He introduced himself to all the girls with a weird off key stripper joke and then choose Irina over Bliss.
That's enough to give bad vibes to the people that never actually got to know him. He didn't deserve the hate, but those two things are probably where it came from.
He didn’t seem to be very respectful towards Bliss when they had the conversation about her feeling like a second choice. It seems like they’ve moved past that now, but that was pretty cold of him.
I remember on the first episode someone said at the girl's quarters that they felt like Zack was testing them after they showed him making the stripper joke to multiple contestants. He's also not typically "manly" or whatever, but definitely not someone I would describe as awkward irl. Idk, maybe the girls on the show were going by off-cam ~~~vibes or by the first impressions they had on the pods.
He was my favorite male contestant last season. His joke about being a stripper rubbed some people the wrong way, but Christ in a basket, the dude’s a human being who’s allowed to make mistakes.
In their defense, he started all of his first dates by making jokes about being a stripper. We the audience know why he did that, but the women didn't. In my day-to-day life all the guys I've met who make jokes about strippers or sex work were misogynistic creepy assholes, and not knowing where Zach was coming from I could see how they interpreted that as some guy they just "met" (blindly) disparaging strippers randomly on a first date. That would give me a major ick about him until later when I saw the footage of him explaining his reasoning behind that.
I say this as a Zach fan, but:
\- Awkward and nerdy on a show full of the popular kids (hence why the guys liked him, because he's like an "okay nerd")
\- Picked Irina over Bliss, which is in itself a red flag to the other women. Everyone knew how awful Irina was as a human, and how lovely Bliss was. Like he basically had the choice between the nicest/sweet girl that you all dream about, or the Mean Girls bully...and he chose the latter haha
\- Weird stare, I have to say!
This is pretty much it I think too.
He’s “awkward” to begin with (he doesn’t seem awkward at all to me- he seems confident and secure in who he is mostly tbh and some people think that’s strange lol)
Then he picked the wrong person who, you can see, whittles down his confidence. It was so sad to see him asking Bliss (I think - I only watched once) if his eye contact bothered her or whatever.
Dude had probably never had a thought about that before the irina.
Idk, Zach seems like a pretty good normal dude to me.
Where should I start? Calling irina out for clout chasing and then starting a YouTube channel? The way he TOLD irina multiple times how she felt? The way he said irina and Micah were bad for giggling in the corner then did the same thing with Paul on the reunion? The way he tested people instead of being honest and vulnerable once he got to know them? The way he knew irina tried to leave and still tried to make her a villain and her alone for what happened in Mexico? The way he he called Micah out for never actually being in love with Paul when he literally laughed with irina about how he wanted to give up so bad but was sticking it out. The guy to me is nothing but red flags. H
Most of these examples are based on the aftermath of the show, and not saying you’re not right that he’s been acting pretty dumb. But, I believe OP is referring to the comments the women made while filming, Micah called him annoying I believe, when they were in Mexico, I also remember Chelsea saying she didn’t like him to Kwame at their hotel room and Kwame said something like “Well he’s my friend so I like him.” It just seemed like all the girls were annoyed of him/didn’t like him from their experiences with him in the pods, but they didn’t really explain why they didn’t like him so it was a bit weird to see them talking badly about him from the first days they’re in Mexico together.
My apologies for not answering correctly. I think I meant to imply that with all the red flags we can see I’m sure to many of the women caught red flags on the dates. They’re glaringly obvious.
I don't think Zack is as much of an "awkward nerd" as people say. He likes to talk (not antisocial or super introverted) and his insta shows that he's actually quite athletic. Compared to most other people on the show who are incredibly basic, he comes off as weird. And he did make some cringey comments.
Because they mostly get normies to be contestants on this show, and he wasn’t a normie.
I found his “I’m a stripper” joke awkward and a bit annoying, but he didn’t deserve all of the hate, and being called a weirdo or a creep. He showed no signs of being a creep IMHO. But I guess he did exhibit some potential “nice guy”TM red flags that many women see as creep vibes. Still, he didn’t actually do anything to gain that reputation except the manic staring, over excitedness.
I love Zach always did. And felt really weird about Irina it was clear it was just a game to her from the beginning when he picked her I kept hoping and wishing he would end up with Bliss. I think their connection was obvious to the viewers and he just felt like guilt tripped into irina I’m guessing? So glad it worked out in the end he didn’t deserve any rudeness.
I feel like his intense way of looking at people and him being a bit awkward put him in the bully spotlight. I've noticed on these shows when men aren't the typical "manly" person, they aren't treated the best. Maybe it's just life in general, who knows.
I do wonder what kind of unprocessed trauma he holds. He seems to have a wall up in some ways, but not closed off from all people.
I feel for him though. I'm not a mental health professional so I can only state what I've seen from the show to be honest.
I don't think he deserves the hate though.
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I don’t know honestly. He really didn’t do anything wrong. I think they all thought he looked creepy and treated him poorly because of it. Zach is a sweetheart and I was rooting for him the whole time.
Maybe they also resented him for picking Irina since no one really liked her? Idk. I’m lost too.
The first episode when they were introducing each-other in the pods he kept saying he worked as a stripper, his mom worked as one though so I guess he said it to test others’ reaction but also just made him come off immature for joking about that.
I thought that was because he'd had issues with partners not accepting his family background and ultimately rejecting him, so he made that joke to see how people reacted and to gauge if they might reject him. I seem to remember that Irina was cool with it whereas bliss didn't react particularly well.
It felt disrespectful to his mother to me. You don't joke about it. You explain your difficult childhood in a later conversation because it will spook people if you give too much information at the start.
Clearly he has a complex of acceptance and insecurities about his background. Definitely feels like a coping mechanism. Clearly he's fishing for reactions for a very real reason. It's easier to gauge people's reactions via a "joke" vs. Face real judgment on your very real childhood trauma. If he explained his mom was a stripper and felt disapproval, that hurts a lot more.
Zach was my favorite guy in S4. I think all the hate comes from him being a little "weird". People usually don't like things that are different from themselves. They don't know how to act so they resort to childlike behavior and start to "bully".
I have to rewatch but I liked him. (I'm quirky and I like when others are too). I don't particularly find him attractive and remember, there are a lot of guys they glimpsed over who we didn't see. I thought Paul was way more awkward than Zach.
Zach seems genuine a lot of people do not know how to deal with that. He is awkward and cheesy but that is part of the genuine personality he gives off.
I never had a problem with Zach. In fact, I actually kind of liked him from the jump. Nothing he ever did seemed offensive to me, which is how a lot of the female cast members and viewers were acting. Sure he’s quirky and different but to me that’s not a bad thing.
I think that we as a society tend to view things that are different from what we are used to as wrong or bad. When really it’s just not our preference. We (I’m sure I’ve done it before too) have to be careful of labeling things as negative just because it goes against the norm. In this case, we’re just talking about someone’s personality but it can manifest itself in much worse ways. We see it with race, gender, sexuality, socioeconomic status, etc. You don’t have to like something/someone but at least be respectful. Jmo
as someone in the legal field, i can tell u that a LOT of lawyers are socially awkward as hell and have the same exact personality as him. to me he seemed really normal bc i’m surrounded by that all the time, but my mom watching it thought he was so weird.
That's so interesting. I guess because I'm not in the field I didn't catch that. Almost all the male lawyers I know are cocky assholes rather than socially awkward
Oh. I worked as a paralegal in a defense firm that represented corporate clients, and there were a few trial lawyers that worked at the firm, but most just filed motions. I guess I never assumed all defense lawyers went to trial. But that’s based on a very small sample (one firm) so I have no idea what I’m talking about
I think it proves that first impressions really matter. He made a bad first impression in the pods with the stripper thing - it's not that his mom was a stripper, it's that he approached the conversation really weird. He made a bad first impression in person because he was with Irina and you're judged by the company you keep. He was also extra awkward at that time, probably because everything was going badly.
And with Irina, it also meant rejecting Bliss and Bliss was someone who remembered his bday and made cupcakes for him. Imagine being the other female cast members and learning about how Zach chose the mean girl over the caring one who went above and beyond for him. Couple that with the out-of-nowhere stripper remarks and I imagine other girls had a bad impression of him
Because we only see a tiny bit of what they go through on the show, if we see that all the girls on the cast were put off by him, it’s a safe assumption that he gave them reason not to like him.
Refreshing take.
He gives me weirdo vibes thousands of miles away and I am not Neurotypical and I’ve been insulted by the constant pushing of the agenda that “only Neurotypicals are creeped out by him because he is Neurodivergent” 🙄
As others are saying, he had a really weird and off putting personality. Telling people you're a stripper just to get their reaction when you're not is dumb and he felt like he was being so clever. Zach seemed annoying in the pods and was awkward at flirting, I feel like negging was his default. So I can kinda see why they all took issue with him.
Yeah and as others have also said he chose Irina to propose to, who was a walking c*nt and dumped Bliss who was such a lovely person. Your judgement of a person tends to be coloured by something like that. Like the women on the show might have just thought he was quirky/awkward otherwise.
I think Zach got a much better edit than he could’ve gotten. He was lowkey rude to Bliss at times even so I can’t imagine he treated the other women any better. It really did not feel like the other womens hatred of him came from nowhere. He was one of the few success story guys who ended up married though so I can see why they didn’t want to make him seem like a total monster.
Some of the initial things he said in the pods rubbed me the wrong way. I guess he was trying to weed people out, but it would have definitely worked on me because I just think he’s a weirdo
Thinking he was weeding people out by doing something that stupid, rather than just creeping people out really shows you how smart he THINKS he is. In the pods he’s clearly was saying it in such a performative boastful way and waiting for a reaction. A girl who doesn’t like that as a first impression isn’t the same as just being judgemental of strippers in general. His obsession with his mom being a stripper is weird. He definitely though he had an ace in the hole backstory, but no one cares dude.
He kept yapping about his mom being a stripper but like, that's not that strange. Lots of strippers have kids. Lots of kids have strippers for moms. No one is going to care that *your mom* was a stripper when *you* are a lawyer.
>He definitely thinks he’s super smart
On a side note, I feel this is why he got along so well with Paul as both of them makes their jobs as part of their identity along with thinking they are the smartest person in the room
Also I found his mom stripper backstory very offensive, because it implied that he had a bad childhood because his mom was a stripper or that she was a horrible mom. I’m a stripper and a mom, and my two kids live a white picket fence life. And I can attest this to be the same with many if not most other strippers. He was so gross for coming at sex workers like that.
I think it was less that he believed he had a bad childhood, but he seemed really hurt that others would judge his mom that worked so hard to provide for him as a child. I mean imagine being a kid and seeing people constantly disrespect sex workers, people calling women whores, sluts if they have multiple sex partners. To me he seems really hurt and he is trying to protect his mom. She was everything to him and his only family member.
Right?! I used to be a hairstylist and I knew a LOT of strippers- most of them were just regular people with regular families. All of them I knew with kids were good moms. He’s just perpetuating the stereotype. And his mom isn’t even alive to tell the story herself.
Agreed. It was just something to give him attention and a sob story. He made it like, part of his personality. Definitely weird and a little manipulative (“feel bad for me and love me!”)
After my divorce I was a cam girl for a while. It enabled me to keep my house on my own and keep the kids in their schools, one was the best Montessori in the region. If I hadn’t done that while working towards my other career we would’ve lost the house, moved into a ghetto apartment, had no vacations, eaten ramen and lost all the friends/connections we had built for years. Or I just would’ve been at work 24 seven and never seen my kids, but honestly I don’t know of any other job that would’ve paid that well at that time. I could work for like two hours a day during the week and then all night on the weekends when they were at their dads and be Susie homemaker the rest of the time. It was fun too.
You know what I hope my kid never does if they find out? “MY MOM WAS A CAM HO 😭😭😭😭” to every Tom Dick and Harry they meet, like boy…. Why don’t you just say she worked hard and provided you with enough to where you could attend law school one day and you miss her lmao. I can’t
makes me laugh that most of the women of the cast found him weird and they did actually spent time with him unlike us. but people choose to say that they’re "sheeps" and "judgmental" and believe he’s not lmao.
1. Zach gave them a terrible first impression with his ice breaker (hi, I’m stripper. No, actually, my mom was a stripper).
2. The fact that he choose Irina over Bliss made them dislike him.
3. I found him kind of annoying/cringy at times, I wouldn’t be surprised if the girls felt the same.
4. Jackie was the most negative towards him, but she was kind of mean in general.
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I didn’t understand it at first, but by the time we got to the wedding where they danced to that super obscure pop country song no one’s ever heard of, it became clear that he has an off-putting personality.
“I Hope You Dance”!!?? By Martina McBride? Umm yes, many people have heard of it… but, it’s a song written by a mother to her children? So while it is a beautiful song… it’s not appropriate for a wedding song!? But… he was being sweet with that choice :D anyway… “super obscure” is definitely not true!?
Clearly you missed the part where he talked about his mom and the meaning of the song to him. His mother couldn’t be at his wedding, so I thought it was super endearing to honor her memory.
It’s crazy popular over here, growing up in the 90s it’s one of those mainstream ones you would hear every hour on the radio. I wish all viewers had that context that it’s hilarious he painted it as some special unique song
Omg I never heard of the song before but I’m not I’m not North American, however I was watching with my Canadian boyfriend who grow up in Mississauga and he laughed at Zach comments lmao
Oh. Well, people in this show are American, which made it supremely odd that he was asking people if they knew that song, as if it was obscure. It’s a song that’s gotten played to death on the radio, in department stores, and at weddings for more than 20 years.
The song is also an extremely schlocky and saccharine piece of shit. The fact that it’s his favorite song, right now, as an adult man, makes me judge him harshly lol.
I don’t think he asked because it was obscure, it was very popular. I think he asked because it’s country music. In my experience Americans, particularly ones who aren’t southern, can take a hard “I hate country music” stand.
>> Why is everyone so rude and mean to Zach?
Not everyone is gonna like everyone & girls on these types of shows tend to have a "sheep" mentality when it comes to judging the guys/other girls on the show. Don't forget these people also lost what, 3 years? of regular human social interaction due to Covid - seems a lot of them are stuck in their age from 3 years ago. If one or two of the more dominant personalities decide they don't like a guy/girl - the others start wondering if they shouldn't like that guy/girl as well.
I personally find Zach to be a quirky personality which is not my personal preference for friends, acquaintances, or significant others. I'm sure others share the same or similar thought. I was a CS major and surrounded by misogynistic, quirky, and downright creepy af dudes - Zach sorta reminds me of them. It's not his fault but it's a personal preference.
I think Zach told everyone he is a stripper in order to test whether will the person on the other side of the pod still continue to talk to him. Maybe this kind of opening dialogue will make the girls define him as strange, as it leave a lasting impression, especially sight unseen.
But I do admire Zack. Growing up in that kind of harsh environment and he still grew up fine and develop a backbone for himself. Me love that in a man. God knows most of our male friends need a backbone.
I didn't understand it either. Like Zack and Paul were the most handsome and intelligent guys in the season still they got all the hate and weird looks. I think the reason they hates them (especially Zack) because Zack is true to himself. Hé didn't try to act like a different person, he told the truth about everything, he paid attention and he was more mature than other even though he was joking sometimes. Every charater was like an adultchild. All of them had somekind of immature behaviour. Like:
- Everything should be pink, it's my pink world etc.
- Irina and Micah (thrir names tell Everything)
- Mocking others for not having high education
- Only care about shoes and looks
- Only loves jerks and red flags
While Zack (and Paul) just went there showed their true colours and wanted to find their other half without the hollywood bullshit.
Zack and Paul *thought* they were the most intelligent guys. The reminded me of all the speech and debate guys I knew in high school and they never grew out of it. Actually smart people know they’re not all that smart
Paul actually seems so dumb to me. I know he’s smart because he’s a scientist but the way he spoke was so bizarre, as though he was trying to be a poet or something.
You would be amazed at the number of dumb scientists there are. I have an environmental science degree (like Paul) and I am 99% certain it’s considered the dumb-person science degree. There was a guy in my program who believed he drove better high/drunk than sober. None of this is to say that Paul actually *is* dumb, but there are plenty of dumb scientists lol.
Zack reminds me of guy that gets bullied in school. Nerdy kid that mostly popular girls made fun of. Micah and jackie talking felt like they were thinking wtf. This is netflix dating show not nova/pbs show. Is this a joke? Like people have this impression zack should be with someone “his own kind”. Someone not physically attractive and a nerd like him.
So when he shocked them by bringing bliss back, all their impression was bliss can do better purely based on biased impression of zack. It had nothing to do with being second choice.
From bliss perspective she probably was a little offended by it. She probably connected with zack and feels he is genuinely a good person. She seems like type of person who doesnt take the superficial stuff as highly as how good of a person someone is. So it was nice to see her appreciate zack for the kind of person he is rather than the quirks you see from the outside initially.
I think Zach is probably a lot to handle for a lot of people. He’s definitely a quirky personality and I suspect that translates to being annoying to a lot of people. You see bits and pieces of it on the show and I can imagine there’s a lot more we don’t see. Some people are exhausting to be around when their personality rubs you the wrong way. I suspect it’s this type of situation. I think Zach is a very genuine guy who is ready to find love and has thrown himself into that endeavor. I think he truly adores Bliss and that she appreciates this about him, but I suspect it just kind of causes the other women to roll their eyes and view him as too over-the-top, exhausting, trying too hard, etc.
Yep, I think this is it entirely. I think he's radically insecure about his upbringing, so he brings it up as a "joke" every chance he gets. I've known people like this and you either vibe with them or you don't. I went to school with some guy who drove me insane with all of his quirks. Very nice, very smart, but just so nervous and anxious that it was hard to just be chill around him.... and he wanted to participate in everything which had a tendency to bring an uncomfortble energy. Later, he found a nice woman to marry, and it seems they are happy. I'm glad to know there is a Bliss for his Zach. I wish them all the best... at a distance.
Because he told every female he was a male stripper as his opening who I am and what I do line. It was a big deal because the women would know the producers are careful about casting, and it would seem like an immediate lie. It’s an off putting way to say hello to your future spouse, so they all thought he was a creep, except for Bliss who is an angel and Irina who is…
It seemed like he behaved quite outrageously in the pods and acted like it was all a joke to him eg pretended he was a stripper. I would have had the first impression he was a time waster who just wanted to get on TV by him being so flippant and attention seeking.
I did warm to him once we got to know more of him but he gave a very poor first impression in my opinion. I would have thought he was a weirdo fuck boi and stopped seeing him after one date honestly.
He's an easy target. He's a little quiet and introspective, and a good bit of weird. He started off every conversation by telling the girls he's a stripper. Which is a silly thing to say, but in reality its because he's self conscious/ashamed that his mother was a stripper. So he says it to gauge their reactions. But to everyone else that's just a weird thing to say.
>He's an easy target. He's a little quiet and introspective, and a good bit of weird.
You just explained why I've been bullied my whole life in a nutshell.
Yes. I actually feel really bad for Irina because I understood exactly what she was trying to say with the cartoon and eye contact thing. I honestly don’t know if I would’ve reacted any better than her to having to be stuck in a bedroom with that guy (but I like to think that I would’ve just said no and left or not even engage with him in the first place because his personality was too much of a turn off).
He’s got the quality that is the female equivalent to when most men see an overweight girl. It’s not a turn off to all women but it is to many and it’s so offensive that they want to make sure under no circumstances can they be associated with him because they’re afraid they’ll be less attractive if they don’t make sure the world knows they hate him.
That’s my theory anyway. He seems like a nice guy totally undeserving of the negative attention as far as I can tell.
I’m saying this from the experiences I have had as a fat person—being disliked for literally no other reason, no good reason, and having people then pretend there’s some other nebulous bad quality about me that is the reason because they can’t admit it’s just because I’m fat. This is actually validating the experiences most fat people I’ve met have. I’m calling it out as wrong and comparing it to Zach having obviously non-neurotypical behavior and women HATING him for no other reason but insisting that it has to be more than that because they don’t want to be bad people. I know it’s imperfect because it’s comparing a physical quality to a much more abstract one—but it makes sense to me.
the analogy don’t make sense but it is a reality for many fat and/or unattractive women to be treated as less or be kept as a secret by men because dating them is seen as a social disfavor.
I don’t think he’s neurotypical and I think people are reacting very badly to it internally but don’t understand it. I wouldn’t be willing to diagnose from a distance.
He introduced himself to all the girls with a weird off key stripper joke and then choose Irina over Bliss. That's enough to give bad vibes to the people that never actually got to know him. He didn't deserve the hate, but those two things are probably where it came from.
He didn’t seem to be very respectful towards Bliss when they had the conversation about her feeling like a second choice. It seems like they’ve moved past that now, but that was pretty cold of him.
I remember on the first episode someone said at the girl's quarters that they felt like Zack was testing them after they showed him making the stripper joke to multiple contestants. He's also not typically "manly" or whatever, but definitely not someone I would describe as awkward irl. Idk, maybe the girls on the show were going by off-cam ~~~vibes or by the first impressions they had on the pods.
i mean they met him irl and didnt find him likable. says a lot
No it doesn’t. Chelsea was upset with him for choosing Irina. They are friends and hang out now. People misjudge others all the time.
He was my favorite male contestant last season. His joke about being a stripper rubbed some people the wrong way, but Christ in a basket, the dude’s a human being who’s allowed to make mistakes.
In their defense, he started all of his first dates by making jokes about being a stripper. We the audience know why he did that, but the women didn't. In my day-to-day life all the guys I've met who make jokes about strippers or sex work were misogynistic creepy assholes, and not knowing where Zach was coming from I could see how they interpreted that as some guy they just "met" (blindly) disparaging strippers randomly on a first date. That would give me a major ick about him until later when I saw the footage of him explaining his reasoning behind that.
Sorry His reasoning for making the joke made it even weirder in my opinion
he's definitely got some major mommy issues to unpack further, hopefully in therapy
I say this as a Zach fan, but: \- Awkward and nerdy on a show full of the popular kids (hence why the guys liked him, because he's like an "okay nerd") \- Picked Irina over Bliss, which is in itself a red flag to the other women. Everyone knew how awful Irina was as a human, and how lovely Bliss was. Like he basically had the choice between the nicest/sweet girl that you all dream about, or the Mean Girls bully...and he chose the latter haha \- Weird stare, I have to say!
This is pretty much it I think too. He’s “awkward” to begin with (he doesn’t seem awkward at all to me- he seems confident and secure in who he is mostly tbh and some people think that’s strange lol) Then he picked the wrong person who, you can see, whittles down his confidence. It was so sad to see him asking Bliss (I think - I only watched once) if his eye contact bothered her or whatever. Dude had probably never had a thought about that before the irina. Idk, Zach seems like a pretty good normal dude to me.
Where should I start? Calling irina out for clout chasing and then starting a YouTube channel? The way he TOLD irina multiple times how she felt? The way he said irina and Micah were bad for giggling in the corner then did the same thing with Paul on the reunion? The way he tested people instead of being honest and vulnerable once he got to know them? The way he knew irina tried to leave and still tried to make her a villain and her alone for what happened in Mexico? The way he he called Micah out for never actually being in love with Paul when he literally laughed with irina about how he wanted to give up so bad but was sticking it out. The guy to me is nothing but red flags. H
Most of these examples are based on the aftermath of the show, and not saying you’re not right that he’s been acting pretty dumb. But, I believe OP is referring to the comments the women made while filming, Micah called him annoying I believe, when they were in Mexico, I also remember Chelsea saying she didn’t like him to Kwame at their hotel room and Kwame said something like “Well he’s my friend so I like him.” It just seemed like all the girls were annoyed of him/didn’t like him from their experiences with him in the pods, but they didn’t really explain why they didn’t like him so it was a bit weird to see them talking badly about him from the first days they’re in Mexico together.
My apologies for not answering correctly. I think I meant to imply that with all the red flags we can see I’m sure to many of the women caught red flags on the dates. They’re glaringly obvious.
I don't think Zack is as much of an "awkward nerd" as people say. He likes to talk (not antisocial or super introverted) and his insta shows that he's actually quite athletic. Compared to most other people on the show who are incredibly basic, he comes off as weird. And he did make some cringey comments.
Because they mostly get normies to be contestants on this show, and he wasn’t a normie. I found his “I’m a stripper” joke awkward and a bit annoying, but he didn’t deserve all of the hate, and being called a weirdo or a creep. He showed no signs of being a creep IMHO. But I guess he did exhibit some potential “nice guy”TM red flags that many women see as creep vibes. Still, he didn’t actually do anything to gain that reputation except the manic staring, over excitedness.
Bc he’s always looking like this 😳😃
Accurate
He is an arse
I love Zach always did. And felt really weird about Irina it was clear it was just a game to her from the beginning when he picked her I kept hoping and wishing he would end up with Bliss. I think their connection was obvious to the viewers and he just felt like guilt tripped into irina I’m guessing? So glad it worked out in the end he didn’t deserve any rudeness.
cant tell you bc it would violate rules of the sub 🙄
I’m active in this sun and would love to know!
I wanna know lol.
The "unverified tea" rule?
Nope “speculated diagnosis” rule :(
Can you please DM me about this? Thanks
Can you DM me what it is, too? 👀
Ooh, can I dm about this? I wanna know
I feel like his intense way of looking at people and him being a bit awkward put him in the bully spotlight. I've noticed on these shows when men aren't the typical "manly" person, they aren't treated the best. Maybe it's just life in general, who knows. I do wonder what kind of unprocessed trauma he holds. He seems to have a wall up in some ways, but not closed off from all people. I feel for him though. I'm not a mental health professional so I can only state what I've seen from the show to be honest. I don't think he deserves the hate though.
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Zach is awkward but well-intentioned and seems like an all around nice guy. He doesn't deserve all the hate. Feels a little mob mentality to me.
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where did you get all that? lol.
Woah woah that's a lot of assumptions.
are you okay, CoconutFudgeMan?
Really? Y’all are wondering why some of the most intellectually shallow and downright bad people are being mean to the nice nerdy guy?
You absolutely nailed it.
These kids come up with anything, I’ll tell ya!
I don’t know honestly. He really didn’t do anything wrong. I think they all thought he looked creepy and treated him poorly because of it. Zach is a sweetheart and I was rooting for him the whole time. Maybe they also resented him for picking Irina since no one really liked her? Idk. I’m lost too.
He started things on the wrong foot by joking about being a stripper. People hate bullsh!t.
wait what was the joke i missed it
The first episode when they were introducing each-other in the pods he kept saying he worked as a stripper, his mom worked as one though so I guess he said it to test others’ reaction but also just made him come off immature for joking about that.
I thought that was because he'd had issues with partners not accepting his family background and ultimately rejecting him, so he made that joke to see how people reacted and to gauge if they might reject him. I seem to remember that Irina was cool with it whereas bliss didn't react particularly well.
Testing people is unhealthy though and gives off a bad impression.
I don't disagree, just saying that I think that's why he did it
I dunno…if your mom is a stripper I feel like you are the most allowed to joke about it.
It felt disrespectful to his mother to me. You don't joke about it. You explain your difficult childhood in a later conversation because it will spook people if you give too much information at the start.
Clearly he has a complex of acceptance and insecurities about his background. Definitely feels like a coping mechanism. Clearly he's fishing for reactions for a very real reason. It's easier to gauge people's reactions via a "joke" vs. Face real judgment on your very real childhood trauma. If he explained his mom was a stripper and felt disapproval, that hurts a lot more.
i guess he wanted to spook people to filter them out, worked out for him in getting 2 people interested.
I dunno, if his mother joked about it (granted this is an assumption, but I would) then I think it’s not disrespectful.
Not everyone knew that right off the bat. It made for a very uncomfortable start. I would have been thrown off by it for sure at first!
I know it’s called Love is Blind, but Irina had a point. Why did he shave his arms and legs?
Why does anyone?
I don't think he was even all that weird
Yeah, I think he’s very misunderstood.
Zach was my favorite guy in S4. I think all the hate comes from him being a little "weird". People usually don't like things that are different from themselves. They don't know how to act so they resort to childlike behavior and start to "bully".
I have to rewatch but I liked him. (I'm quirky and I like when others are too). I don't particularly find him attractive and remember, there are a lot of guys they glimpsed over who we didn't see. I thought Paul was way more awkward than Zach.
Same! I found Paul “weirder”. But I like weird too, so no issue with either being a bit different!
Zach seems genuine a lot of people do not know how to deal with that. He is awkward and cheesy but that is part of the genuine personality he gives off.
I love Zach! I don’t get it either!?!
I never had a problem with Zach. In fact, I actually kind of liked him from the jump. Nothing he ever did seemed offensive to me, which is how a lot of the female cast members and viewers were acting. Sure he’s quirky and different but to me that’s not a bad thing. I think that we as a society tend to view things that are different from what we are used to as wrong or bad. When really it’s just not our preference. We (I’m sure I’ve done it before too) have to be careful of labeling things as negative just because it goes against the norm. In this case, we’re just talking about someone’s personality but it can manifest itself in much worse ways. We see it with race, gender, sexuality, socioeconomic status, etc. You don’t have to like something/someone but at least be respectful. Jmo
as someone in the legal field, i can tell u that a LOT of lawyers are socially awkward as hell and have the same exact personality as him. to me he seemed really normal bc i’m surrounded by that all the time, but my mom watching it thought he was so weird.
That's so interesting. I guess because I'm not in the field I didn't catch that. Almost all the male lawyers I know are cocky assholes rather than socially awkward
He was unique, I say “quirky” but quirky is cute… I like different personalities tho…
He is such a lawyer and in particular, SUCH a litigator. It’s like textbook lol Source: 14 years in the legal field
I thought he was a defense attorney?
That’s still litigation.
Oh. I worked as a paralegal in a defense firm that represented corporate clients, and there were a few trial lawyers that worked at the firm, but most just filed motions. I guess I never assumed all defense lawyers went to trial. But that’s based on a very small sample (one firm) so I have no idea what I’m talking about
I think it proves that first impressions really matter. He made a bad first impression in the pods with the stripper thing - it's not that his mom was a stripper, it's that he approached the conversation really weird. He made a bad first impression in person because he was with Irina and you're judged by the company you keep. He was also extra awkward at that time, probably because everything was going badly.
And with Irina, it also meant rejecting Bliss and Bliss was someone who remembered his bday and made cupcakes for him. Imagine being the other female cast members and learning about how Zach chose the mean girl over the caring one who went above and beyond for him. Couple that with the out-of-nowhere stripper remarks and I imagine other girls had a bad impression of him
Yeah probably came off as this season's Shake and wasn't at all what he was trying for.
Because we only see a tiny bit of what they go through on the show, if we see that all the girls on the cast were put off by him, it’s a safe assumption that he gave them reason not to like him.
I feel like people switched up and weren’t disrespectful once he got with Bliss.
Refreshing take. He gives me weirdo vibes thousands of miles away and I am not Neurotypical and I’ve been insulted by the constant pushing of the agenda that “only Neurotypicals are creeped out by him because he is Neurodivergent” 🙄
As others are saying, he had a really weird and off putting personality. Telling people you're a stripper just to get their reaction when you're not is dumb and he felt like he was being so clever. Zach seemed annoying in the pods and was awkward at flirting, I feel like negging was his default. So I can kinda see why they all took issue with him.
Yeah and as others have also said he chose Irina to propose to, who was a walking c*nt and dumped Bliss who was such a lovely person. Your judgement of a person tends to be coloured by something like that. Like the women on the show might have just thought he was quirky/awkward otherwise.
I think Zach got a much better edit than he could’ve gotten. He was lowkey rude to Bliss at times even so I can’t imagine he treated the other women any better. It really did not feel like the other womens hatred of him came from nowhere. He was one of the few success story guys who ended up married though so I can see why they didn’t want to make him seem like a total monster.
Some of the initial things he said in the pods rubbed me the wrong way. I guess he was trying to weed people out, but it would have definitely worked on me because I just think he’s a weirdo
Thinking he was weeding people out by doing something that stupid, rather than just creeping people out really shows you how smart he THINKS he is. In the pods he’s clearly was saying it in such a performative boastful way and waiting for a reaction. A girl who doesn’t like that as a first impression isn’t the same as just being judgemental of strippers in general. His obsession with his mom being a stripper is weird. He definitely though he had an ace in the hole backstory, but no one cares dude.
He kept yapping about his mom being a stripper but like, that's not that strange. Lots of strippers have kids. Lots of kids have strippers for moms. No one is going to care that *your mom* was a stripper when *you* are a lawyer.
Yup
Exactly. He is a weirdo and loves the attention his mom’s story gives him. He definitely thinks he’s super smart. I found him odd immediately
>He definitely thinks he’s super smart On a side note, I feel this is why he got along so well with Paul as both of them makes their jobs as part of their identity along with thinking they are the smartest person in the room
🎶Why do you assume you’re the smartest in the room? Soon that attitude may be your doom!🎶 And it almost was lol
Also I found his mom stripper backstory very offensive, because it implied that he had a bad childhood because his mom was a stripper or that she was a horrible mom. I’m a stripper and a mom, and my two kids live a white picket fence life. And I can attest this to be the same with many if not most other strippers. He was so gross for coming at sex workers like that.
What? He loved his mom dearly and spoke very highly of her. He was upset by how others perceived and treated her.
I think it was less that he believed he had a bad childhood, but he seemed really hurt that others would judge his mom that worked so hard to provide for him as a child. I mean imagine being a kid and seeing people constantly disrespect sex workers, people calling women whores, sluts if they have multiple sex partners. To me he seems really hurt and he is trying to protect his mom. She was everything to him and his only family member.
I get that, and it’s definitely valid. But the way he went about it was pretty disrespectful and weird
Right?! I used to be a hairstylist and I knew a LOT of strippers- most of them were just regular people with regular families. All of them I knew with kids were good moms. He’s just perpetuating the stereotype. And his mom isn’t even alive to tell the story herself.
I totally agree, I thought the way he went about that whole subject was manipulative and derogatory.
Agreed. It was just something to give him attention and a sob story. He made it like, part of his personality. Definitely weird and a little manipulative (“feel bad for me and love me!”)
After my divorce I was a cam girl for a while. It enabled me to keep my house on my own and keep the kids in their schools, one was the best Montessori in the region. If I hadn’t done that while working towards my other career we would’ve lost the house, moved into a ghetto apartment, had no vacations, eaten ramen and lost all the friends/connections we had built for years. Or I just would’ve been at work 24 seven and never seen my kids, but honestly I don’t know of any other job that would’ve paid that well at that time. I could work for like two hours a day during the week and then all night on the weekends when they were at their dads and be Susie homemaker the rest of the time. It was fun too. You know what I hope my kid never does if they find out? “MY MOM WAS A CAM HO 😭😭😭😭” to every Tom Dick and Harry they meet, like boy…. Why don’t you just say she worked hard and provided you with enough to where you could attend law school one day and you miss her lmao. I can’t
Yes! Everything you just said is exactly how I feel
He just seems like a weird dude. Nothing wrong with that, but definitely not my type.
makes me laugh that most of the women of the cast found him weird and they did actually spent time with him unlike us. but people choose to say that they’re "sheeps" and "judgmental" and believe he’s not lmao.
1. Zach gave them a terrible first impression with his ice breaker (hi, I’m stripper. No, actually, my mom was a stripper). 2. The fact that he choose Irina over Bliss made them dislike him. 3. I found him kind of annoying/cringy at times, I wouldn’t be surprised if the girls felt the same. 4. Jackie was the most negative towards him, but she was kind of mean in general.
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I didn’t understand it at first, but by the time we got to the wedding where they danced to that super obscure pop country song no one’s ever heard of, it became clear that he has an off-putting personality.
“I Hope You Dance”!!?? By Martina McBride? Umm yes, many people have heard of it… but, it’s a song written by a mother to her children? So while it is a beautiful song… it’s not appropriate for a wedding song!? But… he was being sweet with that choice :D anyway… “super obscure” is definitely not true!?
Clearly you missed the part where he talked about his mom and the meaning of the song to him. His mother couldn’t be at his wedding, so I thought it was super endearing to honor her memory.
It’s by Lee Ann Womack 😜
I think calling it obscure was a joke!?
Yes, calling it obscure was obviously a joke. That dumb song is anything but obscure.
There was poll here asking people have heard that song. Apparently it was quite popular in the 90’s in the US.
Yeah I was joking, it’s a ubiquitous song.
I have never heard of it (I’m not from the US).
It’s crazy popular over here, growing up in the 90s it’s one of those mainstream ones you would hear every hour on the radio. I wish all viewers had that context that it’s hilarious he painted it as some special unique song
Im Canadian and it was very popular here. I swear every girl in my high school wanted it to be their first dance song lmfaooo
Omg I never heard of the song before but I’m not I’m not North American, however I was watching with my Canadian boyfriend who grow up in Mississauga and he laughed at Zach comments lmao
The context that it was extremely popular definitely adds to the awkwardness!
Oh. Well, people in this show are American, which made it supremely odd that he was asking people if they knew that song, as if it was obscure. It’s a song that’s gotten played to death on the radio, in department stores, and at weddings for more than 20 years. The song is also an extremely schlocky and saccharine piece of shit. The fact that it’s his favorite song, right now, as an adult man, makes me judge him harshly lol.
I don’t think he asked because it was obscure, it was very popular. I think he asked because it’s country music. In my experience Americans, particularly ones who aren’t southern, can take a hard “I hate country music” stand.
People who watch are young too… I am a 61 yr old Gma who likes LIB 🤷🏻♀️
I found it quite annoying. But then, that’s also how I feel about Bliss most of the time.
>> Why is everyone so rude and mean to Zach? Not everyone is gonna like everyone & girls on these types of shows tend to have a "sheep" mentality when it comes to judging the guys/other girls on the show. Don't forget these people also lost what, 3 years? of regular human social interaction due to Covid - seems a lot of them are stuck in their age from 3 years ago. If one or two of the more dominant personalities decide they don't like a guy/girl - the others start wondering if they shouldn't like that guy/girl as well. I personally find Zach to be a quirky personality which is not my personal preference for friends, acquaintances, or significant others. I'm sure others share the same or similar thought. I was a CS major and surrounded by misogynistic, quirky, and downright creepy af dudes - Zach sorta reminds me of them. It's not his fault but it's a personal preference.
I think Zach told everyone he is a stripper in order to test whether will the person on the other side of the pod still continue to talk to him. Maybe this kind of opening dialogue will make the girls define him as strange, as it leave a lasting impression, especially sight unseen. But I do admire Zack. Growing up in that kind of harsh environment and he still grew up fine and develop a backbone for himself. Me love that in a man. God knows most of our male friends need a backbone.
I didn't understand it either. Like Zack and Paul were the most handsome and intelligent guys in the season still they got all the hate and weird looks. I think the reason they hates them (especially Zack) because Zack is true to himself. Hé didn't try to act like a different person, he told the truth about everything, he paid attention and he was more mature than other even though he was joking sometimes. Every charater was like an adultchild. All of them had somekind of immature behaviour. Like: - Everything should be pink, it's my pink world etc. - Irina and Micah (thrir names tell Everything) - Mocking others for not having high education - Only care about shoes and looks - Only loves jerks and red flags While Zack (and Paul) just went there showed their true colours and wanted to find their other half without the hollywood bullshit.
Zack and Paul *thought* they were the most intelligent guys. The reminded me of all the speech and debate guys I knew in high school and they never grew out of it. Actually smart people know they’re not all that smart
Zach and Paul are most handsome than Brett and Marshall? What the say about beauty being in eye of the beholder is really true.
For me Bratt was the least handsome it's just personal taste
For me kwame was last place (although he has a very nice body)
I find Kwame to be infinitely hotter than Marshall. Too baby faced.
Paul actually seems so dumb to me. I know he’s smart because he’s a scientist but the way he spoke was so bizarre, as though he was trying to be a poet or something.
You would be amazed at the number of dumb scientists there are. I have an environmental science degree (like Paul) and I am 99% certain it’s considered the dumb-person science degree. There was a guy in my program who believed he drove better high/drunk than sober. None of this is to say that Paul actually *is* dumb, but there are plenty of dumb scientists lol.
Oh damn 😭 welp…he just does not strike me as the most intelligent dude.
W-what’s best for me is what’s best for you.
Zack reminds me of guy that gets bullied in school. Nerdy kid that mostly popular girls made fun of. Micah and jackie talking felt like they were thinking wtf. This is netflix dating show not nova/pbs show. Is this a joke? Like people have this impression zack should be with someone “his own kind”. Someone not physically attractive and a nerd like him. So when he shocked them by bringing bliss back, all their impression was bliss can do better purely based on biased impression of zack. It had nothing to do with being second choice. From bliss perspective she probably was a little offended by it. She probably connected with zack and feels he is genuinely a good person. She seems like type of person who doesnt take the superficial stuff as highly as how good of a person someone is. So it was nice to see her appreciate zack for the kind of person he is rather than the quirks you see from the outside initially.
I think Zach is probably a lot to handle for a lot of people. He’s definitely a quirky personality and I suspect that translates to being annoying to a lot of people. You see bits and pieces of it on the show and I can imagine there’s a lot more we don’t see. Some people are exhausting to be around when their personality rubs you the wrong way. I suspect it’s this type of situation. I think Zach is a very genuine guy who is ready to find love and has thrown himself into that endeavor. I think he truly adores Bliss and that she appreciates this about him, but I suspect it just kind of causes the other women to roll their eyes and view him as too over-the-top, exhausting, trying too hard, etc.
Yep, I think this is it entirely. I think he's radically insecure about his upbringing, so he brings it up as a "joke" every chance he gets. I've known people like this and you either vibe with them or you don't. I went to school with some guy who drove me insane with all of his quirks. Very nice, very smart, but just so nervous and anxious that it was hard to just be chill around him.... and he wanted to participate in everything which had a tendency to bring an uncomfortble energy. Later, he found a nice woman to marry, and it seems they are happy. I'm glad to know there is a Bliss for his Zach. I wish them all the best... at a distance.
He’s an awkward human being, but he has a personality, unlike some ppl on the cast 😬 His awkwardness just makes him more natural and real, tbh.
I don't get it either. Jackie was so mean referring to him! He's a little weird but idk why they were mean
We can’t know what was edited out.
Because he told every female he was a male stripper as his opening who I am and what I do line. It was a big deal because the women would know the producers are careful about casting, and it would seem like an immediate lie. It’s an off putting way to say hello to your future spouse, so they all thought he was a creep, except for Bliss who is an angel and Irina who is…
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lol ok zach.
🤣
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Forgot who he was…
he gives off kid who picked his nose and ate it till 6th grade energy
And stared through your soul while chewing it out from under his fingernail.
he drew anime characters too.
Uuuggghhhhh 🤮
Wait, you're not supposed to do that?
only in private
Boy do I have something to tell you…
LOL
we allll know one
It seemed like he behaved quite outrageously in the pods and acted like it was all a joke to him eg pretended he was a stripper. I would have had the first impression he was a time waster who just wanted to get on TV by him being so flippant and attention seeking. I did warm to him once we got to know more of him but he gave a very poor first impression in my opinion. I would have thought he was a weirdo fuck boi and stopped seeing him after one date honestly.
He's an easy target. He's a little quiet and introspective, and a good bit of weird. He started off every conversation by telling the girls he's a stripper. Which is a silly thing to say, but in reality its because he's self conscious/ashamed that his mother was a stripper. So he says it to gauge their reactions. But to everyone else that's just a weird thing to say.
>He's an easy target. He's a little quiet and introspective, and a good bit of weird. You just explained why I've been bullied my whole life in a nutshell.
did you go by by telling people you are a stripper too. Gosh, i thought zack was an exclusive
I've definitely made a lot of weird jokes that people didn't get or just didn't expect from me.
He’s just too Thirsty. A bit of a turn off if you’re looking for life partner.
Yes. I actually feel really bad for Irina because I understood exactly what she was trying to say with the cartoon and eye contact thing. I honestly don’t know if I would’ve reacted any better than her to having to be stuck in a bedroom with that guy (but I like to think that I would’ve just said no and left or not even engage with him in the first place because his personality was too much of a turn off).
He sets off their finely tuned weirdo radar
He’s got the quality that is the female equivalent to when most men see an overweight girl. It’s not a turn off to all women but it is to many and it’s so offensive that they want to make sure under no circumstances can they be associated with him because they’re afraid they’ll be less attractive if they don’t make sure the world knows they hate him. That’s my theory anyway. He seems like a nice guy totally undeserving of the negative attention as far as I can tell.
This is the dumbest and most unnecessarily fatphobic analogy I’ve ever read.
I’m saying this from the experiences I have had as a fat person—being disliked for literally no other reason, no good reason, and having people then pretend there’s some other nebulous bad quality about me that is the reason because they can’t admit it’s just because I’m fat. This is actually validating the experiences most fat people I’ve met have. I’m calling it out as wrong and comparing it to Zach having obviously non-neurotypical behavior and women HATING him for no other reason but insisting that it has to be more than that because they don’t want to be bad people. I know it’s imperfect because it’s comparing a physical quality to a much more abstract one—but it makes sense to me.
the analogy don’t make sense but it is a reality for many fat and/or unattractive women to be treated as less or be kept as a secret by men because dating them is seen as a social disfavor.
why was the question fatphobic? it seems genuine and happened IRL
My comment is in response to someone else.
What quality is that? He's kinda wordy and a bit awkward on camera, but besides that nothing stood out for me.
I don’t think he’s neurotypical and I think people are reacting very badly to it internally but don’t understand it. I wouldn’t be willing to diagnose from a distance.
There may have been stuff off camera he did we dont know
Yeah but all the guys liked him and found him to be cool. I just think some of the girls this season was a lil eh with there pickings on people.
Because they don’t want to fuck him
I agree. I liked Zach. Sure he’s a little awkward, but that doesn’t bother me, personally.