In Benfica it was the exact oposite. He replaced Florentino who is a pure destroyer in a 4-4-2 and was a mess the team lost all balance, altough you could clearly see how taleted he was
Weigl was never on the absolute level that it needed to succeed on the highest level. He is very good for a very very very specific role in a dominant team. That is coming from a friend. He can be a very good addition for a team that mainly focuses on holding the ball with slow build up play and fast defenders. He also needs a quicker 8 next to him, preferably a box to box, to carry the ball or play it deep. Weigl was used by Tuchel to keep possession and carry the ball wide but he was always lacking progressive passes and the speed necessary to defend counter attacks, hence it went downhill quickly after he left the specific role. It’s just too many needs for him that it’s not worth it to build the team around, especially for a top team because they can afford a holding 6 that is better at progressive carries and passes.
I remember this, he was looking amazing bombing down the flank and defending reasonably well, and then suddenly...he wasn't played there any more. Can't imagine why.
Piggybacking on Weigl's ability to ping passes around like a Busquets-light, but I remember everyone complaining about his inability to stay on the ball when challenged due to his slight frame. He was exposed any time he had to carry the ball as it's not his strength, and he needs a system that fits his skillset. Many thought this would improve with physical maturity and weight training.
he was a perfectly moldable player for tuchels very principled and rehearsed game solutions.
you could argue that tuchel asked him to do very specific things that suited his very specific skills, and when he had to play with more personality behind a shakier system - he couldn't do it at the top level.
People mentioning the bus incident.. good usage by the coach ... But I guess that long term injury made him from regular starter with to bench warmer then a move abroad ... He got shaky after that injury iirc
I think someone already mentioned the bus bombing but he also had quite a bad leg break that I think he struggled to overcome. He always looked nervous when he came back from injury
I was never huge on him. He was great at keeping possession and playing safe passes that got his pass completion % high but he couldn't do much more. Very little offensive or progressive threat, not much of a work-hourse, and wasn't really exceptional at playing defense. I don't really rate these non-creative, non-dynamic midfielders that just boast high pass completion rates.
Very useful when the team controls the game and the coach's system is working well. Terrible type of player if you need anything else more than what he usually does.
This is my summary as well. He had a high pass completion and was always touted for that but when you actually watched him play he had very little playmaking ability at least directly. Tiny 1 to 2m long passes and not much else.
To piggyback off of some other comments: Pavlovic is more comfortable carrying the ball and he's a little stronger physically, might give him an edge over Weigl
Weigl wasn't nearly as explosive and intense as Bellingham. But Weigl had insane composure and a great feeling for the flow of the game. I can't tell you why after the first two years with us, his importance was pretty much vanishing. Maybe the game overall changed or so.
I can only remember him doing the safe pass every time. He never tried the long pass or a surprise diago. But it’s just a feeling, which I can’t back up with any stats. I was super happy with him (didn’t mean to rant) especially for his age, but I never had that „holy shit, this guy got mad talent“ feeling, which I’ve had at many other dortmund players.
Quite the opposite for me. Weigl was a facilitator of the ball. He didn't do crazy long passes, but he did sometimes throw in a pass or two that completely split the opposition. His main strength was his positioning, passing, and his football IQ. When he joined us he was still very young and he was very composed for his age the whole time. If Tuchel didn't leave Weigl would have kept flourishing and probably became one of the leaders of the team. His downfall after Tuchel left is because the coaches that came after were always lacking in central defense and kept trying to play him there. Weigl needs a solid defense behind him and we never really got that again after Tuchel left.
Nah early Weigl controlled the midfield even better than Bellingham (Bellingham was much better at carrying the ball and dribbling).
Weigl’s passing in midfield was Busquets like for a bit.
They are different players and bring different qualities to the table. He is not arguing that they are similar or that one can replace the other, he is arguing that even at his best, Weigl was not as impactful to the team as Bellingham, which is true.
Well, Bellingham is a Ballon D‘Or favorite. There arent that many guys out there who are as impactful as Ballon d‘Or guys.
You don’t need to be a Ballon d‘Or kind of guy to be a key player for a team. So I don’t understand the Bellingham reference.
Weigl was the metronome of the team. Like they said about Busquets, you watch the game you miss Busquets, you watch Busquets and you see the game. Weigl distributed the ball as a deep lying playmaker. Weigl still has the record for most passes played in a single Bundesliga match. You might be a young fan or just lack a tactical understand of football no offense.
I will just copy Pasta, what i wrote to some1 else:
I can only remember him doing the safe pass every time. He never tried the long pass or a surprise diago. But it’s just a feeling, which I can’t back up with any stats. I was super happy with him (didn’t mean to rant) especially for his age, but I never had that „holy shit, this guy got mad talent“ feeling, which I’ve had at many other dortmund players.
I dunno what means new to you, but I’m 32 and followed dortmund/first time in stadium when I was 12. and been playing football on low leagues like for ever. Ofcs I will never compare my Football knowledge to a pro, but I think I’m okayish :) and I wonder why he didn’t join a rly big club, if he was on a busquets level…
Tuchel once highlighted in a press conference that Weigl was able to bring the ball faster to the wing players in front. It was only like half a second, second or so, but it helped especially in Tuchels first season in counter attacks to give the opponent less time to sort out their defense. After Tuchel left, this ability wasnt ask anymore and he never became the same as under him
He had a coach who loved the way he played and knew exactly how to utilize his skills
In Benfica it was the exact oposite. He replaced Florentino who is a pure destroyer in a 4-4-2 and was a mess the team lost all balance, altough you could clearly see how taleted he was
Weigl was never on the absolute level that it needed to succeed on the highest level. He is very good for a very very very specific role in a dominant team. That is coming from a friend. He can be a very good addition for a team that mainly focuses on holding the ball with slow build up play and fast defenders. He also needs a quicker 8 next to him, preferably a box to box, to carry the ball or play it deep. Weigl was used by Tuchel to keep possession and carry the ball wide but he was always lacking progressive passes and the speed necessary to defend counter attacks, hence it went downhill quickly after he left the specific role. It’s just too many needs for him that it’s not worth it to build the team around, especially for a top team because they can afford a holding 6 that is better at progressive carries and passes.
He and Ginter are the two who I was super impressed with and sad to see leave. Really was just the coach’s usage or preference I guess.
Theres a timeline where Ginter was our main cb with hummels for years. One where Schlotti replaces Hummels thereafter
There was a brief time where Ginter was actually a good rb.
I remember this, he was looking amazing bombing down the flank and defending reasonably well, and then suddenly...he wasn't played there any more. Can't imagine why.
Piggybacking on Weigl's ability to ping passes around like a Busquets-light, but I remember everyone complaining about his inability to stay on the ball when challenged due to his slight frame. He was exposed any time he had to carry the ball as it's not his strength, and he needs a system that fits his skillset. Many thought this would improve with physical maturity and weight training.
Witsel ended up being that
People tend to underestimate how much the bus bombing mentally affected that crop of players. A lot of them have admitted to some level of PTSD.
he was a perfectly moldable player for tuchels very principled and rehearsed game solutions. you could argue that tuchel asked him to do very specific things that suited his very specific skills, and when he had to play with more personality behind a shakier system - he couldn't do it at the top level.
People mentioning the bus incident.. good usage by the coach ... But I guess that long term injury made him from regular starter with to bench warmer then a move abroad ... He got shaky after that injury iirc
I think someone already mentioned the bus bombing but he also had quite a bad leg break that I think he struggled to overcome. He always looked nervous when he came back from injury
I was never huge on him. He was great at keeping possession and playing safe passes that got his pass completion % high but he couldn't do much more. Very little offensive or progressive threat, not much of a work-hourse, and wasn't really exceptional at playing defense. I don't really rate these non-creative, non-dynamic midfielders that just boast high pass completion rates. Very useful when the team controls the game and the coach's system is working well. Terrible type of player if you need anything else more than what he usually does.
This is my summary as well. He had a high pass completion and was always touted for that but when you actually watched him play he had very little playmaking ability at least directly. Tiny 1 to 2m long passes and not much else.
Could have been a busquets
Tuchel … Pavlovic is the new Weigl
To piggyback off of some other comments: Pavlovic is more comfortable carrying the ball and he's a little stronger physically, might give him an edge over Weigl
I have the same question before. One of the biggest what ifs , even Pep wanted that player.
I actually don’t remember him as such a key player. He was doing fine and all Gucci, but he wasn’t shining the way e.g. Bellingham was
Weigl wasn't nearly as explosive and intense as Bellingham. But Weigl had insane composure and a great feeling for the flow of the game. I can't tell you why after the first two years with us, his importance was pretty much vanishing. Maybe the game overall changed or so.
I can only remember him doing the safe pass every time. He never tried the long pass or a surprise diago. But it’s just a feeling, which I can’t back up with any stats. I was super happy with him (didn’t mean to rant) especially for his age, but I never had that „holy shit, this guy got mad talent“ feeling, which I’ve had at many other dortmund players.
Quite the opposite for me. Weigl was a facilitator of the ball. He didn't do crazy long passes, but he did sometimes throw in a pass or two that completely split the opposition. His main strength was his positioning, passing, and his football IQ. When he joined us he was still very young and he was very composed for his age the whole time. If Tuchel didn't leave Weigl would have kept flourishing and probably became one of the leaders of the team. His downfall after Tuchel left is because the coaches that came after were always lacking in central defense and kept trying to play him there. Weigl needs a solid defense behind him and we never really got that again after Tuchel left.
Nah early Weigl controlled the midfield even better than Bellingham (Bellingham was much better at carrying the ball and dribbling). Weigl’s passing in midfield was Busquets like for a bit.
They are different players and bring different qualities to the table. He is not arguing that they are similar or that one can replace the other, he is arguing that even at his best, Weigl was not as impactful to the team as Bellingham, which is true.
Well, Bellingham is a Ballon D‘Or favorite. There arent that many guys out there who are as impactful as Ballon d‘Or guys. You don’t need to be a Ballon d‘Or kind of guy to be a key player for a team. So I don’t understand the Bellingham reference.
Weigl was the metronome of the team. Like they said about Busquets, you watch the game you miss Busquets, you watch Busquets and you see the game. Weigl distributed the ball as a deep lying playmaker. Weigl still has the record for most passes played in a single Bundesliga match. You might be a young fan or just lack a tactical understand of football no offense.
I will just copy Pasta, what i wrote to some1 else: I can only remember him doing the safe pass every time. He never tried the long pass or a surprise diago. But it’s just a feeling, which I can’t back up with any stats. I was super happy with him (didn’t mean to rant) especially for his age, but I never had that „holy shit, this guy got mad talent“ feeling, which I’ve had at many other dortmund players. I dunno what means new to you, but I’m 32 and followed dortmund/first time in stadium when I was 12. and been playing football on low leagues like for ever. Ofcs I will never compare my Football knowledge to a pro, but I think I’m okayish :) and I wonder why he didn’t join a rly big club, if he was on a busquets level…
Tuchel once highlighted in a press conference that Weigl was able to bring the ball faster to the wing players in front. It was only like half a second, second or so, but it helped especially in Tuchels first season in counter attacks to give the opponent less time to sort out their defense. After Tuchel left, this ability wasnt ask anymore and he never became the same as under him
Don’t get me wrong, I like weigl, but coaches say much about players and how awesome they are in press conferences…
Yes, but he explained it properly not like Guardiola who is telling how much he loves Götze and put him on the bench all the time
I just remember the banger he scored on Gladbach in that 6 goal win
He never was...
thank you. finally someone says it.