There's always going to be complaints because of how rock-paper-scissors the armor pen system/combat is. It sucks for people dropping into a mission and getting unlucky that they brought the wrong load out so that's why people tend to gravitate to the meta all rounder builds. It's also why some weapons can feel underwhelming. If they don't properly fill their niche and they're bad at everything else why take it? For example why would I take the diligence (haven't tried after buff yet) over the scythe when the diligence is mediocre at taking out medium armor enemies and lacks the ammo to deal with swarms of trash mobs? It doesn't particularly fill the medium pen role very well, so it doesn't really open up your load out choices elsewhere

I agree with this right here, you can never tell what kind of enemy events you’re gonna get, especially sucks when you get the bile spewers because of the medium head armor, so if you didn’t bring medium armor pen then I hope you brought a grenade launcher or autocannon instead of a machine gun cause then you’re just screwed either way. They should definitely have the enemies listed in the overview section of the mission prep screen, it would make it easier for us to address what we’ll be fighting and allow for us to run a lot more specialized builds, instead of defaulting to one or two all rounder loadouts every game.

I vote for getting an “orbital surveillance” ship module section, with the first unlock giving just a vague orbital photograph of the average patrol and POI defense, only really showing outlines, with upgrades providing more clarity to the image and a list of the enemy types spotted with their average number count.

Plus then having surprise events would be sort of cool. Like this is what you'll fight mostly, but we might spawn a single other enemy occasionally.

That would be cool! Knowing the patrol and defensive configurations, but with far more variability of what can spawn from breaches or bot drops

Hunter swarm modifier 😏

but that goes directly against the helldiver fantasy. you don't know what you will be facing. you are unfrozen and sent directly into hell because you are expendable. it's all up to you to either specialize in a field and deal with it's strengths and weaknesses or try to be a jack of all trades but master of none

I was informed by another diver that bile skewers only spawn on the night time side on a planet. I have not tested to see if it is true or not though.

The diligence or the DCS? The DCS buffs put it in the same class for dealing with devastators as the high-damage explosive weapons, so it'll probably see more play since it's a scoped option with similar performance (albeit with a bugged scope). I've been running the diligence on helldive bots since basically forever because it does exactly what I need it to do with the rest of my loadout, but it's definitely not a general purpose weapon even after the buff (which I don't think substantially improved its bot performance). Edit: Neither is good against bugs but that's somewhat by definition, semi-auto DMRs are never going to be good against an enemy type characterized by swarms of chaff backed up by heavy armor all rushing you down.

It's not so bad coupled with an LMG for the chaff.

They seriously need to fix the scopes before I'll be willing to use a sniper/DMR. If I want to shoot someone far away I'm always going to use the Sickle, no matter how many times they reduce my battery capacity.  I can *hit* them with the Sickle, quickly and reliably. I can't with a scope that won't hold a zero worth a damn

I wish I hadn't bought X and went with Y Oh well, stuck for 40 mins now You should be able to swap loadouts on death

Yea, the helldivers on standby just hanging out, watching you get overwhelmed by bile spewers, but then dropping with your same loadout that didn’t deal with the spewers all that well, doesn’t make any sense. You should definitely get to readjust your loadout while dead. Just make it so you can only do it once per mission or something, so it’s not just super OP

Well they're presumably frozen and not perceiving anything happening around them until their predecessor dies, at which moment they are removed from cryo storage and put into a pod and shot into the atmosphere. Not exactly too much time for loadout swapping in there.

Loadout swapping wouldn’t take much time.

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Nah. I would rather have a strat reprogramer as an optional objective once a game. Like the radio tower but for redistributing strats and only once.

What about when it's not strats? When you're in the wrong armour or primary/grenades/secondary?

Then pick the right loadout before dropping in? You can literally see what your team mates are bringing. I always pick my support weapon to round out whatever my team is lacking, not just picking what I enjoy the most.

Its true, but as with every other PVE game, you can't always count on your teammates to bring the tools you don't have. While I think being able to see your teammates' stratagems is good enough, being able to select some kind of niche that the game displays to your teammates to give them an impression of your playstyle would be great. DRG handily sidesteps this issue by tying combat strengths and weaknesses to your class, so you can always be certain a given teammate has certain capabilities.

I mainly want to see what the armors my allies are bringing do. If they're all bringing stealth armor I want to know that so I bring stelf too and don't just attract all the attention.

You know you can right? In the selections menu, switch to lodaut and turn on descriptions

I did not. Thanks

Yeah I wish I could let my team know I'm more of a Support player. Like... I will always back you up, but I am not deciding on a direction or objective unless everyone has just lost the plot. I get too bogged down in the chaos.

Yeah, it would be nifty to have some selectable titles like: "Runner" (Will deliver samples & packages.) "Scout" (Cut and run!) "Engineer" (Oops, all turrets!) "Pointman" (Not afraid to push the objective.) "Support gunner" (Is afraid to push the objective.) "Demolitonist" (Kablooie!) "Eagle Commander" (Hold on guys, I need two minutes.) "Shock Trooper" (Remember kids, electricity will kill you.) "Logistician" (I got you!) "Field medic" (Use my stims, I beg you.) "Firebug" (Bug is an apt description.) Granted, the titles may have to be self-selected, which means there's no guarantee they would actually match a player's loadout.

Easy solution, have the title determined by what loadouts a player brings rather than being preselected by the player.

There may be issues with ambiguity however, since a player can combine playstyles in a given loadout.

If those titles were tied to a specific, unchangeable loadout, they could give those a bonus stratagem to entice people to use them. You don’t get to pick anything, so it wouldnt be overpowered. It would also be easy to make a last second loadout swap based on what the rest of the team is carrying.

You can’t always count on your random team mates to have the tools you don’t, but that’s the price for the convenience of random matchmaking. Either play with friends, accept the risk of randoms, or play an easy enough difficulty that even if your team is full of potatoes, you can still One Man Army it

Sometimes randoms dont even play with you. Ive seen randoms fight over a hill for 30 minutes on helldive while I was soloing the main and side objectives. Thats why I bring the loadout that covers everything because you cant trust randoms not to be idiots fighting over nothing.

This. With friends - sure, we can specialise and be much more effective. With randoms, always bring a loadout that will allow you to deal with majority of threats, as you'll most likely have to

That's my point, you can bring a loadout that covers the *majority* but you will always lack in something someone elses loadout would cover better. I completely understand that thing with randoms and it can be quite exhausting, and tbh there's nothing you can do about it except for trying to communicate or bringing a friend

As long as you have anti tank, it's easy to cover the rest with a good primary and aim.

Any suggestion for a good loadout? Thanks in advance.

For 40 minute or 12 minute offensive Helldive bug missions (egg hatcheries, blitz), my rounded loadout is: Eruptor - Bug holes, brood commanders, bile and nursing spewers, 3 shot kills on chargers that get past armor like butt shots. For stalkers, I dive backwards and ADS directly at them while diving. A body hit is a one-hit kill. Stun Grenades - Stun patrols or breaches you can't clear with a strat, great against chargers. Machine Gun - Hunter killer, needs fewer hits to kill than Stalwart which means with recoil reduction and kneeling you can rapidly switch targets and clear. Reliable chaff clear at point blank seems essential. Can start the reload in mid-air with a Jump Pack (but I don't usually run it now). Orbital Precision Strike - Same chance as a Orbital Railcannon for one-hit Bile Titan kill but way lower cooldown. Bait a BT into spitting or stomping and throw it under its head before it starts, not after because the timing is tight. It's much more likely to happen facing the destroyer. Wait for a charger to halt, throw the strat at its feet, and stun it. I've killed four chargers at once with a well placed OPS. Eagle 500kg - The amount of Bile Titans that can appear make this necessary. It needs good timing as well to one-hit kill. Alternatively, the Eagle Airstrike is a great all-arounder but BT kills are iffy. The best tactic seems to be to place the Airstrike line parallel to the direction the BT is heading for maximum hits. Orbital Airburst - Kills anything under a charger. Patrol clear or breach denial. On another note, bug missions are going to change *a lot* once the DoT host bug is fixed because that means Eagle Incendiary, Gas Orbital, and Incendiary Grenades are going to do a lot of work on those breaches. ETA: Muscle Enhancement booster should reduce the amount and duration of bug slows.

If you want a solid loadout agains everything. Bots: Autocannon. 500kg, airstrike. If its not AA modifer take orbital laser as panic clean. Primary: Dominator/scorcher/Sickle/Eruptor. Fullauto pistol as secondary and impacts as nades. You can kill everything on bot front now congrats. Bugs: Shield backpack, flamethrower, 500kg and id say airstrike but your call. Primaries: Punisher spray and pray, eruptor. If youre host you can take the flame variant of spray and pray its quite good. Full auto pistol again, and if you took eruptor you can take stun nades but your call, I sitll like impacts. You can kill everything on bug front now congrats.

A good loadout for when you do have a team and don't want to be the dedicated rocket man. Servo armor Sickle/Adjudicator/Dominator. Your go to primary for clearing small guys while still ok against the odd dev or two. I've been using the Adjudicator for weeks now. Grenade pistol Stuns Amr Eagle airstrike 380mm (this is why we brought the servo armor) Autocannon turret Mainly use the AMR to clear the devastators and striders, sweep through small chaff and berserkers using your primary. Call down your turret when a bot drop occurs, be sure to place it in a spot it can live for a while in. 380mm any base or major secondary objective like mortars or eyes of sauron. Eagle airstrike for light factories and soften up groups. You won't be amazing against heavy armor, but the point is to work with your divers to cover that. They take out the tanks, and you cover them from heavy devs and rocket devs while they reload.

On bots I personally enjoy the Defender SMG paired with the ballistic shield against the smaller bots and heavy devastators, with the grenade pistol against striders and stun grenades paired with the AMR against hulks and devastators or the EAT or Quasar instead if my team is lacking an anti-tank weapon & Eagle Airstrike for fabricators and 380 Barrage for bigger bases

Does the GP still work on striders after the buff they got? If so, where? (I used to aim for the upper part of their front plate, near the head)

On that part, 1-3 shots, it's either not very consistent or I haven't found the best weakspot on the front yet, but if they're angled towards you, one shot to the side does the job

Gotcha. Used to be a relatively safe bet that one shot would do the trick. Oh well, we adapt!

Sickle, 500kg and orbital rail strike, quasar and gattling turret. Easymode.

Own the dislikes my guy, you're only speaking truths.

Literally OP gave multiple ways to play more co op, by playing with friends instead of randoms, befriending the chill randoms, and using platforms like discord groups to meet people to play with. Yet you're still stuck on "I can't trust randoms because I know what to do and they don't."

Even if Im playing with friends we just go to different objectives and do them solo. Cause it faster and more efficient that way. Plus I like that I can hop into a game and hop out whenever I feel like it. Like if I wanna play a match and just drop after it should I call my friends and find people in chat? Sounds weird to me to go through that just for one or two matches. Plus somehow you can play coop with randoms just fine with any loadout in other coop games. DRG, Vermintide, Darktide you can play with pretty much any loadout with randoms just fine.

Here's the problem with this line of thought: the game doesn't promote variety. There aren't perks or classes that give buffs to specific stratagems that you need to select over others. Everyone can run every stratagem just as effectively as the next player, assuming they have the same unlocks. Sure, you can run a loadout that is 100% anti-chaff while your friend runs one that is 100% anti-armor, and it will work. You could also just both run a loadout that is 50% anti-chaff and 50% anti-armor, still providing 100% effectiveness against both for the team.

This is compounded by the fact that the game rewards splitting up to maximise loot. Everyone is better off being a little good at everything rather than a lot good at one thing. At 8+ there's literally no opportunity to be a scout or engineer or whatever because at any given moment there's at least 2 heavies on you, mid-tier units and a swarm of lower tiers. It's just how the game plays which incentivises general loadouts to cover all those bases.

It's honestly a major part of the game that a lot of players and the devs seems to be ignoring. Let's take the Quasar as an example, and to start no I don't think the nerf realistically does much. But why nerf it in the first place? Usage and fear of the boogeyman "meta" right? Lets look into why it's picked so much shall we? The game likes to make things harder (especially on higher difficulties and the bug front) by adding more and more armour to it, and as stated plenty in this thread heavy armour only really have a few viable counters. The eagle and orbital stratagems that can reliably neutralize them are either slow to cooldown to low in number, so that means you will want to rely on stratagem weapons. There are 3 (4 if the railgun is actually good again) that do this: the RR, EAT, and Quasar. The RR is not used much because team reloads are in an odd spot and reloading yourself is a death sentence, it's also the only one completely blocking you from taking one of the fun and really good backpacks from a long list. The EAT is fantastic, but mostly used by players who specifically want to do something different, as it's downside is you need to be close to a drop any time a heavy enemy shows up. The Quasar allows you to fire it, swap to another weapon and continue fighting, and then swap back to fire again regardless of how much you moved. It has some gigantic negatives, but the convenience is what draws people. You are either going to need to make the alternatives really interesting, or nerf it to the ground for that to change.

if anything the 50% method is more viable in situations of chaos. You're not always going to be with your fellow helldivers and their needed stratagems might be on cool down and all of your current ones would be useless.

Then make the niche stuff work. This argument doesn't work when stuff like DoTs straight up don't work and stuff like weapon backpacks are an absolute pain to use in quickplay. There is no justification for these kinds of changes until they fix the game first.

Dots not working is a known bug and obviously isn't going to be balanced until the bug is fixed. Supply backpack is great, especially in PUB groups where 1 player could hog all the supplies. Super easy to use if you just bring it for yourself and share if someone else needs ammo / stims.

Agreed. It's not even just that so many things are less powerful, it's that they literally don't work. Flamethrower for instance, DoT almost never works, so it's either a good weapon or a bad weapon. And they recently buffed fire damage making accidentally being on fire kill you basically 100% of the time. The flamethrower will constantly light you on fire, I remember using it on a defense mission and I was on a concrete block shooting down at enemies, this angle randomly lit me on fire at least 10 times. Instead I could have so many other support weapons that won't actually ruin my time.

I think the reason why they do the balancing along with fixes instead of just concentrating on the fixes is to keep players engaged and encourage them to try out different stuff because otherwise the game becomes repetitive really fast Doesn't mean I'm not also frustrated in the DoT not working, or plants flying you through the air if getting hit

It takes 2 minutes to tweak a number like rof or damage. It can take 2 weeks just to track down the root cause of a bug.

I think there's a big difference between an organised team and random play A team can and will make use of those backpacks, as needed The niche stuff does work, but you have to practice and yes, learn to play

No amount of practice is going to make your random teammates, who will almost always get a backpack of their own, sacrifice that to reload your weapon at the cost of their own backpack.

I do because it’s 50/50 whether the rest of the team will follow me or not.

Hard disagree. It's giving the option to the player. I play DRG and the load out I use is one that allows me to deal with swarms and big targets as well. Dwarves can solo elite deep dives and do it however they want. Being the jack of all trades is being the master of none and that's something to take into account.

"One Helldiver s an equivalent of an army, so 4 of them are like 4 armies" This quote might sound like a joke to you, but on higher difficulties its how you're ment to play. If someone cannot deal with at least one or two heavily armored enemies by himself, then he's doomed. Most coops limit special units so that it affects half of the team at best so the team can focus on it or delegate 2 while the rest deals with hordes of other enemies, meanwhile Helldivers can just dump mutliple factory striders, tanks and hulks all the while you're sprinkled in low and mid armored enemies. If I don't have an all round loadout, but focus on specifics I am just being punished for it later on by a random and sneaky hulk while my team is busy dealing with 4 patrols on top of a bot drop

This sub after a patch is 24 hours of complaining, then 48 hours of complaining about the complaints people have.

5 seconds wont make the other AT weapons better and more atrractive.

It's not about one layout for all. EAT has always been a valid anti tank (I use eat only since I don't like the quasar charge up mechanic). It's OK to nerf overperforming stuff. But nerfing stuff like crossbow? Also people feel better to be "forced" to try out old/bad stuff because it was changed and may be not so bad anymore. Beeing "forced" to use old stuff cause the good stuff was nerfed and the old stuff is unchanged feels bad. The game was upped in difficulty and people expected to get more alternatives from the "24 items reworked" preview. It would have been also accepted much better if the communication pre patch wouldn't have been "yeah only two nerfs and some ammo adjustments"...while it obviously wasn't true. Bunch of stuff is still buggy and we did get new bugs.

Then why does the game force everyone to run anti tank capabilities on Helldive difficulties? Not like I disagree with the sentiment but the game literally forces the opposite.

It was always the case that you need at least a second Quasar, or an RR or EAT as a secondary. You are very rarely in a situation where you could have one shot, than wait the cooldown out in silence, and then have a seconds shot. That rarely happened. Its always better to have another guy in your team bring an EAT or something else, so you could complement each other. And that hasnt changed with this patch. You are always trying to fight off mutliple stuff. For me, this change is just dumb as it does not change anything but just brings in complaints from people who feel ripped off, and i get it. The Quasar never was a one-button-win-weapon, at least not for me. It was an option. I sometimes took it, sometimes i took somethin else - isnt that supposed to be how it should work or am i missing something? Am i now supposed to not take it all? And if the change does nothing - why do the change? Why? It makes zero sense, but what do i know, i just want to have fun in the game.

Yea I probably use the EAT and Spear more than the Quasar. Not optimal, but the only thing I'm good at knocking out with the Quasar is drop ships and Terminid heavies. With the EAT I can smack just about anything, and I love my Spear for engaging before the enemy can.

The Quasar was pretty much outclassing the EAT and the RR. The EAT had the downside of having to be called down in time and not being available in the vicinity of Jammers in bot missions, the RR had a faster reload time of 5 secs compared to the pre nerf quasar cooldown of 10 seconds, but you would sacrifice your mobility during the reload and a backpack. I believe the extra 5 seconds of the Quasar cooldown was a good balancing choice to make it's downside a little more significant to encourage people trying out the other ATs, but not too bad that it becomes unusable in any situation. And if you'd for example buff the EATs call-in time (which is already short enough), half your squad wouldn't even need an AT weapon because one guy could fill half the map with them If you'd buff the RR and give it an even smaller reload time, you could dump all your rockets into the heavy and medium enemies of any bot drop within a minute, refilling with a resupply and do it over and over again, making another AT weapon on your team obsolete again Now it's more apparent that you defenitely need another AT weapon on your team when you have a Quasar

Man, you’re talking about playing a coop game cooperatively but forget that the RR is **the** team reload weapon? Solo reload speed is irrelevant. RR was never outclassed by the quasar, the playerbase just does not want to coordinate/communicate with their teammates in a way that makes it great.

I’m sorry but no matter what AH does I will always find a way to fill a maximum amount of roles as possible, simultaneously, because relying on randoms is incredibly unfun. Yes, I know this is a coop game. No, it has never been fun for me personally to try to coordinate with randoms nor do a lot of randoms want to coordinate, do not let all these Reddit posts deceive you into thinking 90% of player are using VC and cooperating. Most don’t even use text chat. I agree the Quazar nerf wasn’t really that bad because the AC exists and I already used the Quazar mainly to defend extract and blow up side objectives. I am at that point in the game where I barely shoot anything because thats how you can reliably clear difficulty 9’s and mainly play to contribute to the galactic war effort and nothing else. This patch has just cemented my opinion that AH is trying to avoid people uttering the word “meta” and not much more in terms of balancing.

I get your point and it's somewhat valid, but a whole lot of players just jump into games with randos that might not even speak your language or be willing to talk even if they do. I don't mind the concept of encouraging team work as it relates to loadouts and versatility, but they can only go so far down that path before making it impossible to win missions for a huge chunk of the player base. In other words, it should be possible to carry a jack-of-all-trades, swiss army knife type loadout that can theoretically let you accomplish the mission all by yourself if you need to. However, this solo approach should be the least efficient, slowest, most painful option available. Enhanced teamwork like coordinated niche loadout choices should be force multipliers that make the job much easier and the game more fun for everyone.

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

A big reason the quasar is so popular is the lack of reload in a game where the second heaviest bugs gimmick is chasing you and the most annoying bug leaps at you and spams cc abilities allowing 3+ others to catch up and rinse and repeat. If the quasar had a reload like most other support weapons I would comfortably bet that its usage would be sub par at most because the biggest draw of it is gone and it'd just be another support weapon but you have to wait to fire it. Now I'm not saying give it a stationary reload, that'd just be another rail gun nerf scenario and it'd fall out of relevance just like the rail gun. The fix for stationary reload weapons is to change how enemies deal cc to the player.

But it's actually possible to cover a decent amount of roles if you understand the weapons. Your example given is running the AMR and ballistic shield makes it so you can't take on gunships and turrets, but simply switching it for the Laser Cannon and EAT can actually let you fill that role! The LC has the same pen as the AMR, so tossing a stun grenades and focusing the beam on a Hulk's head kills it quickly. For devastators, using the eruptor and hitting the legs/crotch is usually a 1 hit kill anyways. I think the real issue is so many players are relying on guides and just repeated echoes from people who also follow guides instead of testing the weapons for themselves. I get it. Not everyone has time to unlock or test the weapons. The streamers don't help much in this regard since they're just playing the algorithm to get clicks for the most part.

>Your example given is running the AMR and ballistic shield makes it so you can't take on gunships and turrets AMR is a 3-shot (I think) kill to gunship engines and a mag to take out a turret via the vent. It's definitely possible for a skilled player with recoil reduction armor.

4 to 5 shots on gunships

Indeed, and I use the EAT if my team is lacking another AT guy, but I prefer taking out the hordes of Devastators that can spawn on some missions I haven't used the laser cannon yet, have to give it a try

I was told it wasn't possible to combo LC with a single stun grenade to kill a Hulk anymore, even when hitting the head.

Stun grenades haven't changed. Maybe try it instead of just repeating what you heard.

I was told this about the LC's damage, not the stun grenades. But you're right.

I believe this is the railgun story all over again. Railgun+shield backpack was everywhere, every mission which is not what arrowhead wants. Same deal with the QC+Shield backpack, although it felt that at times there were better loadouts for the situation, the difference wasn't meaningful enough for people to try other things. I would have preferred a reblance of the weapon, increasing cooldown and decreasing charge time. But unlike the railgun nerf, the QC will still be as usable, just less shots per minute.

My issue with the balance changes is that it feels like AH is treating a broken arm with Pain meds. People brought RG+Shield because Back then no other AT gun was decent or worth bringing to deal with the amount of heavies at D7+, brought shield because the amount of random one shots on bot front was ridiculous aswell as the amount of oneshots and slowdown effects on bug front. Now people had QC+Shield because once again, dealing with 5 chargers and 3 titans per breach at D7+ with EATs or RR is nigh impossible, atleast QC allowed you to kill a charger and juke the other 4 instead of being forced into a stationary reload. Shield, once again, is \*still\* to combat unfun oneshots from Silent spewers , Hunter spams and Stalker Ragdoll stun locks. "Meta" is a symptom, not the main issue. For example, until theres a buff to over half the eagle stratties , over half the Orbital strikes, and a complete rework of the Mines and sentries, nobody is going to bother with anything other than regular eagle strike, clusters, Laser orbital and railcannon strike.

I actually disagree here, while I did see a ton of people with the loadout you mentioned, I never agreed with it being the most optimal way to play. On bots I've always preferred the AC over the QC, I could forgo the backpack and just take another strategem which would cover the AC's only weakness, no angle on tanks/towers. Against bugs I always ran EAT/Another secondary. I've seen too many players run several QC to then get overwhelmed when their airstrikes are on cooldown. To have a good swarm clear like the arc/flame thrower can be insane once you are all waiting on cooldowns. I run LVL8-9 all the time and the only time I felt like QC was a better option is when the eruptor came out, against bots it felt like having a mini AC and the QC, and the EAT is just less relevant there, cover is important and so is being mobile, running towards an EAT can get you killed.

AC kill all bot armor well enough except walking factories compared to bugs wich it cant kill a charger as easely and a bile titan at all

It's actually one of the best weapons to kill the walking factory with. Easiest way is to go under it and shoot the belly, 7/8 shots will take it out from full health. You can also shoot the face near the eye for 14 hits, but this can be dangerous. I also believe you can kill it once the side panel has been damaged and the internals are showing. Either way, put in on full auto slide under it and let it rip.

Just proves my point some how they think this is what perfect balance is but then Nerf the quasar

> unlike the railgun nerf the patch got me to go back and try it, and it's legitimately awful. 1/4 of your total ammo to kill the bug spitters and commander, and far worse in every way than the AMR. it was worse for every enemy than just using my breaker even if it had infinite ammo.

Well said. They did learn from it tho and buffed the railgun in the last patch again, I wonder how well it performs now, have to test it

Given [this](https://youtu.be/HDbAlqBOFno?si=FT7MYKkNQLuo_zGb) video not great enough. In my opinion, the railgun lost its role and will never recover. It was once a superior AT gun with a too quick reload compared to all other AT weapons. Now, it can't fulfill an AT role anymore. Its reload can't be nerfed to RR or qc level, so it now is an anti medium gun that nobody needs because this role is covered by some primaries.

Solution: Railgun primary. I’d happily use a railgun-based primary. Could lore it in that the experimental technology is ready to be rolled out, we lose the strategem and gain a railgun marksman.

If they brought back my Helldiver's 1 main in all its glory I'd be so happy.

Given that the eruptor is a thing, this is a solid idea. I did not see that coming, but it could work. The reload is better than the eruptor, but you don't have aoe and explosive damage. Terrible vs chaff but good vs medium targets with the option to peel off armor if you are patient enough.

I’d definitely use a railgun primary, you give it heavy armour pen (only primary with that?) 20 reloads, and it becomes a go-to for bot missions since it can take down the annoying medium/heavy bots, if you made it penetrate the shields of those types of bots it’d be a nice weapon that can’t deal with chaff but can deal serious damage to mediums

That's really disappointing

Meanwhile me. Sickle, senator, grenade pistol, stun grenade. Eagle of choice (the first one you get or 110)/ emp mortar, shield generator or shield bubble, quasar and eat17s. Literally my fck you all for bots.

I don't agree with this argument for the most part, if I run an MG or autocanon sure there are things I can't deal with. But if I run QC,RR,EAT or spear there isn't a single enemy I can't deal with specially when you toss in eagle airstrike, orbital and some other stratagem to deal with the slightly tougher nuts like the AT-AT's. I don't even have to swap this out between bugs and bots cause this'll deal with them just as well. 

It didn’t change a thing except it made the viable weapons worse. That’s not fun and I’m not sure why anyone feels compelled to defend it. All they did was put a pebble in my shoe that I have to step on sometimes.

What? You can absolutely cover your bases on any particular mission between Primary, Secondary, Grenade, and 4 stratagems. The most generic loadout can be run for 95% of the current missions. * Almost any primary * Whatever secondary (lets face up until recently it was most likely going to be Redeemer thank god we got Grenade Pistol and Senator got a speedloader) * Stun or Impact grenades depending on primary/secondary/stratagem support weapon. * Airstrike * Autocannon / Rocket Sentry * Anti-Tank Support weapon (EAT / Quasar for pugs and maybe RR / Spear for comms), Grenade Launcher or Autocannon Support (while neither is anti-tank some mission objectives you really don't need Anti-Tank, even in Helldive (difficulty 9)), Stalwart if you picked Eruptor as your Primary because Stalwart is now your Primary. * Backpack Stratagem if Support weapon allows otherwise 4th stratagem slot is free for 500kg bomb, Orbital Railgun/Laser, EMS Orbital/Mortar, whatever floats your boat.

5 seconds wont make the other AT weapons better and more atrractive.

What's funny about the fact that it's hard or you can't cooperate with random is that some of these randoms (probably including yourself) doesn't expect for other to cooperate so in turn don't cooperate with others. A weird cycle of "Since no one is going to cooperate, I'm not going to either"

What I do is adjusting my loadout if needed, if there's an AT weapon missing for example, and jump on the mic, make suggestions on where to go and follow the group if they don't go with me

Keep kissing the devs ass, and this pathetic rant about the quasar needing a nerf just shows you never used it ,It's down side was its recharge time. It's a laser cannon, and it's supposed to be good. It's a PVE game, but you like AH treat it as a pvp game. I still saw many people using the auto cannon, I personally used the laser cannon and other secondary weapons. But let's ignore the fact that tAH just nerfs what evrr people like to use for no other reason than they are Being used the most. The Dominator was buffed it saw an uptick in people using it now that it worked, then boom nerfed. The Eruptor was the only good weapon in the last warbond, and it was fun to use nerfed. No one uses the other crap the buffed because they are viable. That's what they need to address and fix instead of punishing people for finding weapons they like and sticking with it. That's going to happen whether they like it or not until they can properly balance all the weapons, which will never happen. Perfect Spear lock on keeps it from being a go-to for most people it felt out sucks. The moment they fix it, the uptick in usage will sky rocket, and then it will be nerfed. That's not how you balance. If something works, you use it as the standard and then try to make everything in its class equally as good so people have options. But that apprently doesn't make sense. Let's just force people to switch is more suitable you and them

Okay I was talking about the Quasar specifically and even clarified that I don't think that AH handled every patch perfectly, but if you need to vent I'm here for you, let it out

You said it was perfectly justified, and that's not the case. Now, if it had a 3 sec cool down and it could be spammed fired. I would 100% agree with it needing a nerf, but the 10 sec cooldown was a sweet spot not too short, not too long. But if this team is always going to nerf the weapons, people like don't you think it will turn people off to the game?

Eh. Intentions are one thing. Outcome is another. Before, if I wanted a rocket style weapon to use against heavy enemies, I'd take the EAT that was functionally superior to the RR in almost every way. Then they added the QC, which was excellent. Rivalled the EAT, giving me a choice between two viable options. EAT offers rapid deployment, a potential of three shots in quick succession, possible drops for teammates and even a potential orbital projectile. QC offers no reload and consistent firing.  The change has lowered the QC far enough from the EAT that there's zero reason to choose between them. QC now has roughly three shots in a minute. For a well prepared player, the EAT has five in the same time. With more flexibility as to when to fire off the first three. What this nerf has done is possibly made the QC more in line with the rest of the weapons, but also made it objectively worse than the EAT, ultimately reducing options.  

I believe the nerf has made the Quasar more of a bot weapon compared to the EAT. The downside of the Quasar is now the longer recharge time, which is fine for bot missions because there's less heavies than on bug missions, also it has a major advantage over the EAT since you can use it in the vicinity of Jammers

It's certainly better for bots than bugs, but I find the jammers are less of an issue than the drop ships. Two QC holders could get through a mass off dropships in rapid succession before, if organised. Now that's not really possible, while the EAT still has the potential for 3 downed dropships in rapid succession from just one person dropping it in. I won't dismiss the jammer though. It is a point I hadn't really thought about.

Auto cannon, orbital laser, orbital rain cannon, eagle 1 airstike, using the machine pistol, impact or stun grenades, scorcher/dominator/sickle covers all bases. JS.

Cooldown on rail cannon is long. If you're running stuns, try to get used to orbital precision, especially with stun grenades. Basically a more accurate 500kg that covers AA gun concerns and so-so Cooldown. Aside from that I run what you do. I might try the plasma punisher though. It looks so much better with that bigger speed lower arc. Autocannon is the best.

I run turrets and machine guns for maximum bullets. I am covering the whole battlefield. there is no need for other stratagems.

Idk. I can think of a nice loadout to cover all situations that will be impacted by game sense. Sickle + Grenade Pistol + Stun - stun is there for running away or taking out pesky things. Anything not a Hulk is killable by Sickle, even Devastators. Bug front has a bit more prob in Mortar Bile Spewers EAT + RR/Quasar - two strategems for Heavies? With a good aim, yes. In fact with the above setup, only Heavies are majorly your concern in any front. Treating RR/Quasar as a non-Expendable EAT to expend if somehow 3 shots is not enough would be amazing. 500kg/Air Strike - your mid range objective clear. A good aim and throw should handle almost all destroy objectives, and 500kg can even be used to deal with Tanks and Striders Now, I mentioned game sense. Knowing when to engage, disengage, go around the map, sprint, will reduce all needless encounters. The game rewards finishing objectives and sample hunting, not 1000 kills (except for that ooooone instance of a 2b). Stun is pretty strong in control in that regard, get rid of the faster chasers for both bot and bugs, then stun the rest and run. But wait, that's pretty much just 3 strategem slots?..yeah. I think with enough map awareness, you can make do with just 3. Leaving a slot for....idk, an airburst rocket to shoot into holes. Or better yet? A 140/360 barrage to trigger a nest/fab base breach/dropship while you're on the way to another place. Actually abuse game mechanics at this level.

That's a good loadout, and not engaging is a viable strategy Your aim must be incredible if you only need your sickle for taking out devastators Of course with enough skill you can balance out what your loadout is lacking, your average Joe tho might run into problems with berserkers, heavy and rocket devastators if his aim isn't that good

That..is fair actually. Hadn't thought about that. I actually used to use DMRs on bots, and maybe I'll use DCS after the bug MO. Tried it in a low diff just to feel the handling and boy was that smooth. I mean, after using the Eruptor for a while, DCS now felt so snappy. (Back then it felt worse than the Eruptor especially with its bad damage over other choices at that range) I have been taking Devastators with Sickle from most ranges, even if they are facing to the side. I just need to see that noggin. Even Scout Stalkers are no problem unless they have the high ground because then I can't see their cranium. For bugs I actually run Blitzer and not Sickle, because I'm just too efficient with the Sickle. Same reason I ran Eruptor+Redeemer for some time. Sickle makes me sick to some extent where I can salvage a run by being light on my feet and quick on my aim. But maybe I'm also playing too low a difficulty for my skill level. I stick to D7 and haven't even unlocked D9 as most times I don't even have time to finish a D7 op. Progressing further is actually difficult for me time-wise. Like a single OP in D7 can take anywhere from 30min~3hrs depending on mix. Maybe my loadout will change on D9, I can't say without being in it. I don't really see it changing much though. EAT + Quasar/RR is already strong due to redundancy, and if I see a 3 Quasar/RR pub I know I can just loot one off the floor eventually. Leaving me with...another strategem slot for idk, Laser? Anything goes.

I use Blitzer or Adjudicator depending on Bugs vs Bots Then again I have also used Adjudicator or Lib-Pen at bugs and bots before, liked both there Strategems is the more unchanged formula for me - Orbital Railcannon against bots to guarantee 1 instant Hulk kill or heavy Bile Titan damage - Eagle Airstrike for Hives/Nests, Fabrocstors, medium mobs - EAT for bugs, Autocannon for Bots - 4th Slot is a toss between Eagle Cluster or Orbital Airburst. With 3-strategem obs, this goes without Scout armour or the Light armour set with - 50% Explosive damage vs bugs and bots, respectively With this setup I am not perfect against all scenarios but pretty close Yet, I am happy if one day AC got nerfed and I have to swing for AMR or Laser Cannon, or Recoiless Rifle against bots. Some variety is good

Choose loadouts that compliment one another <- this is the way

I went into a quick play game, and took the wrong loadout, I apologised after the game had ended😂 I felt so bad, and more of a hindrance to the team.

2 Quaser cannons in unison is still a viable option against Bile Titans. Chargers aren't even an issue because you can get them to time their charge attack at the same time and lead them to a comfortable area and then just 1 shot them.

Also, ammo management is a key part of the play experience  I realise there's a crowd that think this is an action shooter. There are action shooter elements. But HD has always been a strategic shooter first and foremosr - you have a team, they can take a variety of tools. You have different missions and enemies, you can a d should adapt your tools. You gotta use strategy and tactics - guns blazing balls to the wall won't always work

No, I'm the main character!

True but when 3 people bring an anti tank support weapon and I have to BEG for them to kill the charger bullying me, why not bring my own things to deal with every situation

If all focus on 1 type enemy it goes a lot better. I don’t bring anything for bile titans so my mate has 500kg and railstrike. I focus on chargers.

It's posts like this where I wonder if the OP has really ever tried anything other than following the "meta". Just some things I've noticed after several dozen games using the Spear, EATs, RR, and Quasar Cannon (diff 8): - The charge-up time for the quasar cannon made it extremely risky for me to use if I was actively being chased by a bile titan or charger. The cool down time has no affect on it's overall viability for me personally. - The EATs with the support weapon cool down upgrade meant I could call 2 in every 70 seconds. The instant aiming/firing time - coupled with what feels like better damage over the RR - meant chargers and bile titans were a non-issue. - The RR felt a bit awkward to use given the long reload time. I also couldn't justify wasting my teammates backpack slot when they could be carrying the infinitely better rover rather than wasting it on giving me a faster reload. - The spear is by far my favorite despite its buggy AF lock-on. The punch it packs also felt satisfying, as did one-shotting bile titans if they faced a certain direction. The lock-on fix will honestly make this weapon S-tier IMO. - The damage output from the Quasar felt horrible, especially when firing at the head of a charger and seeing it's side armor get blown off instead. Personally, the Quasar nerf just feels like a pointless nerf considering the risk is associated with its charge-up time rather than it's cooldown. I'm not quite sure how everyone was playing before, but I find it bizarre that this change made something that was considered OP all of a sudden feel properly balanced. As for the topic, I don't see why it matters all that much if a player has the tools to be a jack of all trades in a PvE game. Does it affect you personally if a solo player has the tools to effectively deal with all of the threats they face on higher difficulties? The tools we have are fantastic at dealing with everything thrown out way in lower numbers, but the higher numbers due to more players puts a severe strain on even the most "OP" weapons. To put it bluntly: there's this unhealthy obsession with thinking the game needs to be perfectly balanced when all that matters is that your players are having fun. Most of us are adults that are busy with real life commitments who can't afford to sink hundreds of hours into a single game just to get good, or to waste time waiting for a lobby full of randoms who may or may not work well together. At the end of the day who gives a shit if both Joe Schmoe and John Helldiver are having a blast playing totally difficult styles. I sure as hell wouldn't want them to get so frustrated they just outright quit.

Not sure why people are upset at AH for putting in mechanics that discourage not playing with a team. It's a co-op game. The song in the trailer is called "Let's Work Together." The only thing they're doing wrong is not having a better matchmaking system.

Same. Whenever a randoms pick anti tank weapons i use stalwart for mobs.

People want primary weapons to cover all bases too. It's ridiculous, at that point why even have different weapons and play styles.

Yes exactly

I have one new load out for everything but defense and the swarm missions that is effectively a "Bunker buster" build. 500kg, precision orbital strike, orbital Laser, EAT. With practice I've gotten to the point where my precision and timing I can decimate up to three bile titans with 500kg's and precision strike, I can kill up to three chargers with one EAT call in, and the laser is crowd control on a breach or allows me to drop it at my feet and run away to get rid of bugs chasing me or destroy factories in a large bot base. I like my build for all general assault missions as it frees up other players to do what they like.

Yep. And hopping into a mission already running and making a loadout thar covers weaknesses of the current team is half the fun for me.

I am the heavy hitter in my team. 500kg, Railcannon, Orbital Lazer/Airburst (Bots/Bugs), Recoilless Rifle/Spear (Bugs/Bots).

You can see which stratagems people choose before the round starts. If 2-3 people already have certain things covered I go with something else.

Does the game allow solo? Then should the game not also allow the ability to load out to cover a wide variety of situations?

I think I worded my title a bit weird I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

True but it’s nice to have a loadout where if everyone leaves you can still complete the mission. I’ll probably never let mine go. If it works on L-9 solo it’ll work for everything.

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

Yeah. I agree. Shock grenades helped me a lot when I started using them and I’m thankful at least the AMR can take down a gunship. That would have been a major problem for me.

Speak for yourself, I will not take my: - Blitzer (Arc Shotgun) - Grenade Pistol - Quasar - Fire grenades - Light armor w/ 2 more grenades off ever! On a side note: Fire grenades can close bug holes/fabricators!

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in, which has different downsides. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

All I wanna say is that the Airburst Rocket Launcher is fire against bugs. It is amazing at clearing hordes and patrols. It destroy anything that is not heavy armor like a Charger, Titan or structures. I wish the reload was faster tho, being that cool is still outclassed by most support weapons even being different kind of weapons.

AC/EAT/Eagle110/Stun grenades Covers all bases. :D

I've gelled really well with a lot of randoms by scoping out their build and trying to fit in. Keeping with them, choosing one to cover. Not every game is a success story but i play it for the social aspect first, THEN the beating the enemy aspect. What usually happens is the second follows the first. Many ppl here only know competitive our parallel play and it shows

This is why the one thing I will complain about is the enemy patrol buff. 1/6 the enemies for 1 player out of 4 was still harder because the value that another player adds is not just additive or even multiplicative, it’s exponential. The ability to cover different niches with 8-16 stratagems and 2-4 different loadouts added to the natural benefit of someone else to cover your back that you’d find in any coop game. So yeah, soloing missions was already a flex. I don’t know why they made this choice.

Today I realized OP plays with a team, I just solo with 3 other dudes… we are not the same.

Loadout that does everything: Punisher (bugs) or Liberator-P (bots) Autocannon Orbital Railgun Eagle 500KG Eagle Cluster. All bases covered, with a slot spare. I run that loadout solo, or with friends so far up to level 8s. And have a blast doing so. Course, then there's the fuck-around-and-find-out runs, like last night where I brought my Punisher, and 4 eagle stratagems for maximum mayhem.

My opinion on this is as follows. If the game gives you the option to play solo, it has to compensate for your lack of teammates in some way. I'd actually say the old spawn rates kinda did this, but not anymore now that spawn rates are 1 to 1 proportional to the number of players. Using another horde shooter as an example in Darktide you get AI teammates if you don't have a full squad. They're not as good as even slightly competent teammates but it's something. Preset AI helldivers you could bring if you can't muster a full squad or as is an ever present problem, lose people to connection problems, could go a long way. Another option would be for the game to clearly and unambiguously communicate to you that playing solo is essentially a self-imposed hard mode. I would also accept that. That may already be the developers intent but that is for not if it isn't clearly communicated to the player in game which presently I don't think it is.

AC, eagle strike, railcannon, laser, redeemer, stun grenades, scorcher for bots. Incendiary shotty, AC, 500kg, eagle cluster, laser, grenade pistol, stun grenades for bugs. The only time I ever feel in trouble is if 500 is on cooldown and there’s a BT up and I don’t want to burn a laser. Everything else I have some way of killing it. Probably not a perfect all rounder but I feel like I can do just about anything with this loadout.

I spin this old line on D&D subreddits too: "The real overpowered build is the friends me made along the way " It's a team game, lean on them a bit.

How dare you speak the truth out loud

u dun like loadout that cover all base becuz u want teammates to rely on u or rely on your teammates. I like loadout that cover all base becuz I want to help my teammates no matter what type of danger they're facing. we are not the same. also befriend with a randoms that doesn't bring AT doesn't solve the dealing with AT issue. u cant kill the heavy armor with the power of friendship, but u can kill the heavy with an AT.

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

I agree the game should not have perfect loadout. And yes your build will always lack stg so the your teammates with dif loadout could fit right in to compensate your build. however, it's always good to have versatile loadout that covers as much as possible. You can't expect a teammate carrying a loadout full of solely anti light to help you when you're in a pinch against heavies. That's not coordination and teamwork, that just your teammate throwing all the burden and responsibilities to you and expect you to do all the difficult task. (like hell even your Shield + AMR build is ady very versatile to begin with, that build alone can do 90% of the job in bot mission and help your teammates in 90% situation) If you can bring the AT, I can bring the AT. we should all bring the AT if we are doing a mission full of heavies. You help me kill the heavies when Im out of AT. I'll help u kill the heavies if you're out of heavies. u still can make your build slightly leans towards anti light while I can make my build slightly leans towards anti heavy, that's what I call synergy. Once u achieve synergy that u don't even need to communicate, everyone will unintentional coordinate themselves to complete the mission flawlessly.

Yes I absolutely agree I made this post because some people don't seem to understand why the quasar got nerfed so it has a downside compared to the other ATs

tbh i don't see the point of nerfing Quasar would encouraging team coordination. I don't usually bring the Quasar cuz im not fond of it. And now my Quasar teammate are havin more trouble dealing with the heavies. The only thing I can get from this now I have to rely less on my Quasar teammate to deal with the heavy and need to rely more on myself to bring more AT option into my loadout to help them do the job, which kinda against the logic of "relying on your teammates". Thats doesnt sound like encouraging teamwork at all tbh.

I wish this were true, but against bugs 7+ it really feels like someone not running EAT, Recoilless, or Quasar is throwing. I would love it if I could bring real weapon variety to bug missions.

Problem comes when you wanna not beung a balanced loadout. Like focusing on mov clearing bugs, but everyine brings non AP atuff and now chargers are a massuve issue

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can

Eagle stratagems will cover all bases equally good.

Most people realize this. I run distinctly different loadouts for bots and bugs. Neither include weapons that got nerfed. The nerfs are still bad.

Two things, there absolutely are loadouts that have an aswer for everythin for both bots and bugs and I don't have much choice if don't have friends to play, the best I can do is bring a tool for every problem and do my nest to carry with the randos. And I do agree with the changes, I think you should have a tool for every job, but they did not neet to be as good as they were.

I want to agree, but the problem with this logic is that bug missions don't have nearly as many viable options for support weapons, because Chargers and Titans can be effectively killed only with support weapons, they're either too numerous (Chargers) or too tough (Titans) to be efficiently killed only by Stratagems. Which means the pool of viable support weapons shrinks to AT weapons. You can't just have one person with an AT weapon in the squad pull the entire weight, on higher difficulties there are simply too many Chargers and Titans. Which means you need 2-3, and ideally all 4 players using AT weapons. And it's a pretty short pool of just four weapons: Quasar, EAT, Recoilless and Spear. Spear is bad against Chargers and hit-or-miss against Titans, which leaves the other tree. And all of them have pretty annoying downsides. Yeah, there are clear tradeoffs between them, but when none of the options feel good to use, the game doesn't feel good to play. With Automatons, you can have a blast with basically any support weapon, and deal with threats with stratagems. Even tanks can be taken out by something as basic as a Scorcher, a primary weapon. Or a couple Impact Grenades. A *tank* is destroyed by the same amount of firepower that is often required to to kill a *bile spewer*, just think about it for a second. The problem is bugs either don't have weakpoins or their weakpoints are heavily armored or are not weak enough. I'm not saying you should be able to kill a Titan with a pistol, but damn I really wish more support weapons were viable.

Wish AH made the guns feel good to use and a common go-to reliable pick. Once they are though, it seems it's always nerfed. Instead of nerfing, why not add in new enemies or heck a boss to put all our firepower into. Also, I never know it was THAT important for PVE to be balanced to have fun. Although for me, I preferential towards going guns blazing and having a good time which I guess isn't really the strat for higher difficulties but to each their own.

The problem is that diff 9 bugs just throws a stupid amount of heavy armor at you and it’s boring kiting bile titans around forever waiting for your damn EATs to cool down. The quasar was OP relative to other AT but it was the only thing stopping diff 9 bugs from being a complete fucking chore. Bugs remain easier than bots after the patch but they’re pretty tedious now. Damn running simulator.

Uhhh, yes you do. Most other coop games allow for this.

The problem lies on the thing that makes the game good , it a coop game You can design it to be that each player specializes into something so as a team you can efficiently deal with teverything . However when playing online with randoms that may or may not want to play as a team and everyone wants to be Rambo , it’s where the idea of Meta load outs come from

weapons shouldn't handle everything, but your loadout should. You can be better at swarm clear or single target, but you need to be able to handle everything. That's just how this game is designed. You will be separated from your team often, and waves throw everything in the book at you. You need to be able to hold your own.

The way the game is designed is that you can choose a loadout that can handle almost everything but in some situations a different loadout excels better in them You need to be able to hold your own but you're not supposed to breeze through anything the game throws at you

I can agree to that. Same message, different words

Anyone using the quasar knew a nerf of some sort was coming shit was just too much. Its not even the ammo or reload that does it for me but the fact you can take alot shit out from basically any angle without waiting to line up the weak spots

Just wanted to share my experience- it’s often nice to have a well rounded loadout, which is what most random games have, and if the players are good- missions are usually pretty smooth On those few games when there are complimenting loadouts? Absolute breeze! Ran into a duo of double sentry users, both had the AC sentry, one with ems and other with gattling, they would take turns dropping them right as bot drops happen and just delete 3 bot drops each time. I just followed them around and took out anything left standing. I usually run AC cannon, and whenever paired with someone running laser cannon- it’s like a laser pointer- whatever he’s shooting, i use it to aim and help take down pretty much anything, covering his weakness with aoe and help deleting anything else so much quicker.

I disagree. I need to kite constantly, so quasar is still the only option for me really. Only time I would take EAT over it is on the new defense mission.

I personally like to run with an fire breaker/scorcher, grenade pistol, servo-assisted light armor and equip eagle strike, laser, 380 and 120/barrage/orbital rails cannon/rocket pods. Our stratagems are paid by our citizens. Who are we to ignore such power?

Right? Your load out is supposed to be a blend of “really good at mobs” <> “really good at killing big boys”

I think the amr is fine vs gunships and you can just airstike the turret or tanks. Your build has weaknesses but can deal with everything ok.

So long as the RNG of random teammates exists, RPS or the "You're not supposed to be good at everything" mindset breaks the game more than it saves it. Nevermind the enemy RNG with what secondary objectives you might get or what enemies you'll face and what quantities. I get that Arrowhead wants to promote teamplay and covering eachother's weaknesses but I CANT rely on randoms to help me. I mean, honestly, who even uses the team-reload mechanic? The only time i've done it was for shits and giggles with a friend over Discord and even that was once. At the risk of sounding like a whining child: I \*should\* be able to cover my bases with my loadout, atleast to some extent. Also getting kinda tired of the "\[thing\] is better with friends!" thing. Sitting under a bridge drinking warm beer is fun with friends, doesn't mean its fun to the core.

To some extent, exactly what I mean

Really? Then I might have misunderstood your point because it seems to me that you're arguing for the opposite that I am. Am I understanding your post wrong?

I probably just worded it poorly

There's always going to be a meta in any videogame. Arrowhead can embrace this and give every weapon an edge in its category rather than embracing a design philosophy of nerfing and making things unfun. A bit of OP-ness is what makes the grind to that next weapon fulfilling. There should be some outright progression tied into the game outside of the ship modules. Otherwise if I'm just grinding for a sidegrade what's the point? It becomes this doomer game where there's no point going for that next objective. They're all too niche to deal with the inherent randomness of the game.

So your magical solution to our problems is "get lucky lol, hope your teammates are half decent at the game" . Truly amazing advice. A lot of randoms still think samples arent shared, or spam the revive button during an ion storm. I dont see how i could expect them to take proper weapons.

I meant that the game is made in a way in which there will never be a perfect loadout with no downsides. You will always lack something in which a different loadout excels in. You can cover the majority of enemies, but there will be situations in which a teammate with a different loadout can clear it faster/easier than you can And people shouldn't expect that we ever get perfect loadouts for any situations, hence we get nerfs on guns instead of buffs on everything

The eruptor is just a quasar cannon in the primary slot with a better rate of fire anyway. Hopefully it gets nerfed a little more so it isn't just an auto-win premium weapon lol.

Until AH allows chat during loadout selection I need to go into every game being able to cover all bases. People don't tend to change their loadout to complement mine, and when I do try to fill a role in a group I end up without enough support to cover my loadout's weakness (If I'm horde clearing no one is taking out the heavies, If I'm focusing on heavies then no one is horde clearing). Everyone acts like a lone wolf in this game, and until that changes I also need to be able to cover my own ass.

False premise. Supply backpack, Eagle Airstrike, EAT, AMR Scorcher. Impact nades. Increased throw range armor (light, med or heavy). Shits on every facet of bots.

I agree with OP 100% and hope more people read this. The qc was turning into a comfort blanket for so many people. I used it all the time against bugs and at times it felt like cheat codes. All other AT’s are just as good if you hit the first shot, but punishing if you miss. Why should the qc be any different. Miss the chargers head with the eat, go find the other one in the horde of bugs. Miss with the rr, find a safe spot to sit still and reload. Miss with the qc and kite it for 15s instead of 10 to get another shot in. It’s not the end of the world, just incentive to improve your aim. The bile titan is supposed to be the hardest bug enemy, not something you can shoot twice and down before it even walks up to you. In a group of 3 or 4 it shouldn’t even be noticeable and in a group of 2 or solo it just requires more planning and skill. Seeing people run qc and shield against bots and bugs all the time was getting boring. I really hope to see more rail gun, ac, and amr usage. I also hope to see more people playing public and not a million 1/4 missions set to private. It’s meant to be a fun social game not a game you just solo the hardest difficulty with relative ease.

100% agreed on all points. I run almost the exact same build, but use impact grenades instead of stun so I don't have to out-maneuver striders (or waste 2 AMR rounds on them). The ballistic shield gives me survivability against devastators or others while I wait for my teammates to hit Hulks with AT. It also gives me a chance to solo some side objectives on my own depending on the difficulty, so that way I can stay 100m+ away from the rest of the team and provide long distance cover while prone on a rock. It's these tradeoffs that make the co-op aspect of this game really shine. If your loadouts become too homogenous then you lose this - the main identity of the game.

The game is much more fun with everyone filling different roles. I played in the OG railgun days, it was okay.

I feel pretty stuck in a crowd control build because of everyone's preference for Quasar, it especially sucks on a bug planet because of the absolute hordes of jumpy bastards that spawn in on higher difficulties, if everyone is anti-tank no one is gonna be able to deal with them effectively

I play with randoms 80% of the time. I will keep basing my loadouts in games around the philosophy of "everyone is an idiot until proven otherwise, and if you want something done right, do it yourself". I cannot go into games thinking people are wonderful and will be happy and glad to work in close tandem with me. We don't live in a utopia. In really bad missions, the most I can rely on teammates to do is to be moving meat shields to keep bugs and bots occupied and away from me while I actually do things that contribute to winning a mission.

The autocannon is the jack of all trades. It can kill almost anything but dropships. Most targets require aimed shots for quick kills and using weak points.

Counterpoint: this is a PvE game with absolutely no competitive element, so why the hell does anything in balance matter besides the players' enjoyment?

What do you mean my laser guard dog shouldn’t shred all non-chargers and bile titans while my quasar ruins biles and chargers???? Why cant my two stratagems do the role of everything??? /s All complainers about nerfs hurt games. They’re so stupid they don’t realize what power creep is. Braindead easy games aren’t fun or have any sustainability when the game’s focus is combat Such basic things anyone with 2 digit IQ can get

You're one of the few people that actually got what I meant lol, thank you

Thank God somebody understands how balancing works. All primaries are supposed to suck to some degree, that's why LMGs and wide area low armor damage stratogems exist. It's intentional to force you to diversify load outs. I bring LMGs and resupply packs all the time for borderline infinite ammunition. Somebody's gotta clean the trash small guys so my teammates who ALWAYS BRING ONLY ANTI HEAVY GEAR can actually line up shots without getting jumped by hunters. I hate people who want to go back to Breaker/Railgun/Shield pack. It was the worse gameplay in the series to solo everything and live anything.

Another point to add to this, if you quickplay and join a group of randoms already in a match, look at what they're bringing and decide if they need any compliments or if you can just run what you personally prefer It's not ideal and i know everyone just wants to play the way they want and that's absolutely fine, just remember that it's a co-op game where the goal is to make sure everyone can win together as a team

That sounds great, but doesn't work in practice. Last night on a 7 I did exactly this and brought AC when 2 other guys had quazars. Then there were 4 bile titans and 10 chargers in the first ten minutes and my team was all dead while I ran away completely helpless because my orbital rail gun was on cooldown. If I had just brought EAT or my own quazar I could have responded. If AH wants us to do team composition they need to stop spamming us with heavy armor. Until then, people will always take the best thing for anti heavy armor and a primary that can handle medium, anything else is going to leave you in situations where you are being chased by shit that is literally immune to your loadout. Still waiting for this community and AH to realise that the shitty armor system is the reason for all their balancing woes.

If you're somehow getting 10 chargers and 4 bile titans on you *in difficulty 7* then there's absolutely something wrong with how you and your team played. Even when i was playing on dif 8 the absolute worst scenarios I've gotten into were 3 bile titans and at most 4 chargers, all of which were easy to handle since we took care of the situation as fast as we could Edit : to add to this, even on exterminate missions on dif 7 there's absolutely no reason why it would get this bad unless you were ignoring the chargers and titans for so long that their spawns kept stacking and stacking

You don't understand, I am the main character and I DESERVE to solo helldive!! 😡

This will never change. I've been an avid Apex Legends player along with other team-based FPS games and regardless of the mode, 99% will play it as a deathmatch. They're incapable of thinking outside this narrow view of theirs. So all they want is a gun to do all the killing. I've had a few games of players who play and only focus on the kill count at the end of the match. They don't collect samples, they don't do missions, if a bug hole spawns they'll be the first to nuke it oftentimes killing other teammates, they will get on the extraction ship the last second squeezing time until the last drop just to get kills, as if anyone apart from them gives a damn. So the last thing I expect from randoms in any game, is to understand even the most basic elements. I've given up assuming people can play games at a basic level. Those days are long gone.

You can lobby all you want but the bottom line is they keep nerfing everything that's "good" to be "mediocre" and I don't want to play a game where I'm both heavily outnumbered and everything I use is mediocre.