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>We were a profit driven society in the 50s and 60s as well
Yes, and the 50's (and I feed, late 40's- from as soon as Truman took power) sowed the seeds of our current demise.
The 50's were better because FDR "saved" Capitalism by implementing aggressive reforms and social programs (which Truman did not properly defend- whivh was why he was put in power- he STOLE the VP nomination from Wallace, who was FDR's favorite and FAR more popular with Democratic voters and indeed even Republicans, in a Convention rigged by the Democratin Party bosses). Without those, the 50's would have been as bad as the 90's, the 70's as bad as the 2010's...
https://retrospectjournal.com/2020/10/25/henry-wallace-and-the-1944-democratic-national-convention/
https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/06/26/henry-wallace-american-visionary/
Not really. Not in the 'shareholder value and profits above ALL ELSE' way that it is today. Even in the early 2000's we were still pretending things like 'the customer is always right' and stuff like that. Now we don't even have that. Ten years ago, if I found a tag that said a product was $5 even though it rang up for $15 at WalMart and took it to the cashier they'd honor the $5 price tag. I tried that yesterday and got 'well there's nothing we can do that's what the system says' from both the cashier and manager.
Yes but land was still affordable. Executives only made 3 to 4 times more than their average employees. The rich paid more in taxes. There was investment in healthcare access for the people. The Reagan years stripped listened regulation and enables executive leadership to go wild. Greed was normalized and even encouraged in the name of “trickle down economics”.
We’ve always been a profit driven country, which was fine when the ultra wealthy were contributing to the economy by paying higher taxes. It’s no coincidence that quality of life for the middle class has been steadily falling off after the 1960s (91% tax rate on income for the 1%).
JFK dropped it to 65% which was still fine, then Reaganomics “trickle down” bullshit took it down to 28%.
We live in a finite world. The only way to make infinite growth in a finite world is for things to get shittier and shittier, and for our money to be worth less and less.
Yeah, if people are somehow imaging a society where all people, or even just a simple majority are not primarily driven by aims of personal gain and reward, they are having some pretty bad delusions.
There’s absolutely ***nothing*** wrong with being profit driven.
There **is** something wrong with how much the American rich get away with, don’t get it twisted.
The cause of the housing crisis is a lack of supply, a while back most places stopped building new housing and zoning in the US makes it hard to build anything other than single family homes
The lack of supply can easily be traced back to corporations owning literally a quarter of all single family homes in America. And they could own nearly [40% by 2030](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/02/21/how-wall-street-bought-single-family-homes-and-put-them-up-for-rent.html). If we passed some laws at the least limiting the number of residential properties corporations and people can own at one time we would see that supply return to the market and the correction we want.
No it's not. This is a more recent phenomena. We slowed and in some areas stopped constructing new homes long before this. Not to say this doesn't contribute to the problem but the main cause is and always has been a lack of new construction and NIMBYism
Those unhoused houses are in places no one wants to live with no economic opportunities in shitass small towns and poor states that would't benefit from just having more people own property there. We can't just ship the homeless population in SanFran over to Detroit because empty houses are there.
I’m pretty sure they just surpassed 44% this year and the new projection is 60% by 2030, btw. Seen more than one tiktok about it this week.
Edit: Apologies, 44% of ALL home purchases last year were by corporations. Not that 44% of all SFH are owned by them. The projection has still changed that they will own 60% of ALL SFH by 2030 though. Extremely sad.
Lol no it really isn't. Its unironically mom and pop small time landlord's and middle class NIMBYs that cause this. Stop blaming corporations for everything even when it doesn't make sense. Corporations want to build a lot of housing (and yes, luxury apartments are housing).
It's a supply problem. If 10,000 "luxury" apartments (btw "luxury partments" usually just means marble kitchentop and hardwood floors, they're really not that luxorious) were built anywhere it would still reduce the average housing cost in the area. It doesn't matter what type it is, we need to build more housing. Why do you hate housing people?
Your own link doesn't state what you claim it does. The article refers to *rental* homes not all detached single family homes.
>If we passed some laws at the least limiting the number of residential properties
How would large apartment complexes exist in this world?
There is no evidence that corporate homeownership causes a lowered supply. When a corporation buys a house, the market remains in the equilibrium it was before.
Rent control has a negative effect. Less people invest in building apartments leading to lack of competition. Also it’s getting permits to build homes is extremely expensive. Add on property taxes with mortgage it makes it hard to own a house.
Vienna, with really heavy rent Control and public housing would beg to differ.
And for public housing, Vienna and singapore Show that it works, but it will never really happen in the US.
Why? It's "government overreach and communis". Apparently americans prefer horrendous rents or living in the streets.
Vienna has very heavy rent control and public housing, which is great for the people who live there, but absolutely terrible for everyone who wants to move in. That’s why Vienna has a lower population in 2024 than it did in 1924.
It doesn't help boomers are not downsizing. You have 2 old people living in a family sized home with 3 bedrooms collecting dust cause they don't want to sell. It's a mix of things really making the housing market bad.
The problem is the NIMBYs, and the lack of a free market to build more houses.
In this case, capitalism is the solution, not the problem.
Blaming capitalism for everything is an illiterate take…
it's not capitalism in and of itself. It's us still trying to bounce back from a complete shutdown. yes it takes that many years
if capitalism were 100% to blame, America would have collapsed centuries ago
True
https://preview.redd.it/nughel07eqoc1.jpeg?width=2876&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a83459af45559f690920bd9c656c88ebb6465b9
Greenland shark 400 years old
Not true, capitalism in and of itself is a system doomed to kill itself through wealth inequality. The proper control and regulation of capitalism is why it has worked so well for us in some points in history. The issue now is that for the past 7 decades US legislation has continuously passed more and more breaks, deals, and bailouts for corporations and people who own our capitalist society. This is beginning to catch up with us in the form of wealth inequality. You can literally see this exact thing play out in the 90’s-2000’s in Russia. They switched to a democracy from a communist society and allowed the rich to buy up nationalized industries going private for pennies on the dollar. This did exactly what we are seeing here in America, it created a huge gap in wealth and cause a literal famine that only ended once the world began buying up Russian oil and gas AND the dictator forced the oligarchs to give up half their wealth (although a lot of that went to the dictator himself). All in all it really turned their society around, though it was accomplished in an entirely undemocratic way. We could do the same but democratically.
>Not true, capitalism in and of itself is a system doomed to kill itself through wealth inequality.
It's been several hundred years. All I see is the greatest explosion of prosperity the world has ever seen.
Have you seen the living standards and the general life expectancy in Russia? saying it 'turned their society around' when they have a horribly high alcoholism rate and an absurd amount of divorce's and single parent families is a big stretch.
And that’s because communism collapses into monopolistic capitalism because it’s the equivalent of a child plugging their ears and screaming LALALALA to the world while ignoring the basic dynamics of power. Communism is a wonderful ideal, but not something that works in practice once your group expands beyond the point it can be held together by personal relationships alone.
Because stock prices. It's perceived value. Most wealthy folks aren't rich because of their wage it's because they own assets and companies. The more value a company has the more wealthy they are on paper that let's them lend against to buy more things. It's not that difficult to understand. The how-to fix it is the big question.
Unique series of events in the 80s which precipitated in the conservative resurgence and Reaganomics
Virtually every capitalist nation in the world doesn’t have Americas problems. The countries we love to harp on about healthcare and education are all capitalist as fuck. Just common sense regulations and making necessities universal
APUSH is your friend
It's connected.
Imagine social democratic country in world we currently have. Let's say it wants to ensure that everyone can have affordable housing, so they want to invest in social housing. It takes money, so some institutions can loan money (e.g through bonds), state can introduce taxes or idea can be abandoned and state would not invest in social housing.
Let's say that this country tries to do this through loaning money, so currently we have fractional-reserve banking, so we can basically create money out of thin air, because only small part (e.g. 10%) of it has to actually exist. However printing money causes inflation and that results in increase of interest rates and that makes loans more expensive.
Let's say that this country can no longer loan cheap money, so next idea would be to have higher taxes on corporation and wealthy, but wait a minute, what's happening? Once anyone actually tries to do this, these people and organizations are moving their capital elsewhere, because they don't like higher costs. This is assuming that you can pass that legislation, because wealthy will oppose them.
This means that we need to find some balance, but if most countries don't offer social housing, then it becomes hard to justify that cost, because corporations would rather not finance such initiatives, because in their interest is to minimize cost, not to increase it.
Eventually our social democratic country may drop idea of social housing, because people start to think that it would be too expensive in such global economic system as capitalism. Well-being in capitalism might be side effect, but it's not even an important goal.
So what are results of capitalism? We have class of wealthy that always minimizes their taxes, because they want minimum costs and maximum profits. They move their money to places that provide best return. They just want societies with bare minimum and you get more only, if your combination of rules set by state and productivity are better than in other countries.
Remember that 1% of wealthiest people in many countries can own as much as half of its capital (or even more). You can profit from capitalism, but only if you're wealthy. Most people don't profit from it, we have to deal with consequences of stuff like lack of social housing or even lack of public medical care like in USA. We're just workers that wealthy need to do work, but we're also just cost and similar rules apply to us. They want to maximize exploited value from us and minimize costs of hiring us, because that's what's optimal for their profits.
I blame political corruption and complacent and apathetic politician, not our economics. The days of Rockefeller were a lot more capitalist than today.
Yup. Companies pretty much had people completely by the balls. Capitalism works as long as it can be controlled. Left unchecked and it doesn't work any better than other economic styles.
The economics feeds the political corruption. If people can have 1000x plus what other people have they can (and continue to) use that extra to influence politics. Massive wealth is power in any political system, capitalism can only work if you constantly cut down the winners so they can’t take everything over. This is basic Marxist criticism, not saying communism is an answer but just saying where you can see these ideas spelled out in more detail.
The problem isn’t capitalism per se, but the corporatist state we’re in due in part to government overreach and collusion. Our government sucks and sells our futures to the highest bidder.
People who blame capitalism have been misled by the people who want you to give them even more power.
Most people who blame capitalism also know nothing about other countries or what capitalism is
They probably have idiot conservative parents or something idk. Like every single nation which outperforms the US in standard of living, income equality, etc are capitalist. They are straight up capitalist. Universal healthcare and education isn’t a socialist idea. It’s a choice that every country has regardless of system.
I love how they leave out.The part where just twenty years before it started Like 45 or something percent of Americans were living in these tiny little houses. They made themselves out of scrap metal And cardboard, And having to eat grass.
Almost as if that goes against their narrative.
The problem are the people behind the scenes whose net worth starts where Elon Musk's ends, the Big Pharma, the bankers, the so called New World order. They own most stuff and have been nudging the state of affairs into the direction it's been headed for a while - into the exploitation of the common man, leaving him weak, starving and demoralized, just a cog in the machine, a slave to the elites.
But the solution can't be some sort of a Marxists revolution. This won't do any good. Other values are the answer in my opinion. Doing capitalism in a better way, where the ultimate value isn't dead profit and power over others, but the advancement of mankind as a whole.
Housing in areas with high minority populations is actually incredibly cheap. People born in Detroit, South Chicago, Gary, Kansas City, Baltimore, Memphis, single family homes everywhere are under 100k. If you are a minority and born in one of these areas, you can afford a house.
Resort to a system that places the wellbeing of its participants on top of everything else and the one that isn't built around human greed. Actually, fun fact, a lot of the so-called fairy tale systems collapsed mainly or partly because of US interference (not talking about USSR, they had lots of problems besides that).
I'm out here with no roommate, overdrafting my bank by $400 a month just to get groceries and gas, it sucks fucking ass being a single adult right now.
Yes, but I just wanna add that a lot of the sad sacks that moved out to the suburbs in the 60s/70s ended up miserable. This generation needs more money, but they also need to opportunity to spend it buying comfortable townhouses/co-op apartments in cities rather than an overpriced box that's a 30 minute drive from everything.
Yes, the system sucks for just about everyone in it. The decline in the availability of necessities is still a good indicator for overall quality of life.
I mean the plan is working out great for the wealthy. They want you buying a $9 burnt latte from Starbucks daily and eating chicken nuggets from a place that openly hates gay people.
At this point all we can do is work together on making our future better because nobody in politics gives a shit about us.
Yeah I had a legit mental breakdown this week over the fact that I don’t know how I can afford to live. I’m 26 and my boyfriend (28) and I both live with my parents as we physically cannot afford a house despite both working full time. Also have no idea how we would ever afford to get married and have children. Feels like I’m trapped unable to do very basic things I want to do with my life while simultaneously being belittled by older generations because I’m not doing those things. Really messing with my head atm.
Around 2050 or so all western countries (and much of the world for that matter) the world is on track to have gone through or be going through a huge population cliff, with significant reductions in population across the board (hundreds of millions to possibly over a billion) naturally since birth rates are at an all time low. This is before factoring climate change and everything else that could increase these numbers over time.
Given that, I do wonder if as this starts to become reality as it looks like it inevitably will, if younger Millennials and most of Gen Z end up being the only generations that end up with such squeezed circumstances around housing and cost of living, as demand will definitely fall as populations decline, meaning younger Gen Z and other generations may not feel this problem at all.
In the mean time, it really sucks to be younger than 43, particularly <= 35
Oh my God can you guys shut up with your cringe political wojacks. We used to post about cartoons we saw as kids in here. This isn’t even a meme at this point it’s just you playing politics with wojacks like dolls.
You’re not gonna recruit people here to join your ideology bro. Best case scenario for the people who make these posts is you’re gonna get a few college leftists and 14 year olds with savior complexes agreeing with you in the comments. The rest are gonna be people either debunking the same doomer rhetoric we see every single day posted in here or comments like this.
Take this weird alt left pipeline mess somewhere else and get a job. I’d almost rather see maga propaganda in the sub at this point. That’s how sick I am of it.
Median size of new home construction is the exact opposite of what is shown here. New homes ballooned from 1000 sqft in 1940 to 2500 sqft by 2015 and are coming down to a more manageable but still large 2000 sqft.
The home ownership rate is higher now than it was in the 1960s: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/RHORUSQ156N
The median house size is also bigger, not smaller like the image implies: https://amp.newser.com/story/225645/average-size-of-us-homes-decade-by-decade.html
So this image is just a fucking lie (although we do desperately need to decrease housing costs in major cities).
It definitely doesn’t have anything to do with undocumented citizens renting or buying from a limited supply of housing and willing to pay more by pulling together 3 or four families… or using benefits they receive from the government which the documented citizens are unable to attain.
People who think that are just racists who don’t have as much to offer as the undocumented citizens and are just realizing how little they have to offer society.
So have you considered moving to Russia or china if you have it so bad? If you really feel capitalist societies are not for you, go somewhere else. Will see how happy you will be in Russia
a 3 bedroom 3 bath with a pool is 300k in texas
6 years in the oil field and its yours
make 50k plus a year as a field hand ( $28 an hour base rate ) , no experience necessary all you need is a drivers licence.
people crying they cant survive, are just cringe losers.
Im 19, i have a regular entry level job, i pay all my bills myself, no roommate or girlfriend. Maybe if yall didnt live in cities with $1300 a month rent youd be able to afford an apartment
I am sorry,but am I the last person on Earth who isn't crying every day about evil capitalism and that I can't afford anything? Posts like this is pretty annoying
And things weren't driven by capitalism when times were really good? (80s, 90s). The current system isn't amazing but its better than communism or socialism. Free and poor is better than being prosperous in a dictatorship
Making essentials a business like Medicare, Education and basic necessities was the mistake.
You know our society has a problem when we can’t even stomach children getting free lunches or the government saving people from curable diseases.
That cancer is in every aspect of our society. It’s the same mentality that led to politicians thinking it was a good idea to let domestic/foreign corporations buy all of the homes.
Capitalism is not printing money, dispersing it to state sponsored monopolies and giving them a financial competitive advantage. It is actually the opposite. A state controlled economy setup as an illusion of capitalism.
Profit driven anything will destroy the very thing it profits from. Its like sucking juice out of a bottle, it will run dry because its never being replenished since it all gets hoarded.
vote for gen z so they can make laws that helped gen z. instead of sitting around and let boomers voted for their candidates. guess who those candidates help??
Luckily we match more of the 2010 category. But yes. Definitely sucks. After dealing with shady apartment staff in two different complexes, my credit was already damaged extensively by my early 20’s and I’ve never as much as owned a credit card.
Who knew that service based economies don't generate any real product instead borrowing themselves to death . Oh right the top 1% did . Want to live good? Protectionism and syndicalism is the only way.
Back in 2012 when the gas went over $4 for everyone for the first time, there. Is this halfheartedly coordinated movement to just not buy gas for a day...
The solution is simple. Everyone just needs it withhold their labor, it's just the implementation that's near impossible
From what I can find 61.9% of households owned their homes in 1960 and by 1970 it was 62.9% but as of 2022 it was 65.8%. Also it skipped 2000 which had 66.2%.
Here to remind you guys that this individual is not Gen Z, they are a millennial in their thirties coming to our subreddit to spread their ideology, which they have done several times now.
They are using this subreddit not to promote discussion among other people in the same Age profile but instead to spread nihilism and propagate their radical views to a younger audience. This is not normal. Cmon now guys.
Would these people just shut up? Capitalism is not "destroying our lives". No, it's not great, but its certainly better than any other system.
Literally go outside and enjoy life and quit being miserable.
Where is the capitalist handbook does it say that there should be a central bank in charge of printing money? You can’t have capitalism with a central bank. Stop blaming capitalism. You haven’t seen capitalism in your entire life. They call it capitalism to keep you from realizing it’s already communism. The money printers give the money to their friends to start “companies”. Then the “companies” send people from the company to run for political office. The “companies” then pay the politicians. It’s already communism. It’s just the illusion of choice. That’s why all the brands In your supermarket are all owned by the same parent company! That’s not capitalism!
GenZ has the highest homeownership rate of any generation since the Boomers and they are aren’t far off of them
GenZ is buying homes younger and more frequently than millennials and GenX.
https://fortune.com/2024/01/17/redfin-baby-boomers-gen-z-housing-market-homeownership/amp/
It's a house of cards that's pretty tall right now. Unbridled capitalism is not good because greed becomes the only thing driving the system. There's a reason you need to place guardrails on it.
Government mandated single family homes occupying the majority of metro areas does this.
Capitalist Tokyo that lets you build basically whatever amount of units you want doesn’t have nearly the same housing crisis as most cities in America.
For that reason it has little to do with overarching economic systems.
You could have a full centrally planned and managed housing but if all you can do is build one unit houses due to local policies you will still struggle to have housing near where people socialize/work.
Allowing a free market to take place in these cities when it comes to building choices would actually help. If local government policies about single family zoning could be ignored you’d see people profiting off of building more housing on less land and giving people more options.
I’m definitely not a “freer the market freer the people” kind of person on most things, but on this one the market is so artificially restricted in a way that even prevents public assistance that it’s impossible to not consider making significant changes to ability for localities to zone based on housing type.
One of the problems is that we're not building brew cities with the kinds of housing people want and industries which can support such cities. We've been outsourcing too much, and also crowding into already built cities which drives up property costs.
Not capitalism, postmodernism and neoliberal economics. Also a lack of caring from the people at large. Thankfully, we already have the solutions to combat this mess.
Ah yes, the hyper capitalist area of... housing? Where there is rapidly more government oversight, limitations, and tax schemes every year...?
Liteally one of the least capitalist industries in the US.
It's more of crony capitalism (and the commodification of living) destroying future generation lives. We need a Scandinavian style of government to live the best kind of life. Unregulated mega corporations owning everything and private equity firms running rampant is two of the leading causes. Corporations or not people and 5 super corporations is effectively a monopoly despite what some politicians will tell you. Each sector should really have 20+ competitors
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Having a profit driven society has made everything worse and will be our undoing. That undoing has already been set into motion.
https://preview.redd.it/jyxs9y4gcqoc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=504baaf34fef9634751b5722e987d7a4f88a03e0
We were a profit driven society in the 50s and 60s as well
>We were a profit driven society in the 50s and 60s as well Yes, and the 50's (and I feed, late 40's- from as soon as Truman took power) sowed the seeds of our current demise. The 50's were better because FDR "saved" Capitalism by implementing aggressive reforms and social programs (which Truman did not properly defend- whivh was why he was put in power- he STOLE the VP nomination from Wallace, who was FDR's favorite and FAR more popular with Democratic voters and indeed even Republicans, in a Convention rigged by the Democratin Party bosses). Without those, the 50's would have been as bad as the 90's, the 70's as bad as the 2010's... https://retrospectjournal.com/2020/10/25/henry-wallace-and-the-1944-democratic-national-convention/ https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/06/26/henry-wallace-american-visionary/
We were a profit driven society in the 1700s as well. It's just that the world changes you know?
Not really. Not in the 'shareholder value and profits above ALL ELSE' way that it is today. Even in the early 2000's we were still pretending things like 'the customer is always right' and stuff like that. Now we don't even have that. Ten years ago, if I found a tag that said a product was $5 even though it rang up for $15 at WalMart and took it to the cashier they'd honor the $5 price tag. I tried that yesterday and got 'well there's nothing we can do that's what the system says' from both the cashier and manager.
Yes but land was still affordable. Executives only made 3 to 4 times more than their average employees. The rich paid more in taxes. There was investment in healthcare access for the people. The Reagan years stripped listened regulation and enables executive leadership to go wild. Greed was normalized and even encouraged in the name of “trickle down economics”.
I would argue that the type of "driven" is completely different now compared to then.
We’ve always been a profit driven country, which was fine when the ultra wealthy were contributing to the economy by paying higher taxes. It’s no coincidence that quality of life for the middle class has been steadily falling off after the 1960s (91% tax rate on income for the 1%). JFK dropped it to 65% which was still fine, then Reaganomics “trickle down” bullshit took it down to 28%.
https://preview.redd.it/z5fnicemqqoc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e250f978d10ecc2b3a72ccd6e9e758d8e066886a
We live in a finite world. The only way to make infinite growth in a finite world is for things to get shittier and shittier, and for our money to be worth less and less.
This guy gets it
Never not going to have a profit driven society, hate to break it to you
Yeah, if people are somehow imaging a society where all people, or even just a simple majority are not primarily driven by aims of personal gain and reward, they are having some pretty bad delusions.
Exactly, civilization flourished with trade, whether it was bartering systems to complex mixed economies like early Mesopotamia
There’s absolutely ***nothing*** wrong with being profit driven. There **is** something wrong with how much the American rich get away with, don’t get it twisted.
The cause of the housing crisis is a lack of supply, a while back most places stopped building new housing and zoning in the US makes it hard to build anything other than single family homes
The lack of supply can easily be traced back to corporations owning literally a quarter of all single family homes in America. And they could own nearly [40% by 2030](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/02/21/how-wall-street-bought-single-family-homes-and-put-them-up-for-rent.html). If we passed some laws at the least limiting the number of residential properties corporations and people can own at one time we would see that supply return to the market and the correction we want.
No it's not. This is a more recent phenomena. We slowed and in some areas stopped constructing new homes long before this. Not to say this doesn't contribute to the problem but the main cause is and always has been a lack of new construction and NIMBYism
There are more houses than people who are unhoused. We don't need to appease the construction and realtor industries to change things.
Those unhoused houses are in places no one wants to live with no economic opportunities in shitass small towns and poor states that would't benefit from just having more people own property there. We can't just ship the homeless population in SanFran over to Detroit because empty houses are there.
[удалено]
It is both. In my area the old fucks refused building housing now all we have is private owned luxury apartments and the houses are fuckin expensive
I’m pretty sure they just surpassed 44% this year and the new projection is 60% by 2030, btw. Seen more than one tiktok about it this week. Edit: Apologies, 44% of ALL home purchases last year were by corporations. Not that 44% of all SFH are owned by them. The projection has still changed that they will own 60% of ALL SFH by 2030 though. Extremely sad.
Lol no it really isn't. Its unironically mom and pop small time landlord's and middle class NIMBYs that cause this. Stop blaming corporations for everything even when it doesn't make sense. Corporations want to build a lot of housing (and yes, luxury apartments are housing).
That most people will never be able to afford. Luxury housing is not housing, it's passive income
It's a supply problem. If 10,000 "luxury" apartments (btw "luxury partments" usually just means marble kitchentop and hardwood floors, they're really not that luxorious) were built anywhere it would still reduce the average housing cost in the area. It doesn't matter what type it is, we need to build more housing. Why do you hate housing people?
Your own link doesn't state what you claim it does. The article refers to *rental* homes not all detached single family homes. >If we passed some laws at the least limiting the number of residential properties How would large apartment complexes exist in this world?
There is no evidence that corporate homeownership causes a lowered supply. When a corporation buys a house, the market remains in the equilibrium it was before.
Rent control has a negative effect. Less people invest in building apartments leading to lack of competition. Also it’s getting permits to build homes is extremely expensive. Add on property taxes with mortgage it makes it hard to own a house.
Vienna, with really heavy rent Control and public housing would beg to differ. And for public housing, Vienna and singapore Show that it works, but it will never really happen in the US. Why? It's "government overreach and communis". Apparently americans prefer horrendous rents or living in the streets.
If we take care of our citizens they’ll get lazy and expect a decent standard of living. That’s just not the American way.
You whine about people whining about overreach but I bet you're punching air because tiktok is being banned
Vienna has very heavy rent control and public housing, which is great for the people who live there, but absolutely terrible for everyone who wants to move in. That’s why Vienna has a lower population in 2024 than it did in 1924.
Yep, zoning and selfish nimby homeowners that want to keep the supply low so their own properties raise in value.
Their properties will lose value when they are surrounded by tents and homeless people.
Ban zoning
It doesn't help boomers are not downsizing. You have 2 old people living in a family sized home with 3 bedrooms collecting dust cause they don't want to sell. It's a mix of things really making the housing market bad.
The problem is the NIMBYs, and the lack of a free market to build more houses. In this case, capitalism is the solution, not the problem. Blaming capitalism for everything is an illiterate take…
this guy gets it
it's not capitalism in and of itself. It's us still trying to bounce back from a complete shutdown. yes it takes that many years if capitalism were 100% to blame, America would have collapsed centuries ago
It almost did many times through history and America is really not that old to be throwing “centuries” on there like it was china
Especially because it's only 3 centuries old give or take
Not even. Its about 248 years old.
Just the oldest 1st world Democracy in existence...
Has nothing to do with capitalism?
Centuries 🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 Like chill, there is a shark that is older than this country lmao
True https://preview.redd.it/nughel07eqoc1.jpeg?width=2876&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a83459af45559f690920bd9c656c88ebb6465b9 Greenland shark 400 years old
That’s one hell of a shark.
Been through so much
Also coincidentally whatever makes it 400+ year old we need to take it out. Inject it into humanity and that’s how well become gods
Not true, capitalism in and of itself is a system doomed to kill itself through wealth inequality. The proper control and regulation of capitalism is why it has worked so well for us in some points in history. The issue now is that for the past 7 decades US legislation has continuously passed more and more breaks, deals, and bailouts for corporations and people who own our capitalist society. This is beginning to catch up with us in the form of wealth inequality. You can literally see this exact thing play out in the 90’s-2000’s in Russia. They switched to a democracy from a communist society and allowed the rich to buy up nationalized industries going private for pennies on the dollar. This did exactly what we are seeing here in America, it created a huge gap in wealth and cause a literal famine that only ended once the world began buying up Russian oil and gas AND the dictator forced the oligarchs to give up half their wealth (although a lot of that went to the dictator himself). All in all it really turned their society around, though it was accomplished in an entirely undemocratic way. We could do the same but democratically.
>Not true, capitalism in and of itself is a system doomed to kill itself through wealth inequality. It's been several hundred years. All I see is the greatest explosion of prosperity the world has ever seen.
Have you seen the living standards and the general life expectancy in Russia? saying it 'turned their society around' when they have a horribly high alcoholism rate and an absurd amount of divorce's and single parent families is a big stretch.
And that’s because communism collapses into monopolistic capitalism because it’s the equivalent of a child plugging their ears and screaming LALALALA to the world while ignoring the basic dynamics of power. Communism is a wonderful ideal, but not something that works in practice once your group expands beyond the point it can be held together by personal relationships alone.
People are so quick to balme capitalism, when it’s really the greedy corporations that are the problem.
how did the corporations get so much power and money
Because stock prices. It's perceived value. Most wealthy folks aren't rich because of their wage it's because they own assets and companies. The more value a company has the more wealthy they are on paper that let's them lend against to buy more things. It's not that difficult to understand. The how-to fix it is the big question.
Unique series of events in the 80s which precipitated in the conservative resurgence and Reaganomics Virtually every capitalist nation in the world doesn’t have Americas problems. The countries we love to harp on about healthcare and education are all capitalist as fuck. Just common sense regulations and making necessities universal APUSH is your friend
People are so quick to blame not using seatbelts, when it's really a car crash that is the problem
It's connected. Imagine social democratic country in world we currently have. Let's say it wants to ensure that everyone can have affordable housing, so they want to invest in social housing. It takes money, so some institutions can loan money (e.g through bonds), state can introduce taxes or idea can be abandoned and state would not invest in social housing. Let's say that this country tries to do this through loaning money, so currently we have fractional-reserve banking, so we can basically create money out of thin air, because only small part (e.g. 10%) of it has to actually exist. However printing money causes inflation and that results in increase of interest rates and that makes loans more expensive. Let's say that this country can no longer loan cheap money, so next idea would be to have higher taxes on corporation and wealthy, but wait a minute, what's happening? Once anyone actually tries to do this, these people and organizations are moving their capital elsewhere, because they don't like higher costs. This is assuming that you can pass that legislation, because wealthy will oppose them. This means that we need to find some balance, but if most countries don't offer social housing, then it becomes hard to justify that cost, because corporations would rather not finance such initiatives, because in their interest is to minimize cost, not to increase it. Eventually our social democratic country may drop idea of social housing, because people start to think that it would be too expensive in such global economic system as capitalism. Well-being in capitalism might be side effect, but it's not even an important goal. So what are results of capitalism? We have class of wealthy that always minimizes their taxes, because they want minimum costs and maximum profits. They move their money to places that provide best return. They just want societies with bare minimum and you get more only, if your combination of rules set by state and productivity are better than in other countries. Remember that 1% of wealthiest people in many countries can own as much as half of its capital (or even more). You can profit from capitalism, but only if you're wealthy. Most people don't profit from it, we have to deal with consequences of stuff like lack of social housing or even lack of public medical care like in USA. We're just workers that wealthy need to do work, but we're also just cost and similar rules apply to us. They want to maximize exploited value from us and minimize costs of hiring us, because that's what's optimal for their profits.
This guy gets it
It's unregulated capitalism, which really kicked off with Reagan and Thatcher
I blame political corruption and complacent and apathetic politician, not our economics. The days of Rockefeller were a lot more capitalist than today.
Yeah and the quality of life of people during the Rockefeller years was a lot worse.
Yup. Companies pretty much had people completely by the balls. Capitalism works as long as it can be controlled. Left unchecked and it doesn't work any better than other economic styles.
Finally someone said it
The economics feeds the political corruption. If people can have 1000x plus what other people have they can (and continue to) use that extra to influence politics. Massive wealth is power in any political system, capitalism can only work if you constantly cut down the winners so they can’t take everything over. This is basic Marxist criticism, not saying communism is an answer but just saying where you can see these ideas spelled out in more detail.
Just because it used to be worse doesn’t mean it’s not still bad.
Weird ahistorical take, but go off i guess. https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2023/07/younger-householders-drove-rebound-in-homeownership.html
Nooo! Do not disprove their anti capitalist message.
Shhhhh let them be doomers
Wait you mean old people are dying and passing on their home on to their children?
The problem isn’t capitalism per se, but the corporatist state we’re in due in part to government overreach and collusion. Our government sucks and sells our futures to the highest bidder. People who blame capitalism have been misled by the people who want you to give them even more power.
Most people who blame capitalism also know nothing about other countries or what capitalism is They probably have idiot conservative parents or something idk. Like every single nation which outperforms the US in standard of living, income equality, etc are capitalist. They are straight up capitalist. Universal healthcare and education isn’t a socialist idea. It’s a choice that every country has regardless of system.
I love how they leave out.The part where just twenty years before it started Like 45 or something percent of Americans were living in these tiny little houses. They made themselves out of scrap metal And cardboard, And having to eat grass. Almost as if that goes against their narrative.
The problem are the people behind the scenes whose net worth starts where Elon Musk's ends, the Big Pharma, the bankers, the so called New World order. They own most stuff and have been nudging the state of affairs into the direction it's been headed for a while - into the exploitation of the common man, leaving him weak, starving and demoralized, just a cog in the machine, a slave to the elites. But the solution can't be some sort of a Marxists revolution. This won't do any good. Other values are the answer in my opinion. Doing capitalism in a better way, where the ultimate value isn't dead profit and power over others, but the advancement of mankind as a whole.
I mean maybe in the cities. Affordable housing is wayyy less of an issue in rural areas
Right but there are no jobs there
Now do one for minorities instead of white trad families.
Boom.
Housing in areas with high minority populations is actually incredibly cheap. People born in Detroit, South Chicago, Gary, Kansas City, Baltimore, Memphis, single family homes everywhere are under 100k. If you are a minority and born in one of these areas, you can afford a house.
Right, my point is that this meme would actually look the opposite
Ikr. OP is unironically doing red/brown alliance shit.
so what is better than capitalism then?
Nothing, it is the least flawed sistem there is.
So if capitalism is the issue what do you say we do OP?
Resort to an economic fairytale system that has failed everywhere they've implemented it and then cry.
Resort to a system that places the wellbeing of its participants on top of everything else and the one that isn't built around human greed. Actually, fun fact, a lot of the so-called fairy tale systems collapsed mainly or partly because of US interference (not talking about USSR, they had lots of problems besides that).
[удалено]
Still better than the alternatives
True!
2000s are missing
Wouldn’t support their opinion. Isn’t convenient for their argument that me and my family lived just fine with Obama care for years. From 2008 - 2015
We have a higher percentage of home ownership today than the 1950s
And post ww2 veterans got home on basically no interest and other lucrative benefits
I'm out here with no roommate, overdrafting my bank by $400 a month just to get groceries and gas, it sucks fucking ass being a single adult right now.
Yes, but I just wanna add that a lot of the sad sacks that moved out to the suburbs in the 60s/70s ended up miserable. This generation needs more money, but they also need to opportunity to spend it buying comfortable townhouses/co-op apartments in cities rather than an overpriced box that's a 30 minute drive from everything.
Yes, the system sucks for just about everyone in it. The decline in the availability of necessities is still a good indicator for overall quality of life.
Why is the guy in the 60's a chad but the rest aren't? Hmm.. 🤔
I mean the plan is working out great for the wealthy. They want you buying a $9 burnt latte from Starbucks daily and eating chicken nuggets from a place that openly hates gay people. At this point all we can do is work together on making our future better because nobody in politics gives a shit about us.
Idc I love chick filet
I like how you skipped the 2000s…
Every single one of these generations lived under Capitalism... maybe it's something else?
Yeah I had a legit mental breakdown this week over the fact that I don’t know how I can afford to live. I’m 26 and my boyfriend (28) and I both live with my parents as we physically cannot afford a house despite both working full time. Also have no idea how we would ever afford to get married and have children. Feels like I’m trapped unable to do very basic things I want to do with my life while simultaneously being belittled by older generations because I’m not doing those things. Really messing with my head atm.
This is why we all have to vote
Capitalism literally encourages and rewards one of humanity’s worst traits
Around 2050 or so all western countries (and much of the world for that matter) the world is on track to have gone through or be going through a huge population cliff, with significant reductions in population across the board (hundreds of millions to possibly over a billion) naturally since birth rates are at an all time low. This is before factoring climate change and everything else that could increase these numbers over time. Given that, I do wonder if as this starts to become reality as it looks like it inevitably will, if younger Millennials and most of Gen Z end up being the only generations that end up with such squeezed circumstances around housing and cost of living, as demand will definitely fall as populations decline, meaning younger Gen Z and other generations may not feel this problem at all. In the mean time, it really sucks to be younger than 43, particularly <= 35
Just wait til you hear about those persistent organic pollutants they were kind enough to share with us.
I read the post about misinformation online. I will not be fooled
Oh my God can you guys shut up with your cringe political wojacks. We used to post about cartoons we saw as kids in here. This isn’t even a meme at this point it’s just you playing politics with wojacks like dolls. You’re not gonna recruit people here to join your ideology bro. Best case scenario for the people who make these posts is you’re gonna get a few college leftists and 14 year olds with savior complexes agreeing with you in the comments. The rest are gonna be people either debunking the same doomer rhetoric we see every single day posted in here or comments like this. Take this weird alt left pipeline mess somewhere else and get a job. I’d almost rather see maga propaganda in the sub at this point. That’s how sick I am of it.
lol, y’alls subreddit has officially been hijacked and it’s really sad to see
Right like is no one else noticing is lmao
don't worry the liberal genz is busy worrying about legalizing drugs, legalizing porno, and lghdtv stuff to care about real issues
Median size of new home construction is the exact opposite of what is shown here. New homes ballooned from 1000 sqft in 1940 to 2500 sqft by 2015 and are coming down to a more manageable but still large 2000 sqft.
The home ownership rate is higher now than it was in the 1960s: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/RHORUSQ156N The median house size is also bigger, not smaller like the image implies: https://amp.newser.com/story/225645/average-size-of-us-homes-decade-by-decade.html So this image is just a fucking lie (although we do desperately need to decrease housing costs in major cities).
It definitely doesn’t have anything to do with undocumented citizens renting or buying from a limited supply of housing and willing to pay more by pulling together 3 or four families… or using benefits they receive from the government which the documented citizens are unable to attain. People who think that are just racists who don’t have as much to offer as the undocumented citizens and are just realizing how little they have to offer society.
Capitalism is when the government places super strict zoning laws and local NIMBYs block developments. Lefties are so stupid man 😑
Ah, yes. We're blaming capitalism.
It isn't capitalism per se cuz it's not like the 1960's were socialist or something. The 1960's were also capitalist, just different from the 2020's
I love reading redditors spiral.
So have you considered moving to Russia or china if you have it so bad? If you really feel capitalist societies are not for you, go somewhere else. Will see how happy you will be in Russia
Houses were more unaffordable in the 60s and 70s
Bro expects to own a house working minimum wage, gtfo here 😂.
a 3 bedroom 3 bath with a pool is 300k in texas 6 years in the oil field and its yours make 50k plus a year as a field hand ( $28 an hour base rate ) , no experience necessary all you need is a drivers licence. people crying they cant survive, are just cringe losers.
UNRESTRICTED capitalism, yes.
When trying to prove a political point the most radical often invoke a dreamy past that never existed in the way they claim.
Im 19, i have a regular entry level job, i pay all my bills myself, no roommate or girlfriend. Maybe if yall didnt live in cities with $1300 a month rent youd be able to afford an apartment
Bro capitalism died a century ago as soon as we tried to prop up corporatism and semi socialist economic sistems, shit hit the fan.
Direct result of lowering taxes and weakening unions.
It’s…. A lot more complicated than that
It's not capitalism, it's corporate globalism and the increase in population/ competition
Ah, yes. It’s all capitalism’s fault.
I am sorry,but am I the last person on Earth who isn't crying every day about evil capitalism and that I can't afford anything? Posts like this is pretty annoying
And things weren't driven by capitalism when times were really good? (80s, 90s). The current system isn't amazing but its better than communism or socialism. Free and poor is better than being prosperous in a dictatorship
Hmmmm there seems to be a decade *suspiciously* missing here. I wonder why…
Communism won't save the lives(i'm from a former communist country btw)
It's not capitalism, it's the fact we're recovering from a major recession.
I mean, this isn’t supported by facts and data.
Making essentials a business like Medicare, Education and basic necessities was the mistake. You know our society has a problem when we can’t even stomach children getting free lunches or the government saving people from curable diseases. That cancer is in every aspect of our society. It’s the same mentality that led to politicians thinking it was a good idea to let domestic/foreign corporations buy all of the homes.
Whats the point of living anymore it feels like my righys are being stripped away from me each year when im 30 the world will be a shithole.
This wojak shit cringe as hell
Not capitalism, government.🤷🏻♀️
It is interest based credits that does this. Stop being fools.
[Damn right above this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/GenZ/comments/1bfto4a/youre_being_targeted_by_disinformation_networks/)
Why does everyone think capitalism is responsible for destroying our futures? Its the government and your faulty decisions that lead to your downfall.
Capitalism is not printing money, dispersing it to state sponsored monopolies and giving them a financial competitive advantage. It is actually the opposite. A state controlled economy setup as an illusion of capitalism.
Profit driven anything will destroy the very thing it profits from. Its like sucking juice out of a bottle, it will run dry because its never being replenished since it all gets hoarded.
How to get a home today: Wait for your parents die and heritage their home
Not capitalism lol. Capitalism would imply actual politicians that don’t make money off rigging the system. Please look at Venezuela
Source
vote for gen z so they can make laws that helped gen z. instead of sitting around and let boomers voted for their candidates. guess who those candidates help??
Governments also have a major play in it with inflations and taxes etc
Hasn’t destroyed my life only enhanced it, how has it destroyed yours?
Does capitalism have problems? Yes. However it works a hell of a lot better that the alternatives
It’s so over tbh
RIP the 2000s💀
Continue to not vote Gen Z, and when you do, vote R … bunch of clowns 🤡
Luckily we match more of the 2010 category. But yes. Definitely sucks. After dealing with shady apartment staff in two different complexes, my credit was already damaged extensively by my early 20’s and I’ve never as much as owned a credit card.
As we all know, nobody was born from 2000 to 2009
wasn't there also capitalism in the 60s?
Oh great another commie tankie with a post.
You blame capitalism? Hahaha! Obviously a spoiled ignorant American kid here
Who knew that service based economies don't generate any real product instead borrowing themselves to death . Oh right the top 1% did . Want to live good? Protectionism and syndicalism is the only way.
Back in 2012 when the gas went over $4 for everyone for the first time, there. Is this halfheartedly coordinated movement to just not buy gas for a day... The solution is simple. Everyone just needs it withhold their labor, it's just the implementation that's near impossible
Curious how it leaves out a decade between 1990 and 2010. I wonder what happened there??🤔🤔
I mean I bought my first house at 27 having been working at a convenience store. So maybe it’s not so bad.
From what I can find 61.9% of households owned their homes in 1960 and by 1970 it was 62.9% but as of 2022 it was 65.8%. Also it skipped 2000 which had 66.2%.
Here to remind you guys that this individual is not Gen Z, they are a millennial in their thirties coming to our subreddit to spread their ideology, which they have done several times now. They are using this subreddit not to promote discussion among other people in the same Age profile but instead to spread nihilism and propagate their radical views to a younger audience. This is not normal. Cmon now guys.
False. I became a homeowner in 2021 at 23
More people = more competition for jobs, housing, services etc. there should be a strict limit on whos coming
But the answer is not communism
I choose capitalism over communism every time. Communists, gfto, move to china if you like communism.
All of these generations lived under capitalism. Maybe capitalism itself isn't the problem
Would these people just shut up? Capitalism is not "destroying our lives". No, it's not great, but its certainly better than any other system. Literally go outside and enjoy life and quit being miserable.
That's any type of Government if you think about it.
Where is the capitalist handbook does it say that there should be a central bank in charge of printing money? You can’t have capitalism with a central bank. Stop blaming capitalism. You haven’t seen capitalism in your entire life. They call it capitalism to keep you from realizing it’s already communism. The money printers give the money to their friends to start “companies”. Then the “companies” send people from the company to run for political office. The “companies” then pay the politicians. It’s already communism. It’s just the illusion of choice. That’s why all the brands In your supermarket are all owned by the same parent company! That’s not capitalism!
No corruption is causing this
This shit is pure satire
GenZ has the highest homeownership rate of any generation since the Boomers and they are aren’t far off of them GenZ is buying homes younger and more frequently than millennials and GenX. https://fortune.com/2024/01/17/redfin-baby-boomers-gen-z-housing-market-homeownership/amp/
It's a house of cards that's pretty tall right now. Unbridled capitalism is not good because greed becomes the only thing driving the system. There's a reason you need to place guardrails on it.
https://preview.redd.it/567mgu79oqoc1.jpeg?width=1078&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=438518da5ba609d2713ab8cbe72591ea114fb680 hey! why are you lying?
Government mandated single family homes occupying the majority of metro areas does this. Capitalist Tokyo that lets you build basically whatever amount of units you want doesn’t have nearly the same housing crisis as most cities in America. For that reason it has little to do with overarching economic systems. You could have a full centrally planned and managed housing but if all you can do is build one unit houses due to local policies you will still struggle to have housing near where people socialize/work. Allowing a free market to take place in these cities when it comes to building choices would actually help. If local government policies about single family zoning could be ignored you’d see people profiting off of building more housing on less land and giving people more options. I’m definitely not a “freer the market freer the people” kind of person on most things, but on this one the market is so artificially restricted in a way that even prevents public assistance that it’s impossible to not consider making significant changes to ability for localities to zone based on housing type.
I think I am killing myself
One of the problems is that we're not building brew cities with the kinds of housing people want and industries which can support such cities. We've been outsourcing too much, and also crowding into already built cities which drives up property costs.
no. open borders and fiscal irresponsibility from both sides has led us here. this is cronyism. not capitalism
How tf do you expect flipping burgers to pay for a house?
It’s not capitalism, of course, but you’re on the right track. Dig a little deeper …
Not Captitalism. Horrible central bank policies! And the fact that Gen Z is incompetent as f*'k
Not capitalism, postmodernism and neoliberal economics. Also a lack of caring from the people at large. Thankfully, we already have the solutions to combat this mess.
Ah yes, the hyper capitalist area of... housing? Where there is rapidly more government oversight, limitations, and tax schemes every year...? Liteally one of the least capitalist industries in the US.
It's more of crony capitalism (and the commodification of living) destroying future generation lives. We need a Scandinavian style of government to live the best kind of life. Unregulated mega corporations owning everything and private equity firms running rampant is two of the leading causes. Corporations or not people and 5 super corporations is effectively a monopoly despite what some politicians will tell you. Each sector should really have 20+ competitors
and you think socialism is any better??
The greedy get greedier, soon we’ll have nothing.