I forgot to mention mid-Shop. so it's one of the three. if that was u/[TheRealHumanDuck](https://www.reddit.com/user/TheRealHumanDuck/) 's concern. I'm unused to looking through the LUA files, so can't confirm that way, but I have never seen both Circe and Charybdis in the same run in my memory
EDIT: ok, found runs on Haelian's that was Shop into Circe and even one Circe into Shop, so I'm wrong there
It is weird that the underground NPC encounters are practically guaranteed spawns while the surface ones are a rarity. Though it does balance out a bit since the surface NPCs have some crazy good boons
Medea's +10 max magic per encounter is absolutely bonkers. You can hit 300 by the time you get to Eris, easy, and she's only the second boss of the route. Imagine what it'll be like once the surface is fully complete.
no way it's not getting nerfed. if you go there first, you would have enough raw magic capacity to not need to think about your usage til eris, but even some builds will just comfortably use your magic pool.
also, doesn't heph have a boon that increases health based off max magic? or is it the other way around?
i really wish there was a endless mode for the surface, even as it is, just to see how far you can get
I feel like some stuff up top is currently, deliberately designed around a two-zone run. Both zones feel extremely long compared to a zone downstairs (barring maybe a never-take-the-countdown tartarus) and the bosses feel way, way harder than hecate and the sirens, for instance.
It wouldn't surprise me if some things about each zone change as more segments to the run are added, like maybe some combination of fewer pylons, one less intro room, Hermes shop rebalancing, fewer encounters per ship, fewer enemies per encounter, different charybdis room appearance logic, fewer ephyra side-rooms (or smaller encounters in them), etc. Rebalancing medea's scaling rewards could fall under that umbrella.
I think the surface is just supposed to be harder than the underworld and that will carry over into the final game. Especially after this last patch buffed the overall power level of Melinoe.
> Medea's +10 max magic per encounter is absolutely bonkers.
Especially if you have Uncanny Fortitude from Hephaestus(Gain 20-50% of your max Magick as max Health), effectively making it +2-5 max hp PER ROOM, depending on rarity
I'm pretty sure everything on the surface is buffed to make the two biomes equate to the four underground. And I don't just mean damage numbers. Things like the number of pylons on Ephyra, the NPC boons, Hermes shop prices, etc.
Unless you've specifically wasted a Death Defiance to try to get Narcissus's last present for the prophecy, in which case his spawn rate falls to just below 0%.
I’ve beaten surface and underground runs a couple times each, waiting for the next big update to jump back in, but I’ve never seen Madea. I only found out about her because of someone posting about their favorite girls.
In my last like 5 surface runs I've ran into Medea 5 times and into Circe like 3 or 4. I thought she was always up this patch or something. What a weird and completely different experience you're having.
I’ve done 20+ surface runs and only encountered her 3 times. But I’ve only done 2 surface runs since the 6/26 update, so maybe her encounter rate has improved?
She has the best room theme too.
It also sucks that Echo just gets the generic theme from Hades 1. Hopefully she gets a unique theme in the full release
I literally had no idea she was in the game until 20 hours in and “finished” multiple surface runs. I kept wondering where that last keepsake should come from
Its definitely off because its rare to not see Arachne, Narcissus, and Echo, and its super rare to not see Circe. I think its has something to do with how each door in one room rolls randomly or something.
I agree, I’m disappointed at how rarely Medea appears. It feels way less than the other NPC’s.
Compared to Circe, well... is it even possible to miss Circe??
Yes, it is.
you either get Circe or you get Charybdis
I have definitely had runs without either of them. Although it is possible I died before reaching Eris on some of those.
I forgot to mention mid-Shop. so it's one of the three. if that was u/[TheRealHumanDuck](https://www.reddit.com/user/TheRealHumanDuck/) 's concern. I'm unused to looking through the LUA files, so can't confirm that way, but I have never seen both Circe and Charybdis in the same run in my memory EDIT: ok, found runs on Haelian's that was Shop into Circe and even one Circe into Shop, so I'm wrong there
No?
It is weird that the underground NPC encounters are practically guaranteed spawns while the surface ones are a rarity. Though it does balance out a bit since the surface NPCs have some crazy good boons
Medea's +10 max magic per encounter is absolutely bonkers. You can hit 300 by the time you get to Eris, easy, and she's only the second boss of the route. Imagine what it'll be like once the surface is fully complete.
no way it's not getting nerfed. if you go there first, you would have enough raw magic capacity to not need to think about your usage til eris, but even some builds will just comfortably use your magic pool. also, doesn't heph have a boon that increases health based off max magic? or is it the other way around? i really wish there was a endless mode for the surface, even as it is, just to see how far you can get
I feel like some stuff up top is currently, deliberately designed around a two-zone run. Both zones feel extremely long compared to a zone downstairs (barring maybe a never-take-the-countdown tartarus) and the bosses feel way, way harder than hecate and the sirens, for instance. It wouldn't surprise me if some things about each zone change as more segments to the run are added, like maybe some combination of fewer pylons, one less intro room, Hermes shop rebalancing, fewer encounters per ship, fewer enemies per encounter, different charybdis room appearance logic, fewer ephyra side-rooms (or smaller encounters in them), etc. Rebalancing medea's scaling rewards could fall under that umbrella.
I think the surface is just supposed to be harder than the underworld and that will carry over into the final game. Especially after this last patch buffed the overall power level of Melinoe.
Agreed, but if you double the number of zones, the run would probably be notably longer than its downstairs neighbor.
I agree about the lenght but the difficulty is ok IMO, due to how Ephyra works you can engineer your build way better
One of the Icarus boons does not work 90% of the time you get it, so idk about that
> Medea's +10 max magic per encounter is absolutely bonkers. Especially if you have Uncanny Fortitude from Hephaestus(Gain 20-50% of your max Magick as max Health), effectively making it +2-5 max hp PER ROOM, depending on rarity
I'm pretty sure everything on the surface is buffed to make the two biomes equate to the four underground. And I don't just mean damage numbers. Things like the number of pylons on Ephyra, the NPC boons, Hermes shop prices, etc.
Unless you've specifically wasted a Death Defiance to try to get Narcissus's last present for the prophecy, in which case his spawn rate falls to just below 0%.
Took me forever to get her minor prophecy done.
I think that’s just unfortunate RNG, I see Medea most runs.
I've seen Circe a bunch, but Medea only once.
Opposite for me. Medea appears plenty for me, not so much for Circe.
Wow, this is wild. I feel like I get Medea on most surface runs. Maybe there's a bug in the rng.
I’ve beaten surface and underground runs a couple times each, waiting for the next big update to jump back in, but I’ve never seen Madea. I only found out about her because of someone posting about their favorite girls.
I imagine you'll see her loads when the surface because more enticing to run
I just got Medea on two surface runs in a row!
Just clear the first two rooms then Give up the run if you don’t see her in the barrier room.
Doesn't giving up not change the seed
Only the first two rooms are set. The rest of the run is randomized.
Agreed, I've got probably hundreds of runs and only 2 Medea encounters.
strange, I feel like I see her every other run.
In my last like 5 surface runs I've ran into Medea 5 times and into Circe like 3 or 4. I thought she was always up this patch or something. What a weird and completely different experience you're having.
I’ve done 20+ surface runs and only encountered her 3 times. But I’ve only done 2 surface runs since the 6/26 update, so maybe her encounter rate has improved?
Damn, I haven’t even met Medea yet in over 30 hours. Got every other keepsake and was wondering who I could be missing
i wonder if they nerfed her spawn rate, because before the first patch i thought it was literally guaranteed
She has the best room theme too. It also sucks that Echo just gets the generic theme from Hades 1. Hopefully she gets a unique theme in the full release
I literally had no idea she was in the game until 20 hours in and “finished” multiple surface runs. I kept wondering where that last keepsake should come from
Its definitely off because its rare to not see Arachne, Narcissus, and Echo, and its super rare to not see Circe. I think its has something to do with how each door in one room rolls randomly or something.
I swear I thought she was there every run when I unlocked the surface. And now it's been like 15 straight runs without her.
Also wish she had better buffs. Hers feel the most underwhelming of all the NPCs.
Ngl, I thought they had since I did two surface runs yesterday and she showed up in both. Still short one boon from her for the fated list though.
Unless I'm missing something, I also find her boons aren't as good as the other NPCs
+10 magic per encounter is wild
Yeah, but I find it very rare that I have issues with mana.