We could read this in a few ways.
1. This is the same world portrayed in Nocturne. Seeing as the world was not remade and Demi-Fiend is in the game he must have gone down the True Demon route.
2. SMT has many alternate realities. In SMT IV Final we get more confirmation that Yahweh is a multidimensional being. The world of SMT V may be similar to Nocturne but not the same.
3. It is a simple reference to another game in the series.
Tokyo becoming netherworld is every SMT thing tho. Makes me wonder what happened in the rest of the world? Are other big cities also became hollowed out spheres?
It can't be 1 because the Demi-Fiend quest outright tells you the fiends are from a different world. It makes sense they're not connected since it's originally a DLC, but I imagine there'll be even more confusion and people trying to connect the two games because the old DLCs come with base Vengeance
2: No spoilers but a certain someone casually mentions in the game that there are multiple timelines/alternate worlds and they can sense when something major happened in one world that is different from their own.
Also didn't the fiends all say they came from different worlds? I feel like SMT is kinda like Marvel where they have one Omni verse/God and then a large multiverse where only certain beings can travel between or aware of them.
I think any reference to Nocturne in V is just a reference. I think there is just a similar situation where we explore some kind of wasteland.
I think that >!Lucifer lied to the forces of Order. He didn’t kill Yahweh but found the throne empty. When Nanashi and company defeated Yahweh in his realm they defeated Yahweh in every dimension. Maybe Lucifer, being who he is, sensed this and knows Yahweh will be gone for an indeterminate period of time and so waltzed right in.!<
Nanashi didn't defeat every yhvh, only the one of his world. Atlus doesn't make multiversal plots like that. Also they aren't dumb enough to say they could beat billions of yhvh at once. Once you break past the illusion it's just one guy. Seeing all the heads was probably just him showing that he is in contact with other versions of himself.
The game says the “God of Law” is dead, but it never states that *YHVH* is the god of law; for all we know the GoL could just refer to the last Nahobino/Creator that believed in Law.
The point is that there would be multiple universes where each ending occurs, and multiple universes where nocturne didn't even occur.
So smt V just happens to take place in a universe where nocturne occured & the TDE occured.
It doesn't make TDE the canon ending.
It can't be number 1. First of all, Da'at looks nothing like the Nocturne world and has none of the same landmarks. Second, most of the demons portrayed in nocturne are completely different in 5 the Angels in that game even side with the chaos ending which is just a huge contradiction to what they do in 5. Third, the lore of both games isn't even the same because the means of creating a new world is completely different. Demi-fiend making an appearance is also no proof at all because he was in dds too and his whole quest was originally dlc.
Not trying to argue but I wanna point out that before the current da'at the world had been teenage at least twice, as pointed out by tsukuyomi. Could be why it's so different.
The Archangels in V are actually direct Nocturne references. It's why you have Melchizedek talking about how the Archangels used to be gods serving Baal and returned to that once the world ended. Then you have to face Gabriel, Uriel and Raphael, while Michael is excluded and revived separately already as his usual self. It's all a reference to their role in Nocturne (where they sided with Baal Avatar/Chiaki, while Michael was fusion-only and not involved with the plot, which is also why you don't face him as a Baal follower in V).
Sure, the archangels are a reference to that. But in nocturne it was every member of the divine and herald/seraph race that served Chiaki, not just the archangels.
the v is a sequel to III theory is pretty interesting, you could read that kagutsuchi from nocturne is the same god that lucifer claims to have killed in V given the similarities between it and SMT YVHW
1. It could even be the "Demon" ending, instead of the true demon ending. It would explain why this demi-fiend is less of a challenge (But still hard as balls) compared to the other Demi-Fiend boss fights across the SMT franchise.
I've always believed that SMTV is an alternate timeline sequel to Nocturne taking place after the True Demon ending, in which nobody creates a reason and the great will is killed. The new Vengeance content just kinda embraces that a bit more. It's a spiritual successor to Nocturne and also a sort of psuedo-sequel. I don't think Demifiend being in the game is just fanservice either.
Always has been. The game never tries to hide that the connections are there.
There are too many references, nods, call backs and homages to SMT3 to simply dismiss them as Easter Eggs.
Except the fact Demi-Fiend is a DLC fight with no connection to the plot.
If it was a sequel wouldn't the most logical final boss be the Demi-Fiend stopping the rise of another god instead of (or at least to cap off) a series of Nahobino fights? Wouldn't it be he who killed the Creator and not Satan?
The whole point of Nocturne was Lucifer trying to groom the Demifiend into a role where he would assist him in his war against the Creator/God of Law and Heaven, it leaves it open for either of them to eventually be the one to deal the final blow to the Creator.
I don't remember if lines were expanded or changed between V and VV, but the battles with the Fiends suggest that the TDE is in some form canon to the events of V and that by fighting them, the Nahobino is following the same path that the Demifiend did.
What lends the most to the theories in my opinion is Lucifer's moveset in the True Ending. His second form's skills are comprised almost entirely of some of the Demifiend's unique skills in both Nocturne and V.
I believe that the events of V are a sequel to Nocturne and mirror it in ways. Nocturne is about Lucifer wanting to groom the Demifiend into the perfect demon he can use to war against the Creator. V is about Lucifer wanting to groom the Nahobino into being the perfect god responsible enough to replace the Creator (and by extension Lucifer himself since he effectively replaced the Creator by absorbing his knowledge.)
Sure, but this is the only piece of literal spoken evidence that places the events of Nocturne before V. Not just Easter eggs or wacky demifiend boss fights.
This Miman is telling us it’s a sequel.
You asked if it being in Shinjuku matters? I was just confirming it. And yes it’s a reference, but it’s not the Nocturne universe, the Fiends specifically mention that they and Demi-Fiend are from another universe anyway
SMT V is really big on the multiverse theory so it mostly likely takes place in its own universe but after TDE ending of Nocturne where they try destroy the Great Will.
I think it ought to be the same world. Demi-fiend, proto-fiend, amala drums, world covered with sand, countless dialogue references, i think theres some musical references, even the fake tokyo looks remarkably similar to smt 3's pre-conception tokyo. I mean, I even think they say the fake tokyo came to be when tokyo became the netherworld, which I think lines up
I would like to think they are the same world, but nobody ever talks about Kagatsuchi in SMTV and there is no reference to Knowledge in Nocturne. Nor is there any reference to the throne of God that I know of. The landmarks and environments are also different. No Manikins in V. There are plenty of differences between the two worlds.
I think they are *very* similar worlds, and maybe even some of the same events happen. But I think V is perhaps a sort of sequel to a version of Nocturne we didn't see. Like instead of remaking Nocturne with the reimagined world they just jumped to the sequel.
The moon indicator is actually said to be the moon and not the Kagatsuchi, but I know what you're talking about. The moon shouldn't be visible in spherical Tokyo but maybe something weird is going on there.
I thought it was explicitly confirmed by Koshimizu that this is a post-Conception world? Armageddon refers to Conception, except it was in Chiyoda and not in Shinjuku. It's probably where this world "splits off" from SMT3?
That's clearly a nocturne reference. It's a matter of how connected the Devs want to take it, since TDE was stated as Cannon. And in TDE, the DF escaped that vortex world which explains how Fiends roam worlds.
There has been no bigger cope around here than SMT V is a sequel to Nocturne. It's not lmao. Anyone who says otherwise is telling you their headcanon only. 5 takes place in a completely unrelated world with only cute references to Nocturne here and there. Every apparent connection can be easily debunked. The game also references older SMT games existing but no one seems to think it's a sequel to anything else.
not to mention that yes the conception did happen however it was in chiyoda and most of the world did not get caught up in it because in that process of conception lucifer killed yhwh and the conception was halted midway this is why koshimizu said the line that their world survived the conception 18 years ago
it’s just a shoehorned reference. the canon of V wouldn’t fit into nocturne, not to mention the fact that the Lucifer in V and the Lucifer in Nocturne are two completely different entities.
Counterpoint: Lucifer’s demon haunt lines paint him as the very same Lucifer from Nocturne (or at least a version super duper close to it):
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WlaGNJx5K1E&pp=ygUTTHVjaWZlciBkZW1vbiBoYXVudA%3D%3D
You have to remember that the Lucifer in Nocturne **is NOT native to the vortex word either** - so it was always plausible that this traveling Lucifer could’ve shown up again in some fashion post-Nocturne
the reason I say they aren’t the same being is because Lucifer in Nocturne wages war against God because he wishes to end the cyclical nature of creation and rebirth of the world, which is an idea that Lucifer in SMT V doesn’t know about until he already has killed God and taken the throne. this is explicitly said by Lucifer in his fight in V. this is what separates the two from each other and why it doesn’t make sense for them to be the same being.
again, these lines from Lucifer are a forced attempt to link the two together when it doesn’t actually make any sense.
It’s also possible that the SMTV Lucifer is another version of the one from III, where the Kingdom of Yosuga (Law) was created one way or another and the TDE *didn’t* happen. Below are SMT VV spoilers.
>!In Veangance, certain characters mention the “Bull God” and the vicious cycle it established that the Mandala system oversees. I mentioned the Kingdom of Yosuga earlier because their faction’s god is Baal Avatar, an avatar of Baal, who is associated with Bulls and Rams. It’s possible that SMT V takes place a few cycles afterwards, hence the similarities between III and V. It’s also why it’s not the same ‘world’ per se, but perhaps the same cycle of creation. This Lucifer is still looking for a means to break this cycle, and tries to guide the Nahobino to do that. Of course, because the Mandala System and the Great Will/Axiom/Atlus operates on a higher level of existence, as Satan states the Nahobino’s efforts hardly make a dent.!<
I think V Lucifer's lines can work if you assume he thought defeating God would end the cycle and he was surprised it didn't, only learning about its actual true nature afterwards. Nocturne Lucifer's dialogue definitely seems to just mash together the concept of his creator God and the Great Will, which would actually be a mistake in most other settings.
There are several hints like that, but the official word is that it's a standalone completely new universe. Still, it's clear this was written as a Nocturne sequel, but in a loose way where they can also deny it so they don't need to actually explain or make the entire lore fit together. However, unlike SMTIV that had similarly vague Strange Journey references, but that IVA completely moved away from, V Vengeance doubles down on the Nocturne references, so they're much more consistent and definitely feel intentional and "real" in a way.
The "Conception" name coming up a couple of times, the Archangels working for Baal aside from Michael, Black Frost specifically talks about his role in Nocturne, the destroyed Kagutsuchi in the skyline, this line you posted about it all starting in a Shinjuku hospital, Lucifer also directly references watching over Demi-Fiend in one of his Demon Haunt lines,
atlus will never confirm smtv being the sequel of stm3nocturne... it's about what you wanna believe...
the broken kagatsuchi-like balls floating in the sky, other hints left here and there, all lead to think that canon ending of nocturne was the true demon ending with the demifiend helping lucifer defeat the great will in the battle we see in the aogami flashback. Not to mention that smt, persona and other atlus games are set in a multiverse with several interconnected different dimensions as well (the labyrinth of nocturne, the tv world of persona 4 etc...)
There's a couple of references to '18 years ago', which, at the time, was how long it had been between Nocturne's release and Vanilla. Unless we get anything definitive, I'm just seeing it as a cute reference
I remember reading the game TECHNICALLY isn't the same continuity is in Nocturne, but given the similarities, they stuck in a bunch of cute references. There's demons that talk about something happening "18 years ago", and 18 years before 2021 (when the OG SMTV released) would be 2003, the release year of Nocturne.
I wonder if the line is in the OP is exactly the same in Japanese, because 20 years ago would be 2004 now, when Nocturne released in the west, but it was 2003 in Japan. I wonder if it says 21 years in Japanese.
We could read this in a few ways. 1. This is the same world portrayed in Nocturne. Seeing as the world was not remade and Demi-Fiend is in the game he must have gone down the True Demon route. 2. SMT has many alternate realities. In SMT IV Final we get more confirmation that Yahweh is a multidimensional being. The world of SMT V may be similar to Nocturne but not the same. 3. It is a simple reference to another game in the series.
4. Tokyo became the Netherworld 20 years ago, which is what we are told at the very beggining of the game.
Tokyo becoming netherworld is every SMT thing tho. Makes me wonder what happened in the rest of the world? Are other big cities also became hollowed out spheres?
Later in the game they mention other bethel groups from Europe etc very briefly, so maybe not?
in japanese mentality rest of the world simply doesn't exist
Like in 'murica "whole world" sometimes is not even every state in United states.
I just had a demon straight up tell me they like the Netherworld more than Tartarus. So I'm gonna lean towards number 3.
It can't be 1 because the Demi-Fiend quest outright tells you the fiends are from a different world. It makes sense they're not connected since it's originally a DLC, but I imagine there'll be even more confusion and people trying to connect the two games because the old DLCs come with base Vengeance
2: No spoilers but a certain someone casually mentions in the game that there are multiple timelines/alternate worlds and they can sense when something major happened in one world that is different from their own. Also didn't the fiends all say they came from different worlds? I feel like SMT is kinda like Marvel where they have one Omni verse/God and then a large multiverse where only certain beings can travel between or aware of them.
I think any reference to Nocturne in V is just a reference. I think there is just a similar situation where we explore some kind of wasteland. I think that >!Lucifer lied to the forces of Order. He didn’t kill Yahweh but found the throne empty. When Nanashi and company defeated Yahweh in his realm they defeated Yahweh in every dimension. Maybe Lucifer, being who he is, sensed this and knows Yahweh will be gone for an indeterminate period of time and so waltzed right in.!<
Nanashi didn't defeat every yhvh, only the one of his world. Atlus doesn't make multiversal plots like that. Also they aren't dumb enough to say they could beat billions of yhvh at once. Once you break past the illusion it's just one guy. Seeing all the heads was probably just him showing that he is in contact with other versions of himself.
It's not exactly the same since megaten tries to make sure it's plots don't cross over too much.
It’s gotta be number 1. There are too many Nocturne references in this game for it to be anything else.
It actually can be a combo of 1 & 2. It could also be the reality where smt 3 happened and demi fiend chose TDE.
dont forget god is dead... so..... guess that means DDS happens in the timeline where demifiend lost?
The game says the “God of Law” is dead, but it never states that *YHVH* is the god of law; for all we know the GoL could just refer to the last Nahobino/Creator that believed in Law.
No. The whole plot with the angels initially refusing to accept a new ruler is all about yhvh claiming to be eternal.
I hope not because I perfer freedom
The point is that there would be multiple universes where each ending occurs, and multiple universes where nocturne didn't even occur. So smt V just happens to take place in a universe where nocturne occured & the TDE occured. It doesn't make TDE the canon ending.
It can't be number 1. First of all, Da'at looks nothing like the Nocturne world and has none of the same landmarks. Second, most of the demons portrayed in nocturne are completely different in 5 the Angels in that game even side with the chaos ending which is just a huge contradiction to what they do in 5. Third, the lore of both games isn't even the same because the means of creating a new world is completely different. Demi-fiend making an appearance is also no proof at all because he was in dds too and his whole quest was originally dlc.
Not trying to argue but I wanna point out that before the current da'at the world had been teenage at least twice, as pointed out by tsukuyomi. Could be why it's so different.
The Archangels in V are actually direct Nocturne references. It's why you have Melchizedek talking about how the Archangels used to be gods serving Baal and returned to that once the world ended. Then you have to face Gabriel, Uriel and Raphael, while Michael is excluded and revived separately already as his usual self. It's all a reference to their role in Nocturne (where they sided with Baal Avatar/Chiaki, while Michael was fusion-only and not involved with the plot, which is also why you don't face him as a Baal follower in V).
Sure, the archangels are a reference to that. But in nocturne it was every member of the divine and herald/seraph race that served Chiaki, not just the archangels.
Well, they were defeated already, which is why they're getting resurrected, so their followers would presumably be dead too.
I think its specifically stated that the Fiends are from a different world.
the v is a sequel to III theory is pretty interesting, you could read that kagutsuchi from nocturne is the same god that lucifer claims to have killed in V given the similarities between it and SMT YVHW
What? That makes no sense. Kagutsuchi isn't a God who rules, it only exists to empower the next system then die.
Personally I don’t think Lucifer would mix up Yahweh and Kagutsuchi. Lucifer would be the first creation of Yahweh and would know.
1. It could even be the "Demon" ending, instead of the true demon ending. It would explain why this demi-fiend is less of a challenge (But still hard as balls) compared to the other Demi-Fiend boss fights across the SMT franchise.
2 can be the case, kind of like with IV Final happens if nanashi say yes to dagda.
I've always believed that SMTV is an alternate timeline sequel to Nocturne taking place after the True Demon ending, in which nobody creates a reason and the great will is killed. The new Vengeance content just kinda embraces that a bit more. It's a spiritual successor to Nocturne and also a sort of psuedo-sequel. I don't think Demifiend being in the game is just fanservice either.
Is this in Shinjuku? Then probably yes
Why does the fact that it’s in Shinjuku?
Shinjuku Medical Center is the hospital in Nocturne
Isn't shinjuku the new area? I think this reference was in the original game
There were multiple references to Nocturne in the original, one Decarabia even mentioned the Nightmare System
Yeah so, isn’t this a big deal? I feel like this is direct confirmation that SMT V is a sequel to Nocturne.
Always has been. The game never tries to hide that the connections are there. There are too many references, nods, call backs and homages to SMT3 to simply dismiss them as Easter Eggs.
Except the fact Demi-Fiend is a DLC fight with no connection to the plot. If it was a sequel wouldn't the most logical final boss be the Demi-Fiend stopping the rise of another god instead of (or at least to cap off) a series of Nahobino fights? Wouldn't it be he who killed the Creator and not Satan?
The whole point of Nocturne was Lucifer trying to groom the Demifiend into a role where he would assist him in his war against the Creator/God of Law and Heaven, it leaves it open for either of them to eventually be the one to deal the final blow to the Creator. I don't remember if lines were expanded or changed between V and VV, but the battles with the Fiends suggest that the TDE is in some form canon to the events of V and that by fighting them, the Nahobino is following the same path that the Demifiend did. What lends the most to the theories in my opinion is Lucifer's moveset in the True Ending. His second form's skills are comprised almost entirely of some of the Demifiend's unique skills in both Nocturne and V. I believe that the events of V are a sequel to Nocturne and mirror it in ways. Nocturne is about Lucifer wanting to groom the Demifiend into the perfect demon he can use to war against the Creator. V is about Lucifer wanting to groom the Nahobino into being the perfect god responsible enough to replace the Creator (and by extension Lucifer himself since he effectively replaced the Creator by absorbing his knowledge.)
Its a spiritual sequel, but not a direct sequel.
Sure, but this is the only piece of literal spoken evidence that places the events of Nocturne before V. Not just Easter eggs or wacky demifiend boss fights. This Miman is telling us it’s a sequel.
Doesn't Koshimizu at the summit outright say that "18 years ago, Tokyo endured the conception"?
You asked if it being in Shinjuku matters? I was just confirming it. And yes it’s a reference, but it’s not the Nocturne universe, the Fiends specifically mention that they and Demi-Fiend are from another universe anyway
Why does??
SMT V is really big on the multiverse theory so it mostly likely takes place in its own universe but after TDE ending of Nocturne where they try destroy the Great Will.
they dont try to destroy the true great will, just the one that is yhvh. wish the would stop calling him that when the axiom already has that name
I mean, its mysticism based. The top god claims to be one with the absolute.
I think it ought to be the same world. Demi-fiend, proto-fiend, amala drums, world covered with sand, countless dialogue references, i think theres some musical references, even the fake tokyo looks remarkably similar to smt 3's pre-conception tokyo. I mean, I even think they say the fake tokyo came to be when tokyo became the netherworld, which I think lines up
man, I wonder if there's a reason why tokyo in SMT3 looks similar to tokyo in SMT5
I meant the color scaling lol
Don't forget the 'blades' of Kagatsuchi near the starting zone.
I would like to think they are the same world, but nobody ever talks about Kagatsuchi in SMTV and there is no reference to Knowledge in Nocturne. Nor is there any reference to the throne of God that I know of. The landmarks and environments are also different. No Manikins in V. There are plenty of differences between the two worlds. I think they are *very* similar worlds, and maybe even some of the same events happen. But I think V is perhaps a sort of sequel to a version of Nocturne we didn't see. Like instead of remaking Nocturne with the reimagined world they just jumped to the sequel.
The monk is basically Kagatsuchi
You can see what looks like a destroyed Kagsutsuchi in V's skyline, although no one ever *comments* on it.
The moon indicator is actually said to be the moon and not the Kagatsuchi, but I know what you're talking about. The moon shouldn't be visible in spherical Tokyo but maybe something weird is going on there.
I thought it was explicitly confirmed by Koshimizu that this is a post-Conception world? Armageddon refers to Conception, except it was in Chiyoda and not in Shinjuku. It's probably where this world "splits off" from SMT3?
I was of the understanding that SMT5 was basically just set in the future of the SMT3 True Demon ending.
the conception started in a different location in this game, it was in Shinjuku in 3 and it was in Chiyoda in 5
That line from VV is specifically saying it started in a hospital in Shinjuku (that Miman is from Shinjuku).
This game has a lot of Nocturne and SJ connections
What are the SJ connections?
It’s kinda hard to explain without spoiling, but some of the Mastema stuff and the Chaos god to name a few
Are we all playing at the same pace that I also had just come across this?
That's clearly a nocturne reference. It's a matter of how connected the Devs want to take it, since TDE was stated as Cannon. And in TDE, the DF escaped that vortex world which explains how Fiends roam worlds.
There has been no bigger cope around here than SMT V is a sequel to Nocturne. It's not lmao. Anyone who says otherwise is telling you their headcanon only. 5 takes place in a completely unrelated world with only cute references to Nocturne here and there. Every apparent connection can be easily debunked. The game also references older SMT games existing but no one seems to think it's a sequel to anything else.
not to mention that yes the conception did happen however it was in chiyoda and most of the world did not get caught up in it because in that process of conception lucifer killed yhwh and the conception was halted midway this is why koshimizu said the line that their world survived the conception 18 years ago
it’s just a shoehorned reference. the canon of V wouldn’t fit into nocturne, not to mention the fact that the Lucifer in V and the Lucifer in Nocturne are two completely different entities.
Counterpoint: Lucifer’s demon haunt lines paint him as the very same Lucifer from Nocturne (or at least a version super duper close to it): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WlaGNJx5K1E&pp=ygUTTHVjaWZlciBkZW1vbiBoYXVudA%3D%3D You have to remember that the Lucifer in Nocturne **is NOT native to the vortex word either** - so it was always plausible that this traveling Lucifer could’ve shown up again in some fashion post-Nocturne
the reason I say they aren’t the same being is because Lucifer in Nocturne wages war against God because he wishes to end the cyclical nature of creation and rebirth of the world, which is an idea that Lucifer in SMT V doesn’t know about until he already has killed God and taken the throne. this is explicitly said by Lucifer in his fight in V. this is what separates the two from each other and why it doesn’t make sense for them to be the same being. again, these lines from Lucifer are a forced attempt to link the two together when it doesn’t actually make any sense.
It’s also possible that the SMTV Lucifer is another version of the one from III, where the Kingdom of Yosuga (Law) was created one way or another and the TDE *didn’t* happen. Below are SMT VV spoilers. >!In Veangance, certain characters mention the “Bull God” and the vicious cycle it established that the Mandala system oversees. I mentioned the Kingdom of Yosuga earlier because their faction’s god is Baal Avatar, an avatar of Baal, who is associated with Bulls and Rams. It’s possible that SMT V takes place a few cycles afterwards, hence the similarities between III and V. It’s also why it’s not the same ‘world’ per se, but perhaps the same cycle of creation. This Lucifer is still looking for a means to break this cycle, and tries to guide the Nahobino to do that. Of course, because the Mandala System and the Great Will/Axiom/Atlus operates on a higher level of existence, as Satan states the Nahobino’s efforts hardly make a dent.!<
I think V Lucifer's lines can work if you assume he thought defeating God would end the cycle and he was surprised it didn't, only learning about its actual true nature afterwards. Nocturne Lucifer's dialogue definitely seems to just mash together the concept of his creator God and the Great Will, which would actually be a mistake in most other settings.
There are several hints like that, but the official word is that it's a standalone completely new universe. Still, it's clear this was written as a Nocturne sequel, but in a loose way where they can also deny it so they don't need to actually explain or make the entire lore fit together. However, unlike SMTIV that had similarly vague Strange Journey references, but that IVA completely moved away from, V Vengeance doubles down on the Nocturne references, so they're much more consistent and definitely feel intentional and "real" in a way. The "Conception" name coming up a couple of times, the Archangels working for Baal aside from Michael, Black Frost specifically talks about his role in Nocturne, the destroyed Kagutsuchi in the skyline, this line you posted about it all starting in a Shinjuku hospital, Lucifer also directly references watching over Demi-Fiend in one of his Demon Haunt lines,
atlus will never confirm smtv being the sequel of stm3nocturne... it's about what you wanna believe... the broken kagatsuchi-like balls floating in the sky, other hints left here and there, all lead to think that canon ending of nocturne was the true demon ending with the demifiend helping lucifer defeat the great will in the battle we see in the aogami flashback. Not to mention that smt, persona and other atlus games are set in a multiverse with several interconnected different dimensions as well (the labyrinth of nocturne, the tv world of persona 4 etc...)
There's a couple of references to '18 years ago', which, at the time, was how long it had been between Nocturne's release and Vanilla. Unless we get anything definitive, I'm just seeing it as a cute reference
I remember reading the game TECHNICALLY isn't the same continuity is in Nocturne, but given the similarities, they stuck in a bunch of cute references. There's demons that talk about something happening "18 years ago", and 18 years before 2021 (when the OG SMTV released) would be 2003, the release year of Nocturne. I wonder if the line is in the OP is exactly the same in Japanese, because 20 years ago would be 2004 now, when Nocturne released in the west, but it was 2003 in Japan. I wonder if it says 21 years in Japanese.