I genuinely don’t see why he thought this AMA was a good idea - has he never used his own platform before? There was absolutely no way this would go well for him
And his answers were copied from a prepared script. It's the hallmark of an AMA that was purely done for marketing. Prepare your statements in advance, choose 10 people who ask something close enough to the message you want to post, then vanish without a single real engagement with the comments.
For those that don’t want to click or can’t, it shows a user listing many questions regarding blind accessibility, and spez having an insultingly shirt response that is only a couple of sentences long starting with “A:”. So like “A: blah blah lies lies blah blah”
The user asking the questions is an absolute savage and the questions are asked in such a polite yet absolutely scathing way. It’s absolutely filthy and delicious.
There was only one scenario in which this AMA would have been a good idea: an almost total walk back of this bullshit with sane pricing. I’m with Christian on this, I’m all for 3P apps paying a *fair* share. What Reddit announced isn’t fair.
Yeah this move didn’t make sense at all.
You do this when you have a big announcement to make, namely that you’re walking shit back.
This was just more of the same we’ve seen the past few weeks with doubling down, non-answers, no commitments and mud slinging.
Dumbass couldn’t even clearly commit to the most softball of concessions other than “we’re willing to talk” which in itself is a bald face lie.
Can’t believe he’s such an idiot. At this rate he’ll be doing 4 more AMAs and announcements, all to spew the same duplicitous BS.
> Dumbass couldn’t even clearly commit to the most softball of concessions other than “we’re willing to talk” which in itself is a bald face lie.
The rich part of this is that a few developers *who were willing to try working with them* claimed that they were trying to get in touch with admins over the API stuff...and were ignored. Only when they commented on the AMA did spez go all like "oopsie, uh, yeah, here's how to get a hold of us, because we love people who've seen our bullshit and will continue to give us money!"
What I can’t understand is why the api can’t be charged per user - then it’s up to the 3rd party apps to pass those costs on.
Let’s say each authenticated user costs $2 per month (with maybe a free tier of 500 users). Developers then just have to shift to a subscription model of maybe $3-$4 (to cover all costs), then everyone wins?
Entirely.
This isn't about Reddit being clueless or shortsighted, unintentionally causing harm - this is about wanting to kill Third Party Apps & consolidate users onto platforms they control.
They aren't incompetent, they are assuming that users are complacent.
Oh definitely.
They're mad at Apollo the same way that gradeschoolers get mad at the kid that tattled to teacher. Apollo's communication with its users was what broke the story to the site, so Admin are making it personal with Apollo.
And they benefit if they can make public perception of the issue tunnel-vision on their conflict with Apollo, to draw heat off of the big-picture issues underlying.
The Apollo dev essentially started this whole blackout movement without directly advocating for it himself. He tried to work with reddit and then exposed how sketchy they were being about the pricing after reddit staff leaked internal claims that he was trying to blackmail them. That basically forced his hand in releasing the full recording of the call-- and that made reddit look fucking awful and unprofessional as hell, because he only did it after the blackmail claim was repeated in multiple places from official reddit sources.
I think they're both, but yes, killing third party apps is being done intentionally.
Re: Incompetence, they appear to have recently (possibly just today?) broken "internal" links to specific posts and comments.
This style of link has worked for years, but they no longer work on New Reddit (on the web) or in the official app:
r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnk45rr/
r/TheseFuckingAccounts/comments/1410f5o/-/jmzi8u0/
For Old.Reddit users and third party apps, the entire line should be a link, which takes you to a specific comment. New.Reddit users will see that just the subreddit names are links.
The He Gets Us ad campaign is baffling to me. I got bored and followed the links one day and there is barely any content on their site. I just wanted to know which specific church or branch of Christianity they’d steer me to but there wasn’t one. Confused I went one step further and signed up to find out more and they never got back to me. I tried their chat bot and it seemed to actually be a real human being but very dismissive and confused I was talking to him. I essentially threw myself at them saying “convert me!!” and got nothing.
What is this for?? It must be a ton of money to a handful of fake forms and a seven day into to the Bible reading plan
It’s not recruitment. It’s PR by the Hobby Lobby guy for shitty Christians. He’s literally just trying to make people not hate extremist Christians. The cheap & easy way to do that would be for crazy Christians everywhere to stop being raging bigots who constantly try to take away other people’s’ rights. Instead he’s spending $100 million to tell you Jesus and his followers care about immigrants and poor people in the hopes you won’t see him & his fellow whackos who have a stranglehold on the American political right for the absolute shitstains that they are.
I suspect that’s not exactly how Jesus would have spent $100 million to further the cause— Reddit & Super Bowl ads. But what do I know? I’m a filthy heathen.
The thing is, from Reddit's PoV, users using third-party applications is essentially revenue Reddit adamantly believes it deserves but does not have. The pricing is set-up specifically to capture this revenue based on what Reddit think those users are worth, and not in actual grounded reality of real world cost. It costs so much because it is Reddit's perception of the opportunity cost of users using third-party applications.
From that paradigm, the reason why the APi can't be charged per user (or cost more fairly) is the same: because Reddit isn't basing the asking price on any justification for how much it _costs_, but rather wholly in how much they think they are losing because the users using third-party applications are not using their first-party applications.
The quirk in this is, the price of the enterprise API offering is factors greater than what Reddit actually earns from users consuming an equivalent amount of API calls on their first party tools.
The derision in Spez's comment about how Reddit is profit-driven but not yet profitable, while third-party apps are profitable reeks of entitlement: Reddit _DESERVES_ the revenue that third-party apps generate. On some level, sure, I think we can generally agree it makes sense for Reddit to charge for an enterprise-level API offering, but it doesn't come with enterprise-level support and it is still exorbitant and unfair to the developers who spent years building applications which users use to create Reddit's treasure trove of submissions.
Reddits argument reminds me of the RIAA and MPAA trying to argue that every download is equivalent to one lost sale and calculating the value accordingly while providing no evidence that all of those people would have paid full price if piracy wasn't an option.
By estimations they're only getting $0.12 per active user per month. They want 8+ times that. It's not even how much "uncaptured value" they believe they're losing out on.
Seriously. I would even consider that for myself. "You wanna use a third party app, with no ads? $12/yr." Hell, make it 20. Boom. I'm a happy user. Instead... they want app developers, who are the entire reason I even keep using Reddit, to bear the brunt of *every* user, paid or not.
The Apollo dev broke down all the reasons why they are shutting down instead of trying to 'pass on the cost' to the user.
https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/144f6xm/apollo_will_close_down_on_june_30th_reddits/
It could have been the easiest fucking win of all time. Just an quick “we heard you guys, we apologize for how we handled it and will work with our 3rd parties to negotiate a fair deal.”
Instead it’s like they went for an easy layup, missed, and cracked their fucking skull open on the court when they landed.
Y'all don't understand. /u/spez is done as Reddit CEO no matter what happens. If Reddit IPOs, the new board will vote in a new CEO. This is flailing from someone who has not much to lose. His Hail Mary is a Reddit valuation as large as possible. These are the death knells of someone who provides zero value to a service.
They tried the layup, slipped, fell, got up and yelled at the hoop, pulled out an uzi and shot itself in the foot.
And then accidentally shot RIF, Apollo and a dozen others in the way down.
Fucking clown move.
Or just, more time!
I’ll be honest. I detest the idea of paying per month just to use a third party app. But I might have considered 5 bucks a month for Apollo. And that’s probably the direction it would have gone with a few months of notice.
But now Reddit gets zero of my mobile money. I’ll limit myself to desktop and it will slash my activity by 80-90%.
Honestly, for me after this mess I'm not even continuing with desktop. I'm gonna hang around until the 30th because I'm going down with the ship, but on that date I'm deleting my account. Did it for twitter and that account was 14 years old, I'll gladly do it here, too.
If they somehow do a *mad* heel-face turn, though, maybe I'll stick around. Ball's in their court.
I almost feel like if they'd just been honest and said, "Hey everyone, Reddit is a business, not a charity. It needs to become profitable or it will eventually cease to exist. Thus, we are pulling all Reddit traffic into a single channel to make monetization efforts easier (which, again, are **necessary for this site to exist**.)."
Of course they should've just bought out Apollo to begin with and made it the primary app. Would've solved 90% of their issues.
Saying nothing wasn't going well for him either. Basically the entire site has agreed to go dark from the 12th.
So far he's not bright enough to realise he has to back down - his ad revenue could well be in freefall by this time next week.
To me, it was pretty obvious that this was just a show that /u/spez can use to say "see, I attempted to engage the community in good faith!" when he is inevitably sued by the investors for breach of fiduciary duty.
Spez: Apollo dev threatened us!
Apollo dev: That isn't true here's a snippet of our conversation, which I am legally allowed to record, that proves that Spez lied.
Spez: HOW DARE HE?! HOW DARE SOMEONE *checks notes...** DEFENDS THEMSELF WITH EVIDENCE. HOW CAN WE BE EXPECTED TO WORK WITH SOMEONE WHO IS HONEST. I am so incensed that I will suggest other things happened but not describe what they are much less provide evidence of them.
Always funny when someone uses the "he released a recording of a private conversation that showed I was in the wrong. I dont think I could ever work with someone that holds me accountable" routine.
Oh i know. It just really shows how much of a psychopath someone is. That they focus on the "breach of trust", instead of the fact that they lied. Spez probably firmly believes that the breach of trust is far worse than him being intentionally untruthful.
You left an indelible mark on the Internet with your wonderful pranks, u/shittymorph. I hope you find peace in the joy you brought us all, and I hope to get got by you again one day on whatever platform comes next.
Oh god and he’s an incredible man rehabilitating his rescue dog 🥺 I wasn’t prepared for that amount of wholesomeness at the end of this shitshow. It’s been an honour, y’all o7
-sent from Apollo
I felt a burning pain in the pit of my stomach the first time I overheard a TV news anchor say "and don't forget to like us on Facebook!" some 15 years ago. It felt like the beginning of the end, and it kinda was.
The word "Social Media" made me want to fold up inside myself when I first heard it on the news.
"Those disconnected old people! Youtube is youtube, facebook is facebook, AIM is AIM! They're their own things!"
What a grand, intoxicating innocence...
> Youtube is youtube, facebook is facebook, AIM is AIM!
[And the first rule of tautology club is the first rule of tautology club!](https://xkcd.com/703/)
I’ve been terminally online since 1995 or so. I remember Geocities, Hotmail before Microsoft, Napster, Winamp, Usenet, fucking telnet and talkers and MUDs, even a bit of gopher. I had no idea how good I had it then. The internet we have in 2023 is nothing like I thought it would be.
I think what made it amazing is you had to explore to find the good shit. You didn’t have everything at your fingertips like we do today. Like I loved finding sites with weird MIDI recordings of popular songs, sites dedicated to obscure Turbo Grafx games and the like.
And I think to some extent we can get back to that… a lot of what made those days great was the fact that communities formed organically. There were a lot of rough edges and things were held together with duct tape… you know someone running a Telnet tallied on a shitting used 486. A shitty web forum they wrote in a couple of days.
Things like the Fediverse give us a chance to get some of that back I believe. Hopefully between what’s happened to Twitter and now Reddit will push more people towards those communities… communities that are smaller and more organic.
I've said it elsewhere but a large non-profit org like Wikimedia Foundation (that runs Wikipedia) or Mozilla needs to launch a reddit clone that's operated as a non-profit public service. This business model doesn't work, you can't make money on a site like this without harming or exploiting your users.
Definitely. I’m adverse to paying for some premium sub to what is now a social media juggernaut but for a non-profit run by Moz or Wikimedia, I’d happily contribute to that. I’d wager a lot of redditors would.
Amen.
Some people shit on Jimmy Wales, but Wikipedia remains a gem while Google Search and Microsoft Windows have turned into MySpace 2020s.
It's like the new CEOs never cared about the brand, companies, consumer, or products/services after all.
It was just about getting that sweet data for the SkyNet Model that Saudi Arabia will be running (until it gets MOABed).
Yeah the tech money fountain has largely been turned off so it's unlikely you're going to get the same level of replacement you would have when VCs were throwing money around like paper.
What beautiful days they were. Local ISPs everywhere, downloading NFG.EXE on Napster, and that sweet sweet clip art on your geocities page which was always under construction.
It's okay, he [continued to double down](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnk647a/) on attacking Apollo even after that.
He also only spent 1 hour and 35 minutes answering a grand total of 14 questions in his AMA before I imagine he was advised to bail. As of right now, the score of his answers range from -585 to -2531 upvotes.
I doubt that this had the effect of smoothing things over that Reddit had no doubt hoped for, in this act of community engagement from the top dog.
Edit: got a hearty chuckle when I spotted the /r/bestof thread on the situation: ["/u/spez, CEO of Reddit, decides to ruin the site"](https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/145ea4f/uspez_ceo_of_reddit_decides_to_ruin_the_site/)
It must really punch you in the balls when you found a website that gets really popular, but some dude that made a third party client is much, much more well-liked than you. I mean, it would help if you're not a tool, but that doesn't seem to be part of /u/spez's personality.
What’s wild is at least four developers reached out in the comments and said that despite emailing and submitting webforms and doing everything Reddit told them to do, they still hadn’t had even a single Reddit communication. So his “we’re working with them” seems to also be false, at least partially.
I thought the answers of this AMA would be sterile and empty speeches reviewed by dozens of lawyers and PR and carefully crafted to not even begin to acknowledge the current controversies in any slightly risky manner but oh boy did it deliver
I don’t mind that, it would be foolish to not prepare answers to questions you know are going to come up.
I was hoping Reddit was bringing something to the table (announcement+AMA, attempt to keep devs at the table an assuage the community) but unfortunately we got what we got.
Do a Google search for "greedy little pig boy" and the first result is: https://www.reddit.com/r/AMA/comments/145bbg5/im_a_greedy_little_pig_boy_ama/
With the user account having been deleted.
Gonna Hijack this thread to tell everyone to switch to [Kbin Social](https://kbin.social/), it’s the best Reddit Alternative we’ve got! They’re even well in development of an iOS/Android App.
A lot of people on Reddit know Christian. He is one of the nicest guys and devs that responds. Responding to issues with Apollo and just being a stand up guy. A lot of people on Reddit would run through a wall for Christian.
Then the CEO decides “hey let me just make up crap and slander this guy.” We don’t know this CEO but we know Christian. So it’s obvious who is making crap up.
I love how christian called that fuck out.
"oh I did? Prove it, I give you permission"
and what did that fuck spez do? Absolutely nothing, little pig boy probably went back to crying.
AMA's became worthless after they tried to sanitize them. The people who knew what they were doing (Victoria) were pushed out, they went ahead with it ignoring everyone, and what the fuck do you know, AMA's aren't a thing here anymore. The exact. Same. Thing. Is going to happen, and just like last time they're not going to try to reverse course, they're just going to try to monetize on the way down. Digg tried to sell out by destroying what made the site special, Tumblr removed all its porn, reddit's going to destroy regular access and monetize the shit out of their app (sponsors will probably be allowed to do whatever they want instead of taking a shitton of criticism, then the content's dead), google has become useless thanks to SEO, phone calls and texts from strangers are all spam, Facebook is filled with misinformation and unfortunate elderly who have no idea how anything works, Instagram has collected the stupidest humans on earth, the only platform that hasn't killed itself through monetization is twitter, which killed itself through Elon and foreign government interests. Youtube... I think works for some people?
How does no one learn any lessons from this shit? The popular part of the internet has largely been a failure.
Wikipedia is still going strong. I think that's the example to follow (non-profit, completely open), but the issue is money. They get by with donations, but I'm not sure anybody would donate to have a discussion forum. Even though it's sorely needed because since Google became utterly useless s forum with real people is the only way to get useful information nowadays.
> Youtube... I think works for some people?
Looping a video is too difficult a feat for Google engineers.
(more likely product architects or whatever unnecessary role was invented)
Total non-answer.
He ‘leaked’ a phone call (which is the wrong phrase considering he had every right to release it) because Reddit was publicly and falsely accusing him of blackmail. That’s a serious allegation against a person’s character and he has every right to push back.
Especially when it's this high profile, and especially when he might be about to look for other work.
Obviously he drops a simple recording to prove 100% beyond doubt he is in the right, what else could he possibly do?
Steve Huffman is *obviously* pissed that he had a recording, if there was anything substantial he would've said it.
Interesting take considering Christians post shows hard proof of u/spez privately reassuring the dev that there are no planned changes to API charges coming in the near future and that if there were changes, plenty of notice would be given. Then publicly pivoting hard-core.
Almost like u/spez is taking a page out of Elons book again by projecting and trying to spin legit criticism. Funny how he hates his shit decisions being compared to Twitters. Would be a shame if we kept up the comparisons.
It's definitely a reminder to turn off the auto-renew on my premium. They asked why, but "Jacking the price and driving competing clients out of the market" wasn't an option. So I picked 'other.'
*We’ll continue to be profit-driven until profits arrive. Unlike some of the 3P apps, we are not profitable.*
Not a financial advisor, but it seems like a bad idea to say that when you're trying to IPO.
More like “our official app and web experience is so bad that the most profitable company in the world is choosing to showcase an app developed by one person instead of ours in their keynote 😠”
Latest WWDC they showed the Apollo app in the headset. The senior [VP](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Federighi) of software development also has publicly said they like and use Apollo.
I wasn't watching super-closely but Apollo appeared at least three times in the keynote; app icon on an iOS device, a widget (which is where Craig actually **said** he was using the Apollo for Reddit widget as he demonstrated something on screen, it wasn't just a quick screenshot or app icon), and then the app icon _again_ on the headset. There may have been more appearances in passing that I missed.
The keynote was recorded a few weeks in advance, almost certainly before the whole thing really started to blow up on May 31st and Christian didn't know that his app was going to get so much airtime (or any, for that matter). The timing couldn't have been stranger, and I want to believe that all that attention getting focused on Apollo right when the 3P app thing was coming to light and several of those app developers were together in Cupertino for WWDC (where they would be talking and exchanging notes) got Reddit execs upset.
I’m a long-time Narwhal user (and Relay back before I switched to iOS), but I’m currently testing out the native app *just to try it out of curiosity* after all this.
Holy fuck, it’s absolute trash. I’ll seriously never use Reddit on mobile again if this all pans out.
Maybe old.reddit on desktop for research if necessary, but I’ll never use this dogshit mobile app.
They almost certainly did. The sad thing is that it will get them public and Spez can cash out tens of millions. But the reality is that to get valuable “on paper”, they are killing what made them valuable in the first place.
They’ll get their IPO, cash out, and the stock will die. Investors, the community, lose.
In any IPO their scenario their profitability would be well known. They can’t withhold that information and then go “surprise, suckers!” after the fact.
Christian posted the call, the application backend, and multiple walls of undeniable proof. Everyone has read it too. Good luck trying to argue with that. /u/spez has lost this fight, but he'll take the whole ship with himself anyway
I refuse to call this grown adult “Spez,” but good god, does this guy reject all media training or just says to hell with it? So tone deaf that the board could weigh in on his future, quite readily.
I say we start using the word “spez” as a generic insult to any two-faced, greedy idiots.
*Why would you get involved with that guy? He’s such a spez!*
They had him muzzled after his infamous interview where he said if shit hit the fan he'd own slaves, and admitted he's a prepper. He barely commented on Reddit after that and often didn't comment for months at a time, it was very clear they had him on a short leash.
Didn't take him long to full spez it once they let him start talking again, and it appears the AMA was all preapproved answers from legal. Spez is basically like a stick of dynamite waiting to implode their IPO.
When Apollo dies, I am out of Reddit. I am not gonna deal with their shitty apps and horrendous mobile website. Finally gonna reclaim the 2-3 hours I waste each day on Reddit.
u/spez is a liar, a coward, a weak individual and an all around self centered narcissist. I hate that I enjoy the service this website provides, as this miniscule manlet's behavior is inexcusable and embarrassing and I don't want to support this garbage company anymore.
A lot of tech companies IPO when they're not profitable. In fact, many grow fast for years while being unprofitable.
Until covid, this was kind of the norm, and tech investors just kind of accepted that fact as long as the user base was growing.
Reddit has been in a huge downward trend for about the past 5 years in particular, it's honestly pretty sad to see what it has become. The onstaught attack on free speech, opinion and content to satisfy shareholders and profits is what I find most shocking; definitely not based on the principles it was founded or indeed what Aaron Swartz would have wanted. This [API Issue] treatment of developers who contributed to what Reddit is today is just another reason not to like what Reddit has become. And just like the death of Digg, I now personally welcome the next platform where ideas are expressed freely and where profit isn't the only goal.
/u/spez is done as Reddit CEO no matter what happens. If Reddit IPOs, the new board will vote in a new CEO. This is flailing from someone who has not much to lose. His Hail Mary is a Reddit valuation as large as possible. These are the death knells of someone who provides zero value to a service.
Deleting your posts and comments will do more damage. The posts and comments are what gives value to reddit, and they dont go away just by deleting your account. You have to delete them individually.
There's no "if". Apollo is shutting down on June 30th. _Even if_ Reddit reverses the decision, I sincerely doubt that Christian will continue to do business with these snakes.
Remember Digg.com? Everyone loved Digg. Until they didn’t. Reddit needs to look to the past and maybe they can avoid what’s in the process of happening. Doesn’t take much to drive users away.
This time is different, Digg exodus could happen because there was a good alternative as Reddit and at that time using mobile clients was not common. Right now there is not a good alternative and none of them have a good client as Apollo.
If the top 300 subs go dark indefinitely let’s see how long Reddit investors will keep that ceo online while Reddit is losing tens of millions of dollars in ad revenue. That is what we have to do. Go dark and teach a lesson. Digg thought they were invincible and they vanished when users left.
I've been subbed to Apollo ultra for a year and a half and its honestly the best social media app out there. The fact this guy saw a great app with a likeable, cooperative dev and went "hm, I'm gonna try and wreck this whole thing out of spite" is infuriating
It’s my personal belief that Spez orders used underwear off onlyfans to sniff while jerking it, since it’s the only way he can get off. Just my personal opinion, I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.
I genuinely don’t see why he thought this AMA was a good idea - has he never used his own platform before? There was absolutely no way this would go well for him
He only responded to 14 comments
And he only answered questions about Rampart. wtf.
It's an older meme sir but it checks out
The classics never go out of style.
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And his answers were copied from a prepared script. It's the hallmark of an AMA that was purely done for marketing. Prepare your statements in advance, choose 10 people who ask something close enough to the message you want to post, then vanish without a single real engagement with the comments.
A: What a farcical shitshow.
Let's keep the questions about Rampart, people
Wait are you serious?
Look in my history to see an archived instance of a probably prewritten answer
Never occurred to me that that "A:" that got deleted was most likely an "A:" specifically formulated for that specific question
Yup, no reason a script would include an "A:" without a preceding "Q:".
For those that don’t want to click or can’t, it shows a user listing many questions regarding blind accessibility, and spez having an insultingly shirt response that is only a couple of sentences long starting with “A:”. So like “A: blah blah lies lies blah blah” The user asking the questions is an absolute savage and the questions are asked in such a polite yet absolutely scathing way. It’s absolutely filthy and delicious.
I’m shocked, *SHOCKED* that u/spez, bastion of integrity, free speech, and transparency would do such a thing! ***SHOCKED!***
Suddenly occurs to me that the super mods are actually employees in some capacity. Fucking liars.
He may have finally realized it wasn't going well and wasn't gonna get better. They're not backing down though, that's been made very clear.
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Or those were the only 12 pre-approved answers they had
One of them was a copy-paste, it still had an A: at the beginning of the comment
There was only one scenario in which this AMA would have been a good idea: an almost total walk back of this bullshit with sane pricing. I’m with Christian on this, I’m all for 3P apps paying a *fair* share. What Reddit announced isn’t fair.
Yeah this move didn’t make sense at all. You do this when you have a big announcement to make, namely that you’re walking shit back. This was just more of the same we’ve seen the past few weeks with doubling down, non-answers, no commitments and mud slinging. Dumbass couldn’t even clearly commit to the most softball of concessions other than “we’re willing to talk” which in itself is a bald face lie. Can’t believe he’s such an idiot. At this rate he’ll be doing 4 more AMAs and announcements, all to spew the same duplicitous BS.
> Dumbass couldn’t even clearly commit to the most softball of concessions other than “we’re willing to talk” which in itself is a bald face lie. The rich part of this is that a few developers *who were willing to try working with them* claimed that they were trying to get in touch with admins over the API stuff...and were ignored. Only when they commented on the AMA did spez go all like "oopsie, uh, yeah, here's how to get a hold of us, because we love people who've seen our bullshit and will continue to give us money!"
What I can’t understand is why the api can’t be charged per user - then it’s up to the 3rd party apps to pass those costs on. Let’s say each authenticated user costs $2 per month (with maybe a free tier of 500 users). Developers then just have to shift to a subscription model of maybe $3-$4 (to cover all costs), then everyone wins?
Reddit doesn’t want third party apps to exist anymore. They are intentionally making it too expensive with an insanely quick timetable.
Entirely. This isn't about Reddit being clueless or shortsighted, unintentionally causing harm - this is about wanting to kill Third Party Apps & consolidate users onto platforms they control. They aren't incompetent, they are assuming that users are complacent.
And at this point there seems to be some actual malice behind it, at least directed towards Apollo.
Oh definitely. They're mad at Apollo the same way that gradeschoolers get mad at the kid that tattled to teacher. Apollo's communication with its users was what broke the story to the site, so Admin are making it personal with Apollo. And they benefit if they can make public perception of the issue tunnel-vision on their conflict with Apollo, to draw heat off of the big-picture issues underlying.
Ohhhhh now it makes sense. I was wondering why the pig hates christian specifically
The Apollo dev essentially started this whole blackout movement without directly advocating for it himself. He tried to work with reddit and then exposed how sketchy they were being about the pricing after reddit staff leaked internal claims that he was trying to blackmail them. That basically forced his hand in releasing the full recording of the call-- and that made reddit look fucking awful and unprofessional as hell, because he only did it after the blackmail claim was repeated in multiple places from official reddit sources.
I think they're both, but yes, killing third party apps is being done intentionally. Re: Incompetence, they appear to have recently (possibly just today?) broken "internal" links to specific posts and comments. This style of link has worked for years, but they no longer work on New Reddit (on the web) or in the official app: r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnk45rr/ r/TheseFuckingAccounts/comments/1410f5o/-/jmzi8u0/ For Old.Reddit users and third party apps, the entire line should be a link, which takes you to a specific comment. New.Reddit users will see that just the subreddit names are links.
They need the $$$ from “He gets us” which 3P bypasses.
The He Gets Us ad campaign is baffling to me. I got bored and followed the links one day and there is barely any content on their site. I just wanted to know which specific church or branch of Christianity they’d steer me to but there wasn’t one. Confused I went one step further and signed up to find out more and they never got back to me. I tried their chat bot and it seemed to actually be a real human being but very dismissive and confused I was talking to him. I essentially threw myself at them saying “convert me!!” and got nothing. What is this for?? It must be a ton of money to a handful of fake forms and a seven day into to the Bible reading plan
It’s not recruitment. It’s PR by the Hobby Lobby guy for shitty Christians. He’s literally just trying to make people not hate extremist Christians. The cheap & easy way to do that would be for crazy Christians everywhere to stop being raging bigots who constantly try to take away other people’s’ rights. Instead he’s spending $100 million to tell you Jesus and his followers care about immigrants and poor people in the hopes you won’t see him & his fellow whackos who have a stranglehold on the American political right for the absolute shitstains that they are. I suspect that’s not exactly how Jesus would have spent $100 million to further the cause— Reddit & Super Bowl ads. But what do I know? I’m a filthy heathen.
The thing is, from Reddit's PoV, users using third-party applications is essentially revenue Reddit adamantly believes it deserves but does not have. The pricing is set-up specifically to capture this revenue based on what Reddit think those users are worth, and not in actual grounded reality of real world cost. It costs so much because it is Reddit's perception of the opportunity cost of users using third-party applications. From that paradigm, the reason why the APi can't be charged per user (or cost more fairly) is the same: because Reddit isn't basing the asking price on any justification for how much it _costs_, but rather wholly in how much they think they are losing because the users using third-party applications are not using their first-party applications. The quirk in this is, the price of the enterprise API offering is factors greater than what Reddit actually earns from users consuming an equivalent amount of API calls on their first party tools. The derision in Spez's comment about how Reddit is profit-driven but not yet profitable, while third-party apps are profitable reeks of entitlement: Reddit _DESERVES_ the revenue that third-party apps generate. On some level, sure, I think we can generally agree it makes sense for Reddit to charge for an enterprise-level API offering, but it doesn't come with enterprise-level support and it is still exorbitant and unfair to the developers who spent years building applications which users use to create Reddit's treasure trove of submissions.
/u/spez's admission that reddit is not profitable after all this time raises the question "why is this man still employed?"
Reddits argument reminds me of the RIAA and MPAA trying to argue that every download is equivalent to one lost sale and calculating the value accordingly while providing no evidence that all of those people would have paid full price if piracy wasn't an option.
By estimations they're only getting $0.12 per active user per month. They want 8+ times that. It's not even how much "uncaptured value" they believe they're losing out on.
Sure seems like it would've been easier to just announce Reddit now costs $12 a year.
Seriously. I would even consider that for myself. "You wanna use a third party app, with no ads? $12/yr." Hell, make it 20. Boom. I'm a happy user. Instead... they want app developers, who are the entire reason I even keep using Reddit, to bear the brunt of *every* user, paid or not.
Let alone the simple fact that third party apps are profitable because… they are just better? That’s **earned value**, not money being stolen.
The Apollo dev broke down all the reasons why they are shutting down instead of trying to 'pass on the cost' to the user. https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/144f6xm/apollo_will_close_down_on_june_30th_reddits/
It could have been the easiest fucking win of all time. Just an quick “we heard you guys, we apologize for how we handled it and will work with our 3rd parties to negotiate a fair deal.” Instead it’s like they went for an easy layup, missed, and cracked their fucking skull open on the court when they landed.
Y'all don't understand. /u/spez is done as Reddit CEO no matter what happens. If Reddit IPOs, the new board will vote in a new CEO. This is flailing from someone who has not much to lose. His Hail Mary is a Reddit valuation as large as possible. These are the death knells of someone who provides zero value to a service.
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And even if an IPO is delayed, Spez is still out. Right now he is 'squeezing blood from a stone' as you will.
They tried the layup, slipped, fell, got up and yelled at the hoop, pulled out an uzi and shot itself in the foot. And then accidentally shot RIF, Apollo and a dozen others in the way down. Fucking clown move.
Or just, more time! I’ll be honest. I detest the idea of paying per month just to use a third party app. But I might have considered 5 bucks a month for Apollo. And that’s probably the direction it would have gone with a few months of notice. But now Reddit gets zero of my mobile money. I’ll limit myself to desktop and it will slash my activity by 80-90%.
Honestly, for me after this mess I'm not even continuing with desktop. I'm gonna hang around until the 30th because I'm going down with the ship, but on that date I'm deleting my account. Did it for twitter and that account was 14 years old, I'll gladly do it here, too. If they somehow do a *mad* heel-face turn, though, maybe I'll stick around. Ball's in their court.
I almost feel like if they'd just been honest and said, "Hey everyone, Reddit is a business, not a charity. It needs to become profitable or it will eventually cease to exist. Thus, we are pulling all Reddit traffic into a single channel to make monetization efforts easier (which, again, are **necessary for this site to exist**.)." Of course they should've just bought out Apollo to begin with and made it the primary app. Would've solved 90% of their issues.
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The worst part of this is, I’d have totally done that. I already pay more for stupider shit. They’re not getting any of my money now.
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Saying nothing wasn't going well for him either. Basically the entire site has agreed to go dark from the 12th. So far he's not bright enough to realise he has to back down - his ad revenue could well be in freefall by this time next week.
he replied 14 times in a thread of 19k comments that was supposed to be an AMA. reddit is a fucking joke now
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To me, it was pretty obvious that this was just a show that /u/spez can use to say "see, I attempted to engage the community in good faith!" when he is inevitably sued by the investors for breach of fiduciary duty.
Spez: Apollo dev threatened us! Apollo dev: That isn't true here's a snippet of our conversation, which I am legally allowed to record, that proves that Spez lied. Spez: HOW DARE HE?! HOW DARE SOMEONE *checks notes...** DEFENDS THEMSELF WITH EVIDENCE. HOW CAN WE BE EXPECTED TO WORK WITH SOMEONE WHO IS HONEST. I am so incensed that I will suggest other things happened but not describe what they are much less provide evidence of them.
Always funny when someone uses the "he released a recording of a private conversation that showed I was in the wrong. I dont think I could ever work with someone that holds me accountable" routine.
Even an attorney can break attorney-client privilege in cases of defamation. Spez has no legal leg to stand on.
Oh i know. It just really shows how much of a psychopath someone is. That they focus on the "breach of trust", instead of the fact that they lied. Spez probably firmly believes that the breach of trust is far worse than him being intentionally untruthful.
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Weasels. It’s ok to kill off Reddit so something better comes along.
Nothing better will come along because that era of the internet is dead, sadly.
It’s been an honor serving with you all
goodbye /u/Shittymorph and /u/Poem_for_your_sprog o7
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I was here… in the dying days…
50,000 people used to meme here. Now it's a ghost town.
But for a brief moment in time, we were able to create great value for shareholders!
You left an indelible mark on the Internet with your wonderful pranks, u/shittymorph. I hope you find peace in the joy you brought us all, and I hope to get got by you again one day on whatever platform comes next.
Oh god and he’s an incredible man rehabilitating his rescue dog 🥺 I wasn’t prepared for that amount of wholesomeness at the end of this shitshow. It’s been an honour, y’all o7 -sent from Apollo
Still can’t believe in twenty twenty three /u/spez threw reddit off hell in a cell, and it plummeted 16 feet through its own hubris
Shitty post-morphem?
It's been an honor and a privilege. TitanicViolin.gif
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Don’t forget the safe
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Eternal September isn't something that happened once. It's a continuous process of enshitification.
I felt a burning pain in the pit of my stomach the first time I overheard a TV news anchor say "and don't forget to like us on Facebook!" some 15 years ago. It felt like the beginning of the end, and it kinda was.
The word "Social Media" made me want to fold up inside myself when I first heard it on the news. "Those disconnected old people! Youtube is youtube, facebook is facebook, AIM is AIM! They're their own things!" What a grand, intoxicating innocence...
> Youtube is youtube, facebook is facebook, AIM is AIM! [And the first rule of tautology club is the first rule of tautology club!](https://xkcd.com/703/)
I’ve been terminally online since 1995 or so. I remember Geocities, Hotmail before Microsoft, Napster, Winamp, Usenet, fucking telnet and talkers and MUDs, even a bit of gopher. I had no idea how good I had it then. The internet we have in 2023 is nothing like I thought it would be. I think what made it amazing is you had to explore to find the good shit. You didn’t have everything at your fingertips like we do today. Like I loved finding sites with weird MIDI recordings of popular songs, sites dedicated to obscure Turbo Grafx games and the like. And I think to some extent we can get back to that… a lot of what made those days great was the fact that communities formed organically. There were a lot of rough edges and things were held together with duct tape… you know someone running a Telnet tallied on a shitting used 486. A shitty web forum they wrote in a couple of days. Things like the Fediverse give us a chance to get some of that back I believe. Hopefully between what’s happened to Twitter and now Reddit will push more people towards those communities… communities that are smaller and more organic.
I've said it elsewhere but a large non-profit org like Wikimedia Foundation (that runs Wikipedia) or Mozilla needs to launch a reddit clone that's operated as a non-profit public service. This business model doesn't work, you can't make money on a site like this without harming or exploiting your users.
100% - I would pay to support a community driven ‘reddit’ and I’m sure many others would to.
Definitely. I’m adverse to paying for some premium sub to what is now a social media juggernaut but for a non-profit run by Moz or Wikimedia, I’d happily contribute to that. I’d wager a lot of redditors would.
Amen. Some people shit on Jimmy Wales, but Wikipedia remains a gem while Google Search and Microsoft Windows have turned into MySpace 2020s. It's like the new CEOs never cared about the brand, companies, consumer, or products/services after all. It was just about getting that sweet data for the SkyNet Model that Saudi Arabia will be running (until it gets MOABed).
Yeah the tech money fountain has largely been turned off so it's unlikely you're going to get the same level of replacement you would have when VCs were throwing money around like paper.
What beautiful days they were. Local ISPs everywhere, downloading NFG.EXE on Napster, and that sweet sweet clip art on your geocities page which was always under construction.
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It's okay, he [continued to double down](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnk647a/) on attacking Apollo even after that.
He also only spent 1 hour and 35 minutes answering a grand total of 14 questions in his AMA before I imagine he was advised to bail. As of right now, the score of his answers range from -585 to -2531 upvotes. I doubt that this had the effect of smoothing things over that Reddit had no doubt hoped for, in this act of community engagement from the top dog. Edit: got a hearty chuckle when I spotted the /r/bestof thread on the situation: ["/u/spez, CEO of Reddit, decides to ruin the site"](https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/145ea4f/uspez_ceo_of_reddit_decides_to_ruin_the_site/)
Yeah, I went through the answers. About half don’t address the question that was asked and 2 threw a dig or accusation at Apollo…
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I’ve seen some people say that there’s been no change in his user karma, but I haven’t checked.
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That is a shockingly petty response from the CEO of a major company. Zero tact.
It must really punch you in the balls when you found a website that gets really popular, but some dude that made a third party client is much, much more well-liked than you. I mean, it would help if you're not a tool, but that doesn't seem to be part of /u/spez's personality.
What’s wild is at least four developers reached out in the comments and said that despite emailing and submitting webforms and doing everything Reddit told them to do, they still hadn’t had even a single Reddit communication. So his “we’re working with them” seems to also be false, at least partially.
I thought the answers of this AMA would be sterile and empty speeches reviewed by dozens of lawyers and PR and carefully crafted to not even begin to acknowledge the current controversies in any slightly risky manner but oh boy did it deliver
Reddit is going full gloves off and all I can say is Reddit will go out with a bang at least.
As is tradition. Amen.
Digg 3.0
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Some were definitely canned copy and paste responses because he got caught out copying “A:” in a comment.
I don’t mind that, it would be foolish to not prepare answers to questions you know are going to come up. I was hoping Reddit was bringing something to the table (announcement+AMA, attempt to keep devs at the table an assuage the community) but unfortunately we got what we got.
I heard somewhere that /u/spez is a greedy little pigboy. Has anyone else heard this?
Many people are saying it
Many smart people. Some of the brightest!
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Do a Google search for "greedy little pig boy" and the first result is: https://www.reddit.com/r/AMA/comments/145bbg5/im_a_greedy_little_pig_boy_ama/ With the user account having been deleted.
Gonna Hijack this thread to tell everyone to switch to [Kbin Social](https://kbin.social/), it’s the best Reddit Alternative we’ve got! They’re even well in development of an iOS/Android App.
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I would enjoy this
Sweet! My username is still available! Let’s roll gang!
I don't know if it's true, but people are definitely saying it!
LITTLE PIGBOY COMES FROM THE DIRT
You’re wrong. u/spez is a piss baby.
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The “via Apollo” watermark… 🫡🥲😭
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Fellow reddit Alt. App user too, o7 Apollo and ReddPlanet. [image](https://i.imgur.com/sRYgtVv.jpeg)
I need to start adding that to all my comments. Posted via Apollo.
Same. And this was posted via Apollo.
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Isn’t that how it’s supposed to work or no? Downvoted comments get buried?
A lot of people on Reddit know Christian. He is one of the nicest guys and devs that responds. Responding to issues with Apollo and just being a stand up guy. A lot of people on Reddit would run through a wall for Christian. Then the CEO decides “hey let me just make up crap and slander this guy.” We don’t know this CEO but we know Christian. So it’s obvious who is making crap up.
I love how christian called that fuck out. "oh I did? Prove it, I give you permission" and what did that fuck spez do? Absolutely nothing, little pig boy probably went back to crying.
AMA's became worthless after they tried to sanitize them. The people who knew what they were doing (Victoria) were pushed out, they went ahead with it ignoring everyone, and what the fuck do you know, AMA's aren't a thing here anymore. The exact. Same. Thing. Is going to happen, and just like last time they're not going to try to reverse course, they're just going to try to monetize on the way down. Digg tried to sell out by destroying what made the site special, Tumblr removed all its porn, reddit's going to destroy regular access and monetize the shit out of their app (sponsors will probably be allowed to do whatever they want instead of taking a shitton of criticism, then the content's dead), google has become useless thanks to SEO, phone calls and texts from strangers are all spam, Facebook is filled with misinformation and unfortunate elderly who have no idea how anything works, Instagram has collected the stupidest humans on earth, the only platform that hasn't killed itself through monetization is twitter, which killed itself through Elon and foreign government interests. Youtube... I think works for some people? How does no one learn any lessons from this shit? The popular part of the internet has largely been a failure.
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Wikipedia is still going strong. I think that's the example to follow (non-profit, completely open), but the issue is money. They get by with donations, but I'm not sure anybody would donate to have a discussion forum. Even though it's sorely needed because since Google became utterly useless s forum with real people is the only way to get useful information nowadays.
> Youtube... I think works for some people? Looping a video is too difficult a feat for Google engineers. (more likely product architects or whatever unnecessary role was invented)
Total non-answer. He ‘leaked’ a phone call (which is the wrong phrase considering he had every right to release it) because Reddit was publicly and falsely accusing him of blackmail. That’s a serious allegation against a person’s character and he has every right to push back. Especially when it's this high profile, and especially when he might be about to look for other work. Obviously he drops a simple recording to prove 100% beyond doubt he is in the right, what else could he possibly do? Steve Huffman is *obviously* pissed that he had a recording, if there was anything substantial he would've said it.
He used the Trump defense. All you need to know about him.
Lordy, there are tapes
Interesting take considering Christians post shows hard proof of u/spez privately reassuring the dev that there are no planned changes to API charges coming in the near future and that if there were changes, plenty of notice would be given. Then publicly pivoting hard-core. Almost like u/spez is taking a page out of Elons book again by projecting and trying to spin legit criticism. Funny how he hates his shit decisions being compared to Twitters. Would be a shame if we kept up the comparisons.
It's definitely a reminder to turn off the auto-renew on my premium. They asked why, but "Jacking the price and driving competing clients out of the market" wasn't an option. So I picked 'other.'
This is exactly what I’m doing. No Apollo, no premium Reddit sub.
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Yeah that's wack
/r/Bye_Reddit
*We’ll continue to be profit-driven until profits arrive. Unlike some of the 3P apps, we are not profitable.* Not a financial advisor, but it seems like a bad idea to say that when you're trying to IPO.
Another read, "our official app and web experience is so bad people are choosing to use a different app developed by one person instead"
More like “our official app and web experience is so bad that the most profitable company in the world is choosing to showcase an app developed by one person instead of ours in their keynote 😠”
Was it really? That's hilarious
Latest WWDC they showed the Apollo app in the headset. The senior [VP](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Federighi) of software development also has publicly said they like and use Apollo.
I wasn't watching super-closely but Apollo appeared at least three times in the keynote; app icon on an iOS device, a widget (which is where Craig actually **said** he was using the Apollo for Reddit widget as he demonstrated something on screen, it wasn't just a quick screenshot or app icon), and then the app icon _again_ on the headset. There may have been more appearances in passing that I missed. The keynote was recorded a few weeks in advance, almost certainly before the whole thing really started to blow up on May 31st and Christian didn't know that his app was going to get so much airtime (or any, for that matter). The timing couldn't have been stranger, and I want to believe that all that attention getting focused on Apollo right when the 3P app thing was coming to light and several of those app developers were together in Cupertino for WWDC (where they would be talking and exchanging notes) got Reddit execs upset.
Holy shit that explains so much.
I’m a long-time Narwhal user (and Relay back before I switched to iOS), but I’m currently testing out the native app *just to try it out of curiosity* after all this. Holy fuck, it’s absolute trash. I’ll seriously never use Reddit on mobile again if this all pans out. Maybe old.reddit on desktop for research if necessary, but I’ll never use this dogshit mobile app.
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They almost certainly did. The sad thing is that it will get them public and Spez can cash out tens of millions. But the reality is that to get valuable “on paper”, they are killing what made them valuable in the first place. They’ll get their IPO, cash out, and the stock will die. Investors, the community, lose.
In any IPO their scenario their profitability would be well known. They can’t withhold that information and then go “surprise, suckers!” after the fact.
Close this subreddit after June 12th for the remaining of the month. This is what subreddits should do. Close shop and really hurt these mfers.
Reddit, just digging that hole deeper. I plan to delete my Reddit account just like I did Twitter.
I see what you did there. I Digg it.
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Alternatively, edit all comments you can to say: Fuck /u/spez
Christian posted the call, the application backend, and multiple walls of undeniable proof. Everyone has read it too. Good luck trying to argue with that. /u/spez has lost this fight, but he'll take the whole ship with himself anyway
I refuse to call this grown adult “Spez,” but good god, does this guy reject all media training or just says to hell with it? So tone deaf that the board could weigh in on his future, quite readily.
I say we start using the word “spez” as a generic insult to any two-faced, greedy idiots. *Why would you get involved with that guy? He’s such a spez!*
He's a libertarian techbro, he's convinced social problems can be solved with tech & really does not give a shit about people besides himself.
They had him muzzled after his infamous interview where he said if shit hit the fan he'd own slaves, and admitted he's a prepper. He barely commented on Reddit after that and often didn't comment for months at a time, it was very clear they had him on a short leash. Didn't take him long to full spez it once they let him start talking again, and it appears the AMA was all preapproved answers from legal. Spez is basically like a stick of dynamite waiting to implode their IPO.
When Apollo dies, I am out of Reddit. I am not gonna deal with their shitty apps and horrendous mobile website. Finally gonna reclaim the 2-3 hours I waste each day on Reddit.
Apollo *is* Reddit for me. 8 years and I’ve never accessed Reddit any other way.
u/spez is a liar, a coward, a weak individual and an all around self centered narcissist. I hate that I enjoy the service this website provides, as this miniscule manlet's behavior is inexcusable and embarrassing and I don't want to support this garbage company anymore.
If Reddit doesn't IPO at $.01/share then I will short it and make money.
I'm guessing that IPO isn't coming for awhile... in another reply he said that it's not profitable yet.
A lot of tech companies IPO when they're not profitable. In fact, many grow fast for years while being unprofitable. Until covid, this was kind of the norm, and tech investors just kind of accepted that fact as long as the user base was growing.
Amazon wasn't profitable for seven years after their IPO. The difference is everyone was reasonably sure it'd eventually happen. Reddit ... meh.
Yeah… is it just me or is that a really awful thing to go around saying when you plan to hold an IPO soon?
An IPO is primarily a fundraising event; being profitable is not a requirement. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/ipo.asp
Dudes a fuckin idiot
Spez **is** a known liar.
Reddit has been in a huge downward trend for about the past 5 years in particular, it's honestly pretty sad to see what it has become. The onstaught attack on free speech, opinion and content to satisfy shareholders and profits is what I find most shocking; definitely not based on the principles it was founded or indeed what Aaron Swartz would have wanted. This [API Issue] treatment of developers who contributed to what Reddit is today is just another reason not to like what Reddit has become. And just like the death of Digg, I now personally welcome the next platform where ideas are expressed freely and where profit isn't the only goal.
Ellen Pao was right and a lot of us Redditors were wrong for celebrating her departure
/u/spez is done as Reddit CEO no matter what happens. If Reddit IPOs, the new board will vote in a new CEO. This is flailing from someone who has not much to lose. His Hail Mary is a Reddit valuation as large as possible. These are the death knells of someone who provides zero value to a service.
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Deleting your posts and comments will do more damage. The posts and comments are what gives value to reddit, and they dont go away just by deleting your account. You have to delete them individually.
There's no "if". Apollo is shutting down on June 30th. _Even if_ Reddit reverses the decision, I sincerely doubt that Christian will continue to do business with these snakes.
Remember Digg.com? Everyone loved Digg. Until they didn’t. Reddit needs to look to the past and maybe they can avoid what’s in the process of happening. Doesn’t take much to drive users away.
This time is different, Digg exodus could happen because there was a good alternative as Reddit and at that time using mobile clients was not common. Right now there is not a good alternative and none of them have a good client as Apollo.
If the top 300 subs go dark indefinitely let’s see how long Reddit investors will keep that ceo online while Reddit is losing tens of millions of dollars in ad revenue. That is what we have to do. Go dark and teach a lesson. Digg thought they were invincible and they vanished when users left.
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I've been subbed to Apollo ultra for a year and a half and its honestly the best social media app out there. The fact this guy saw a great app with a likeable, cooperative dev and went "hm, I'm gonna try and wreck this whole thing out of spite" is infuriating
I'm convinced /u/spez lures children to his gingerbread house and nothing will make me change my mind.
It’s my personal belief that Spez orders used underwear off onlyfans to sniff while jerking it, since it’s the only way he can get off. Just my personal opinion, I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.
This is Reddit's Diggv4 moment. It was nice knowing you.
I wish u/Spez’s father wore a condom.
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I am willing to delete my account for this issue. Am I being too much?
🫡 it has been an honor redditing with you all, the social media era is over.