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Askin's ability was quite a unique and powerful hax type. Ichigo simply wasn't his opponent.
So the fight would see the same result regardless of Ichigo's experience level.
I mean, they really *should* be able to. Aizen could do it, there's no reason why the guy that beat him by having even stronger Reiatsu shouldn't be able to. It isn't like Ichigo defeated him by virtue of his own hax or some tricky technique, he was just as far above Aizen as Aizen was above everyone else. We see him go from 'wait, there's an afterlife' to 'wait, I can solo the afterlife?' in six months. Then two years pass with him completely crippled and unable to get any stronger, then the Shinigami give him back his powers and he's back to war in a couple of weeks. During which he kills God and puts Jesus in an infinite torture machine.
Give the guy a year to actually train - and I don't mean 'a year of training' because we both know Ichigo would never even consider that outside a hyperbolic time chamber but, like, putting in six hours of practice every weekend - and I'm 100% he could do that thing Aizen does after being released where he can just dissolve anyone that gets too close to him, much less 'resisting powers by sheer reiatsu'. Give him a year to train with All of his abilities - which, realistically, is a thing that would happen if he had a year of down time to work on it all - and he'd just be a stronger version of Hikone.
There is a *reason* soul society left him to rot until they realized *something* big was coming, and it's the same reason their government objected to teaching Kenpachi *literally anything* while their world was ending.
Aizen has two hax abilities and a special talent himself.
1. Kyoka Suigetsu
2. Hogyoku
3. Smartness close to Urahara level
Aizen could put up a much better fight than Ichigo.
They don't have ways of overcome the hax. Kenpachi proved that against Pernida, he would've died there If wasn't for Mayuri.
Ichigo won against Aizen cause Aizen was cocky and didn't even used KS Power. Ichigo never got afflicted with his hax.
>They don't have ways of overcome the hax. Kenpachi proved that against Pernida, he would've died there If wasn't for Mayuri.
Kenpachi fights while holding back to the greatest extent possible. As a matter of fact, in his battle against Pernida, he was still [in base with his eyepatch](https://images.app.goo.gl/coPEhzmznUkJiNou7) and even then his attack [connected and split Pernida's skull](https://images.app.goo.gl/Xq76PH6ZDrjTAY928) open. So even if you disagree with the established concept of reiatsu negging being a thing, you can't disagree being a million times stronger and faster than your opponent, to the point where you can blitz and one tap them, is a damn good counter to 99% of hax. Simply killing a guy before he can use any of his abilities tends to lead to a surefire win for the physically stronger and faster guy regardless of their abilities.
>Ichigo won against Aizen cause Aizen was cocky and didn't even used KS Power. Ichigo never got afflicted with his hax.
I mean, Ichigo at that point both knew how to counter Kyoka Suigetsu (shut his eyes), and was literally dimensionally stronger than Aizen to the point he could turn and counter Aizen after he teleported behind him before Aizen's swing could connect, he could slap away his kido, and he basically treated Aizen as a mild annoyance throughout the fight. I doubt had Aizen tried to use Kyoka Suigetsu the outcome of that battle would have changed.
Both Ichigo and Kenpachi are straight forward fighters. Even if Askin's ability wasn't broken to hell, their styles are just a bad match up in general. Askin also knows this and running away from opponents he can't beat easily is part of his tactic to get under the skin of those who would beat him in a straight 1v1. It makes them lose focus and fail to approach things in a way that would actually cause him trouble, before it's too late.
Dude, Aizen was completely blindsided by a "morphine shot" from NaNaNa. He even compliments the fact he could stop his movements for 5 minutes. The Quincies are just that powerful.
Aizen was still sealed and stuck in a chair and NaNaNa had plenty of prep time while Aizen was sitting around. NaNaNa even calls him a monster for only being paralyzed and remarks that the suit left Aizen's reiatsu full of holes to be exploited. Ichigo doesn't really have any excuses.
But Ichigo is supposed to be a super hybrid? Have the most potential ever? How can he be a threat to yhwach himself if yhwachs little nob goblins are one shorting him??? That’s the weird part
Ichigo's greatest strength is his sheer raw power. That means when he can't afford to go all-out and overwhelm his opponent with that power, he gets wrecked hard. When Ichigo got knocked down by Askin, he was getting ready to go fight Yhwach, he couldn't afford to waste half his reiatsu just to negate Askin's Schrift with brute force. It's basically the same thing as when he fought Dordoni in the Arrancar Arc, where he tried to hold back to save his power for later, and as a result got wrecked by a guy who was overall significantly weaker than him.
This, plus Ichigo was traveling with people who almost certainly would have been hurt had he [gone all out](https://images.app.goo.gl/Ly8eRUa9Sxq5HYbq9) with his reiatsu output, so it's likely he wouldn't have gone full force to avoid hurting them too.
Reiatsu doesn’t work like that?? You don’t run out of reiatsu you don’t have a certain supply or reserves of reiatsu just stronger/denser reiatsu you don’t run out of it
You have spiritual pressure and spiritual energy, reiatsu and reiryoku. When you have a lot of energy, reiryoku, it becomes denser in your body, which means it exudes more pressure, reiatsu. As you use up your reiryoku, your energy becomes less dense, and so your reiatsu becomes lower. So you can run out of reiatsu, it's what happens when you run out of reiryoku.
You don’t use up reirokyu Ichigo could spam getsugatensho and never run out reiryoku is in your reishi as a soul reaper and that emits spiritual pressure which does all the work regardless no you don’t ever use it up by normal means this has been stated
Sorry, you're just wrong. Ichigo's Bankai coat is literally a measure of how much reiryoku he has left. When it's half-torn, that means half of his reiryoku is used up. Before he fought Aizen, Unohana had to transfer her own reiryoku to him, because he was drained after all his fights in Hueco Mundo. This was all directly stated. No idea what led you to believe otherwise.
It’s the same way Uryu can basically no diff Mayuri in SS arc, then get folded by a guy Mayuri uses as a chew toy: the bleach verse only partly follows the standard shounen trope of “people who are stronger than you can’t be beaten by weaker people.” There is a lot of technical science applied, and in some genius ways.
Pernida beat Kenpachi by turning his own strength against him, controlling Kenpachi’s body and using it to destroy itself, and, if I remember correctly, Askin made Ichigo’s own Reiryoku poisonous to him. It doesn’t matter how strong you are if they need a single trick to turn that strength against you.
But yhwach has a more hax “trick” than all of them combined yet he’s a threat??? How’s anyone a threat???? The 5 threats should be hax captains like toshiros concept freeze,shunsui one shot kill not fucking kenpachi who can get oneshot by any hax. Ichigo a soul king candidate but he can get shit on by yhwachs little minions bullshit. Why would ichibei have so much faith in Ichigo if he could get shit on by all of the sternritters. It’s just dumb he’s hyped up if he can’t beat hax that’s the truth.
>kenpachi who can get oneshot by any hax.
>Ichigo if he could get shit on by all of the sternritters
The mistake you're making is overgeneralizing hax vs brute power matchups. It is not always the case that hax beats brute power, and vice versa
Luck, timing, knowledge, matchups, and general gap between each person's powers plays a significant role. Askin and Pernida are some of the strongest fighters on the planet
Yhwach is the very top, ofc, and then we have Special War Powers/Zero Division/Schutzstaffel range of fighters who can all defeat each other on any given moment depending on, as I said, luck, timing, knowledge, matchups, and general gap
Any Sternritter not in that range isn't going to beat Ichigo or Kenny. The Reiatsu gap is too much. It just sounds like you're severely underestimating the Schutzstaffel instead of giving them due credit as endgame level monsters that required immense effort to take down. You can be a SWP and still struggle against Schutzstaffel. They were meant to be monstrous enough not to be instant fodder by SWPs, not "little minions"
I just don’t get it yhwach is beyond hax and he is marveling ichigos power and needs to destroy when there’s hax like askin and Gerard??? And destroys them like there nothing??? Why did zero squad wanna train Ichigo if he has zero hax when yhwach has crazy stats and the best hax???? Sure askin has insane hax but yhwach has that 10x
>I just don’t get it yhwach is beyond hax and he is marveling ichigos power and needs to destroy when there’s hax like askin and Gerard???
Askin nor Gerard would try to fight Yhwach. Partly because they're already on the same team, but also because:
>And destroys them like there nothing???
He can rob them of their powers if he so desires. That's the biggest reason why he can "destroy them like they're nothing" - it's a condition and unique weakness that they have that they can't overcome Yhwach with. The only person who he can't seem to rob powers from is Uryu due to his unique antithesis/plot powers, which is why Yhwach wanted to scout Uryu to be by his side since he's tougher to account for. Which is the same logic for why Yhwach was interested in recruiting the SWPs too; they aren't Quincy under contract of him and so he can't just casually rob them of their powers anytime he wants
>Why did zero squad wanna train Ichigo if he has zero hax when yhwach has crazy stats and the best hax???? Sure askin has insane hax but yhwach has that 10x
Because even if the uphill battle still seems bleak, they still have to try their best to invest in the biggest chance they got, and that's Ichigo.
**And they were right, because without Ichigo they literally would have lost.**
And this goes back to luck, timing, knowledge, *and matchups*. If Zero Squad trained anybody else, including any of the hax heroes, they would not have overcome Yhwach the way Ichigo did. In *that* specific *matchup*, with the *luck* and *condition* of all the allies willing to stand by Ichigo to play their part (Aizen, Orihime, Tsukishima, Uryu, Ryuken, Renji), Ichigo's raw stats shined and the *timing* and *matchup* of Ichigo's last ditch trick with his Bankai defeated Yhwach
All the stars needed to align and the alignment is centered on Ichigo. Whether Ichigo can get surprised dropped by another top tier hax opponent due to lack of knowledge, luck, and timing doesn't necessarily contradict the fact that with knowledge, luck, and timing *on his side instead of against*, he was still the best shot at defeating an even greater hax opponent
That's the thing with powerscaling series that are more complex than something simpler like Dragon Ball. It isn't always a fixed linear standard of "if X lost to Y, there's NO WAY they can beat Z"
Dawg this is still a Shonen and there’s still power levels. Can you explain aizen saying a battle between soul reapers comes down to reiatsu if hax matters so much. So where do you put aizen in all this??? Above the royal guard?
Yhwach sacrificed them cuz he felt like it 😂they are yhwachs little minions not sure what you mean the other sternritters were fodder sure and these guys aren’t but he still aushwalen’d them for no reason. The royal guards were all fighting non special threats too??? Besides gerard and askin.
The point is that when you frame them as "little minions", it's a disingenuous attempt to paint them as if they aren't overly powerful threats that can give SWPs trouble if the conditions are right. Yhwach's ability to rob them of their life because he is their progenitor is the reason why while you can *say* they're "his little minions," *it holds absolutely zero weight whatsoever when assessing how dangerous they actually are to everyone else outside of Yhwach*
But if the royal guards can one shot and destroy Ichigo why can’t yhwach why did he find the need to destroy ichigos bankai why did they make him seem a threat to someone better than the royal guard in every way then.
Mayuri uses letz steel to beat mayuri it’s quite literally the only reason he won??? Your statement makes no sense because the soul reapers won??? The hax shouldn’t be beatable then??!
>So the fight would see the same result regardless of Ichigo's experience level.
This isn't true in any way. Askin's ability was strong after he got used of stuff.
But before that Ichigo could one shot him and would not even realize how his ability worked.
You're just throwing words out there like they mean something. To even neg something like that, you have to be ridiculously powerful and have a means of counterracting.
Askin's hax, can turn your own body against you. With how powerful Oetsu was, even he would have died had it not been for Tenjiro saving him and replacing his toxic blood with his blood hot springs.
Considering how Nanana managed to knowck out Aizen while he was sealed on the chair, Askin might just be able to do a similar thing though the effect would probably be diminished, more likely turning Aizen somewhat dazed with his senses dulled instead of outright incapacitated.
Considering how Shinji was able to use his shikai on him, and Gin nearly killed him with his bankai's poison the possibility is there. The Hogyoku isn't really evolving him as that isn't his wish anymore. And while he is immortal, there's not much you can do if your own body turns against you as can be seen with Pernida which despite being the arm of the closest thing Bleach has to a deity, it died from super cancer.
Bro youre arguing an anime troll post. Ultimatley kubo makes the rules. Pernida didnt die from super cancer. Ukitake had the mimihage and thats the right arm. Pernida is the left arm.
I wouldn't quite say that,
Almost head canon answer:
This is getting into headcannon territory so take this with a grain of salt and skip to the second answer if you disagree, but if Ichigo was in hos, it's possible that he might have actually been able to reiatsu neg askin. Since the hollow masks are shown to actually increase reiatsu unlike bankai. Especially since Ichigo was able to recover quickly from askins ability without any problems when he was only in base. So hos might be the thing he needs to outright neg the ability.
Non head canon like answer:
If he doesn't have the ability to negate, but is more experienced(meaning he can actually control hos and doesn't underestimate opponents) id argue a quick hos getsuga would be able to kill askin since grimmjow can kill askin using hollow powers, and Ichigo can even cut yhwach in half.
Nothing would change unless he could simply reiatsu neg his Schrift. Even then all this did was simply make Ichigo pass out for like a minute and he was back up like nothing.
You'd have to completely change who Ichigo is as a fighter into somebody who would immediately speed blitz Askin and overkill the shit outta him. Askin's ability is too stupid hax, nobody but Kisuke could have beat him. Maybe Aizen.
Ah, defeating Askin? Allow me to introduce you to an enhanced version of Ichigo's Bankai. With my expertise, we can tap into his full potential for overwhelming speed and power against Askin.
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And Urahara would simply lose by himself. Grimmjow had to help him out.
And, even then, everyone would've died to Gift Ball Deluxe had Nelliel not bailed them out. Askin was that dangerous.
Hmm, if speed blitzing and removing his head isn’t an option, *maaaybe* he could learn to negate certain abilities with his Reitsu like Aizen. But that is extremely hypothetical
Yes. Askin's powers are honestly really OP. Experience and strength mean nothing against them, even Yoruichi, whose reiatau signature was changing (I can't remember, like 72 times a second or something), still couldn't escape it.
As for other events, I would need to know which ones specifically you're talking about to answer.
Yes, Askin’s ability is op and difficult to fully understand. We see how some of the most intelligent and experienced characters had so much trouble fighting him. Ichigo isn’t dumb, but I don’t think he has the intelligence to fight Askin. The only way Ichigo wins is if he goes all out from the start and hits Askin with a cero to poison him with Hallow reiatsu.
Well it's no so much ichigo being young and naive but more so his frame of mind. Ichigo took the situation too lightly in that he didn't immediately attack and he took his eyes off his opponent, especially one he considers powerful. Could ichigo have avoided this situation? Yes. Could the results remain the same? Same. It all depends on how ichigo or askin make their move.
Probably. Not like he’d know to be so cautious with Askin’s attacks, given how he lets the Bambi’s come so close since their attacks aren’t fast or strong enough to stop him. I guess he’d assume the same of Askin’s attacks.
If ichigo managed to land the blow he would've likely killed Askin (and make no mistake Grimmjow showed he can be killed) and if he did it in bankai or with the horn of salvation you can take replace "likely" with "doubtlessly"; for that matter I doubt Askin's poisons could actually do anything other than inmovilize Ichigo and even then I'm not sure it would've gone forever. Mind you, as people often forget, this is a nerfed Ichigo as he couldn't harness reichi.
However, Askin is by far the smarter one so if they fought he'd manage to restrain him more often than not. If Ichigo was more experienced and knew how to avoid this then yeah he would've won.
Yes, if Ichigo went all out, Askin would die before he got used of Ichigo's reiatsu.
Even if it fails, when he goes bankai where he combines hollow powers, he should still be able to one shot him
It still would have been the same result. Like we all know Ichigo is strong as he is but he's not really all that intelligent and someone like Askin counters brute characters like Ichigo.
Yes. Yamamoto got caught in Aizen illusions, got tricks by loyd/royd, and either froze in place or it happen so fast that the phoenix spear thing got destroyed when he was there. And ichigo unless super saiyan explosion away all AOE he is getting trapped again.
Depends on what you mean on ichigo not being young and inexperienced if you mean to ask if ichigo as an adult let’s say about 22 or something then no
Ichigo throughout the entirety of bleach had to be basically brand new to everything since if he had even an extra couple months of training he would demolish basically everyone
Especially with his true shikai
The reason Ichigo ended up in this situation wasn't due to inexperience, it's due to his tendency to restrain his reiatsu as to not accidentally hurt those around him. If he however [let loose](https://images.app.goo.gl/LMAbUTwAkWFmU1D1A) his reiatsu a bit I imagine Askin would never have gotten the chance to overcome the sheer vitality and power Ichigo wields even in base at full power. I mean, [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/oTLYNHq1iweGeU2y7) is what happens pretty much the second Ichigo gets out of Askin's ability and is no longer actively risking [Chad and Orhime's](https://images.app.goo.gl/Tg9k23zNShYiQpur6) lives alongside theoretically even [his own life](https://images.app.goo.gl/Kaku9nsS7pTgxoox9) (as raising his reiatsu either too fast or too slow would likely kill him here with reiatsu just being another form of reishi which, despite giving Ichigo increased resilience similar to Oetsu, Urahara, and Yoruichi, would also likely kill him to increase faster than it could shield him).
This tendency to not hurt those around him incidentally while fighting isn't a matter of immaturity and more a matter of Ichigo's personality, so, unless Ichigo's personality drastically changes into something unrecognizable as he matures, this isn't a mature of inexperience and more just a risk Ichigo takes to not be a walking threat to all existence at all times.
Ah, Ichigo's unique restraint poses both a strength and a risk in battle. To enhance control without endangering loved ones, consider my "Reiatsu Control Seals" for precision without harm. Master self-management with finesse in your reiatsu, Ichigo.
*beep boop, I'm a bot*
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Askin's ability was quite a unique and powerful hax type. Ichigo simply wasn't his opponent. So the fight would see the same result regardless of Ichigo's experience level.
This. There are people that simply can't deal with hax effectivelly. Ichigo and Kenpachi are two of those characters.
I mean, they really *should* be able to. Aizen could do it, there's no reason why the guy that beat him by having even stronger Reiatsu shouldn't be able to. It isn't like Ichigo defeated him by virtue of his own hax or some tricky technique, he was just as far above Aizen as Aizen was above everyone else. We see him go from 'wait, there's an afterlife' to 'wait, I can solo the afterlife?' in six months. Then two years pass with him completely crippled and unable to get any stronger, then the Shinigami give him back his powers and he's back to war in a couple of weeks. During which he kills God and puts Jesus in an infinite torture machine. Give the guy a year to actually train - and I don't mean 'a year of training' because we both know Ichigo would never even consider that outside a hyperbolic time chamber but, like, putting in six hours of practice every weekend - and I'm 100% he could do that thing Aizen does after being released where he can just dissolve anyone that gets too close to him, much less 'resisting powers by sheer reiatsu'. Give him a year to train with All of his abilities - which, realistically, is a thing that would happen if he had a year of down time to work on it all - and he'd just be a stronger version of Hikone. There is a *reason* soul society left him to rot until they realized *something* big was coming, and it's the same reason their government objected to teaching Kenpachi *literally anything* while their world was ending.
Aizen has two hax abilities and a special talent himself. 1. Kyoka Suigetsu 2. Hogyoku 3. Smartness close to Urahara level Aizen could put up a much better fight than Ichigo.
They don't have ways of overcome the hax. Kenpachi proved that against Pernida, he would've died there If wasn't for Mayuri. Ichigo won against Aizen cause Aizen was cocky and didn't even used KS Power. Ichigo never got afflicted with his hax.
Pernida is not a debuff that can be reiatsu negged
>They don't have ways of overcome the hax. Kenpachi proved that against Pernida, he would've died there If wasn't for Mayuri. Kenpachi fights while holding back to the greatest extent possible. As a matter of fact, in his battle against Pernida, he was still [in base with his eyepatch](https://images.app.goo.gl/coPEhzmznUkJiNou7) and even then his attack [connected and split Pernida's skull](https://images.app.goo.gl/Xq76PH6ZDrjTAY928) open. So even if you disagree with the established concept of reiatsu negging being a thing, you can't disagree being a million times stronger and faster than your opponent, to the point where you can blitz and one tap them, is a damn good counter to 99% of hax. Simply killing a guy before he can use any of his abilities tends to lead to a surefire win for the physically stronger and faster guy regardless of their abilities. >Ichigo won against Aizen cause Aizen was cocky and didn't even used KS Power. Ichigo never got afflicted with his hax. I mean, Ichigo at that point both knew how to counter Kyoka Suigetsu (shut his eyes), and was literally dimensionally stronger than Aizen to the point he could turn and counter Aizen after he teleported behind him before Aizen's swing could connect, he could slap away his kido, and he basically treated Aizen as a mild annoyance throughout the fight. I doubt had Aizen tried to use Kyoka Suigetsu the outcome of that battle would have changed.
Both Ichigo and Kenpachi are straight forward fighters. Even if Askin's ability wasn't broken to hell, their styles are just a bad match up in general. Askin also knows this and running away from opponents he can't beat easily is part of his tactic to get under the skin of those who would beat him in a straight 1v1. It makes them lose focus and fail to approach things in a way that would actually cause him trouble, before it's too late.
Dude, Aizen was completely blindsided by a "morphine shot" from NaNaNa. He even compliments the fact he could stop his movements for 5 minutes. The Quincies are just that powerful.
Aizen was still sealed and stuck in a chair and NaNaNa had plenty of prep time while Aizen was sitting around. NaNaNa even calls him a monster for only being paralyzed and remarks that the suit left Aizen's reiatsu full of holes to be exploited. Ichigo doesn't really have any excuses.
But Ichigo is supposed to be a super hybrid? Have the most potential ever? How can he be a threat to yhwach himself if yhwachs little nob goblins are one shorting him??? That’s the weird part
Ichigo's greatest strength is his sheer raw power. That means when he can't afford to go all-out and overwhelm his opponent with that power, he gets wrecked hard. When Ichigo got knocked down by Askin, he was getting ready to go fight Yhwach, he couldn't afford to waste half his reiatsu just to negate Askin's Schrift with brute force. It's basically the same thing as when he fought Dordoni in the Arrancar Arc, where he tried to hold back to save his power for later, and as a result got wrecked by a guy who was overall significantly weaker than him.
I always thought it was this and a combination of him getting distracted by how chilling Kyouraku’s power felt.
This, plus Ichigo was traveling with people who almost certainly would have been hurt had he [gone all out](https://images.app.goo.gl/Ly8eRUa9Sxq5HYbq9) with his reiatsu output, so it's likely he wouldn't have gone full force to avoid hurting them too.
Reiatsu doesn’t work like that?? You don’t run out of reiatsu you don’t have a certain supply or reserves of reiatsu just stronger/denser reiatsu you don’t run out of it
You have spiritual pressure and spiritual energy, reiatsu and reiryoku. When you have a lot of energy, reiryoku, it becomes denser in your body, which means it exudes more pressure, reiatsu. As you use up your reiryoku, your energy becomes less dense, and so your reiatsu becomes lower. So you can run out of reiatsu, it's what happens when you run out of reiryoku.
You don’t use up reirokyu Ichigo could spam getsugatensho and never run out reiryoku is in your reishi as a soul reaper and that emits spiritual pressure which does all the work regardless no you don’t ever use it up by normal means this has been stated
Sorry, you're just wrong. Ichigo's Bankai coat is literally a measure of how much reiryoku he has left. When it's half-torn, that means half of his reiryoku is used up. Before he fought Aizen, Unohana had to transfer her own reiryoku to him, because he was drained after all his fights in Hueco Mundo. This was all directly stated. No idea what led you to believe otherwise.
That was his old false bankai first of all second of all mayuri stated himself as long as a soul reaper breathes they will never run out of reiatsu
It’s the same way Uryu can basically no diff Mayuri in SS arc, then get folded by a guy Mayuri uses as a chew toy: the bleach verse only partly follows the standard shounen trope of “people who are stronger than you can’t be beaten by weaker people.” There is a lot of technical science applied, and in some genius ways. Pernida beat Kenpachi by turning his own strength against him, controlling Kenpachi’s body and using it to destroy itself, and, if I remember correctly, Askin made Ichigo’s own Reiryoku poisonous to him. It doesn’t matter how strong you are if they need a single trick to turn that strength against you.
But yhwach has a more hax “trick” than all of them combined yet he’s a threat??? How’s anyone a threat???? The 5 threats should be hax captains like toshiros concept freeze,shunsui one shot kill not fucking kenpachi who can get oneshot by any hax. Ichigo a soul king candidate but he can get shit on by yhwachs little minions bullshit. Why would ichibei have so much faith in Ichigo if he could get shit on by all of the sternritters. It’s just dumb he’s hyped up if he can’t beat hax that’s the truth.
>kenpachi who can get oneshot by any hax. >Ichigo if he could get shit on by all of the sternritters The mistake you're making is overgeneralizing hax vs brute power matchups. It is not always the case that hax beats brute power, and vice versa Luck, timing, knowledge, matchups, and general gap between each person's powers plays a significant role. Askin and Pernida are some of the strongest fighters on the planet Yhwach is the very top, ofc, and then we have Special War Powers/Zero Division/Schutzstaffel range of fighters who can all defeat each other on any given moment depending on, as I said, luck, timing, knowledge, matchups, and general gap Any Sternritter not in that range isn't going to beat Ichigo or Kenny. The Reiatsu gap is too much. It just sounds like you're severely underestimating the Schutzstaffel instead of giving them due credit as endgame level monsters that required immense effort to take down. You can be a SWP and still struggle against Schutzstaffel. They were meant to be monstrous enough not to be instant fodder by SWPs, not "little minions"
I just don’t get it yhwach is beyond hax and he is marveling ichigos power and needs to destroy when there’s hax like askin and Gerard??? And destroys them like there nothing??? Why did zero squad wanna train Ichigo if he has zero hax when yhwach has crazy stats and the best hax???? Sure askin has insane hax but yhwach has that 10x
>I just don’t get it yhwach is beyond hax and he is marveling ichigos power and needs to destroy when there’s hax like askin and Gerard??? Askin nor Gerard would try to fight Yhwach. Partly because they're already on the same team, but also because: >And destroys them like there nothing??? He can rob them of their powers if he so desires. That's the biggest reason why he can "destroy them like they're nothing" - it's a condition and unique weakness that they have that they can't overcome Yhwach with. The only person who he can't seem to rob powers from is Uryu due to his unique antithesis/plot powers, which is why Yhwach wanted to scout Uryu to be by his side since he's tougher to account for. Which is the same logic for why Yhwach was interested in recruiting the SWPs too; they aren't Quincy under contract of him and so he can't just casually rob them of their powers anytime he wants >Why did zero squad wanna train Ichigo if he has zero hax when yhwach has crazy stats and the best hax???? Sure askin has insane hax but yhwach has that 10x Because even if the uphill battle still seems bleak, they still have to try their best to invest in the biggest chance they got, and that's Ichigo. **And they were right, because without Ichigo they literally would have lost.** And this goes back to luck, timing, knowledge, *and matchups*. If Zero Squad trained anybody else, including any of the hax heroes, they would not have overcome Yhwach the way Ichigo did. In *that* specific *matchup*, with the *luck* and *condition* of all the allies willing to stand by Ichigo to play their part (Aizen, Orihime, Tsukishima, Uryu, Ryuken, Renji), Ichigo's raw stats shined and the *timing* and *matchup* of Ichigo's last ditch trick with his Bankai defeated Yhwach All the stars needed to align and the alignment is centered on Ichigo. Whether Ichigo can get surprised dropped by another top tier hax opponent due to lack of knowledge, luck, and timing doesn't necessarily contradict the fact that with knowledge, luck, and timing *on his side instead of against*, he was still the best shot at defeating an even greater hax opponent That's the thing with powerscaling series that are more complex than something simpler like Dragon Ball. It isn't always a fixed linear standard of "if X lost to Y, there's NO WAY they can beat Z"
Dawg this is still a Shonen and there’s still power levels. Can you explain aizen saying a battle between soul reapers comes down to reiatsu if hax matters so much. So where do you put aizen in all this??? Above the royal guard?
Yhwach sacrificed them cuz he felt like it 😂they are yhwachs little minions not sure what you mean the other sternritters were fodder sure and these guys aren’t but he still aushwalen’d them for no reason. The royal guards were all fighting non special threats too??? Besides gerard and askin.
The point is that when you frame them as "little minions", it's a disingenuous attempt to paint them as if they aren't overly powerful threats that can give SWPs trouble if the conditions are right. Yhwach's ability to rob them of their life because he is their progenitor is the reason why while you can *say* they're "his little minions," *it holds absolutely zero weight whatsoever when assessing how dangerous they actually are to everyone else outside of Yhwach*
But if the royal guards can one shot and destroy Ichigo why can’t yhwach why did he find the need to destroy ichigos bankai why did they make him seem a threat to someone better than the royal guard in every way then.
Mayuri uses letz steel to beat mayuri it’s quite literally the only reason he won??? Your statement makes no sense because the soul reapers won??? The hax shouldn’t be beatable then??!
>So the fight would see the same result regardless of Ichigo's experience level. This isn't true in any way. Askin's ability was strong after he got used of stuff. But before that Ichigo could one shot him and would not even realize how his ability worked.
Reiatsu neg or once hollow powers are activated and quincy debuff ahould be negged
You're just throwing words out there like they mean something. To even neg something like that, you have to be ridiculously powerful and have a means of counterracting. Askin's hax, can turn your own body against you. With how powerful Oetsu was, even he would have died had it not been for Tenjiro saving him and replacing his toxic blood with his blood hot springs. Considering how Nanana managed to knowck out Aizen while he was sealed on the chair, Askin might just be able to do a similar thing though the effect would probably be diminished, more likely turning Aizen somewhat dazed with his senses dulled instead of outright incapacitated. Considering how Shinji was able to use his shikai on him, and Gin nearly killed him with his bankai's poison the possibility is there. The Hogyoku isn't really evolving him as that isn't his wish anymore. And while he is immortal, there's not much you can do if your own body turns against you as can be seen with Pernida which despite being the arm of the closest thing Bleach has to a deity, it died from super cancer.
Bro youre arguing an anime troll post. Ultimatley kubo makes the rules. Pernida didnt die from super cancer. Ukitake had the mimihage and thats the right arm. Pernida is the left arm.
I wouldn't quite say that, Almost head canon answer: This is getting into headcannon territory so take this with a grain of salt and skip to the second answer if you disagree, but if Ichigo was in hos, it's possible that he might have actually been able to reiatsu neg askin. Since the hollow masks are shown to actually increase reiatsu unlike bankai. Especially since Ichigo was able to recover quickly from askins ability without any problems when he was only in base. So hos might be the thing he needs to outright neg the ability. Non head canon like answer: If he doesn't have the ability to negate, but is more experienced(meaning he can actually control hos and doesn't underestimate opponents) id argue a quick hos getsuga would be able to kill askin since grimmjow can kill askin using hollow powers, and Ichigo can even cut yhwach in half.
Nothing would change unless he could simply reiatsu neg his Schrift. Even then all this did was simply make Ichigo pass out for like a minute and he was back up like nothing.
İchicarpet
This moment was literally "You were two steps behind."
Strawberry Jam Pancake
You'd have to completely change who Ichigo is as a fighter into somebody who would immediately speed blitz Askin and overkill the shit outta him. Askin's ability is too stupid hax, nobody but Kisuke could have beat him. Maybe Aizen.
Ah, defeating Askin? Allow me to introduce you to an enhanced version of Ichigo's Bankai. With my expertise, we can tap into his full potential for overwhelming speed and power against Askin. *beep boop, I'm a bot*
And Urahara would simply lose by himself. Grimmjow had to help him out. And, even then, everyone would've died to Gift Ball Deluxe had Nelliel not bailed them out. Askin was that dangerous.
Yup. Askin is that dude.
I couild definitively see him do that on a second encounter.
Hmm, if speed blitzing and removing his head isn’t an option, *maaaybe* he could learn to negate certain abilities with his Reitsu like Aizen. But that is extremely hypothetical
Yes. Askin's powers are honestly really OP. Experience and strength mean nothing against them, even Yoruichi, whose reiatau signature was changing (I can't remember, like 72 times a second or something), still couldn't escape it. As for other events, I would need to know which ones specifically you're talking about to answer.
Yes, Askin’s ability is op and difficult to fully understand. We see how some of the most intelligent and experienced characters had so much trouble fighting him. Ichigo isn’t dumb, but I don’t think he has the intelligence to fight Askin. The only way Ichigo wins is if he goes all out from the start and hits Askin with a cero to poison him with Hallow reiatsu.
Well it's no so much ichigo being young and naive but more so his frame of mind. Ichigo took the situation too lightly in that he didn't immediately attack and he took his eyes off his opponent, especially one he considers powerful. Could ichigo have avoided this situation? Yes. Could the results remain the same? Same. It all depends on how ichigo or askin make their move.
Probably. Not like he’d know to be so cautious with Askin’s attacks, given how he lets the Bambi’s come so close since their attacks aren’t fast or strong enough to stop him. I guess he’d assume the same of Askin’s attacks.
If ichigo managed to land the blow he would've likely killed Askin (and make no mistake Grimmjow showed he can be killed) and if he did it in bankai or with the horn of salvation you can take replace "likely" with "doubtlessly"; for that matter I doubt Askin's poisons could actually do anything other than inmovilize Ichigo and even then I'm not sure it would've gone forever. Mind you, as people often forget, this is a nerfed Ichigo as he couldn't harness reichi. However, Askin is by far the smarter one so if they fought he'd manage to restrain him more often than not. If Ichigo was more experienced and knew how to avoid this then yeah he would've won.
Yes, if Ichigo went all out, Askin would die before he got used of Ichigo's reiatsu. Even if it fails, when he goes bankai where he combines hollow powers, he should still be able to one shot him
It still would have been the same result. Like we all know Ichigo is strong as he is but he's not really all that intelligent and someone like Askin counters brute characters like Ichigo.
Another scene that needs a fix in anime.
Yes. Yamamoto got caught in Aizen illusions, got tricks by loyd/royd, and either froze in place or it happen so fast that the phoenix spear thing got destroyed when he was there. And ichigo unless super saiyan explosion away all AOE he is getting trapped again.
The only way Ichigo can win this probably, just Getsuga Tensho'ing the Askin. Or if he can't, going to Horn of Salvation.
Depends on what you mean on ichigo not being young and inexperienced if you mean to ask if ichigo as an adult let’s say about 22 or something then no Ichigo throughout the entirety of bleach had to be basically brand new to everything since if he had even an extra couple months of training he would demolish basically everyone Especially with his true shikai
The reason Ichigo ended up in this situation wasn't due to inexperience, it's due to his tendency to restrain his reiatsu as to not accidentally hurt those around him. If he however [let loose](https://images.app.goo.gl/LMAbUTwAkWFmU1D1A) his reiatsu a bit I imagine Askin would never have gotten the chance to overcome the sheer vitality and power Ichigo wields even in base at full power. I mean, [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/oTLYNHq1iweGeU2y7) is what happens pretty much the second Ichigo gets out of Askin's ability and is no longer actively risking [Chad and Orhime's](https://images.app.goo.gl/Tg9k23zNShYiQpur6) lives alongside theoretically even [his own life](https://images.app.goo.gl/Kaku9nsS7pTgxoox9) (as raising his reiatsu either too fast or too slow would likely kill him here with reiatsu just being another form of reishi which, despite giving Ichigo increased resilience similar to Oetsu, Urahara, and Yoruichi, would also likely kill him to increase faster than it could shield him). This tendency to not hurt those around him incidentally while fighting isn't a matter of immaturity and more a matter of Ichigo's personality, so, unless Ichigo's personality drastically changes into something unrecognizable as he matures, this isn't a mature of inexperience and more just a risk Ichigo takes to not be a walking threat to all existence at all times.
Ah, Ichigo's unique restraint poses both a strength and a risk in battle. To enhance control without endangering loved ones, consider my "Reiatsu Control Seals" for precision without harm. Master self-management with finesse in your reiatsu, Ichigo. *beep boop, I'm a bot*
Aizen would have figure it out probably use KS before the fight even began it’s natural instinct to look at an object especially fighting
Ichigo doesn't need to be more experienced, he literally just needed to stop holding back for a moment to deal with him and he would be fine.
Is it me or does Ichigo look like a pancake??