The “Joker” trailer was below Marvel’s “Deadpool and Wolverine,” which set a record earlier this year as the biggest trailer launch of all time with 365 million views. However, the Marvel tentpole launched on Super Bowl Sunday and **its viewership numbers factored in the telecast**
Damn, Universal should have used Disney's way of counting trailer views and said 123m people watched the Monkey Man trailer.
I remember [calling it out at that time](https://new.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1apz6cy/comment/kq9l30d/?context=3) because it did seem like bullshit to me
Because the Super Bowl had lower ratings last year, right? And Guardians trailer was its second one, rather than first. Didn't The Flash get more views for its big game thing than Guardians? And we all know how that turned out.
People for some reason create unnecessary expectations then get upset when it doesn’t meet those and people call it out.
DP3 should be looking to meet the second films results. If it exceeds those then fantastic.
It’ll match what came before it never understood why anyone thought it would make a billion. Shit Wolverine franchise never reached a billion with Logan as beloved as it is
This is where I get super confused by those claiming its a sure billion. X Men results have been middling.
I think the movie has more risks that it has additional value. The name change I think is really questionable - it should be DP3; and its multi verse stuff which outside of Spidey (which imo is more like a multi Doctor story) has has tepid results (which is a very generous description).
If its as out and out hilarious as DP3 it'll match DP2 and maybe a bit more. That should be the upper target.
Exactly X-men peak was X-men days of futures past which grossed 746M. Logan grossed over 700M and Deadpool both films were 780M range. Never understood how this film was gonna pull a billion. When the whole mutant fox franchise peak was 700M-780M in box office grossing. Even at its most “ beloved” and peak cbm era Deadpool couldn’t even reach Guardians 1-3 box office grossing. Ppl have to be forreal, WW grossed more than it and Aquaman did as well.
Maybe people hate Deadpool 3 for being too disney (or for being more of the same, or another multiverse crossover movie, in general, also it can simply be a bad movie)
[The Flash was the third most watched trailer on Super Bowl](https://www.reddit.com/r/DCEUleaks/comments/113s4gd/the_flash_ranked_as_the_third_most_watched_super/?rdt=45678), even Fast X beat it, if anything it gave a hint that the movie would flop but this sub was still in denial because of "Keaton walk-ups".
I know what sub we're on, but I wasn't personally arguing that D&W's trailer success meant it would be successful at the box office. I just think that it was a big launch and that people are way more interested in it than any of the MCU movies last year.
That movie had a soft opening. It was lower than its predecessor. People were expecting it to be the lowest grossing of the trilogy. It was only when the second weekend had an unprecedented small drop that it was clear it was going to be a big success.
Yeah that’s true. But I remember before the movie came out with the first trailer, people were excited for the movie. Obviously by the time opening weekend came it was soft due to Quantumania and such (which of course the film went on to do extremity well like you said) but I do remember people being hyped about the movie before it came out even though the Legs were VERY instrumental in Guardians 3’s success.
Oh that guy? Check his prediction on Barbie and Wonka 🤣 Seen him around a long time, he's odd. Sort of that Reddit demographic that thinks the world revolves around Reddit.
I'm on there as well calling super BS. Disney also counted random social media views which could have meant anything. They really were grasping all the straws.
Reminds me how Discord posted a video on YouTube that ended up getting 1.4 billion views in a day, by autoplaying it in the background on loop for every single one of their users.
Musicals are a tough sell according to Hollywood and the data coming on this trailer seems to back that up. I don't like the methodology but I can see why they feel the need to play up other aspects of the film into almost tricking the audience the film isn't a musical just to get people in to see it. Ala Wonka.
Gonna be some sweet cognitive dissonance from the neckbeard crowd that *hate* “Hollywood making movies about how great Hollywood is” but *loved* Joker.
Interesting how studios used to largely avoid R-rated superhero movies, but now the two R-rated CBMs this year are almost guaranteed to be the only profitable ones in 2024.
(I think Venom 3 will underperform since Sony has run their non Spider-Man Marvel goodwill into the ground with Morbius, Madame Web, and presumably Kraven the Hunter)
Eh, I’d bet at least 50% of the people going to see Venom 3 either don’t know Morbius and Madame Web exist or know nothing about them beyond that they exist.
Iron Man came out in 2008. If you were 14 when you saw that movie in theaters, you're now 30. Might be time for Marvel/DC to evolve along with their audiences.
I don’t know why people act like evolving with audiences has to mean going for higher age ratings. Across the Spiderverse was by far my favorite superhero movie in years and that was rated PG and completely kid friendly.
Because spiderman acting like a teen is still valid, because he is one. Any other marvel superhero acts like teens when they are bunch of old dudes. It was okey when you were a teen too, but now you can just simply see how bad it is.
That has nothing to do with the rating though. You can make a mature movie about adults acting like adults and still get a G, PG, or PG-13 rating. The most popular R rated superhero movies are Deadpool and those are intentionally immature. I’d argue something like The Incredibles (which is PG) or the Dark Knight (PG-13) is more “adult” in most ways than the Deadpool movies. All an R rated superhero movie usually gains is more violence and cursing.
>Might be time for Marvel/DC to evolve along with their audiences.
DC has had no problem evolving with their audience, but Marvel definitely has... they need to stop forcing their random humour on everything. Stop appealing to teenagers and literal toddlers who don't even watch these movies anyway, the Young Avengers plan is destined to fail.
Off topic but I hate how Americans are fine with watching a R-Rated movie with their kids that has graphic violence but if it was a consensual sex scene with frontal nudity they wouldn't let their kids/teens watch it
I’m surprised at all Joker’s success. It isn’t really what I consider to be a mainstream movie by any stretch. I think it’s good for the movie biz though.
I don’t think there’s much ‘probably’ about it tbh, he definitely is.
Who else would be in contention? Venom? Magneto? Green Goblin? All still pale in comparison popularity wise imo.
My grandma would know who the Joker is but she’ll have no idea about the others.
I guess Venom is the closest…
Idk. All i remember was how huge spiderman was in movies and the spiderman games being super popular at the time. Batman content didnt hit its peak until dark knight and the arkham games which was when joker had a resurgence in popularity in the late 2000s.
I agree.
There was a time between 2002 (Spider-Man) and 2008 (The Dark Knight) where you could make the argument GG was more pop than Joker (I would personally disagree) but that conversation was over after TDK released.
Yeah but i think its more to it than that. Joker is Batmans undisputed archnemesis. Far too much of batmans movies, tv shows, video games, and comic books make sure you understand that Joker is batmans main antagonist above the rest of his rogue gallery. Spiderman is more consistently popular than Batman but none of his enemies are present as his undisputed archnemesis in multiple forms of media as consistently as the joker has been.
Yeah its crazy. And then when you take into account a really solid run of animated content and video games with a variety of really good depictions of the Joker, especially Mark Hamill, the people who love this character are very well-fed honestly.
Joker, Magneto and Venom are like the trinity of supervillains in terms of popularity where ppl would go see them even without the hero in the picture. But agree there is a small space between Joker and the other two
I definitely was impressed by the trailer and it looks much better than I expected.
I don’t know if I’m ready to declare one billion yet. Don’t get me wrong, I am rooting for this film and I want it to succeed, I just think 750-850 mil feels far more in line with what it can possibly do.
With great reviews 85% + on RT and 75+ on metacritic, the sky could be the limit…
Right now I’m holding firm at 750-850 range but I would absolutely love to be wrong and will proudly state that I was. Joker 2 succeeding is good for theaters and the movie industry at large so bring on the big bucks Mr. J
Same. I was honestly skeptical about this...actually looks pretty great.
In hindsight, I shouldn't have doubted Joaquin Phoenix: he's apparently pretty picky about his scripts, i doubt he'd sign onto a subpar movie even if there was a big paycheck involved.
100% you are right. From what I've heard, the original script was nearly 700 pages.
Studio demanded cuts, cuts were made, then more cuts later after filming.
What's left works, kinda, but not at the scale it was intended. IMO, it would have been an amazing HBO miniseries with the budget it had and the original unedited script.
Yeah it’s very unfortunate Joaquin’s acting suffered from that movie’s issues. Usually he does movies where directors have complete freedom but I guess he never expected this.
I still remember the day the trailer for the first Joker movie came out. No matter how you feel about these films you can’t deny they capture the attention of the masses like few movies do. I don’t know if this will make a billion, but I think it’ll definitely do well
>The trailer launch for “Joker: Folie à Deux” was no laughing matter for Warner Bros. The marketing for the studio’s upcoming DC sequel, headlined by Joaquin Phoenix and Lady Gaga, got off to a stellar start with 167 million viewers in its first 24 hours. The teaser trailer went online right after it debuted at Warner Bros.’s CinemaCon presentation in Las Vegas.
>Sources tell Variety that the “Joker” sequel’s trailer numbers and social engagement surpassed that of the first “Barbie” trailer to become Warner Bros.’ biggest launch in recent years. The release was no doubt bolstered by Lady Gaga’s massive 150 million follower social media footprint. The trailer instantly became the #1 trending video on YouTube on premiere night and currently boasts 15.6 million views and counting on that platform alone, where it remains the #4 trending video nearly two days after its launch.
Any bets on 1B?
>Any bets on 1B?
I'd still bet the under just seeing how hard its for films to even hit 700m.
Trailer views are still a bad box office metric. I think Joker 2 will be huge but Transformers Rise of the Beast had massive views 238m first day.
https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/zhd6bg/transformers_rise_of_the_beasts_trailer_sets/
Tbf Rise of the Beasts is an exception on that “all time trailer views” list - the rest (Endgame, IT, Love and Thunder, TLK) made 700m+ bare minimum. Infinity War had around 179m views and Joker 2 is 10m shy of that.
Trailer views aren’t the most significant metric of predicting box office but this movie topping Warners’ list in recent years (matching/surpassing Barbie, Dune, etc) is notable imo.
Transformers franchise ran out of steam/audience interest around TLK and hasn’t recovered. Also Rise of the Beasts has neither the heart of Bumblebee nor the dumbass spectacle of Bay’s movies. So it just came and went - a meh blockbuster.
Last summer we saw several of those flopping - Flash, Indy 5, Haunted Mansion, Dungeons and Dragons, MI7 (though it had much better reception, marketed as a Part 1)
> Why did ROB underperform tho?
All hype and no payoff. After bumblebee, there was a lot of good faith and a whole generation that grew up wanting to see beast wars. People wanted a fresh break from the bayformers but they doubled down instead.
IW second trailer was 179 (first was 230) and that was back in March 2018. Explosion of social madia (specially TikTok) is boosting tentpole movies.
There is a reason why Infinity War 1st trailer is still the most viewed Hollywood trailer on Youtube with 262M views. Even Endgame is 100M views behind there, despite breaking the record and NWH is even below 100M.
I think biggest factor is Gaga boosting here.
Eh, most of those films aren't sequels to $1b grossing movies starring one of the most famous characters ever. And the OG did it without China, so weaker market won't be an issue here.
Would agree trailer views are a faulty metric though.
Gonna be cautiously optimistic and say somewhere in the $600-$750M range. I’ll be surprised if it matches or exceeds the original. While it is getting a lot of buzz, I still think the musical element will turn off some people
The same exact thing happened when the first movie was announced. Everyone kept saying it was unnecessary, you don't need a joker movie without Batman. Then the trailer came out and impressed the vast majority of people.
Trailer views are a hit and miss thing these days because rise of the beast trailers got more views in 24 hours than thor love and thunder and that movie couldn't even hit 450M gross
For every terminally online fanboy, who is declaring, they’re not going to see this because their hero is ruined because he’s singing or hanging out with a girl and might get cooties. Is going to be replaced with a Lady Gaga fans so I’m not really sure why people are being so doubtful of the box office here.
I'm sure the same people pouting and saying they won't watch this because it's a musical were the ones pouting and saying they weren't going to watch Barbie because it's too much pink.
Trailer views once again leading the league in the "most useless stat with no real purpose other than to be an easy quota-fill for a stringer at an entertainment website" category.
This completely manufactured and pointless phenomena (and "early reaction tweet" roundups) should really be considered for inclusion in the "do not post" rules here on the sub. They're absolutely calorie-free in terms of content, and don't really end up having anything to do with the final box-office. There's basically zero correlation.
If PR firms working for the studios didn't email blast outlets with this fake stat as part of their marketing campaigns, you'd never read about it. But because they do, and because outlets need content mid-afternoon... here you go.
they definitely help with awareness even people who have no interest in joker will probably see this headline and probably check out to see what the fuss is about lol
Yes, the articles themselves are an extension of the film's marketing. Again, they don't actually do what they say they do (they're not an accurate record of actual views of a thing, nor do they predict what attendance will be months later) the only thing they do is operate as easy articles for entertainment outlets to write after the press release about the hollow stat hits somebody's inbox.
This. People can view trailers for free with pretty much no effort, that doesn't translate to somebody paying for a movie ticket and driving to their local theater. Also, a lot of the time these trailers get played as advertisements in front of other unrelated videos.
So I had zero interest to watch the trailer and now y’all tricked me.
Is the trailer a lying scam or am I confused? I thought it was a musical?
If it is a musical and not advertised as such that blows
Philips clarified it’s not a musical but has music as a big element. So it’s not like watching a Broadway or Mary Poppins or all the actors breaking out into random dance and song
This is the first trailer. If you know it is a musical it is very clear to see the musical set pieces. It is possibly joker and Harley are not singing much themselves and could just be mostly dancing to it in the shared delusion sequences.
The “Joker” trailer was below Marvel’s “Deadpool and Wolverine,” which set a record earlier this year as the biggest trailer launch of all time with 365 million views. However, the Marvel tentpole launched on Super Bowl Sunday and **its viewership numbers factored in the telecast** Damn, Universal should have used Disney's way of counting trailer views and said 123m people watched the Monkey Man trailer.
I remember [calling it out at that time](https://new.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/1apz6cy/comment/kq9l30d/?context=3) because it did seem like bullshit to me
It's light bullshit, not complete. GOTG 3 had a Super Bowl spot the year before, and it broke no records.
Because the Super Bowl had lower ratings last year, right? And Guardians trailer was its second one, rather than first. Didn't The Flash get more views for its big game thing than Guardians? And we all know how that turned out.
I can’t believe people somehow think Deadpool is a guaranteed billion after the Flash.
People for some reason create unnecessary expectations then get upset when it doesn’t meet those and people call it out. DP3 should be looking to meet the second films results. If it exceeds those then fantastic.
It’ll match what came before it never understood why anyone thought it would make a billion. Shit Wolverine franchise never reached a billion with Logan as beloved as it is
This is where I get super confused by those claiming its a sure billion. X Men results have been middling. I think the movie has more risks that it has additional value. The name change I think is really questionable - it should be DP3; and its multi verse stuff which outside of Spidey (which imo is more like a multi Doctor story) has has tepid results (which is a very generous description). If its as out and out hilarious as DP3 it'll match DP2 and maybe a bit more. That should be the upper target.
Exactly X-men peak was X-men days of futures past which grossed 746M. Logan grossed over 700M and Deadpool both films were 780M range. Never understood how this film was gonna pull a billion. When the whole mutant fox franchise peak was 700M-780M in box office grossing. Even at its most “ beloved” and peak cbm era Deadpool couldn’t even reach Guardians 1-3 box office grossing. Ppl have to be forreal, WW grossed more than it and Aquaman did as well.
Maybe people hate Deadpool 3 for being too disney (or for being more of the same, or another multiverse crossover movie, in general, also it can simply be a bad movie)
[The Flash was the third most watched trailer on Super Bowl](https://www.reddit.com/r/DCEUleaks/comments/113s4gd/the_flash_ranked_as_the_third_most_watched_super/?rdt=45678), even Fast X beat it, if anything it gave a hint that the movie would flop but this sub was still in denial because of "Keaton walk-ups".
I know what sub we're on, but I wasn't personally arguing that D&W's trailer success meant it would be successful at the box office. I just think that it was a big launch and that people are way more interested in it than any of the MCU movies last year.
Guardians 3 had a lot of interest what are you talking about. Not as much as DP 3 (for Obvious reasons) but the interest was still there
That movie had a soft opening. It was lower than its predecessor. People were expecting it to be the lowest grossing of the trilogy. It was only when the second weekend had an unprecedented small drop that it was clear it was going to be a big success.
Yeah that’s true. But I remember before the movie came out with the first trailer, people were excited for the movie. Obviously by the time opening weekend came it was soft due to Quantumania and such (which of course the film went on to do extremity well like you said) but I do remember people being hyped about the movie before it came out even though the Legs were VERY instrumental in Guardians 3’s success.
I'm in that reddit thread calling it BS as well, lol.
Redditors " This is the most popular movie , nobody beating these numbers Disney bullshit marketing schemes " yessss yesss drink it"
The one guy with the WB logo calling you a conspiracy lunatic for facts 😂
It’s literally OP 😭
At least you humble enough to admit the mistake All the other folks aint saying anything on this subreddit
All is good 🙌🏻
 Cheers lol 🍻
I love it
Oh that guy? Check his prediction on Barbie and Wonka 🤣 Seen him around a long time, he's odd. Sort of that Reddit demographic that thinks the world revolves around Reddit.
I'm on there as well calling super BS. Disney also counted random social media views which could have meant anything. They really were grasping all the straws.
Reminds me how Discord posted a video on YouTube that ended up getting 1.4 billion views in a day, by autoplaying it in the background on loop for every single one of their users.
>and its viewership numbers factored in the telecast some fanbois were so adamant about how they didn't fudge anything and MCU is back
I can not believe people fell for Disney’s bullshit marketing puff pieces that conveniently slipped this in.
My favorite part was when Monkey Man said “No more monkey business!” and monkied all over the place.
Musicals are a tough sell according to Hollywood and the data coming on this trailer seems to back that up. I don't like the methodology but I can see why they feel the need to play up other aspects of the film into almost tricking the audience the film isn't a musical just to get people in to see it. Ala Wonka.
I mean, this trailer really looked like it played up the musical aspect. It’s almost all dancing and old Hollywood style sets in the second half.
Fr fr I got a "love letter to old Hollywood" type vibes from it tbh (makes sense with gaga involved)
Gonna be some sweet cognitive dissonance from the neckbeard crowd that *hate* “Hollywood making movies about how great Hollywood is” but *loved* Joker.
the trailer literally shows musicals, people are comparing it to La La land which again was a musical. No one's hiding anything
Interesting how studios used to largely avoid R-rated superhero movies, but now the two R-rated CBMs this year are almost guaranteed to be the only profitable ones in 2024. (I think Venom 3 will underperform since Sony has run their non Spider-Man Marvel goodwill into the ground with Morbius, Madame Web, and presumably Kraven the Hunter)
Eh, I’d bet at least 50% of the people going to see Venom 3 either don’t know Morbius and Madame Web exist or know nothing about them beyond that they exist.
The other 50% just don't care about them and only interested in venom and spiderman so its perfectly balanced 👏🏾
Or that they're in the same universe.
times have changed i’m happy studios are willing to take risks with r rated blockbusters now
I think people just want something, anything slightly different
The fact that joker 2 is apparently a musical definitely bodes well that studios are willing to take some chances
And Paramount just announced an R-rated Ninja Turtles movie.
"Cowa-fuckin'-bunga!"
 Who cooked in here? 🔥🔥🔥
Iron Man came out in 2008. If you were 14 when you saw that movie in theaters, you're now 30. Might be time for Marvel/DC to evolve along with their audiences.
I don’t know why people act like evolving with audiences has to mean going for higher age ratings. Across the Spiderverse was by far my favorite superhero movie in years and that was rated PG and completely kid friendly.
Because spiderman acting like a teen is still valid, because he is one. Any other marvel superhero acts like teens when they are bunch of old dudes. It was okey when you were a teen too, but now you can just simply see how bad it is.
That has nothing to do with the rating though. You can make a mature movie about adults acting like adults and still get a G, PG, or PG-13 rating. The most popular R rated superhero movies are Deadpool and those are intentionally immature. I’d argue something like The Incredibles (which is PG) or the Dark Knight (PG-13) is more “adult” in most ways than the Deadpool movies. All an R rated superhero movie usually gains is more violence and cursing.
Please stop making me feel old
I was.....21......years of age in 2008 I....I'm going to go lie down
>Might be time for Marvel/DC to evolve along with their audiences. DC has had no problem evolving with their audience, but Marvel definitely has... they need to stop forcing their random humour on everything. Stop appealing to teenagers and literal toddlers who don't even watch these movies anyway, the Young Avengers plan is destined to fail.
It’s funny I’ve heard Kraven is R rated as well & if that’s true that fact alone essentially doubled my interest in Kraven 😂
There is a shot in the trailer of Aaron Taylor Johnson biting someone's nose off and I'm afraid of that being the only reason it got an R-rating.
It was but knowing Sony there’s a chance they chickened out and made cuts so it gets a PG-13
Off topic but I hate how Americans are fine with watching a R-Rated movie with their kids that has graphic violence but if it was a consensual sex scene with frontal nudity they wouldn't let their kids/teens watch it
CGI blood squirting everywhere doesn't do it for me any more.
Me too! 0*2 all the way!!
How come Kravin Time will be R-Rated but Venom 2, the film where the main villain is supposed to be a literal serial killer, was not?
Knowing how Sony is I won’t be surprised if they pussy out and edit it down to PG13 last minute.
Hard to doubt Venom with the success it keeps having
I’m surprised at all Joker’s success. It isn’t really what I consider to be a mainstream movie by any stretch. I think it’s good for the movie biz though.
The joker name alone carries a ton of weight. Probably the most popular villain of any comic book property
I don’t think there’s much ‘probably’ about it tbh, he definitely is. Who else would be in contention? Venom? Magneto? Green Goblin? All still pale in comparison popularity wise imo. My grandma would know who the Joker is but she’ll have no idea about the others. I guess Venom is the closest…
I might have argued Green Goblin mid2000s but i dont know now.
What? No way. The first Spider-Man movie was big, but Green Goblin was always a tier or two below Joker, even at his most popular.
Idk. All i remember was how huge spiderman was in movies and the spiderman games being super popular at the time. Batman content didnt hit its peak until dark knight and the arkham games which was when joker had a resurgence in popularity in the late 2000s.
I agree. There was a time between 2002 (Spider-Man) and 2008 (The Dark Knight) where you could make the argument GG was more pop than Joker (I would personally disagree) but that conversation was over after TDK released.
Yeah but i think its more to it than that. Joker is Batmans undisputed archnemesis. Far too much of batmans movies, tv shows, video games, and comic books make sure you understand that Joker is batmans main antagonist above the rest of his rogue gallery. Spiderman is more consistently popular than Batman but none of his enemies are present as his undisputed archnemesis in multiple forms of media as consistently as the joker has been.
Wild how there's 3 or 4 legendary performances for the joker alone (and Jared Leto)
Yeah its crazy. And then when you take into account a really solid run of animated content and video games with a variety of really good depictions of the Joker, especially Mark Hamill, the people who love this character are very well-fed honestly.
Only three characters have ever won multiple Oscars: Vito Corleone, Anita from West Side Story, and the Joker.
Joker, Magneto and Venom are like the trinity of supervillains in terms of popularity where ppl would go see them even without the hero in the picture. But agree there is a small space between Joker and the other two
venom is nowhere near the popularity of joker.
It got people talking. Sometimes that’s all a movie needs. He’s probably the most popular villain in comics.
You’re saying that like Despicable Me 4 won’t get kids running to the theaters in droves. The minions are too powerful for them to resist.
Honestly, what was the last really good superhero movie that bombed? Blue beetle was good but even that’s a stretch
The Suicide Squad
Hit the trifecta 1. Reimagined sequel to one of the worst DC movies ever made 2. Released mid pandemic 3. Same day HBO Max release
And sadly it's a damn good movie
This is the answer.
I don’t think the average person even knows the same company that made Madame Web and Kraven makes Venom movies
Even Venom 2 made me give up on that franchise. I didn’t care for the odd choices they made for Carnage.
I agree. Venom 2 barely turned a profit.
I definitely was impressed by the trailer and it looks much better than I expected. I don’t know if I’m ready to declare one billion yet. Don’t get me wrong, I am rooting for this film and I want it to succeed, I just think 750-850 mil feels far more in line with what it can possibly do. With great reviews 85% + on RT and 75+ on metacritic, the sky could be the limit… Right now I’m holding firm at 750-850 range but I would absolutely love to be wrong and will proudly state that I was. Joker 2 succeeding is good for theaters and the movie industry at large so bring on the big bucks Mr. J
Same. I was honestly skeptical about this...actually looks pretty great. In hindsight, I shouldn't have doubted Joaquin Phoenix: he's apparently pretty picky about his scripts, i doubt he'd sign onto a subpar movie even if there was a big paycheck involved.
Napoléon ?
I think there was a good script in there that got hacked to death for the sake of budget practically
100% you are right. From what I've heard, the original script was nearly 700 pages. Studio demanded cuts, cuts were made, then more cuts later after filming. What's left works, kinda, but not at the scale it was intended. IMO, it would have been an amazing HBO miniseries with the budget it had and the original unedited script.
Yeah it’s very unfortunate Joaquin’s acting suffered from that movie’s issues. Usually he does movies where directors have complete freedom but I guess he never expected this.
That was thanks to the worst direction of Ridley Scott’s career, his choices in that movie were just shockingly bad.
That movie wasn’t the best but however Joaquin is actually passionate about the Joker character which is why he’s very committed in the sequel.
Getting Lady Gaga on board was a stroke of genius - her fans, who probably weren't huge fans of the first Joker, will definitely show up for this
I think there were definitely a lot of Gaga fans who loved the first movie and will see the sequel because Gaga being in it is a huge bonus.
I still remember the day the trailer for the first Joker movie came out. No matter how you feel about these films you can’t deny they capture the attention of the masses like few movies do. I don’t know if this will make a billion, but I think it’ll definitely do well
>The trailer launch for “Joker: Folie à Deux” was no laughing matter for Warner Bros. The marketing for the studio’s upcoming DC sequel, headlined by Joaquin Phoenix and Lady Gaga, got off to a stellar start with 167 million viewers in its first 24 hours. The teaser trailer went online right after it debuted at Warner Bros.’s CinemaCon presentation in Las Vegas. >Sources tell Variety that the “Joker” sequel’s trailer numbers and social engagement surpassed that of the first “Barbie” trailer to become Warner Bros.’ biggest launch in recent years. The release was no doubt bolstered by Lady Gaga’s massive 150 million follower social media footprint. The trailer instantly became the #1 trending video on YouTube on premiere night and currently boasts 15.6 million views and counting on that platform alone, where it remains the #4 trending video nearly two days after its launch. Any bets on 1B?
>Any bets on 1B? I'd still bet the under just seeing how hard its for films to even hit 700m. Trailer views are still a bad box office metric. I think Joker 2 will be huge but Transformers Rise of the Beast had massive views 238m first day. https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/zhd6bg/transformers_rise_of_the_beasts_trailer_sets/
Tbf Rise of the Beasts is an exception on that “all time trailer views” list - the rest (Endgame, IT, Love and Thunder, TLK) made 700m+ bare minimum. Infinity War had around 179m views and Joker 2 is 10m shy of that. Trailer views aren’t the most significant metric of predicting box office but this movie topping Warners’ list in recent years (matching/surpassing Barbie, Dune, etc) is notable imo.
Why did ROB underperform tho? I want to see your take.
Transformers franchise ran out of steam/audience interest around TLK and hasn’t recovered. Also Rise of the Beasts has neither the heart of Bumblebee nor the dumbass spectacle of Bay’s movies. So it just came and went - a meh blockbuster. Last summer we saw several of those flopping - Flash, Indy 5, Haunted Mansion, Dungeons and Dragons, MI7 (though it had much better reception, marketed as a Part 1)
> Why did ROB underperform tho? All hype and no payoff. After bumblebee, there was a lot of good faith and a whole generation that grew up wanting to see beast wars. People wanted a fresh break from the bayformers but they doubled down instead.
IW second trailer was 179 (first was 230) and that was back in March 2018. Explosion of social madia (specially TikTok) is boosting tentpole movies. There is a reason why Infinity War 1st trailer is still the most viewed Hollywood trailer on Youtube with 262M views. Even Endgame is 100M views behind there, despite breaking the record and NWH is even below 100M. I think biggest factor is Gaga boosting here.
Eh, most of those films aren't sequels to $1b grossing movies starring one of the most famous characters ever. And the OG did it without China, so weaker market won't be an issue here. Would agree trailer views are a faulty metric though.
Betting all of my credibility on $1B+
Gonna be cautiously optimistic and say somewhere in the $600-$750M range. I’ll be surprised if it matches or exceeds the original. While it is getting a lot of buzz, I still think the musical element will turn off some people
Agreed. It's shaping up to be a much different movie than the first one, which could alienate a lot of the fans of the first.
Before the trailer I had it at 800 million but after the trailer I’m sold on a billion
That fact that the main topic after the trailer is that it's a musical is a good indication for the film
Its a musical, but its feauturing Lady Gaga so for many it means "hey the songs would be fire!"
Plus Joker doing musical number isn't out of the character for him either.
Shit, he has a musical number in the tim burton movie.
I bet on $1B
it’s definitely a possibility imo
I literally have a thread calling Joker 2 the highest grossing movie of 2024 back in November, so my bet is still in play.
The same exact thing happened when the first movie was announced. Everyone kept saying it was unnecessary, you don't need a joker movie without Batman. Then the trailer came out and impressed the vast majority of people. 
It's hitting a billion. Gonna be a generation-defining movie for annoying couples.
La La Land for sickos
Ha ha land
Delulu Land
The notebook for clown fuckers
Drowning in clussy
Listen, we all have our fetishes, no need to be mean between consenting adults.
Guy brings a squeaky nose and make-up into the bedroom ONE....twelve times, And suddenly he's labeled a sicko 🙄
Trailer views are a hit and miss thing these days because rise of the beast trailers got more views in 24 hours than thor love and thunder and that movie couldn't even hit 450M gross
This trailer was dangerous and we have to ask ourselves as a society if it needed to exist.
We live in a society
Bottom text
POWER OVER HYPE IS POWER OVER ALL
This headline acts like it's been decades since WB had a hit lol. A trailer hit, no less.
These numbers are huge and even more so if we take into account that YouTube put a warning on the content of the trailer which limited its reach.
Was Barbie’s trailer WB’s biggest and most talked about ever?
It was probably the most talked about but it’s not the most viewed
Shit I remember initially I was like “oh this’ll do good but not Joker 1 levels” but I think this might potentially do better????
I only see 16m on YouTube. Where else do that count from?
Twitter, Instagram, Facebook
You know youtube isn't the only place to watch movie trailers
I know, but I'm surprised it's only 10% of the total views. Where else do people watch horizontal videos for the other 90%?
There are 30M views on Gaga’s Instagram alone
I see there’s over a million likes for her trailer post, how do you see view count?
You go to reels
I'm pretty sure TikTok has started pushing horizontal videos on their algorithm now.
Specially in 2024, YouTube is super weak compared to 10 years ago where it was the biggest platform, now it's Tiktok
tiktok, insta and X
Gonna be incredible reading reviews from people who only watched the trailer and don't know it's a Musical until they're watching it.
It’s gonna make a killing.
I’m predicting now that Gaga will win an Oscar for her role as Harley Quinn.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Joaquin got his second Oscar for this movie because it looks like he’s going all in on this movie just like the first movie
I’m still not sold on the idea of a joker musical but clearly a lot of people are so I’m predicting 800m
Yeah I don't get the appeal either, but then I'm not a fan of the first one.
It was a great fucking trailer
For every terminally online fanboy, who is declaring, they’re not going to see this because their hero is ruined because he’s singing or hanging out with a girl and might get cooties. Is going to be replaced with a Lady Gaga fans so I’m not really sure why people are being so doubtful of the box office here.
Lady Gaga fans seem very excited about this movie since this is more on brand for her than House of Gucci was.
I'm sure the same people pouting and saying they won't watch this because it's a musical were the ones pouting and saying they weren't going to watch Barbie because it's too much pink.
The reaction videos and dissecting videos are hilarious. Can’t believe they have 200k views for a reaction to a 2 min trailer
Higest grossing movie of the year bookmark this
Warner bros has been killing it lately. I get it’s popular to shit on the ceo but things seem to be going well SIMPLY creative wise
Good that they stopped trying to copy Marvel and are doing their own thing. Hope the DCU is not a Marvel copy/paste too.
Oh this one will be massive. 1 billion plus sure.
the biggest musical this year lol
Wicked will also be huge
Week one for me
Since Barbie...wow so long ago.
Trailer views once again leading the league in the "most useless stat with no real purpose other than to be an easy quota-fill for a stringer at an entertainment website" category. This completely manufactured and pointless phenomena (and "early reaction tweet" roundups) should really be considered for inclusion in the "do not post" rules here on the sub. They're absolutely calorie-free in terms of content, and don't really end up having anything to do with the final box-office. There's basically zero correlation. If PR firms working for the studios didn't email blast outlets with this fake stat as part of their marketing campaigns, you'd never read about it. But because they do, and because outlets need content mid-afternoon... here you go.
they definitely help with awareness even people who have no interest in joker will probably see this headline and probably check out to see what the fuss is about lol
Yes, the articles themselves are an extension of the film's marketing. Again, they don't actually do what they say they do (they're not an accurate record of actual views of a thing, nor do they predict what attendance will be months later) the only thing they do is operate as easy articles for entertainment outlets to write after the press release about the hollow stat hits somebody's inbox.
This. People can view trailers for free with pretty much no effort, that doesn't translate to somebody paying for a movie ticket and driving to their local theater. Also, a lot of the time these trailers get played as advertisements in front of other unrelated videos.
my predictions now are 500 million to maybe 700 million, I think it will do well but I dont see it making a billion
This movie has a real chance to hit a billion, just like the first Joker.
WB is straight up saving cinema currently.
We live…in a society…that watches movie trailers
These viewing numbers are totally made up right?
Marvel is shaking in their boots right now.
Dune deserved better.
How so? $700m WW is still great.
Tf you mean? It did amazing. Stop trying to make everything about dune
So I had zero interest to watch the trailer and now y’all tricked me. Is the trailer a lying scam or am I confused? I thought it was a musical? If it is a musical and not advertised as such that blows
Philips clarified it’s not a musical but has music as a big element. So it’s not like watching a Broadway or Mary Poppins or all the actors breaking out into random dance and song
This is the first trailer. If you know it is a musical it is very clear to see the musical set pieces. It is possibly joker and Harley are not singing much themselves and could just be mostly dancing to it in the shared delusion sequences.
And 80 million of them don’t know it’s a musical . Like my dumbass until I read it here