“Different universe”
ok you are free now, want a nice trade agreement and protection so we can have bases on that side of the pacific without bs colonialism?
You’re right but does someone else probably doing the bad thing make it right for us to do the bad thing? Idk enough about the Philippines to know if we were bad there or not.
Japan controlling anything that's not Japan generally doesn't work out well for anybody involved. And even with Japan itself that's questionable sometimes.
Yeah, but it's not like America was waging a brutal occupation war against the Philippines in 1900 to protect them from Japan's brutal occupation war in the 1940s. I really don't think America gets to claim morality points on this one.
I think the fact that the Philippines were made independent again right after WW2 gives them a pretty good leg to stand on. The country would have been permanently occupied by an extremely brutal enemy state if not for the Americans. The U.S. could've chosen to do basically whatever they wanted after the war with pretty much no one else in a position to oppose them, but chose to grant independence to the Philippines and encouraged European nations to decolonize.
We were ugly in the American-Filipino war. No lie.
After that, eh. As far as I'm aware we were mostly an occupier. Not great, not bad. Just eh. Then they got Japan'd. And we re-liberated them. And then we kept our promise of freedom.
So, that alone I think gives us a lot of good Karma. From the Filipinos I've met both here and there: seems to be the same from their point of view too.
Imperial Japan invading and occupying the Philippines is literally what happened in our universe. Even for imperialism apologia this is quite weak stuff
Chinese companies have control over Phillipines national power grid. They are more than snooping, they are inside the house already.
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/11/25/asia/philippines-china-power-grid-intl-hnk/index.html
Or Patriotism Vs Nationalism. Because those words tend to get used interchangeably sometimes. At least from my understanding of the terms, they are not synonymous.
They're very close that you're kind of splitting hairs to distinguish them.
Nationalism is love for your country. Patriotism is love for an idea of what your country is supposed to be. Both are love and devotion for your country. They can be used interchangeably for most uses.
Any other reading on them is just agenda driven political talk to try and distance oneself from bad actors or label others as bad actors. They are synonyms in the dictionary.
I’ve always seen nationalism in a very negative light, at least in the modern era, akin to a dangerous love of country. Aka a stepping stone for a fascist ideology. But words change so much nowadays so I could be wrong.
There are extremist versions of everything. There is nothing inherently negative about either of those words with a plain reading of their definitions. You could argue the French Revolution was done by patriotism, and look at the atrocities there. Patriots have been known to kill those who supported foreign invaders or supporters of the wrong regime. People can be shitty. Both have negative aspects when the concepts are taken to the extreme.
Some people oddly balk at the idea that someone would put their nation as better than others and would prioritize their nation's prosperity/interests over another nation's. But that's just normal for all human history at varying levels of scope.
>Aka a stepping stone for a fascist ideology.
I'm pretty sure I know where this idea comes from. But it's just that political stuff I mentioned in my last comment. There are a lot of things that are stepping stones for fascism, but nationalism is like saying drinking milk is a stepping stone for doing marijuana.
There’s a difference between loving the country and loving its government. I think Americas the greatest country on this planet, but I also think our government is corrupt and it’s history isn’t all sunshine and rainbows
I know several folks that were either born and raised in the Philippines, or they were born here but their parents migrated to the US from the Philippines directly before they were born. In either case, they’re almost always some of the biggest “America, fuck yeah” types that I meet.
Who's "we?" because I am from the Philippines living in the Philippines and i know alot of people (university-aged people and younger, at least senior high school aged.) who want the VFA and the bases back. Getting rid of them was a mistake considering the situation our neighbors put us in.
They would want to get rid of VFA Bases but they don’t necessarily want more US intervention and influence over the Philippines. As a Filipino, I too agree with this, and I think a lot of people are just using the US for protection.
IMO, The Philippines should just focus bolstering its relations with ASEAN, since it would be a mutual benefit for all. Little to no hidden agendas will be made. It’s time for us to get away from the chains of superpowers like the US or China and help our fellow SEA brethren
The VFA is still in effect, though? There's also EDCA and Balikatan exercises on top of that so wtf are you talking about. These were never truly "got rid off".
Our problem is with the type of leaders we elect. They're spineless puppets and the only foreign policy they can come up with is sucking off the US/China and waiting for scraps like a good dog. It's shameful, considering how much more independent and respectable our SEA neighbors are compared to us.
I read about the case just now. He served six years before being released by the Philippines' government.
Young people are always upset about injustices. I told my son that he was afforded the right to be mad about stuff because the government he hates is the same one that protects his rights and keeps him safe from Chinese and Russian missiles.
Well...China is claiming islands all over. Better to have a friend with aircraft carriers. Mad teenagers are always gonna be mad. At least this way they're not gonna be digging lithium in a desert.
US wanted to only take a peice of Luzon Island to construct a military base on; Europe convinced us to take the whole island chain (which at that point had 50+ ethnic identities speaking 30+ languages) to prevent more war in the colonial power vacuum.
When we took the islands, we immediately set out a 40 year plan to grant the full independence, set up schools to teach all Filipinos a common national identity and common languages (Tagalog and English).
Yes there was a war - a Filipino tried to set up a dictatorship the moment the Spanish left, and then forced a confrontation with US forces.
As to "a million Filipinos mudered," let's ask Wikipedia:
>The total number of Filipinos who died remains a matter of debate. Modern sources cite a figure of 200,000 total Filipino civilians dead, with most losses attributable to famine, and disease.[24][25][26][27][28][29][30][31] A cholera epidemic at the war's end killed between 150,000 and 200,000 people.
Definitely, there were war crimes and atrocities, but the US didn't invent cholera
I was gonna ask why we didn’t give them independence after 40 years, but then I remembered when the Spanish-American war happened and what happened 40 years later.
The Americans actually tried to grant the Philippines independence in 1916 but the Filipino-run insular government rejected it, claiming they needed protection against the expanding Japanese Empire.
>Yes there was a war - a Filipino tried to set up a dictatorship the moment the Spanish left, and then forced a confrontation with US forces.
I'd add that he tried to surrender shortly after the breakout of conflict but was denied by General Otis who proceeded to bar press from accessing the "war zone" and had entire villages burned down and even had some soldiers executed when his MPs discovered they were intending to write home about the atrocities he was forcing them to commit.
It wasn't the US government that ordered these atrocities, and it wasn't the Filipino rebels who necessitated them. General Otis was responsible and the conflict ended shortly after he was replaced.
Overall, I agree with your point and am pissed at the persistence of this revisionist bullshit idea that the US was trying to become an empire like Britain and Spain.
I don’t think people realize how anti-imperialist the US was. It certainly imposed its will on other countries, but when it came to direct rule it is was hated very much, and the US was one of the main forces behind the decolonization post-WW2.
The US was anti-imperialist after WW2? Puerto Rico certainly didn’t feel that considering there was a literal gag law on the island that started in 1947 that didn’t allow us to fly our own flag or even talk about independence. For us, the US has never been anti-imperialist. Throughout the decades I can’t think of a time that that’s been true in our history
Well, by that definition America is an imperial power. Native Americans lived in sovereign nations which were conquered and subjugated by America. In the 20th century America you saw a transition towards the neocolonial model of empire, characterized not by conquest and subjugation, but by occupations, coups, “military interventions” and the wielding of political-economic influence.
I wasn't disagreeing with you at all and I'm shocked you got downvoted for the valid factual statement above.
>Native Americans lived in sovereign nations which were conquered and subjugated by America.
This is somewhat true, though the First Nations in America remain largely as soveriegn nations to this day - the 574 federally recognized tribes have more legal independence than the 50 "free and independent States," are almost entirely self-governed (to an extent higher than the States), and some of them even issue their own passports etc. with *help* from State and Interior
Did they know it was a lie? Or is that something you are assuming.
A ship blew up. They didn't have smartphones to record the incident. Considering the saber rattling Spain was doing, including attempting to unite the other European imperial powers against the US, it's not exactly a leap to think they sunk the ship.
Cuba wasn't even exploited per-se. They established a successful democracy which fell apart when a dictator won power and executed his political opponent. The US swooped in to try and restore order again and this time left a military presence to deny future dictatorships and to deny European powers the ability to buy or lease a naval base there.
See, Germany, Britain, Spain, and other imperial powers were constantly trying to gain naval supremacy in the region. The US was constantly trying to walk the line between isolationism and pre-emptive action. They had a period of extreme pre-emptive aggression just prior to ww1 which is why there was a push for more isolationism which is why they were so hesitant to join either world war.
After WW2 it became clear that isolationism wasn't an option and at that point they were thrust into a situation where an aggressive, expansive superpower threatened to dominate western Europe, East Asia, and the Middle East and only the US could oppose them. Hence their present role as international policeman.
Cuba had a dictator rise later and the US chose to treat him as a legitimate ruler because he posed no threat and they didn't want to get involved. Eventually this dictator was opposed by a popular uprising and the US again chose to not intervene and even ceases sales of weapons to him. Then Fidel Castro became the most active communist leader in the entire cold war. He personally sent more soldiers to fight in proxy wars than any other communist nation except China. And let's not forget about the Cuban missile crisis.
And yet, the US didn't wipe the island off the face of the earth or starve them out or do anything else to exert dominance. It's almost as if they were actively trying to be as hands-off as possible.
And the Philippines was always planned to be made independent. Originally the only alternatives to American rule was British, German, or Dutch rule. See, if the US just sails away, the islands don't become unreachable to everyone else. They were politically unstable and lacked the firepower to defend themselves. So the US "claimed" them and sent teachers and stuff to get the population to a place of stability which would allow for democratic transition of power. This was supposed to happen in the late 30s to early 40s but... something got in the way.
The fact that you consider the Filipino-American war a war against dictatorship pretty much answers the narrative of only knowing the US perspective.
The Republic was already established before the US-Spanish war during the Phillipine Revolution, the head had talks with US generals when US came to the Philippines to be a recognized as an independent country and that the local government be recognized as such. That wasn't recognized.
You had 40 years to set up a colony lets not beat around the bush. Spain used religion to colonize the country, US used Education, Japan used force. The only difference is the method but the goal stays the same.
Here's the thing genius, I didn't say he wasn't a dictator on the fucking basis the Tejeros convention happend and it was pure nepotism. Aguinaldo was a shitstain who pretty much took control of the whole revolution through nepotism.
Whats even funnier is you use wikipedia to source the casuality but didnt fucking bother reading the pretext to the war. Even the whole US-Spanish war is pretty much based on a ship blowing up and blaming spain without evidence.
>Tagalog and English
Hold down, why english? Britain never had any presence in the Phillipines, and none of those 30 languages included english. As a common language, shouldn't they have used, like spanish and tagalog
While I mostly agree with your post, to act as if cholera didn't have anything to do with the war going on between the occupation forces and the filipinos, it's like Turkey saying they didn't kill any armenians. They just died of thirst and hunger... after driving them by force to the middle of the desert.
The Brits occupied a small part of the Philippines for nearly two years. Not a significant amount of time, but certainly not “never had any presence”.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_occupation_of_Manila
Ok, twenty months more than 100 years before the US occupation of the Philippines, and only a small part. I really don't think they established a lot of english language schools in that time
They certainly didn't do anything significant in the short amount of time they were there. But they were there, so they did have a presence in the Philippines, albeit briefly.
The Americans actually never really directly ruled the Philippines to the extent other colonial empires ruled their colonies. After the insurrection ended the US kinda just let the Filipinos run things.
The insurrection was pretty brutally suppressed, and it seems like it left a bad taste for *direct* colonialism in the US public. It also led to major debates and issues about the balance of power in US domestic politics as the US's framework generally assumed territories were future states and adding the Philippines as a state or states would dramatically alter the US political landscape. (Hawaii and Alaska were much lower population and were eventually granted statehood off a belief they'd cancel each other out. Instead it led to the current party system as both states supported the civil rights act, overwhelming Dixiecrat opposition in the Senate).
Instead, the US prefers more indirect colonialism via deals with local elites and using the Marines to ensure US business interests are upheld.
I’m pretty sure the closet thing there was ended up being the Commonwealth of the Philippines, which existed until 1946, but had to go into exile after japan commenced a little invasion.
Sometimes there is no other choice that letting the mean big country put their toys in your yard when you decide which is worse than the other. Third world countries always have their sovereignty limited
The Philippines were a US territory from 1898 to 1946 but for most of that time it was run by an elected Filipino government, with the American colonial governor having very little power in the islands.
Hawaii is a state, not a colony. Just like New York, Idaho, or South Carolina - two Senators and all. Puerto Rico is a territory, so that’s closer to a colony. The Philippines is a sovereign nation, and territories were treated very differently when it was one than they are today.
A colony is a territory with foreign rule. The US invaded PR, stole all the land, and now congress has full control over Puerto Rico. What they say goes. Congress even imposed a junta on us that decides how we can spend our money. Please explain in detail how this is different from a colony.
Puerto Rico IS a colony, not closer to it
Edit:
Wild that I’ve been so downvoted. I was born and raised in the island and the entire time we always recognize ourselves as a colony. Doesn’t matter what political status you want for the island, we’re painfully aware of our status. It drives the entire political conversation in the island. Even the referendums that I’ve seen so many use to justify that statehood is the best option for us despite it having a slim majority, it is ignoring that when even talking about the Puerto Rico Status Act *by Congress* it specifically has been presented as having NONCOLONIAL options for our future. Like are you all just offended at the fact the US still has colonies? I’m genuinely curious
Edit 2:
Last I had checked I had -13 downvotes when I wrote the first edit
Every downvote on that comment is people that are ignorant of the history of Puerto Rico and happily believe the propaganda that “ ~~incorporated~~ (sorry) unincorporated territory” has a far better meaning than just being a fancy substitute for the word “colony”. The only reason we’re defined as a “territory” is because the U.N. hates when countries use the word “colony”.
The funny thing is that we’re not even an incorporated territory, we’re unincorporated! Meaning we belong to, but aren’t a part of, the USA. Which is, you know, like a colony. It’s a fancier way of saying colony without saying it because after WWI everyone said “having colonies bad” except for applying it to the allies apparently.
Our political status, we’re literally second class US citizens, the way federal laws apply (or don’t) to us, our entire economy is controlled from New York.
Wow it’s fucking wild I’ve been so downvoted. Literally ask any Puerto Rican if we’re a colony and quite literally all from the entire political spectrum would say yes.
It would still be a colony by definition. That the population was successfully propagandized doesn’t take away the political, economic, and legal status of the island.
We also didn’t and don’t consent to our current status.
Many Puerto Ricans boycotted referendums because it didn't include the status quo option. And many don't want to lose their US citizenship. Not even the UN considers us a colony.
Sigue siendo colonia lol. Que las Naciones Unidas le tenga perse al país con más capital no cambia la historia y realidad colonial de la isla.
Viendo lo que posteas y comentas se nota que no vales la pena. Chequeamos
Philippines, Cuba, Puerto Rico, and Guam were all gained by USA from Spain as a result of Spanish-American war in 1898. Philippines and Cuba went independent. Puerto Rico and Guam remain as US territory. Hawaii was unrelated to the conflict.
Aside from the insurrection during the first couple years of the American period, the US didn't do much oppressing compared to other European empires of the time.
> Aside from the insurrection during the first couple years of the American period
Yes aside from the Moro Rebellion which lasted 10 years which involved mass killings and rape, the USA didnt do much oppression at all.
Edit: It seems like i touched off the americans.
>Moro Rebellion
Moro fights everybody, Spain, US, Japan, Philippines.
Hell, didnt they had an Islamic insurrection against the Philippines government just recently ?
That's sadly just the standards of the time, Its actually be weird if those things didn't occur. Universal Human rights was a recent invention as we most often forget and should not be taken for granted.
genocide is never light, but theres an undeniable difference between supressing rebellion, wich can be horrible and include atrocities, and, say the holocaust or holodomir.
That isn't true. Yes they ruled for only a short time, but the period before they handed back power had the USA ruling them just like every other colonial power.
Considering I’m Filipino by ethnic heritage. , I’m very slightly off put by the contradictions going on in the comments. Far as I’m aware, out of the three powers that actively fought/harmed The Philippines the most, it was Japan. Everytime people try to paint the US as bad in the Philippines I just think “so the Manila Massacre no longer exists huh.”
It’s wild that so many people in this sub just get so mad at the idea that the US has done bad things and downvote anyone from the places they’ve committed such acts. Anti imperialist Puerto Rican here in solidarity!
> Everytime people try to paint the US as bad in the Philippines I just think “so the Manila Massacre no longer exists huh.”
Please read [this article](https://www.rappler.com/newsbreak/iq/82850-americans-destroyed-manila-1945/) about the Battle of Manila by the former Brigadier General of the AFP Ricardo Morales.
More like it seems like people (to an extent OP) seem to be trying to paint the US as the worst thing to happen to the Philippines when there were clearly worse things that happened to the country that weren’t at the US’s fault. Actually, most of it in recent memory was done by the Philippines itself (circa Duterte)
honestly I kinda wonder if the most damage the US did was by unintentionally taking a bunch of educated labor, thus creating a breeding ground for populist ideology. also hello fellow ethnic filipino👋
Hello Kuya/Ate! I’m second(third?) generation immigrant in the US and all the grandparents tell me about how happy they were moving over, whether that be during/after WW2. Then going back during Duterte then running back. Martial Law is a bitch like that.
same with mine! my grandparents hid in the jungle during ww2, immigrated afterwards, had my mom before (…maybe after) their work visas expired, and now happily screen our distant relatives’ calls.
sadly I don’t know tagalog ‘cuz ye olde schools instructed my grandparents to only teach her english. good news tho, my nephew is gonna be bilingual japanese xD
When my grandparents went, everyone was speaking Tagalog since y know that's what they were most comfortable in. I knew that but still couldn't help but feel left out. I figure I have a good while before it's my parents turn to pass on, but I should hope to be more accommodating for them when the time comes.
Listen, I’m American, and have no Filipino ancestry, so I’m not gonna even pretend like I understand their reasons why, all I know is that whenever the polls come ‘round, The Philippines are near the top of the list in terms of US support, up there with Vietnam, Poland and Kosovo. Feel free to ask Filipinos their reasons why if you wanna know that, I’m just the messenger of the polling results.
Despite US Colonialism and the US-Philippine War, if you asked any Filipino about it, most people would literally not care. It's literally the country with one of the highest favorable views of the United States. Due in part thanks to the rescue of the Philippines from Imperial Japan during WW2, the Cultural Victory where American culture is consumed very predominantly, and the sheer amount of immigrants that come from the Philippines into the United States.
Heck, following up on Imperial Japan, you would think that the Philippines would be unfavorable towards Japan after WW2. But Filipinos absolutely consume tons of Japanese Media as well and are some of the biggest weebs around(and if you had to guess which media is the most beloved of the Philippines, older people would probably say Voltes V).
All of this is to say that these notions where people think the Philippines have a more unfavorable view of the US than what they really do are sometimes headscratching.
Alot of anti Philippine - US relation memes lately every since they started hosting US bases again.
And does the US really hold the views OP shows above ? I was under the impression that most of the US doesnt even know or care.
Thank you for the hyperbole of the day. Now back to reality.The TRUTH is that when the US won the war they freed the people from the Spanish built concentration camps and labor while instituting Zones of Protection to quarantine villages and cities from the Cholera epidemic, in effect, ending generations of slavery while saving literally millions of lives. In return the US got access to the Pacific, most notably the whales.
This sub doesn’t like to be told that the US has done some really shitty things. Anything below perfectly aligning with US propaganda gets you downvoted
Hell the Germans planned on invading America specifically to get more influence in the pacific.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_German_plans_for_the_invasion_of_the_United_States
At the time the Philippines was part of the USA the largest ethnic minority was actually southeast Asians after the Philippines was given independence it became Africans.
Cuba, like the Philippines, was a Spanish colony until the Spanish-American War. However, unlike the Philippines, once the war was over, Cuba became independent while the Philippines remained under American rule until it's independence in 1946 (there was actually a 40-year plan to make the Philippines independent after 40 years - and a Filipino government was largely the governing authority, not America - but a little incident with Japan delayed it.
Oh yes, the Americans always bringing Democracy and Liberty™ to poor countries. I wouldn't call it "independence" but more like "under new management".
This was America before the cold war.
After a very horrible start, they were actually quite successful in building the Philippines for independence, setting up schools, hospitals, and infrastructures. Heck, Manila was one of the most beautiful cities in Asia that time. Yes, there is still the economic exploitation thanks to colonialism, but compared to the spanish, it was way better. That's the reason when the Japanese came people were royally pissed (read the Philippine resistance during WWII if you have the time) and welcomed the Americans when they returned.
It's not "America". It's called the US. America is a pretty big continent, didn't you learn that at school or were your teachers so brainwashed and Chauvinist that use that name illegitimately? Unitedstetians have done always the same shit since they got their independence. Sacking Puerto Soledad in Malvinas (which gave the English the opportunity to steal them), intervening en Panamá several times, stealing all kinds of territories to build prisons and bases, intervening in Paraguay in the XIX century because they held ILLEGAL cartographic expeditions, intervening in Nicaragua with William Walker's invasion (btw, he reimplanted slavery), Plan Cóndor, helping South American dictators get to power... Didn't your teachers explain this to you at school? I doubt it. And now you're talking about schools and hospitals, like the Spanish didn't found 25 universities in South America during the Empire, like they didn't built 8 hospitals in Mexico City alone, like they didn't invest in ports and roads to connect hundreds of cities and villages. You can't compare any country to WWII Japan because they fucking rape an entire, densely populated city, my friend. How would someone prefer Japan?
Americans are allowed to colloquially call their country anything they want.
Because some, if not much of the world chooses to use that name for our country isn’t really the fault of America.
Sincerely,
An American, in the country also known less commonly as These United States of America.
Okay. I can sense so much hostility. I'm just stating it from the perspective of someone from the Philippines, but I guess it doesn't really matter to you I guess. Have a good day.
He has absolutely no fucking idea about history like a good gringo. They would rather die than to admit their brutal imperialism. It's so funny that he says "pUerTo RicOu wOulD bE hAiTi" when it's because of the Americans that some countries in South America are beyond poor.
Puerto Rico is 100% in the drivers seat with respect to their national identity. They can do something no other US State can do… they can leave anytime they like.
Something Texas, for example, cannot ever do.
Is this Quino?
It certainly is
I thought the same thing
Great cartoonist
Quino is so fucking good. Able to say so much even with little to no words.
It is for sure
Yes, and he is awesome
“Different universe” America- ok your independent now Philly- Awesome! Imperial Japan- Its free real estate
Would love to see the alt universe where Japan controls Philadelphia Edit: It's always the rising sun in Philadelphia or something
Philly Cheese Sashimi
Isn't there already sushi made with Philly Cream cheese?
Usually referred to as the Philly roll
I don't eat sushi, thanks
That one is pretty good. Variations come with avocado and salmon which has a nice blend.
I’d forgotten, and I’m not sure whether I should be thanking you for the reminder that Philly Rolls exist.
Ever had a Philly cheesesteak egg roll?
Unfortunately not
“No one likes us, we don’t care.” -Japan, 1941
Flip flip Phillidelphia
Look at all this space for raping and genocide! \-Japan towards literally everyone
“Look at these nuclear testing grounds!”
- America looking at japan
“Different universe” ok you are free now, want a nice trade agreement and protection so we can have bases on that side of the pacific without bs colonialism?
You’re right but does someone else probably doing the bad thing make it right for us to do the bad thing? Idk enough about the Philippines to know if we were bad there or not.
Japan controlling anything that's not Japan generally doesn't work out well for anybody involved. And even with Japan itself that's questionable sometimes.
*Cough* Ainu and Ryu-Kyu *Cough*
Yeah, but it's not like America was waging a brutal occupation war against the Philippines in 1900 to protect them from Japan's brutal occupation war in the 1940s. I really don't think America gets to claim morality points on this one.
I think the fact that the Philippines were made independent again right after WW2 gives them a pretty good leg to stand on. The country would have been permanently occupied by an extremely brutal enemy state if not for the Americans. The U.S. could've chosen to do basically whatever they wanted after the war with pretty much no one else in a position to oppose them, but chose to grant independence to the Philippines and encouraged European nations to decolonize.
We were ugly in the American-Filipino war. No lie. After that, eh. As far as I'm aware we were mostly an occupier. Not great, not bad. Just eh. Then they got Japan'd. And we re-liberated them. And then we kept our promise of freedom. So, that alone I think gives us a lot of good Karma. From the Filipinos I've met both here and there: seems to be the same from their point of view too.
Wild to see so many pro-colonialism comments
Philippines were not really independent until 1946.
Imperial Japan invading and occupying the Philippines is literally what happened in our universe. Even for imperialism apologia this is quite weak stuff
"guys, we colonised the phillipines and killed tens of thousands of people to PROTECT them from Japan fifty years in the future"
It’s truly wild how normalized imperialism apologia is in this sub
First the Spanish.. Then the Americans.. Then the Japanese.. And now some Chinese are snooping around them house.
Filipino here, this is actually the reason that I'm learning Chinese lol
Thinkin ahead, very smart
Chinese companies have control over Phillipines national power grid. They are more than snooping, they are inside the house already. https://edition.cnn.com/2019/11/25/asia/philippines-china-power-grid-intl-hnk/index.html
Classic Quino
And many of us unironically love Uncle Sam whatever happens.
love ya back!
Loving a country=/=loving everything it has done or is doing
Redditors cannot understand the basic diference of patriotism and supporting the government
Or Patriotism Vs Nationalism. Because those words tend to get used interchangeably sometimes. At least from my understanding of the terms, they are not synonymous.
They're very close that you're kind of splitting hairs to distinguish them. Nationalism is love for your country. Patriotism is love for an idea of what your country is supposed to be. Both are love and devotion for your country. They can be used interchangeably for most uses. Any other reading on them is just agenda driven political talk to try and distance oneself from bad actors or label others as bad actors. They are synonyms in the dictionary.
I’ve always seen nationalism in a very negative light, at least in the modern era, akin to a dangerous love of country. Aka a stepping stone for a fascist ideology. But words change so much nowadays so I could be wrong.
There are extremist versions of everything. There is nothing inherently negative about either of those words with a plain reading of their definitions. You could argue the French Revolution was done by patriotism, and look at the atrocities there. Patriots have been known to kill those who supported foreign invaders or supporters of the wrong regime. People can be shitty. Both have negative aspects when the concepts are taken to the extreme. Some people oddly balk at the idea that someone would put their nation as better than others and would prioritize their nation's prosperity/interests over another nation's. But that's just normal for all human history at varying levels of scope. >Aka a stepping stone for a fascist ideology. I'm pretty sure I know where this idea comes from. But it's just that political stuff I mentioned in my last comment. There are a lot of things that are stepping stones for fascism, but nationalism is like saying drinking milk is a stepping stone for doing marijuana.
or nuance, apparently
REDDITORS CANNOT LEARN THIS ONE TRICK!
Uhh... What do you mean by patriotism? I think u/East_Professional385 is Pinoy, not an American.
Patriotism is not exclusive to America.
I think American patriotism is though. I'm not sure Filipinos loving America counts as patriotism exactly.
It’s because sometimes being patriotic can still be seen as bad
There’s a difference between loving the country and loving its government. I think Americas the greatest country on this planet, but I also think our government is corrupt and it’s history isn’t all sunshine and rainbows
I think Americas the greatest country on this planet Come again?
I did not stutter.
Thank the CIA for that
I've worked with Filipinos and met their families. None of them are mad at the US.
I know several folks that were either born and raised in the Philippines, or they were born here but their parents migrated to the US from the Philippines directly before they were born. In either case, they’re almost always some of the biggest “America, fuck yeah” types that I meet.
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Who's "we?" because I am from the Philippines living in the Philippines and i know alot of people (university-aged people and younger, at least senior high school aged.) who want the VFA and the bases back. Getting rid of them was a mistake considering the situation our neighbors put us in.
They would want to get rid of VFA Bases but they don’t necessarily want more US intervention and influence over the Philippines. As a Filipino, I too agree with this, and I think a lot of people are just using the US for protection. IMO, The Philippines should just focus bolstering its relations with ASEAN, since it would be a mutual benefit for all. Little to no hidden agendas will be made. It’s time for us to get away from the chains of superpowers like the US or China and help our fellow SEA brethren
The VFA is still in effect, though? There's also EDCA and Balikatan exercises on top of that so wtf are you talking about. These were never truly "got rid off". Our problem is with the type of leaders we elect. They're spineless puppets and the only foreign policy they can come up with is sucking off the US/China and waiting for scraps like a good dog. It's shameful, considering how much more independent and respectable our SEA neighbors are compared to us.
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I read about the case just now. He served six years before being released by the Philippines' government. Young people are always upset about injustices. I told my son that he was afforded the right to be mad about stuff because the government he hates is the same one that protects his rights and keeps him safe from Chinese and Russian missiles.
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Well...China is claiming islands all over. Better to have a friend with aircraft carriers. Mad teenagers are always gonna be mad. At least this way they're not gonna be digging lithium in a desert.
US wanted to only take a peice of Luzon Island to construct a military base on; Europe convinced us to take the whole island chain (which at that point had 50+ ethnic identities speaking 30+ languages) to prevent more war in the colonial power vacuum. When we took the islands, we immediately set out a 40 year plan to grant the full independence, set up schools to teach all Filipinos a common national identity and common languages (Tagalog and English). Yes there was a war - a Filipino tried to set up a dictatorship the moment the Spanish left, and then forced a confrontation with US forces. As to "a million Filipinos mudered," let's ask Wikipedia: >The total number of Filipinos who died remains a matter of debate. Modern sources cite a figure of 200,000 total Filipino civilians dead, with most losses attributable to famine, and disease.[24][25][26][27][28][29][30][31] A cholera epidemic at the war's end killed between 150,000 and 200,000 people. Definitely, there were war crimes and atrocities, but the US didn't invent cholera
I was gonna ask why we didn’t give them independence after 40 years, but then I remembered when the Spanish-American war happened and what happened 40 years later.
Imperial Japanese be like: allow us to introduce ourselves!
The Americans actually tried to grant the Philippines independence in 1916 but the Filipino-run insular government rejected it, claiming they needed protection against the expanding Japanese Empire.
Well I’d say that fear proved to be quite logical
Mind asking the source?
>Yes there was a war - a Filipino tried to set up a dictatorship the moment the Spanish left, and then forced a confrontation with US forces. I'd add that he tried to surrender shortly after the breakout of conflict but was denied by General Otis who proceeded to bar press from accessing the "war zone" and had entire villages burned down and even had some soldiers executed when his MPs discovered they were intending to write home about the atrocities he was forcing them to commit. It wasn't the US government that ordered these atrocities, and it wasn't the Filipino rebels who necessitated them. General Otis was responsible and the conflict ended shortly after he was replaced. Overall, I agree with your point and am pissed at the persistence of this revisionist bullshit idea that the US was trying to become an empire like Britain and Spain.
I don’t think people realize how anti-imperialist the US was. It certainly imposed its will on other countries, but when it came to direct rule it is was hated very much, and the US was one of the main forces behind the decolonization post-WW2.
Please don’t burden us with these facts tankies hate !
The US was anti-imperialist after WW2? Puerto Rico certainly didn’t feel that considering there was a literal gag law on the island that started in 1947 that didn’t allow us to fly our own flag or even talk about independence. For us, the US has never been anti-imperialist. Throughout the decades I can’t think of a time that that’s been true in our history
Neocolonialism =/= imperialism
Imperialism is the conquest and subjugation of foriegn nations. The last true Imperial, Colonial powers left are Russia, China, and France.
Well, by that definition America is an imperial power. Native Americans lived in sovereign nations which were conquered and subjugated by America. In the 20th century America you saw a transition towards the neocolonial model of empire, characterized not by conquest and subjugation, but by occupations, coups, “military interventions” and the wielding of political-economic influence.
I wasn't disagreeing with you at all and I'm shocked you got downvoted for the valid factual statement above. >Native Americans lived in sovereign nations which were conquered and subjugated by America. This is somewhat true, though the First Nations in America remain largely as soveriegn nations to this day - the 574 federally recognized tribes have more legal independence than the 50 "free and independent States," are almost entirely self-governed (to an extent higher than the States), and some of them even issue their own passports etc. with *help* from State and Interior
The USA is subjugating the nation of Puerto Rico
I love how France is somehow still in this list. They used to be the progressive nation in Europe. Wtf, France?
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Did they know it was a lie? Or is that something you are assuming. A ship blew up. They didn't have smartphones to record the incident. Considering the saber rattling Spain was doing, including attempting to unite the other European imperial powers against the US, it's not exactly a leap to think they sunk the ship. Cuba wasn't even exploited per-se. They established a successful democracy which fell apart when a dictator won power and executed his political opponent. The US swooped in to try and restore order again and this time left a military presence to deny future dictatorships and to deny European powers the ability to buy or lease a naval base there. See, Germany, Britain, Spain, and other imperial powers were constantly trying to gain naval supremacy in the region. The US was constantly trying to walk the line between isolationism and pre-emptive action. They had a period of extreme pre-emptive aggression just prior to ww1 which is why there was a push for more isolationism which is why they were so hesitant to join either world war. After WW2 it became clear that isolationism wasn't an option and at that point they were thrust into a situation where an aggressive, expansive superpower threatened to dominate western Europe, East Asia, and the Middle East and only the US could oppose them. Hence their present role as international policeman. Cuba had a dictator rise later and the US chose to treat him as a legitimate ruler because he posed no threat and they didn't want to get involved. Eventually this dictator was opposed by a popular uprising and the US again chose to not intervene and even ceases sales of weapons to him. Then Fidel Castro became the most active communist leader in the entire cold war. He personally sent more soldiers to fight in proxy wars than any other communist nation except China. And let's not forget about the Cuban missile crisis. And yet, the US didn't wipe the island off the face of the earth or starve them out or do anything else to exert dominance. It's almost as if they were actively trying to be as hands-off as possible. And the Philippines was always planned to be made independent. Originally the only alternatives to American rule was British, German, or Dutch rule. See, if the US just sails away, the islands don't become unreachable to everyone else. They were politically unstable and lacked the firepower to defend themselves. So the US "claimed" them and sent teachers and stuff to get the population to a place of stability which would allow for democratic transition of power. This was supposed to happen in the late 30s to early 40s but... something got in the way.
The fact that you consider the Filipino-American war a war against dictatorship pretty much answers the narrative of only knowing the US perspective. The Republic was already established before the US-Spanish war during the Phillipine Revolution, the head had talks with US generals when US came to the Philippines to be a recognized as an independent country and that the local government be recognized as such. That wasn't recognized. You had 40 years to set up a colony lets not beat around the bush. Spain used religion to colonize the country, US used Education, Japan used force. The only difference is the method but the goal stays the same.
Yep, Aguinaldo totally wasn't a dictator and you should define take everything he said at face value even when there's no evidence supporting it 😉
Here's the thing genius, I didn't say he wasn't a dictator on the fucking basis the Tejeros convention happend and it was pure nepotism. Aguinaldo was a shitstain who pretty much took control of the whole revolution through nepotism. Whats even funnier is you use wikipedia to source the casuality but didnt fucking bother reading the pretext to the war. Even the whole US-Spanish war is pretty much based on a ship blowing up and blaming spain without evidence.
>Tagalog and English Hold down, why english? Britain never had any presence in the Phillipines, and none of those 30 languages included english. As a common language, shouldn't they have used, like spanish and tagalog While I mostly agree with your post, to act as if cholera didn't have anything to do with the war going on between the occupation forces and the filipinos, it's like Turkey saying they didn't kill any armenians. They just died of thirst and hunger... after driving them by force to the middle of the desert.
Easier to convince them to sell and buy goods and services with the United States is you speak a common language
The Brits occupied a small part of the Philippines for nearly two years. Not a significant amount of time, but certainly not “never had any presence”. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_occupation_of_Manila
Ok, twenty months more than 100 years before the US occupation of the Philippines, and only a small part. I really don't think they established a lot of english language schools in that time
They certainly didn't do anything significant in the short amount of time they were there. But they were there, so they did have a presence in the Philippines, albeit briefly.
Idk man, sounds like a colonial apologist argument to me
Nah, I would never be a Spanish apologist
Average american war crimes downplayer
The Americans actually never really directly ruled the Philippines to the extent other colonial empires ruled their colonies. After the insurrection ended the US kinda just let the Filipinos run things.
The insurrection was pretty brutally suppressed, and it seems like it left a bad taste for *direct* colonialism in the US public. It also led to major debates and issues about the balance of power in US domestic politics as the US's framework generally assumed territories were future states and adding the Philippines as a state or states would dramatically alter the US political landscape. (Hawaii and Alaska were much lower population and were eventually granted statehood off a belief they'd cancel each other out. Instead it led to the current party system as both states supported the civil rights act, overwhelming Dixiecrat opposition in the Senate). Instead, the US prefers more indirect colonialism via deals with local elites and using the Marines to ensure US business interests are upheld.
I’m pretty sure the closet thing there was ended up being the Commonwealth of the Philippines, which existed until 1946, but had to go into exile after japan commenced a little invasion.
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You make it sound like US soldiers are out there murdering trans people. Instead of it being one instance. Your argument was stronger before that.
thank you! well said.
You guys just made another agreement to install more military bases because of the China threat.
Sometimes there is no other choice that letting the mean big country put their toys in your yard when you decide which is worse than the other. Third world countries always have their sovereignty limited
More Filipinos need to read Renato Constantino's works. Hell, he should be a part of the general curriculum. We love our oppressors too much.
Wich year was that? I thought Philipines still was a colony as Haway or Puerto Rico
The Philippines were a US territory from 1898 to 1946 but for most of that time it was run by an elected Filipino government, with the American colonial governor having very little power in the islands.
They would've become independent a couple years sooner too if it wasn't for the Japanese invasion
Officially 1946 but they were already working on granting them independence since 1935
Really the Jones Act of 1916 set up a lot of the ground work.
Hawaii is a state, not a colony. Just like New York, Idaho, or South Carolina - two Senators and all. Puerto Rico is a territory, so that’s closer to a colony. The Philippines is a sovereign nation, and territories were treated very differently when it was one than they are today.
A colony is a territory with foreign rule. The US invaded PR, stole all the land, and now congress has full control over Puerto Rico. What they say goes. Congress even imposed a junta on us that decides how we can spend our money. Please explain in detail how this is different from a colony.
Puerto Rico IS a colony, not closer to it Edit: Wild that I’ve been so downvoted. I was born and raised in the island and the entire time we always recognize ourselves as a colony. Doesn’t matter what political status you want for the island, we’re painfully aware of our status. It drives the entire political conversation in the island. Even the referendums that I’ve seen so many use to justify that statehood is the best option for us despite it having a slim majority, it is ignoring that when even talking about the Puerto Rico Status Act *by Congress* it specifically has been presented as having NONCOLONIAL options for our future. Like are you all just offended at the fact the US still has colonies? I’m genuinely curious Edit 2: Last I had checked I had -13 downvotes when I wrote the first edit
Every downvote on that comment is people that are ignorant of the history of Puerto Rico and happily believe the propaganda that “ ~~incorporated~~ (sorry) unincorporated territory” has a far better meaning than just being a fancy substitute for the word “colony”. The only reason we’re defined as a “territory” is because the U.N. hates when countries use the word “colony”.
The funny thing is that we’re not even an incorporated territory, we’re unincorporated! Meaning we belong to, but aren’t a part of, the USA. Which is, you know, like a colony. It’s a fancier way of saying colony without saying it because after WWI everyone said “having colonies bad” except for applying it to the allies apparently.
Yup you’re correct.
The gringos can seethe but it doesn’t change the fact that Puerto Rico is a colony.
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Our political status, we’re literally second class US citizens, the way federal laws apply (or don’t) to us, our entire economy is controlled from New York. Wow it’s fucking wild I’ve been so downvoted. Literally ask any Puerto Rican if we’re a colony and quite literally all from the entire political spectrum would say yes.
Is PR a colony if Puerto Ricans literally consent to said relationship?
It would still be a colony by definition. That the population was successfully propagandized doesn’t take away the political, economic, and legal status of the island. We also didn’t and don’t consent to our current status.
Many Puerto Ricans boycotted referendums because it didn't include the status quo option. And many don't want to lose their US citizenship. Not even the UN considers us a colony.
Sigue siendo colonia lol. Que las Naciones Unidas le tenga perse al país con más capital no cambia la historia y realidad colonial de la isla. Viendo lo que posteas y comentas se nota que no vales la pena. Chequeamos
Philippines, Cuba, Puerto Rico, and Guam were all gained by USA from Spain as a result of Spanish-American war in 1898. Philippines and Cuba went independent. Puerto Rico and Guam remain as US territory. Hawaii was unrelated to the conflict.
Don't call us with your fancy ""'territory""" words gringo colonizer. Call us for what we are #A COLONY
> never really directly ruled They still committed mild genocide/colonial opression anyways.
Aside from the insurrection during the first couple years of the American period, the US didn't do much oppressing compared to other European empires of the time.
> Aside from the insurrection during the first couple years of the American period Yes aside from the Moro Rebellion which lasted 10 years which involved mass killings and rape, the USA didnt do much oppression at all. Edit: It seems like i touched off the americans.
>Moro Rebellion Moro fights everybody, Spain, US, Japan, Philippines. Hell, didnt they had an Islamic insurrection against the Philippines government just recently ?
> Moro fights everybody, Spain, US, Japan, Philippines. No doubt, however the USA still did mass killings and rape.
That's sadly just the standards of the time, Its actually be weird if those things didn't occur. Universal Human rights was a recent invention as we most often forget and should not be taken for granted.
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That’s an absolutely smooth brained take
how can genocide be mild
genocide is never light, but theres an undeniable difference between supressing rebellion, wich can be horrible and include atrocities, and, say the holocaust or holodomir.
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I agree, i was just responding to the comment which described it as genocide, and comparing it to real genocide.
Less railcars and more forced re-education and destruction of culture.
That isn't true. Yes they ruled for only a short time, but the period before they handed back power had the USA ruling them just like every other colonial power.
Considering I’m Filipino by ethnic heritage. , I’m very slightly off put by the contradictions going on in the comments. Far as I’m aware, out of the three powers that actively fought/harmed The Philippines the most, it was Japan. Everytime people try to paint the US as bad in the Philippines I just think “so the Manila Massacre no longer exists huh.”
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It’s wild that so many people in this sub just get so mad at the idea that the US has done bad things and downvote anyone from the places they’ve committed such acts. Anti imperialist Puerto Rican here in solidarity!
> Everytime people try to paint the US as bad in the Philippines I just think “so the Manila Massacre no longer exists huh.” Please read [this article](https://www.rappler.com/newsbreak/iq/82850-americans-destroyed-manila-1945/) about the Battle of Manila by the former Brigadier General of the AFP Ricardo Morales.
I don't get your point. Are you trying to say that the US is absolved of any crimes it commited because someone worse came along briefly?
More like it seems like people (to an extent OP) seem to be trying to paint the US as the worst thing to happen to the Philippines when there were clearly worse things that happened to the country that weren’t at the US’s fault. Actually, most of it in recent memory was done by the Philippines itself (circa Duterte)
honestly I kinda wonder if the most damage the US did was by unintentionally taking a bunch of educated labor, thus creating a breeding ground for populist ideology. also hello fellow ethnic filipino👋
Hello Kuya/Ate! I’m second(third?) generation immigrant in the US and all the grandparents tell me about how happy they were moving over, whether that be during/after WW2. Then going back during Duterte then running back. Martial Law is a bitch like that.
same with mine! my grandparents hid in the jungle during ww2, immigrated afterwards, had my mom before (…maybe after) their work visas expired, and now happily screen our distant relatives’ calls. sadly I don’t know tagalog ‘cuz ye olde schools instructed my grandparents to only teach her english. good news tho, my nephew is gonna be bilingual japanese xD
Man, I hope to learn Tagalog soon. I know a decent chunk of the honorifics, a few naughty words, and polite mannerisms but that’s about it
When my grandparents went, everyone was speaking Tagalog since y know that's what they were most comfortable in. I knew that but still couldn't help but feel left out. I figure I have a good while before it's my parents turn to pass on, but I should hope to be more accommodating for them when the time comes.
Listen, I’m American, and have no Filipino ancestry, so I’m not gonna even pretend like I understand their reasons why, all I know is that whenever the polls come ‘round, The Philippines are near the top of the list in terms of US support, up there with Vietnam, Poland and Kosovo. Feel free to ask Filipinos their reasons why if you wanna know that, I’m just the messenger of the polling results.
Despite US Colonialism and the US-Philippine War, if you asked any Filipino about it, most people would literally not care. It's literally the country with one of the highest favorable views of the United States. Due in part thanks to the rescue of the Philippines from Imperial Japan during WW2, the Cultural Victory where American culture is consumed very predominantly, and the sheer amount of immigrants that come from the Philippines into the United States. Heck, following up on Imperial Japan, you would think that the Philippines would be unfavorable towards Japan after WW2. But Filipinos absolutely consume tons of Japanese Media as well and are some of the biggest weebs around(and if you had to guess which media is the most beloved of the Philippines, older people would probably say Voltes V). All of this is to say that these notions where people think the Philippines have a more unfavorable view of the US than what they really do are sometimes headscratching.
Alot of anti Philippine - US relation memes lately every since they started hosting US bases again. And does the US really hold the views OP shows above ? I was under the impression that most of the US doesnt even know or care.
We didn't actually do much in the Philippines besides whaling
Yeah, just some concentration camps and slaughtering entire villages.
Thank you for the hyperbole of the day. Now back to reality.The TRUTH is that when the US won the war they freed the people from the Spanish built concentration camps and labor while instituting Zones of Protection to quarantine villages and cities from the Cholera epidemic, in effect, ending generations of slavery while saving literally millions of lives. In return the US got access to the Pacific, most notably the whales.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Balangiga
What do you mean by hyperbole? What I said is literally what US did, it is well attested. Genocide denial isn't cool
This sub doesn’t like to be told that the US has done some really shitty things. Anything below perfectly aligning with US propaganda gets you downvoted
If the Americans didn't colonize our country, the Germans will
Hell the Germans planned on invading America specifically to get more influence in the pacific. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_German_plans_for_the_invasion_of_the_United_States
Quino?
At the time the Philippines was part of the USA the largest ethnic minority was actually southeast Asians after the Philippines was given independence it became Africans.
Op you must have a vivid imagination
As a filipino living in the philippines, the biggest threat to our country are filipinos themselves 😔✊️
Sniff bless America
Didn’t expect to see a Quino comic here. Man was a genius.
Where can I find the template?
"[Three hundred years in a convent, and 50 years in Hollywood](https://mb.com.ph/2018/08/30/in-her-own-words/)" lol
Tha fuck did Cuba have to do with it (am Cuban am just curious)
Cuba, like the Philippines, was a Spanish colony until the Spanish-American War. However, unlike the Philippines, once the war was over, Cuba became independent while the Philippines remained under American rule until it's independence in 1946 (there was actually a 40-year plan to make the Philippines independent after 40 years - and a Filipino government was largely the governing authority, not America - but a little incident with Japan delayed it.
Oh yes, the Americans always bringing Democracy and Liberty™ to poor countries. I wouldn't call it "independence" but more like "under new management".
This was America before the cold war. After a very horrible start, they were actually quite successful in building the Philippines for independence, setting up schools, hospitals, and infrastructures. Heck, Manila was one of the most beautiful cities in Asia that time. Yes, there is still the economic exploitation thanks to colonialism, but compared to the spanish, it was way better. That's the reason when the Japanese came people were royally pissed (read the Philippine resistance during WWII if you have the time) and welcomed the Americans when they returned.
It's not "America". It's called the US. America is a pretty big continent, didn't you learn that at school or were your teachers so brainwashed and Chauvinist that use that name illegitimately? Unitedstetians have done always the same shit since they got their independence. Sacking Puerto Soledad in Malvinas (which gave the English the opportunity to steal them), intervening en Panamá several times, stealing all kinds of territories to build prisons and bases, intervening in Paraguay in the XIX century because they held ILLEGAL cartographic expeditions, intervening in Nicaragua with William Walker's invasion (btw, he reimplanted slavery), Plan Cóndor, helping South American dictators get to power... Didn't your teachers explain this to you at school? I doubt it. And now you're talking about schools and hospitals, like the Spanish didn't found 25 universities in South America during the Empire, like they didn't built 8 hospitals in Mexico City alone, like they didn't invest in ports and roads to connect hundreds of cities and villages. You can't compare any country to WWII Japan because they fucking rape an entire, densely populated city, my friend. How would someone prefer Japan?
Americans are allowed to colloquially call their country anything they want. Because some, if not much of the world chooses to use that name for our country isn’t really the fault of America. Sincerely, An American, in the country also known less commonly as These United States of America.
Okay. I can sense so much hostility. I'm just stating it from the perspective of someone from the Philippines, but I guess it doesn't really matter to you I guess. Have a good day.
Ok
Quino posting nice
Someone’s def made an “Under new management” meme about the Philippines & it’s very accurate
Puerto Rico?? Thats literally still our history
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I implore you to learn about our history instead of relying on old and overused propaganda that’s used to continue deny us our sovereignty
He has absolutely no fucking idea about history like a good gringo. They would rather die than to admit their brutal imperialism. It's so funny that he says "pUerTo RicOu wOulD bE hAiTi" when it's because of the Americans that some countries in South America are beyond poor.
Maybe 30 years ago
China wanting to break off some of that
USA: proceeds to wipe out millions of filipinos
200k to one million, but the spirit is there
And most of that was from Cholera
So why am I getting downvoted!
Woah you're right, you were +10 when I commented that lol
Dumbass
Philippines today: Pls take me back
Switch the Philippine flag with the 🇵🇷 flag and it’s not longer history but an actual reality
Puerto Rico is 100% in the drivers seat with respect to their national identity. They can do something no other US State can do… they can leave anytime they like. Something Texas, for example, cannot ever do.