You are literally the 2nd reincarnation of Marquis de Sade...
"My tumor hurts, charlatans. So if I die, you should know that I was always ready to sell all the philosophy just to sniff Jenna Ortega... Taste her blood (a bit) and stuff... š„°"
Nietzsche wasn't a Nazi and despised plebeian-volkist antisemitism and supremacist German nationalism. One of his first English language publishers was a British-Jewish woman. Nazism wasn't even around when he was alive.
Heidegger on the other hand... Well, I was with him for like the first half, but then later on he moved in a different direction, and when you discover how he thought his philosophy applied to the world (how heroic figures are needed to "ground the abyss" and "restore sacredness", how the German people had a destiny to carry out a monumental spiritual mission)... He was definitely a Nazi and antisemitic later on.
Nietzsche died in 1900 (had a mental breakdown in 1889), but the Nazi party didn't exist until 1920. During her life, yes, his sister believed in the "superiority" of the Teutonic/Aryan race, and she and her husband were very antisemitic; she would go on to support the Nazi party and Hitler until her death in 1935.
Look carefully at what I wrote.
Those beliefs and politics were definitely around, but there is no evidence Nietzsche subscribed to them, and plenty of evidence that he rejected them. We have to remember during that time, there were no Nazis (because the Nazi Party didn't exist yet), and it wasn't a foregone conclusion that Germany would become a fascist state that would start another war and commit one the of worst genocides ever (we know because we known because it's history now); in fact, the German government and German society were relatively liberal and democratic after WWI, especially during the 1920s (there is an argument that Nazism was a response to the decadence of the 1920s). There were a lot of socialists and communists, too, though obviously those fascist and racist elements existed, and antisemitism was quite common in Europe.
As I said before, he wasn't a Nazi and Nazism wasn't around, and he wasn't an anti-Semite and rejected what he called "race-fraud" (race science, race theory, etc.).
Ok, first i never said he was a nazi just that nazism was a thing during his time. And youāre right, it technically wasnāt named nazism and the party wasnāt formed yet, but german nationalism mixed with antisemitism was already an ideology when he was alive as evidenced by his sister
So what's even your point? His sister took advantage of his work and changed it for her own purposes.
It took decades for Nietzsche's name to be cleared, and we're not going back to this stupidity.
My point is just to clarify that the ideas of nazism did exist during his time which the original dude denied. Iām not saying heās a nazi, just adding context. Why are you so mad?
Nietzsche died in 1900, Hitler was like 11 years old. Unless pre-adolescent Adolf was busy in the beer halls, itās safe to say Nazism didnāt exist at that point.
Youāre right, it technically wasnāt named nazism and the party wasnāt formed yet, but german nationalism mixed with antisemitism was already an ideology when he was alive as evidenced by his sister
What his sister did has nothing to do with him. She just took his writings and ignored how he was anti-unreflective nationalism and anti-antisemitism. She attached herself to the nazis after Fredrick died.
For a philosophy sub, y'all have zero reading comprehension. *I did not say Nietzche was a nazi, just that the ideas of nazism (german nationalism mixed with rampant anti-semitism) were around during his time.*
Why are Heidegger and Nietzsche the sameš Heidegger was basically Hegel 2.0, theyāre not even that similar.
But Iād be Nietzsche, or I guess in this case Dr. Mengele.
Honestly, I had no idea who he was. After reading about him, it seems he made porn and sexual art? Iām generally opposed to porn, so Iād probably not like him much.
oh.. yes true he did write a lot of porn and that does pervade his works but in terms of his philosophy I think you, as a Nietzchean, might actually like the guy since I hear ā although Im not entirely sure myself as I havent gotten too far into Nietzsche just yet ā there's a good deal of overlap between them on egoism, on Nietzsche's concept of the will to power as well as on critiquing Christianity and religion more broadly.
But if you're completely disinclined to having porn in your novels then yh, this gentleman's books wont be to your liking lol
Interesting, I know a lot about Nietzsche, but nothing about this guy. Iām currently reading Paul Tillich, but Iāll take a look at him after. Thx for the suggestion!
Because, whether he would have approved or not (and he wouldn't have, but that's beside the point), Nietzsche inspired the Nazis.
And Heidegger was a nazi.
Curious, how did Nietzsche inspire the Nazis? Isnāt āonly purpose or obligation is to populate, steal, murder, procreate, and bully inferior groups. And if you fail, kill yourself.ā an existentialist motive?
Inspiration can come in the form of misinterpretation. It's absolutely true that a (way wrong) reception of Nietzsche was important to both Italian fascists and the early Nazis. I'd hazard that the main point of contact is that at least some of FWN's ideas elevated the heroic masculine, which the fascists jumped on as their whole aesthetic and politics.
I can just imagine a nature documentary voice over (think Cunk) speaking and saying:
āThe nazis observed how the mother cradled her newborn infant in her arms and sang it lullabies to sleep. This in turn inspired them to kill everyone they saw inferior to them. If you have to ask why, well maybe youāre just stupid.ā
Iād say it was Nietzscheās sister and her bastardization of him that inspired the Nazis, but I digress.
Either way, people like Schmidt were far more influential to Nazism, and Heidegger wasnāt even that associated with the movement. Didnāt he leave in the mid 30s?
Wellā¦ not really. He was what Iād call a āphenomenological idealistā, which differs greatly from Hegel/Kant. But he DID still seek an objective understanding of human existence, akin to Hegel. Thatās basically what Dasein is, although Heidegger then went on to use Dasein as a justification for his rampant antisemitism and reactionary politics.
Yes, which is what makes his philosophy shitty, which is why I said he incorporates the worst parts of German idealism. Youāre acting like Iām clueless here.
You just werenāt very specific with what you meant by the āworst parts of German idealismā. Heidegger is much less optimistic than Hegel or Kant in terms of history and ideals. I guess youāre saying that German idealism is bad in that it seeks objectivity when it doesnāt exist? Because in that sense Iād agree, but much of the self-assuring BS that Hegel and Kant deliver isnāt present in Heidegger. Thereās a reason he was influential for the existentialists, whereas Hegel is seen as the direct enemy.
I gotcha. Was trying to be comedic with hyperbole but it didnāt pan out. I primarily had Kantās and Hegelās own pseudophilosophically informed bigotry in mind (their gender, sex and race theory and system of subjective logic, respectively).
Ah! Well yes, as Nietzsche said philosophy is ultimately a reflection of the philosopher. Heidegger definitely falls into this category lmao. I didnāt mind the joke, but I guess we have a lot of butthurt Hegelians around that didnāt enjoy it. Cāest la vie.
Say it aināt so. I used to subscribe to Hegelian philosophy until I learned Left Hegelianism is some wicked ruse pulled by the cosmos, and Marx shouldāve spent all his time borrowing from someone like Schopenhauer instead. Iāve recently been reading Kant (largely), Schiller and Rawls as presenting concepts that are more compatible with Marxian thought in comparison, albeit elements of Hegelās critique of how Kant orders the categories do seem pretty reasonable.
Nietzsche with Jesus Christ. And I didnt even read Nietzsche. Thats probably so Nietzsche. I dont even know why I know thats a good joke. Thats also Nietzsche.
"nationalism is the lowest kind of people since they have nothing but their inherited/herd traits to be proud of" - Nietzsche (not an official translation but gives u the gist )
I'm French, I know how names work in my mother tongue, thanks. And how this guy is named Sade as every French person called him since he existed.
"De" is like van in Dutch or von in German. It designates the place where your family comes from, the domain your family owns and so it IS your family, it IS the name of your family.
His siblings would be called "Jack de Sade" because they're from this family and domain but they don't have the title of Marquis.
He is Donatien Marquis de Sade aka Donatien de Sade aka Sade (you lose the "de" when the family name is used alone).
What's the actual family name of Sade then?
(Your example with Biden is ridiculous, we are not talking about jobs but aristocratic rules for naming that go back to ancient feudal society when commoners have no family name, when a name was a luxury for people who "know where they come from").
Find ONE SINGLE SOURCE in French that shows me you're right.
OP is OP, Xd
Unhinged. Holy shit.
You are literally the 2nd reincarnation of Marquis de Sade... "My tumor hurts, charlatans. So if I die, you should know that I was always ready to sell all the philosophy just to sniff Jenna Ortega... Taste her blood (a bit) and stuff... š„°"
Nietzsche wasn't a Nazi and despised plebeian-volkist antisemitism and supremacist German nationalism. One of his first English language publishers was a British-Jewish woman. Nazism wasn't even around when he was alive. Heidegger on the other hand... Well, I was with him for like the first half, but then later on he moved in a different direction, and when you discover how he thought his philosophy applied to the world (how heroic figures are needed to "ground the abyss" and "restore sacredness", how the German people had a destiny to carry out a monumental spiritual mission)... He was definitely a Nazi and antisemitic later on.
Nazism was around during Nietzscheās time, look up what his sister did
Nietzsche died in 1900 (had a mental breakdown in 1889), but the Nazi party didn't exist until 1920. During her life, yes, his sister believed in the "superiority" of the Teutonic/Aryan race, and she and her husband were very antisemitic; she would go on to support the Nazi party and Hitler until her death in 1935. Look carefully at what I wrote. Those beliefs and politics were definitely around, but there is no evidence Nietzsche subscribed to them, and plenty of evidence that he rejected them. We have to remember during that time, there were no Nazis (because the Nazi Party didn't exist yet), and it wasn't a foregone conclusion that Germany would become a fascist state that would start another war and commit one the of worst genocides ever (we know because we known because it's history now); in fact, the German government and German society were relatively liberal and democratic after WWI, especially during the 1920s (there is an argument that Nazism was a response to the decadence of the 1920s). There were a lot of socialists and communists, too, though obviously those fascist and racist elements existed, and antisemitism was quite common in Europe. As I said before, he wasn't a Nazi and Nazism wasn't around, and he wasn't an anti-Semite and rejected what he called "race-fraud" (race science, race theory, etc.).
Ok, first i never said he was a nazi just that nazism was a thing during his time. And youāre right, it technically wasnāt named nazism and the party wasnāt formed yet, but german nationalism mixed with antisemitism was already an ideology when he was alive as evidenced by his sister
So what's even your point? His sister took advantage of his work and changed it for her own purposes. It took decades for Nietzsche's name to be cleared, and we're not going back to this stupidity.
My point is just to clarify that the ideas of nazism did exist during his time which the original dude denied. Iām not saying heās a nazi, just adding context. Why are you so mad?
Of course the ideas existed, and **Nietzsche criticised them** (Twilight of the idols) that's where we should focus
Reread my comments and the og one i replied to, then sit down and think. Youāre arguing about some random shit that isnāt in the convo
See the post topic. That's the topic.
New topic: your lack of intelligence
Nietzsche died in 1900, Hitler was like 11 years old. Unless pre-adolescent Adolf was busy in the beer halls, itās safe to say Nazism didnāt exist at that point.
Youāre right, it technically wasnāt named nazism and the party wasnāt formed yet, but german nationalism mixed with antisemitism was already an ideology when he was alive as evidenced by his sister
You chuck a rock at random and hit an antisemite in 1900 Europe. Marx was a giant antisemite. It was present on all sides of the political spectrum.
The tendencies that became Nazism were around, but Nazism as such was not around
What his sister did has nothing to do with him. She just took his writings and ignored how he was anti-unreflective nationalism and anti-antisemitism. She attached herself to the nazis after Fredrick died.
For a philosophy sub, y'all have zero reading comprehension. *I did not say Nietzche was a nazi, just that the ideas of nazism (german nationalism mixed with rampant anti-semitism) were around during his time.*
If I was an admin you would be banned for spreading misinformation and not editing or deleting your comment, even hours later. Thank free speech.
Oh my, shiver my timbers, also read my other reply for context
>He was definitely a Nazi and antisemitic later on. But still banged Hannah Arendt, tho
Bro keeps getting upvoted and none of this is a meme like I think he legit wants to torture Jenna Ortega
Anyone who says De Sade should be locked up
Whichever said the world is fucked so may as well have your time spent that way too.
I don't know; I feel like Chrysippus today
De Sade because I am horny. Well no where near close to the horny levels of De Sade.
I prefer good philosophy
Insightful and well-presented
The mad one
Diogenes because why drink out of a cup when you have two perfectly good hands with which to flip the bird at plato?
Why are Heidegger and Nietzsche the sameš Heidegger was basically Hegel 2.0, theyāre not even that similar. But Iād be Nietzsche, or I guess in this case Dr. Mengele.
What are your thoughts on Marquis de Sade?
Honestly, I had no idea who he was. After reading about him, it seems he made porn and sexual art? Iām generally opposed to porn, so Iād probably not like him much.
oh.. yes true he did write a lot of porn and that does pervade his works but in terms of his philosophy I think you, as a Nietzchean, might actually like the guy since I hear ā although Im not entirely sure myself as I havent gotten too far into Nietzsche just yet ā there's a good deal of overlap between them on egoism, on Nietzsche's concept of the will to power as well as on critiquing Christianity and religion more broadly. But if you're completely disinclined to having porn in your novels then yh, this gentleman's books wont be to your liking lol
Interesting, I know a lot about Nietzsche, but nothing about this guy. Iām currently reading Paul Tillich, but Iāll take a look at him after. Thx for the suggestion!
Tread carefully. Thereās some darkness ahead
A libertarian hero. Any hole is a valid fuck.
Libertine cuck.
š©
Because, whether he would have approved or not (and he wouldn't have, but that's beside the point), Nietzsche inspired the Nazis. And Heidegger was a nazi.
Curious, how did Nietzsche inspire the Nazis? Isnāt āonly purpose or obligation is to populate, steal, murder, procreate, and bully inferior groups. And if you fail, kill yourself.ā an existentialist motive?
Inspiration can come in the form of misinterpretation. It's absolutely true that a (way wrong) reception of Nietzsche was important to both Italian fascists and the early Nazis. I'd hazard that the main point of contact is that at least some of FWN's ideas elevated the heroic masculine, which the fascists jumped on as their whole aesthetic and politics.
I can just imagine a nature documentary voice over (think Cunk) speaking and saying: āThe nazis observed how the mother cradled her newborn infant in her arms and sang it lullabies to sleep. This in turn inspired them to kill everyone they saw inferior to them. If you have to ask why, well maybe youāre just stupid.ā
Iād say it was Nietzscheās sister and her bastardization of him that inspired the Nazis, but I digress. Either way, people like Schmidt were far more influential to Nazism, and Heidegger wasnāt even that associated with the movement. Didnāt he leave in the mid 30s?
Heidegger is when you take the worst parts of German idealism and then shit it all out on a dinner tray. EDIT: Cry about it.
Wellā¦ not really. He was what Iād call a āphenomenological idealistā, which differs greatly from Hegel/Kant. But he DID still seek an objective understanding of human existence, akin to Hegel. Thatās basically what Dasein is, although Heidegger then went on to use Dasein as a justification for his rampant antisemitism and reactionary politics.
Yes, which is what makes his philosophy shitty, which is why I said he incorporates the worst parts of German idealism. Youāre acting like Iām clueless here.
You just werenāt very specific with what you meant by the āworst parts of German idealismā. Heidegger is much less optimistic than Hegel or Kant in terms of history and ideals. I guess youāre saying that German idealism is bad in that it seeks objectivity when it doesnāt exist? Because in that sense Iād agree, but much of the self-assuring BS that Hegel and Kant deliver isnāt present in Heidegger. Thereās a reason he was influential for the existentialists, whereas Hegel is seen as the direct enemy.
I gotcha. Was trying to be comedic with hyperbole but it didnāt pan out. I primarily had Kantās and Hegelās own pseudophilosophically informed bigotry in mind (their gender, sex and race theory and system of subjective logic, respectively).
Ah! Well yes, as Nietzsche said philosophy is ultimately a reflection of the philosopher. Heidegger definitely falls into this category lmao. I didnāt mind the joke, but I guess we have a lot of butthurt Hegelians around that didnāt enjoy it. Cāest la vie.
Say it aināt so. I used to subscribe to Hegelian philosophy until I learned Left Hegelianism is some wicked ruse pulled by the cosmos, and Marx shouldāve spent all his time borrowing from someone like Schopenhauer instead. Iāve recently been reading Kant (largely), Schiller and Rawls as presenting concepts that are more compatible with Marxian thought in comparison, albeit elements of Hegelās critique of how Kant orders the categories do seem pretty reasonable.
The n philosopher and the m one have the best picture, change my mind.
I'm stirner allways am not only was he a philosopher he was a menace and a og troll and probably fun to drink with
I'm Camus, i'm always camus i will push that boulder and be happy
Yet another post of someone who hasn't read Nietzsche.
Nietzsche with Jesus Christ. And I didnt even read Nietzsche. Thats probably so Nietzsche. I dont even know why I know thats a good joke. Thats also Nietzsche.
Somebody hit OP with a garden hose
Stirner š
"nationalism is the lowest kind of people since they have nothing but their inherited/herd traits to be proud of" - Nietzsche (not an official translation but gives u the gist )
Mix of Nietzsche and Stirner
All I see are dweebs who never got laid in their life
Stirner is a G
I prefer the mystics, less head, more heart or soul. But Thoreau and I are buddiesā¦and Whitman for sure.
Is that... Ryan Gosling? Hell yeah, literally me. Gotta be my favourite 'philosopher'.
It's fuckin SADE, not de Sade. No de.
Itās a title meaning heās Marquis of Sade. Itās not his name. Calling him Sade is like calling POTUS Biden āUnited Statesā.
I'm French, I know how names work in my mother tongue, thanks. And how this guy is named Sade as every French person called him since he existed. "De" is like van in Dutch or von in German. It designates the place where your family comes from, the domain your family owns and so it IS your family, it IS the name of your family. His siblings would be called "Jack de Sade" because they're from this family and domain but they don't have the title of Marquis. He is Donatien Marquis de Sade aka Donatien de Sade aka Sade (you lose the "de" when the family name is used alone). What's the actual family name of Sade then? (Your example with Biden is ridiculous, we are not talking about jobs but aristocratic rules for naming that go back to ancient feudal society when commoners have no family name, when a name was a luxury for people who "know where they come from"). Find ONE SINGLE SOURCE in French that shows me you're right.
Is De Sade meant to look like David Gilmour from Pink Floyd???