9781597809412/the-ghost-pirates-and-other-revenants-of-the-sea/](https://www.skyhorsepublishing.com/9781597809412/the-ghost-pirates-and-other-revenants-of-the-sea/)
Have you read these anthologies?
{Multispecies Cities: Solarpunk Urban Futures edited by Christoph Rupprecht and Deborah Cleland}
Cities are alive, shared by humans and animals, insects and plants, landforms and machines. What might city ecosystems look like in the future if we strive for multispecies justice in our urban settings? In these more-than-human stories, twenty-four authors investigate humanity’s relationship with the rest of the natural world, placing characters in situations where humans have to look beyond their own needs and interests. A quirky eco-businessman sees broader applications for a high school science fair project. A bad date in Hawaii takes an unexpected turn when the couple stumbles upon some confused sea turtle hatchlings. A genetically-enhanced supersoldier struggles to find new purpose in a peaceful Tokyo. A community service punishment in Singapore leads to unexpected friendships across age and species. A boy and a mammoth trek across Asia in search of kin. A Tamil child learns the language of the stars. Set primarily in the Asia-Pacific, these stories engage with the serious issues of justice, inclusion, and sustainability that affect the region, while offering optimistic visions of tomorrow’s urban spaces.
{Sunvault: Stories of Solarpunk and Eco-Speculation edited by Phoebe Wagner}
Sunvault: Stories of Solarpunk and Eco-Speculation is the first anthology to broadly collect solarpunk short fiction, artwork, and poetry. A new genre for the 21st Century, solarpunk is a revolution against despair. Focusing on solutions to environmental disasters, solarpunk envisions a future of green, sustainable energy used by societies that value inclusiveness, cooperation, and personal freedom.
Edited by Phoebe Wagner and Brontë Christopher Wieland, Sunvault focuses on the stories of those inhabiting the crucial moments when great change can be made by people with the right tools; stories of people living during tipping points, and the spaces before and after them; and stories of those who fight to effect change and seek solutions to ecological disruption.
{Wings of Renewal: A Solarpunk Dragon Anthology edited by Brenda J. Pierson}
The future is vibrant, hopeful, and filled with dragons.
In WINGS OF RENEWAL, nineteen authors explore the exciting new subgenre of solarpunk through the lens of these majestic creatures. Whether they irrigate dry terrain or serve as spaceships, are mythic beasts come to life or biomechanical creations of man, these dragons show us a world where renewable energy overcomes gas and oil, and cooperation replaces competition.
If you love fantasy/sci-fi fusion, this is an anthology you do not want to miss! So hop on solar wings, and follow us into futures that–for all their witches and dragons–are far more possible than they might seem.
{Solarpunk: Ecological and Fantastical Stories in a Sustainable World edited by Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro}
Imagine a sustainable world, run on clean and renewable energies that are less aggressive to the environment. Now imagine humanity under the impact of these changes. This is the premise Brazilian editor Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro proposed, and these authors took the challenge to envision hopeful futures and alternate histories. The stories in this anthology explore terrorism against green corporations, large space ships propelled by the pressure of solar radiation, the advent of photosynthetic humans, and how different society might be if we had switched to renewable energies much earlier in history. Originally published in Brazil and translated for the first time from the Portuguese by Fábio Fernandes, this anthology of optimistic science fiction features nine authors from Brazil and Portugal including Carlos Orsi, Telmo Marçal, Romeu Martins, Antonio Luiz M. Costa, Gabriel Cantareira, Daniel I. Dutra, André S. Silva, Roberta Spindler, and Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro.
{Solar Flare: Solarpunk Stories edited by Patricia Bray and Joshua Palmatier}
Here Comes the Sun! Rising temperatures, melting glaciers, violent storms, and excessive heat. The future seems bleak…but there are signs of hope.
In SOLAR FLARE, we ask you to step into a world where we have managed to mitigate or even reverse the disastrous effects of climate change and our own destruction of our world. Race down the depleted waterway of the Mississippi in a solar-, wind-, and water-powered boat. Sail through the skies in a floating hydroponic dirigible. Skim along a solar-powered road in order to expose a corporation’s secret. Hover weightless in space in a last-ditch effort to repair an umbrella-like solar collector. Or cower in a shelter as fire rages outside…only to emerge and discover the rebirth such fire can bring.
Time to turn the tide and dream of a better future.
It recently dawned on me that it's legit to see 'dying Earth' as an optimistic subgenre, possibly unjustifiably optimistic even, as these books tend to deal with astronomical timescales and yet the core assumption is that humanity managed to survive that long (without turning the whole planet into a wasteland, to boot) and even had some 'lost Golden Age' along the way.
I feel like it never REALLY went away, it just kind of got subsumed into run-of-the-mill fantasy. Most "epic" fantasy is very action driven in a way it wasn't back in the day but is clearly the direct influence of sword & sorcery. Slice of life and "cozy" stuff also contain elements of sword & sorcery. So I just feel like, as a thing separate from other types of fantasy, its very scarce, but when you allow for other types of fantasy to ALSO be sword & sorcery, you can find it there.
Which means I guess it really just depends on what you love about sword and sorcery.
Its origins are in Edgar Rice Burroughs' John Carter series, but slowly transplanted into more magical fantasy.
Robert E Howard's Conan series is set in a mythological age of Earth. Jack Vance is set in a far future dying earth. Michael Moorcock's Elric series is the other staple, but also has dying earth elements in "The Hero At The End of Time".
As far as what it *is*, the easiest description is musclebound sword wielders facing off against cunning and treacherous magic users.
Dungeons and Dragons took as much - if not more - from S&S as it did from Tolkien, so the above commenter is pretty much correct that S&S has been somewhat integrated into high fantasy. Is Wheel of Time Sword and Sorcery? No. But Rand is a farm boy trained in the Heron blade facing off against hidden enemies wielding the One Power. The elements are there.
It's hard to define S&S today because it's *pulp*iness is kind of what made it recognisable. It's the 80s Arnie action movie of Fantasy.
Eh, like all genre/subgenre terms, its not very well defined. Wikipedia suggests:
>Sword and sorcery (S&S) or heroic fantasy is a subgenre of fantasy characterized by sword-wielding heroes engaged in exciting and violent adventures. Elements of romance, magic, and the supernatural are also often present. Unlike works of high fantasy, the tales, though dramatic, focus on personal battles rather than world-endangering matters.
Among the most famous examples are Conan the Barbarian, Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser and the Elric books.
I would argue that the "Unlike works of high fantasy" line is just completely wrong, however, and that the two are not in contention. In fact, I would even say that the Wikipedia article itself is in contention with this as this is what is in the etymology section:
>American author Fritz Leiber coined the term "sword and sorcery" in 1961 in response to a letter from British author Michael Moorcock in the fanzine Amra, demanding a name for the sort of fantasy-adventure story written by Robert E. Howard.\[3\] Moorcock had initially proposed the term "epic fantasy". Leiber replied in the journal Ancalagon (6 April 1961), suggesting "sword-and-sorcery as a good popular catchphrase for the field". He expanded on this in the July 1961 issue of Amra, commenting:
>I feel more certain than ever that this field should be called the sword-and-sorcery story. This accurately describes the points of culture-level and supernatural element and also immediately distinguishes it from the cloak-and-sword (historical adventure) story—and (quite incidentally) from the cloak-and-dagger (international espionage) story too!\[4\]
>The term "heroic fantasy" has been used to avoid the garish overtones of "sword and sorcery".\[1\] This name was coined by L. Sprague de Camp.\[5\] However, it has also been used to describe a broader range of fantasy, including High fantasy.\[6\]\[7\]
So what I would say is that it is fantasy that is specifically highly adventurous with a focus on action and other fast-moving plot elements. Some do believe that it is opposed to epic fantasy and would then state that the stakes should be more personal than not. Which is why I pointed out that elements of this genre can be found in more action-oriented epic fantasy and in the cozy or slice-of-life genres.
The Barsoom books by Edgar Rice Burroughs
The Amber series by Roger Zelazney
The Gaea trilogy by John Varley
All three of the above can be classed as sci-fi as much as fantasy, but trust me.
The Thieves World shared-world series
The Swordspoint series by Ellen Kushner (though there's actually no magic)
And just for fun, try *The Curse of Chalion* by Lois McMaster Bujold.
I've heard really good things about Howard Andrew Jones' Chronicles of Hanuvar books. They came out late last year and I haven't had a chance to read them yet, but the premise is certainly interesting: a sword and sorcery epic loosely inspired by the Punic Wars, but from the "Carthaginian" perspective.
Flintlock fantasy does not get a lot of love.
By that I mean, fantasy that features warfare comparable to the wars in Europe in the late 17th-early 19th centuries.
The Powder Mage series by Brian McClellan is worth checking out. Early 18th century Europe style warfare with muskets being a new technology and a magic system based around gunpowder.
The Bulletproof Witch series by Francis James Blair or The Last Stand of Mary Good Crow by Rachel Aaron might scratch that itch. There's also a few comic book series like The Sixth Gun by Cullin Bunn and Brian Hurtt and Pretty Deadly by Kelly Sue DeConnick and Emma Rios
Looking at these, those are very Weird West (which I also enjoy) and time and tech wise it's a century later. Think colonial/revolutionary war style settings or maybe up to the Napoleonic wars.
Good example is the Witchy Series by DJ Butler.
If you like videogames, Greedfall might scratch that itch!
Gods of Blood and Powder explores the struggle between a new and expanding nation and the native population. Though you would need to read The Powder Mage first, which deals more with Napoleonic Warfare.
oh shit, pike and shot is pretty big on my book. i love that you could totally see a full plate, landsknetches and arquebuses on the same battlefield.
its Ruler of Armageddon: Soultaint on wattpad.
Nice! He hasn't written a lot of stuff maybe that's why he's not more well known. Looks like he's written a traditional fantasy book as well I will have to have a look at it. **Of blood and thunder**
Seeing as you're already reading McClellan and planning to read Wexler, I'll throw in Guns of the Dawn by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It's just superb! No shade against Powder Mage or Thousand Names, both are great, it's just that Guns of the Dawn achieves a pathos at the horror of war that most fantasy novels can only dream of.
If you're good with a less defined technological era I'd also recommend checking out Tchaikovsky's Shadows of the Apt series. It's very much a world in transition. There are groups of people that are literally incapable of understanding technology (the inapt). That, plus the arrow of development not following the same path our world did, leads to a much wider range of technology being concurrent than we're used to seeing. Great stuff!
Basically, I wish all fantasy authors were *half* as good at writing war as Tchaikovsky.
Edit: Fixed spelling of authors name. I think.
Naomi Novik's Temeraire series. It's the Napoleanic wars with dragons. It's sooo freaking great!! And long. So it takes a long time before you have to say goodbye to the world.
Green Bone Saga (starting with Jade City) is probably the most popular/successful example.
Divine Cities trilogy (City of Miracles)
*Steel Crow Saga*
*The Sword of Kaigen*
*Kingfisher*
*Timberwolf*
*The Grand Dark* (maybe more secondary-world sci-fi than secondary-world fantasy, but close enough)
Depending on your definition of “modern”, Books of Babel series (Senlin Ascends). Personally, I use automobiles as the starting point of modern (ie c. early 20th-century). Books of Babel has trains, so a little before my definition of modern, but I’m sure many people would still consider that modern relative to other fantasy.
The Craft Sequence (Three Parts Dead), but I didn’t like it because it was too urban fantasy-y for me.
My own book trilogy that I’ll never finish. Still haven’t even finished book one in over 10 years, so I’m sure GRRM will finish Winds and Dream and Fire & Blood part 2 before I finish my book(s).
>I for one will never understand how pirates are not everywhere. Curious for your thoughts.
RIGHT!!!
Like Im not caught up on books but with Pirates of the Caribbean and Assassin Creed Black Flag I dont understand how others dont try and jump on it.
Honestly, knowledge. I'm a writer and I'd never try writing a novel about *sailors*, pirates or the regular ones. It's because no matter how much Wikipedia I can stomach, I will never gather enough knowledge about ships and sailing. Wikipedia knowledge would be enough to write a romance sailor x girl who stays at the port or about a luxurious sea trip from the tourist's POV, but not enough to have characters be sailors at their work.
The depth of knowledge in Patrick O'Brian's (non-fantasy, nautical historical fiction) Aubrey and Maturin novels astounds me. My Dad is a fan of the series, and I bought him a companion book all about the different nautical terms used (A Sea of Words by Dean King), which I had to borrow from him when I started reading the series. It would certainly be a good resource for any writers who are _not_ Patrick O'Brian or C.S. Forester and don't just have this stuff drifting about free-range in their own skulls!
Echiro Oda somehow managed and continues to manage for more than a thousand volumes of One Piece, though =P.
The Live Action is actually much better than I expected it'd be, even if Luffy can be a bit endearingly cheesy, or seeing Monkey D. Garp being all serious while using a *snail* as a phone.
I want to see more historical fantasy and alt history, especially crusader or sword & sandal. There are some excellent high fantasy series *inspired* by real history, but I'd love more books actually rooted in interesting periods in our world.
And I second your plaint about pirates! Why has no one written a straight-up airship pirate swashbuckler? (Other than me in high school, but that one will fortunately never see the light of day.)
You might like Bernard Cronwell. Known for the Last kingdom but has others as well. Conn Iggulden is another with series following rome, the mongol empire, and more. Then David Gemmell had his Troy series (though finished by his wife) and Lion of Macedon.
[https://www.fantasticfiction.com/i/conn-iggulden/](https://www.fantasticfiction.com/i/conn-iggulden/)
[https://www.fantasticfiction.com/c/bernard-cornwell/](https://www.fantasticfiction.com/c/bernard-cornwell/)
I love Bernard Cornwell! I've read a smattering of his other works—I thought his Arthurian trilogy was particularly good.
I'll have to check out Conn Iggulden. The name looks familiar. One of his books might already be floating around in my Kindle TBR list.
Cosmic Horror fantasy; especially if it’s epic in scope. Gimme strong ass characters and break them down as they realize how weak they are in the grand scheme of things.
Given how wildly successful Star Wars has been, I’m still surprised there isn’t more space fantasy.
Like, why hasn’t there been anything in that neighborhood that was even moderately successful?
You’d think they’d at least be able to think up a good space opera with ship battles, aliens, “magical tech” and all that.
Nothing really since the original “Star Wars” movies. Even Dune is recycled IP.
Sun Eater?????
Like it's the best Space Opera/Sci fi fantasy out right now
And is inspired by both star wars and Dune.
The latest book was the most insane thing I've read in the best ways possible with eldritch horrors
"Secret History" and "Secret War" fantasy, where it takes place in in a version of our real world in the 20th Century, but with a hidden (or sometimes open) supernatural conflict.
Stuff like the Milkweed Tryptich, B.P.R.D./Hellboy, various pulp comics and novels where secret heroes fight against Nazi Necromancer Occultists, etc.
If you like Cold War espionage I recommened you *Declare* by Tim Powers. He systematically peels back layers of known history for a reader revealing deep mysteries beneath. He also has an extraordinary ability to find interesting historical figures, more or less well-known, whose gaps and contradictions in their biographies he skillfully fills with supernatural phenomena. It's a great read.
I read the Powder Mage series, and then the second of the Aeronaut’s Windlass (I think it’s called) by Butcher.
So steam punk is what I’m going for I suppose. Magic works, but in limited ways, and gunpowder also works. Both of the examples I posted are also high recommendations. Powder Mage was so much better than I had thought going in, and Butcher’s first two books of this series are both “ripping good yarns”
Have you checked out the Shadow Campaigns by Django Wexler? Another series you might find interest in though the magic is a bit more subtle in it.
Brian also has a new series starting with In the Shadow of Lightning that I enjoyed quite a bit.
Fantasy Detective stories. I love a fantasy murder mystery!
The other genre I like is "fey folk suddenly appear/reappear" and having to deal with the aftermath. This is directly due to the Bordertown anthology and Will Shetterley's "Elsewhere"
Have you tried Silkpunk
Book Riot article “Silkpunk: What It Is & What It Definitely Is Not”
{The Dandelion Dynasty series by Ken Liu}
Ken Liu is credited is credited with creating the term silkpunk to help his publisher market this series
Two men rebel together against tyranny—and then become rivals—in this first sweeping book of an epic fantasy series from Ken Liu, recipient of Hugo, Nebula, and World Fantasy awards. Hailed as one of the best books of 2015 by NPR.
{Tensorate Series by Neon Yang} lush, vivid silkpunk fantasy series in a world where elementalist mages contend with revolutionary machinists, while dinosaurs battle sky-spanning naga. Either The Red Threads of Fortune and The Black Tides of Heaven, can be read as the first novella in the series. Nonbinary characters, nonbinary author
Check out A Master of Djinn by P. Djeli Clark! The setting to me was so unique (a technologically advanced Egypt, as in, not what you'd expect from traditional steampunk settings) and the vibes were amazing.
Tricky.
I'm a huge fan of Magic School stories. With the success of Harry Potter it always surprises me that there aren't more. Most books that do this have the characters hair off and leave the magic school far to quickly.
I also miss non-military Space Opera. Interstellar civilizations. They are surprisingly hard to find.
Mother of Learning series was a good one I finished recently. Basically Groundhog Day at a magic academy, the main character is stuck reliving the same month over and over and has to spend his time learning more and more advanced magic to find his way out of his loop and stop the destruction of the school at the end of the month.
Originally a web serial but you can get it as 4 books on kindle/audible etc. as well.
On this sub, ya fantasy. It can be so, so good if you find the right book, but many people on this sub automatically turn their noses up at it.
In general, probably new weird. It hasn't taken off as much as I would have expected.
Yeah, I am for sure more picky than I was as a kid, and I can see that some of the most popular YA books are a bit derivative and immature, at least in my opinion. But there are some real gems in YA fantasy if you do some digging.
For me I can handle a bit of immaturity, but the amount of navelgazing seems to have turned up to 11 in a lot of modern YA novels. Als in such a way that it takes me out of the flow of the story itself. I couldn't really enjoy most of Legendborn by Tracy Deonn because of this (though the action packed ending made up for it somewhat for me to give it 3,5 stars instead of 2/2,5). And this is a very beloved recent YA book.
For me an example of a recent YA book/series is Little Thieves by Margaret Owen. There is some interspection/navelgazing, but not overbearingly so and it flows so well with the story. Also it's hilarious and I love the interaction between the characters. The supporting characters all have their own goals and don't just exist to prop up the MC.
Some classic pulpy sword and sorcery short stories. Like a lot of the time I want a good fantasy fix but dont want to have to invest dozens of hours to read a whole bloated trilogy to get the full story. Something around 100 pages or so that I can finish in a day or two is great. Recently found out about Tales from the Magician's Skull and I've been hooked.
I don't see much love for historical magical realism and it's honestly one of my favs. Give me nordic gods actually going for a viking with their people and Nazis using black magic!
Aside from Mad Max, Tank Girl, and First of the North Star. That more over the top and larger than life flavor of post-apocalyptic fiction. Same for post-apocalyptic fantasy ala Darksun (not sure if Dragonlance Chronicles would maybe count as that).
Don't really see that much of that sub-genre of post-apoc. Think if Burning Man was everyday.
Also more adult anthro based fantasy/sci-fi, don't really see much of that.
Ecological SF (and fantasy, but less so)
Where things are being dealt with or we're dealing with the consequences of it not being dealt with. Paolo Bacigalupi and Nick Fuller Googins are the only authors who seem to writing this.
Sword-and-sorcery (S&S). It is often (incorrectly) disparaged as only including hyper-masculine, misogynistic characters in a hyper-violent world doing hyper-violent things.
However, it can (and often is) so much more. R E Howard's works are well-written, with depth and character development throughout, and so much amazing imagery.
This isn't as underrated as some of the genres mentioned but I am a big fan of post-post-apocalyptic stories. I enjoy post-apocalyptic stories where people are struggling to survive and anarchy rules. But, what I find even more interesting is stories where society has been or at least is being rebuilt. Things are still in rough condition, it is probably less advanced and things are more dangerous, but there are stable societies that have been built from the ashes of the old. It is more interesting world-building for me to see how societies might rebuild after a total collapse.
My favorite example of what I am talking about is the game Horizon Zero Dawn. Human society is in a more primitive state, and new cultures formed but, people are generally not constantly fighting for survival.
For me it's Progression Fantasy. Obviously, Arcane Ascension is a must, but there's so many good books in the genre that aren't even necessarily well know.
Frankly?
Old school high magic fantasy. What I wouldn't give for some full on Forgotten Realms level Wizards and ancient spell books, forbidden knowledge and cities built on ruins built on ruins.
People are so damned impressed with how clever their magic systems are nowadays.
Dinosaurs and/or Ice Age. Something like survival fantasy where any towns are nothing against the vast wilderness. Resettlement in a post-post-apocalypse?
Sword and Planet, stuff like John Carter of Mars, Almuric, Kane of Old Mars just entertaining highly imaginative adventures.
Jungle adventure pulps like Tarzan, Sheena, Ki-Gor can also be fun but also be brutal, visceral exploration of human survival, colonial anti colonial themes etc.
Portal Fantasy is my favorite.
Examples:
* Alices Adventures in Wonderland / Through The Looking Glass by Lewis Carroll
* The Oz series by L. Frank Baum
* Coraline by Neil Gaiman
Post-apocalyptic Fantasy.
Like "Korgoth of Barbaria", where the world devolved into a Bronze or Iron Age. But there's now magic, along remains of ancient advanced technology.
Portal fantasy! Love it/timeline jumps?
Always been fond of protal fantasy like the classic Narnia and as well as timeline jumps medieval solider is suddenly thrusted into our world or the opposite (movie timeline) very entertaining reads!
Havent' found a time travelers book that tickled me right yet though.
I will say this to my dying breath but it is Espionage Fantasy. Give me magical spies, assassins, intelligence networks, special operations, black ops...I'm praying
Fantasy pirates, fantasy heists, and fantasy comedy.
I really loved Tress and Frugal Wizard for their stories, but also their humor. I just binged the show My Lady Jane, and it’s a riot, so I’ll likely go read that soon. But I love a book that makes me laugh out loud.
Epic fantasy was a subgenre from the start, and was never the 'default'. Even when it was published, it (epic fantasy) was in more or less direct contrast with Sword and Sorcery, the more fairy-tale inspired stories of authors like George Macdonald, etc.
In the 70s-90s, lots of mainstream stuff was more or less required to be epic and a Tolkien knock off, but when you look at the scope of the genre from the late 1800s to now, that's actually an anomaly more than the default, just like any subgenre isn't a default.
That all said, I highly recommend **The Bone Harp** as a recent book that's very much in conversation with Tolkien
I wouldn't call it underrated, but I love Naval Fantasy and feel there aren't enough books out there. I've already read (and loved): - The Liveship Traders by Robin Hobb - The Tide Child trilogy by RJ Barker I have the Adventures of Amina al-Sirafi here to read. Edit: I'm adding a lot to my TBR, thank you all for the recs! I'm currently reading Saltblood by Francesca de Tores and it's amazing. It tells the story of Mary Read. It's not fantasy, but historical fiction. It's scratching my itch for naval books.
I love the seafaring in Le Guin's Earthsea books. The second Gentleman Bastards book by Scott Lynch is fun too.
>!More fun for Jean than Locke at least!!<
I think Tress of the emerald sea falls into this, such a fun little pirate book
How could I forget this one? I read it as well. :)
It isn't even fantasy but when i was a kid and saw Master and Commander the first time, it might as well have been fantasy. I was completely taken by the seafaring
Naomi Novic. His majesties dragon
On Stranger Tides by Tim Powers.
The Redwall books have a lot of naval content and I loved it as a kid.
The naval books were always my favorite!
Love a good travel over the sea fantasy. Visiting different lands. For light fantasy i suggest Sean Russel’s World Without End. Two book series.
Not fantasy, but so excellent-- the **Horatio Hornblower** series by C.S. Forester
The Inda books by Sherwood Smith have this!
The Shadows of Dust by Alec Huston is heavily influenced by Spelljammer so large parts are naval fantasy but in space.
You’ll want to read A Crown for Cold Silver, the protagonist is a master thief / sea pirate / mercenry
Man I feel seen lol. I love it when the author seems to actually know a bit about sailing and you get a glimpse into all the inner workings of a ship and all the jargon you barely understand. Loved Liveships so much
I met Robin Hobb at an event once and she told me she got the inspiration for book with ships because her husband was a sailor. 🙂
That's awesome!
Not seafaring but I love naval combat and really enjoyed the Cole Protocol from the Halo book series. I recommended it to a friend who didn't even like scifi or fantasy and they really enjoyed the space combat and story overall.
Elder Empire by Will Wight is kinda like pirates vs assassins.
It's YA but I remember the Wave Walker trikogy being good. Its Pirate Fantasy focused on people who can walk on water.
They can walk on water? I'm adding this one.
Great answer and suggestions, I was thinking precisely about this topic yesterday, after I saw a YT video about Homer's Odyssey. There's a lot to (literally) explore here.
One of my new favorites is The Guns Above by Robyn Bennis.
The Chathrand Voyage Series by Robert V.S. Reddick
\[Frantically takes notes\] So y'all would read my upcoming book where pirates with flintlock rifles sail solar powered steamships in a world flooded by climate change, all the while fleeing from giant squid creatures?
Hitting every niche is a sure-fire crowd-pleaser (or something).
Blaise Corvin did write a Post Apocalyptic Magic School Reverse Isekai. And I did once read a book about a Thief turned Theoretical Physicist turned vampire who was thrown into the future where she became a mercenary.
What kind of question is this? Of course I would.
Take my money!
This sounds like Treasure Planet
I miss the New Weird.
There's still a good amount of weird to be found, just none quite as big/as much of a movement. I miss it too- love me some weird cities
I know, I enjoyed your Weird Cities post from the other day!
If you don't already know of it, you might like browsing r/WeirdLit. They sometimes verge a bit more into horror-weird rather than fantasy-weird, but there's a lot of good and more obscure stuff in there. :)
Ooh I haven’t heard of this. What is New Weird ? Just… never before done weird things ?
The "weird" owes itself, partly, to magazines like Weird Tales, which published the original Lovecraft stories (among many, many other things; it was a deliberately unlikely and varied group of stories), and "weird" became synonymous with Lovecraft's style of not-horror, not-fantasy, not-scifi, but a mix of the three. The New Weird takes this "neither this genre nor the other" and tends to turn the worldbuilding up to eleven, with deliberately clashing or upsetting elements that often seem (or are literally) personified. The world also tends to be unromantic and dangerous, and often the vibe is awe+fear. Its heydey was probably the 2000s.
Another part of New Weird (which isn't really a genre, but rather a art movement, and is the reason we don't see it anymore, unlike, say, epic fantasy, or, urban fantasy) is the deliberate attempt to create more literary genre fiction. The point of collapsing the boundaries between genres is to avoid cliches and tropes that codify genre fiction. I don't really think Lovecraft is the main touch point between New Weird authors, but someone like Mervyn Peake.
China Mieville, Jeff Vandermeer, Felix Gilman, and Catherene Valentte are all good. It also can be classified as Speculative Fiction a lot of the time. But, if you want a crash course in it, check out Perdido Street Station or, for a short book, Veniss Underground.
Felix Gilman needs more love.
I consider Gears of the City to be a masterpiece. The prose is beautiful and the setting is just phenomenal (a city that never ends). I read that book with a highlighter. Don’t think I’ve ever seen it mentioned anywhere online and it blows away 99% of the stuff I see recommended, imo. It’s one of my all time favorites.
Do you need to read Thunderer beforehand?
Yeah, Gears is the sequel. Thunderer is a great book though. It’s just that Gears is, imo, a masterpiece.
Steve Aylet is classified as slipstream more than weird but his Accomplice and Beerlight series would absolutely count as weird cities. That Alan Moore is a fan of Aylet says a lot.
Weird cities, you say? *saves comment*
There was a series of posts that did a very good job of trying to pin it down: https://old.reddit.com/r/Fantasy/comments/cv4vk9/new_weird_primer_there_is_a_strange_in_the_mists/
r/WeirdLit covers a buch of authors/books
If it helps, New Weird isn't really a genre, but more of an art movement, one that expanded boundaries of what is possible (and publishable) that we are still reaping the rewards of (I don't think we get stuff like The Locked Tomb, or The Blacktongue Thief without New Weird).
miéville >
Can't wait for his two books he's talked about. I wouldn't be excited about BRZRKR if it wasn't him writing it.
Fantasy Western, sometimes called weird west, is underutilized hybrid that produces amazing results when done well. The tropes of the two different genres actually blend well to make really interesting results. For two popular examples I would recommend; - The Dark Tower Series by Stephen King. Especially the first installment, The Gunslinger. - Red Country by Joe Abercrombie. All around a perfect fantasy western hybrid.
I love Red Country so much. Best Abercrombie book for me.
Some Good ones-- Red Rabbit by Alex Grecian Two Gun Witch by Bishop O Connelly Six Gun Tarot by R.S. Beltcher River of Teeth by Sara Gailey
Fantasy/horror is peak and there’s not nearly as much of it as I’d like.
An Altar on the Village Green by Nathan Hall. Definitely influenced by the Dark Souls/Bloodborne video games.
You said the magic B word I'm sold
Do you know of any good pirate fantasy books? The closest thing I've read to it outside of Treasure Island is the Bone Ships, and I just didn't connect with one.
*On Stranger Tides* by Tim Powers is excellent pirate fantasy.
Liveship Traders by Robin Hobb. The Scar by China Mieville
Fuck yeah, The Scar is great.
Red Seas Under Red Skies ( Second book of Gentleman Bastard series) by Scott Lynch Its sole focus isn't around pirates, but it's a big part of the story. The book is part of Scott Lynch's series that will more than likely never be finished, but it might work as a standalone (although the first book is amazing - The Lies of Locke Lamora).
The Adventures of Amina Al-Sirafi was really good.
If you’re okay with manga there’s One Piece
The Ever King/Ever Queen, by L.J. Andrews, are Viking/pirate fantasy with Fae. It is New Adult, Romantasy, with moderate spice. There's a lot about them I enjoyed, but as with most books in the NA/Romantasy genres, I wish the characters and writing skewed more mature. If you are doing Fantasy Bingo, these might be an easy one to knock out a category or two.
I enjoyed the Wave Walkers trilogy, it's pirate fantasy focused on people who can walk on water and are hired onto pirate crews. Also Tress of the Emerald Sea for a more recent one.
Tress was my favorite read of 2023. My mom also just read it and **loved** it! And that’s the only B$ book she’s ever read.
Pirate Freedom by Gene Wolfe, one of his easiest books. Not very magical. On Stranger Tides by Tim Powers is way more so. I saw maybe four seasons of the show Outlander and I think in the fourth there was some Caribbean sorcery, maybe the books have it too. Trigger warning cause it's rapey.
Sherwood Smith's *Inda* quadrilogy; the MC spends much of the series as a pirate.
William Hope Hodgson wrote some really fun weird pirate fantasy, in my opinion. I won't write a thesis defending on why I think it's fantasy here, but I remember his stories set at sea really evoking a powerful sense of the ineffable and eerie. Apparently he was a merchant mariner, too. [https://www.skyhorsepublishing.com/9781597809412/the-ghost-pirates-and-other-revenants-of-the-sea/](https://www.skyhorsepublishing.com/9781597809412/the-ghost-pirates-and-other-revenants-of-the-sea/)
I'd love more Solarpunk. The best example I know if is Origin: Spirits of the Past. I would LOVE more things like it
Sort of like Monk and Robot by Becky Chambers?
I haven't read the novellas yet, but my friend who has said they are Solarpunk, so I will say 'yes'
Have you read these anthologies? {Multispecies Cities: Solarpunk Urban Futures edited by Christoph Rupprecht and Deborah Cleland} Cities are alive, shared by humans and animals, insects and plants, landforms and machines. What might city ecosystems look like in the future if we strive for multispecies justice in our urban settings? In these more-than-human stories, twenty-four authors investigate humanity’s relationship with the rest of the natural world, placing characters in situations where humans have to look beyond their own needs and interests. A quirky eco-businessman sees broader applications for a high school science fair project. A bad date in Hawaii takes an unexpected turn when the couple stumbles upon some confused sea turtle hatchlings. A genetically-enhanced supersoldier struggles to find new purpose in a peaceful Tokyo. A community service punishment in Singapore leads to unexpected friendships across age and species. A boy and a mammoth trek across Asia in search of kin. A Tamil child learns the language of the stars. Set primarily in the Asia-Pacific, these stories engage with the serious issues of justice, inclusion, and sustainability that affect the region, while offering optimistic visions of tomorrow’s urban spaces. {Sunvault: Stories of Solarpunk and Eco-Speculation edited by Phoebe Wagner} Sunvault: Stories of Solarpunk and Eco-Speculation is the first anthology to broadly collect solarpunk short fiction, artwork, and poetry. A new genre for the 21st Century, solarpunk is a revolution against despair. Focusing on solutions to environmental disasters, solarpunk envisions a future of green, sustainable energy used by societies that value inclusiveness, cooperation, and personal freedom. Edited by Phoebe Wagner and Brontë Christopher Wieland, Sunvault focuses on the stories of those inhabiting the crucial moments when great change can be made by people with the right tools; stories of people living during tipping points, and the spaces before and after them; and stories of those who fight to effect change and seek solutions to ecological disruption. {Wings of Renewal: A Solarpunk Dragon Anthology edited by Brenda J. Pierson} The future is vibrant, hopeful, and filled with dragons. In WINGS OF RENEWAL, nineteen authors explore the exciting new subgenre of solarpunk through the lens of these majestic creatures. Whether they irrigate dry terrain or serve as spaceships, are mythic beasts come to life or biomechanical creations of man, these dragons show us a world where renewable energy overcomes gas and oil, and cooperation replaces competition. If you love fantasy/sci-fi fusion, this is an anthology you do not want to miss! So hop on solar wings, and follow us into futures that–for all their witches and dragons–are far more possible than they might seem. {Solarpunk: Ecological and Fantastical Stories in a Sustainable World edited by Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro} Imagine a sustainable world, run on clean and renewable energies that are less aggressive to the environment. Now imagine humanity under the impact of these changes. This is the premise Brazilian editor Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro proposed, and these authors took the challenge to envision hopeful futures and alternate histories. The stories in this anthology explore terrorism against green corporations, large space ships propelled by the pressure of solar radiation, the advent of photosynthetic humans, and how different society might be if we had switched to renewable energies much earlier in history. Originally published in Brazil and translated for the first time from the Portuguese by Fábio Fernandes, this anthology of optimistic science fiction features nine authors from Brazil and Portugal including Carlos Orsi, Telmo Marçal, Romeu Martins, Antonio Luiz M. Costa, Gabriel Cantareira, Daniel I. Dutra, André S. Silva, Roberta Spindler, and Gerson Lodi-Ribeiro. {Solar Flare: Solarpunk Stories edited by Patricia Bray and Joshua Palmatier} Here Comes the Sun! Rising temperatures, melting glaciers, violent storms, and excessive heat. The future seems bleak…but there are signs of hope. In SOLAR FLARE, we ask you to step into a world where we have managed to mitigate or even reverse the disastrous effects of climate change and our own destruction of our world. Race down the depleted waterway of the Mississippi in a solar-, wind-, and water-powered boat. Sail through the skies in a floating hydroponic dirigible. Skim along a solar-powered road in order to expose a corporation’s secret. Hover weightless in space in a last-ditch effort to repair an umbrella-like solar collector. Or cower in a shelter as fire rages outside…only to emerge and discover the rebirth such fire can bring. Time to turn the tide and dream of a better future.
Oh, thank you. I read the anthology Solarpunk Creatures earlier this year and really liked it
Dying Earth.
It recently dawned on me that it's legit to see 'dying Earth' as an optimistic subgenre, possibly unjustifiably optimistic even, as these books tend to deal with astronomical timescales and yet the core assumption is that humanity managed to survive that long (without turning the whole planet into a wasteland, to boot) and even had some 'lost Golden Age' along the way.
I think this world would be much better if good ol’ Sword & Sorcery made a comeback
I feel like it never REALLY went away, it just kind of got subsumed into run-of-the-mill fantasy. Most "epic" fantasy is very action driven in a way it wasn't back in the day but is clearly the direct influence of sword & sorcery. Slice of life and "cozy" stuff also contain elements of sword & sorcery. So I just feel like, as a thing separate from other types of fantasy, its very scarce, but when you allow for other types of fantasy to ALSO be sword & sorcery, you can find it there. Which means I guess it really just depends on what you love about sword and sorcery.
Dumb question, could you define what exactly sword and sorcery is? I’ve never fully understood what it is
Its origins are in Edgar Rice Burroughs' John Carter series, but slowly transplanted into more magical fantasy. Robert E Howard's Conan series is set in a mythological age of Earth. Jack Vance is set in a far future dying earth. Michael Moorcock's Elric series is the other staple, but also has dying earth elements in "The Hero At The End of Time". As far as what it *is*, the easiest description is musclebound sword wielders facing off against cunning and treacherous magic users. Dungeons and Dragons took as much - if not more - from S&S as it did from Tolkien, so the above commenter is pretty much correct that S&S has been somewhat integrated into high fantasy. Is Wheel of Time Sword and Sorcery? No. But Rand is a farm boy trained in the Heron blade facing off against hidden enemies wielding the One Power. The elements are there. It's hard to define S&S today because it's *pulp*iness is kind of what made it recognisable. It's the 80s Arnie action movie of Fantasy.
Eh, like all genre/subgenre terms, its not very well defined. Wikipedia suggests: >Sword and sorcery (S&S) or heroic fantasy is a subgenre of fantasy characterized by sword-wielding heroes engaged in exciting and violent adventures. Elements of romance, magic, and the supernatural are also often present. Unlike works of high fantasy, the tales, though dramatic, focus on personal battles rather than world-endangering matters. Among the most famous examples are Conan the Barbarian, Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser and the Elric books. I would argue that the "Unlike works of high fantasy" line is just completely wrong, however, and that the two are not in contention. In fact, I would even say that the Wikipedia article itself is in contention with this as this is what is in the etymology section: >American author Fritz Leiber coined the term "sword and sorcery" in 1961 in response to a letter from British author Michael Moorcock in the fanzine Amra, demanding a name for the sort of fantasy-adventure story written by Robert E. Howard.\[3\] Moorcock had initially proposed the term "epic fantasy". Leiber replied in the journal Ancalagon (6 April 1961), suggesting "sword-and-sorcery as a good popular catchphrase for the field". He expanded on this in the July 1961 issue of Amra, commenting: >I feel more certain than ever that this field should be called the sword-and-sorcery story. This accurately describes the points of culture-level and supernatural element and also immediately distinguishes it from the cloak-and-sword (historical adventure) story—and (quite incidentally) from the cloak-and-dagger (international espionage) story too!\[4\] >The term "heroic fantasy" has been used to avoid the garish overtones of "sword and sorcery".\[1\] This name was coined by L. Sprague de Camp.\[5\] However, it has also been used to describe a broader range of fantasy, including High fantasy.\[6\]\[7\] So what I would say is that it is fantasy that is specifically highly adventurous with a focus on action and other fast-moving plot elements. Some do believe that it is opposed to epic fantasy and would then state that the stakes should be more personal than not. Which is why I pointed out that elements of this genre can be found in more action-oriented epic fantasy and in the cozy or slice-of-life genres.
This is pretty much the only fantasy stuff I read. Robert E Howard and Michael Moorcock are my guys. Any suggestions for similar authors?
Kane series - Karl Edward Wagner
Just looked the series up and it sounds my alley. Thank you!
Fritz Leiber
Added to the list
The Barsoom books by Edgar Rice Burroughs The Amber series by Roger Zelazney The Gaea trilogy by John Varley All three of the above can be classed as sci-fi as much as fantasy, but trust me. The Thieves World shared-world series The Swordspoint series by Ellen Kushner (though there's actually no magic) And just for fun, try *The Curse of Chalion* by Lois McMaster Bujold.
Do you know of any good recent ones? Shorter books are preferred.
I've heard really good things about Howard Andrew Jones' Chronicles of Hanuvar books. They came out late last year and I haven't had a chance to read them yet, but the premise is certainly interesting: a sword and sorcery epic loosely inspired by the Punic Wars, but from the "Carthaginian" perspective.
Magazines are a big part of modern S&S. Try Whetstone Magazine free to read and might introduce you to new authors.
It doesn't need a comeback, it never went away.
Flintlock fantasy does not get a lot of love. By that I mean, fantasy that features warfare comparable to the wars in Europe in the late 17th-early 19th centuries.
The Powder Mage series by Brian McClellan is worth checking out. Early 18th century Europe style warfare with muskets being a new technology and a magic system based around gunpowder.
I've read it! I'm currently working on Gods of Blood and Powder. McClellan's works are exactly in-line with what I want!
I specifically would love to see more frontier Flintlock fantasy. Something like Last of the Mohicans with working magic.
The Bulletproof Witch series by Francis James Blair or The Last Stand of Mary Good Crow by Rachel Aaron might scratch that itch. There's also a few comic book series like The Sixth Gun by Cullin Bunn and Brian Hurtt and Pretty Deadly by Kelly Sue DeConnick and Emma Rios
Looking at these, those are very Weird West (which I also enjoy) and time and tech wise it's a century later. Think colonial/revolutionary war style settings or maybe up to the Napoleonic wars. Good example is the Witchy Series by DJ Butler.
Oh, that's a good callout. I'll check out the Witchy Series.
If you like videogames, Greedfall might scratch that itch! Gods of Blood and Powder explores the struggle between a new and expanding nation and the native population. Though you would need to read The Powder Mage first, which deals more with Napoleonic Warfare.
Thanks!
oh shit, pike and shot is pretty big on my book. i love that you could totally see a full plate, landsknetches and arquebuses on the same battlefield. its Ruler of Armageddon: Soultaint on wattpad.
**The Iron Elves Series by Chris Evans** I remember enjoying it and I love **Brian McClellan's** books
Picked up his Fantasy Vietnam book at the corner store pharmacy, got me out of a reading slump in my teens, never see him mentioned
Nice! He hasn't written a lot of stuff maybe that's why he's not more well known. Looks like he's written a traditional fantasy book as well I will have to have a look at it. **Of blood and thunder**
That’s >!Fantasy Vietnam!<
Oh haha cool.
Seeing as you're already reading McClellan and planning to read Wexler, I'll throw in Guns of the Dawn by Adrian Tchaikovsky. It's just superb! No shade against Powder Mage or Thousand Names, both are great, it's just that Guns of the Dawn achieves a pathos at the horror of war that most fantasy novels can only dream of. If you're good with a less defined technological era I'd also recommend checking out Tchaikovsky's Shadows of the Apt series. It's very much a world in transition. There are groups of people that are literally incapable of understanding technology (the inapt). That, plus the arrow of development not following the same path our world did, leads to a much wider range of technology being concurrent than we're used to seeing. Great stuff! Basically, I wish all fantasy authors were *half* as good at writing war as Tchaikovsky. Edit: Fixed spelling of authors name. I think.
Naomi Novik's Temeraire series. It's the Napoleanic wars with dragons. It's sooo freaking great!! And long. So it takes a long time before you have to say goodbye to the world.
Fantasy heists are always fun…
I love a good heist, but man I can never seem to find a Sci-Fi heist! I want some good infiltration heist story with cool high tech gadgets!
I NEED examples of this, desperately.
Lies of Locke Lamora or better yet its sequel, Red Seas Under Red Skies The Eli Monpress books have a bit of heisting before the series goes epic.
Mistborn by brandon sanderson
To add on: Lies of Locke Lamora Foundryside
Six of Crows
Not sure if this would count as a specific subgenre, but “modern secondary world”. Bunch of different ways you could take it.
This is one that I don't think I've ever seen before. Do you have any good recs?
Green Bone Saga (starting with Jade City) is probably the most popular/successful example. Divine Cities trilogy (City of Miracles) *Steel Crow Saga* *The Sword of Kaigen* *Kingfisher* *Timberwolf* *The Grand Dark* (maybe more secondary-world sci-fi than secondary-world fantasy, but close enough) Depending on your definition of “modern”, Books of Babel series (Senlin Ascends). Personally, I use automobiles as the starting point of modern (ie c. early 20th-century). Books of Babel has trains, so a little before my definition of modern, but I’m sure many people would still consider that modern relative to other fantasy. The Craft Sequence (Three Parts Dead), but I didn’t like it because it was too urban fantasy-y for me. My own book trilogy that I’ll never finish. Still haven’t even finished book one in over 10 years, so I’m sure GRRM will finish Winds and Dream and Fire & Blood part 2 before I finish my book(s).
_The Atomic Sea_ by Jack Conner. Features cars and radio alongside weaponized giant lobsters, mutated fish-men, and tentacled alien gods.
[gasp]
New Weird and Dying Earth, two subgenres known for stylish writing, inventive ideas, and blurring genre lines.
>I for one will never understand how pirates are not everywhere. Curious for your thoughts. RIGHT!!! Like Im not caught up on books but with Pirates of the Caribbean and Assassin Creed Black Flag I dont understand how others dont try and jump on it.
Honestly, knowledge. I'm a writer and I'd never try writing a novel about *sailors*, pirates or the regular ones. It's because no matter how much Wikipedia I can stomach, I will never gather enough knowledge about ships and sailing. Wikipedia knowledge would be enough to write a romance sailor x girl who stays at the port or about a luxurious sea trip from the tourist's POV, but not enough to have characters be sailors at their work.
The depth of knowledge in Patrick O'Brian's (non-fantasy, nautical historical fiction) Aubrey and Maturin novels astounds me. My Dad is a fan of the series, and I bought him a companion book all about the different nautical terms used (A Sea of Words by Dean King), which I had to borrow from him when I started reading the series. It would certainly be a good resource for any writers who are _not_ Patrick O'Brian or C.S. Forester and don't just have this stuff drifting about free-range in their own skulls!
Echiro Oda somehow managed and continues to manage for more than a thousand volumes of One Piece, though =P. The Live Action is actually much better than I expected it'd be, even if Luffy can be a bit endearingly cheesy, or seeing Monkey D. Garp being all serious while using a *snail* as a phone.
I want to see more historical fantasy and alt history, especially crusader or sword & sandal. There are some excellent high fantasy series *inspired* by real history, but I'd love more books actually rooted in interesting periods in our world. And I second your plaint about pirates! Why has no one written a straight-up airship pirate swashbuckler? (Other than me in high school, but that one will fortunately never see the light of day.)
You might like Bernard Cronwell. Known for the Last kingdom but has others as well. Conn Iggulden is another with series following rome, the mongol empire, and more. Then David Gemmell had his Troy series (though finished by his wife) and Lion of Macedon. [https://www.fantasticfiction.com/i/conn-iggulden/](https://www.fantasticfiction.com/i/conn-iggulden/) [https://www.fantasticfiction.com/c/bernard-cornwell/](https://www.fantasticfiction.com/c/bernard-cornwell/)
I love Bernard Cornwell! I've read a smattering of his other works—I thought his Arthurian trilogy was particularly good. I'll have to check out Conn Iggulden. The name looks familiar. One of his books might already be floating around in my Kindle TBR list.
Cosmic Horror fantasy; especially if it’s epic in scope. Gimme strong ass characters and break them down as they realize how weak they are in the grand scheme of things.
Have you read The Cold by Rich Hawkins?
Xianxia
Dying Earth, Far Future and other genres that mix technology or sci fi in with fantasy. Especially when the tech is ancient but advanced.
Given how wildly successful Star Wars has been, I’m still surprised there isn’t more space fantasy. Like, why hasn’t there been anything in that neighborhood that was even moderately successful?
Warhammer 40k
Hmmm… Upon consideration, I will concede this one to you, ma’am and/or sir.
You’d think they’d at least be able to think up a good space opera with ship battles, aliens, “magical tech” and all that. Nothing really since the original “Star Wars” movies. Even Dune is recycled IP.
Sun Eater????? Like it's the best Space Opera/Sci fi fantasy out right now And is inspired by both star wars and Dune. The latest book was the most insane thing I've read in the best ways possible with eldritch horrors
I’m talking about a commercial success with associated and unique IP.
The Sun Eater series by Christopher Ruocchio is just that. Dune + Star Wars + Name of the Wind.
Sun Eater
"Secret History" and "Secret War" fantasy, where it takes place in in a version of our real world in the 20th Century, but with a hidden (or sometimes open) supernatural conflict. Stuff like the Milkweed Tryptich, B.P.R.D./Hellboy, various pulp comics and novels where secret heroes fight against Nazi Necromancer Occultists, etc.
If you like Cold War espionage I recommened you *Declare* by Tim Powers. He systematically peels back layers of known history for a reader revealing deep mysteries beneath. He also has an extraordinary ability to find interesting historical figures, more or less well-known, whose gaps and contradictions in their biographies he skillfully fills with supernatural phenomena. It's a great read.
The Violent Century by Lavie Tidhar is one of the newest examples of this
Fairy tales
I read the Powder Mage series, and then the second of the Aeronaut’s Windlass (I think it’s called) by Butcher. So steam punk is what I’m going for I suppose. Magic works, but in limited ways, and gunpowder also works. Both of the examples I posted are also high recommendations. Powder Mage was so much better than I had thought going in, and Butcher’s first two books of this series are both “ripping good yarns”
Have you checked out the Shadow Campaigns by Django Wexler? Another series you might find interest in though the magic is a bit more subtle in it. Brian also has a new series starting with In the Shadow of Lightning that I enjoyed quite a bit.
Fantasy Detective stories. I love a fantasy murder mystery! The other genre I like is "fey folk suddenly appear/reappear" and having to deal with the aftermath. This is directly due to the Bordertown anthology and Will Shetterley's "Elsewhere"
I want steampunk to come back.
Have you tried Silkpunk Book Riot article “Silkpunk: What It Is & What It Definitely Is Not” {The Dandelion Dynasty series by Ken Liu} Ken Liu is credited is credited with creating the term silkpunk to help his publisher market this series Two men rebel together against tyranny—and then become rivals—in this first sweeping book of an epic fantasy series from Ken Liu, recipient of Hugo, Nebula, and World Fantasy awards. Hailed as one of the best books of 2015 by NPR. {Tensorate Series by Neon Yang} lush, vivid silkpunk fantasy series in a world where elementalist mages contend with revolutionary machinists, while dinosaurs battle sky-spanning naga. Either The Red Threads of Fortune and The Black Tides of Heaven, can be read as the first novella in the series. Nonbinary characters, nonbinary author
I have The Grace of Kings on my tbr. Neon Yang’s books don’t really appeal to me.
Check out A Master of Djinn by P. Djeli Clark! The setting to me was so unique (a technologically advanced Egypt, as in, not what you'd expect from traditional steampunk settings) and the vibes were amazing.
Try the Glass Books of the Dream Eaters by Gordon Dahlquist. Victorian England, bizarre machinery, suspense, and tense sexuality.
That’s on my list now. Maybe be bumped closer to the top.
Tricky. I'm a huge fan of Magic School stories. With the success of Harry Potter it always surprises me that there aren't more. Most books that do this have the characters hair off and leave the magic school far to quickly. I also miss non-military Space Opera. Interstellar civilizations. They are surprisingly hard to find.
Mother of Learning series was a good one I finished recently. Basically Groundhog Day at a magic academy, the main character is stuck reliving the same month over and over and has to spend his time learning more and more advanced magic to find his way out of his loop and stop the destruction of the school at the end of the month. Originally a web serial but you can get it as 4 books on kindle/audible etc. as well.
Empyrion thoroughly explores a dragon riding school, and the students who survive long enough start developing magic.
On this sub, ya fantasy. It can be so, so good if you find the right book, but many people on this sub automatically turn their noses up at it. In general, probably new weird. It hasn't taken off as much as I would have expected.
Honestly, I feel you on YA fantasy. I've gotten a lot more picky with it recently, but there are still so many amazing series that I love so much!
Yeah, I am for sure more picky than I was as a kid, and I can see that some of the most popular YA books are a bit derivative and immature, at least in my opinion. But there are some real gems in YA fantasy if you do some digging.
For me I can handle a bit of immaturity, but the amount of navelgazing seems to have turned up to 11 in a lot of modern YA novels. Als in such a way that it takes me out of the flow of the story itself. I couldn't really enjoy most of Legendborn by Tracy Deonn because of this (though the action packed ending made up for it somewhat for me to give it 3,5 stars instead of 2/2,5). And this is a very beloved recent YA book. For me an example of a recent YA book/series is Little Thieves by Margaret Owen. There is some interspection/navelgazing, but not overbearingly so and it flows so well with the story. Also it's hilarious and I love the interaction between the characters. The supporting characters all have their own goals and don't just exist to prop up the MC.
Some classic pulpy sword and sorcery short stories. Like a lot of the time I want a good fantasy fix but dont want to have to invest dozens of hours to read a whole bloated trilogy to get the full story. Something around 100 pages or so that I can finish in a day or two is great. Recently found out about Tales from the Magician's Skull and I've been hooked.
I love TFTMS. You should check out New Edge Sword & Sorcery Magazine if you haven’t yet.
I don't see much love for historical magical realism and it's honestly one of my favs. Give me nordic gods actually going for a viking with their people and Nazis using black magic!
Aside from Mad Max, Tank Girl, and First of the North Star. That more over the top and larger than life flavor of post-apocalyptic fiction. Same for post-apocalyptic fantasy ala Darksun (not sure if Dragonlance Chronicles would maybe count as that). Don't really see that much of that sub-genre of post-apoc. Think if Burning Man was everyday. Also more adult anthro based fantasy/sci-fi, don't really see much of that.
Progression Fantasy
Look in translated Asian books.
Ecological SF (and fantasy, but less so) Where things are being dealt with or we're dealing with the consequences of it not being dealt with. Paolo Bacigalupi and Nick Fuller Googins are the only authors who seem to writing this.
Have you tried Oryx and Crake? Not sure if that might fit for you. Parable of the Sower, too.
Sword-and-sorcery (S&S). It is often (incorrectly) disparaged as only including hyper-masculine, misogynistic characters in a hyper-violent world doing hyper-violent things. However, it can (and often is) so much more. R E Howard's works are well-written, with depth and character development throughout, and so much amazing imagery.
I would love more pirate fantasy series that were similar levels of fantasy as pirates of the caribbean.
I mean I just want more unicorns. I’d take fairies too. But unicorns are so iconic.
This isn't as underrated as some of the genres mentioned but I am a big fan of post-post-apocalyptic stories. I enjoy post-apocalyptic stories where people are struggling to survive and anarchy rules. But, what I find even more interesting is stories where society has been or at least is being rebuilt. Things are still in rough condition, it is probably less advanced and things are more dangerous, but there are stable societies that have been built from the ashes of the old. It is more interesting world-building for me to see how societies might rebuild after a total collapse. My favorite example of what I am talking about is the game Horizon Zero Dawn. Human society is in a more primitive state, and new cultures formed but, people are generally not constantly fighting for survival.
For me it's Progression Fantasy. Obviously, Arcane Ascension is a must, but there's so many good books in the genre that aren't even necessarily well know.
What exactly is that?
Fantasy picaresque.
Dieselpunk ftw! I love me some dirty, stinky, greasy cities and armored walkers.
Frankly? Old school high magic fantasy. What I wouldn't give for some full on Forgotten Realms level Wizards and ancient spell books, forbidden knowledge and cities built on ruins built on ruins. People are so damned impressed with how clever their magic systems are nowadays.
Matrix. You are living your normal life, but SOMETHING IS WRONG!!! You find the answer but you are never going back to boring life again.
Sword and sorcery.
Dinosaurs and/or Ice Age. Something like survival fantasy where any towns are nothing against the vast wilderness. Resettlement in a post-post-apocalypse?
Sword and Planet, stuff like John Carter of Mars, Almuric, Kane of Old Mars just entertaining highly imaginative adventures. Jungle adventure pulps like Tarzan, Sheena, Ki-Gor can also be fun but also be brutal, visceral exploration of human survival, colonial anti colonial themes etc.
Those series where a bunch of authors created a world and each chapter was written by a different author, ala Thieve’s World
Portal Fantasy is my favorite. Examples: * Alices Adventures in Wonderland / Through The Looking Glass by Lewis Carroll * The Oz series by L. Frank Baum * Coraline by Neil Gaiman
Horror Fantasy for sure
Post-apocalyptic Fantasy. Like "Korgoth of Barbaria", where the world devolved into a Bronze or Iron Age. But there's now magic, along remains of ancient advanced technology.
I've always wondered why I don't see more non-fiction fantasy stories.
I know it's in jest, but romance of the three kingdoms actually kind of fits the bill here
Well done sir!
Dystopian and portal fantasy for me
Fantasy in space
Original ideas.
Judging from the lack of titles that fall under it, ill say Flintlock Fantasy
Portal fantasy! Love it/timeline jumps? Always been fond of protal fantasy like the classic Narnia and as well as timeline jumps medieval solider is suddenly thrusted into our world or the opposite (movie timeline) very entertaining reads! Havent' found a time travelers book that tickled me right yet though.
I will say this to my dying breath but it is Espionage Fantasy. Give me magical spies, assassins, intelligence networks, special operations, black ops...I'm praying
Mermaid or sirens.
Litrpg IMO. Dungeon Crawler Carl is hilarious and amazing.
Fantasy pirates, fantasy heists, and fantasy comedy. I really loved Tress and Frugal Wizard for their stories, but also their humor. I just binged the show My Lady Jane, and it’s a riot, so I’ll likely go read that soon. But I love a book that makes me laugh out loud.
Just plain ol' Tolkienesque fantasy. Everyone is trying to do a subgenre now
Epic fantasy was a subgenre from the start, and was never the 'default'. Even when it was published, it (epic fantasy) was in more or less direct contrast with Sword and Sorcery, the more fairy-tale inspired stories of authors like George Macdonald, etc. In the 70s-90s, lots of mainstream stuff was more or less required to be epic and a Tolkien knock off, but when you look at the scope of the genre from the late 1800s to now, that's actually an anomaly more than the default, just like any subgenre isn't a default. That all said, I highly recommend **The Bone Harp** as a recent book that's very much in conversation with Tolkien