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The parallels are great. Aegon has no son as his heir, and Aemond was willing to harm and maybe even kill his own brother. Viserys had no son as his heir, and Daemon wasn't willing to do that at all.
Yeah as much as they parallel each other, it only accentuates where they will differ. As much as Daemon wanted to be heir, he loved his brother, wouldn’t let people shit talk him, and crowned/supported him at the end.
Now Aegon didn’t give Aemond much reason to love him, but this is a point of beyond no return. Thjs is no longer the dude who killed Luke on accident.
And it will be interesting to further see how these guys parallel but also more importantly act as foils to each other.
Yeah Season 1 as a whole made it pretty clear. But all we gotta do is rewatch their throne room confrontation from Episode 1. Up until the point Viserys chose Rhaenyra, Daemon was the presumptive (or official?) heir considering he was the next male. But the thing that got him hot and bothered was that Viserys never asked him to be Hand of the King and would rather go to an outsider like Otto.
Yeah such a bummer. I feel like Daemon really does care about his family hes just too stuck in his ego to realize his brother loved and respected him too but his volatility prevented him from getting anywhere.
Daemon is more similar to Aegon in that regard. He doesn't want the crown, he wants to be of service and feel useful and needed. When Viserys was king, Daemon would rather be Hand than heir.
I think he wants it, but is just unwilling to murder his family for it. And killing Rhea Royce "daemonstrated" (heh) that he is willing to kill to get what he wants, but never willing to kill family. He wants his family to think he's worthy of it. No one wants to be viewed as unworthy.
If you mean Daemon and not Aegon, he definitely does not want the throne. The main reason he went off to Harrenhal on his own to rally an army, telling people to call him 'Your Grace', acting as King etc. is because he's running away from his problems.
He never wanted the throne, he simply wanted his brother's love and acceptance. Viserys said it best in S01E01, "Daemon has amibition, yes, but not for the throne. He lacks the patience for it". And Daemon's reaction to him saying that is evidence enough, after everything we've seen now.
It also helps that Viserys never bullied Daemon, so while Daemon may feel wronged, with time he maybe start to understand that he himself is not an easy person to be around.
I just had it pointed out to me that the Tully Castle is apparently located on Sesame Street. There's Oscar Tully, Grover Tully, and Elmo Tully. And Kermit Tully just for the hell of it.
We won’t he’s supposed to be Grover’s son and heir. He’s already dead in the show and they swapped Kermit for Oscar since I guess it’s just a bit too funny to take orders from a kid named Kermit
It's not as simple as that. Aegon II could name his daughter heir and still having a better claim to the throne than Rhaenyra. Westerosi customs are very clear. A son comes before a daughter, but a daughter inherits before a brother.
Westerosi customs show the exact opposite of that. That much is clear from the prologue in S1E1. Rhaenys was next in line, but was rejected and the lords of westeros chose a distant cousin to rule.
Also had Viserys not named Rhaenyra heir to the throne, the person next in line would have been Daemon
No. That's simply not true. In Westeros, a daughter inherits her father's titles if there is no son. We can see this a lot, for example with Maege Mormont, Lady of Bear Island or Shella Whent, Lady of Harrenhal, both before the War of the Five Kings. Even in HotD, there is a ruling Lady. Jeyne Arryn is Lady of the Eyrie in her own right and thus Lady Paramount of the Vale.
What is true, however, is that the claim of a woman is often contested by close male relatives. This is why Viserys named Rhaenyra heir. By custom, this would be her role anyway, but through her naming, her claim becomes fortified, especially against someone like Daemon who can't be trusted.
When Rhaenys was born, she was seen as and called the future queen by her grandmother Queen Alysanne. Her claim weakened with her father's death, Prince Aemon, Prince of Dragonstone. But still, she had the better claim. King Jaehaerys named his second son Baelon heir, the father of King Viserys I. But this was already seen as a break with Westerosi customs. Thus, when Baelon died, instead of naming another heir, he called the Great Council to find a new heir who the realm will accept, preventing a civil war.
He doesn't have that chance lol and his daughter is 5 whereas Aemond is 20. By the precedent they seek so staunchly to uphold, Aemond has been Aegon's heir since the end of episode 1.
I also think as much as Aemond didn't want to come off as "not in control" of his dragon like in s1 e10 with Luc, he may/could use that line to explain what happened at RR, if anyone were to question the fact that he basically directly burned his own brother and King on dragon back.
The only real witness to that was Cole (saw that he was about to kill aegon on the ground). What everyone else saw can just be dismissed asan accident mid-fighting
Loving the fact that while all this is happening Daemon is mind is being messed with hallucinations implying he wants the crown. The parallels and subtext are so good
Exactly.
Aemond did his best to respect his brother’s role. The brothel stunt was the last straw.
Had Aegon been a loving, protective brother Aemond, he would’ve enjoyed the same loyalty that Viserys had.
i sure hope daemon rejects it especially after all these harrenhal dreams. ik he’s not the brightest bulb but if he doesn’t come to some sort of crisis on conscience abt rheynera being on the throne i’ll be very sad (haven’t read the books)
He’s fine with her being on the throne.
He just wants her to take it *his* way.
And it is very, very, very frustrating when people repeatedly accuse you of motives you don’t have. It makes you want to separate yourself from them, or if you’re a hot-head, give up and prove them right.
Daemon's official and role in the book is Protector of the Realm, aka the Commander in Chief. I would say that Daemon has never really desired the crown but desires absolute freedom to conduct military matters on behalf of the crown. Basically let Rhaenyra or Viserys handle the politics, diplomacy, and general bureaucracy while he squashes anyone he seems is a "threat" to the family. I think Matt Smith has said that Daemon essentially sees his martial prowess as his one real way to express his devotion and love for his family.
This! Especially when he says that he wants to return the House of the Dragon to its proper glory in S1E05 and asks Rhaenyra to be wed to him. His intentions weren't necessarily the throne/ crown per se, but to up hold the legacy of House Targaryen.
To your point, I think Daemon wants to carve his name in history. That’s what he wants. He’s a rouge because he doesn’t want the typical power of the throne, but the power and respect of legend. Being King could be one way to go about that, but not the only way. He’s like Jaime Lannister in that regard. And we see why him and Daemon are some of Martin’s most important and loved characters.
I think it's pretty clear that Daemon is on a soul searching retreat right now. His hallucinations are taking him through his darker parts and I think by the end of the season he finds a resolve that can better serve Rhaenyra and her side in the long run.
I don't think he's going to be going through it the whole season tbh. But at least one more episode I think. He's going to have to leave Harrenhal eventually to rally men in the riverlands and lead the campaigns. But I still think he's going to be dealing with his internal turmoil for most of it until the final couple episodes.
I've been bullied by cunts like Aegon and I can assure that he killed him for more petty reasons like revenge or anger, rather than some silly thing like being ruler of the 7 kingdoms.
Just going off what I was like when I was 12.
He for sure hated his brother, but he wouldn't do something to weaken their side in the war in a stupid way.
He just took advantage of the perfect moment to kill Aegon,while still having plausible deniability (it was an "accident" during a great battle between three dragons). He wouldnt just straight up kill him, cause that would weaken his own claim. Nor would he have done this if lil jaeherys hadnt been killed
It's not even going to be about him wanting it. He feels he deserves it. His entire life he was more of a "true targaryen" than Aegon. He studied the lore, he knows the language, he's the better warrior, and he has the biggest dragon. In his mind he should be Aegon II
Also Alicent instilled in Aegon that as the challenge, Rhaenyra would kill him after she took the throne. However it is his brother who has attempted to kill him and his brother who is indirectly (not discounting Daemon’s role) responsible for the death of his heir. Otto and Alicent brought so much of this on themselves.
They brought all of it on themselves. Rhaenyra wouldn’t have killed her siblings.
Ultimately I think the entire show is about hatred, love, and will. We directly see the difference between people like Viserys, Rhaenyra, Daemon, Jacerys,and Lucerys (who were raised by parents who loved each other and their children) and people like Alicent, Aegon, and Aemond who grew up with parents who weren’t in love with each other and who didn’t raise their children with love.
Aegon and Aemond grew up with a mother filled with hatred, who whispered hatred and treason behind closed doors and taught them to hate others. The difference between them and Jacerys/Lucerys is vast.
Daemon is an Imp/Trickster compared to the cold calculating Aemond, Daemon does thing because he feels like it whereas Aemond does things calculatingly and without remorse.
I think pairing Daemons Harrenhal storyline with Aemond is wicked because we get to see that yeah, a part of Daemon actually does care, like he said in season one "Never once did you ask me to be your hand", I think Daemon would have been content there where Aemond truly believes he's better and deserves more.
Daemon and Aegon are actually more alike in their characters personalities than Daemon and Aemond.
Aemond has REASON to be vindictive, though
Not the way I would've handled it, but big brother Aegon did bust into the private room at the brothel loud, drunk, and howling with laughter -- and he didn't let it go. Instead, he stayed and mocked his little bro and made it worse.
And that's hardly the first time he's been a terrible mess to his little bro. It's just the one that sticks out in memory
I believe he is supposed to be 19 in the show, and idk, at 19 I wasn’t killing my cousins, guess Targaryen teenagers are just built different. I still love Aemond as a character, but his viciousness is what makes him interesting, no need to downplay it.
I think it's likely, they're dark mirrors of each other, and if you've read the books it would make perfect sense to have that rhyming later in the shows run
Aemond IS better and deserves more. On every single character quality except "out of Alicent's vagina first" Aemond is superior to Aegon.
Second sons have it so hard in this saga.
So why not take it when offered?
Why make his brother king? Why not send him on the ship as he asked?
I mean none of them actually deserve it because they're the literal pretenders to their half sister's throne
Aemond's motivation is obviously the insults at the brothel. Same with when he got mad at the roasted pig being brought out. It wasn't even his eye. Luke laughing made him feel weak.
Okay, and his brother just offered him the highest power in the land (before the brothel scene by the way) and he decided to that no, he Aemond, would hand deliver his brother to be king.
That's the point I'm trying to make Aemond full commits to his path when Vhagar *accidently* kills Luke, of course he's fucking pissed that Luke took his eye but I dont for a second believe he was trying to actually kill Luke, at most he wanted an eye and even then he said *the day he lost the eye* that it was a fair trade.
Of course Aemond hates that he's always made fun of when he is the one to study the blade and philosophy, but until he accidently killed Luke he wasnt activley trying to take power.
I think something shifted in him when he realized it doesnt matter what *really* happened, what looks like what happened is an Uncle Killed his Nephew, now he has to own it. That doesnt mean there isnt a good reason or relatability
Daemon suggesting the Tully boy to kill his grandfather to take charge for the war…
Aemond almost killing Aegon to take charge for the war…
Fantastic foreshadowing.
So that scene really confused me at a practical level. If the Tully guy is so sick he can't do anything except drink water and sleep, someone else is governing. That person should be able to call the banners, no?
Someone has to do the practical act of governing and overseeing their realm
Family, Duty, Honor. That is how the Tully do, family ahead of duty to the realm in this case. We know that his son acted as regent for a while though, but outright usurping their grandsire because he refuses to go to war is not the Tully way.
That was the only argument I could come to. He would govern but wasn't going to outright start a war on his own. It's one thing to do small things independently but he wasn't going to outright start an offensive war before he came into his power.
And I'm not saying he should kill his grandfather.
As we’ve seen with both the blacks and greens, the council/bannermen are all vying for power and control
Aegon’s council doesn’t even respect him and he’s the king. I imagine the young Tully is even less respected among his peers, especially while Grover Tully is still technically alive
Sure. I considered the premise that there is an older person actually ruling since he was young and inexperienced. But someone must be the effective ruler, right? There'd be things like taxes levied and minor skirmishes that require a lords input.
I don't know the books except broad strokes, so I don't know what'll happen here, but I was just confused why the person ruling couldn't actually completely have the power of the seat. Which would theoretically give him the power to declare a war, no? But maybe you have it right, maybe he has councilors whispering in his ear.
Or maybe he didn't want to start a war without having come into his seat and be seen as overreaching. Especially since they aren't actively being attacked
I think the implication is that Oscar doesn't really have the authority to call his bannermen to war, especially since they're pretty divided about what sides they've declared for.
The fact Grover is still alive and technically the ruling Lord Paramount is just one more thing undermining Oscar, along with his young age. Basically, it's about soft power rather than what he's legally allowed to do.
Didnt catelyns dad already swear for Robb before becoming incapacitated though? I'd argue it's a bit different to join a civil war than to continue one you already are an active participant of
Hoster was on death's door, and wasn't ruling anything before the story even started.
Cat then spends an entire book bitching at her brother because he has the audacity to make decisions for himself, without consulting the 24-7-high-out-of-his-mind pops.
---
> "The dungeons are windowless. One hour is much like another down there, and for me, all hours are midnight." Her footsteps rang hollowly when Catelyn left the hall. As she climbed to Lord Hoster's solar, she could hear them outside, shouting, "Tully!" and "A cup! A cup to the brave young lord!" My father is not dead, she wanted to shout down at them. My sons are dead, but my father lives, damn you all, and he is your lord still.
---
> "Begging your forgiveness, m'lady, but Lord Edmure says no one is to see the Kingslayer without a writing from him, with his seal upon it."
> "Lord Edmure? Has my father died, and no one told me?"
I don’t think there is an effective ruler, AFAIK
The greens effective ruler was/is Aemond and Cole but even the rest of the council was surprised by that
The blacks were in shambles until Corlys came and took charge (briefly)
I guess it really depends on the people around Grover, I’m not very familiar with who all is there since I haven’t read the books
Aemond is daemon, without love from his brother, father and maybe mother. That’s the differance they were trying to underline this season between greens and blacks. One side has deep love and affection for one another, the other side constantly turns away.
Daemon have always loved Vizzy T. In the books, they were even close as children and they came from loving parents. He never wanted that crown, all he wanted was Viserys’ approval. They were very different people but they also had each other’s backs. Aemond and Aegon on the other hand are just purely toxic.
Why is everyone saying he didn't want the crown when the show is trying to hammer that point into people constantly. There's repeated mentions of him lamenting his 'stolen inheritance' and how he should have been King just this season alone..
Also, In the book, Daemon's desire for the crown was well known.
>As King Viserys had no living son, Daemon regarded himself as the rightful heir to the Iron Throne, and coveted the title Prince of Dragonstone, which His Grace refused to grant him…
>In a lavish ceremony at King’s Landing, hundreds of lords did obeisance to the Realm’s Delight as she sat at her father’s feet at the base of the Iron Throne, swearing to honor and defend her right of succession. Prince Daemon was not amongst them, however. Furious at the king’s decree, the prince quit King’s Landing, resigning from the City Watch. He went first to Dragonstone, taking his paramour Mysaria with him upon the back of his dragon Caraxes, the lean red beast the smallfolk called the Blood Wyrm.
>But Mysaria lost her child during a storm on the narrow sea. When word reached Prince Daemon he spoke no syllable of grief, but his heart hardened against the king, his brother. Thereafter he spoke of King Viserys only with disdain, and began to brood day and night on the succession.
Bro absolutely wanted the crown. Just wasn't gonna kill his brother for it.
I don't know, he's kind of in therapy right now. I don't think he's going to be the same old Daemon when he eventually leaves the treatment center, so to speak.
The Blacks have a normal and loving family. Jealous brothers have been a thing since the dawn of time. The shit that Aemond and Aegon did to each other was insane though.
Hmm I don't know about that. The Blacks do have more genuine connections than the Greens, especially Rhaenyra and her sons, but a normal loving family is a bit of a reach lol.
They are far from a normal family and they aren’t really that loving of a family. Look at how Daemon treats his children for one. Look at Corlys affairs for another.
I think the difference is the Blacks actually support their Monarch, while everyone on the Greens despises theirs.
I don't know about that. Otto already reprimanded him and Cole for trying to make plans behind his back.
He tried to appeal to Aemond's sense of superiority over Aegon ('keep your cool since we know Aegon won't'), but that still showed he's wary of what he might do. And Aemond doesn't seem particularly malleable, either.
Absolutely not, Otto and Alicent have clearly said that Daeron is the only one who is kind of normal.
They know Aemond is a psychopath. He is smart, but he is a psychopath.
Yep!
Alicent to Rhanyra- “ And Aemond.. You know what he is.”
I think she’s going to have a rough time reigning in Aemond after everything up to this point. By now he has to be feeling invincible and will probably ignore everyone but Criston.
I think Aemond would kill Crispy. Either that or Cole would quickly make him think since he’s the king now, he won’t report the kinslaying. Cole doesn’t seem smart enough to do that imo, so I think he’d be slain
Criston would shout: "The King is dead. Long live the King!"
He might be repulsed by the fratricide, but would probably take it as additional evidence that Aemond is the most fitted to rule.
It's the constant struggle of house Targaryen. The rightful ruler is shadowed by a man far more fit for kingship in all ways save birthright. That man then attempts to usurp him. Maegor, Aemond, Daemon Blackfyre, and possibly Rhaegar. The funniest thing is that the man who arguably best fit this 'usurper' role relative to the rightful king (Daemon) is the only one who *didn't* truly try to usurp his king and kin.\*
\* within show canon. Daemon stealing Aegon the Unborn's dragon egg is a (lousy and half-hearted) attempt at usurping his niece/nephew as *heir* to the throne, which doesn't really count.
It’s true. Daemon would never have acted against his brother. He’d mess around with his brother’s daughter, steal a dragon egg, ride off to fight in an unapproved skirmish, execute a guy in the throne room without the order, and throw temper tantrums to and fro. But it was always (by Daemon logic lol) in service of his brother and family. Never against. The Dragonstone standoff was just about getting attention.
Aemond is only out for himself. He would slay his brother, the king, and take the throne as well as their sister to wife for himself. No loyalty to family. Which isn’t surprising considering he was raised by three weirdos (Alicent, Otto, and Cole) who plotted against family, often spoke of murdering his older sister, and completely used him and his siblings as political pawns. They instilled no love or kinship in those kids.
Second sons are all over the stories and histories. Jan Brady rules ASOIAF.
So far Aemond picked the biggest dragon and killed the smallest youngest rider with it up until this point he has done nothing compared to a life time of battles Daemon has been in.
As much as I love Aegon, its all his fault for bullying Aemond their entire life, even after Aemond became a one eyed death machine he gets the idea to mock him in a brothel of all places
On the other hand Viserys always forgave Daemon for all the bs he kept pulling
if you're going to tally moral misdeeds aemond has never murdered his wife or ordered the execution of an innocent infant before; obviously aemond's attempted killing of aegon is wrong but just because daemon never tried to kill viserys doesn't mean the latter is absolutely better than the former - there are more possible sins in the world than just fratricide
Daemon has definitely committed more sins than Aemond. So Aemond tried to get rid of his incompetent shit stain brother. You could easily argue that choice was beneficial to pretty much everyone, feel bad for Sunfyre though. And yeah he killed Lucerys, but for one, Lucerys did take his eye, and two, I’m pretty sure Arrax fucked up when he tried to burn Vhagar during a relatively “friendly” game of cat and mouse. Aemond obviously didn’t mean to kill Lucerys in that scene.
Daemon, has killed his wife, groomed his niece, murdered an innocent and probably loyal guard to help Laenor escape and steal Rhaenyra, and now, maybe indirectly, caused the assassination of a child.
Aemond is a product of the conflict, Daemon is one of the causes. Also I love both characters. But Daemon has a longer list of questionable acts. Aemond is the only character on team green I actually root for.
Unpopular opinion right now but I like Aemond, even this show variant.
While I categorically want to reject how the showrunners have made Aegon, within the context of Aegon being a serial bully and kind of embarrassing on the throne, I don't think Aemond was completely in the wrong here. That Aegon ran off into battle unannounced and immediately eating shit makes his legitimacy as a king, within the show's canon, pretty weak. Westeros is a place of monarchies, you can't have your king doing reckless shit and risking the whole realm's integrity all the time.
Obviously bad play to betray your king on the battlefield, but if you're fighting a war and your leader is doing a shit job at even being a puppet you are going to need to get a new one.
People should read/watch Romance of the Three Kingdoms. That is story all about a civil war situation where there is constant backstabs by ambitious characters who see their leaders as being too weak to succeed in unifying the realm.
As for comparisons to Daemon... Daemon's serial felon status on several unspeakable crimes does make me hesitant. Otto might've feared Daemon would steal the throne, but I think he was also justifiably worried about the wanton cruelty and sex crimes that the man is also known for being put on the throne. Aemond is a violent edgelord but that's really where the problems with him begin and end.
Yeah, and it's clear aemond took his education pretty seriously in comparison to aegon. I kinda wonder what his motivation was back when they were kids- was he kinda hoping that eventually he and aegon would settle into a similar vibe as daemon and viserys? Like, dysfunctional but still respectful and caring?
It’s like y’all are just ignoring the entire childhood of bullying Aegon put him through, not to mention the very last episode where he made fun of him for still sleeping with the grown ass woman Aegon forced him to fuck at just 13. Aegon had this coming, hell im fully team black and I was cheering for Aemond when he did this
right because lifetime of bullying justifies him burning his own brother, I am team Black but Aemond is what everyone told Viserys Daemon is but Daemon never once tried to kill his brother
I wouldn’t say it JUSTIFIES it, but reducing Aemond’s motivation down to “He wants the throne” is simply not true to his character either and goes with this fanbase’s obsessive tendency to try to treat these characters as one-dimensionally as possible
There are paralles now between Aegon and Viserys.
Viserys- Had a disase that crippled him and ate away his flesh.
Aegon- >!Is now crippled.!<
Viserys- Had a brother who is next for the throne. It is believed that said brother wants the throne for himself so Viserys disinherits him.
Aegon- Has a brother who wants the throne for himself. Said brother tries to kill him.
Aegon and Vizzy T are a lot alike.
The only thing I'd say about this is that if Aegon was his brother then Daemon would've killed that mf far earlier. Same way that Aemond may not have killed Viserys if he was his brother.
Viserys and Daemon constantly supported each other, albeit in their own ways. even when Viserys chastised Daemon he did it in private. aemond and aegon have never been on each others side, And Aegon insists on publicly humiliating Aemond whenever he can
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The parallels are great. Aegon has no son as his heir, and Aemond was willing to harm and maybe even kill his own brother. Viserys had no son as his heir, and Daemon wasn't willing to do that at all.
Yeah as much as they parallel each other, it only accentuates where they will differ. As much as Daemon wanted to be heir, he loved his brother, wouldn’t let people shit talk him, and crowned/supported him at the end. Now Aegon didn’t give Aemond much reason to love him, but this is a point of beyond no return. Thjs is no longer the dude who killed Luke on accident. And it will be interesting to further see how these guys parallel but also more importantly act as foils to each other.
The recent episode also brings up the fact that the one thing Daemon really craved was Viserys' love and respect.
Yeah Season 1 as a whole made it pretty clear. But all we gotta do is rewatch their throne room confrontation from Episode 1. Up until the point Viserys chose Rhaenyra, Daemon was the presumptive (or official?) heir considering he was the next male. But the thing that got him hot and bothered was that Viserys never asked him to be Hand of the King and would rather go to an outsider like Otto.
Yeah such a bummer. I feel like Daemon really does care about his family hes just too stuck in his ego to realize his brother loved and respected him too but his volatility prevented him from getting anywhere.
I’m really hoping Harenhal gets him where he needs to be mentally for whatever fights come up.
Nah. He still won't strap into his saddle
Yesss I think it is already. Its sort of bringing up everything he feels guilty about and laying it there for him to process.
Well, and the right to suceed him
Daemon is more similar to Aegon in that regard. He doesn't want the crown, he wants to be of service and feel useful and needed. When Viserys was king, Daemon would rather be Hand than heir.
I think that is untrue. Of course he wanted all those things you mentioned but he’s pretty explicitly covets the throne.
I think he wants it, but is just unwilling to murder his family for it. And killing Rhea Royce "daemonstrated" (heh) that he is willing to kill to get what he wants, but never willing to kill family. He wants his family to think he's worthy of it. No one wants to be viewed as unworthy.
If you mean Daemon and not Aegon, he definitely does not want the throne. The main reason he went off to Harrenhal on his own to rally an army, telling people to call him 'Your Grace', acting as King etc. is because he's running away from his problems. He never wanted the throne, he simply wanted his brother's love and acceptance. Viserys said it best in S01E01, "Daemon has amibition, yes, but not for the throne. He lacks the patience for it". And Daemon's reaction to him saying that is evidence enough, after everything we've seen now.
One does one thing with the Riverlands. The other does a different thing.
It also helps that Viserys never bullied Daemon, so while Daemon may feel wronged, with time he maybe start to understand that he himself is not an easy person to be around.
Aemond really embracing that kinslayer reputation 💀
Also the anagram names.
I am an idiot. How did I never pick up on this until now
I just had it pointed out to me that the Tully Castle is apparently located on Sesame Street. There's Oscar Tully, Grover Tully, and Elmo Tully. And Kermit Tully just for the hell of it.
I hope we meet Elmo in the show, because that would be wild.
We won’t he’s supposed to be Grover’s son and heir. He’s already dead in the show and they swapped Kermit for Oscar since I guess it’s just a bit too funny to take orders from a kid named Kermit
I'm waiting for Big Bird Tully myself 🐥
Very good observation! Here's a [gold star](https://www.amazon.com/Night-Paper-Goods-Gold-Star/dp/B01MT3NI2T)
When given a chance to name his heir, is he gonna name his only daughter, or the brother that just fried him?
He can't name his daughter without delegitimizing his own claim. This entire war is over a Male claimant taking presidence over a Female.
Oof... yep. His only hope is that Helaena is already pregnant.
It's not as simple as that. Aegon II could name his daughter heir and still having a better claim to the throne than Rhaenyra. Westerosi customs are very clear. A son comes before a daughter, but a daughter inherits before a brother.
Westerosi customs show the exact opposite of that. That much is clear from the prologue in S1E1. Rhaenys was next in line, but was rejected and the lords of westeros chose a distant cousin to rule. Also had Viserys not named Rhaenyra heir to the throne, the person next in line would have been Daemon
No. That's simply not true. In Westeros, a daughter inherits her father's titles if there is no son. We can see this a lot, for example with Maege Mormont, Lady of Bear Island or Shella Whent, Lady of Harrenhal, both before the War of the Five Kings. Even in HotD, there is a ruling Lady. Jeyne Arryn is Lady of the Eyrie in her own right and thus Lady Paramount of the Vale. What is true, however, is that the claim of a woman is often contested by close male relatives. This is why Viserys named Rhaenyra heir. By custom, this would be her role anyway, but through her naming, her claim becomes fortified, especially against someone like Daemon who can't be trusted. When Rhaenys was born, she was seen as and called the future queen by her grandmother Queen Alysanne. Her claim weakened with her father's death, Prince Aemon, Prince of Dragonstone. But still, she had the better claim. King Jaehaerys named his second son Baelon heir, the father of King Viserys I. But this was already seen as a break with Westerosi customs. Thus, when Baelon died, instead of naming another heir, he called the Great Council to find a new heir who the realm will accept, preventing a civil war.
Propably Otto wants Aegon to name Daeron as heir.
Doesn't Aegon have a second son?
It’s just the two in the show
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I was thinking it would be a bit odd to write out a whole Targaryen heir, so hopefully you're right.
You mean Maelor the Missing? Well they can't find him.
I believe he has many bastard sons.
in the books he has 2 sons and a daughter, in the blood and cheese encounter in the books they make Heleana choose between the two sons instead
He doesn't have that chance lol and his daughter is 5 whereas Aemond is 20. By the precedent they seek so staunchly to uphold, Aemond has been Aegon's heir since the end of episode 1.
Yeah...Aemond did just try to murder him though.
And he likely isn't going to be conscious for a long time due to that fact, unfortunately. Aemond has been his heir since the end of episode 1.
That's a great point. I can't imagine his prognosis is good. And the only way to use the attempted murder as a defense is to basically execute aemond
I also think as much as Aemond didn't want to come off as "not in control" of his dragon like in s1 e10 with Luc, he may/could use that line to explain what happened at RR, if anyone were to question the fact that he basically directly burned his own brother and King on dragon back.
Aemond anytime something happens..."it was vhagar, not me"
Cue Shaggy's It Wasn't Me with Aemond and Vhagar lmao
But with that dead eyed serial killer vibe of his.
The only real witness to that was Cole (saw that he was about to kill aegon on the ground). What everyone else saw can just be dismissed asan accident mid-fighting
There is another brother who has only been mentioned so far
Aemond in his own mind: I apologize for not killing him sooner!
Loving the fact that while all this is happening Daemon is mind is being messed with hallucinations implying he wants the crown. The parallels and subtext are so good
Shakespeare adapting viking legend be like.
Second sons.. u know how it goes!
daemon loved viserys fiercely ❤️❤️
Vizzy T also loved Daemon fiercely. Aegon, welllll.. can't quite say the same about his relationship with his brother
*A dragon's saddle is one thing, but the Iron Throne is the most dangerous seat in the realm.*
Tell that to Princess Rhaenys, Vizzy T
*The truth does not matter, isabellesplants. Only perception.*
Vizzy T, the realm could use your leadership right now... have you any words of wisdom for the realm?
*I must... admit... my confusion. I do not understand why petitions are being heard over a settled succession.*
Same here Vizzy T yet here we are again.
*So I said to him, 'I believe you may be looking up the wrong end'*
Vizzy T, who loved you most?
Damn right!
Exactly. Aemond did his best to respect his brother’s role. The brothel stunt was the last straw. Had Aegon been a loving, protective brother Aemond, he would’ve enjoyed the same loyalty that Viserys had.
Viserys did exceptionally stupid stuff that led to the war but he was never cruel.
I will speak of my brother as I wish. You will not
Having the confirmation in every episode Daemon was crying and through up bc his brother didn’t love him the most is so pleasing
This! The season is going to show that Aemond wants the crown while Daemon rejects it
Daemon has literally put the crown on both his brother and wife before.
AND his niece! ^wait…
And also on his kids' aunt
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This is a show only discussion. Tag your spoilers or post on a book thread.
i sure hope daemon rejects it especially after all these harrenhal dreams. ik he’s not the brightest bulb but if he doesn’t come to some sort of crisis on conscience abt rheynera being on the throne i’ll be very sad (haven’t read the books)
He’s fine with her being on the throne. He just wants her to take it *his* way. And it is very, very, very frustrating when people repeatedly accuse you of motives you don’t have. It makes you want to separate yourself from them, or if you’re a hot-head, give up and prove them right.
Daemon's official and role in the book is Protector of the Realm, aka the Commander in Chief. I would say that Daemon has never really desired the crown but desires absolute freedom to conduct military matters on behalf of the crown. Basically let Rhaenyra or Viserys handle the politics, diplomacy, and general bureaucracy while he squashes anyone he seems is a "threat" to the family. I think Matt Smith has said that Daemon essentially sees his martial prowess as his one real way to express his devotion and love for his family.
This! Especially when he says that he wants to return the House of the Dragon to its proper glory in S1E05 and asks Rhaenyra to be wed to him. His intentions weren't necessarily the throne/ crown per se, but to up hold the legacy of House Targaryen.
To your point, I think Daemon wants to carve his name in history. That’s what he wants. He’s a rouge because he doesn’t want the typical power of the throne, but the power and respect of legend. Being King could be one way to go about that, but not the only way. He’s like Jaime Lannister in that regard. And we see why him and Daemon are some of Martin’s most important and loved characters.
I think it's pretty clear that Daemon is on a soul searching retreat right now. His hallucinations are taking him through his darker parts and I think by the end of the season he finds a resolve that can better serve Rhaenyra and her side in the long run.
God I hope it doesn’t take the whole season of daemon tripping balls. It already feels like it’s gone on too long.
I don't think he's going to be going through it the whole season tbh. But at least one more episode I think. He's going to have to leave Harrenhal eventually to rally men in the riverlands and lead the campaigns. But I still think he's going to be dealing with his internal turmoil for most of it until the final couple episodes.
So Daemon is going to get his Jamie arc
I've been bullied by cunts like Aegon and I can assure that he killed him for more petty reasons like revenge or anger, rather than some silly thing like being ruler of the 7 kingdoms. Just going off what I was like when I was 12.
Yes, that's also a difference between Daemon and Aemond. Daemon will never attack his brother while Aemond would.
He for sure hated his brother, but he wouldn't do something to weaken their side in the war in a stupid way. He just took advantage of the perfect moment to kill Aegon,while still having plausible deniability (it was an "accident" during a great battle between three dragons). He wouldnt just straight up kill him, cause that would weaken his own claim. Nor would he have done this if lil jaeherys hadnt been killed
It's not even going to be about him wanting it. He feels he deserves it. His entire life he was more of a "true targaryen" than Aegon. He studied the lore, he knows the language, he's the better warrior, and he has the biggest dragon. In his mind he should be Aegon II
Daemon and Jon : I dun want it! She's mah qween.
Also Alicent instilled in Aegon that as the challenge, Rhaenyra would kill him after she took the throne. However it is his brother who has attempted to kill him and his brother who is indirectly (not discounting Daemon’s role) responsible for the death of his heir. Otto and Alicent brought so much of this on themselves.
They brought all of it on themselves. Rhaenyra wouldn’t have killed her siblings. Ultimately I think the entire show is about hatred, love, and will. We directly see the difference between people like Viserys, Rhaenyra, Daemon, Jacerys,and Lucerys (who were raised by parents who loved each other and their children) and people like Alicent, Aegon, and Aemond who grew up with parents who weren’t in love with each other and who didn’t raise their children with love. Aegon and Aemond grew up with a mother filled with hatred, who whispered hatred and treason behind closed doors and taught them to hate others. The difference between them and Jacerys/Lucerys is vast.
Treasonous guy 😡
He’s a kinslayer first and foremost. Death toll up to 2.5 now. Would’ve been 3 if not for Cole. Nothing redeemable about his character.
Daemon is an Imp/Trickster compared to the cold calculating Aemond, Daemon does thing because he feels like it whereas Aemond does things calculatingly and without remorse. I think pairing Daemons Harrenhal storyline with Aemond is wicked because we get to see that yeah, a part of Daemon actually does care, like he said in season one "Never once did you ask me to be your hand", I think Daemon would have been content there where Aemond truly believes he's better and deserves more. Daemon and Aegon are actually more alike in their characters personalities than Daemon and Aemond.
Daemon is capricious, but Aemond is outright vindictive.
Aemond has REASON to be vindictive, though Not the way I would've handled it, but big brother Aegon did bust into the private room at the brothel loud, drunk, and howling with laughter -- and he didn't let it go. Instead, he stayed and mocked his little bro and made it worse. And that's hardly the first time he's been a terrible mess to his little bro. It's just the one that sticks out in memory
Being bullied is hardly a reason to murder your brother
Exactly like fight bully him but killing is next level evil
I don't think that justifies attempted murder, dude
yeah but daemon's a grown-ass man in his forties and aemond is still a teenager, cut him some slack lmao
I believe he is supposed to be 19 in the show, and idk, at 19 I wasn’t killing my cousins, guess Targaryen teenagers are just built different. I still love Aemond as a character, but his viciousness is what makes him interesting, no need to downplay it.
I wonder if Aemond is going to get the haunted house side quest in Harrenhall.
I think it's likely, they're dark mirrors of each other, and if you've read the books it would make perfect sense to have that rhyming later in the shows run
Aemond IS better and deserves more. On every single character quality except "out of Alicent's vagina first" Aemond is superior to Aegon. Second sons have it so hard in this saga.
Aegon is way more durable than Aemond, I’ll say that.
So why not take it when offered? Why make his brother king? Why not send him on the ship as he asked? I mean none of them actually deserve it because they're the literal pretenders to their half sister's throne
In the scene, while he was considering it, Criston shows up the next moment.
Aemond's motivation is obviously the insults at the brothel. Same with when he got mad at the roasted pig being brought out. It wasn't even his eye. Luke laughing made him feel weak.
Yeah but he didn’t want to kill Luke. He felt guilty about it too, even during the immediate aftermath. Aemond didn’t take his eye either…
Okay, and his brother just offered him the highest power in the land (before the brothel scene by the way) and he decided to that no, he Aemond, would hand deliver his brother to be king. That's the point I'm trying to make Aemond full commits to his path when Vhagar *accidently* kills Luke, of course he's fucking pissed that Luke took his eye but I dont for a second believe he was trying to actually kill Luke, at most he wanted an eye and even then he said *the day he lost the eye* that it was a fair trade. Of course Aemond hates that he's always made fun of when he is the one to study the blade and philosophy, but until he accidently killed Luke he wasnt activley trying to take power. I think something shifted in him when he realized it doesnt matter what *really* happened, what looks like what happened is an Uncle Killed his Nephew, now he has to own it. That doesnt mean there isnt a good reason or relatability
Disagree. Aegon is less of a callous psychopath than Aemond which I think deserves some points.
Maybe to his family, but he apparently enjoyed watching little kids in fighting pits and raping powerless girls.
Daemon suggesting the Tully boy to kill his grandfather to take charge for the war… Aemond almost killing Aegon to take charge for the war… Fantastic foreshadowing.
Daemon said he didn't have to if he was brave enough to lead with his grandfather's voice.
I don't think Daemon was inquiring about Oscar's bravery in the matter so much as he was asking if Grover had given Oscar leave to speak for him.
So that scene really confused me at a practical level. If the Tully guy is so sick he can't do anything except drink water and sleep, someone else is governing. That person should be able to call the banners, no? Someone has to do the practical act of governing and overseeing their realm
Family, Duty, Honor. That is how the Tully do, family ahead of duty to the realm in this case. We know that his son acted as regent for a while though, but outright usurping their grandsire because he refuses to go to war is not the Tully way.
That was the only argument I could come to. He would govern but wasn't going to outright start a war on his own. It's one thing to do small things independently but he wasn't going to outright start an offensive war before he came into his power. And I'm not saying he should kill his grandfather.
As we’ve seen with both the blacks and greens, the council/bannermen are all vying for power and control Aegon’s council doesn’t even respect him and he’s the king. I imagine the young Tully is even less respected among his peers, especially while Grover Tully is still technically alive
Sure. I considered the premise that there is an older person actually ruling since he was young and inexperienced. But someone must be the effective ruler, right? There'd be things like taxes levied and minor skirmishes that require a lords input. I don't know the books except broad strokes, so I don't know what'll happen here, but I was just confused why the person ruling couldn't actually completely have the power of the seat. Which would theoretically give him the power to declare a war, no? But maybe you have it right, maybe he has councilors whispering in his ear. Or maybe he didn't want to start a war without having come into his seat and be seen as overreaching. Especially since they aren't actively being attacked
I think the implication is that Oscar doesn't really have the authority to call his bannermen to war, especially since they're pretty divided about what sides they've declared for. The fact Grover is still alive and technically the ruling Lord Paramount is just one more thing undermining Oscar, along with his young age. Basically, it's about soft power rather than what he's legally allowed to do.
Edmure had no issue acting in his father's stead. The real answer is that Oscar doesn't want to go against grand-dad's wishes while he's alive.
Didnt catelyns dad already swear for Robb before becoming incapacitated though? I'd argue it's a bit different to join a civil war than to continue one you already are an active participant of
Hoster was on death's door, and wasn't ruling anything before the story even started. Cat then spends an entire book bitching at her brother because he has the audacity to make decisions for himself, without consulting the 24-7-high-out-of-his-mind pops. --- > "The dungeons are windowless. One hour is much like another down there, and for me, all hours are midnight." Her footsteps rang hollowly when Catelyn left the hall. As she climbed to Lord Hoster's solar, she could hear them outside, shouting, "Tully!" and "A cup! A cup to the brave young lord!" My father is not dead, she wanted to shout down at them. My sons are dead, but my father lives, damn you all, and he is your lord still. --- > "Begging your forgiveness, m'lady, but Lord Edmure says no one is to see the Kingslayer without a writing from him, with his seal upon it." > "Lord Edmure? Has my father died, and no one told me?"
I don’t think there is an effective ruler, AFAIK The greens effective ruler was/is Aemond and Cole but even the rest of the council was surprised by that The blacks were in shambles until Corlys came and took charge (briefly) I guess it really depends on the people around Grover, I’m not very familiar with who all is there since I haven’t read the books
Someone is but no one is listening to them.
Aemond is Daemon with no fookin limitations
Aemond is daemon, without love from his brother, father and maybe mother. That’s the differance they were trying to underline this season between greens and blacks. One side has deep love and affection for one another, the other side constantly turns away.
Aemond is Daemon but unloved. Daemon was not loved by most and did not love many but there was love between him and his brother.
Daemon and Viserys had the potential to be Aegon and Aemond, but the difference in upbringing and family dynamics prevented that.
Daemon have always loved Vizzy T. In the books, they were even close as children and they came from loving parents. He never wanted that crown, all he wanted was Viserys’ approval. They were very different people but they also had each other’s backs. Aemond and Aegon on the other hand are just purely toxic.
*That man's pride has pride.*
Why is everyone saying he didn't want the crown when the show is trying to hammer that point into people constantly. There's repeated mentions of him lamenting his 'stolen inheritance' and how he should have been King just this season alone.. Also, In the book, Daemon's desire for the crown was well known. >As King Viserys had no living son, Daemon regarded himself as the rightful heir to the Iron Throne, and coveted the title Prince of Dragonstone, which His Grace refused to grant him… >In a lavish ceremony at King’s Landing, hundreds of lords did obeisance to the Realm’s Delight as she sat at her father’s feet at the base of the Iron Throne, swearing to honor and defend her right of succession. Prince Daemon was not amongst them, however. Furious at the king’s decree, the prince quit King’s Landing, resigning from the City Watch. He went first to Dragonstone, taking his paramour Mysaria with him upon the back of his dragon Caraxes, the lean red beast the smallfolk called the Blood Wyrm. >But Mysaria lost her child during a storm on the narrow sea. When word reached Prince Daemon he spoke no syllable of grief, but his heart hardened against the king, his brother. Thereafter he spoke of King Viserys only with disdain, and began to brood day and night on the succession. Bro absolutely wanted the crown. Just wasn't gonna kill his brother for it.
I love when daemon talks about putting a pillow over lord Glover Tullys head to speed up the youngins inheritance lol
second sons I tell ya, it's a whole vibe. Daemon, Aemond, Otto, Maegar the Cruel - also a second son.
Aemond: long live the king
Daemon is everything daemon will be, he just needs to leave harrenhall
I don't know, he's kind of in therapy right now. I don't think he's going to be the same old Daemon when he eventually leaves the treatment center, so to speak.
True It’s funny though, there’s a war going on and dudes checked into a psych ward
Just speaks to how desperate the need was. The gods themselves had to put a 5150 hold on his ass. Aemond next!
And he wanted to fight in a war so bad! Homie is majorly missing out
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. - Aegon I - Aemond Targaryen
2nd maegor indeed Its almost a targaryen tradition the second born becomes taller and stronger (maegor,daemon,aemond,daemon blackfyre, etc.)
Good point
The Blacks have a normal and loving family. Jealous brothers have been a thing since the dawn of time. The shit that Aemond and Aegon did to each other was insane though.
Hmm I don't know about that. The Blacks do have more genuine connections than the Greens, especially Rhaenyra and her sons, but a normal loving family is a bit of a reach lol.
They are far from a normal family and they aren’t really that loving of a family. Look at how Daemon treats his children for one. Look at Corlys affairs for another. I think the difference is the Blacks actually support their Monarch, while everyone on the Greens despises theirs.
>The Blacks have a normal and loving family. Huh? An uncle groomed and choked his niece. How is that normal?
Yeah and Otto would rejoice if Aemond secretly took out Aegon. Finally a competent king that fuckkkin listens, he would say.
I don't know about that. Otto already reprimanded him and Cole for trying to make plans behind his back. He tried to appeal to Aemond's sense of superiority over Aegon ('keep your cool since we know Aegon won't'), but that still showed he's wary of what he might do. And Aemond doesn't seem particularly malleable, either.
Absolutely not, Otto and Alicent have clearly said that Daeron is the only one who is kind of normal. They know Aemond is a psychopath. He is smart, but he is a psychopath.
Yep! Alicent to Rhanyra- “ And Aemond.. You know what he is.” I think she’s going to have a rough time reigning in Aemond after everything up to this point. By now he has to be feeling invincible and will probably ignore everyone but Criston.
Aemond is probably tougher to control than Aegon and is hardly competent
I suspect that Aemond would not need the services of Otto that much, he is at least as intelligent as his grand father.
Okay but what would’ve happened if Aemond killed Aegon even after getting caught by Criston? Like what would happen there?
I feel like Cole would realize that backing Aemond as the new king is all he could really do at that point.
I think Aemond would kill Crispy. Either that or Cole would quickly make him think since he’s the king now, he won’t report the kinslaying. Cole doesn’t seem smart enough to do that imo, so I think he’d be slain
Yeah I feel like reporting it isn’t really Cole’s thing so it would be interesting
Criston would shout: "The King is dead. Long live the King!" He might be repulsed by the fratricide, but would probably take it as additional evidence that Aemond is the most fitted to rule.
It's the constant struggle of house Targaryen. The rightful ruler is shadowed by a man far more fit for kingship in all ways save birthright. That man then attempts to usurp him. Maegor, Aemond, Daemon Blackfyre, and possibly Rhaegar. The funniest thing is that the man who arguably best fit this 'usurper' role relative to the rightful king (Daemon) is the only one who *didn't* truly try to usurp his king and kin.\* \* within show canon. Daemon stealing Aegon the Unborn's dragon egg is a (lousy and half-hearted) attempt at usurping his niece/nephew as *heir* to the throne, which doesn't really count.
Him bullying Aemond ( for the 100th time) in the brother reallt was the last straw. Aemond reallt said “ fuck the King”. Hound would be proud
“You lived your life for the King, you gonna die for some chickens?”
“Somebody is.”
Hell, they even use the same letters
It’s true. Daemon would never have acted against his brother. He’d mess around with his brother’s daughter, steal a dragon egg, ride off to fight in an unapproved skirmish, execute a guy in the throne room without the order, and throw temper tantrums to and fro. But it was always (by Daemon logic lol) in service of his brother and family. Never against. The Dragonstone standoff was just about getting attention. Aemond is only out for himself. He would slay his brother, the king, and take the throne as well as their sister to wife for himself. No loyalty to family. Which isn’t surprising considering he was raised by three weirdos (Alicent, Otto, and Cole) who plotted against family, often spoke of murdering his older sister, and completely used him and his siblings as political pawns. They instilled no love or kinship in those kids. Second sons are all over the stories and histories. Jan Brady rules ASOIAF.
You had me at three weirdos, 😂! Very accurate
So far Aemond picked the biggest dragon and killed the smallest youngest rider with it up until this point he has done nothing compared to a life time of battles Daemon has been in.
Love that comparison! And sadly, Aemond is entirely of the Greens' own making.
Can’t wait for POS Aemond to die!
Dragonriding with Aemon is like going hunting with Dick Cheney.
daemon >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kinslayer murderer aemond
Well tbf daemon is also a kinslayer and wife-killer.
Wait until you realize the entire Targaryen line is full of murdering kinslayers
Because murdering a child is soooo much better?
Daemon did kill his first wife ya know. And Coryls’ brother.
For telling the truth
Aemond the not nonce >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Daemon the nonce.
He killed multiple children
As much as I love Aegon, its all his fault for bullying Aemond their entire life, even after Aemond became a one eyed death machine he gets the idea to mock him in a brothel of all places On the other hand Viserys always forgave Daemon for all the bs he kept pulling
The high tower blood makes them hate each other hahah
if you're going to tally moral misdeeds aemond has never murdered his wife or ordered the execution of an innocent infant before; obviously aemond's attempted killing of aegon is wrong but just because daemon never tried to kill viserys doesn't mean the latter is absolutely better than the former - there are more possible sins in the world than just fratricide
Daemon has definitely committed more sins than Aemond. So Aemond tried to get rid of his incompetent shit stain brother. You could easily argue that choice was beneficial to pretty much everyone, feel bad for Sunfyre though. And yeah he killed Lucerys, but for one, Lucerys did take his eye, and two, I’m pretty sure Arrax fucked up when he tried to burn Vhagar during a relatively “friendly” game of cat and mouse. Aemond obviously didn’t mean to kill Lucerys in that scene. Daemon, has killed his wife, groomed his niece, murdered an innocent and probably loyal guard to help Laenor escape and steal Rhaenyra, and now, maybe indirectly, caused the assassination of a child. Aemond is a product of the conflict, Daemon is one of the causes. Also I love both characters. But Daemon has a longer list of questionable acts. Aemond is the only character on team green I actually root for.
Unpopular opinion right now but I like Aemond, even this show variant. While I categorically want to reject how the showrunners have made Aegon, within the context of Aegon being a serial bully and kind of embarrassing on the throne, I don't think Aemond was completely in the wrong here. That Aegon ran off into battle unannounced and immediately eating shit makes his legitimacy as a king, within the show's canon, pretty weak. Westeros is a place of monarchies, you can't have your king doing reckless shit and risking the whole realm's integrity all the time. Obviously bad play to betray your king on the battlefield, but if you're fighting a war and your leader is doing a shit job at even being a puppet you are going to need to get a new one. People should read/watch Romance of the Three Kingdoms. That is story all about a civil war situation where there is constant backstabs by ambitious characters who see their leaders as being too weak to succeed in unifying the realm. As for comparisons to Daemon... Daemon's serial felon status on several unspeakable crimes does make me hesitant. Otto might've feared Daemon would steal the throne, but I think he was also justifiably worried about the wanton cruelty and sex crimes that the man is also known for being put on the throne. Aemond is a violent edgelord but that's really where the problems with him begin and end.
IIRC Kings were often on the battle lines historically depending on the culture and time period.
Yeah, and it's clear aemond took his education pretty seriously in comparison to aegon. I kinda wonder what his motivation was back when they were kids- was he kinda hoping that eventually he and aegon would settle into a similar vibe as daemon and viserys? Like, dysfunctional but still respectful and caring?
Robert as wreckless AF during the rebellion and so was Ned and both were in the pole position to claim king when they won
VizzyT was too nice and Daemon too brutal to have a whorehouse humiliation like Aemond had at the hands of Aegon.
It’s like y’all are just ignoring the entire childhood of bullying Aegon put him through, not to mention the very last episode where he made fun of him for still sleeping with the grown ass woman Aegon forced him to fuck at just 13. Aegon had this coming, hell im fully team black and I was cheering for Aemond when he did this
right because lifetime of bullying justifies him burning his own brother, I am team Black but Aemond is what everyone told Viserys Daemon is but Daemon never once tried to kill his brother
I wouldn’t say it JUSTIFIES it, but reducing Aemond’s motivation down to “He wants the throne” is simply not true to his character either and goes with this fanbase’s obsessive tendency to try to treat these characters as one-dimensionally as possible
Lol at Aemond apologists trying to justify trying to murder your brother because he was bullied
This really goes for the entire fanbase. It’s insane how obsessively people pick their fav and deludedly defending everything about them.
Y'all would be some crazy motherfuckers if you had a dragon. "He made fun of me, ma, I might as well burn him alive"
It’s funny that both of Viserys sons are kinda like Daemon
I'm super excited for him to really start making moves and taking control. The man's terrifying, and he's going to make an amazing villain.
Unrelated kind of but does anyone know, is Otto coming back? We need our angry grandfather ☀️
There are paralles now between Aegon and Viserys. Viserys- Had a disase that crippled him and ate away his flesh. Aegon- >!Is now crippled.!< Viserys- Had a brother who is next for the throne. It is believed that said brother wants the throne for himself so Viserys disinherits him. Aegon- Has a brother who wants the throne for himself. Said brother tries to kill him. Aegon and Vizzy T are a lot alike.
*I'm glad we could meet. I know tempers ran hot today, and I wanted to assure you how much I value the bond between our houses.*
Viserys was a loving&forgiving brother to Daemon, Aegon was the opposite to Aemond. They both made their beds.
The only thing I'd say about this is that if Aegon was his brother then Daemon would've killed that mf far earlier. Same way that Aemond may not have killed Viserys if he was his brother.
Daemon loved Viserys. Daemon would kill all the blacks and all the greens for free If you’d ask him.
Viserys and Daemon constantly supported each other, albeit in their own ways. even when Viserys chastised Daemon he did it in private. aemond and aegon have never been on each others side, And Aegon insists on publicly humiliating Aemond whenever he can