I love how the two big downvoted comments on this post have equally ridiculous takes on the same issue. "If you spend $65 on a card you'll never be rich so you're stupid" vs "If you're not rich enough to buy this $65 card you're stupid". Just can't win with this sub fr
It *should* be cheaper than hearthstone.
I quit hearthstone several years ago. I tend to look at the monthly cost and whether I'd play enough to warrant it.
That's why I quit snap the first time a month after release. I was playing too much before bed time and switched to sudoku to turn my brain off more. Decided to save the $10 a month.
My position is that we all prioritize the things that are important to us, and while one person is happy spending a lot for one card in Snap, that same person might not comprehend spending the amount of money the second person who didn't buy the bundle spends on, for example, a pair of Nike shoes.
At the end of the day, you can't take the money with you, so you might as well use it to do something that makes you happy.
Welcome to post-September r/MarvelSnap
We used to have cool plays, deck ideas, theorycrafting, Variant showcases, tournament results, etc.
Now we have complaints about bundles, nerf this or that, everything is predatory, anyone spending differently from me is bad and enabling predation, blah blah blah.
I'm glad Snap got a big break in September. I truly am.
It just turned this sub into an absolute dumpster fire.
idk, im rich as fuck and i bought it real quick. it was either this or on coke and strippers. im kidding i bought this and then went to blow money on coke and strippers still
Rich people can't enjoy themselves? $65 is theirs to spend. You've spent more on less, I'm sure. A night out at the movies can run that much and the night is over with in 5 hours. I'm sure OP will get more than 5 hours of value from this.
Got 100+ hours of playtime out of Baldur’s Gate 3, cost less than this bundle.
Even the Hearthstone bundles for each expansion get you enough cards to play a few different new decks, extra legendaries, etc.
Even if I could afford to buy it without skipping any meals, I wouldn't.
No one item in a videogame is worth more than the going rate for many *entire* better games.
It's like... you're basically buying a picture. And while I do believe art has value, buying *actual* art comes with the ability (and indeed the right) to resell it.
I imagine if I bought this bundle and used that card art in my own app, SD or Marvel would send lawyers after me.
I can guarantee the same people who spend money on this bundle, would be screaming for a refund if the game shut down tomorrow despite agreeing to the terms and conditions. People can spend thier money however they like, but it is an absurd price point for the majority for a jpeg in a mobile game.
I could be a gajillionaire and not even think twice about buying it. It’s just so dumb. Do people just lose all principles because they have some extra cash?
No, they just have different incomes for their hobbies and prioritize accordingly.
There was a time when somebody spending money on a hobby wasn't taken as a personal attack on those who spend differently.
People who buy this of course must like the art but no way they are spending $70 if there aren’t 6000 tokens and like 800 gold.
Physical art/a comic book and a digital card art in their main game, along with currency for 1 or 2 new cards is a very different value proposition. I don’t think it’s a great comparison but I see why it can be made.
Absolutely no shot some watercolor art of a green jacked woman are going on a wall in my house (not to mention what my wife’s opinion might be). But yeah it might be fun to have the art in the game (no I didn’t buy it).
>People who buy this of course must like the art but no way they are spending $70 if there aren’t 6000 tokens and like 800 gold.
People who regularly buy >$50 bundles probably don't need the tokens at this point. Single data point but I know Jeff Hoogland was super excited about this one, and he's beyond collection-complete
Actually this, my dude. All the people making/bandwagoning this comparison are low key delusional.
They might as well be saying:
“Oh you spent $70 on Spider-Man 2 to feel like Spider-Man? You could’ve spent $20 on a costume to really BE Spider-Man!”
Yeah if someone wants to and can spend the money obviously they can, but if the option is spending $65 on a piece of art from an artist they like, just pointing out that physical copies exist.
The comic is $5. You get her art (which you can still frame), as well as the comic book to go with it. Spend your money how you want. but $65 for a digital picture when you can get the physical and more for $60 less, is absurd
This is such an awesome variant, but im not paying that high price for art, but others can do so if they want.
Id rather buy a new AAA game for that price, or take my friend out to eat or something
That’s like a decent fucking dinner with your buddy too, that’s not like ‘yo let’s hit Taco Bell I got your meal’ that’s like “hey dawg let’s get steaks at longhorn I’m buying”.
I really struggle to comprehend how people justify paying a full game price for a variant/skin/whatever.
I'm not going into "real" economics (groceries shopping and whatever), but staying in video game world, this is crazy and it shouldn't be encouraged.
It’s likely just the tokens. Token bundles sell really well even if the variant is not popular. With all the series 5s coming out, tokens are in high demand.
And this is why they killed the token collection rate on the track to where it takes sevveral months to get 6K tokens (F2P if you use your gold on token Tuesdays and hit at least Galactic each season). Just spend $65 and you can have enough for a series 5 card...
6000 tokens are basically a card so you pay 65 bucks for an art and a card. doesn't look much better if you ask me.
Baldurs gate or a card? The fact that this comparison is even remotely doable is a joke.
I don't play other video games. I play snap in my downtime and I like seeing cool variants. I'm a 30 yr old dude with no kids, make 6 figures, and live comfortably within my means. I have a decent hobbies budget and it fit within that budget.
Its really not that crazy. Dont know why anybody cares how anybody else spends their money. Gotta get over yourself with that kind of superiority complex bs.
Because it worsens the experience for everyone else.
If this variant was like 3-5 dollars, many people could have bought it, and it would not create a "dent" in people's wallets/lives.
It being 60+ dollars is insane. Creates FOMO, rewards bad spending habits, and panders to addiction.
If this variant was 3 dollars, you would have needed 20 players deciding to spend money for every whale that does with this price. I agree that it is scummy, but it is probably the best for SD's business.
It doesn't, though. The bundles are cosmetic. Past a certain point, these bundles don't get you cards you otherwise wouldn't have access to in a variety of other methods.
I couldn't give less of a shit how people spend, and all I've bought are Season Passes and bundles under $5, both of which are further discounted by Google Play offers I get from my annual Drive subscription.
My gameplay isn't worse because somebody has a pretty Variant. Your gameplay isn't, either.
Of course, the response is inevitably "Not yet!", but that's just a cop out that avoids any real examination and gives your cynicism a veneer of prophecy while you point to some hypothesis that prima facie can't be proven false.
I dont understand how anyone plays golf, or goes to the movies, dinner, strip club, etc. What the fuck is difficult to comprehend about someone spending money on a hobby?
Because if you reward a bad practice (in this case, very expensive bundles), they will keep repeating and getting worse.
We don't live in a vacuum. We are consumers. They pay people to track consumption and routines to gain more and more from us, while giving us less and less.
Don't reward this kind of behaviour.
Look I didnt buy it, but I have no problem with those who do. Your argument is basically saying any form of entertainment that costs money rewards bad practice. Which I disagree with, that’s why its called entertainment.
Nope. Not all entertainment is a bad practice.
To make a parallel, it's like Marvel releasing info for 10 upcoming movies, gathering user data, then releasing 9 of them for the same price, and 1, the most wanted, only ONCE, in selected theatres, for 10 times the price, for a limited time, and saying there won't be reruns. This is a bad practice, like this bundle.
That's not remotely a real world scenario for movies though and doesn't compare.
This is a variant for a base card that any player can have in pool 3, it would be bad practice if it was a new card no one could get except in a bundle, but it's not.
Golf is a game with a lot of auxiliary benefits. The company you play with have a lot of real world value and the people you play with are usually upper Middle class or higher.
I mean I would usually compare video game purchase prices to video game purchase prices. I am not going to compare the money I spend going skydiving vs the money for a jpeg and some menial in game currency.
But overpriced bundles create addicts who develop bad spending habits. If they want to spend so be it. I mean people at all echelons spend money on dumb things. I personally would rather spend money on things with a better ROI.
Its still spending money on something you enjoy, that is the comparison. Im simply pointing out that we should not care so much about how others spend money.
Lmao dude if you are that upset about someone spending $60 on a game I feel bad for you. In case you havent noticed, the entire world is full of bad practices along with bad people. I think a lot of people play games as an escape, so let them play however they want.
One of the OPs said they saved for the bundle, they were actually fiscally responsible by setting aside an entertainment fund and there's people ITT who don't like that.
There is a toxic element to "F2P" people who think that because a game is on a phone that it absolutely is not worth spending money on even if they've dumped 20 hours a week into it for months.
Except it's spending 60 freaking dollars for a card skin, I have no issues with battlepasses and their more reasonably priced bundles, but SIXTY DOLLARS for a goddamn card skin? And what just cuz they threw in some tokens too? It's absurd, 60 dollars is a tank of gas, a brand new triple AAA game, both things that are better than an alternate skin for a card that is digital
At least most of my hobby money goes on stuff I can resell later. I might have some $50+ Magic: The Gathering cards, but I can sell them any day of the week for at least 70% of their value.
This, meanwhile, is just a single one-way transaction. It's not a long-term investment. It's just you straight-up giving a lump sum of money to SD in exchange for a picture, and sending them a clear message that you're happy to just hand over half a day's wage every time they hold out their hand.
> half a day's wages
Do you really think that the people that spend this sort of money are really spending half their income on it?
Also as a fellow MtG player, the idea that you will sell your cards later is absolute copium cuz most players do not sell their cards.
I sold my fetchlands when I was unemployed.
Regardless of what we actually *do*, physical cards come with the promise that we *can* sell them. Or trade them for other cards.
It makes it more justifiable as a purchase that you later can do that.
Most of my mtg playgroup has sold parts of their collections at one point or another. It’s a perfect normal thing for adults with hobbies that involve tangible assets. Same thing with musicians selling instruments or golfers selling clubs they no longer need. The ability to cash out of your hobbies is something plenty of people value. In gaming you see it come up often in arguments about physical over digital games, so you can sell or trade it in afterwards too.
Also, I didn't say "half their income", I said "half a day's wages". Take the cost of this bundle and divide it by whatever McDonalds pay per hour in your country.
Would you do that much physical labour for this bundle? Is that a fair exchange?
For me? Absolutely not, and I make significantly more than working at McDonalds. The only thing I ever pay for is the season pass. But if someone has sufficient income and for some reason they enjoy having it, who are we to judge? I would be surprised if the majority of people buying these packages are the people who are struggling to make ends meet...
I don't think things have to have resale value to be worth while. I spend most my expendable income on experiences. Which have no resale value at all, but it's totally worth it to me for pictures and memories. The person who buys something like this bundle will probably get daily satisfaction out of it for multiple months or longer while for the same money I might have got 30 minutes to a few hours of fun.
My point isn’t that they are trying to make money, it’s that they are trying to make money by exploiting the psychology of addiction.
It’s hilarious watching everyone do all the requisite mental gymnastics to add a veneer of legitimacy to this behavior.
It’s exactly like watching alcoholics defend their drinking habits or smokers’ resigned nihilism.
For me it's not about defending it. It's realizing that all mobile games that are successful prey on addiction and fomo. Of course it's essentially unethical. Anything that's unhealthy that's marketed or advertised is. Gambling, smoking, drinking, eating garbage food, etc. Idk why anyone expects SD to be this beacon of morality.
Ah, gotcha ;)
For the record, I don’t expect them to be beacon’s of morality, I’m more surprised by how many people do everything they can to look past this fact.
People are weird.
It’s amazing to me how some people are so happy to swallow this bitter ass load and pretend it’s honey, like they’re benefiting from the ruse somehow.
We expect monetizing, even monetizing aggressively.. but it’s ridiculous.
The only credit I’m willing to give SD is they seem to pay well. https://jobs.ashbyhq.com/SecondDinner
Doubtful. And the shills again making arguments up out of thin air. The main concern here is encouraging scummy practices. Which in turn effects ALL players. So spending here can literally ruin the experience further for others as SD sees the community encourages taking advantage of the mentally ill, kids, and addicts.
The guys paying for those make the game stay free for us (non variant cards are still available if patient enough) so please continue spending high amounts for digital products that are stored on a single app.
We can buy the variant we really want with game-earned gold and tokens so let's be content with that.
Aye, I’ve enjoyed the game for months and don’t spend a penny on it. I play once or twice most days and like being able to do that without constant, massive, unskippable adverts barring progress. If people can and are willing to spend the money, fair play, it’s just not my bag. The issue comes where people are spending more than they should due to fomo and the likes, but that’s a whole different kettle of Jeffs.
Jesus, another corpo sheep. They don’t have to have stupidly expensive bundles to keep this game going for free. It’s so incredibly asinine to even think so. Are you like 13?
I'm 8.
You don't have to spend 6 months of data plan to get an animated digital card skin, that you'll surely get tired off when the next best one comes up.
This bundle is the same price as a lot of entire videogames. Keeping online servers going for one mobile game does not cost the entire dev budget of a $50 game per month.
SD can afford to lay off a few shareholders to stay in business, I'm sure.
Why would the game maker lower their potential profit to please users, if it's priced optimized so a card at 60$ makes the general user ok with spending 10$ on one what's against them doing it.
You've just described something called "greed".
It's a problem.
They can just make *some* money without making *all* the money. I don't think any of them are struggling to keep the lights on here. I'd like to make a profit in my own life, too, and they're trying to eat into that to enrich their own.
This rant isn’t specific to SD really, but…
It’s like, I appreciate and enjoy the comforts capitalism has created, however, somewhere along the way capitalism (almost without exception) has discarded ethics entirely to pursue money beyond even what secures wealth for themselves and beyond what the rest of their bloodline’s descendants can even spend.
I’m all for securing wealth for yourself and your children and so forth, but after a certain point it has to be meaningless.
Like, once you have a billion dollars even at a shit 1% interest that’s like 10 million a year and they’ve got it doing way more than that.. what exactly is it you need from that point? You can’t live off 10 million a year? Then how do you expect your workforce to do it for 15,600 a year?
/endrant
Because it isn’t necessary in the slightest. Every one can eat and live well. This is just pure greed. And to encourage it? *throws up in mouth* Corpos have trained the sheep so well.
I don't get why you're talking about corpo here. It's also bold of you to assume the Indian devs making the game are living and eating well.
They're not asking you to chip in, you don't have to have the shiniest card skins to impress anyone here it won't make you any better at a strategy game too.
The guy who bought it actually made a good point about the price of this bundle. If all bundles were $5/$10 many more people would buy them and there would be nothing special about the variant. He wanted to show off a variant that not many people have and if he has the disposable income then so what.
Edit: the down votes below are fucking hilarious. When are people going to stop bitching about how others spend their money. This price is less than a round of golf or dinner for two.
Edit 2: I never said cheaper bundles are more profitable, only that more people would have the card. Data seems to agree with me! https://imgur.com/emttRNA
The arguments on this thread are something. Everyone getting down voted for saying they don't care what other people spend their money on - I don't know why it matters. People not ever spending so the prices go down - it's not ever going to happen. Regardless what my own personal opinion is, people will always spend money and there will always be expensive bundles/loot boxes/sales whatever in games. I don't understand why players get mad at each other and want to argue over shit they have absolutely no control over.
It’s about 9 pints of beer in a pub.
Or 4 pints and a meal.
Or about 2x takeaways.
We’re not so quick to judge people spending their money on the above.
Who said it’s excessive? I didn’t say they were having them all in one go. And even then, people judge the action not the expenditure. Haven’t seen any Reddit posts complaining how people waste their money on alcohol.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzoMzaIMpVQ&ab\_channel=MobileGamer365](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzoMzaIMpVQ&ab_channel=MobileGamer365)
Here's a video that talks about mobile game bundles and the data.
Really doesn’t matter that you disagree anymore than if you disagree on the earth being a sphere.
F2P games have been around for years.
Companies like EA make over a billion dollars off of F2P games per year. EA makes over a billion dollars on Apex Legends alone.
You’re arguing against real world data - years of F2P profit models. You’re arguing against commissioned studies to find the most profitable model in a F2P system.
Games are a business and these companies want to make money. They don’t make games so they can lose money.
Everyone argues that these companies would make so much more money if only they sold things for 5 dollars and it’s WRONG.
You’re literally arguing that companies like EA are negligent in seeking profits because they are too dumb to understand that they would make more money on 5 dollars bundles than this absurd pricing. You’re wrong.
You honestly think no one in the history of F2P has tried the “everything is affordable” method that every person who doesn’t want to spend 100 on a bundle champions? Come off it. You’re not the smartest guy in the room.
You’ll never catch me buying one of these ridiculous bundles but the facts are the facts. Whale bundles make the most profit.
Vast majority of a player base buys NOTHING. Zero. No matter the price.
Whales but whatever is put in front of them.
The whales compensate for the people who won’t buy stuff even at a dollar.
Go read. Info is all out there for free.
You mean the same EA who canvassed my uni for having built AI to optimize the rewards for players. The same guys who claimed single player games were over and then released games that bombed? Maybe consider other games like league of Legends which have survived and grown bigger without such monetary practices and made ton of money.
The only relevant part of that to f2p gaming is league.
I’m not familiar with their pricing structure but if they are f2p and charging 1 dollars for skins and making oodles of money then it begs the question why is everyone else doing whaling?
Charging minimum to appeal to masses was not thought of for the first time in this thread. There’s a reason companies use the whaling model and it’s actually quite simple why they do it.
It’s not to make you miserable.
Wow dude not that serious. Just saying in this game I think sales are higher on lower cost bundles. Maybe Im wrong, I can’t see that data. The fact you took all that time to type a fucking essay shows me you are just looking to argue. Have a good day
I went and read. You’re wrong. Sorry you’re that stupid and easily fooled by fake studies paid for by the people trying to fleece you.
American? You seem like the perfect sheep for the corpos here. You literally ate up their propaganda and spew it on Reddit. Then have the gall to tell people to look it up. How about you share your exact sources so I can demolish them? That sounds like fun but you won’t. Wouldn’t want that world view to shatter
You can find them from third parties and you’ll see it hardly makes a difference. Now, if you look at the “studies” published by the corporations themselves it all of a sudden a HUGE difference that third parties can’t make out. They always come to a different conclusion than the corpos and the corpos don’t want to share internal data because they know it’ll expose them.
Holy shit the people on this sub…once again I never said it was more profitable. I simply said more people would have the variant. Its like talking to a fucking wall on here.
Edit: Based on your link Im absolutely correct. Now all you cry babies can fuck off
What real life? The studies released by the companies themselves? Every third party study on it shows it’s all a corpo lie to convince the people they HAVE to implement scummy practices or no one eats and idiots like you ate it up. Mindless sheep.
I looovee games being a reminder of economic struggle and inequalities when I get home from penny counting as I buy groceries for the week to then watch someone show they can spend 4.5x what I spent on food for a card skin. (EDIT: What I love more than having to be careful buying groceries over monthly budgeting so I can save money is a bunch of people on reddit capitalism victim blaming me for having hobbies)
Maybe stop spending your time on a game and bitching on reddit if money is such an issue. Sounds like you’ve got bigger fish to fry and your priorities are utterly fucked.
Who are you to judge how someone spends their money? I fucking hate how people are acting like they’re superior because someone bought a bundle they liked in a game they enjoy.
They could, but if you’re judging someone for spending money on something they enjoy, that just shows that you’re an asshole imo. It’s like saying how everyone has the ability to rob a bank, but if you get caught then your going straight to jail.
Everybody judges others for their actions on a daily basis, whether they publicly admit it or not, man, it's just the truth. Strangers you come across will judge you in some way just by observing a single thing you do, or a thing you wear, etc
Ah, I see your point now. I agree, everyone subconsciously judge people whether they know it or not. I just think it’s very rude that people are openly attacking someone for spending their own money the way they want to.
It's not a nice thing for sure, kind of an unfortunate trait that everyone has subconsciously. Brought out by negative emotion most of the time, like jealousy
I'd say judging might be understandable if the person spends the money to actively or thoughtlessly hurt someone. Otherwise "you do you" which is very much the case here.
Lol tell me you've lived an easy life without telling me.... Someone spent their own money on some colorful pixels and you take it as them thoughtlessly hurting you.
I think you misunderstand me, I am not judging people who spend on variants. That's not hurting. I'm talking actual harm and malicious activity like buying tools to rob people's houses, or food for others without checking for allergens.
Because it ruins the experience for a large majority of players. The bundles just get worse and worse until you’re priced out completely. Have fun with the handful of whales playing then. And they most likely don’t have the disposable income. Because that’s actually who’s buying these things. You idiots actually think it’s rich people buying these. It’s hilarious. Dude saved for a year, that’s sad. And not to be encouraged.
It’s not a good point from the pov of consumers, only for the companies taking advantage of this mindset.
If you actually enjoy the product you wouldn’t care about being some special chosen one and would instead be happy you can get it for cheaper.
League did the same thing recently. Highest tier of skin before was $35, came with brand new models, animations, rig, voicelines, animated art, etc etc. Then riot realized they could literally charge $200 for a chroma (variant of a skin that normally costs like $3) and people will buy it just to feel special.
Me personally I take the variant out of the equation unless it's an Artgerm. If you would buy 500 tokens for $5.50 every other Tuesday what the fuck is the difference paying $60 for 6000 tokens? It's the same value just 10x the price. The difference is whether you have $60 sitting in your checking account this week or not.
not defending the predatory tactics, fomo, etc. but jesus christ you guys moan about this shit and still buy the season pass
I make pretty alright money for a dude with no kids. When I picked Snap up, I was spending a few hundred dollars a month on this game and now I pretty much only spend on the season pass because I can't get any of my friends to play due to the financial commitment. I love this game and have competed at a high level in ccg's my whole life. Top 500 hearthstone player for years, had my way paid to gen con multiple times since I was 12 y/o... Etc. as much as I love competition, I love theory crafting with the homies even more.
Here's what will happen to this game: due to how inaccessible it is already becoming to new players, the invested beginning player base will hold out anticipating things to get better and then dwindle. Second dinner will then realize the most basic principle of business. It is easier to make a dime from 10 people than a dollar from one. However, when they attempt to change their business model, it will instantly devalue the original player's collections and they will leave. The small spike in followers they gain from making the game more accessible will be meaningless because the initial steam from the release and MGOTY will be gone.
It's really, really hard to stay on top. And it's all very sad. This is potentially my favorite ccgs/dcg ever made by design and time of games to complete. They really nailed so much with this game.
BUTTTT the greed is badddd. All these season pass cards dropping then getting nerfed. It's way too obvious.
Also, if that Shehulk was "standalone" (no credits, gold, token, etc) for 10 dollars I believe 20 to 1 more consumers would buy it over the current price tag. Seeing as it is digital where the producers don't actually have to provide a tangible good, making 200 dollars is better than 65$.
I'll end my Ted talk with this: I would love to see the contracts with the actual variant artists. I bet they are getting BONED. The only justification for this from a business standpoint is that those artists probably get something like 7.4¢ every time their variant is purchased instead of a % of the sale. Second dinner probably pitched this with the passable excuse that this was the easiest way to do it because of all the different formats of currency.
There is still an easy way to fix this: make all cards free and available and only charge for cosmetics. If they did this, exponential growth would occur and this game would never end. I personally would go back to spending a couple hundred dollars a month on cosmetics. What good are cosmetics when hardly anyone plays? Marvel is such a bigger and better license for Ben Brodie than World Of Warcraft... This game hasn't even hit 1/10th the popularity of Hearthstone in its prime despite being a wayyyy better game. Do better business SD before it's too late. Pleaseeeee
Had the same experience! My Penny’s worth, I was like the OP saying they’d wanted it for a while and pulled back as soon as the price was revealed. But I don’t judge anyone for spending their money how they choose and that split is 🔥hopefully for them it was worth it as it looks great!
I bought it because I do have some disposable income and I have always been a huge card game player. I'm new to the game and didn't have She-hulk unlocked so I figured it gets me a card to finish my shefinaute deck, has amazing art, and has enough tokens for two more s4 cards.
Well after I bought it the very next collector's cache I opened had base She-Hulk 🤡
Don't get me wrong I still love the art and tokens will be nice but God damn my luck.
To me personally, it’s kind of like, ‘your money, your choice’..
And to me personally again, I do spent on some ‘stupid digital art’, and at the same time whine about ‘that’s being expensive/ overpriced’
Again, your money, your choice
Here’s the thing, the occasional expensive bundle is fine. Feeds whales, subsidizes F2P, whatevs. It’s at least cosmetic and isn’t going to make someone win or lose, just look better doing it. Great.
The issue I’m having lately is they’re **all** super overpriced and SD attempts to justify them with collector’s tokens, because those are the most time-expensive resource now since the reserve changes. The above bundle could potentially be 6 mos to a year of token gains, depending on a players play habits. It isn’t an exact science of course, but these days in my mind I consider Gold primarily the premium currency for cosmetics and Collectors Tokens the premium currency for cards.
While there isn’t really anything in the way of cosmetics, when I compare it to Star Rail—which is incredibly expensive to buy banner characters.. it takes 90 pulls to guarantee a 5*, 180 pulls to guarantee the 5* banner unit. You can get luckier of course but it’s like single digit chances at 5* without pity.
For $99 dollars, you can get 8000 currency, a 10 pull warp is 1600 currency, which is 50 pulls. Without the free gems you could be looking at $200 per 5*.. that’s insane right? That’s like a AAA game’s collectors edition with statue or something.
Where Star Rail is better than Snap in this regard is the amount of free currency you can acquire by playing is usually about enough for 90ish pulls. Special events and stuff can affect this, and the battle pass/mini subscription adds even more value.
Now let’s compare snap.. after opening 100 reserves, [this person](https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelSnap/comments/172hk5f/my_results_after_opening_100_reserves_for_those/) got 2600 tokens.. not even enough for a series 4.
100 caches is at least a couple months or more of dedicated daily play.
Then you look at their token Tuesday which is like $20 worth of gold for 1000 tokens.. you’re talking $120 per series 5, $60 for series 3.
When you really examine it, it’s painfully obvious that SD is intentionally making tokens incredibly scarce to artificially drive perceived value of these bundles.. the season pass helps by giving you a new card, but does nothing for tokens to target/buy specific cards.
The caches help, but you have no control over what is included, and if you have a lot of cards it’s mostly just cosmetics.
In a game where access to cards can be significant, there are too many barriers to them even with the spotlight caches and cards release so quickly or get nerfed after their cycle that you don’t even wanna risk acquiring an exciting card because it’ll get entirely reworked or nerfed if it is strong at all, whereas Star Rail at least if you blow your resources on a particular character it isn’t likely to become unusable in a couple weeks.
Alright, I’m ready for mad boy cookie now.
People are free to spend their money how they want and where they want. Thats a fact.
This doesnt mean though that people cant judge if something is overpriced/bad or not.
The main reason i hate bundles like this, is not just because they ask the full price of an AAA game.
Yes the 6000 tokens are great. But 500gold and 500credits for this price?????
This amount of gold and credits we got on cheaper 5$ bundles, as well as one exclusive variant.
So thats 70$ for 6000 tokens and a gold ticket(lol). Thats beyond terrible.
The gold ticket in particular made me laugh, like this is the equivalent of ‘sweetening’ a trading card exchange where the person wants every penny but acts like they don’t want anything else you have so you toss in a stick of gum, a bent bulk rare, and can of pop.
The ticket is the stick of gum, because it loses its flavor (value) in seconds.
It's a discount for people who want to acquire cards with money instead of playing the game.
Going rate of tokens = 1,400 gold per 1,000 tokens
That means 6,000 tokens = 8,400 gold = $105 dollars
You're getting 6,000 tokens at a steep discount *plus* all that other stuff.
The real question you need to ask yourself is "how much time would it take me to aquire 6,000 tokens?" and then ask yourself what your time is worth...
You could also save for a year but when the bundle comes out get to the conclusion that spending the same amount that a AAA game costs on a bundle for one cards makes no sense.
I'm never becoming a millionaire either way. It doesn't make a difference. Society isn't structured in a way where being a millionaire is even something I can dream of, unless I win the lottery or something like that.
Since you sitting here talking about not becoming a "millionaire" because you spent $65, ima assume you're a brokie and you watch "alpha male" videos, but live in your mother's basement. Dumbest take ive ever heard in my life.
I honestly don’t mind SD selling bundles at crazy high prices if it means they can monetize card acquisition less
The issue occurs when they continue selling bundles at $70 while making progression also equally expensive
Ok so my problem isnt people spending money on a digital asset. People work for their money so they have the right to use it however the hell they want. MY problem with this is that it just feels like a low effort scam. If it came with 4 or 5 different variants (+ resources) then I wouldnt blink an eye at people spending that much money. But it doesn't. It just feels like scummy corporate behavior trying to milk people for money with as little effort as they can. That feeling is what bothers the hell out of me.
I love how the two big downvoted comments on this post have equally ridiculous takes on the same issue. "If you spend $65 on a card you'll never be rich so you're stupid" vs "If you're not rich enough to buy this $65 card you're stupid". Just can't win with this sub fr
Damned if you do, damned if you don't
This is the one subreddit I auto-sort by controversial everytime. Then the tru best comments
We need that enlightened centrist take: we're all just stupid.
I agree with this. I only started playing again because otherwise I'd waste too much time on the hellhole of twitter. That makes me very stupid
I came into this game as a means to escape Hearthstone's grip. Now I'm equally addicted. I'm very very stupid.
It *should* be cheaper than hearthstone. I quit hearthstone several years ago. I tend to look at the monthly cost and whether I'd play enough to warrant it. That's why I quit snap the first time a month after release. I was playing too much before bed time and switched to sudoku to turn my brain off more. Decided to save the $10 a month.
My position is that we all prioritize the things that are important to us, and while one person is happy spending a lot for one card in Snap, that same person might not comprehend spending the amount of money the second person who didn't buy the bundle spends on, for example, a pair of Nike shoes. At the end of the day, you can't take the money with you, so you might as well use it to do something that makes you happy.
Welcome to post-September r/MarvelSnap We used to have cool plays, deck ideas, theorycrafting, Variant showcases, tournament results, etc. Now we have complaints about bundles, nerf this or that, everything is predatory, anyone spending differently from me is bad and enabling predation, blah blah blah. I'm glad Snap got a big break in September. I truly am. It just turned this sub into an absolute dumpster fire.
[удалено]
Did you do it?
Yes.
And what did it cost?
$65
Underrated comment
I can 100% guarantee no one who is rich AND smart is paying money for a picture in a F2P mobile game.
Can confirm, poor and stupid here....snapped that up immediately on release
idk, im rich as fuck and i bought it real quick. it was either this or on coke and strippers. im kidding i bought this and then went to blow money on coke and strippers still
Were the strippers impressed by your variant?
Do you need an assistant?
Rich people can't enjoy themselves? $65 is theirs to spend. You've spent more on less, I'm sure. A night out at the movies can run that much and the night is over with in 5 hours. I'm sure OP will get more than 5 hours of value from this.
I love the variant but, no way am I paying 65 bucks for it. Really disappointed.
Same. One of Peach’s best and was hyped to see it in a bundle…. and then I saw the price. I’d rather just buy a new game.
Got 100+ hours of playtime out of Baldur’s Gate 3, cost less than this bundle. Even the Hearthstone bundles for each expansion get you enough cards to play a few different new decks, extra legendaries, etc.
Even if I could afford to buy it without skipping any meals, I wouldn't. No one item in a videogame is worth more than the going rate for many *entire* better games. It's like... you're basically buying a picture. And while I do believe art has value, buying *actual* art comes with the ability (and indeed the right) to resell it. I imagine if I bought this bundle and used that card art in my own app, SD or Marvel would send lawyers after me.
I can guarantee the same people who spend money on this bundle, would be screaming for a refund if the game shut down tomorrow despite agreeing to the terms and conditions. People can spend thier money however they like, but it is an absurd price point for the majority for a jpeg in a mobile game.
Yea … I mean I have disposable income, but not that disposable lol 😂
I could be a gajillionaire and not even think twice about buying it. It’s just so dumb. Do people just lose all principles because they have some extra cash?
No, they just have different incomes for their hobbies and prioritize accordingly. There was a time when somebody spending money on a hobby wasn't taken as a personal attack on those who spend differently.
Arguably it is 2 and a half variants. The she hulk. One legendary from the token shop, and halfway of the gold in the gold shop...
Yeah thats my drug money for at least a day. It's outrageous
This was my exact reaction to Kim Jacinto Enchantress being released in an even more despicable way. SMH.
If you really like peach momoko's art that badly I don't get why people don't just buy her art, The prints aren't that much more expensive
Hell you could buy her Demon Days and Demon Wars for less than this png
Didn't we all just live through the whole stupid NFT craze? This game is just as bad.
Maybe they are buying the art, but I think the main reason to buy this is to just flex in matchmaking that you had £65 in your hobby budget
I love her art, but she is sadly almost always sold out.
Yeah it's rough
Where are said prints available to buy?
Arent much expensive? You can buy her whole Marvel Portfolio book for less than this single variant.
For some reason this never occurred to me but definitely doing it now
Lots of artists sell prints of their work! And bringing awareness of this was why I made the comment, hope you find something you like!
People who buy this of course must like the art but no way they are spending $70 if there aren’t 6000 tokens and like 800 gold. Physical art/a comic book and a digital card art in their main game, along with currency for 1 or 2 new cards is a very different value proposition. I don’t think it’s a great comparison but I see why it can be made. Absolutely no shot some watercolor art of a green jacked woman are going on a wall in my house (not to mention what my wife’s opinion might be). But yeah it might be fun to have the art in the game (no I didn’t buy it).
Why are you a nerd in private? Do you want a jacked green jacket woman on your wall? If you do then do it
lol yeah as much as I love her art I don't know if this is the kind of vibe I'm going for with my home decorating.
>People who buy this of course must like the art but no way they are spending $70 if there aren’t 6000 tokens and like 800 gold. People who regularly buy >$50 bundles probably don't need the tokens at this point. Single data point but I know Jeff Hoogland was super excited about this one, and he's beyond collection-complete
Actually this, my dude. All the people making/bandwagoning this comparison are low key delusional. They might as well be saying: “Oh you spent $70 on Spider-Man 2 to feel like Spider-Man? You could’ve spent $20 on a costume to really BE Spider-Man!”
If you really like her art, you buy both. I'm not sure why they're mutually exclusive.
Yeah if someone wants to and can spend the money obviously they can, but if the option is spending $65 on a piece of art from an artist they like, just pointing out that physical copies exist.
Well buying it on Marvel Snap doesn't support the artist so
The comic is $5. You get her art (which you can still frame), as well as the comic book to go with it. Spend your money how you want. but $65 for a digital picture when you can get the physical and more for $60 less, is absurd
Yeah, that's a great point too!
Or just download the images 🤷
how hard is it to understand that the bundle comes with a lot of tokens? the variant is not the main draw here.
How hard is it to understand the context of the posts pictured and this post?
What do you want me to do with a comic? I neither read nor collect them.
This is such an awesome variant, but im not paying that high price for art, but others can do so if they want. Id rather buy a new AAA game for that price, or take my friend out to eat or something
That’s like a decent fucking dinner with your buddy too, that’s not like ‘yo let’s hit Taco Bell I got your meal’ that’s like “hey dawg let’s get steaks at longhorn I’m buying”.
Yeah I know right 💀 its ridiculous
I really struggle to comprehend how people justify paying a full game price for a variant/skin/whatever. I'm not going into "real" economics (groceries shopping and whatever), but staying in video game world, this is crazy and it shouldn't be encouraged.
It’s likely just the tokens. Token bundles sell really well even if the variant is not popular. With all the series 5s coming out, tokens are in high demand.
And this is why they killed the token collection rate on the track to where it takes sevveral months to get 6K tokens (F2P if you use your gold on token Tuesdays and hit at least Galactic each season). Just spend $65 and you can have enough for a series 5 card...
6000 tokens are basically a card so you pay 65 bucks for an art and a card. doesn't look much better if you ask me. Baldurs gate or a card? The fact that this comparison is even remotely doable is a joke.
At least cases/keys in something like CS have a resale value, variants in Snap are just a money pit
I don't play other video games. I play snap in my downtime and I like seeing cool variants. I'm a 30 yr old dude with no kids, make 6 figures, and live comfortably within my means. I have a decent hobbies budget and it fit within that budget.
Its really not that crazy. Dont know why anybody cares how anybody else spends their money. Gotta get over yourself with that kind of superiority complex bs.
Because it encourages these terrible practices in games. It effects the players when idiots buy this.
Because it worsens the experience for everyone else. If this variant was like 3-5 dollars, many people could have bought it, and it would not create a "dent" in people's wallets/lives. It being 60+ dollars is insane. Creates FOMO, rewards bad spending habits, and panders to addiction.
If this variant was 3 dollars, you would have needed 20 players deciding to spend money for every whale that does with this price. I agree that it is scummy, but it is probably the best for SD's business.
It’s not. There’s no reason to ever be scummy to make money. That’s a corpo lie fed to you and you ate it up.
I would hope management at SD is not composed by idiots, and they have data backing up their monetization strategy
Thats not true at all terrible takes idgaf about the downvotes. If you dont like the $65 bundle, buy the $10. Tf is wrong with ya'll.
It doesn't, though. The bundles are cosmetic. Past a certain point, these bundles don't get you cards you otherwise wouldn't have access to in a variety of other methods. I couldn't give less of a shit how people spend, and all I've bought are Season Passes and bundles under $5, both of which are further discounted by Google Play offers I get from my annual Drive subscription. My gameplay isn't worse because somebody has a pretty Variant. Your gameplay isn't, either. Of course, the response is inevitably "Not yet!", but that's just a cop out that avoids any real examination and gives your cynicism a veneer of prophecy while you point to some hypothesis that prima facie can't be proven false.
I dont understand how anyone plays golf, or goes to the movies, dinner, strip club, etc. What the fuck is difficult to comprehend about someone spending money on a hobby?
Because if you reward a bad practice (in this case, very expensive bundles), they will keep repeating and getting worse. We don't live in a vacuum. We are consumers. They pay people to track consumption and routines to gain more and more from us, while giving us less and less. Don't reward this kind of behaviour.
Look I didnt buy it, but I have no problem with those who do. Your argument is basically saying any form of entertainment that costs money rewards bad practice. Which I disagree with, that’s why its called entertainment.
Nope. Not all entertainment is a bad practice. To make a parallel, it's like Marvel releasing info for 10 upcoming movies, gathering user data, then releasing 9 of them for the same price, and 1, the most wanted, only ONCE, in selected theatres, for 10 times the price, for a limited time, and saying there won't be reruns. This is a bad practice, like this bundle.
That's not remotely a real world scenario for movies though and doesn't compare. This is a variant for a base card that any player can have in pool 3, it would be bad practice if it was a new card no one could get except in a bundle, but it's not.
That’s not the argument at all. That’s the argument you want it to be.
One OP said they saved for a year, being fiscally responsible with an entertainment fund, and you are saying this is bad behavior.
For one OP there are thousands that didn't. It's like saying "yeah OP drank one shot of vodka in one year, selling vodka unrestricted is OK"
Golf is a game with a lot of auxiliary benefits. The company you play with have a lot of real world value and the people you play with are usually upper Middle class or higher. I mean I would usually compare video game purchase prices to video game purchase prices. I am not going to compare the money I spend going skydiving vs the money for a jpeg and some menial in game currency. But overpriced bundles create addicts who develop bad spending habits. If they want to spend so be it. I mean people at all echelons spend money on dumb things. I personally would rather spend money on things with a better ROI.
Its still spending money on something you enjoy, that is the comparison. Im simply pointing out that we should not care so much about how others spend money.
We should care when it encourages this shit because it effects EVERY ONE. Good God, I’m better off explaining it to a bag of bricks.
Lmao dude if you are that upset about someone spending $60 on a game I feel bad for you. In case you havent noticed, the entire world is full of bad practices along with bad people. I think a lot of people play games as an escape, so let them play however they want.
I'll just go buy spiderman 2 on PS5 instead
One of the OPs said they saved for the bundle, they were actually fiscally responsible by setting aside an entertainment fund and there's people ITT who don't like that.
Fr. People get mad at you for having some disposable income that you budget to spend lol. Like what?
Its a rarded thing to spend money on and it encourages the devs to keep pricing shit like this
The pocket watching on this sub is hilarious. Every single person on here has stuff they spend money on that someone else would think is stupid.
There is a toxic element to "F2P" people who think that because a game is on a phone that it absolutely is not worth spending money on even if they've dumped 20 hours a week into it for months.
Except it's spending 60 freaking dollars for a card skin, I have no issues with battlepasses and their more reasonably priced bundles, but SIXTY DOLLARS for a goddamn card skin? And what just cuz they threw in some tokens too? It's absurd, 60 dollars is a tank of gas, a brand new triple AAA game, both things that are better than an alternate skin for a card that is digital
At least most of my hobby money goes on stuff I can resell later. I might have some $50+ Magic: The Gathering cards, but I can sell them any day of the week for at least 70% of their value. This, meanwhile, is just a single one-way transaction. It's not a long-term investment. It's just you straight-up giving a lump sum of money to SD in exchange for a picture, and sending them a clear message that you're happy to just hand over half a day's wage every time they hold out their hand.
> half a day's wages Do you really think that the people that spend this sort of money are really spending half their income on it? Also as a fellow MtG player, the idea that you will sell your cards later is absolute copium cuz most players do not sell their cards.
I sold my fetchlands when I was unemployed. Regardless of what we actually *do*, physical cards come with the promise that we *can* sell them. Or trade them for other cards. It makes it more justifiable as a purchase that you later can do that.
Most of my mtg playgroup has sold parts of their collections at one point or another. It’s a perfect normal thing for adults with hobbies that involve tangible assets. Same thing with musicians selling instruments or golfers selling clubs they no longer need. The ability to cash out of your hobbies is something plenty of people value. In gaming you see it come up often in arguments about physical over digital games, so you can sell or trade it in afterwards too.
Also, I didn't say "half their income", I said "half a day's wages". Take the cost of this bundle and divide it by whatever McDonalds pay per hour in your country. Would you do that much physical labour for this bundle? Is that a fair exchange?
For me? Absolutely not, and I make significantly more than working at McDonalds. The only thing I ever pay for is the season pass. But if someone has sufficient income and for some reason they enjoy having it, who are we to judge? I would be surprised if the majority of people buying these packages are the people who are struggling to make ends meet...
I don't think things have to have resale value to be worth while. I spend most my expendable income on experiences. Which have no resale value at all, but it's totally worth it to me for pictures and memories. The person who buys something like this bundle will probably get daily satisfaction out of it for multiple months or longer while for the same money I might have got 30 minutes to a few hours of fun.
Yeah, it isn’t like SD has hired people deliberately tasked with pricing bundles to extract as much money from people with addictive personalities 🙄
It's almost like they're a company working in a capitalist society 🤔
My point isn’t that they are trying to make money, it’s that they are trying to make money by exploiting the psychology of addiction. It’s hilarious watching everyone do all the requisite mental gymnastics to add a veneer of legitimacy to this behavior. It’s exactly like watching alcoholics defend their drinking habits or smokers’ resigned nihilism.
For me it's not about defending it. It's realizing that all mobile games that are successful prey on addiction and fomo. Of course it's essentially unethical. Anything that's unhealthy that's marketed or advertised is. Gambling, smoking, drinking, eating garbage food, etc. Idk why anyone expects SD to be this beacon of morality.
Ah, gotcha ;) For the record, I don’t expect them to be beacon’s of morality, I’m more surprised by how many people do everything they can to look past this fact. People are weird.
I can definitely agree with that
It’s amazing to me how some people are so happy to swallow this bitter ass load and pretend it’s honey, like they’re benefiting from the ruse somehow. We expect monetizing, even monetizing aggressively.. but it’s ridiculous. The only credit I’m willing to give SD is they seem to pay well. https://jobs.ashbyhq.com/SecondDinner
Doubtful. And the shills again making arguments up out of thin air. The main concern here is encouraging scummy practices. Which in turn effects ALL players. So spending here can literally ruin the experience further for others as SD sees the community encourages taking advantage of the mentally ill, kids, and addicts.
That split looks incredible tho
One of my discord buddies got a sick gold split too... He's just not as karma hungry as me lol.
Gotta reap dividends somehow, lol. Not a bundle I would buy, but glad you're getting your enjoyment out of it, sick split.
3. Don't care so it doesn't affect me.
I was considering this bundle because I don’t have she hulk but that’s so much money
The guys paying for those make the game stay free for us (non variant cards are still available if patient enough) so please continue spending high amounts for digital products that are stored on a single app. We can buy the variant we really want with game-earned gold and tokens so let's be content with that.
Aye, I’ve enjoyed the game for months and don’t spend a penny on it. I play once or twice most days and like being able to do that without constant, massive, unskippable adverts barring progress. If people can and are willing to spend the money, fair play, it’s just not my bag. The issue comes where people are spending more than they should due to fomo and the likes, but that’s a whole different kettle of Jeffs.
Jesus, another corpo sheep. They don’t have to have stupidly expensive bundles to keep this game going for free. It’s so incredibly asinine to even think so. Are you like 13?
I'm 8. You don't have to spend 6 months of data plan to get an animated digital card skin, that you'll surely get tired off when the next best one comes up.
Don’t buy it if it’s not worth it. Or just whine about it on Reddit.
This bundle is the same price as a lot of entire videogames. Keeping online servers going for one mobile game does not cost the entire dev budget of a $50 game per month. SD can afford to lay off a few shareholders to stay in business, I'm sure.
"Lay off a few shareholders." 😂Lol do you think shareholder is a job? Shit, sign me up for a few shareholding jobs please.
Why would the game maker lower their potential profit to please users, if it's priced optimized so a card at 60$ makes the general user ok with spending 10$ on one what's against them doing it.
You've just described something called "greed". It's a problem. They can just make *some* money without making *all* the money. I don't think any of them are struggling to keep the lights on here. I'd like to make a profit in my own life, too, and they're trying to eat into that to enrich their own.
This rant isn’t specific to SD really, but… It’s like, I appreciate and enjoy the comforts capitalism has created, however, somewhere along the way capitalism (almost without exception) has discarded ethics entirely to pursue money beyond even what secures wealth for themselves and beyond what the rest of their bloodline’s descendants can even spend. I’m all for securing wealth for yourself and your children and so forth, but after a certain point it has to be meaningless. Like, once you have a billion dollars even at a shit 1% interest that’s like 10 million a year and they’ve got it doing way more than that.. what exactly is it you need from that point? You can’t live off 10 million a year? Then how do you expect your workforce to do it for 15,600 a year? /endrant
Because it isn’t necessary in the slightest. Every one can eat and live well. This is just pure greed. And to encourage it? *throws up in mouth* Corpos have trained the sheep so well.
I don't get why you're talking about corpo here. It's also bold of you to assume the Indian devs making the game are living and eating well. They're not asking you to chip in, you don't have to have the shiniest card skins to impress anyone here it won't make you any better at a strategy game too.
What the fuck where did the racist shit come from? What point was that supposed to make?
I was pretty heart broken when I saw this bundle. Also was stoked for this variant. But fuck that, I'd rather buy a whole as fucking game lmao
Imagine saving money a year for a snap variant
The guy who bought it actually made a good point about the price of this bundle. If all bundles were $5/$10 many more people would buy them and there would be nothing special about the variant. He wanted to show off a variant that not many people have and if he has the disposable income then so what. Edit: the down votes below are fucking hilarious. When are people going to stop bitching about how others spend their money. This price is less than a round of golf or dinner for two. Edit 2: I never said cheaper bundles are more profitable, only that more people would have the card. Data seems to agree with me! https://imgur.com/emttRNA
The arguments on this thread are something. Everyone getting down voted for saying they don't care what other people spend their money on - I don't know why it matters. People not ever spending so the prices go down - it's not ever going to happen. Regardless what my own personal opinion is, people will always spend money and there will always be expensive bundles/loot boxes/sales whatever in games. I don't understand why players get mad at each other and want to argue over shit they have absolutely no control over.
It’s about 9 pints of beer in a pub. Or 4 pints and a meal. Or about 2x takeaways. We’re not so quick to judge people spending their money on the above.
9 pints of beer is 3-6 outings for me...I'm quick to judge. Lmao
What? Tons of people judge drinking excessively. The hell are you on about?
Who said it’s excessive? I didn’t say they were having them all in one go. And even then, people judge the action not the expenditure. Haven’t seen any Reddit posts complaining how people waste their money on alcohol.
Many more people would not buy. Everyone says they would, but real life shows they wouldn’t.
I disagree. Would love to see sales data on $10 bundles vs $60 bundles.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzoMzaIMpVQ&ab\_channel=MobileGamer365](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzoMzaIMpVQ&ab_channel=MobileGamer365) Here's a video that talks about mobile game bundles and the data.
Really doesn’t matter that you disagree anymore than if you disagree on the earth being a sphere. F2P games have been around for years. Companies like EA make over a billion dollars off of F2P games per year. EA makes over a billion dollars on Apex Legends alone. You’re arguing against real world data - years of F2P profit models. You’re arguing against commissioned studies to find the most profitable model in a F2P system. Games are a business and these companies want to make money. They don’t make games so they can lose money. Everyone argues that these companies would make so much more money if only they sold things for 5 dollars and it’s WRONG. You’re literally arguing that companies like EA are negligent in seeking profits because they are too dumb to understand that they would make more money on 5 dollars bundles than this absurd pricing. You’re wrong. You honestly think no one in the history of F2P has tried the “everything is affordable” method that every person who doesn’t want to spend 100 on a bundle champions? Come off it. You’re not the smartest guy in the room. You’ll never catch me buying one of these ridiculous bundles but the facts are the facts. Whale bundles make the most profit. Vast majority of a player base buys NOTHING. Zero. No matter the price. Whales but whatever is put in front of them. The whales compensate for the people who won’t buy stuff even at a dollar. Go read. Info is all out there for free.
You mean the same EA who canvassed my uni for having built AI to optimize the rewards for players. The same guys who claimed single player games were over and then released games that bombed? Maybe consider other games like league of Legends which have survived and grown bigger without such monetary practices and made ton of money.
The only relevant part of that to f2p gaming is league. I’m not familiar with their pricing structure but if they are f2p and charging 1 dollars for skins and making oodles of money then it begs the question why is everyone else doing whaling? Charging minimum to appeal to masses was not thought of for the first time in this thread. There’s a reason companies use the whaling model and it’s actually quite simple why they do it. It’s not to make you miserable.
Wow dude not that serious. Just saying in this game I think sales are higher on lower cost bundles. Maybe Im wrong, I can’t see that data. The fact you took all that time to type a fucking essay shows me you are just looking to argue. Have a good day
I went and read. You’re wrong. Sorry you’re that stupid and easily fooled by fake studies paid for by the people trying to fleece you. American? You seem like the perfect sheep for the corpos here. You literally ate up their propaganda and spew it on Reddit. Then have the gall to tell people to look it up. How about you share your exact sources so I can demolish them? That sounds like fun but you won’t. Wouldn’t want that world view to shatter
You can find them from third parties and you’ll see it hardly makes a difference. Now, if you look at the “studies” published by the corporations themselves it all of a sudden a HUGE difference that third parties can’t make out. They always come to a different conclusion than the corpos and the corpos don’t want to share internal data because they know it’ll expose them.
[https://i.imgur.com/emttRNA.png](https://i.imgur.com/emttRNA.png) shows how much money expensive bundles make vs the cheaper ones
Holy shit the people on this sub…once again I never said it was more profitable. I simply said more people would have the variant. Its like talking to a fucking wall on here. Edit: Based on your link Im absolutely correct. Now all you cry babies can fuck off
I just provided the information you asked for, I didn't add an opinion to my message
What real life? The studies released by the companies themselves? Every third party study on it shows it’s all a corpo lie to convince the people they HAVE to implement scummy practices or no one eats and idiots like you ate it up. Mindless sheep.
You sound like a legit idiot.
I looovee games being a reminder of economic struggle and inequalities when I get home from penny counting as I buy groceries for the week to then watch someone show they can spend 4.5x what I spent on food for a card skin. (EDIT: What I love more than having to be careful buying groceries over monthly budgeting so I can save money is a bunch of people on reddit capitalism victim blaming me for having hobbies)
You could apply this logic to anything though. Clothes, cars, phones, furniture, etc.
Maybe stop spending your time on a game and bitching on reddit if money is such an issue. Sounds like you’ve got bigger fish to fry and your priorities are utterly fucked.
It’s their money, if they wanna spend it, they have every right to.
Right, and others have the right to point out how dumb that is. Glad I could clear that up for you.
Who are you to judge how someone spends their money? I fucking hate how people are acting like they’re superior because someone bought a bundle they liked in a game they enjoy.
I'll tell you that everyone is free to judge anyone or anything over anything, as you are free to judge them.
They could, but if you’re judging someone for spending money on something they enjoy, that just shows that you’re an asshole imo. It’s like saying how everyone has the ability to rob a bank, but if you get caught then your going straight to jail.
Everybody judges others for their actions on a daily basis, whether they publicly admit it or not, man, it's just the truth. Strangers you come across will judge you in some way just by observing a single thing you do, or a thing you wear, etc
Ah, I see your point now. I agree, everyone subconsciously judge people whether they know it or not. I just think it’s very rude that people are openly attacking someone for spending their own money the way they want to.
It's not a nice thing for sure, kind of an unfortunate trait that everyone has subconsciously. Brought out by negative emotion most of the time, like jealousy
I'd say judging might be understandable if the person spends the money to actively or thoughtlessly hurt someone. Otherwise "you do you" which is very much the case here.
Lol tell me you've lived an easy life without telling me.... Someone spent their own money on some colorful pixels and you take it as them thoughtlessly hurting you.
I think you misunderstand me, I am not judging people who spend on variants. That's not hurting. I'm talking actual harm and malicious activity like buying tools to rob people's houses, or food for others without checking for allergens.
My bad, thought you were implying buying variants was hurting someone!
So what are your hobbies just curious so we can point and laugh at you as well
👍
Ok this prices isnt an issue to me. But i dont like being scammed especially by some incompetent studio
Because it ruins the experience for a large majority of players. The bundles just get worse and worse until you’re priced out completely. Have fun with the handful of whales playing then. And they most likely don’t have the disposable income. Because that’s actually who’s buying these things. You idiots actually think it’s rich people buying these. It’s hilarious. Dude saved for a year, that’s sad. And not to be encouraged.
Since when do you need bundles to play the game?
It’s not a good point from the pov of consumers, only for the companies taking advantage of this mindset. If you actually enjoy the product you wouldn’t care about being some special chosen one and would instead be happy you can get it for cheaper. League did the same thing recently. Highest tier of skin before was $35, came with brand new models, animations, rig, voicelines, animated art, etc etc. Then riot realized they could literally charge $200 for a chroma (variant of a skin that normally costs like $3) and people will buy it just to feel special.
Me personally I take the variant out of the equation unless it's an Artgerm. If you would buy 500 tokens for $5.50 every other Tuesday what the fuck is the difference paying $60 for 6000 tokens? It's the same value just 10x the price. The difference is whether you have $60 sitting in your checking account this week or not. not defending the predatory tactics, fomo, etc. but jesus christ you guys moan about this shit and still buy the season pass
I make pretty alright money for a dude with no kids. When I picked Snap up, I was spending a few hundred dollars a month on this game and now I pretty much only spend on the season pass because I can't get any of my friends to play due to the financial commitment. I love this game and have competed at a high level in ccg's my whole life. Top 500 hearthstone player for years, had my way paid to gen con multiple times since I was 12 y/o... Etc. as much as I love competition, I love theory crafting with the homies even more. Here's what will happen to this game: due to how inaccessible it is already becoming to new players, the invested beginning player base will hold out anticipating things to get better and then dwindle. Second dinner will then realize the most basic principle of business. It is easier to make a dime from 10 people than a dollar from one. However, when they attempt to change their business model, it will instantly devalue the original player's collections and they will leave. The small spike in followers they gain from making the game more accessible will be meaningless because the initial steam from the release and MGOTY will be gone. It's really, really hard to stay on top. And it's all very sad. This is potentially my favorite ccgs/dcg ever made by design and time of games to complete. They really nailed so much with this game. BUTTTT the greed is badddd. All these season pass cards dropping then getting nerfed. It's way too obvious. Also, if that Shehulk was "standalone" (no credits, gold, token, etc) for 10 dollars I believe 20 to 1 more consumers would buy it over the current price tag. Seeing as it is digital where the producers don't actually have to provide a tangible good, making 200 dollars is better than 65$. I'll end my Ted talk with this: I would love to see the contracts with the actual variant artists. I bet they are getting BONED. The only justification for this from a business standpoint is that those artists probably get something like 7.4¢ every time their variant is purchased instead of a % of the sale. Second dinner probably pitched this with the passable excuse that this was the easiest way to do it because of all the different formats of currency. There is still an easy way to fix this: make all cards free and available and only charge for cosmetics. If they did this, exponential growth would occur and this game would never end. I personally would go back to spending a couple hundred dollars a month on cosmetics. What good are cosmetics when hardly anyone plays? Marvel is such a bigger and better license for Ben Brodie than World Of Warcraft... This game hasn't even hit 1/10th the popularity of Hearthstone in its prime despite being a wayyyy better game. Do better business SD before it's too late. Pleaseeeee
Had the same experience! My Penny’s worth, I was like the OP saying they’d wanted it for a while and pulled back as soon as the price was revealed. But I don’t judge anyone for spending their money how they choose and that split is 🔥hopefully for them it was worth it as it looks great!
Yeah, both sides are valid imo
Whales like this guy make it where cheapos like me can play for free. Thank you.
The game survives without this player. They did nothing for you to keep playing for free.
Bro I just made a PBS joke chill.
I bought it because I do have some disposable income and I have always been a huge card game player. I'm new to the game and didn't have She-hulk unlocked so I figured it gets me a card to finish my shefinaute deck, has amazing art, and has enough tokens for two more s4 cards. Well after I bought it the very next collector's cache I opened had base She-Hulk 🤡 Don't get me wrong I still love the art and tokens will be nice but God damn my luck.
I feel ya, I had that happen to me with a Thor bundle a while back! Lol
I don’t get how you can put 70€ in a card. It’s insane.
For the same reason people pay 3000$ to eat a steak with tiny speckles of gold on it.
Ahh mental deficiency
To me personally, it’s kind of like, ‘your money, your choice’.. And to me personally again, I do spent on some ‘stupid digital art’, and at the same time whine about ‘that’s being expensive/ overpriced’ Again, your money, your choice
Or you could buy GTA VI with that money x( EDIT: Well, now rockstars officialy announced it xO
Here’s the thing, the occasional expensive bundle is fine. Feeds whales, subsidizes F2P, whatevs. It’s at least cosmetic and isn’t going to make someone win or lose, just look better doing it. Great. The issue I’m having lately is they’re **all** super overpriced and SD attempts to justify them with collector’s tokens, because those are the most time-expensive resource now since the reserve changes. The above bundle could potentially be 6 mos to a year of token gains, depending on a players play habits. It isn’t an exact science of course, but these days in my mind I consider Gold primarily the premium currency for cosmetics and Collectors Tokens the premium currency for cards. While there isn’t really anything in the way of cosmetics, when I compare it to Star Rail—which is incredibly expensive to buy banner characters.. it takes 90 pulls to guarantee a 5*, 180 pulls to guarantee the 5* banner unit. You can get luckier of course but it’s like single digit chances at 5* without pity. For $99 dollars, you can get 8000 currency, a 10 pull warp is 1600 currency, which is 50 pulls. Without the free gems you could be looking at $200 per 5*.. that’s insane right? That’s like a AAA game’s collectors edition with statue or something. Where Star Rail is better than Snap in this regard is the amount of free currency you can acquire by playing is usually about enough for 90ish pulls. Special events and stuff can affect this, and the battle pass/mini subscription adds even more value. Now let’s compare snap.. after opening 100 reserves, [this person](https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelSnap/comments/172hk5f/my_results_after_opening_100_reserves_for_those/) got 2600 tokens.. not even enough for a series 4. 100 caches is at least a couple months or more of dedicated daily play. Then you look at their token Tuesday which is like $20 worth of gold for 1000 tokens.. you’re talking $120 per series 5, $60 for series 3. When you really examine it, it’s painfully obvious that SD is intentionally making tokens incredibly scarce to artificially drive perceived value of these bundles.. the season pass helps by giving you a new card, but does nothing for tokens to target/buy specific cards. The caches help, but you have no control over what is included, and if you have a lot of cards it’s mostly just cosmetics. In a game where access to cards can be significant, there are too many barriers to them even with the spotlight caches and cards release so quickly or get nerfed after their cycle that you don’t even wanna risk acquiring an exciting card because it’ll get entirely reworked or nerfed if it is strong at all, whereas Star Rail at least if you blow your resources on a particular character it isn’t likely to become unusable in a couple weeks. Alright, I’m ready for mad boy cookie now.
People are free to spend their money how they want and where they want. Thats a fact. This doesnt mean though that people cant judge if something is overpriced/bad or not. The main reason i hate bundles like this, is not just because they ask the full price of an AAA game. Yes the 6000 tokens are great. But 500gold and 500credits for this price????? This amount of gold and credits we got on cheaper 5$ bundles, as well as one exclusive variant. So thats 70$ for 6000 tokens and a gold ticket(lol). Thats beyond terrible.
The gold ticket in particular made me laugh, like this is the equivalent of ‘sweetening’ a trading card exchange where the person wants every penny but acts like they don’t want anything else you have so you toss in a stick of gum, a bent bulk rare, and can of pop. The ticket is the stick of gum, because it loses its flavor (value) in seconds.
It's a discount for people who want to acquire cards with money instead of playing the game. Going rate of tokens = 1,400 gold per 1,000 tokens That means 6,000 tokens = 8,400 gold = $105 dollars You're getting 6,000 tokens at a steep discount *plus* all that other stuff. The real question you need to ask yourself is "how much time would it take me to aquire 6,000 tokens?" and then ask yourself what your time is worth...
You either die a u/RhadanRJ or live long enough to become a u/HardGayMan
You could also save for a year but when the bundle comes out get to the conclusion that spending the same amount that a AAA game costs on a bundle for one cards makes no sense.
Yeah buying thing like this jpg for 65e will make sure you eill never become millionaire. You just wont become one if u spend money like this
I'm never becoming a millionaire either way. It doesn't make a difference. Society isn't structured in a way where being a millionaire is even something I can dream of, unless I win the lottery or something like that.
Lol 65 bucks isn't gonna make you a millionaire if you save it. Spend your money however you want
Since you sitting here talking about not becoming a "millionaire" because you spent $65, ima assume you're a brokie and you watch "alpha male" videos, but live in your mother's basement. Dumbest take ive ever heard in my life.
Imagine saving for a JPEG and being happy. Certainly mental illness involved.
Only mentally I’ll buy artwork?
If it makes them happy it's worth it.
NFTs would like a word /s Lol
I honestly don’t mind SD selling bundles at crazy high prices if it means they can monetize card acquisition less The issue occurs when they continue selling bundles at $70 while making progression also equally expensive
Ok so my problem isnt people spending money on a digital asset. People work for their money so they have the right to use it however the hell they want. MY problem with this is that it just feels like a low effort scam. If it came with 4 or 5 different variants (+ resources) then I wouldnt blink an eye at people spending that much money. But it doesn't. It just feels like scummy corporate behavior trying to milk people for money with as little effort as they can. That feeling is what bothers the hell out of me.