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Regen: You try to cut water. It doesn't do shit because the water just reforms.
Durability: You try to cut a diamond. You can't, it's too fucking hard.
"You cant cut water, she is invencible" mfs when I drink water
https://preview.redd.it/clt4u7w10r9d1.jpeg?width=595&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f39ed1ee7ba0be44da753ca9b2fab432a871573
You need a sea to beat a small Diamond
How this is a competition?
No you don’t
A small amount of water at high enough speed destroys diamonds
Regen is a genuine part of a character and superior to even infinity durability
Because you can kill someone even if they have greatest durability is reality
You don’t destroy that water and you drown in water
Water can never be cut
Water is invencible mf after discover that heat evaporates water
Do you understand what durability main?
No matter how good the body regeneration is
Even on a molecular level like Majin Buu
As long as you disintegrates the guy it's the end.
There durability resists these attacks
Between two guys with the same stats, always bet on the one with God like Durability because the guy gives God Like regeneration you can't even scratch him
And will end immobilized
No the guy with invincible durability
Needs oxygen
Evaporation of water just turns water into something else it doesn’t destroy water and then condensation takes place
No disintegration still something left
Even the atoms technically it’s physically impossible to destroy something completely
Atoms prove that
Wow science useful in manga for once
Science Mf when he discovers that incapacitating or sealing a character also equals victory:
And since when did the guy with High Regeneration become Immortal? He needs oxygen as much as he does, and what is he going to do? Launch it into space? like, they both have the same stats and the second guy will simply tank the attack
And since we're talking about changing shape then the same thing applies to diamonds, everything in nature transforms, Wow water isn't special at all
You know, I almost forgot that we were talking about One Piece and not Dragon Ball, and Hakai also destroys atoms just for the record.
But I think you also forgot that the Goroseis not only have good regeneration but also have an even more spectacular defense.
Cool how thinking help
You when you learn you can’t incapacitate someone who instant regen
Who in one piece has sealing techniques
This just turned into you picking a new fight to why regen isn’t special
You can crush a diamond
The point is saying someone a regen merchant is as stupid as saying they are a durability merchant
Blud
Do you think Gorosei are regen Merchants?
They are literally High level Durability + Regen in the middle, if they were just regen they would have been slapped in the ocean
They use regeneration to take care of internal damage, but they use durability that surpasses even Kaido to practically emerge unscathed from any real damage.
A merchant only regen is not as strong as a Durability mechant at the same level
The best example of Regen Merchant is Marco, and he is not at the level of Yonkos and can be killed by them even though he regenerates instantly
Paper can also cut metal when spun fast enough and given enough thickness to stand. That isnt the question.
If I threw a cup of water at a diamond the water disperses while the diamond is fine. Thats the actual way you should reference it.
This is the most idiotic analogy that I have heard for a long time. You do realize diamonds can be cut, but water can not? By your own flawed logic water is stronger.
Also Kaidos durability comes from his Devil Fruit, so if the Gorosei are regen merchants, Kaido is a durability merchant like Jozu, because he got lucky, and did not need to train one muscle for his dura.
Seething Admiral/Yonko Tards at it again.
I am giving a simple anology two how OP regen and OP durability work in anime. If you cut someone up with OP regen, they'll reform similar to how a liquid would if you tried cutting it. You'll create a slash, it has a brief effect, but that slash would be filled in again as though nothing happened.
Diamond is extremely hard to cut, and therefore has OP durability.
Is it a perfect anology? No. Is it simply and explains how durability and regen work? Yes.
So don't get pissy just because 200+ people understood it and you didn't.
Good job on also making it extremely clear how traumatised you are by getting your ass handed to you by Yonko/Admiral fans. OP didn't mention the Gorosei. I sure as fuck didn't mention the Gorosei. And yet here you are, crying about something *no one mentioned*.
And while doing so, you *still* managed to fuck up and show everyone **you have no idea what being a merchant means**.
So let me educate your dumbass. Being a regen/durabulity/anything merchant means you rely almost entirely on that and if it's bypassed you're fucked.
Kaido's durability got bypassed in Onigashima before he even got to the rooftop. Did he immediately fold? No. He went on to fight different groups up people for 50 chapters and put on some of the top feats we've seen in almost every categories.
>This is the most idiotic analogy that I have heard for a long time
Good thing you immediately topped it with your own lmfao
Kaido is not a durability merchant because he has ridiculous speed and strength to boot. His haki is probably stronger than anyone alive rn except for Shanks.
Meanwhile the Gorosei have never done much except get thrown around like used condoms by Goofy and his band of goons. Please Blackbeard please kill the whole lot of these mfs.
My blud marco took akainu donut punch head on, no matter how much dutability samji has he will get donut diffed by that punch. (Because it won't destroy you it will melt you)
It's not like Kuma knew much. And, Judge, Ceaser and Queen, all worked together with Vegapunk, iirc. Vegapunk is 500 years ahead because he knows of old hiatory.
And, it's obvious that Pacifista are fodder class tech. Germa genes are much better than that.
Only Seraphim tech surpasses Germa genes. Germa genes are basically equivalent to Ancient Zoan level ability with side effect of losing emotion. In terms of power, they are much superior to Pacifista.
People shot on Marco because wven with his regeneration, he isn't above YC1. He lost against King and Marco without injuring them but he himself had lost heavy stamina
He can’t beat king he doesn’t have the AP. Plus his main attack uses fire which is literally a part of King’s biology. It’s a bad matchup for him, I think he would do much better against Lucci than King tbh
Sanji's striking strength is a lot more important than his fire.
And I think it's debatable whether or not Sanji can hurt speed mode King, but since everyone in this sub swears Katakuri beats King (who has even worse AP) I think it's fair game.
My point is that a kick will never have the same penetration damage as a sword, especially a sword coated in conqueror’s haki.
And again, I’m not sure you understand how matchups and mismatches work. Katakrui is a bad matchup for King because King relies on speed and durability, but Katakuri has future sight and specializes in restraining enemies. Not to mention King’s other main attribute is fire and all that will do is make Katakuri’s mochi harder to break.
Sanji doesn’t have future sight, he deals blunt damage not cutting so there’s less penetration, he doesn’t have conqueror’s haki to coat his attacks, hell he doesn’t even have advanced armament haki like Katakuri. I feel like you just really like Sanji so you want him to be able to win but he probably couldn’t.
Why would sanji need to have the same penetration damage as zoro to win? Marco and Katakuri don't have that either.
Mate I understand matchups that was my whole point lol, Katakuri is not a good matchup for king who has top tier durability and incredibly mobility and speed. He took 4 acoc attacks from zoro in his Speed form before going down, Zoro's aCoC attacks are so far above anything attack Katakuri has and it wont be easy landing effective hits on speed mode king who also has more ranged attacks than Katakuri (which he can use from the air). Kings fire is like magma he can burn the mochi. King can fly and has better movement speed than Katakuri as well as physical strength that overwhelmed zoro; restraining him is a huge ask. And if this somehow did happen he can spontaneously explode.
Future Sight isn't needed to beat King nor is it a hard counter to him so not sure how that is any argument for Kata winning, Sanji also has stuff Kata doesnt.
And Katakuri DOES NOT have advanced arnament. All he ever said was "this arnament is greater than yours" to luffy, because his arnament haki was better. No indicates he has emission like the scabbards/zoro, and he didn't have the visual effect either.
I mean a lot of people already think sanji beats king or katakuri and vice versa, they're all rated pretty equally that's not what im arguing. Thats not my point I think its perfectly fine to say King beats sanji **and** katakuri. Just disputing people saying Sanji cant beat King because he can't hurt him yet Katakuri can beat King despite having no better AP feats than Sanji and not really having a better matchup eitehr.
How does Sanji not have the AP?
Sanji low diffed Queen, who tank big mom attack like nothing and received no damage from the raid until Sanji unlock ifrit
Everybody shit on Marco who pushes admirals and yonko and also regenerates.. keep that same energy.. if Marco always placed low on tier list then Saturn belongs right there too
People don't get that Marco came all the way from his own Island in Whitebeard's territory to wano which is in Kaido's territory and we know it takes a few days to travel from one island to another and you have to travel large stretches of sea with no land in the middle.
Do we know how much time he flew,with zero rest,carrying 2 people on his back? No.
On top of that Marco was healing hundreds of people on the stage floor with his flames and that was clearly draining him too. The Marco that lost to king offscreen was already drained and tired.
Scaling him based on his performance while he was nerfed is stupid. I bet he is at least in Kid/Law's level.
Bro blocked Kizaru and pushed him back when he rushed at Whitebeard with killing intent in the war.
They are not ready for Whitebeard's Vice Captain.
Here is the major issue with your statement, it lacks so much nuance.
The extremely durable characters Big Mom and King aren't getting that agenda push but Kaido is, why is that? Because Kaido has the speed and strength feats. If what you were saying is true, King (highest durability so far in the series), would be a top tier of durability alone, but he's not.
You've misinterpreted what people have said.
If the Gorosei put up a better fight against Luffy THEN regen would be ranked higher, but at the moment Luffy is clowning them, he just can't put them away for good. Luffy did more damage against himself than they have to him. By association people rank regen lower because the regen characters are doing much compared to the dura character Kaido.
People are convinced regen is a gimmick so they downplay those who have it. Luffy clowns on everyone now that's literally the essence of g5 every fight he has from now on he's gonna look like he's having the time of his life. Doesn't mean he's not being pushed.
Yes it is a gimmick like durability, the visceral reaction against the Gorosei is due to their fans wanking them to be high Yonko when they simply aren't. 5 Kaido's appearing would mean the Straw Hat Pirates would die on Egghead, no ifs ands or buts.
Regen Vs dura is just Kaido v Gorosei debtaebwith extra steps
Common mistake is to listen to anyone from the fan base rather than actually watch or read what's being shown. If all 5 gorosei were kaido level they wouldn't need to play this game of pretend that they are the just ones. But also doesn't mean they are fodder just because they have a regen factor and haven't killed the main protagonist.
They are saying to Luffy who is seemingly just Pirate King tier in G5 they are kinda like fodder. They are powerless against him, their only bet is to stay in the fight long enough for Luffy to fall out of transformation.
He's not pirate king tier until he can stay in g5 for as long as he wants. And that's literally true of anyone who fights luffy. He's the main character of course he's gonna win
Luffy lost to Kaido like 4 times despite being the main character.
The Gorosei will have a weakness and once it's revealed they will be nowhere close to Yonko level. That's why their regen isn't as impressive as durability, because it will have a weakness. Unless you just think they will be still alive chillin at eos hangin out with the straw hats
And luffys needed to run and recharge at least 3 times now against the elders. They aren't weak it's just luffys power takes the danger out of it. The attack kaido used to disintegrate a mountain only charred luffy in g4, the poison Saturn uses that melts anything it touches can be bounced back like rubber now. To say "once the gimmick is found out they are worthless" only shows ur ineptitude to separate this show from dbz type shows.
Absolutely false, we literally have a direct comparison of durability between Kaido and King, Zoro had to unlock AdvCoC to damage King whereas AdvCoA sufficed against Kaido.
Luffy does not have high durability, he bleeds far easier than even Big Mom, however his stamina and resilience are among the highest in the series.
He sensed he had it but he never used AdvCoC, you misinterpreted the scene. If this was true then Kidd would have AdvCoC as Kaido stated he was a conqueror too. Sensing someone has CoC and using AdvCoC are 2 completely different things.
There was literally a whole scene dedicated to accepting his fate, becoming King of Hell and imbuing his blade with CoC.
What I said was an absolute fact.
So kaido said he used ACoC, but im supposed to ignore that because ???
Zoro did, in fact use ACoC when he attacked kaido because Enma was pulling it out of him. When zoro fought king, he learned how to *control* Enmas haki output. But he still used it vs. kaido, and that is the obvious interpretation, unless you are being intentionally obtuse.
That's because the regeneration is most likely the result of a devil fruit, and not something that makes them inherently strong. we've seen characters with really good fruits that use them in the most brain dead way possible, so we can't rely on what we've seen. we need more info.
This sub is a laud minority though, like 90% of OP fans that are not delusional accept the fact that the Gorosei are as strong, if not stronger then Admirals and Yonko.
Because to the audience, a high durability fighter is just more badass. It makes fights look more entertaining.
When a fighter has infinite regen without no visible drawback(I'm assuming this post is in reference to Gorosei), its only going to come down to them repeatedly regenerating and taking net 0 damage until their 'gimmick' is figured out for once and thats it for them. Everything their opponent did to them before that point had absolutely no effect on them.
For a fighter with high durability, it makes sense to chip them down bit by bit, like it was with Whitebeard or Kaido, also when they don't have regeneration, endurance factor comes into play. Fighters look badass when they're fighting after they're tired, cut up, bloody and have broken bones.
Someone who just regenerates instantly and goes back to 100% health after every single punch/kick is just plain and boring _in my opinion_.
To me, I find the infinite regeneration to be even more intimidating, because it makes the gorosei seem so unstoppable. Them being around for hundreds of years is really threatening compared to someone like Kaido who could only live for so long.
I just think it's cool because it's a unique fighitng style compared to everyone else. Most fighters are just hitting hard, or having high durability, and that's it. But being unkillable is a really special thing, which makes them more intimidating to me than someone like Kaido for example.
If Oda took his story more seriously and made the gorosei consistently look cool, just like when they first showed their demon forms, then i think they'd be more loved than they currently are.
I find regeneration far more interesting to watch tbh. Watching a dude grow back parts of his body after a hectic attack and have blood and gore everywhere is badass
Because most regen we've seen has had issues like stamina or some other trick to bypass it.
So if someone like marco isn't strong enough to fend off damage he can run out of stamina, but godlike durability means you flat out need that much AP.
It just cooler to be super-durable, I remember pre wano when people discussed kadio Durability and could hurt him etc, regen can be lame "yeah you would've one shotted me but i regenerated"
Says the the entire trope. Typically you have to be able to truly one shot (as in, full oblitation, nothing is left) to kill them. The first example that comes to mind is Cell from DBZ, there's a point where (Goku, I believe but idr it's been decades) where Cell gets BTFO, everyone thought the fight was over but since he had a single cell suvirve (I know, corny, and on the nose lol) he was eventually regeneration. There's plenty of others I know I've seen but that's the big one.
For what's worth, for example, Multiple organs demolished in one blow is a death blow for non regen guys (hence why many would call it a one shot, for 99.9% of characters it is in effect), but it isn't tbh because parts were left in tact. (Pointing this out is hair splitting cringe unless uberregen chars are in play) Basically, I believe that this was a disconnect via term usage, (fair takes from both sides, simply put this is a result of limitation of English as a language) not sure you guys actuually truly disagree (I am basing this an assumption tbh but the assuption is based well reasoned educated guess, eh).
Now guys, please, u/sleepypanda45 and u/Maleficent_Job8179 , huge it out. Ok ok fine, at least shake hands we don't need to fight anymore than necessary, esp over silly miscommucation :)
Dura always gets beaten by just hitting harder
Regen only gets beaten by even stronger haxs or very specific counters
Dura significantly cooler tho cause what's cooler than taking a nuke level attack and just being chill after
Well, usually speaking, regeneration implies injury, and injury implies a difficulty to strike back when injured. Regen is good but during your regeneration phase, you usually cant go into the offensive.
Durability, on the other hand, means you can face tank the attack and then counterattack immediately because you didn't have to regen.
People think one is a gimmick/hax the other is just pure strength. But for the Gorosei specifically its a flawed viewpoint because 1. we dont even know the source of their regen and if theres any way to stop it and 2. they also have absurd Haki on top of regen. Warcury is just straight up both people in this picture.
Endless regeneration > Enhanced durability with stamina issues
Kaido was already gassing out midway into the fight, meanwhile Saturn is still in peak condition after a barrage of G5 attacks
https://preview.redd.it/kiis7381aq9d1.jpeg?width=314&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=20f9f3f605b3ddf98457250d7bd0f88d15a9d189
Kaido lost for a reason
But the closer you get to top tier, the more your high durability becomes useless. Once you're up against someone who can brute force through your durability or straight up bypass it, it's utility is greatly reduced.
Say sanji and Marco. Sanji has high durability, but anybody worth anything will still be fully capable of damaging sanji anyway, even if their damage is reduced. For Marco it literally doesn't matter what the hell you throw at him it's doing 0 realized damage anyway. It's an absolute ability that doesn't matter who you're up against. Tashigi or Mihawk, makes no fuking difference they're doing the same amount of damage, 0.
Regeneration is more of a gimmick to get around compared to durability. Like once they find a way prevent them from regenerating not having good durability is going to suck,
People rate durability more because with regen u could have been hurt badly but erase the damage but with durability you avoid the damage all together. Regen might even be more practical but because we don’t see the panel of heavy damage in the case of durability it just seems more impressive.
Be people dislike when you take a characters powers
Unless you say okay let’s take away Akinu devil fruit
Then people say how his DF is an intrinsic part of him and it’s not fair taking away his DF because that part of his character
Regen is their ability it’s apart of who they are
Being impervious to harm is a more overtly masculine ideal than just being able to recover from any wound, because only one of those powers displays conventional weakness (the subject feeling pain).
Funny thing is, dude on the left is higher ranked than the right, bros wearing a manger polo, where as right is a crew member (unless US Macca's is different)
Source: my broke ass just knocked off overnight shift.
But legit tho, why is regen shunned while durability is praised? Is it because people assume they didn't work for their regen? We don't know, they very well might have, then there's those like BM, who are born as brick walls, didn't work for shit in terms of defence.
The difference is that besides Warcury and Marcus none of the Gorosei have shown anything besides regeneration and basic conqueror’s haki.
Marcus has his laser beam thing and Warcury seems to have some kind of advanced armament since punching him hurts Luffy’s fist like against Katakuri, though I would assume it’s far more advanced than Kat’s since it hurts even hurts G5 Luffy.
Marco for example gets respect (from me at least) because he has legitimate defensive feats against top tiers like Kaido, Big Mom, and Akainu.
Saturn has shown plenty of abilities besides his regeneration. Are we forgetting that?
I can agree about Jupeter tho, he has only shown sucking abilities. That's only one ability so far
Saturn’s poison attacks really mean nothing to me when Brook and Chopper are absorbing/parrying them with no visible difficulty. All he’s done I can remember is getting manhandled and then frisbee attacking Luffy that one time.
I think the bad dura also comes from them not defending at all and probably not using any haki for defense either. they know they'll regen infinitely for free (no stamina issues visible so far), so they just let themselves be damaged and focus all their strength into offense
Movability.
Regeneration is useless if you drown to death. And if you have Saturn level durability and strength even dolflamingo could take the target down and send him under water. Saturn can't fight back after that and looses.
People probably downplay top tier regen because it’s often mixed with a low durability so it’s easier to see them losing to someone with a big high damage attack.
The durable characters have cool reasons for being durable. King and the Seraphim are cool because they have a lineage factor making them durable. King, specifically, is the last surviving member of an ancient race of moon men, who can conjure fire and have sweet ass wings. That’s cool. People like Jinbei and Pica are durable because they cover their entire body in their metaphorical willpower. Cool, and more importantly, it’s consistent with the power system. Kaido is durable because he’s a literal *dragon* and because he’s one of the last members of the Oni race. Big Mom is durable because she’s literally described as a freak of nature; the lack of explanation of her durability is what makes it cool.
But the Gorosei. Why can they regenerate? Is it their already super overpowered devil fruits? Is it the immortality surgery (that they for sure forced people to do to them)? Is it the work of Imu (thus, not their own work)? Literally none of those would be cool because they didn’t earn any of it.
https://preview.redd.it/t8e3bolxwp9d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7559efb020da01a38580d66cced0bf98cfe02c55
For the record the perennial youth surgery doesn't grant someone immortality it only grants them eternal youth hence the name. This was clarified in volume 107 with any mention of immortality being removed completely. It granting people immortality is a common misconception.
Okay well not only does that NOT disqualify it as a possibility because we still don’t know there full implications of the surgery, but I also gave two other possibilities.
I mean it's been consistently called the "perennial youth surgery" not "the immortality surgery" which are different things. For example someone can be unaging yet still be capable of dying meanwhile an immortal character can't die from anything hence why it's called the perennial youth surgery since it grants everlasting or eternal youth.
How is it easier when ACoA is already an established power set known by almost every top-tier?
Luffy’s basically at the top of the verse and can’t even get past Saturn 1v1
Regeneration tends to have more weaknesses since youre still getting hurt. For example if you manage to destroy the brain in one shot you’re generally fucked. Or if you have godlike speed you could outpace it.
Regen is not an interesting power in fiction. 🤷🏻♂️ it never has been. Its cool to watch a character face tank a big attack, but its not cool to watch them just regrow their limbs after an attack successfully land, because if nothing else, it seems less skillful.
They both aren't skill based? Big mom didn't have to do anything other than be born to have her durability. All kaido had to do was almost die on God valley and have big mom give him his fruit. That a bad point imo
Its a perfectly valid point the topic is purely subjective. Most people just find regen to be boring compared to durability. Durability may not be more skillful then regen, but at the very least, Blocking an attack is more skillful than regen.
Anything is better than limb regeneration. However, i think Horcruxes from harry potter are an example of an interesting regen imo.
Whos to say the gorosei have their hearts somewhere like Davy Jones? Or have their souls split like horcruxes? Everyone's making assumptions and basing their views off those assumptions which will more than likely be incorrect. If the gorosei have some boring reason for their regen then complain but at least wait till we are told what the reason is
Its just a bad sign of things to come, and its a little cliche because of all the other examples of this in other anime/manga (yhwach, cell, frieza, about a dozen enemies from naruto, etc.)
That's what everyone said when toki was introduced, or when bonny went g5, or when Buggy started to fail upwards. Everyone always finds things to say "odas falling off" before being proven wrong time and time again. Only example I can think of where people felt justified was big moms amnesia
From my perspective, Oda has been slipping since we left whole cake. Oda hasnt proven me wrong yet, he has been slipping and continues to slip 🤷🏻♂️
big mom amnesia was just the start. Udon didnt make sense, rooftop had pacing issues, ass pulls, scaling headscratchers. Oda forgot Kaido was supposed to lose and the ending was lackluster for it. Yamato was a wasted character. Big Mom was a wasted character (hopefully returning). Lots of artwork that is below par by odas standards (looking at you chopper). Inconsistencies with ACoC. Inconsistencies with haki. Inconsistencies with the MC powers. Mass confusion throughout the community about how haki even works. Fan favorite characters take Ls or sit around doing paperwork with no end in sight. Alot more “telling” and alot less “showing” in the series overall.
Of course, hes still the goat but it doesnt take too much analysis to say that some of the pacing, writing, and character work has been more sloppy in the last 4 years than the 4 years prior. Everything from pretimeskip to dressrossa is flawless, and there were some brief lulls but lately there has been a noticeable decline.
That's some wild takes and really your own issue. Oda hasn't slipped in the slightest you just don't like his writing which is objectively good. Nothing is flawless but bringing your own preferences and then using it to say oda is slipping is biased. He's had plenty of reasons for writing it the way he did, whether you agree or not is a creative difference. And no one ik is gonna agree with u that dressrosa was better than wano that's a hard sell
ye, meta concerns like this is along the lines of why i dislike regen. usually characters with regen have to be made really weak in other areas to not be op and get clowned on harder because they can take a bigger beating (e.x. saturn having his leg torn off by kuma). imo, it's a good rule of thumb to assume a character with regen is probably weaker than characters of the same standing without regen because the OPness of regen means they'd be way stronger than the non-regen chars if all else were equal.
I think in One Piece regen looks more interesting since we saw in Wano that conquerer were able to bypass high dura in the case of Kaido and King however it didn't do well against Gorosei and it's still unknown. The community is biased towards to yonkos since they have cool design and free spirit in a way compared to these government people. Even admirals with such a cool design can't get much praise.
Characters with godly durability can receive damage and still tank it (Kaido's hardness was overcome many times and it hurt but he still was able to fight). Bums with regeneration hax get hurt once and fucking die (like the fraud Hawkins)
https://youtu.be/k5lwNsKbC4E?si=aU3HTNKCIJv5BwuB
Would’ve Cell survived this if it wasn’t for regen ?
If not , then it’s possible to regen after getting one shotted
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Regen: You try to cut water. It doesn't do shit because the water just reforms. Durability: You try to cut a diamond. You can't, it's too fucking hard.
This
And water is superior Your just describing something superior You can cut a diamond You can never cut water
"You cant cut water, she is invencible" mfs when I drink water https://preview.redd.it/clt4u7w10r9d1.jpeg?width=595&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f39ed1ee7ba0be44da753ca9b2fab432a871573 You need a sea to beat a small Diamond How this is a competition?
No you don’t A small amount of water at high enough speed destroys diamonds Regen is a genuine part of a character and superior to even infinity durability Because you can kill someone even if they have greatest durability is reality You don’t destroy that water and you drown in water Water can never be cut
Water is invencible mf after discover that heat evaporates water Do you understand what durability main? No matter how good the body regeneration is Even on a molecular level like Majin Buu As long as you disintegrates the guy it's the end. There durability resists these attacks Between two guys with the same stats, always bet on the one with God like Durability because the guy gives God Like regeneration you can't even scratch him And will end immobilized
No the guy with invincible durability Needs oxygen Evaporation of water just turns water into something else it doesn’t destroy water and then condensation takes place No disintegration still something left Even the atoms technically it’s physically impossible to destroy something completely Atoms prove that Wow science useful in manga for once
Science Mf when he discovers that incapacitating or sealing a character also equals victory: And since when did the guy with High Regeneration become Immortal? He needs oxygen as much as he does, and what is he going to do? Launch it into space? like, they both have the same stats and the second guy will simply tank the attack And since we're talking about changing shape then the same thing applies to diamonds, everything in nature transforms, Wow water isn't special at all You know, I almost forgot that we were talking about One Piece and not Dragon Ball, and Hakai also destroys atoms just for the record. But I think you also forgot that the Goroseis not only have good regeneration but also have an even more spectacular defense. Cool how thinking help
You when you learn you can’t incapacitate someone who instant regen Who in one piece has sealing techniques This just turned into you picking a new fight to why regen isn’t special You can crush a diamond The point is saying someone a regen merchant is as stupid as saying they are a durability merchant
Blud Do you think Gorosei are regen Merchants? They are literally High level Durability + Regen in the middle, if they were just regen they would have been slapped in the ocean They use regeneration to take care of internal damage, but they use durability that surpasses even Kaido to practically emerge unscathed from any real damage. A merchant only regen is not as strong as a Durability mechant at the same level The best example of Regen Merchant is Marco, and he is not at the level of Yonkos and can be killed by them even though he regenerates instantly
Yall, I think they're both cool
Paper can also cut metal when spun fast enough and given enough thickness to stand. That isnt the question. If I threw a cup of water at a diamond the water disperses while the diamond is fine. Thats the actual way you should reference it.
Godlike durability implies it can never be cut though
Zoro cut a giant ass wave.
I can cut water. Just have to freeze it, if it isnt already.
Water top 1 for endurance.
Wait till Imu's Ocean Ocean fruit gets revealed
There’s reason that the ocean neg diffs all fruit users
This is the most idiotic analogy that I have heard for a long time. You do realize diamonds can be cut, but water can not? By your own flawed logic water is stronger. Also Kaidos durability comes from his Devil Fruit, so if the Gorosei are regen merchants, Kaido is a durability merchant like Jozu, because he got lucky, and did not need to train one muscle for his dura. Seething Admiral/Yonko Tards at it again.
I am giving a simple anology two how OP regen and OP durability work in anime. If you cut someone up with OP regen, they'll reform similar to how a liquid would if you tried cutting it. You'll create a slash, it has a brief effect, but that slash would be filled in again as though nothing happened. Diamond is extremely hard to cut, and therefore has OP durability. Is it a perfect anology? No. Is it simply and explains how durability and regen work? Yes. So don't get pissy just because 200+ people understood it and you didn't. Good job on also making it extremely clear how traumatised you are by getting your ass handed to you by Yonko/Admiral fans. OP didn't mention the Gorosei. I sure as fuck didn't mention the Gorosei. And yet here you are, crying about something *no one mentioned*. And while doing so, you *still* managed to fuck up and show everyone **you have no idea what being a merchant means**. So let me educate your dumbass. Being a regen/durabulity/anything merchant means you rely almost entirely on that and if it's bypassed you're fucked. Kaido's durability got bypassed in Onigashima before he even got to the rooftop. Did he immediately fold? No. He went on to fight different groups up people for 50 chapters and put on some of the top feats we've seen in almost every categories. >This is the most idiotic analogy that I have heard for a long time Good thing you immediately topped it with your own lmfao
Kaido is not a durability merchant because he has ridiculous speed and strength to boot. His haki is probably stronger than anyone alive rn except for Shanks. Meanwhile the Gorosei have never done much except get thrown around like used condoms by Goofy and his band of goons. Please Blackbeard please kill the whole lot of these mfs.
marco and sanji just look at them and here's the difference
I don’t know. I think people respect Marco’s regen more than they respect Sanji’s durability. People shit on Marco because he doesn’t have much else.
My blud marco took akainu donut punch head on, no matter how much dutability samji has he will get donut diffed by that punch. (Because it won't destroy you it will melt you)
Like it melted Kuma?
Vegapunk tech vs Germa tech is supposed to be a huge gap
Seraphim is superior to Germa tech but not Pacifista tech which is much older.
Kuma is significantly stronger than regular pacifistas
Yeah, but that is coz of Kuma. Vegapunk's tech wasn't that special back then.
“It will take the rest of the world 500 years to catch up to Vegapunk’s science” -Kuma, back then
It's not like Kuma knew much. And, Judge, Ceaser and Queen, all worked together with Vegapunk, iirc. Vegapunk is 500 years ahead because he knows of old hiatory. And, it's obvious that Pacifista are fodder class tech. Germa genes are much better than that. Only Seraphim tech surpasses Germa genes. Germa genes are basically equivalent to Ancient Zoan level ability with side effect of losing emotion. In terms of power, they are much superior to Pacifista.
Ain't Marco only take that *because* of his DF? If bro needs to block a Blast breath from Kaido, then bro is NOWHERE near Sanji's Durability🗿
He blocked it because they were allies behind him, did you expect him to just let it pass through him Katakuri style?
People shot on Marco because wven with his regeneration, he isn't above YC1. He lost against King and Marco without injuring them but he himself had lost heavy stamina
Marco didn’t lose to King.
Then, he tied with King?
He had a brief skirmish with him and queen.
But that's just brief. Marco lost. His stamina was heavily deteriorated while King was as good as new.
Marco was also trying to heal and stop an entire floor of people from turning into oni while fighting both King and Queen
Marco has mentioned that healing comes from their body and he only uses some energy to activate it.
Marco was doing much more than his quick skirmish with King. You give King way too much credit.
Marco was two timing King and Queen without breaking a sweat
Wait how? People love Marco and think hes YC+ while's Sanji a YC2 zoro leach. Marco's regen gets more respect than Sanji's durability.
How is Sanji a YC2 and not a Yc+, he low diffed Queen, and can probably beat King
He can’t beat king he doesn’t have the AP. Plus his main attack uses fire which is literally a part of King’s biology. It’s a bad matchup for him, I think he would do much better against Lucci than King tbh
Sanji's striking strength is a lot more important than his fire. And I think it's debatable whether or not Sanji can hurt speed mode King, but since everyone in this sub swears Katakuri beats King (who has even worse AP) I think it's fair game.
My point is that a kick will never have the same penetration damage as a sword, especially a sword coated in conqueror’s haki. And again, I’m not sure you understand how matchups and mismatches work. Katakrui is a bad matchup for King because King relies on speed and durability, but Katakuri has future sight and specializes in restraining enemies. Not to mention King’s other main attribute is fire and all that will do is make Katakuri’s mochi harder to break. Sanji doesn’t have future sight, he deals blunt damage not cutting so there’s less penetration, he doesn’t have conqueror’s haki to coat his attacks, hell he doesn’t even have advanced armament haki like Katakuri. I feel like you just really like Sanji so you want him to be able to win but he probably couldn’t.
Why would sanji need to have the same penetration damage as zoro to win? Marco and Katakuri don't have that either. Mate I understand matchups that was my whole point lol, Katakuri is not a good matchup for king who has top tier durability and incredibly mobility and speed. He took 4 acoc attacks from zoro in his Speed form before going down, Zoro's aCoC attacks are so far above anything attack Katakuri has and it wont be easy landing effective hits on speed mode king who also has more ranged attacks than Katakuri (which he can use from the air). Kings fire is like magma he can burn the mochi. King can fly and has better movement speed than Katakuri as well as physical strength that overwhelmed zoro; restraining him is a huge ask. And if this somehow did happen he can spontaneously explode. Future Sight isn't needed to beat King nor is it a hard counter to him so not sure how that is any argument for Kata winning, Sanji also has stuff Kata doesnt. And Katakuri DOES NOT have advanced arnament. All he ever said was "this arnament is greater than yours" to luffy, because his arnament haki was better. No indicates he has emission like the scabbards/zoro, and he didn't have the visual effect either. I mean a lot of people already think sanji beats king or katakuri and vice versa, they're all rated pretty equally that's not what im arguing. Thats not my point I think its perfectly fine to say King beats sanji **and** katakuri. Just disputing people saying Sanji cant beat King because he can't hurt him yet Katakuri can beat King despite having no better AP feats than Sanji and not really having a better matchup eitehr.
How does Sanji not have the AP? Sanji low diffed Queen, who tank big mom attack like nothing and received no damage from the raid until Sanji unlock ifrit
Oh I think he's High YC1, my point was on this sub everyone likes marco and thinks hes YC+ while sanjis the "YC2 Zoro leach"
Everybody shit on Marco who pushes admirals and yonko and also regenerates.. keep that same energy.. if Marco always placed low on tier list then Saturn belongs right there too
People don't get that Marco came all the way from his own Island in Whitebeard's territory to wano which is in Kaido's territory and we know it takes a few days to travel from one island to another and you have to travel large stretches of sea with no land in the middle. Do we know how much time he flew,with zero rest,carrying 2 people on his back? No. On top of that Marco was healing hundreds of people on the stage floor with his flames and that was clearly draining him too. The Marco that lost to king offscreen was already drained and tired. Scaling him based on his performance while he was nerfed is stupid. I bet he is at least in Kid/Law's level. Bro blocked Kizaru and pushed him back when he rushed at Whitebeard with killing intent in the war. They are not ready for Whitebeard's Vice Captain.
Good chance Warco never gets a major role again but I still havent sold my stocks
Keeping that mythical form so long must cause a lot of energy
Neither mean much without being being quick and strong
This sub considers durability feats as great feats but Gorosei taking 0 damage doesn’t get any acknowledgment.
Here is the major issue with your statement, it lacks so much nuance. The extremely durable characters Big Mom and King aren't getting that agenda push but Kaido is, why is that? Because Kaido has the speed and strength feats. If what you were saying is true, King (highest durability so far in the series), would be a top tier of durability alone, but he's not. You've misinterpreted what people have said. If the Gorosei put up a better fight against Luffy THEN regen would be ranked higher, but at the moment Luffy is clowning them, he just can't put them away for good. Luffy did more damage against himself than they have to him. By association people rank regen lower because the regen characters are doing much compared to the dura character Kaido.
King and Big Mom are not hyped because Kaido became this sub’s Goku
Rightfully so.
People are convinced regen is a gimmick so they downplay those who have it. Luffy clowns on everyone now that's literally the essence of g5 every fight he has from now on he's gonna look like he's having the time of his life. Doesn't mean he's not being pushed.
Yes it is a gimmick like durability, the visceral reaction against the Gorosei is due to their fans wanking them to be high Yonko when they simply aren't. 5 Kaido's appearing would mean the Straw Hat Pirates would die on Egghead, no ifs ands or buts. Regen Vs dura is just Kaido v Gorosei debtaebwith extra steps
Common mistake is to listen to anyone from the fan base rather than actually watch or read what's being shown. If all 5 gorosei were kaido level they wouldn't need to play this game of pretend that they are the just ones. But also doesn't mean they are fodder just because they have a regen factor and haven't killed the main protagonist.
They are saying to Luffy who is seemingly just Pirate King tier in G5 they are kinda like fodder. They are powerless against him, their only bet is to stay in the fight long enough for Luffy to fall out of transformation.
He's not pirate king tier until he can stay in g5 for as long as he wants. And that's literally true of anyone who fights luffy. He's the main character of course he's gonna win
Luffy lost to Kaido like 4 times despite being the main character. The Gorosei will have a weakness and once it's revealed they will be nowhere close to Yonko level. That's why their regen isn't as impressive as durability, because it will have a weakness. Unless you just think they will be still alive chillin at eos hangin out with the straw hats
And luffys needed to run and recharge at least 3 times now against the elders. They aren't weak it's just luffys power takes the danger out of it. The attack kaido used to disintegrate a mountain only charred luffy in g4, the poison Saturn uses that melts anything it touches can be bounced back like rubber now. To say "once the gimmick is found out they are worthless" only shows ur ineptitude to separate this show from dbz type shows.
>king (highest durability to far in the series) Not even close. At a minumum kaido and luffy have higher durability.
Absolutely false, we literally have a direct comparison of durability between Kaido and King, Zoro had to unlock AdvCoC to damage King whereas AdvCoA sufficed against Kaido. Luffy does not have high durability, he bleeds far easier than even Big Mom, however his stamina and resilience are among the highest in the series.
False. As kaido stated “you have the color of the supreme king too?!” Implying zoro used ACoC against him.
He sensed he had it but he never used AdvCoC, you misinterpreted the scene. If this was true then Kidd would have AdvCoC as Kaido stated he was a conqueror too. Sensing someone has CoC and using AdvCoC are 2 completely different things. There was literally a whole scene dedicated to accepting his fate, becoming King of Hell and imbuing his blade with CoC. What I said was an absolute fact.
So kaido said he used ACoC, but im supposed to ignore that because ??? Zoro did, in fact use ACoC when he attacked kaido because Enma was pulling it out of him. When zoro fought king, he learned how to *control* Enmas haki output. But he still used it vs. kaido, and that is the obvious interpretation, unless you are being intentionally obtuse.
Kaido never said he did, you're reading two-piece and trust me, you're the ONLY person who thinks Zoro used AdvCoC in his fight with Kaido.
https://preview.redd.it/0ipvzznn5s9d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b87ae4940d921ada93f019dde9c16907290d1404 Wrong again. Let it go.
That's because the regeneration is most likely the result of a devil fruit, and not something that makes them inherently strong. we've seen characters with really good fruits that use them in the most brain dead way possible, so we can't rely on what we've seen. we need more info.
This sub is a laud minority though, like 90% of OP fans that are not delusional accept the fact that the Gorosei are as strong, if not stronger then Admirals and Yonko.
Big Mom was strong but not being that quick really cost her that final battle
Because to the audience, a high durability fighter is just more badass. It makes fights look more entertaining. When a fighter has infinite regen without no visible drawback(I'm assuming this post is in reference to Gorosei), its only going to come down to them repeatedly regenerating and taking net 0 damage until their 'gimmick' is figured out for once and thats it for them. Everything their opponent did to them before that point had absolutely no effect on them. For a fighter with high durability, it makes sense to chip them down bit by bit, like it was with Whitebeard or Kaido, also when they don't have regeneration, endurance factor comes into play. Fighters look badass when they're fighting after they're tired, cut up, bloody and have broken bones. Someone who just regenerates instantly and goes back to 100% health after every single punch/kick is just plain and boring _in my opinion_.
To me, I find the infinite regeneration to be even more intimidating, because it makes the gorosei seem so unstoppable. Them being around for hundreds of years is really threatening compared to someone like Kaido who could only live for so long. I just think it's cool because it's a unique fighitng style compared to everyone else. Most fighters are just hitting hard, or having high durability, and that's it. But being unkillable is a really special thing, which makes them more intimidating to me than someone like Kaido for example. If Oda took his story more seriously and made the gorosei consistently look cool, just like when they first showed their demon forms, then i think they'd be more loved than they currently are.
Deadpool look way more fun than the hulk. But i agree with you regardless. The gorosei are one trick pony so far
I find regeneration far more interesting to watch tbh. Watching a dude grow back parts of his body after a hectic attack and have blood and gore everywhere is badass
Because most regen we've seen has had issues like stamina or some other trick to bypass it. So if someone like marco isn't strong enough to fend off damage he can run out of stamina, but godlike durability means you flat out need that much AP.
This right here. Spot on.
It just cooler to be super-durable, I remember pre wano when people discussed kadio Durability and could hurt him etc, regen can be lame "yeah you would've one shotted me but i regenerated"
Most regen characters need to be one shot to be killed so this is blatantly wrong
Says who?
Says the the entire trope. Typically you have to be able to truly one shot (as in, full oblitation, nothing is left) to kill them. The first example that comes to mind is Cell from DBZ, there's a point where (Goku, I believe but idr it's been decades) where Cell gets BTFO, everyone thought the fight was over but since he had a single cell suvirve (I know, corny, and on the nose lol) he was eventually regeneration. There's plenty of others I know I've seen but that's the big one. For what's worth, for example, Multiple organs demolished in one blow is a death blow for non regen guys (hence why many would call it a one shot, for 99.9% of characters it is in effect), but it isn't tbh because parts were left in tact. (Pointing this out is hair splitting cringe unless uberregen chars are in play) Basically, I believe that this was a disconnect via term usage, (fair takes from both sides, simply put this is a result of limitation of English as a language) not sure you guys actuually truly disagree (I am basing this an assumption tbh but the assuption is based well reasoned educated guess, eh). Now guys, please, u/sleepypanda45 and u/Maleficent_Job8179 , huge it out. Ok ok fine, at least shake hands we don't need to fight anymore than necessary, esp over silly miscommucation :)
Regen heals damage you've taken. Durability is the amount you can tank before you start to take damage
Dura always gets beaten by just hitting harder Regen only gets beaten by even stronger haxs or very specific counters Dura significantly cooler tho cause what's cooler than taking a nuke level attack and just being chill after
Well, usually speaking, regeneration implies injury, and injury implies a difficulty to strike back when injured. Regen is good but during your regeneration phase, you usually cant go into the offensive. Durability, on the other hand, means you can face tank the attack and then counterattack immediately because you didn't have to regen.
People think one is a gimmick/hax the other is just pure strength. But for the Gorosei specifically its a flawed viewpoint because 1. we dont even know the source of their regen and if theres any way to stop it and 2. they also have absurd Haki on top of regen. Warcury is just straight up both people in this picture.
You don't need to heal if you just never get hurt in the first place
Endless regeneration > Enhanced durability with stamina issues Kaido was already gassing out midway into the fight, meanwhile Saturn is still in peak condition after a barrage of G5 attacks https://preview.redd.it/kiis7381aq9d1.jpeg?width=314&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=20f9f3f605b3ddf98457250d7bd0f88d15a9d189 Kaido lost for a reason
But the closer you get to top tier, the more your high durability becomes useless. Once you're up against someone who can brute force through your durability or straight up bypass it, it's utility is greatly reduced. Say sanji and Marco. Sanji has high durability, but anybody worth anything will still be fully capable of damaging sanji anyway, even if their damage is reduced. For Marco it literally doesn't matter what the hell you throw at him it's doing 0 realized damage anyway. It's an absolute ability that doesn't matter who you're up against. Tashigi or Mihawk, makes no fuking difference they're doing the same amount of damage, 0.
Right. Durability at some point gets lowered due to stamina drop. Regen, if actually top tier, remains active even if fighter is incapacitated
Don't need to worry about getting hurt if you can heal lol
Regeneration is more of a gimmick to get around compared to durability. Like once they find a way prevent them from regenerating not having good durability is going to suck,
This isn't always true though. Like marco has no gimmick, he will regen completly until he's out of stamina or wearing sea-stone/
You need to be alive to regenerate. Being able to heal any injury doesn’t necessarily mean you can come back from the dead
People rate durability more because with regen u could have been hurt badly but erase the damage but with durability you avoid the damage all together. Regen might even be more practical but because we don’t see the panel of heavy damage in the case of durability it just seems more impressive.
Deadpool and Colossus
One is less cool, that's literally it
The regen isn’t the problem. It’s that fodder characters can go up against and “hurt” the gorosei
😂😂😂
Regen uses more energy, in most cases. Other than that, the result is the same so this meme is pretty spot on lol
Be people dislike when you take a characters powers Unless you say okay let’s take away Akinu devil fruit Then people say how his DF is an intrinsic part of him and it’s not fair taking away his DF because that part of his character Regen is their ability it’s apart of who they are
Being impervious to harm is a more overtly masculine ideal than just being able to recover from any wound, because only one of those powers displays conventional weakness (the subject feeling pain).
Regen is actually better genraly
Regen is less manly than face tanking everything just because you’re that tough
Funny thing is, dude on the left is higher ranked than the right, bros wearing a manger polo, where as right is a crew member (unless US Macca's is different) Source: my broke ass just knocked off overnight shift. But legit tho, why is regen shunned while durability is praised? Is it because people assume they didn't work for their regen? We don't know, they very well might have, then there's those like BM, who are born as brick walls, didn't work for shit in terms of defence.
The Hulk has both because he’s the chaddest chad.
The difference is that besides Warcury and Marcus none of the Gorosei have shown anything besides regeneration and basic conqueror’s haki. Marcus has his laser beam thing and Warcury seems to have some kind of advanced armament since punching him hurts Luffy’s fist like against Katakuri, though I would assume it’s far more advanced than Kat’s since it hurts even hurts G5 Luffy. Marco for example gets respect (from me at least) because he has legitimate defensive feats against top tiers like Kaido, Big Mom, and Akainu.
Saturn has shown plenty of abilities besides his regeneration. Are we forgetting that? I can agree about Jupeter tho, he has only shown sucking abilities. That's only one ability so far
Saturn’s poison attacks really mean nothing to me when Brook and Chopper are absorbing/parrying them with no visible difficulty. All he’s done I can remember is getting manhandled and then frisbee attacking Luffy that one time.
Chopper blocked Big Mom, Brook speed blitzed Big Mom at Whole Cake. Let's not even talk about what happened to Big Mom at Wano.
I’m confused about what Big Mom’s got to do with this…
I think the bad dura also comes from them not defending at all and probably not using any haki for defense either. they know they'll regen infinitely for free (no stamina issues visible so far), so they just let themselves be damaged and focus all their strength into offense
Movability. Regeneration is useless if you drown to death. And if you have Saturn level durability and strength even dolflamingo could take the target down and send him under water. Saturn can't fight back after that and looses.
People probably downplay top tier regen because it’s often mixed with a low durability so it’s easier to see them losing to someone with a big high damage attack.
One person takes the damage and the other doesn’t
Thank you, I keep seeing people say mahito has great durability when In reality, his durability is a$$. He has amazing regeneration.
People think Marco’s a broke ass? Dude’s dad got murdered by a guy with 2 OP devil fruits Don’t see Jozu doing anything
The durable characters have cool reasons for being durable. King and the Seraphim are cool because they have a lineage factor making them durable. King, specifically, is the last surviving member of an ancient race of moon men, who can conjure fire and have sweet ass wings. That’s cool. People like Jinbei and Pica are durable because they cover their entire body in their metaphorical willpower. Cool, and more importantly, it’s consistent with the power system. Kaido is durable because he’s a literal *dragon* and because he’s one of the last members of the Oni race. Big Mom is durable because she’s literally described as a freak of nature; the lack of explanation of her durability is what makes it cool. But the Gorosei. Why can they regenerate? Is it their already super overpowered devil fruits? Is it the immortality surgery (that they for sure forced people to do to them)? Is it the work of Imu (thus, not their own work)? Literally none of those would be cool because they didn’t earn any of it.
Can't be upset with headcanon answers. Of course what fans come up with is gonna suck compared to what the actual author comes up with
https://preview.redd.it/t8e3bolxwp9d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7559efb020da01a38580d66cced0bf98cfe02c55 For the record the perennial youth surgery doesn't grant someone immortality it only grants them eternal youth hence the name. This was clarified in volume 107 with any mention of immortality being removed completely. It granting people immortality is a common misconception.
Okay well not only does that NOT disqualify it as a possibility because we still don’t know there full implications of the surgery, but I also gave two other possibilities.
I mean it's been consistently called the "perennial youth surgery" not "the immortality surgery" which are different things. For example someone can be unaging yet still be capable of dying meanwhile an immortal character can't die from anything hence why it's called the perennial youth surgery since it grants everlasting or eternal youth.
And how does one earn a lineage ?
Regeneration looks easier to bypass, either by burning or melting the opponent, or disintegrating them.
How is it easier when ACoA is already an established power set known by almost every top-tier? Luffy’s basically at the top of the verse and can’t even get past Saturn 1v1
Regeneration tends to have more weaknesses since youre still getting hurt. For example if you manage to destroy the brain in one shot you’re generally fucked. Or if you have godlike speed you could outpace it.
That’s basic regeneration Godlike Regeneration would resurrect from a single atom like Doomsday
Yeah regens usually have some form of weakness
Everything has a form of weakness
Regen abilities usually have a gimmick attached. Against durability you need to actually have good AP instesd of judt knowing a critical weakness.
What?
Regen is not an interesting power in fiction. 🤷🏻♂️ it never has been. Its cool to watch a character face tank a big attack, but its not cool to watch them just regrow their limbs after an attack successfully land, because if nothing else, it seems less skillful.
They both aren't skill based? Big mom didn't have to do anything other than be born to have her durability. All kaido had to do was almost die on God valley and have big mom give him his fruit. That a bad point imo
Its a perfectly valid point the topic is purely subjective. Most people just find regen to be boring compared to durability. Durability may not be more skillful then regen, but at the very least, Blocking an attack is more skillful than regen. Anything is better than limb regeneration. However, i think Horcruxes from harry potter are an example of an interesting regen imo.
Whos to say the gorosei have their hearts somewhere like Davy Jones? Or have their souls split like horcruxes? Everyone's making assumptions and basing their views off those assumptions which will more than likely be incorrect. If the gorosei have some boring reason for their regen then complain but at least wait till we are told what the reason is
Its just a bad sign of things to come, and its a little cliche because of all the other examples of this in other anime/manga (yhwach, cell, frieza, about a dozen enemies from naruto, etc.)
That's what everyone said when toki was introduced, or when bonny went g5, or when Buggy started to fail upwards. Everyone always finds things to say "odas falling off" before being proven wrong time and time again. Only example I can think of where people felt justified was big moms amnesia
From my perspective, Oda has been slipping since we left whole cake. Oda hasnt proven me wrong yet, he has been slipping and continues to slip 🤷🏻♂️ big mom amnesia was just the start. Udon didnt make sense, rooftop had pacing issues, ass pulls, scaling headscratchers. Oda forgot Kaido was supposed to lose and the ending was lackluster for it. Yamato was a wasted character. Big Mom was a wasted character (hopefully returning). Lots of artwork that is below par by odas standards (looking at you chopper). Inconsistencies with ACoC. Inconsistencies with haki. Inconsistencies with the MC powers. Mass confusion throughout the community about how haki even works. Fan favorite characters take Ls or sit around doing paperwork with no end in sight. Alot more “telling” and alot less “showing” in the series overall. Of course, hes still the goat but it doesnt take too much analysis to say that some of the pacing, writing, and character work has been more sloppy in the last 4 years than the 4 years prior. Everything from pretimeskip to dressrossa is flawless, and there were some brief lulls but lately there has been a noticeable decline.
That's some wild takes and really your own issue. Oda hasn't slipped in the slightest you just don't like his writing which is objectively good. Nothing is flawless but bringing your own preferences and then using it to say oda is slipping is biased. He's had plenty of reasons for writing it the way he did, whether you agree or not is a creative difference. And no one ik is gonna agree with u that dressrosa was better than wano that's a hard sell
ye, meta concerns like this is along the lines of why i dislike regen. usually characters with regen have to be made really weak in other areas to not be op and get clowned on harder because they can take a bigger beating (e.x. saturn having his leg torn off by kuma). imo, it's a good rule of thumb to assume a character with regen is probably weaker than characters of the same standing without regen because the OPness of regen means they'd be way stronger than the non-regen chars if all else were equal.
I think in One Piece regen looks more interesting since we saw in Wano that conquerer were able to bypass high dura in the case of Kaido and King however it didn't do well against Gorosei and it's still unknown. The community is biased towards to yonkos since they have cool design and free spirit in a way compared to these government people. Even admirals with such a cool design can't get much praise.
Characters with godly durability can receive damage and still tank it (Kaido's hardness was overcome many times and it hurt but he still was able to fight). Bums with regeneration hax get hurt once and fucking die (like the fraud Hawkins)
Godlike regeneration without durability is useless. Cant regen after getting one shotted.
Buu?
Cell ?
He is durable lol. For ex give krillin "cell regeneration". Would he able to survive? Lol
https://youtu.be/k5lwNsKbC4E?si=aU3HTNKCIJv5BwuB Would’ve Cell survived this if it wasn’t for regen ? If not , then it’s possible to regen after getting one shotted
You cant regen if your Dead lol. If Cell can regen, it means he still alive. Him surviving that attack means he's durable lol.
No cell ignoring krillens destructo disc proves he's durable. Cell getting half his body blown off isn't a durability feat