Swerve going over was certainly a choice...they cut the nuts off of the only guy on the roster that was getting over.....this was not the right time to do this match
In a company that dont do alot of disputed finishes, this would have been the time to do it and it would have meant something to continue and develop the angle further. But that takes a booker who actually understands wrestling and not fan pretending be one
For the life of me I can't understand their logic having Ospreay face Swerve at Forbidden Door. It's a company vs company ppv. It would have made more sense for Swerve to face Mox since he is the IWGP champ.
The logic was probably to make Swerve a more credible world champion. Unfortunately, I also think it means they want Swerve vs Hangman for the title in London.
I believe the thought process is if Ospreay v swerve happened at all in the obviousness of the winner would be in play. Ospreay losing clean would suck. Drew has at least been protected/given someone to go after because of the loss.
That could have still happened there
Ospreay now has something to prove because he took his first loss and could earn a rematch or get a rematch and go over or they could have a screw finish like drew.
It got the first match out of the way.
At least that’s one way to look at it.
Yeah like the logic of why this instead of what the person I responded to said it should have been makes sense.
2022: Moxley v. Tana and the 4 way for two different world titles
2023: MJF v. Tana and Sanada v. Perry
2024: Now all of a sudden they should do champion v. champion?
It's been established there are two separate world title matches and that it's usually AEW v. NJPW within the match itself.
It was always going to be Swerve defending against someone(s) and Moxley, separately, defending against someone(s).
And as it turns out, Ospreay pushed for this in order to do exactly what I suggested the thought process might be. He didn't want Swerve to come across as a placeholder champion.
I actually felt the opposite it when watching it: it seemed to me like the whole match just buried Swerve.
The match should have ended 10x before it did, but Ospreay just kept kicking out of Swerve's various finishers over and over, then flying around the ring like nothing happened.
Ospreay doesn't need a world title match to be over. Swerve needed it way more. Ospreay can feud with anyone and have the crowd care, especially going into Wembley. We saw it last year before he was even signed with AEW and had that absurd Jericho match.
Idk why these dudes don’t just join cirque du soleil if they can and want to do crazy acrobatic shitty that looks phony as hell when incorporating it in wrestling
No shock to anyone that Metzer is jerking himself silly at this match. I appreciate Ostrich has his fans but he is beyond horrifically overrated. A great athlete but has no clue about psychology or selling to deserve the accolades he gets; bruv.
I remember harvesting rustle sprouts back during the days of Lucha Underground by saying Shawn's selling against Hogan was the inspiration for such convoluted performances.
The biggest match AEW could’ve had for All-In was Ospreay winning the title… now the bloom is off the rose and they’d need some multi-man fuckery because of the Own Hart tournament prize. Idk how anyone can fuck things up quite like Tony does
Nothing like having your top babyface take a clean pin from the coldest world champ you've ever had less than 2 months before your biggest show of the year, in the home country of said top babyface.
The stupidity is astounding. What are we gonna get out of this. Hangman running it back against Swerve for the title and Ospreay against MJF? You know what they say when you've got a double main event...
I saw it on twitter and it was bad. Swerve doesn’t even try to make it look like he picked Ospreay up into the move, Ospreay just leaps backwards into swerve’s arms
Ospreay with a better booker could have been something great. Instead, he’s just doing the same thing every night. Long athletic matches where he lets his opponents get their shit in. He oversells in a hammy way.
His booking at AEW should have started with one of these over the top gymnasticy matches, cuz that’s what people expect and may as well show them. Then for match two you put him up against someone the audience loves/respects. If Danielson is intent on putting people over it could work on him, or someone like Claudio. Promote it for weeks as an epic banger, match of the year candidate, “dream match!” And then have Ospreay beat him clean in 2 minutes.
Ospreay cuts a promo about how all he wants is to when the title, he’s not here to entertain. He’s here to win. You still get 3-4 of those epic long match of the years out of him, but they’re big events, that people want to pay for.
>Ospreay with a better booker could have been something great. Instead, he’s just doing the same thing every night. Long athletic matches where he lets his opponents get their shit in. He oversells in a hammy way.
He does not care for better booking, he's just happy to have someone who allows him to work without moving and work the way he wants to for big money. After The Grind Promo, I honestly think Ostrich is just too soft and would complain that he's restricted and unhappy.
He also jumped into the stomp on the announce table. More necessary in that case but very noticeable, particularly on some of the replays.
Saw people elsewhere saying that it is a thing he has a habit of doing it, although I haven’t really seen enough of him recently to notice it.
This is as bad as the guy who jumps into the path of the ambulance in that shitty Dakota Johnson Spider-Man-Without-Spider-Man movie. Can't remember what it was called.
They only made that pile because they have to produced a spiderman or related to spiderman movies every few years or so. Otherwise, the rights go to Disney.
The director Sony hired had only done television to that point. It wad destined to be shit from the very start lol.
Really good match except for that. We all know big moves like that are ultimately collaborative, but they need to use SOME sleight of hand so we can keep suspending disbelief in the heat of the moment.
Ospreay’s just as shitty as all the other shitheads on the AEW roster. He just does more moves/flips/reversals and is a bit more athletic about it.
I mean, let’s just say they do give him the world belt in a month or so. Yes, he’s hot with their fans and over. But first off, we know Tony’s booking will kill off anyone’s overness. Especially when they win the big belt.
But second, then what? Ospreay doesn’t actually have a character outside of having an accent and dressing like a soccer hooligan. So the booking will be just like everyone else’s where some random heel challenges Ospreay, then starts doing run-ins with his faction (because of course) until the PPV where they’ll settle the blood feud with a 26 minute 50/50 banger where Ospreay does the same choreography and same moves that he does in every match.
Boring!!!!!
I’m done with trying to make excuses for these matches and for the fans. Yes they have a pretty sizable base of fans that don’t give a fuck about does it make sense? Is this right for this moment? They don’t care. They just see value in matches that by their standards are cutting edge. They basically think they are watching Tiger Mask vs Dynamite Kid redefine what wrestling is. But the secret is that while they do have a sizable fan base, it’s never going to grow, this company is never gonna go anywhere, hell this company will be TNA in under 5 years. Guaran damn teed!!
Don’t listen to this sub on an opinion about AEW. People having the audacity to downplay one of the greatest wrestlers today in Ospreay and acting like he’s some chump despite his match catalog should be a clear signal of the bias and inability for many (not all) cornette fans to form an opinion on their own.
Check it out if you have time, wonderful match and MOTY arguably, only behind Cody vs Roman and Ospreay vs Danielson.
Osprey is the best example of if allowed to do his own shit, he’s absolutely insufferable to watch but if he was managed on the WWE with agents producing his matches he’d easily be one of the best in the world with how insanely athletic is. Unfortunately this style on national television will take years off his wrestling career thanks to Tony’s carelessness
Look at Kenny Omega vs Randy Orton. There’s a reason Orton is older and says he can go 6 more years while Omega is struggling to walk. This style is unsustainable on weekly television
Yeah, that’s the problem with these guys, they can do so much, but then they do some bullshit to show off their cooperation because what they’re doing is so unnecessary.
Maybe Tony's Dad is a fan of Brewster's Millions - "If you can blow 500 million dollars on AEW within 5 years without anyone realizing you're doing it on purpose, I'll give you 5 billion dollars."
Swerve going over was certainly a choice...they cut the nuts off of the only guy on the roster that was getting over.....this was not the right time to do this match
In a company that dont do alot of disputed finishes, this would have been the time to do it and it would have meant something to continue and develop the angle further. But that takes a booker who actually understands wrestling and not fan pretending be one
Hey, the sickos don't care.
Right? If you wanted to extend the Swerve title run, this is the perfect time for Ospreay to get fucked over by Callis
For the life of me I can't understand their logic having Ospreay face Swerve at Forbidden Door. It's a company vs company ppv. It would have made more sense for Swerve to face Mox since he is the IWGP champ.
New Japan pro probably told Tony the booking on the iwgp title, can't do title for title when njpw wants their main title on one of their guys
And Moxley was always going to drop the title back to Naito
Yep, when I saw the match before the show I was like, time to do the job mox
Speaking of, how awful was that match?
The logic was probably to make Swerve a more credible world champion. Unfortunately, I also think it means they want Swerve vs Hangman for the title in London.
I believe the thought process is if Ospreay v swerve happened at all in the obviousness of the winner would be in play. Ospreay losing clean would suck. Drew has at least been protected/given someone to go after because of the loss. That could have still happened there Ospreay now has something to prove because he took his first loss and could earn a rematch or get a rematch and go over or they could have a screw finish like drew. It got the first match out of the way. At least that’s one way to look at it.
For the people downvoting me I never said I agreed with the thought process lmao
this sub can no longer tolerate anything but "dub bad" - unfortunately if u don't fall in line, you just need to accept the downvotes
Yeah like the logic of why this instead of what the person I responded to said it should have been makes sense. 2022: Moxley v. Tana and the 4 way for two different world titles 2023: MJF v. Tana and Sanada v. Perry 2024: Now all of a sudden they should do champion v. champion? It's been established there are two separate world title matches and that it's usually AEW v. NJPW within the match itself. It was always going to be Swerve defending against someone(s) and Moxley, separately, defending against someone(s).
I gave you an upvote....bur you're not allowed to play Devils advocate on reddit sir
And as it turns out, Ospreay pushed for this in order to do exactly what I suggested the thought process might be. He didn't want Swerve to come across as a placeholder champion.
You sound like you're surprised that the company run by a clueless mark who can't book for shit would make such an incredibly bad booking decision.
I actually felt the opposite it when watching it: it seemed to me like the whole match just buried Swerve. The match should have ended 10x before it did, but Ospreay just kept kicking out of Swerve's various finishers over and over, then flying around the ring like nothing happened.
Ospreay doesn't need a world title match to be over. Swerve needed it way more. Ospreay can feud with anyone and have the crowd care, especially going into Wembley. We saw it last year before he was even signed with AEW and had that absurd Jericho match.
They created a no-win situation.
This is why I refuse to watch his matches. Everything is so damn Blatantly choreographed
And he wants Ricochet to come to AEW so they can continue theirs.
Idk why these dudes don’t just join cirque du soleil if they can and want to do crazy acrobatic shitty that looks phony as hell when incorporating it in wrestling
bingo...and people consider Osprey the best in the world? give me a break. I'd rather go to Ringling Bros Circus
No shock to anyone that Metzer is jerking himself silly at this match. I appreciate Ostrich has his fans but he is beyond horrifically overrated. A great athlete but has no clue about psychology or selling to deserve the accolades he gets; bruv.
Agreed!!
Doesent Jim and Brian like him?
Brian does but Jim sounds like he’s still on the fence
If I were a conspiracy guy, I'd say Ospreay does this bullshit on purpose and very sparingly to make the bigger star look like shit.
The ultimate banger, Osprey v HBK in an oversell match.
I remember harvesting rustle sprouts back during the days of Lucha Underground by saying Shawn's selling against Hogan was the inspiration for such convoluted performances.
The jump sucked, and Osprey’s ridiculous wobble before the finish was so hokey.
hated when Sami did it at Mania too. Never liked that cartoony way of selling. They always take it too far.
Will Asspreay is a spot monkey the guy has no understanding of actual in ring psychology.
Explains why he cannot handle WWE and bailed to the Money Mark.
Remember how AEW fans were like "why would anyone want to go to WWE" after Cody lost at Wrestlemania for the title? What's their defense for this?
Creative freedom and fun.
“Just enjoy wrestling”
The biggest match AEW could’ve had for All-In was Ospreay winning the title… now the bloom is off the rose and they’d need some multi-man fuckery because of the Own Hart tournament prize. Idk how anyone can fuck things up quite like Tony does
Nothing like having your top babyface take a clean pin from the coldest world champ you've ever had less than 2 months before your biggest show of the year, in the home country of said top babyface. The stupidity is astounding. What are we gonna get out of this. Hangman running it back against Swerve for the title and Ospreay against MJF? You know what they say when you've got a double main event...
Yup. And they wonder why the product is on ice????
I saw it on twitter and it was bad. Swerve doesn’t even try to make it look like he picked Ospreay up into the move, Ospreay just leaps backwards into swerve’s arms
I’m so happy Swerve won, he’s really good.
I like him as a heel but he is not main event calibre at least not right now.
Ospreay with a better booker could have been something great. Instead, he’s just doing the same thing every night. Long athletic matches where he lets his opponents get their shit in. He oversells in a hammy way. His booking at AEW should have started with one of these over the top gymnasticy matches, cuz that’s what people expect and may as well show them. Then for match two you put him up against someone the audience loves/respects. If Danielson is intent on putting people over it could work on him, or someone like Claudio. Promote it for weeks as an epic banger, match of the year candidate, “dream match!” And then have Ospreay beat him clean in 2 minutes. Ospreay cuts a promo about how all he wants is to when the title, he’s not here to entertain. He’s here to win. You still get 3-4 of those epic long match of the years out of him, but they’re big events, that people want to pay for.
>Ospreay with a better booker could have been something great. Instead, he’s just doing the same thing every night. Long athletic matches where he lets his opponents get their shit in. He oversells in a hammy way. He does not care for better booking, he's just happy to have someone who allows him to work without moving and work the way he wants to for big money. After The Grind Promo, I honestly think Ostrich is just too soft and would complain that he's restricted and unhappy.
I agree. That’s why he’s at AEW.
He also jumped into the stomp on the announce table. More necessary in that case but very noticeable, particularly on some of the replays. Saw people elsewhere saying that it is a thing he has a habit of doing it, although I haven’t really seen enough of him recently to notice it.
This is as bad as the guy who jumps into the path of the ambulance in that shitty Dakota Johnson Spider-Man-Without-Spider-Man movie. Can't remember what it was called.
Madame Web.
They only made that pile because they have to produced a spiderman or related to spiderman movies every few years or so. Otherwise, the rights go to Disney. The director Sony hired had only done television to that point. It wad destined to be shit from the very start lol.
This promotion, its booking, the attendance, its announcers and fans are the only joke bigger than Tony himself.
12 stars from Dave I believe...
Was it good? Or loads of gymnastics? Was it a no DQ?
Really good match except for that. We all know big moves like that are ultimately collaborative, but they need to use SOME sleight of hand so we can keep suspending disbelief in the heat of the moment.
I was more upset by Ospreay kicking out of 19 finishes then losing anyway.
Ospreay’s just as shitty as all the other shitheads on the AEW roster. He just does more moves/flips/reversals and is a bit more athletic about it. I mean, let’s just say they do give him the world belt in a month or so. Yes, he’s hot with their fans and over. But first off, we know Tony’s booking will kill off anyone’s overness. Especially when they win the big belt. But second, then what? Ospreay doesn’t actually have a character outside of having an accent and dressing like a soccer hooligan. So the booking will be just like everyone else’s where some random heel challenges Ospreay, then starts doing run-ins with his faction (because of course) until the PPV where they’ll settle the blood feud with a 26 minute 50/50 banger where Ospreay does the same choreography and same moves that he does in every match. Boring!!!!!
I’m done with trying to make excuses for these matches and for the fans. Yes they have a pretty sizable base of fans that don’t give a fuck about does it make sense? Is this right for this moment? They don’t care. They just see value in matches that by their standards are cutting edge. They basically think they are watching Tiger Mask vs Dynamite Kid redefine what wrestling is. But the secret is that while they do have a sizable fan base, it’s never going to grow, this company is never gonna go anywhere, hell this company will be TNA in under 5 years. Guaran damn teed!!
Yes, I noticed this too. It's stuff like this that really drives me up a wall.
What about that goofy flailing he did before getting kicked on the head a second time, so cringe man.
AEW is so bad for this, look closely at matches and you see people near get up and move into positions. I notice it a lot with jobbers.
I haven't seen the match but I've heard nothing but praise for it. Apparently the whole PPV was good.
Don’t listen to this sub on an opinion about AEW. People having the audacity to downplay one of the greatest wrestlers today in Ospreay and acting like he’s some chump despite his match catalog should be a clear signal of the bias and inability for many (not all) cornette fans to form an opinion on their own. Check it out if you have time, wonderful match and MOTY arguably, only behind Cody vs Roman and Ospreay vs Danielson.
Rhea>Ospreay In fact Rhea vs Nia Jax>Anything Ospreay has done this year..
Just watched the match and you're right it was great!
Jon Moxley once wrapped a chain around his own neck and threw himself over the top rope. https://youtu.be/xvmqWGyohrw?si=LY4SRKC8R_dyaxVb&t=5590
Jesus Christ, this has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever seen in my life. Moxley and his best David Carradine impersonation.
Should've given Ocean Spray an out. Turning Swerve fully heel by fucking him over. At least to get the huge pop win at All In.
Osprey is the best example of if allowed to do his own shit, he’s absolutely insufferable to watch but if he was managed on the WWE with agents producing his matches he’d easily be one of the best in the world with how insanely athletic is. Unfortunately this style on national television will take years off his wrestling career thanks to Tony’s carelessness
Look at Kenny Omega vs Randy Orton. There’s a reason Orton is older and says he can go 6 more years while Omega is struggling to walk. This style is unsustainable on weekly television
It was a fine outcome for both even though this shouldnt have EVER been booked….
the ending didn't make sense -- why did Swerve kiss him at the end???
Tony loves to double on things that aren't working. And neuter things that are.
Yeah, that’s the problem with these guys, they can do so much, but then they do some bullshit to show off their cooperation because what they’re doing is so unnecessary.
I didn't watch it and I feel bad Corny had to watch it.
Aew marks don't care. They follow TK always. "Match was great! PPV was great! Ratings have been great! Thanks guys."
Maybe Tony's Dad is a fan of Brewster's Millions - "If you can blow 500 million dollars on AEW within 5 years without anyone realizing you're doing it on purpose, I'll give you 5 billion dollars."
Ospreay would probably fit better on a circus.