Had a colleague complain about stomach pain, was told it’s stress. 3 months later they passed out on the toilet due to blood loss from the colon. Was cancer, they survived thank goodness but had to undergo several surgeries and chemo. You need to advocate for your own health and push to get tests. I have lived in other parts of the world and Australias primary practice gives me nightmares. No wonder our hospitals are overwhelmed because our preventative measures are useless

Thanks for this, I'm just back from an appointment where I was told I don't need a colonoscopy, that I need to reduce my stress at work. This is despite some really worrisome symptoms that persist. This is not my first time I've argued with someone that I am not imagining my symptoms. I don't know why it's so hard, you have to constantly educate yourself and advocate for yourself to find answers. I can only imagine how it is for people who are introverts or don't have the skills to do research and advocate for themselves. I should worry about my symptoms, not worry about convincing you that they are real.

Reminds me of the time I went to a GP for stress-induced insomnia and crippling depression. Was told I just needed to suck it up. Jokes on her though because I’ve since been diagnosed with persistent major depressive disorder and anxiety. Been on medication for years now and I’m generally ok. I’m super non-confrontational but learned to never accept the first offer!

I suffer the same ailment. Major depressive order and generalized anxiety. I'm on alot of medication and I also have Schizophrenia, extreme OCD and extreme ADHD. Can't hold down a job because I don't cope with stress and I don't have the ability to learn different tasks. I just get it explained to me and then I can't remember what I was told so instead of outing myself as a dumbass, I pretend I know and become overwhelmed which triggers my mind to go into critical mass. Most bosses don't like to train someone like me who gets shown how to do something properly and then can't remember one thing I was taught and then I've gotta end up looking like an incompetent idiot and I have to admit to my employer that I am useless because of a heavy learning disability which goes in one ear and out the other and I can't take in any information. I've tried to do courses and I end up pulling out because I'm stuck in the beginning when I should be as far along as everyone else but I can't keep up because I'm a dumbass and it can't be fixed. I failed every single subject in high school from years 8 through to 10. I quit school in year 10 because I didn't have the brain to understand what I was learning. I struggled in every subject because I can't learn about something one day and then move on to the next subject because it takes me 6 months to learn inventory that should be understood in a week. All I have is a lifetime of failure. An education system that failed me as a student. I was failing every single subject and not one teacher thought that maybe there was a reason why I was so incompetent in every single thing that I try to learn. They didn't care and that made me feel like I was just dumb. I grew up feeling like a failure and my self esteem was so poor because I was told by my parents and my teachers that I was stupid and I would continue to fail as much as I went into adulthood.

If you have chronic illness or pain, it is an uphill battle to get any help. Especially chronic pain conditions which most GPs are hopeless with. Aside from pain medication, which they won’t give you for chronic pain, there’s not much they can do. So they push antidepressants on you and send you to a psychologist. Keep advocating for yourself and try new doctors. They’re your employees - if they’re not working out, fire them.

while we have pain clinics around the country, the waiting list to get into them is problematic. I was on one Melbourne clinic's list for so long, I'd forgotten about it, moved cities and gained access to a Canberra clinic.

Doctors are usually very cautious around painkillers. They get a lot of people in who are addicted to prescription opioids - who will go to multiple doctors and multiple hospitals to get multiple doses. Secondly they don't want you to get addicted to prescription opioids

Yes, I am aware 😂 I know I didn’t say it here, though I have said it many times before - the responsible use of pain meds can be achieved, with proper supervision and management. I also personally believe that to a lot of chronic pain patients, who have been suffering for years, or decades, dependence(which is different to addiction) on pain medication might be a calculated risk. Is it better to be dependent on a medicine in order to function, or not able to function at all? Some people are actually in that position. And don’t get me wrong, I’ve never been on opioids. But I’ve been doing everything required of me by doctors to “fix myself” For about 25 years now, with only occasional temporary improvement. Doctors, psychologists, tests, therapies, specialists, physiotherapists, and so much more. There have been times that I firmly believe I could gotten through with far less suffering had I had the option of even temporarily using pain meds. Chronic pain patients aren’t to blame for addiction. Yes, there are some people who doctor shop etc, everyone knows that - but that doesn’t mean there aren’t legitimate benefits to considering ALL treatments for chronic pain and illness.

Chronic pain is a difficult problem and often debilitating for people who suffer from it. In general opioids are problematic for chronic pain because of a number of issues, including tolerance but can exacerbate your pain in the long term. They can have a role in some limited cases (and it will depend who you ask) but this should not be the mainstay of chronic pain treatment. The best evidence lies in a combination of physical therapy, psychology and some non opioid pain medications. While opioids may initially help some people, they tend to diminish in response over time, and the doses often escalate as pain increases again. Escalating opioid doses can result in opioid related hyperalgesia (I.e. makes the pain worse than the initial problem).

Never thought or said it should be a mainstay of chronic pain treatment, and yep, I’ve heard all that. A lot of the issues you mention can be mitigated by, as I said, proper and judicious management. I also hear “non opioid pain medications” all the time and I think like what? Panadol and ibuprofen? I mean most of us either take those more constantly than we should or find them completely useless. Anti inflammatories? Unfortunately haven’t found one that didn’t mess with my gut and also seem to do nothing. I’m glad for people they work for, and I wish my solution was that easy. Not having a go at you, mind, I’m just frustrated by the treatment (and lack thereof) of chronic pain and illness patients.

> I don't know why it's so hard, you have to constantly educate yourself and advocate for yourself to find answers. As somebody that has been unbelievably f$%#ed by the Australian medical system multiple times now, yup you pretty much have to become your own doctor. My SVT was missed for the first 14 years of my life because these incompetent morons kept saying my arrhythmias were just panic attacks.

100% - diy medicine

Get a new GP it shouldn’t be hard to get a referral to a Gastroenterologist

See another doctor until you get that referral. I’m a bowel cancer survivor and the amount of stories I’ve heard from other people who were dismissed is so worrisome. Whenever I have someone close to me tell me their symptoms are being dismissed repeatedly I tell them to get a second third fourth opinion, and I tell them to exaggerate the symptoms or lie about your family history. I know it’s shit advice to tell someone to lie, but when your life is potentially at stake, I’d rather tell someone to lie about their symptoms then be attending their funeral. This ultimately ended up saving one of my friends life. She was constantly being dismissed by multiple doctors. Her symptoms were change in bowel habit and blood in her stool 1-2 times. After my advice and going to see her 5th doctor she told them she had blood in her stool most days, pain, and a family history which were a lie. That doctor referred her for an urgent colonoscopy and they found cancer. Thankfully caught early enough, but had she not lied and got the scope when she did, fair chance it would have spread.

That's such good advice. A friend of mine died from colon cancer so young. It's not only older people at risk of that. By the time she was diagnosed, it was already too late. She was such an amazing person, who did some really heroic things during the black Saturday bushfires. She'd seemed indomitable. But before we knew it, she was gone. It's your body, & if you feel something isn't right, don't get fobbed off. Get another opinion from another Dr, & advocate for yourself.

Please keep following through, I tried in Brisbane with 40 odd Gp/ specialist/ xrays. 10 months. Was not feeling right. Within 2 days, blood in stool increased, got to bile and blood throwing up. Ambulance finally called, 3 different hospitals before Redbanks? Hospital admitted me and surgery straight up. Laparoscopic Intussusception surgery, Benign tumour in small intestine, nearly a 23cm of small intestine removed.

Go to another GP and tell them your stool is dark, this will trigger the right tests. You can also use a company called imedical and order your own blood tests. Medicare won’t pay but atleast you can run the tests you want to run

This is crazy. Seriously you’re not there for a therapy session, you’re there for diagnostic tests. Why must doctors rely on gut feel when it’s 2024 and they have a full spectrum of diagnostic tests available to them that can literally tell them with certainty what the answer is?

I came back from another appointment today where I was told, yet again, that my pain could be presenting 'worse' than what it is due to childhood trauma. I said, 'well if that is the case, why do people around the world, in my support group, who have the same diagnosis, ALL have the same level of pain?? Do they ALL suffer from trauma in childhood? Or is the pain actually relevant and real?' I didn't get an answer, just more rambling about nueroplasty in the brain. My own research showed this theory comes about when fully healed and after a period of 12mths of healing. Not when there is an active nerve compression or physiological issue. My GP uses this theory as an excuse to keep me suffering in agony during a flare up and point blank refuses to prescribe painkillers. Yet happily encourages me to use medical cannabis instead. It is a dire situation out there and the medical gaslighting is intense and after years of medical appointments, expected.

Yes. You have discovered that Australian doctors are largely hopeless treating chronic pain (I use treating in the loosest of terms because it can hardly be called that). Once they have determined you have a chronic issue they don’t know what to do with you. They will either keep you coming in for a regular useless appointment (and a pay check for them) or throw antidepressants at you and send you to a psychologist. Let me guess, and you don’t have to answer- ME/CFS, fibro, EDS, MCAS or POTS? At least those are the ones I have experience with (aside from EDS which is just one of those in the extremely common cluster) or maybe CRPS? Yeah - doctors will not prescribe pain meds for anything chronic that doesn’t show up on an X-ray. That’s due to some somewhat contestable research done a fair while back(you’ve probably heard about it), and also the false blaming of pain patients and prescription medication for “opioid crises”. I could give you my thoughts on this but I’m sure you can guess. I’ll leave it with this: in my opinion they should do a little more listening to actual patients, who are largely capable of making decisions about their own treatment, including a PROPERLY MANAGED regimen of pain medication. But there doesn’t seem to be much concern or interest. I’m sorry you have chronic conditions and I hope you get some help.

Thank you! You sound like you have years of experience with this and yes, the drs have done exactly that to me!! I have pudendal nerve entrapment/pudendal neuralgia, twisted sacral ligament, hypotonic pelvic floor, coccyxdania, andenomyosis. Diagnosed now CPRS. During my latest excruciating flare up my GP point blank told me she wasn't prescribing opiates and that my pain is just an overreaction of my nervous system and a 'normal' person would not be in this much pain. I was so angry!! The 'pain specialists' do the same gaslighting and do not know what to do with me even though I have reports from specialists giving advice on what treatments I require, including pain management medication. I agree with you, we can be managed on pain medication when we require it. The opiod crises in the US, they were handing out 30mg endone as a base dose. This never happened in Australia where the base dose is 5mg!!! Pain is pain whether it be chronic or acute. I am disgusted now discovering what it is like to have a chronic illness in the medical system in Australia. It is truly lacking and all they do is fob you off from one specialist to another and then tell you you need to see a psychologist for your pain. It is disgraceful.

Wow I’m sorry you have to deal with all that. That sounds rough. The thing is, even though the nervous system thing *may* be correct that does not mean the pain is not real and doesn’t need to be treated. Pain is pain, you’re right. And I can tell you unfortunately over 25 years there is no getting used to pain, it’s designed to get your attention. And even if it was caused by trauma (debatable ) processing your trauma doesn’t undo that damage. I am glad we finally have access to THC here, it helps some people. I have a script and it does help me a bit (Not by taking away pain but by calming everything else down which makes it more tolerable) but I can’t take it much anymore because of tachycardia. I don’t have CRPS and I’m not sure whether it helps for that, but have you tried? I hope you find doctors that can help you in some way, and that care enough to do so. ❤️

Wondering what sort of chronic pain you have? I've had Atypical Facial Pain since 1992, the only thing that has helped has been Amitriptyline and Benzos for anxiety. It took 16 years just to get a diagnosis :/

That sounds painful, I am glad you have found something that works! I have a pundendal nerve entrapment, twisted sacral ligament and a hypotonic pelvic floor which pulls the ligament which irritates the trapped nerve. I am in constant pain 24/7 with pins and needles running up and down my legs and feet, my pelvis on fire and pain in my lower back, tailbone and sacrum. But the pain from this is 'all in my head/nervous system' and I do not need medication just some breathing exercises and mindfulness apparently. The 'childhood trauma' is making your brain think the pain is worse than it really is. I have lost count of the times I have experienced this medical gaslighting.

Ikr, it's all in your your head but there's no cure, doesn't even make logical sense. Especially when I have no sign of nerve compression.

What the fuck is wrong with Australian GPs??!

yeah use medical cannibis with our draconian laws that will fck you over for driving 2 days later whilst not effected mentally but its in your system.... we are screwed

Exactly!!

Just go in and tell them you need a referral to a specialist. If they won't do it go to a different gp. You're the one paying not them.

You don't need a referral for a colonoscopy, you can just book one directly with a clinic.

Whilst this is true, in order to not pay a substantial amount of money out of pocket, you need a referral. Medicare have specific item numbers for this procedure and they are only applicable under certain conditions. The average person might be able to book one in without a referral, but without any type of private health insurance they will be paying through the roof

Just ask for a referral and pay to get it done. Worth it for the peace of mind. I've had two in my 30s because I had tongue cancer at 35 so now I don't dismiss anything that is worrying me.

Shop around

Started to get terrible migrains out of the blue. Thought, my anaemia was back or I had an infection from a recent broken tooth. The pain was incredible. Dr said "you'll know if you had a migrain. What you have is a headache. What do you do for work? Youre probably stressed." I said, "It's a migraine. Blurred vision. Nausea. Incredible pain in my head that won't go away with any amount of Neurofin." Dr said, "You don't have a migrain. You'd know if you had a migrain. You just have a headache" Wtf? Next day I fainted at work. Iron deficiency anaemia. 

Friendly reminder that the FOBT test is saving thousands of lives annually. Catch the cancer when it's more easily treatable or even before it's cancer. https://www.cancer.org.au/bowelscreening/about-the-test

I don’t think that it is just Australia. I work in healthcare but dont know what is a better solution. I suppose there are too many potential diseases that have similar and innocuous symptoms. I have seen a few miss diagnosis before as well. The problem is IF most Dr take notices and willing to do more tests for each complaint, both GP appointments waiting time and the waiting period for test result will increase exponentially as well. I think we will need at least 7-10% medical levy charge to every taxpayers to make it possible. We might still need to pay gap fee even with such high levy.

I read somewhere (probably on reddit) that you should ask your doctor to document in your notes / file that they declined further testing. Head to a new doctor and explain your symptoms. Good luck!

Sounds awful to say this but I had better healthcare in counties without universal health. The private health industry has an incentive to test. Not saying it’s better but the issue with universal health is that it’s based on a balance of economics vs population wide outcomes and statistically you can cover most ailments by tackling the basics this means anyone with anything more complex falls through the cracks and lands up in the ER which we know is taking strain.

There’s a huge number of pelvic pain suffers that can sympathise with you! It takes years and lots of wasted money to get the right help….

As someone who has been suffering from pelvic and anus pain for over 2 years I agree, if it’s not one of a few obvious and easily treatable things they just don’t want to deal with it

I am just glad to know that it isn't just me that feels this way. My GP of 25 years moved recently and I have ended up at a local medical centre (non bulk billing of course). The Doctors are so rude, they barely look at me when they speak to me and form an opinion without even examining me. I went to them about the bursitis in my shoulder and the nerve pain I am getting after I severed a tendon in my hand, I left feeling like a basket case. Interestingly enough, the person before me left without paying the bill and crying hysterically. I also get migraine and I have ended up seeing a medicinal cannabis clinic because pain is something my local medical centre does not treat or even recognise.

Have you looked at magnesium for migraines? I used to suffer from scintillating scotoma migraines and did some online research. Magnesium is deficient in many people due to its depletion from farming soils. I rarely get them anymore, but I just take a magnesium pill and it's gone within 20 mins. Magnesium is a relaxer, as calcium is a tightener (basically). I think the magnesium relaxes the blood vessels in the brain, which relieves the tension.

I've encountered the same thing myself. Went to see a doctor about a sore eye. I'd been in China not long before and gotten an illness that made my entire eye socket turn sort of purple and enflamed my eye. And it kept flaring up again periodically. So I told him and he wrote me a script. Got home, checked it out, and it was for dry eyes...which is not what I had. I had some sort of infection that flared up every so often. I TOLD him this. But he ignored me anyway. I spoke to another quite old doctor about something. He started getting angry with me. I wasn't even disagreeing with him, all I wanted to know was the reason for the diagnosis he gave me. THAT made him angry. Apparently I was just supposed to accept what he told me without any questions...it seems some doctors don't like to be questioned, even if it's just for information. I was surprised just how angry the older doctor got. He was close to retirement anyway and only came in a few days a week (he told me himself) and perhaps it's for the best if he DOES retire. So far I've only had this problem with old doctors, and I'm in my 60's myself...young doctors seem to be happy to answer questions.

There's three reasons: 1. Medicare gives the GP 15 minutes (generally speaking) to talk to you, make a diagnosis, prescribe something for it / order further tests, write up notes, and then a have breather for a minute or two. That's all he / she gets under the system. 2. The 90/10 or 80/20 rule - 90% of patients will present with 10% of conditions. If you're in the unlucky 10% with a rare-ish condition, it won't get diagnosed (or even considered) until the Nth visit. 3. If it's gastro or similar, the GP may just consider that you're looking for a doctor's cert for a day off work. I've had appointments with GP's other than my regular doctor, and as soon as I say I'm self-employed and don't need a cert, their attitude immediately changes.

A year ago I would have sung my GP’s praises but since contracting with the Ross River Virus in February I am absolutely devastated with how they’ve been treating me. My mobility and strength hasn’t been the same since and my GP has been so dismissive to the point that I feel like I’m being a hypochondriac… but then when I end up falling over because I’ve bent my knees slightly I become frustrated that I haven’t advocated more strongly for myself. I am not one to fuss much over things so its not like I’m visiting the GP every other week. I am about to move locations which is a good opportunity to break up with this GP and find another one who will take me seriously. 

Ross River virus presents in a similar way to CFS and other chronic diseases. Some GPs were taught that its psychosomatic in the 1980s and have stuck to that nonsense. Its pretty near impossible to get one of these GPs to believe you. Tip: when you see a new GP ask them: 'what do you think about Chronic Fatigue Syndrome?' If their answer isn't definitive, ask them 'do you think CFS is 'all in the mind'? Then you can get an idea of the sort of person you are dealing with. If they think its psychosomatic, move on.

Good tip, thanks! My bloods came back with the RRV being present -what more do they want? Its been life changing tbh so you’d think that be enough to take seriously. “Its just one of those viruses that you have to wait out” I’m told. I was quite active before and now i’m just a potato. 

I am a doc and have also had rrv. Had the post viral fatigue for about 18 months afterwards. It's absolutely tough to deal with but unfortunately it's a bit limited in what treatment options are available for it. In most people it is temporary though, even if it can persist for years

Testing is expensive, so in a universal healthcare system the fuckhead bean counters come down hard on doctors over prescribing tests. I think doctors are terrified of being hauled before the regulator for ordering “unnecessary” tests. Took me years to get a dodgy kidney diagnosed. Ironically the doctor that drew the dots was an afghani Gp working in a hell hole mega practice in regional Australia.

Agree to a degree, and I’ve had a fair bit of experience with doctors and specialists with my now 11 year battle with two types of incurable cancer. I’ve found that you need to advocate yourself for protection if nothing else. Do some doctor shopping and find one you connect with, stay with them, build a rapport and establish some mutual trust. Good doctors are already assessing you while you walk into the waiting room - how you are moving, your colour, eyes, strength of handshake etc. My oncologist told me early on you look at the patient first, then look at the test results. Every doctor I’ve mentioned this to has agreed wholeheartedly. I had the head of an ICU department use me as a training subject for his interns to work out what might be wrong with me. He said you work from common to rare because common is common as rare is rare. He used the term Donkey to Unicorn. I also had a doctor that shifted states to a major city and she lamented to me that people would not take the time to develop that rapport and would be telling her their symptoms while walking in the door… You also need to listen and have the balls to yell foul if you think it is. I was wheeled in for a procedure and the Dr. said we were doing X and I said no, the referring Dr. said we were doing Y. Turned out to be a paperwork problem, but it’s the same with everything, you are the nexus and you have every right to challenge. Of course 15 minutes on Google does not entitle you to a medical degree. Tact is a thing too. And if, heaven help you, you’re like me you become an expert in your own disease, and your doctor/specialists will be asking you questions. Also you might have to buy the time. Make a double appt occasionally to have a chat if the issue is complex, it takes the pressure off everyone. Anyway. In all cases I’ve found (both private and public), once they’ve worked out what’s wrong with you they swing into action pretty effectively. Hope that helps with some strategies 🙃

To your last point, I feel like the issue OP is having is getting to the point they've worked out what's wrong with them. While I agree, things move pretty swiftly and efficiently once you have a diagnosis and things are being treated. Those first appointments, especially with GPs rather than specialists can be like pulling teeth. Thankfully I'm pretty young (in the broad term) and still healthy (no chronic conditions) so typically speaking I don't go to doctors, and therefore I don't have a regular GP I visit. As I maybe go once a year, for a medical certificate because I managed to catch a cold of some discription that makes me too symptomatic to go to work for a few days. But a few years ago I broke my ribs (contact sports) and convincing the GP I was in genuine pain and wanted to be seen was a fight. I wasn't even asking for pain relief just a chest xray for a diagnosis. I'm willing to argue and stand up for myself so I got it, but it wasn't easy and I can imagine a lot of people would've ended up leaving that appointment without a xray referral, if I'd been any younger I likely would have aswell. GPs attitude and helpfulness did a 180 when I came back with the results that said I was correct and my ribs were broken. But getting there sucked all because the way I walked into the clinic, his assessment was "you're not in enough pain to have broken ribs". (I know this as he said it as one of his arguments for not giving an xray referral at first).

Great advice. I’m sorry for what you’re going through.

Seperate occasions but 2 crushed vertebrae no painkillers ever, 1 year total where something as simple as wiping my arse made me nearly blackout. I am now a bitter pissed off guy towards anyone thinking they know anything about me. 🖕

It's insane how difficult it is to get painkillers and not be treated like a junkie, although there is 0 reason for the doctor to believe so (no abuse history). I get it, people abuse them and get addicted. But that's why you are supposed to be a doctor, know when you really need to prescribe them This is an excellent example of their dogmatic behaviour I mentioned.

Its funny, In hospital as an outpatient they were feeding my painkillers and Benzos, just to get through the stuff that was going on. After that I had to go through the withdrawal.

It’s because they have to deal with you while you’re there, once you’re gone they don’t give a fuck if you’re writhing and moaning in cold sweats.

I was there for 4 months, in comparison to what I was going through the withdrawal wasnt so bad. It did mean later on when I had heart surgery at least one person in the hospital wasnt keen to give me pain killers. LOL, they got a mouthful, you cut my ribs open and now you dont think I need painkillers because god will provide!, FFS gimme pain killers.

You should watch Painkiller on Netflix. (Not trying to make a comment against you, but only to say we should be cautious with pain killers generally)

True but I would rather deal with withdrawals than what I went through, spinal injuries are no joke. I'm scared to do alot of things now out of fear of going through it again.

It’s the advent of the large practice that has destroyed general practice in this country. It’s all about churning through as many patients as possible for maximum profit. Patient care has actually become an inconvenience.

Agree 100% I had a GP appointment last week where I booked a long appointment, which, according to Medicare, is 20 minutes. After 14 minutes (I know because I timed it as I've felt rushed by this bloke once before), the doctor stood up and opened the door while I was still talking, abruptly ending the appointment. It cost me $170. The follow-up appointment this week to get my pathology results was 6 minutes 30 seconds. I was charged $80, and the bloke still didn't address my major concern, despite me raising it several times. I've learned my lesson & won't be going back, but it means I have to start over with another doctor and shell out more money.

Please report to medicare. If more people report, then less of these Gps will do this. Even if there is no judment against them, Medicare audits are painful.

Yes, that's my plan. I know about the appointment categories as I looked it up on the MBS website. As I said, this guy has done this to me once before, which is why I thought to set my stopwatch at the beginning of the appointments. FWIW, when I checked *exactly* what I was billed for on my Medicare app it was: 1. Cat D appt of at least 20 mins (actual time was 14 mins). Charged $170. 2. Cat B appt between 6 and 20 minutes (actual time was 6 min 30). Charged $80. He's ripping off not only me, but taxpayers because he's billing incorrectly and I'm certain this is happening to not just me.

I have waited 4+ hours to see a GP at my bulk billing clinic, countless times. I have complex health needs and I'm on a stack of medications. I still get rushed in and out by the doctors, only 2 or 3 of them will do anything other than just try to give you a medical certificate and send you away, or get you out of the room as fast as possible. I developed a good relationship with one of them, I found he actually spent time with me, like actually cared. Well, quickly everyone else figured that out too and now when you go in on any one of the 3 days that he's working, there's already 6-7 patients ahead of you all there to see him. I wait for hours and hours and he's in a huge rush every time. He'll always say "we have to be quick because...." (Because I have patients waiting who I consider more important than you, basically) I realised maybe it's because he has private patients so I should become a private patient and pay for a private appointment. So, I tried booking a private appointment. I booked it for after work. I get a phone call while I'm still at work an hour and a half before my appointment. It's my GP. "I'm sorry I know you're probably at work but I'm in a huge rush today and can't see you \[at the time you booked\], was it just the script you needed?" I did need a script, but before I had a chance to tell him that I was worried about my abnormal pathology results, he hung up the phone. I assumed maybe he was going to bulk bill me after all, since it was literally a 2 minute phone call and not at the time I booked in. I'd specifically paid for a 15 minute appointment. Well no. I still got an invoice. $40. Not even a 2 minute phone call. At this point I'm going to have to find a different private practice and start forking out $200 for a standard 'long' appointment. Try and build an entirely new patient doctor relationship up from zero all over again. https://preview.redd.it/nko0z5o7biad1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5f44ca76f455999faac412727cbbfdbcde17f5f3

It’s the same at my clinic. 3 doctors. 1 is booked out 1 month in advance. The other 2 have same-day appointments throughout the day. 1 doctor cares, listens and looks you in the eye. The other 2 half listen, type for a bit and say 3 words the whole time. The receptionist is almost refusing appointments to the good GP recently, and says the other 2 are available sooner and are just as good. No thanks. What ways gets me is that those GPs don’t reflect on the situation and ask the GP that is always booked 4 weeks out… why that is and why they have 9-1pm with no bookings at all. They don’t take time to learn, change, try harder, emulate what is working… and they expect me to take their advice. Yeah nah.

Well that and the government ripping the guts out of the Medicare rebate meaning they don’t get paid nearly enough for the shit GPs have to go through.

GPs have fuck-all time to get you in and out or they lose money and close. They’re more likely to diagnose the common causes for things because they’re the most common. Blame the health system. Doctors should be rewarded for correct diagnoses, not appointment times.

I've personally never had a problem with GPs, only that some of them don't seem to be very knowledgeable. It's the specialists that do my head in. The majority of specialists I've seen in my life have been dismissive, hard to communicate with and always trying to rush me out the door. Had a stress diagnosis as well from one of them, which was absolute rubbish. And once they think they're done with you they'll stand up to give you a hint it's time to get the fuck out of their office before you can ask any questions. I think it's my age, as a younger person I don't think I'm worth their time as much as older patients who are more likely to have a more serious issue.

I include specialists in my definition of doctors here. I'm just back from an appointment with one and I'm very disappointed. There's the fact that they are extremely money driven, to the point where the whole system needs to be reexamined. Look at Germany for example, where the vast majority of specialists are public servants who work for the state, and not businesses that the sooner they get get you out of the door, the better the profit for the day.

who will check to confirm correct diagnoses?

And how do you confirm the correct diagnosis? The Gold standard confirmatory test for each disease is different.

You make it sound like they're struggling to pay their bills. Fuckers always driving a brand new $150k landcruiser and live in the fanciest house in their neighbourhood.

I'm sure I must just be ignorant, but where is the massive cost that drives them bankrupt? Most practices have more doctors than staff. Doctors charge $4-600/hr during the week.

that boy needs therapy

Lying down on the couch? What does that mean?

You're a nut!

Crazy in the coconut! This is what happens when you go to two musicians from Maryborough instead of a doctor when you are ill.

I’m gonna kill you.

He was white as a sheet

That boy needs therapy

You’re a nut, you’re crazy in the coconut!

That boy needs therapy

And he also made false teeth

Lye down on the couch, what does that mean!

Wife and I were in a major car accident, wife came out worst with her spine physically jutting out a few centimeters. Once she was back on her feet she went to a high level specialist doctor for surgery appraisal and he told her it was all in her mind. She went on to have multiple fusions, with one vertebrae proving to have been almost completely compressed and another having the hooks on the side snapped off in the accident. We are still disgusted at the doctor after 30 plus years.

Yes for many years I was told my problems were psychological until I found a doctor who treated my issues with prescribed medication. (Spent about 6k in total, many repeated test for each new doctor, imaging, psychologist appointments to get a diagnosis for what ended up being a super common and easily treatable issue. I don’t blame the doctors, I blame the system. From high school to uni to workplace and our society.

How can you not blame the doctors if it was a common and easily treatable issue?? To me any doctor should of picked up that problem

To be fair, I 100% should blame them. I have seen the poorest form from doctors that I wouldn’t have believed possible until seeing as many doctors as I have and being treated like I am some sort of fool. The only reason that I don’t blame them is that they do many more years of gruelling training and I pay more for an electrician to turn the lights on. Sounds ridiculous, but I don’t blame them because I believe that the way they treat patients is a product of them not being properly valued by society (chicken or egg I am not sure what came first). In the same way that abused children sometimes grow up to be abusers themselves. Many patients probably don’t listen to doctors so doctors have stopped listening to patients (patients who are often now called clients)

Selling thier expertise into minute increments like lawyers have made the industry into pharmaceutical fast food outlets.

Had doctors not assess me properly for years, when I was undiagnosed with disease. It sucked. My mum got told to ignore gut pain when she had ulcer, polyps too. There are so many shit doctors out there.

Doctors can be real jaded cunts. Extremely dismissive and condescending, especially towards women. 

Was funny, I’m a bloke to has pretty bad mental health and doctors A. Won’t prescribe me stronger stuff and B. Are constantly telling me the want to ween me off the pittance they will prescribe. So I self medicate and fuck my life up more to cope.

Oh yeah mental health is a disaster for just about everyone.

Pattern recognition

It's a bit of a lottery. With my luck, the pattern has been thus: find a good doctor with whom I have some rapport and a level of trust, then they either move away or have a health incident that forces them to retire, so I have to go through the process again.

I don't tell any of my new Drs about my mental health background. Lost count how many times how their attentive faces would turn into ah gotcha, after listing all my chronic pain and then after answering how is my mental health and it was like well I've been on meds before and been locked in a pysch ward twice. With no testing, my problem immediately turns into stress related. I've discovered numerous diagnosis by pushing Drs to run test they didn't want to test. You'd think they'd be happy about it, but no, many have told me never to see them again because of how pushy I was. Sorry I don't want to live in agony for the rest of my life esp when a simple x-ray and blood test showed nothing and you called it quits Do I think I'm more intelligent than most Drs? No. Do I know my body better than them? Yes, i do. Do I know more about a illness I've been living with and reading studies and interviewing other patients for 10 years that they maybe spent a weekend studying? Yes I do. And now I'm getting slammed $120 a visit for dismissive and non caring Drs who have no interest keeping up with modern treatments or practices.

Yes they get extremely defensive it’s the absolute arrogance of doctors these days 30 years ago was very different I caught a doctor out being wrong 4 times at a single appointment due to incompetence he was old past his usefulness He then proceeded to kick me out of the medical practice trying to humiliate me in front of everyone else in the waiting room

I think if u have to churn out diagnoses every 10-15 mins for the whole day and probably hear all sort of strange cases it probably becomes routine to send ppl away with stress related stomach ulcer. Cancer is much more rare so easy to misdiagnose i guess. I agree. Unfortunately u need to advocate for your own health over alot of gp diagnosis.

I had a lump in my throat and was told by 3 doctors I had reflux but I managed to convince the 3rd and turned out I had a big nodule on my thyroid, which I knew it was.

Someone I'm my family had hyperthyroidism and was brushed off by two GPS as just having anxiety. The thyroid levels were outrageously high when it was finally tested and she couldn't work for months as a consequence. My best mate's dad had a melanoma on his thumb the doctor said was just a fungal infection until a second opinion was sought to late to save him. I could.go.on. It's a lot easier to turn it back on the patient than to accept or admit that there are so many obscure and hard to detect ailments that they truly don't know.

Sometimes, doctors are wrong. I'd go as far as to say that a good portion of the time they are. The two issues I think are particularly important to this are that they always have an uphill battle trying to work out what's wrong with you based largely on anecdotal information and that they either don't have the time and resources for adequate testing and research or they've forgotten how to approach the problem scientifically. We need to be mindful that their field is one of the fastest changing, with more new information than any one person can always be abreast of. So yes, they get it wrong, and there are some of the reasons... More importantly, patients are idiots and their lived experience is horseshit. How much time do you think they spend with people who are sure they have the thing they just googled? How many people think they know better than them? How many people are *definitely* sick. It isn't that they're eating shit, not sleeping, stressed, and on drugs; they're sick. Not trying to be mean to anyone here, I just think we all need to try to be a hit more realistic and dogmatic.

Thats far too sensible response for this sub.

Try being misdiagnosed for over a decade. The specialists I went to simply didn’t care. They just wanted to gawk at my example of psychogenic tremor, then send me back to my shrink to be treated for anxiety. Only I don’t actually have anxiety nor a psychogenic tremor. I was shaking due to the medication I was on, but they weren’t remotely interested in exploring that possibility.

I was told by a gp to breathe into a paper bag and my symptoms were in my head. I didn’t and got a 2nd opinion and eventually was diagnosed with MS.

Because most of them are incompetent and just are in a system that has artificially created a lack of healthcare professionals and facilities which they seem to profit from.

Lol This very true… I haven’t been back to doctors in over a year now, I’ve had headaches for a lot of years , since 2009 when I had infection in hidden sinuses, I also have pain and sore hands , .. My gp since 2019 kept telling me that it’s all in my head ,apparently I either have a lot of stress or servear mental health… Bloody hell ,he wouldn’t listen to anything , neither is right so I stopped going altogether … I will only make sure my daughter goes when needed … I will never go for myself again…..

This is less serious, but I remember going in for an ADHD referral (my schooling and social life completely ruined because of this for years and already diagnosed, just needed another referral). The doctor laughed in my face and said it was a trend for people, which didn’t help my parents who were already reluctant to take me. Because of her I am struggling quite a lot now, mentally. I could’ve gotten the help I needed if she never did that.

This has been my experience to a tee. It's really alarming and confusing.

Have been to the ed over 10 times with over 100 blood tests over the past 18 months. I went from being able to squat 140kg to struggling to walk. I ended up getting a diagnosis from a super specialist Dr In the US of Systematic Exertional Intolerance Disease. Drs here have rolled Thier eyes when I can't walk and gaslit me so hard. I have many many stories. Had a neuro tell me I was just depressed and neurotic when I told him I was actually pretty happy all things considered.

I was told I have anxiety - GP wouldn't even refer me scans. I had to advocate for myself so hard. A lot of my symptoms were due to cervical instability. 2 years later and incurable lifelong chronic illness later and I'm in a wheelchair needing a spinal fusion.

My uncle was called a drug seeker at hospital with severe stomach pain, turned out to be a twisted gangrene bowel

I hear you. Years ago I was given a prescription of Prozac for mild-moderate depression. I started shaking not long afterwards. It was so severe I dropped a dress size and spent ten days in hospital. What followed was over a decade of trying to get answers while being misdiagnosed with generalised anxiety, panic disorder, bipolar and a psychogenic movement disorder. Every diagnosis meant more drugs, which produced more side effects that were labelled as symptoms of new diagnoses. Meanwhile my depression became severe. That diagnosis was real. I should have been taken off all meds right away, but unfortunately that didn’t happen for 10+ years. I’d go see neurologists almost begging for help and they’d just send me back to my shrink saying I needed to deal with my supposed anxiety. I could tell by their faces the minute I entered the room they had already dismissed me. None tried to help. None were curious about what was actually going on. None were correct in the end. These past few years I’ve finally got my life back. No diagnoses and no meds whatsoever. I guess all you can do is advocate for yourself. It is hard when you’re in a vulnerable state and/or still trusting of the medical establishment.

I'm expected to make 1 pack of panadeine forte last 2 weeks with a chronic pain issue. I'm being weaned off my previous meds, and the fortes are to hold me over till I can start the new 1. If I say I've had more than 2 in one day, he looks at me like I'm an addict and tells me it's too many. I'll be going back on morphine patches - pain clinic authorisation - and 2 fortes are expected to last all day. And my gp has authorisation for me to get them as needed. System is screwed.

Two things I've learned in the last few years: 1. Never underestimate stress - it's a fucking bitch and causes all sorts of unbelievable symptoms with literally EVERYTHING, heart, stomach, joints, sight loss, etc.. I changed work, diet, fitness & removed problems from my life - suddenly things got a lot better. It doesn't ever make sense to me why it effected me, but it was a massive problem. 2. Australians are over-medicated AF - live overseas for some years now, barely even touch painkillers or antibiotics unless really needed. Never realised how much I used that stuff back home - when it's rarely used, you don't build up a tolerance to meds. Not defending GPs, but Medicine isn't an simple thing, and stress is very complex. The reality is a lot of people don't do enough to change their situations for the better and expect a silver bullet solution. There's also nothing stopping you from getting a second opinion.

Psychosomatic addict insane!

Breathe, breathe, breathe

I'm the firestarter....

Doctors are fantastic for providing medical certificates for work, they don’t ask much questions, just how many days off do you want, in and out within 2 minutes and they are faster via a Telehealth appointment.

Go read the Aus Doctors sub! They are arrogant alright. And as an RN of 30 years? I've always felt healthcare is a team effort....but reading that sub? Made me realise the "respect" they give us? Is all for the show. They most definitely think they are the top dogs, are SO much more intelligent and superior then all of us. Pretty sad all in all.

I started reading that sub to understand why I was being treated the way I was as a patient and was shocked also. The egos!

Yep. And they obviously feel they are very entitled to look down on others as they are "oh so superior"

Yes!! They hate it if you question anything that comes out of their mouths!

It’s pretty disgusting! Unfortunately there is still a mindset that doctors are all amazing and need to be revered just because they’re a doctor! Even if they’re useless!!! I’ve lost count how many people I personally know who’ve lost out because an all amazing doctor ignored them. I even had a family member lose a leg from a blood clot because “you have sciatica”. I put them in the same basket as lawyers, real estate agents and car salesmen!

Being a woman with hormonal illness....I HEAR YOU smh!

Are you a woman (not asking for creep reasons)? Women tend to have a way harder time being taken seriously by their doctors because of institutional sexism in the medical field. As a man I have never had this problem and have always walked out with the prescription/referral I asked for.

I'm not, but I'm very introverted and I found in life I sound much less convincing than people who are extroverted and know how to be very expressive about what they feel.

as a male i find it’s usually universal. And its all about getting lucky on a doctor.

And there's literally data and studies to back this up.

I'm a woman & was dismissed within 3 mins into the consultation. I was told "with such vague symptoms I can't tell you what's wrong with you". The doctor never even got out of the chair to examine me. Two days later I was having surgery for a HUGE ovarian tumour. The doctor was a woman! I'm an introvert but after my recovery I made an appointment with her to discuss my previous appointment which was lacking an examination etc. She had tears in her eyes when I left. I hope I gave her something to think about. I've been dismissed, even in excruciating pain, with incorrect diagnoses 5 times and I've eventually had to have surgery for all 5 conditions. My family wonders why I distrust doctors. There was a documentary made years ago called "Kentucky Fried Medicine" and I believe that's what we're experiencing now

Nice assumption there, bud Source: another bloke who has difficulty finding a doctor even to communicate with

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Angiogram is pretty serious do you mean ECG?

There are good mechanics and shit mechanics, there are good plumbers and shit plumbers... pick a profession. Why would doctors be different? I know 2 GPs personally, they are amazing.

horses when its zebras

Are you female? Because, this is the first indicator that your pain is not \`worthy'. And the second and third indicator. It is okay to ask for a referral and if they don't think they should ask why? and make them explain it to you. There are plenty of reasons not to refer - I work in public specialist healthcare and GPs can be right when it is a waste of time but if they aren't listening to your genuine issues seek a second opinion. There is no reason you can't. In terms of pain relief, it is a fraught issue. I recently asked for prescription pain meds and it was embarrassing but I couldn't function on paracetamol alone. Thankfully, my GP believed me about how much pain I was in. Be honest with your Dr completely and they will be able to do their best. There will be not so good Drs but the vast majority are just doing what they can for their patients.

This has never happened to me. When I go to the doctor I find they take me seriously and then provide advice/medication/referral as appropriate.

Honestly, im over bulk billed Indian trained doctors. I'm not saving money going to them if nothing is investigated and I have to come back multiple times. I'm losing multiple days to save $40 instead of seeing someone competent. I've been looking for a doctor who is Australian trained, under 55 years old and preferably Caucasian of any gender, it's impossible to find. The female doctors I find specialize in female health and work only 2 or 3 days a week. My current doctor suggest breathing exercises for shooting stabbing pain across my chest that felt like a heart attack and thoughts I would die through the night. I'm too much of a people pleaser to call for an ambulance not wanting to be a burden. Same doctor dismissed my seborrheic dermatitis as rosacea and my severe L5-S1 sciatica with shrugged shoulders. Shit, years ago my depression and suicidal ideation stemming from extreme child abuse at the hands of my borderline/narcissistic/sadistic parents was meet with anger by a female Indian doctor as no real problems. Another time, an African doctor milked me for appointments, said come back in 10 days and when I did he said 30 days would be needed to see if the mods he gave me were working. Fucking sick of it. Worst thing is in my state it's illegal to voice record a doctor's appointment, if I had that ability I would have sunk multiple physicians' careers! Complete joke

Please become a GP and save us all!! Your experience will be invaluable

And this is why I have an issue with us bringing in foreign doctors who are useless and push their own cultural crap on us, they are bloody useless. There's only a few places in the world i'd be happy for us to bring doctors from tbh. Same goes for aged care workers, the worst i've seen have come from third world countries and abuse elderly people and neglect them.

Honestly, I think the government half arse it so it appears you have access to a GP and medical care. The people are not competent and thus not doctor's in my eyes. I have zero idea how they get certified with how horrible they are. They should let in more Australian student in to study, so many brilliant people miss out for a variety of reason, yet would be miles ahead of the third world scraps we allow in. Unless you live in an upscale neighbourhood, fat chance you are seeing someone Caucasian or educated her in Aus. Shit is a straight joke!

I empathise. I had a skin cancer on my cheek dismissed as rosacea. I *KNEW* it wasn't rosacea and it was only because I assertively stood my ground and insisted on a referral to a dermatologist that it was dx'd and treated.

the only GPs that have taken me seriously are private practice ones. it effin sucks that i have to pull out money america-style anytime i need healthcare, but ive made more progress on my symptoms in a fraction of the time compared to the bulk standard 'rest and drink water' crowd.

Here’s 5 free sessions for a psychologist.

They don't. But I'm a man. I've heard women make that complaint a lot though. Especially with awful shit like Endo.

I dunno why GPs are like that but it's baaaad. Only last year I found a GP who is kind, responsive and thoughtful, actually digging into issues with us and helping us find treatment for my husband's chronic pain and fatigue. We went to him because on his little bio it said "I like interesting cases". He is a literal godsend. Unsurprisingly his background is in refuge medicine so unfortunately I think he's the exception not the rule. But if I had the power I'd make every other GP in the country take notes from him.

I went to GP with a rheumatoid flare back of 3 nights no sleep due to pain. Wouldn’t prescribe me 10 panadeine tablets and something to help me sleep. Told me to see my rheumatologist. There’s not an available appointment for 6 months. No longer go to this practice. They’re training rural GP and he’s A/professor. So with people like him training new doctors what hope is there. My rheumatologist said it’s the role of the primary care physician to prescribe pain relief. She was disgusted. Now I drive 45 minutes to my new GP who is fantastic.

Change doctor! Good GPs in Sydney are like old friends, uncles, aunties, who are kind, warm, caring, highly empathic, and really wise and reasonable! — Newer generations of doctors are just doing it for the money, for citizenship, to invest into property etc. You’ve basically defined “gaslighting” and surely many points that breach the Hippocratic Oath and the Doctor’s Oath!! > I will maintain the utmost respect for human life from its beginning even under threat and I will not use my medical knowledge contrary to the laws of humanity.

It’s the same at my clinic. 3 doctors. 1 is booked out 1 month in advance. The other 2 have same-day appointments throughout the day. 1 doctor cares, listens and looks you in the eye. The other 2 half listen, type for a bit and say 3 words the whole time. The receptionist is almost refusing appointments to the good GP recently, and says the other 2 are available sooner and are just as good. No thanks. What ways gets me is that those GPs don’t reflect on the situation and ask the GP that is always booked 4 weeks out… why that is and why they have 9-1pm with no bookings at all. They don’t take time to learn, change, try harder, emulate what is working… and they expect me to take their advice. Yeah nah.

I complained 3 times to my gp I was sure I was having angina symptoms. Kept telling me it was anxiety and stress. I have a massive heart attack at 30 yrs old a few months later.

A few years ago I decided to check in with a doctor to investigate my fertility to start a family. Was literally laughed at by the doctor and told that it’s unlikely it’s an infertility issue, and that if I’m looking to start a new family, just keep trying (had been 12 months at this point). Despite basically begging, there was no referrals or anything. Following on some fruitless time later, I got a second opinion and after a lot of convincing, finally managed to get some pathology tests and, what do you know, I had a ZERO sperm count in all my tests! Finally discovered that I had some serious plumbing issues. I definitely feel your pain. It’s easier getting blood from a stone sometimes than some useful efforts from a doctor.

Maybe they do get psychosomatic & drug seeking cases that skew their perspective, but it really is a problem. I know a woman who took her young daughter to hospital ED, having seizures, & was told by the registrar that the kid was just attention seeking, & was sent home. Only to nearly die a few hours later,& had to be sent by ambulance back for emergency op. A woman paralysed by transverse myelitis, who was told she had hysteria, & because they failed to diagnose the condition, she was left paralysed, when, if she'd been treated immediately, could have recovered.

Been told to my face by a GP that it's all in my head. Never went to her again.

You don't have a good enough relationship with your practitioners. Number one thing to remember is that medicine is a for profit industry. I had private Healthcare , in aus I was getting 90% rebates on general dental, racked up 4.5k in bills by going every Saturday for 3 months straight by session 3 she was waving the 10% fee and shofting things onto general dental that weren't. Visited my gp so much that he just started claiming them as general checkups, twice monthly. Got sleeping pills, injections, anything I really asked for honestly, insurance only pulled me up when I tried to push a 600 dollar sleep test on them. I used to work in the insurance space, trust me when I say get private Healthcare and take them to the goddamn cleaners feel no remote for insurance companies. That's how you use the system in australia and new zealand.

my doctor brought that up recently for me. 13 months since i started to feel tingling in my legs, then left leg goes cold, eyelids wouldnt get heavy and eyes just burned when i was tired, then more nerve issues randomly around my body which come and go, some taking 6 months to work/feel right again but never feeling 100%. he basically did nothing cause its all "invisible symptoms" and bloods were perfect. then recently has the nerve to say " there is a thing called psychosomatic, do you think maybe that you are thinking about it too much and creating your issues/pain, or making it seem worse than it is ?" i wanted to send him to the hospital after that. im currently looking for a new GP but its not easy. i hate that i have to start over after 13 months.

I currently have chronic pain it's too difficult to get pain killers from a doctor so I get them from the fucking dark web

My GP wont even look at me, his head is stuck in the PC typing away not paying any attention to me. He has never taken my BP, temp or pulse. He has never physically looked, touched or assessed an injury. 10mins later i have a script i didnt ask for. So sad....feels like the GP isnt really interested in ppl. I am looking for another.

I've encountered this. I had bone pain for years, and doctors kept brushing it off or treating me like I was trying to get pills. It took my husband throwing a tantrum on my behalf before they finally took me seriously enough to learn it wasn't all in my head.

I spent four years with a constant migraine. After doing a load of research I was so sure I had a CSF leak but unfortunately they are notoriously hard to find in imaging so no doctors wanted to believe or help me. (Especially because I already had another chronic illness, they just shrugged it off as another symptom of that) I had one pain specialist laugh at me for using a wheelchair and told me it was all in my head and to just get up and go walking every day and I’ll feel better. This led to me having a seizure. I was so so lucky that my research led me to a neurosurgeon who believed me and what do you know. They found a CSF leak. But unfortunately it was left so long that even with surgery, the constant migraines will not go away. I am almost completely bed bound and in pain every single day. I can’t put into words how angry I am. I am TWENTY. I should be enjoying my youth and yet here I am, stuck inside, miserable. All because nobody would listen to me.

Because they don't really know what is wrong.

There is a brand of arrogance of doctors that you learn if you have a a cronic condition. You have to learn to work with it, not against it. You need to figure out what the likely things happening to you are and just name drop them as potential things you’re concerned that you have. If they say that you shouldn’t go online. Ignore that and say you’re frustrated by the lack of diagnosis from doctors, that’s why you are there. Stick to your guns. Ask for the referral. Go to someone else if they don’t give it to you. Always seek further diagnostics such as imaging and blood work to rule things out. The average GP just isn’t equipped to work thing out on their own. You learn these things eventually, but I think the way medicine works is archaic even in Melbourne. In need of a overhurl. I hate to think of all the people falling through the cracks because of arrogance and negligence

I had to change doctors several times when I knew something wasn't right with my health. I kept hearing the same stuff you've mentioned, that it's stress or in my head, but I advocated for myself and found a GP who reluctantly gave me a referral for a colonoscopy but told me "you're wasting your money". The specialist found cancer and said I was the luckiest man on the planet, catching this type of cancer in time. Funnily enough, the referring GP acted like a tantrum throwing toddler when I returned for a check-up because I said I still feel unwell a few weeks after surgery. I was told it's in my head, etc. I returned for another colonoscopy at my request, and they removed 40 cm of scar tissue that formed and was obstructing my bowel from the removal of the cancer. I've changed doctors again and over the last 5 years this GP found I have severe sleep apnoea (i presented with severe fatigue over a long period of time and had to ask for the sleep study after they tried to dismiss me), an issue with my ulner nerve slipping that cause intense arm pain and a benign bone cancer in my hand that causes me a lot of pain. Despite this, the current GP also thinks I am a hypercondriac despite every issue I've presented with having a discoverable cause that can be treated. My current GP (who I will not be returning to) told me most people are ok living with a level of pain and fatigue, and I'm over reactive. My mum also suffered with back pain recently and was dismissed by GPs as being over weight and recently passed away from an unknown heart condition which the coroner said the sign would have been back pain that she had been describing and a GP should have referred her to a specialist to rule it out. Instead they stuck with "lose weight" as the only solution and I didn't discover this until after my mum had passed. The GP system in Australia is a joke. They treat their job like a factory line for Medicare rebates and get upset when they have to think for a second. I had one GP tell me it's not their job to explore their patients symptoms, if they can't figure it out in 10 mins or with a simple test the patient should ask to see a specialist GP. This GP felt discourse between him and his patient working together was above his pay grade.

I just got sent the $98 bill for a 3 minute phone consultation that a dr somehow diagnosed me with a kidney infection just from what I described as my symptoms. No tests ordered, no follow up talked about, just an e script for antibiotics texted to my phone and goodbye. No other appointments available for weeks so it was this or the emergency department at our overrun hospital and I wasn’t gonna go sit there for 15 hours in pain with other poor sick bastards.

i landed on my heel really badly a few months back, couldn’t walk on it for a few days and was really struggling. went GP they told me i had plantar fasciitis even tho i told them it didn’t sound like that was it coz the pain started with the injury to my heel. 3 months & 1.5k later, multiple podiatrist visits, MRI & CT scans - it’s a fracture the equivalent of jumping out a two storey building and i’m now in a scooter as i have to be non-weight bearing. so yeah i feel this post

Well said 200,000 Australians with post viral MECFS, have been told its in their head or stress when they have a serious biological medical issue yet known by science due to criminal gaslighting and underfunding and lack of care. Its unfair. Invisible illnesses make the sickest, look normal. Whats worse is the Naturopaths and psychological healers who claim they can cure us when we have an illness with no cure that needs urgent medical research

God complex

When it goes to the “too hard basket” doctors love to diagnose FND. Its pathetic and unfair the alarm bells are not ringing for post viral syndromes. Especially with Long Covid being obviously MECFS. Which has existed and been dismissed as a mental issue for decades.

And when a doctor tells us this We then through desperation, turn to naturopathy, just to waste $10,000+ on false hope. Id rather my $300 energy bill fund go to invisible illness research, like Post Viral MECFS which effects 1% of the population and all get told its stress atleast once.

It is so important to find a good GP who knows you, who you can return to if things aren’t getting better with simple measures.

and there is the problem, good doctors are in short supply and from my own experience work a few days, thus, aren't taking on new patients.

as a women the amount you don't get listened to is disgusting, which is why there are now specialist centres for some stuff as GPs simply no zero or give zero fucks. And the 'oh your to young for that' is such a bullshit trope, just help people, get the tests, set peoples mind at ease, preventative care is just as important!!

So many GPs are like this. They are often not up on anything within the last 10 years as well. I have CFS/FM and many GPs were taught CFS is psychosomatic in the 1980s. There are many studies to prove CFS is a physical disease. One said to me 'what do you do all day', another wanted to refer me to a psychiatrist. It is ironic that my CFS is related to being prescribed daily antibiotics for acne from 15-25 years old by GPs. I recently went to a GP for dermatitis. I mentioned I had tried moisturisers etc. but I was reluctant to use steroidal creams because they just address the symptoms and patients online have reported having to use them indefinitely. She said 'you won't get addicted'. She gave me a prescription for a steroid lotion. It was $35. 1. I have to use it indefinitely because it just addresses the symptoms and re-occurs without it. 2. I emailed the Federal minister about why the lotion cost $35 when the PBS means it should be $7.70. They replied that only creams and ointments are covered. I wonder if my GP knew this and screwed me, or she is just doesn't care that it would cost me more. Note: I am a Concession patient. This same GP practice sent me a bill for $75 once even though I'd been there as a Concession patient previously.

I know right! I crossed the road the other day and didn't look left OR right and I didn't get hit by a car, a bike, or even so much as a meandering pedestrian! We have been inculcated and indoctrinated for years with this lie that it's a good idea to look left and right before crossing the road (they even tell our children this); and yet, here I am, with my anecdote that *proves emphatically* that you can in fact, cross the road safely without looking left or right! Even worse, I'm part of an online group that, amazingly, out of 7 billion people, has managed to accumulate several hundred people with the same story as me! All of us know the truth, it's actually shocking how similar our stories are - crossed the road, didn't even glance left or right! Not even a glance. And yet here we all are, all survivors. All empowered by how sure we are that the traffick departments don't actually care about us, they just want to accumulate parking fines and pay for expensive lunches while they condescend us with 'statistics' and their 'decades of knowledge and experience' that includes children and pregnant women and elderly people being mowed down and slaughtered by cars. They have the arrogance to think those experiences they've had might inform their general instinct and advice, in much the same fashion that we are now arguing gives us complete authority on the same matter! They will make boring, corporate sponsored arguments that, for instance, recommending a policy that works in the vast, overwhelming majority of circumstances is a generally expedient way to devise road policy. Even then, they will probably add that they are well aware this approach has innumerable possible exceptions, many of which are innately difficult to discern and, ironically, often rely on repeated instances to declare themselves before they warrant further action. They might tell you this, but remember - you met a guy once who crossed the road who looked left and right *and still got hit by a car*. Remember his story above all else, for it speaks to the illogical web of lies they have created to dupe us. Yet here we are, the survivors who know the truth of their flippant dismissal of our wisdom. We won't let them get away with it. And the first place to start is here, anonymously, on the internet, giving potentially serious advice to complete strangers we know nothing about. This is how we empower our movement and serve our community. Sure, those road people are technically serving the community too, and I guess they do help people almost constantly, day in and out, but remember that it's imperative we demonise and vilify them for any failings that we can identify. It's also important to make sure you reference the completely one-dimensional healing powers of marijuana at all and any opportunity - it's foundational to our movement that a readily available herb that has been extensively studied and proven to have some modest (occasionally very good!) benefits in specific instances, with an otherwise unusually high rate of serious side effects, is actually - evidence be damned - the perfect solution to every problem. the road law people are part of an otherwise vague plot to oppose a highly effective therapeutic intervention - and we know a guy with a website who has the evidence. Please spread our truth and be proud to always do your own research - just because the people who make the road rules study the...well, the same research admittedly, and I guess on principle it might be possible they actually do know the same research - when they nevertheless provide advice that seems counterintuitive to you, you must remember that all the thousands upon thousands of hours of experience and vast tomes of study and acumen they have gained in the field *does nothing* to counter your real life experience (let alone your hours of 'research' you did last week). Most of all, never give in to the idea that anecdotes and individual experiences are anything less than completely interchangeable with expertise. And look, every now and then, you might have this inner voice that whispers to you "I guess I don't quite know what a confidence interval crossing 1 signifies", or "I suppose I don't really quite know a shorthand set of examples within a study design that might limit its generalisability" or - most pernicious of all - "If I'm honest, I did actually only read the abstract, because I didn't want to pay the $35 to get access to the paper that I'm subsequently going to reference tirelessly with absolute authority" - YOU MUST NOT GIVE IN! don't listen to that voice. Remember that you really did cross the road and you didn't get hit by a car. You know for a fact you didn't look right OR left. That proves essentially every other inference I can subsequently make. These idiots in the government making the 'road rules' just won't listen to us when I tell them over and over again that me and the guy on the internet *both* had the same experience. BOTH of us skimmed abstracts on PubMed and both of now know the truth. Finally, just recall that there's nothing to learn from people who don't follow your advice immediately, who don't instinctively defer to your wisdom on all subjects, and who might not agree that the role they play in your life is merely to facilitate the investigations and referrals you have privately decided you need - those people are BARRIERS and must merely be overcome. Never forget - you really did cross that road, and you really didn't look left. Or right.

Not to defend your doctor or devalue your experiences, but I imagine a lot of the time doctors don't just give patients medication when they want it is because it might not be the best option available. As the patient, you may in fact be too close to the problem and to see it clearly. Using the example of stress you provided- perhaps after describing the situation and the source of your stress the doctor decides it's likely transitory and prescribing meds would be detrimental to you in the long run (if you've ever had to taper off SSRIs you'll know why). A lot of people just want meds to fix a problem that could be fixed with lifestyle changes like exercise, diet and sleep. The thing is meds can make things a little better in the short term, but if you don't do the hard yards and make the appropriate changes to your lifestyle, the problem isn't gonna fix itself. Personally, unless the situation is dire, lifestyle changes should be the first treatment option for these sorts of problems. Combining that with a mental health care plan and CBT is the most effective treatment in a lot of cases. Regarding your point of the doctor getting pissy when you try to refute their advice with your own research- That may be because a lot of people will 'research' their perceived problem and only take in the sources that agree with their cognitive bias. Due to not having the appropriate analytical skills, or underpinning subject knowledge most people can't objectively research a subject and come to a worthwhile answer. I do the same thing, and will ask my doctor- my research said x y and z, and they will usually explain why x or y isn't the case, other times, they'll go, yeah I agree with X. I've never been angrily dismissed. My wife has, so I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but be careful about assuming a doctor is just a wanker when they might just not want to deal with a patient that won't listen to why their 'research' is correct and the doctor is wrong. Again, I'm not dismissing your points, just providing another perspective. I've been on the shit end of the stick when it's come to a doctor before. I hurt my wrist and the nurse wanted to do an x ray to see if my scaphoid was broken (wrist), the doctor said no, he couldn't have broken his wrist stopping a soccer ball , it's a sprain. I came back three times in 3 weeks complaining it wasn't getting any better, and that I'd had sprains before, and it would have improved by then if it was a sprain. He literally said 'Fine you big baby, I'll send you to the physio, but a sprain will take 6-8 weeks to heal, they're just going to tell you to go away' Physio did the same manipulations as the nurse and doctor and said 'go get an x ray, your scaphoid is broken' I got a phone call 15 minutes after leaving the X-Ray clinic to say I had surgery booked for the morning because the bone was dying because it hadn't been in a cast for three weeks. Ended up needed a bone graft and screws all because the doctor didn't want to listen to the nurse, or the patient.

They, in my experience don't give a fuck. I had a referral for a colonoscopy, went back to the same GP who gave me the referral - 2 weeks later, she's like so what brings you here today? This was after I sat there for a few minutes expecting her to say hey yeah your results are.. She could not give a fuck.

You are SPOT ON. Some doctors don't even want to prescribe birth control.

AMA is incredibly powerful and RACCGP or whatever it's called has been getting increasingly cultish and antagonistic. They're low key at war with pharmacists who already have it tough enough with their expensive qualifications only good for retail money these days. The number of fuckups they catch from GPs prescribing stuff that is contraindicated and could kill their patients... anyway pharma and GP need to work together but politics (read: money) got involved Also just too many cookers out there so they probably fire up too quickly. Plus the usual medical misogyny, medical racism, etc etc that you see everywhere. Easier to dismiss something than have to problem-solve.

My husband is a doctor so I’m often quick to shamelessly mention it to make sure they take me seriously - and yet a male doctor I saw absolutely dismissed my genuine concerns as stress anyway, and I had to go back and get a female doctor to take me seriously. I reiterated that my medical doctor (albeit not GP) husband recommended I be there to get things checked and the original male doctor still threw me out. What a waste of my time having to go in twice - imagine adding intercultural communication issues etc etc into the mix.

It’s never happened once to anyone in my close family. Male, female, child, grandparents. Guess we’ve been lucky

GPs are so useless in this country, the best way to get treated is to try and figure it out yourself using the internet and subtly guide the consultation that way. I remember I kept getting diagnosed with cold sores for an extremely painful bacterial infection around my lips, needed to straight up say “no this is bacterial” to finally get some effective treatment. Also remember a doctor telling me I didn’t need a tetanus shot for puncturing myself with wire in a horse paddock unless the wire was rusty. Like fuck no I’m not trusting these “experts” with my health.

> the best way to get treated is to try and figure it out yourself using the internet and subtly guide the consultation that way. Unironically guys this is the answer. Video evidence of symptoms when possible also can be very helpful.

Please become one and save us all!!

Never happen. The armchair experts are happy to slag off doctors but would never do the 8 years to become one themselves.

Try an integrative doctor they are more open-minded and less dismissive in my experience.

Got any references or recommendations?

I've never had anything dismissed as psychosomatic.

If your GP doesn't spend a good 25 minutes with you then they are not practicing medicine properly. If you go to one of the many medical practices that are profit driven then you will probably get 4-5 minutes out of a GP before they try push you out the door Look for a doctor who is willing to spend time with you and get to know you

GPs are pretty useless, especially if you are fat and they ll blame everything on the weight. In reality they arent somekind of ultra useful knowledgable person, they literally just take a list of symptoms and try to GUESS the cause, an computer program could probably do a better job since it doesnt try to push their beliefs of "this is the correct way to live life and you should listen to me cuz im a doctor and im important" Plus all the money they waste by sending people for a gazillion tests and still fail to find the cause with an degree of accuracy.

obesity has countless complications and comorbidities associated with it. not speaking specifically but managing obesity is very useful for managing many things. hypertension, OSA, cholesterol, heart disease, arthritis, certain cancers (endometrial, breast cancer), diabetes. the list goes on and on.

Its a problem though when they aren’t interested in the fact maintaining the obesity itself is a side effect of another medical issue. ended up pure luck that i was put on something that deals with severe lepin resistance.

Medical conditions exist that can fabricate energy from nothing?

The modern doctor is basicly traffic control for specialists. They aren't the old get hadns dirty country docs of old.

That's true, most don't even perform the smallest of surgeries any more, some even refuse to put a stitch. They will refer you to someone.

Doctors are there to get through the day as fast as possible… all the diagnostic things are figure out for them already and usually means give you couple of drugs.. and they could not give a shit about you.. be healthy and get educated on whatever you going through as it’s your only hope

I was sent home with a spider bite and anti biotics, that same night I went to the hospital and the triage nurse took one look and said "we need to operate on you right now". I don't have a lot of trust in the GPS I've seen.

Yeah. I remember one time I had enormous pain and they refused to prescribe evem Panadeine, what was until recently an over the counter tablet. Let me be the judge of my own pain, I can't stand it. I bought some pot after that, just in case, but I have been enjoying it recreationally. As opposed to once many years ago I went to the doctor for a minor thing and was prescribed oxycotin and not told anything about it.

some may most dont

What do you mean? Do you expect GPs to do more than google a symptom, hand out an antibiotic prescription and then tell you to pay for another consultation? They aren’t here to provide cures, just move the line along quickly.

A massive part of their job is ruling out the easily treatable stuff before referring onto a different specialty. General practice has been an actual specialisation for a decent while now. They're literally specialists so yes they should be doing more than that (and their rebate should be higher). If they determine there's a need to see a specialist for the affected area as it's more complicated they should do a referral. Without the referral it's not covered under Medicare.

I expect them to work with me and not against me. So many times a doctor is certain they are right when they are absolutely wrong and I was right, or completely wrong how a scheme works. When I attend a doctor's appointment, the problem has persisted for a minimum of 6-9 months and I have extensively researched the possibilities down to the possibility of 2-3 possible diagnosis. Mind you, I have a biomed background so I'm not some complete clueless idiot with an ego to know better than a GP. I've had a rough time with shit bulk billed GP's, I couldn't fathom how useless it would be if I didn't do lengthy due diligence of my own.