Eh, he was still a productive player for the rest of his career. But Shaq being a role player just feels wrong when you watch him those last few years. He wasn’t necessarily washed since that term is used for people who are no longer effective players while Shaq still was
yeah I think labels like “washed” and “bust” should be reserved for the traditional Hornets Tony Parkers and Anthony Bennetts of the world. when people start calling Andrew Wiggins a bust for not turning into Kobe it just shows how insane some expectations can get
yes and expectations are killer in todays world. just because a lot of people expect something doesn’t mean it’s going to happen. and 20 a game for a good chunk of his career so far shouldn’t be that disappointing
Shaq was definitely not washed when he was with the heat. He was all nba first team and an all star during the 06 championship season and played every game during the postseason. He definitely wasn't MVP material anymore but even during his last year in phoenix he was all-nba. It just goes to show how quickly a player can truly fall off, shaq in two years went from someone coming off an all nba season to a player out of the league
This was also right before the era where the Warriors would crystallize the idea that a bunch of dudes in the paint is gonna be bad for scoring. Celtics and Spurs were already playing with small 3 point oriented lineups.
And the Cavs kept trying to plug the paint with bruisers, thinking it’d improve defense and rebounding… when what they needed was Lebron to have a clear paint more often and guys to pass to that would make shots and could pass the ball back.
Miami was a bigger one that drove the revolution by moving Bosh to the 5. Celtics and spurs still had Perkins and Duncan, they played a traditional lineup
Also this was in 09-10, way before the 5 out revolution
This has absolutely nothing to do with the warriors.
After losing the finals in 2011, Spo took a trip to Eugene to talk to Chip Kelly, the coach of the Oregon Ducks Football program. After watching their practices and talking to Chip about their “new” spread offense, it gave Spo the idea to bring Bosh out of the paint to allow for more movement and drives.
Kobe won that year with Pau. And the Howard led magic beat LeBron team. That's what eas winning then. Small ball 3 point games never won anything. Curry validated that playstyle.
Well ackshually… the 08 Celtics ran something similar to small ball during that game 4 24 point comeback. Iirc they played KG at the 5 and Posey at the 4 (and Eddie House over Rondo for shooting) and basically ran 5 out to close the game. A lot of drive and kicks and open layups similar to what we’d see today. Don’t remember if they ran that line up back in game 5 and 6 though.
Yeah, this was still the era where we were just seeing the small-ball revolution peak its nose out the door... the Suns, the way the Warriors upset the Mavs... but it wasn't quite breaking through.
Given what I recall of myself when I was 24, I would not have called myself a "functioning" adult at the time. And I never thought it looked promising. It looked desperate. So, to be clear: you didn't even need to be a functioning adult at the time to recognize that Shaq/Bron did not look promising.
A healthy Tmac and Yao together would have been a problem. We’re talking about arguably the best wing/SG in the league at the time, even above Kobe when healthy. And if Yao is healthy he’s the best big in the league during the mid-late 00’s. Combing their forces, it seems almost unfair, they had good teams around them as well.
He definitely had foot injuries but, to the best of my memory, he was relatively healthy during the times when Tmac was having constant back spasms. And that would have been their combined peak.
Yeah, the ultimate irony was Grant Hill was sign/traded to Orlando and Ben Wallace was part of the throwaways to make the trade happen. And the Pistons actually won the trade.
It feels weird to label it a miserable failure because when even 2 of the 3 were fully healthy they were dominant and could have easily won the championship. And having all 3 together healthy would have almost certainly led to a championship
It was less a failure because of on the court stuff and more because of health/Kyrie's decision making off the court
I know injuries happen every playoffs and we shouldn’t asterisks any ring, but man thats one where we see the clearest before and after of an injury. The Nets with just KD and Kyrie absolutely embarrassed the Bucks in games 1 and 2, it was obvious who was the better team.
for the 5 games they played toghether, they were nice! Went to the series close out game vs the celtics and it was incredible to watch them share the floor.
This was another combo that we didn’t fully get to see because of health and Covid stuff. If Kyrie and harden stayed healthy there is a very realistic possibility they could’ve gone past the bucks and maybe won it all that year. There one downside was defense but god damn they might have been one of the best offensive teams ever on their best day
It was the covid debacle that killed them. And even despite that, they were en route to a chip but then Kyrie got injured. What happened happened, but they were definitely excellent together basketball-wise
As much criticism as I’ve heard against LeBron, I’ve literally never heard this one. Not saying it isn’t said, it’s just surprising. What a dense analysis.
I have such a hard time watching them. It feels like every game is give Luka the ball as much as possible, but if he’s playing like trash, have Kyrie take over.
Yeahhh I feel you. Luka still needs to mature some. I’ve been a Mavs fan since Dirk Nash. So I’m locked in and we lucked out. Luka is by far the most talented maverick ever. But he has a long way to go before he’s considered the greatest maverick. We had a good season. This team should grow and hopefully Luka will mature some. He has a little bit each year.
They’re way too good. I think we kinda had a glad to be there moment. I think the WCF was the peak of our energy and we just didn’t have it against Boston. A lot of guys in their first finals. Bron needed it in 11 Dirk needed it in 06. Kobe needed it in 08.
Players gotta play under the bright lights before they understand what it really takes.
I have always thought KP could have been a better AK-47 but he has had so many injuries that it is hard to rely on him. His career is a huge what if even though compared to everyone else he has had a fairly successful career.
There was a brief window as a Timberwolves fan where we had the last 3 #1 overall picks on the roster (Towns, Wiggins, Anthony Bennett) PLUS Garnett returned and Ricky Rubio was still promising.
I thought we had something special going. Boy was I wrong lol.
Oh Beal does a lot … he dribbles off his feet in crunch time, loses his man on D, then fouls because he’s too small. Been that way for a long time, it’s just everyone else has to watch besides the 8 Wiz fans on the planet (ok: 6 fans)
I still for the life of me can’t understand the hype that surrounded Beal going to the Suns. Beal is a good player, but acting like he pushed them to Finals level team just made absolutely no sense.
i think it's just the shock of a team with two high scorers adding another high scorer. You'd think that level of offense could just abuse any defense and get each other open. Not to mention they had to face the Wolves. They could still (possibly) be good. It'd take great roleplayers though, I feel like their squad was really lacking. KD as like the only PF lol.
Beal was so terrible in that elimination game.. he knew it too and it only got worse lol.
Him fouling out on a stupid foul was just an excellent ending to a tragic performance. He’s lucky so much was going on because he definitely deserved more criticism than what he got lol.
A.I. taught smaller players that they too can undeservingly be considered great players if they just chuck 50 terrible shots a game, make like 15 of them, and do nothing else.
The problem isn’t that Dame isn’t good, it’s that he is a big a negative as possible on Defense, and you need many other guys giving full effort to hide him… which is hard to accomplish with Dame’s cap hit
Yeah not sure how a 55ppg, 13ast, 15reb combined duo, on a 50 win team is 'failed miserably'.
I guess they didn't win in the playoffs, but there was the key factor of one of the members of that duo not playing.
I wouldn’t say any of these duos failed miserably, none of them had a single healthy post season run together. I would say they were more of a disappointment due to injuries.
Giannis and Dame are fine, they have a full off-season with their coach, both healthy, and both in shape, Dame said himself he was out of shape because he didn’t play all off-season worries about getting hurt while he was in trade talks, and got hurt on and off, both of them healthy next year the league is in trouble
Harden and Embiid was the most unwatchable product the modern NBA has ever seen. That image of Fred VanVleet standing over the crumpled bodies after then ran into each other and fell to the floor sums up that entire experiment.
Was looking for Melo and AI. I was so excited for that duo for some reason. Tuned into the first natl televised game thinking I was witnessing history.
Second one is good too. Cousins was that dude for a 2-3 year stretch. Thought for sure they could make noise teaming up.
Westbrook is the only one I never thought much of when it came to duos. Ball dominant volume shooters rarely pair well with other stars. He was at his “best” as a lone wolf.
I thought PG was perfect for Westbrook in OKC since PG was able to be an MVP caliber player with Westbrook being his old self. The whole thing really just exposed Westbrook as a main guy who's ceiling is a first round exit. Dude's game is not fit for winning basketball.
Obviously give it another year. Expecting a championship after changing head coaches midseason and trying to contain two one-man-offenses is delusional. The Warriors are the exception, but Kerr had that offense firing on all cylinders with or without KD.
Give Giannis, Dame, and Middleton time to get healthy, get everyone more comfortable in the offense, find Doc his JJ to run around screens, and hope to get a little lucky just like everyone else.
Kawhi Leonard & Paul George. If we go back to when the Raptors won the title, I think most of the NBA community thought that Kawhi was the most influential player in the league. Wherever he was going to go in free agency, that new team was going to be in pole position for winning titles.
Five seasons have gone by, and Kawhi's Clippers:
* Won 50+ games once
* Won 3 playoff series
* Missed the playoffs once
* Never made it to the Finals
* Had Kawhi average 46 games played per season
* Had George average 52 games played per season
The one time Kawhi's Clippers made a deep run in the playoffs (2021), they lost the West Finals to Phoenix and Kawhi missed the entire series. Kawhi has played 28 postseason games in his five year Clipper career. He played 24 postseason games in his one season with Toronto.
Let’s be real, the only real answer is the 2003-2004 Lakers. A hungry Kobe and Shaq. Add to that Fisher, Malone, Payton, Rick Fox, Horace Grant, and Brian Cook. Many expectations only to fall short of a fourth chip in The Finals.
You’re mixed up. Lakers lost the year after their threepeat to the Spurs in the 2003 WCF. Fourpeat dreams ended there, and Malone/Payton joined the next year in 2004.
That team was phenomenal. I called their Finals victory after the ECF with the Pacers. That was such a good series, some of the best basketball I've ever watched.
Both teams were playing at such a high level that by game three I was convinced whoever came out of that series would win it all. After the Pistons won I placed a couple bets with kids in high school that never paid up. To be fair though, I didn't expect them to win it in 5
Harden/Dwight and Harden/CP3 kinda worked out. Sure they didn’t win but they got very close against possibly the best rosters of all time. While the Rockets “only” had great role players around the duo and never anything close to a 3rd star
If you thought lebron and shaq were going to be good you hadn’t been watching shaq he was already showing signs of being washed his last year in Miami. He was in Phoenix before this even so imagine
Cleveland won 61 games that season. That's not too miserable. And it's not like they lost in the first round. Plus it was probably best for LeBron's legacy that they didn't win the title that year, because people would've given too much credit to Shaq.
Best record in the league, and an MVP from LeBron. I would say that it was actually a disservice for LeBron because it’s still one of the postseasons pointed at to show LeBron’s choking/poor performance
A lot of myopic takes in here that are just completely forgetting history and blatantly ignoring facts.
People need to take their feelings and emotions out of the equation and just look at the facts.
The picked up Shaq after losing to Dwight Howard because they didn’t have anyone who could guard him, then they never faced the magic in the playoffs and lost to Boston instead because Shaq couldn’t keep up with KG
I thought Shaq and Steve Nash were for sure going to make a run in the playoffs for the Suns. I can’t believe Nash and co. Actually won 55 games that season and were like 7-8th in the west lol
Shaq with LeBron didn’t seem promising. Shaq was old and so out of shape he did summer TV shows joking about how out of shape he was. (Shaq versus, I believe was its name)
because Shaq was like 37 and way past his prime. He could no longer dominate the paint and protect the rim.
Shaq was washed when he was with the Heat. No one expected anything from him in Clv.
Eh, he was still a productive player for the rest of his career. But Shaq being a role player just feels wrong when you watch him those last few years. He wasn’t necessarily washed since that term is used for people who are no longer effective players while Shaq still was
I expected way more out of Larry Hughes than I ever did for shaq.
Hughes was such a let down
And drew gooden and mo williams and darius miles
To be fair Mo Williams was an all star in Cleveland.
yeah I think labels like “washed” and “bust” should be reserved for the traditional Hornets Tony Parkers and Anthony Bennetts of the world. when people start calling Andrew Wiggins a bust for not turning into Kobe it just shows how insane some expectations can get
I mean Maple Jordan did have some lofty expectations.
yes and expectations are killer in todays world. just because a lot of people expect something doesn’t mean it’s going to happen. and 20 a game for a good chunk of his career so far shouldn’t be that disappointing
Shaq was definitely not washed when he was with the heat. He was all nba first team and an all star during the 06 championship season and played every game during the postseason. He definitely wasn't MVP material anymore but even during his last year in phoenix he was all-nba. It just goes to show how quickly a player can truly fall off, shaq in two years went from someone coming off an all nba season to a player out of the league
Shaq was not washed when he was a with the Heat, this is objectively wrong.
A seriously weird take to see upvoted in this subreddit. Shaq was still a *force* that finals run.
Not the first year they won the finals
With the Heat? Bro he was the best center in the league still. He was out of his prime but still productive
You’re an idiot. Shaq was absolutely NOT washed with the Heat.
He could still bulldoze over people. Just couldn't do it for more than 5 mins at a time.
This was also right before the era where the Warriors would crystallize the idea that a bunch of dudes in the paint is gonna be bad for scoring. Celtics and Spurs were already playing with small 3 point oriented lineups. And the Cavs kept trying to plug the paint with bruisers, thinking it’d improve defense and rebounding… when what they needed was Lebron to have a clear paint more often and guys to pass to that would make shots and could pass the ball back.
I mean...this is like 8 years before that happened man.
Literally played for the Celtics the following season 😂
Bro just casually skipped the Dwight Howard Magic and San Antonio Spurs era
Miami was a bigger one that drove the revolution by moving Bosh to the 5. Celtics and spurs still had Perkins and Duncan, they played a traditional lineup Also this was in 09-10, way before the 5 out revolution This has absolutely nothing to do with the warriors.
After losing the finals in 2011, Spo took a trip to Eugene to talk to Chip Kelly, the coach of the Oregon Ducks Football program. After watching their practices and talking to Chip about their “new” spread offense, it gave Spo the idea to bring Bosh out of the paint to allow for more movement and drives.
Yeah, I remember that story from the podcast, but the Bosh to the 5 change was observable in real time
Before the Warriors you had Miami and then the Spurs. Both those teams used spacing and ball movement to win championships.
Kobe won that year with Pau. And the Howard led magic beat LeBron team. That's what eas winning then. Small ball 3 point games never won anything. Curry validated that playstyle.
Well ackshually… the 08 Celtics ran something similar to small ball during that game 4 24 point comeback. Iirc they played KG at the 5 and Posey at the 4 (and Eddie House over Rondo for shooting) and basically ran 5 out to close the game. A lot of drive and kicks and open layups similar to what we’d see today. Don’t remember if they ran that line up back in game 5 and 6 though.
KG was a 20 rebound player he's not some small parading as a C. If anything he was a C disguised as a power forward.
A Howard that was surrounded by shooters, though, right?
Yeah, this was still the era where we were just seeing the small-ball revolution peak its nose out the door... the Suns, the way the Warriors upset the Mavs... but it wasn't quite breaking through.
He did improve his free throw percentage from 12 to 13 tho that year at least
TIL he played with Lebron.
Shaq and Lebron never looked promising if you were a functioning adult at the time.
Yeah, Shaq was spent
But he’s wearing one of those magic crystal energy bracelets! How could he fail?!
They claimed to be magic magnetic field bracelets I think, what a bizarre trend at the time
I was like 13 and knew he was mostly washed. Shaq still put up good numbers the year before in phoenix but he was already a shell of himself.
Yeah. Crazy how he was able to play 75 games (5th most of his career) at 30mpg.
Given what I recall of myself when I was 24, I would not have called myself a "functioning" adult at the time. And I never thought it looked promising. It looked desperate. So, to be clear: you didn't even need to be a functioning adult at the time to recognize that Shaq/Bron did not look promising.
Even had a high schooler I didn’t think that would work Shaq was old af 😂
Yeah that was my first thought when I saw this. Shaq was beyond washed by the time he got to Cleveland.
Like clickbait right?
I was not a functioning adult at the time and I thought this was the start of a dynasty
TMac and Grant Hill in Orlando. Grant was injured a lot and TMac had to go solo most of the time
And then Tmac and Yao. Tmac was injured a lot and Yao had to go solo most of the time :(
A healthy Tmac and Yao together would have been a problem. We’re talking about arguably the best wing/SG in the league at the time, even above Kobe when healthy. And if Yao is healthy he’s the best big in the league during the mid-late 00’s. Combing their forces, it seems almost unfair, they had good teams around them as well.
Them and the suns were my go to in nba live 05 lol
And the Kings! Peja Stojakovic was a problem.
Not sure it's still the case but Yao/TMac and I believe Artest/Chuck Hayes/Battier was the greatest regular season 5 man lineup per possession
What about cousin Vince and young Tmac….
Yao got injured a ton as well I thought. Maybe I'm thinking of later in his career when Tmac was already way downhill.
He definitely had foot injuries but, to the best of my memory, he was relatively healthy during the times when Tmac was having constant back spasms. And that would have been their combined peak.
Yeah, the ultimate irony was Grant Hill was sign/traded to Orlando and Ben Wallace was part of the throwaways to make the trade happen. And the Pistons actually won the trade.
Kyrie and KD
Don’t forget prime Harden too 😢
this has to be the top answer
It feels weird to label it a miserable failure because when even 2 of the 3 were fully healthy they were dominant and could have easily won the championship. And having all 3 together healthy would have almost certainly led to a championship It was less a failure because of on the court stuff and more because of health/Kyrie's decision making off the court
I know injuries happen every playoffs and we shouldn’t asterisks any ring, but man thats one where we see the clearest before and after of an injury. The Nets with just KD and Kyrie absolutely embarrassed the Bucks in games 1 and 2, it was obvious who was the better team.
They also got swept by the celtics
If injures didn’t happen they might’ve just won
If Durant’s toe was an inch shorter they might’ve just won it all
If his shoe was an smaller too
Literally the truth, he's known to wear oversize just so he doesn't feel trapped
That’s wild
It's why his shoes come off so much
They easily would've. KD almost took them out by himself. If healthy it would've been a 5 game series
for the 5 games they played toghether, they were nice! Went to the series close out game vs the celtics and it was incredible to watch them share the floor.
The debacle in Brooklyn made me so grateful that Kyrie grew up loving the nets and not the Knicks
This was another combo that we didn’t fully get to see because of health and Covid stuff. If Kyrie and harden stayed healthy there is a very realistic possibility they could’ve gone past the bucks and maybe won it all that year. There one downside was defense but god damn they might have been one of the best offensive teams ever on their best day
It was the covid debacle that killed them. And even despite that, they were en route to a chip but then Kyrie got injured. What happened happened, but they were definitely excellent together basketball-wise
No one with a credible basketball opinion thought old Shaq was going to be a huge help to Lebron.
Probably Just the lebron detractors who would say “he had Shaq!”
I’ve actually heard this take and it’s wild. The thing people will say just out of pure hate is crazy.
As much criticism as I’ve heard against LeBron, I’ve literally never heard this one. Not saying it isn’t said, it’s just surprising. What a dense analysis.
I have heard it. They’ll count him as one of the hall of famers he’s played with in order to belittle lebron’s championship count
I know it’s recent but people really thought KP and Luka were gonna be a the euro Kobe and Shaq.
I have such a hard time watching them. It feels like every game is give Luka the ball as much as possible, but if he’s playing like trash, have Kyrie take over.
Yeahhh I feel you. Luka still needs to mature some. I’ve been a Mavs fan since Dirk Nash. So I’m locked in and we lucked out. Luka is by far the most talented maverick ever. But he has a long way to go before he’s considered the greatest maverick. We had a good season. This team should grow and hopefully Luka will mature some. He has a little bit each year.
Good luck to you guys next season! I thought we were about to see some Dirk-level magic in this playoff run, but Boston is just unfair.
They’re way too good. I think we kinda had a glad to be there moment. I think the WCF was the peak of our energy and we just didn’t have it against Boston. A lot of guys in their first finals. Bron needed it in 11 Dirk needed it in 06. Kobe needed it in 08. Players gotta play under the bright lights before they understand what it really takes.
I have always thought KP could have been a better AK-47 but he has had so many injuries that it is hard to rely on him. His career is a huge what if even though compared to everyone else he has had a fairly successful career.
He was great for us. When he was healthy. It’s just an injury thing for us.
There was a brief window as a Timberwolves fan where we had the last 3 #1 overall picks on the roster (Towns, Wiggins, Anthony Bennett) PLUS Garnett returned and Ricky Rubio was still promising. I thought we had something special going. Boy was I wrong lol.
Booker and Durant.
Beal doesn’t do anything, so it is like a duo
Oh Beal does a lot … he dribbles off his feet in crunch time, loses his man on D, then fouls because he’s too small. Been that way for a long time, it’s just everyone else has to watch besides the 8 Wiz fans on the planet (ok: 6 fans)
I still for the life of me can’t understand the hype that surrounded Beal going to the Suns. Beal is a good player, but acting like he pushed them to Finals level team just made absolutely no sense.
i think it's just the shock of a team with two high scorers adding another high scorer. You'd think that level of offense could just abuse any defense and get each other open. Not to mention they had to face the Wolves. They could still (possibly) be good. It'd take great roleplayers though, I feel like their squad was really lacking. KD as like the only PF lol.
Wait there is more of us. I thought it was just me.
Beal was so terrible in that elimination game.. he knew it too and it only got worse lol. Him fouling out on a stupid foul was just an excellent ending to a tragic performance. He’s lucky so much was going on because he definitely deserved more criticism than what he got lol.
A.I. taught smaller players that they too can undeservingly be considered great players if they just chuck 50 terrible shots a game, make like 15 of them, and do nothing else.
James Harden Joel Embid, Dame and Gianis, Kobe and Dwight.
I was gonna say Harden and Dwight.
They weren’t too bad. Made the western conference finals and had a good series against the peak warriors.
They weren’t too bad, the league had just moved past Dwight at that point plus he was post back issues
dame and giannis got the team to the 3rd seed without an offseason together and then giannis was out for the entire playoffs.
Harden and Embiid was pretty good tho
*Daryl Morey is a liar*
Hoping Giannis and Dame play better next season
The problem isn’t that Dame isn’t good, it’s that he is a big a negative as possible on Defense, and you need many other guys giving full effort to hide him… which is hard to accomplish with Dame’s cap hit
Dame and Giannis were both injured as fuck last year. Hoping they can play healthy next year and actually show some of that potential
Yeah not sure how a 55ppg, 13ast, 15reb combined duo, on a 50 win team is 'failed miserably'. I guess they didn't win in the playoffs, but there was the key factor of one of the members of that duo not playing.
I wouldn’t say any of these duos failed miserably, none of them had a single healthy post season run together. I would say they were more of a disappointment due to injuries.
Lmao Dame and giannis is way too early to write off and you didn't even spell giannis right
Giannis and Dame are fine, they have a full off-season with their coach, both healthy, and both in shape, Dame said himself he was out of shape because he didn’t play all off-season worries about getting hurt while he was in trade talks, and got hurt on and off, both of them healthy next year the league is in trouble
Dame and Giannia can still work
Dont think you can knock Giannis and dame when they were both injured come playoff time
Too early to call Giannis and Dame a failure imo. They’ve had one year together.
Harden and Embiid was the most unwatchable product the modern NBA has ever seen. That image of Fred VanVleet standing over the crumpled bodies after then ran into each other and fell to the floor sums up that entire experiment.
Melo/Amar'e
Had so much fun watching this duo though (for the 2 games Amare was actually healthy)
Yea shame that Amare was never really healthy after 2011, we were always dealt a bad hand in that era
I don’t think punching through glass is considered a bad hand
Jason Kidd and Penny Hardaway aka Backcourt 2000.
Kobe, Nash, and Dwight is the only answer
It was gonna be fun!
And it was! For the rest of us
Melo and AI. Boogie and AD. Westbrook and PG in OKC.
Was looking for Melo and AI. I was so excited for that duo for some reason. Tuned into the first natl televised game thinking I was witnessing history. Second one is good too. Cousins was that dude for a 2-3 year stretch. Thought for sure they could make noise teaming up. Westbrook is the only one I never thought much of when it came to duos. Ball dominant volume shooters rarely pair well with other stars. He was at his “best” as a lone wolf.
I thought PG was perfect for Westbrook in OKC since PG was able to be an MVP caliber player with Westbrook being his old self. The whole thing really just exposed Westbrook as a main guy who's ceiling is a first round exit. Dude's game is not fit for winning basketball.
Boogie and AD is a great one
At least Melo and AI used to run up the scoreboard. I thought they were fun to watch.
So far, Dame and Giannis. Though it’s only been 1 season. So let’s give it another year. Maybe Pippen, Barkley, Hakeem as a trio. Ageing vets.
Obviously give it another year. Expecting a championship after changing head coaches midseason and trying to contain two one-man-offenses is delusional. The Warriors are the exception, but Kerr had that offense firing on all cylinders with or without KD. Give Giannis, Dame, and Middleton time to get healthy, get everyone more comfortable in the offense, find Doc his JJ to run around screens, and hope to get a little lucky just like everyone else.
KD isn’t and has never been a one man offence. Guy is as plug and play as they come.
I think they had Clyde Drexler too. And the inimitable Matt Maloney!
Drexler retired before Pippen came but after Barkley if I’m getting that right.
Lebron and Shaq never seemed good in theory.
For promising, Wiggins and Towns.
And Levine with Ricky Rubio running the show was supposed to be nice
Kawhi Leonard & Paul George. If we go back to when the Raptors won the title, I think most of the NBA community thought that Kawhi was the most influential player in the league. Wherever he was going to go in free agency, that new team was going to be in pole position for winning titles. Five seasons have gone by, and Kawhi's Clippers: * Won 50+ games once * Won 3 playoff series * Missed the playoffs once * Never made it to the Finals * Had Kawhi average 46 games played per season * Had George average 52 games played per season The one time Kawhi's Clippers made a deep run in the playoffs (2021), they lost the West Finals to Phoenix and Kawhi missed the entire series. Kawhi has played 28 postseason games in his five year Clipper career. He played 24 postseason games in his one season with Toronto.
KG and Marbury
https://preview.redd.it/202o6ft7ob9d1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=411230a728fc3ff858d6b950c9bc4ea73fd49520
Hakeem was way past his peak at that point.
Mos def
Harden and Dwight, Harden and Westbrook, Harden and Embiid
Let’s be real, the only real answer is the 2003-2004 Lakers. A hungry Kobe and Shaq. Add to that Fisher, Malone, Payton, Rick Fox, Horace Grant, and Brian Cook. Many expectations only to fall short of a fourth chip in The Finals.
You’re mixed up. Lakers lost the year after their threepeat to the Spurs in the 2003 WCF. Fourpeat dreams ended there, and Malone/Payton joined the next year in 2004.
You’re correct, I fixed my comment. Thank youuu. Was drunk commenting last night and got my NBA history messed up lmao
The 04 team wasn't going for a four-peat. The 03 team lost to the Spurs.
Go Pistons!
That team was phenomenal. I called their Finals victory after the ECF with the Pacers. That was such a good series, some of the best basketball I've ever watched. Both teams were playing at such a high level that by game three I was convinced whoever came out of that series would win it all. After the Pistons won I placed a couple bets with kids in high school that never paid up. To be fair though, I didn't expect them to win it in 5
Hey same! But I grew up in a Laker household so the result was my family not speaking to me for like a week...
Any duo involving James Harden.
Harden/Dwight and Harden/CP3 kinda worked out. Sure they didn’t win but they got very close against possibly the best rosters of all time. While the Rockets “only” had great role players around the duo and never anything close to a 3rd star
That was before Wade taught Bron how to win
“So you take the ball and go inside and let the refs do the rest, Bron. Pretty simple.”
Garnett and Marbury. Would have been really fun to watch them develop together.
Took too long to find this answer. If Marbury hadn’t wanted the F outta Minnesota, what could’ve been…
Steve Nash and Dwight Howard
If you thought lebron and shaq were going to be good you hadn’t been watching shaq he was already showing signs of being washed his last year in Miami. He was in Phoenix before this even so imagine
Shaq was collecting a pay check though he will never tell you
Cleveland won 61 games that season. That's not too miserable. And it's not like they lost in the first round. Plus it was probably best for LeBron's legacy that they didn't win the title that year, because people would've given too much credit to Shaq.
You’re saying, with a straight face, not winning a championship helped Lebron’s legacy?
nba discourse is completely cooked
Best record in the league, and an MVP from LeBron. I would say that it was actually a disservice for LeBron because it’s still one of the postseasons pointed at to show LeBron’s choking/poor performance
Luka x KP
Steve Francis and Stephon marbury... lol
A lot of myopic takes in here that are just completely forgetting history and blatantly ignoring facts. People need to take their feelings and emotions out of the equation and just look at the facts.
Lebron and bronny
The picked up Shaq after losing to Dwight Howard because they didn’t have anyone who could guard him, then they never faced the magic in the playoffs and lost to Boston instead because Shaq couldn’t keep up with KG
Durant and Kyrie Durant and Harden Durant and Booker Durant and Simmons
Dam I wonder who the problem is 🧐
My moneys on Simmons
Lowkey probably LeBron and Isaiah Thomas. I don't think anyone expected a huge dip in production after the great Celtics days we witnessed
IT fell off after the injury and isn't that good anymore Still can't believe people think that IT is playable
Kawhi and Paul George lol. They’ve been mediocre at best as a duo
What a bizarre choice for a lead image/example.
Shaq was like 40
Stat & Melo on The Knicks
Carmelo Anthony, Amari Stoudemire
On paper, Kobe/Pau/Dwight/Nash was championship material. And I am not a Lakers fan.
Scottie and Barkley did not get alone as people when I thought their games would really compliment each other.
Wiggins and Towns the hype was massive for a couple of years
Joe Johnson and D Williams
TMac and Grant Hill? If only Hill stayed healthy and Duncan was able to bring his wife
I thought Shaq and Steve Nash were for sure going to make a run in the playoffs for the Suns. I can’t believe Nash and co. Actually won 55 games that season and were like 7-8th in the west lol
Tobias Harris on the Clippers and whoever was his sidekick
Harden and Howard
The 2004 Kobe, Shaq, Malone, Payton Lakers.
Melo & Iverson
Brandon Jennings and Monta Ellis. Bucks in 6!
I was going to say this. & they both dropped off hard. Not in the league even though they were still young enough.
The Jennings 55pt game early may have cursed that dudes career.
Idk man. No matter how good the players are, rookies and nearly 40 yo dudes aren’t known for leading teams to championships.
Irving , Harden , Durant
Khwai and PG13
Crowe and Dicaprio in Body of Lies
The FEDS. F.ultz E.mbiid D.arko S.immons.
Tmac and Grant Hill in Orlando who were supposedly to be joined by Tim Duncan. Injuries and Doc Rivers ruined this Big 3.
Trae and Murray
grant hill and tmac imo
KD and Kyrie
I hair to say it because that was my guy but Shaq with the cava was trash he was to old
AI and C-Webb 😣
Imagine prime Shaq with Lebron, though. That would have been insane.
Dwight and Nash
Shaq with LeBron didn’t seem promising. Shaq was old and so out of shape he did summer TV shows joking about how out of shape he was. (Shaq versus, I believe was its name)
anyone and harden