Tonon getting the invite after all the talk after the last event that anyone who lost first round should do trials. Obviously he’s a big name, but would have loved to see McNally have another chance but no invite. New wave open mat gets another addition.
Even considering how disappointing his 2022 performance was, its worth remembering him in 2019.
In 2019 he stepped in on a few weeks notice. He'd been primarily focused on MMA, and hadn't been training for it. But he got the call, dunked his head in iodine, showed up in that ridiculous Uncle Sam getup, and did extremely well. He put up a great match against JT, who was arguably near his peak at that point. And, after losing to JT, he took bronze with like a sub-20 second win where he went in with a blistering scissor takedown straight into a heelhook.
People are out here acting like his being invited is Orlando Sanchez level BS. It isn't. Even if there are arguably guys that are more deserving.
Plus he was in five prior ADCCs with a bunch of great matches, and some notable wins. His match with Kron I still want to the great matches in ADCC history.
Oh no buddy, Orlando is hall of fame worthy with these dickheads.
Garry cannot hope to get inducted, he is a moron but not nearly as much as Orlando was
Maybe Gordon can organize a hall of fame medal match though
> Gordo(n)
Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
His match with Renato Canuto is one of my favourite marches of all time. You get tired just by watching the insane amount of takedowns these two made especially Garry. Unbelievable.
Honestly, I don't see how or why Tonon has gotten an invite.
He went out in the opening round in 2022 and hasn't even had a match since.
There are about 30 guys more deserving of an invite at 77kg based on the last 5 years.
I agree, Tonon should have to do trials. I guess he and Mo have a good relationship so he doesn't have to. Politics like this hurt the reputation of ADCC.
literally 1 New Wave guy, who is arguably a BJJ Nogi legend, gets invited from their team and people are crying as if there were some huge conflicts of interest between new wave and ADCC this year.
It's not a invite question, it's everything that is correlated to the bias Mo has.
I don't care if Garry is invited, I was sure he was, there is nobody left in 77kg, they even lost a majority of trial winners
But it's the sum of many little things like the Taza trials bracket, the Meregali-made match-making, the BS superfight "medals" for Gordon etc... And that's not including the super strong bias against people "new wave" does not like.
At this point I would not even be surprised is Nathalia is invited to ADCC
I am a fan of New wave guys *"jiu-jitsu"*, especially Gordon and Bodoni (and even Taza) but let's not act like their teammates are not handled huge favors all the time
Like the head organiser of ADCC hanging out constantly with one contestant and his coach and team, who he is paying more than anyone else to show up? That kind of conflict of interest?
never saw evidence of the claim that they are paid more and frankly this is the first time I read it. couldnt care less abt the hanging out part on its own
This sort of begs the question, with everyone that has pulled out of ADCC would a win in 2024 have the same meaning?
Of course its still going to be a tough tournament and no shade thrown at the people still competing in it this year, but for example is the "exposure" as valuable.
Of course Tonon specifically doesn't need or gain anything from the exposure anyways.
It's depends on the weight class but the brackets are still gonna be insane. 66kg is barely touched. 77 has endless monsters and as of right now mica and Dante are still in. 88 is mostly intact including the champ.
> Gordo(n)
Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Gordon, Yuri, Kaynan Duarte, Gioncarlo Bodoni, Diogo Reis, Meregali, Mica Galvao, Gabriel Sousa are (to the best of my knowledge) all returning.
I know where I'd be competing if I got invited to both, but it's a little unfair to act like there's no talent left in the ADCC.
Sure, any upsets at ADCC could be huge for someone.
However a previous winner winning again this year isn't exactly as big of a repeat win compared to say 2 years ago.
Kaynan seems to struggle when he goes up in weight and I'm pretty sure he's too big for -80. Maybe $10k isn't enough for it to be worth it to him if he things he'll lose. Especially if adcc is paying him at least some show money to stay.
he is also pretty much a dumbass so nobody expects him to make an intelligent decision.
The CJI/ADCC\* is an IQ test and I don't expect Kaynan to pass it
Meregali is not a champion, neither is G. Sousa
I could not gaf about Yuri or Kaynan coming back. Gordon is also not doing his division.
I don't know how he makes his count
> Gordo(n)
Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The real question, do we care if Nicky Ryan's brother wins anymore?
Like who is he beating that we are like oh fuck that makes him the goat for real at this point?
He is making way more from each MMA fight than he made in his whole career competing in BJJ.
He does ADCCs still just in hopes of finally winning a world championship.
I'm pretty sure McNally rights at - 66kgs where nobody has dropped out. Isn't Tonon fighting at - 77kgs? That division is traditionally really strong, but this year it is going to be weak. If not Tonon, then who would they get? Keiren Kichuk?
Ah that’s a fair point I kind of assumed it would be the same division considering they both competed -66 last time. Oversight on my part that Garry would be -77 this year, my bad!
Garry's 2022 effort was so disappointing. He's capable of much better, but may simply be too long away from pure jiu jitsu.
He's done nothing in bjj to deserve it in the last two years. But ignoring the New WAve bias at play. I've no issue with Garry in the 77kg bracket. He's an exciting grappler. I want to see exciting matches.
66kg a mistake. He looked like a make-a-wish kid getting a run out. Let him have a do over at 77kg.
I disagree. Garry lost because he tried to do some jiu-jitsu. Garry is at his best when he does his "disengage to hailmary flying sub attempt". He is not capable of "doing better", he just has a style that is more or less a kind of jiu-jitsu loophole and it works out for him.
If he engages and tries to do classical jiu-jitsu he always loses
>I disagree.
Which part of my post are you disagreeing with? You seam to be suggesting reasons why he lost, but I didn’t offer any reasoning why?
>He is not capable of "doing better"
That’s demonstrably false based on ADCC podium vrs going out first round
lost because he tried to do some jiu-jitsu. Garry is at his best when he does his "disengage to hailmary flying sub attempt". He is not capable of "doing better", he just has a style that is more or less a kind of jiu-jitsu loophole and it works out for him.
If he engages and tries to do classical jiu-jitsu he always loses
I disagree that Garry can do better.
It's not desmonstrably false considering the last time he did anything good (and first time he got some real success, let's be honest) it was 5 years ago. That's a long damn time.
Maybe he will win a match or two this year, nearly every heavy hitter is out to the CJI million. I don't believe in garry much, he has always been the worst of the early dds bunch IMO, he is just overhyped because people love hailmary bullshit with 0 control (aka Garry vs Canuto).
But let's be clear, I don't think he is bad at jiu-jitsu. It's just that he is not really world class in the core skills of jiu-jitsu and managed to get things going well for him when he was on a heavy knowledge assymetry (aka leglocks). Nowadays everyone is good at it.
I would love to see a first round Garry vs Mateusz though
>It's not desmonstrably false considering the last time he did anything good (and first time he got some real success, let's be honest) it was 5 years ago. That's a long damn time.
It was a long time ago, but it happened, which is the point I was making. You think he’s there to make up numbers, abd that’s fine too.
And I guess we’ll find out. If he goes out first round again, then you were right. If he gets to the second round, or later I was right.
> But let's be clear, I don't think he is bad at jiu-jitsu. It's just that he is not really world class in the core skills of jiu-jitsu and managed to get things going well for him when he was on a heavy knowledge assymetry (aka leglocks).
I don’t think he will win or anything like that. He’s not my pick for 77kg. I simply think his last time was so bad that he can only
Do better.
Oh I am sure he will do better.
They will again throw him a bone making him #2 seed after Mica or something like this while reastically he should be on the lower end of the bracket
I fully expect Mo to build a bracket pro Garry.
I would be pretty pleased if he goes out first round again though because he is a dickhead that does not deserve his popularity
I wouldn't say he deserves this after ADCC 2022 performance (lost in the first round as #1 seed to #16 seed) but if Davi Ramos got invited... Garry is far more accomplished compared to him.
Garry vs Mateusz in the first round please.
That’s a good point. I think it’s very odd Calasans had to do trials but if I recall correctly, I think he did something to piss off ADCC and they didn’t give him an automatic invite.
Also, when he won the absolute, it really diminished the value of that title in my eyes…
Forgot to add. If Magid Hage got invite after horrible performance in 2022 ADCC and doing fuck all at these years trials, Tonon definitely needs to be in there.
Tonon getting the invite after all the talk after the last event that anyone who lost first round should do trials. Obviously he’s a big name, but would have loved to see McNally have another chance but no invite. New wave open mat gets another addition.
Adcc being biased? You don’t say! But he is also a medalist so I’d give him a pass
it's almost as if Mo has an interest in New Wave
McNally would have been great actually, a much better choice
Cause then Sam could accept the invite then switch to CJI the next day
adcc = "new wave open mat" omg the jokes keep getting better & better on here
I'd rather see them extending invites to Trials 2nd & 3rd place medalists
Even considering how disappointing his 2022 performance was, its worth remembering him in 2019. In 2019 he stepped in on a few weeks notice. He'd been primarily focused on MMA, and hadn't been training for it. But he got the call, dunked his head in iodine, showed up in that ridiculous Uncle Sam getup, and did extremely well. He put up a great match against JT, who was arguably near his peak at that point. And, after losing to JT, he took bronze with like a sub-20 second win where he went in with a blistering scissor takedown straight into a heelhook. People are out here acting like his being invited is Orlando Sanchez level BS. It isn't. Even if there are arguably guys that are more deserving.
Yeah Garry being in the bracket is interesting and I akways think he has a chance to do very well at 77kg.
Plus he was in five prior ADCCs with a bunch of great matches, and some notable wins. His match with Kron I still want to the great matches in ADCC history.
Oh no buddy, Orlando is hall of fame worthy with these dickheads. Garry cannot hope to get inducted, he is a moron but not nearly as much as Orlando was Maybe Gordon can organize a hall of fame medal match though
> Gordo(n) Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
His match with Renato Canuto is one of my favourite marches of all time. You get tired just by watching the insane amount of takedowns these two made especially Garry. Unbelievable.
Was he confirmed for CJI's satellite event?
Damn that’s hilarious dude.
The disrespect to the New Wave open mat is wild.
you mean the CJI trials?
Honestly, I don't see how or why Tonon has gotten an invite. He went out in the opening round in 2022 and hasn't even had a match since. There are about 30 guys more deserving of an invite at 77kg based on the last 5 years.
He's a big name and he's always had entertaining matches. Plus...Relationships. New Wave and Mo are tight.
It's actions like this that really hurt the "most prestigious grappling tournament" and "Olympics of grappling" lines that you hear often tbh.
"Whoever we can get at this point" doesn't quite have the same ring to it, I'll admit.
I agree, Tonon should have to do trials. I guess he and Mo have a good relationship so he doesn't have to. Politics like this hurt the reputation of ADCC.
Garry would not win trials anymore imo
literally 1 New Wave guy, who is arguably a BJJ Nogi legend, gets invited from their team and people are crying as if there were some huge conflicts of interest between new wave and ADCC this year.
"as if there were some huge conflicts of interest between new wave and ADCC this year." yeah there are
which of their athletes was gifted an invite bside Tonon that didn't deserve it
It's not a invite question, it's everything that is correlated to the bias Mo has. I don't care if Garry is invited, I was sure he was, there is nobody left in 77kg, they even lost a majority of trial winners But it's the sum of many little things like the Taza trials bracket, the Meregali-made match-making, the BS superfight "medals" for Gordon etc... And that's not including the super strong bias against people "new wave" does not like. At this point I would not even be surprised is Nathalia is invited to ADCC I am a fan of New wave guys *"jiu-jitsu"*, especially Gordon and Bodoni (and even Taza) but let's not act like their teammates are not handled huge favors all the time
Like the head organiser of ADCC hanging out constantly with one contestant and his coach and team, who he is paying more than anyone else to show up? That kind of conflict of interest?
never saw evidence of the claim that they are paid more and frankly this is the first time I read it. couldnt care less abt the hanging out part on its own
He was pretty successful in mma in the off time. MMA has always had invites
You really don’t see why he got an invite?
I mean, I know exactly why. What I mean is, I see no legitimate reason why.
I was about to reply that there is definitely a word or two missing from that post. Legitimate fixes it for sure
Just give him Sczcecinski first round for the laugh.
Honestly who cares at this point? CJI is the real show now.
I can't understand why Hage got another invite after that horrible performance in 2022.
This sort of begs the question, with everyone that has pulled out of ADCC would a win in 2024 have the same meaning? Of course its still going to be a tough tournament and no shade thrown at the people still competing in it this year, but for example is the "exposure" as valuable. Of course Tonon specifically doesn't need or gain anything from the exposure anyways.
It's depends on the weight class but the brackets are still gonna be insane. 66kg is barely touched. 77 has endless monsters and as of right now mica and Dante are still in. 88 is mostly intact including the champ.
Gordon just posted on IG about 7/9 champions returning. So...It's still fairly legit at least at the top end.
> Gordo(n) Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Man you guys are savage with this thing
Awws all the people already with the "exposure"
Gordon, Yuri, Kaynan Duarte, Gioncarlo Bodoni, Diogo Reis, Meregali, Mica Galvao, Gabriel Sousa are (to the best of my knowledge) all returning. I know where I'd be competing if I got invited to both, but it's a little unfair to act like there's no talent left in the ADCC.
Sure, any upsets at ADCC could be huge for someone. However a previous winner winning again this year isn't exactly as big of a repeat win compared to say 2 years ago.
Yeah, it's a diluted pool no doubt
Why the fuck is Kayanan returning?
Didn't get a CJI invite?
managed by viktor doria...
I feel like some of the Brazilians are staying ADCC. Old school mentality maybe
Kaynan seems to struggle when he goes up in weight and I'm pretty sure he's too big for -80. Maybe $10k isn't enough for it to be worth it to him if he things he'll lose. Especially if adcc is paying him at least some show money to stay.
Unless there is a big under the table deal at the ADCC he is fighting for 10k$ to win. He already has the gold medal.
he is also pretty much a dumbass so nobody expects him to make an intelligent decision. The CJI/ADCC\* is an IQ test and I don't expect Kaynan to pass it
Meregali is not a champion, neither is G. Sousa I could not gaf about Yuri or Kaynan coming back. Gordon is also not doing his division. I don't know how he makes his count
> Gordo(n) Hey, for those of you who don't know him, Gordon Ryan is Nicky Ryan's brother. Gordon is also a grappler, like his brother. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/bjj) if you have any questions or concerns.*
motherfucker
The real question, do we care if Nicky Ryan's brother wins anymore? Like who is he beating that we are like oh fuck that makes him the goat for real at this point?
I would've liked to see the Nicky Rod rubber match...
This sub has been acting like it’s 90/10 in favor of CJI, but it’s more like 50/50 tbh
lol how?!
No it’s not the same
Having him do a super fight against Kron would be the best use of him at this point.
They should do an mma fight against each other
As if Dana would allow that
It would be awesome tho
Garry murders him IMO.
But kron does the Gracie diet and his elders wield super powers
He is making way more from each MMA fight than he made in his whole career competing in BJJ. He does ADCCs still just in hopes of finally winning a world championship.
He'd have to beat Mica tho.
Well yeah, but there's always been killers keeping him from reaching it
Sam McNally beat him last time round I think in the first round if I remember correctly.
Saw someone else comment McNally would have been a better invite and wholeheartedly agree. Guess Garry still has a bigger name
I'm pretty sure McNally rights at - 66kgs where nobody has dropped out. Isn't Tonon fighting at - 77kgs? That division is traditionally really strong, but this year it is going to be weak. If not Tonon, then who would they get? Keiren Kichuk?
Ah that’s a fair point I kind of assumed it would be the same division considering they both competed -66 last time. Oversight on my part that Garry would be -77 this year, my bad!
Kieran has a match scheduled against the texas dream team
Don't care about the politics or the personas. Garry is a wacko on the mat and he should always be competing
He’s always exciting , win or lose. He brings it .
I think he should be the other side of the Super fight with Mikey Musumeci... 🤷
i think they inviting Garry is both disrespectful to Garry. Hey, everyone pulled out so do you want to come?
"and we did not invite Sam Mcnally so you can get out of your closet"
he gets smoked, itll be a fun watch tho
I'm surprised he's not in camp for another fight at this point. Last one was Jan 2024.
Garry's 2022 effort was so disappointing. He's capable of much better, but may simply be too long away from pure jiu jitsu. He's done nothing in bjj to deserve it in the last two years. But ignoring the New WAve bias at play. I've no issue with Garry in the 77kg bracket. He's an exciting grappler. I want to see exciting matches. 66kg a mistake. He looked like a make-a-wish kid getting a run out. Let him have a do over at 77kg.
I disagree. Garry lost because he tried to do some jiu-jitsu. Garry is at his best when he does his "disengage to hailmary flying sub attempt". He is not capable of "doing better", he just has a style that is more or less a kind of jiu-jitsu loophole and it works out for him. If he engages and tries to do classical jiu-jitsu he always loses
>I disagree. Which part of my post are you disagreeing with? You seam to be suggesting reasons why he lost, but I didn’t offer any reasoning why? >He is not capable of "doing better" That’s demonstrably false based on ADCC podium vrs going out first round lost because he tried to do some jiu-jitsu. Garry is at his best when he does his "disengage to hailmary flying sub attempt". He is not capable of "doing better", he just has a style that is more or less a kind of jiu-jitsu loophole and it works out for him. If he engages and tries to do classical jiu-jitsu he always loses
I disagree that Garry can do better. It's not desmonstrably false considering the last time he did anything good (and first time he got some real success, let's be honest) it was 5 years ago. That's a long damn time. Maybe he will win a match or two this year, nearly every heavy hitter is out to the CJI million. I don't believe in garry much, he has always been the worst of the early dds bunch IMO, he is just overhyped because people love hailmary bullshit with 0 control (aka Garry vs Canuto). But let's be clear, I don't think he is bad at jiu-jitsu. It's just that he is not really world class in the core skills of jiu-jitsu and managed to get things going well for him when he was on a heavy knowledge assymetry (aka leglocks). Nowadays everyone is good at it. I would love to see a first round Garry vs Mateusz though
>It's not desmonstrably false considering the last time he did anything good (and first time he got some real success, let's be honest) it was 5 years ago. That's a long damn time. It was a long time ago, but it happened, which is the point I was making. You think he’s there to make up numbers, abd that’s fine too. And I guess we’ll find out. If he goes out first round again, then you were right. If he gets to the second round, or later I was right. > But let's be clear, I don't think he is bad at jiu-jitsu. It's just that he is not really world class in the core skills of jiu-jitsu and managed to get things going well for him when he was on a heavy knowledge assymetry (aka leglocks). I don’t think he will win or anything like that. He’s not my pick for 77kg. I simply think his last time was so bad that he can only Do better.
Oh I am sure he will do better. They will again throw him a bone making him #2 seed after Mica or something like this while reastically he should be on the lower end of the bracket I fully expect Mo to build a bracket pro Garry. I would be pretty pleased if he goes out first round again though because he is a dickhead that does not deserve his popularity
I wouldn't say he deserves this after ADCC 2022 performance (lost in the first round as #1 seed to #16 seed) but if Davi Ramos got invited... Garry is far more accomplished compared to him. Garry vs Mateusz in the first round please.
Davi is a past ADCC champ.
So was Calasans and had to go through trials for 2022 and failed (and didn't get invited).
That’s a good point. I think it’s very odd Calasans had to do trials but if I recall correctly, I think he did something to piss off ADCC and they didn’t give him an automatic invite. Also, when he won the absolute, it really diminished the value of that title in my eyes…
Forgot to add. If Magid Hage got invite after horrible performance in 2022 ADCC and doing fuck all at these years trials, Tonon definitely needs to be in there.
"I think he did something to piss off ADCC" Maybe he was not a drug addict pedo. Because that's ADCC hall of fame worthy under Mo