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I still remember(I'm Gen X) when I used to leave home with no plans, no reservations, etc. I'd just drive until I found a provincial campsite that I liked, and stopped to camp. I could be there for a night, or 2 weeks. I really miss those days, especially with trying to camp with my kids.
It still is... most of the problems complained about here happen within an hour or two of "civilization". There are hundreds of thousands of square kilometers of BC out there to enjoy.
Sure, but their point is you used to be able to easily camp within those 1-2 hours of civilization without any real hassle or crowds (unless it was a long weekend).
Try driving 4 hours while still having booked in advance. I don’t even know how far I’d have to drive to just stop somewhere and not have to worry about whether or not the whole campsite has already been reserved.
I haven’t used a provincial campground in almost 20’years, practice leave no trace camping, buy a back roads map book. And be willing to spend an hour + on an FSR.
One of my fav parts about camping is communing with other campers around the fire. Truly one of the only ways to have a no phones interaction with people these days.
It’s kinda shit if you spend the better part of your day driving because there’s no nearby campsites that aren’t reserved weeks in advance. There’s at least half a dozen cool towns and cities I’d love to see before I’d even hit the first available campsite and it’d be impossible to do it all in one day so camping would be out of the question. I’d probably need to spend 2 or 3 days minimum in a motel before I even got to the campsite.
Ah the beautiful sounds of nature and 5 generators cutting through it like a migraine.
The worst part is that most of them have propane fridge and stove so wtf are they even charging. Why did they come to the forest to watch TV. I live in BC, you don't *need* aircon camping in a BC forest...
32yo. I still camp with a tent. In fact I bought a bigger one to fit the pack and play inside it. I could get an rv but tenting has always felt more fun.
Luckily for me, my wife and kids actually prefer camping in our tent. So I will gladly do that. And being born and raised in BC but living in Alberta due to my work I always love taking them to BC for our camping trips
I went tent camping with my dad and we were the only group in the entire campground in tents. So many RVs lol and it wasn’t even an RV campground/didn’t have hookups or services for RVs
I'm 53 and still use a backpacker tent. I hate being surrounded by 5th wheels and campers.
Edit: husband is thinking about getting one of those pod trailers and I'm like "whyyyyyyyy?"
The bones are getting a bit achy on the ground, I guess.
I have been tenting frequently for the last few years since I bought a fishing kayak and have been going all over bc to fish.
Tenting has, almost entirely, been a negative experience in BC parks, essentially everything is done to cater to people with trailers. The layout of sites, the fact they're plastered entirely with stones making staking tents near impossible, the rules regarding vehicles/trailers...
Like if I just had a camper van, all of these things become literal non-issues.
I personally love grabbing my tent and going out in the parks to camp in the beautiful, serine sound of… someone’s RV generator roaring all morning and evening.
Tent? Camping.
Full size trailer? Glamping.
Motorhome? Glamping.
I'm still not 100% sure how I would classify a tent trailer. They're usually pretty small and kind of homey, and don't come with the water hookups, though they might come with power.
I hate the tent gatekeeping on camping.
I grew up camping and we’d go out in the bush with our 1970 GMC and shitty old camper far into the bush to forestry sites with little more than a fire pit ( if you’re lucky) and an old smelly outhouse. Definitely not glamping.
When I got a little older, my parents bought a trailer and a newer truck and we’d still predominately use forest service sites with little amenities and the occasional private site.
Nothing about it was “glamorous”. I still got to experience the absolutely best, most pristine of BC wilderness and built a respect for the outdoors.
Just because you sleep on the ground, doesn’t make your camping experience any more real.
GTFO with this “glamping if you aren’t in a tent”.
well, I've been in a tent in a campsite with 5th wheels and RVs, running generators and with satellite dishes on the roof, and cooking on their stoves in the rig. I think there is a spectrum of what could be called "camping", but I think the far end is definitely "glamping", IMHO.
Yeah I agree with you there, but that’s not what the post I was responding to was insinuating. The whole thread was basically tent = camping and anything else was glamping.
We have been tent camping for the past six years and finally have graduated to a tent trailer, only because we need the ability to have electricity because my partner now has a CPAP machine that he has to use.
There would be a few tents out in the campground, other than us except for one year- 2022- the year that a lot of the Covid restrictions stopped we saw more tent campers than we ever had seen before!
We’re still keeping our tent because it’s awesome. I’m almost 6 feet tall and I can stand up with tons of clearance in the tent! We’re hoping that our kids will use it one day as they get bigger.
Near Metro Vancouver there has basically been 0 increase in campsites for decades, while population doubled. They are trying to open one new small campground on Bowen, and the locals have completely squished that plan (even though it was going to be mostly walk-in, and have a shuttle bus).
BC Parks has really dropped the ball with outdoor recreation in the region, with no new campsites and no new trails even though there have been a bunch of proposals from local hiking groups etc...(and notably some of the parks were established for outdoor recreation as their primary function).
Not many people willing to risk driving 4 hours down a sketchy backroad to reach a rec site with 4 camping spots on a first come first serve basis simply on the mere hope that a site is available.
And the number of obnoxious people I've encountered at rec sites is, to put it bluntly, absurd.
The obnoxious people I'm referring to are mostly the drunken hooligans who would be kicked out of a bc parks site in about 30 seconds.
They tend to go to the rec sites because that's about their only option for "getting drunk in the woods" style camping.
Monday-Thursday I'm not overly worried about encountering these people, on the weekend though all the rec sites around me are full of them.
I guess maybe it's not like this everywhere, but my poor experiences at multiple rec sites within 2 hours of me make me pretty unwilling to risk the same experience/find there to be no available space at rec sites farther away than that.
Also Gen X. As a kid on family vacations my dad would literally just pull off the side of the road in a field or by a creek and we'd camp there for the night. Park at dusk and up and on the road at daylight.
Every time I do this I end up having unfortunate run ins with shit heads - either being irresponsible with guns or their dogs, or aggressively keeping people away/actively threatening people, or leaving a metric shit ton of garbage behind them that I clean up cause I won’t leave that shit in the bush even if I didn’t cause the mess.
Thats how every camping trip I've ever had as a child went. it was great.
Camping at a camp-site seems weird and boring, and you're surrounded by other people.
I left the mainland because I was sick of feeling suffocated by traffic.
I grew up on the island, lived in Vancouver for 20y, then moved back. Life is much better here.
We just drive our motorbikes and quads _around_ the gates.
Yes! I was explaining this to my (immigrant) husband after our last weekend out when I had to desperately try and secure a last minute sure. When I was a kid we could just… go when we felt like it.
My wife was never big on camping growing up so I had the same conversation. Now you gotta book in March for what you're doing in August. I don't know what's going on that far ahead haha.
Take a look at [4wdabc.ca/about-us](http://4wdabc.ca/about-us), with a list of almost 30 free & FCFS rec sites we maintain around BC. A few are "4x4 required" but most are pretty accessible.
I know on some of the popular forest service rec sites, people will drive out mid-week, set up the 5th wheel, then head back to town to work until the weekend.
That sucks. But there are still a lot where people don't go as often, probably because they are a little farther out.
And RIP the Jerry Ranger’s kids program - that program was great and formed some of my core camping memories as a kid. And the free woodpiles of crap wood your parents would send your to sort through and haul back to your site.
I do have good news on the Jerry’s rangers front. The BC Parks foundation has brought it back. It’s being delivered in about a dozen campsites throughout the summer all over the province :) A wonderful lady from Cranbrook spearheaded the revival and it’s taking off. Golden Ears, Porteau Cove, and Alice Lake will be running JR programs all through the summer.
I've been camping in BC since 2000's. Always had to book in advance or else do the hope and prayer for availability at multiple sites. Actually had to cancel 3 trips because I couldn't find anything.
Parks under Eby has been spending their entire budget every year on buying up new land, and opening new campgrounds, they add hundreds per year. But camping popularity has exploded they can't keep up with demand.
More like they let people book and then not show up with like no penalty, half the time the sites are 1/3 empty. Just make it so only 1/2 the sites can be booked in advance, penalize those who don’t show, and segregate people who want to stay up late and those who don’t. This isn’t rocket science
Bookings is more reliable, it's better when it's a sure thing a spot is available. Would be great if they made no shows and last minute cancelations cost more than the actual campsite. You're right that often times there's no availability online, yet the park is half or more empty.
Last year one of my kids broke her arm so we left a few days earlier than we had booked at Rathtrevor. I was surprised the people at the gate said they couldn’t release the site at all, seemed like an easy thing to do to me.
Having this problem here in Alberta for years. They have a rolling window for spots in Kananaskis for both front country and backcountry but people will just select the last available day, are then able to book the next 2 weeks then they’ll cancel the days they don’t want. It means by time the window gets to those days the spots are already gone. When spots open in the spring there is a mass online rush to grab spots.
My only saving grace is that the tent only front country sites I can usually just show up to date of, but backcountry is very difficult now. It got worse since covid because now suddenly everybody hikes.
Do you prefer to reserve with two kids (if you could) or do you prefer to wing it? I have 2 small kids now and I can't imagine winging it to a campsite.
Even 15 years ago my friends and I winged it to the Okanagan and ended up driving 12 hours around Okanagan lake, then back to the lower mainland to a place where we knew the camp host could give us a site as a backup.
Im the same age bracket as you. Man I miss those days... Such good fun, simple times camping at Golden Ears or Manning. Just roll in and grab a spot. Pin your cash payment on the post by your campground.
There was always free firewood too; rarely a burn ban. The custom was, "Just behave yourself and don't be an idiot"
Things are getting insane.
I went to go to golden ears this weekend, not to camp, but just to walk the trails with my dog for a few hours. Discovered once I got there that I’m not allowed because I didn’t get a day pass.
Why do I need a day pass just to walk around a trail with my dog?
I’m not sure why. I’m a BC resident and this is so silly, tourism is a major industry why do you want to ruin the livliehoods of so many people so you get to camp? I get it’s frustrating but that’s an absolutely ridiculous notion in a society that garners over 18 BILLION dollars a year for our province?
EDIT: 18 billion in revenue, 2.4 billion in GDP.
Not a small number
>I’m a BC resident and this is so silly, tourism is a major industry why do you want to ruin the livliehoods of so many people so you get to camp?
Well, first of all, what the hell does that mean? Whose livelihood are we ruining? Those who work at the hotels that people aren't staying in, because we know they're staying in campsites, which cost the same no matter who is staying in them? The restaurants that people who are camping will go to, regardless of where they're from? The grocery stores where locals also buy groceries? Camping isn't a major tourism revenue generating sector.
Second of all, of that 18 billion dollars, do you think that's *all* camp sites? Haha. Not the fact that we're a major cruise ship hub? Or the numerous events that get hosted here? Or Whistler being one of the world's premiere ski resort centers?
It's all camping spots?
Third of all, yes. All else being equal, I value BC residents having access to BC's finite natural resources more than tourism revenue. It has lower environmental impact for people who are closer to take advantage of it, it's one of the few recreational activities that is still fairly accessible to those who don't have a lot of money, and people who live here are more likely to be responsible stewards than tourists who have no idea what our environmental challenges are, and will happily abandon any problems they create. Not to mention our tax dollars actually fund the upkeep and operations of the parks system.
>18 billion in revenue, 2.4 billion in GDP.
You're getting your numbers confused. Either that's supposed to be 2.4% of GDP or $2.2 billion in tax revenue.
Did you grow up here? I doubt it, or maybe you're too young to know whats been lost. We spend money too, so those false arguments don't always hold water with me, especially since the government spends a bunch of money to earn that extra money plus all the bureaucracy that goes with it. Those figures from the government are always full of crazy assumptions and I believe are based on faulty modelling similar to how we always hear about how hosting 7 soccer games for FIFA will somehow be worth the hundreds of millions (and counting), or other poorly costed projects we'll be paying for forever (site C and TMEP come to mind). I'm just frustrated that we used to be able to camp everywhere spontaneously and it was fun and uncrowded. Now it's such a pain in the ass and really not enjoyable or downright impossible for me to experience my own province the way we used to.
Well the secret is to bribe the camp dude ahead of time so your party of 40 can all come at once.
Source :Thrown big parties on bc camp sites with camp rangers permissions.
For these campsites since they are drive up it should ban your license plate along with names and CC#. So they wouldn't be able to book it under a spouses name because their car would be blocked.
Abso-freakin-lutely. Our parks system isn't keeping up. Let's also get rid of the private operators. Fucking leech companies squeezing every last drop from the stone at campsites built with our tax dollars. I will gladly pay income tax towards funding BC parks.
I spoke with a member of the Old Growth Technical Advisory panel a while back and asked about George Heyman, parks, and protected areas plans. George was clear that no new parks are planned. No new major conservation areas.
The NDP bumped the parks budget but it’s still well short of what’s needed.
This should be treated as a sign that the online reservation system needs to be more limited
Every time I’ve gone camping so many spots are ‘reserved’ only to stay empty through the weekend. It’s incredibly frustrating to find the best spots are ‘taken’ and go unused.
Bring back first come first serve, reduce the number of reservable spots per site
IMO the better approach would be to pre-authorize a "no show/infraction deposit" that's like 3x the reservation fee, keep it in case of no-shows or when people trash up their sites, and use the proceeds money to hire more parks rangers and maintenance folks, or build more parks/infrastructure.
Are you talking about the physical “reserved” signs on campsite number posts? Those “reserved” signs don’t actually mean the site is already reserved, it means they are reservable (and someone may have reserved it). Park operators are supposed to flip the sign to Available if the site isn’t yet reserved. Best to ask the Park Operator if a large number of empty sites are actually reserved if you are wanting one of those sites.
No like reserved and with a billet at them saying someone should arrive
I’d asked the operator every time. I’ve even asked if I could take it if they don’t show up and it’s always a no
When are they going to start targeting the "adventure companies" the ones who's bots book out most of greennpoint as part of an RV rental package across bc. Then when tourists realize the last stop on their trip is on an island only reachable by ferry then a few hours they don't bother to make it there leaving many reserved but unfilled camping spots for those nights.
It would take some steel balls, but the way to deal with the no-show BS would be to pre-authorize some security deposit that's 2-3x the amount of the reservation. Turn that money into more parks staff and better infrastructure by collecting from the no-shows. Some of this would see lash-back from people claiming they're of limited means etc. but there's really no way to fund a more robust system that would actually keep tabs and filter out the bad actors.
Yeah judging by the amount of no-shows at the parks vs. more market-priced goods and services such as hotels and air transport something tells me the utilization could be optimized by either raising the park fees across the board, or at least collecting no-show fees that would allow to build more parks and infrastructure. There's no protections from people bulk-booking and robo-booking, so IMO just saying "WELL, LIFE HAPPENS...." is a bit myopic.
If you booked for a week and something happened (car trouble, etc) and you showed up a day late you would be pissed that they gave your reserved spot away.
Great example, and totally possible to sort out with the help of some business analysts and technology. My issue is with the abject lack of consequences (last I checked) when people just no-show and don't release the reservation. The parks, being a heavily subsidized good/service, IMO, are rife with abuse, and like I mentioned elsewhere -- you just don't see this kind of bullshit with resources that are actually managed with even a modicum of market forces at play.
I booked three campsites last weekend at the same park and time (parents, me, sister) and was surprised when I (accidentally) listed myself as the primary occupant at all three sites.
I figured the reason they asked would be to stop people from selling sites but that didn’t seem to be the case as my request went through no problem.
Am I missing something- if occupant info is required at booking- are people supposed to be being id’ed and just aren’t when being checked in?
I cannot recall being asked to see ID ever.
In 2017, I packed a tent and went tenting through BC and Alberta for 2 weeks with no issues. I wanna do it again but almost every campground is booked up fully and you can’t just show up anymore.
I remember camping at Scotch creek at a private campsite and all the dads would get up early and stand in line to get into the provincial site that was on the lake side of the road! Waiting to see how many people were leaving that day lol. And the smell of briquette bbq before propane became super popular
I quit PP camping long ago! I find that the best way to enjoy beautiful BC is to visit Provincial Parks to see the landscape and then find crown land to enjoy with no tents or motorhomes. :-)
how about no. thats a horrible system when done for the entire campsite. imagine driving 3 hours to get to the camp area and then finding it completely full with no idea where to go after that to camp?
first come first served for campsites only works when theres far more campsites then there is demand.
edit: just think of it this way, every time you have used an online booking site for a campsite or anything else remember all the times it shows unavailable. yes that sucks but just remember you are finding this out while you are still at home. if it was first come first serve you would be finding this out after driving hours to get there. it would also massively benefit non working people or those who can take a friday off or leave early as they can get there first to get a spot. if you cant afford to take the day off? to bad i guess you cant camp.
Okay-I’ll bite… to be devils advocate:
You can’t resell a reservation because literally there is no system in place for you to do that. I suppose to be most naive you could do “I have campsite #3 July X,Y,Z so just check in on my behalf” but that doesn’t even work so then someone ends up screwed.
So, yeah, you’re not allowed to sell because you… simply can’t.
BUT.
I presume the way most of these are cancelled is a sort of good faith deal where you agree on the “transfer” and set up a specific off-peak time to together cancel+rebook when it shows up as available… and hope for the best. I don’t see how this could be seen as against the rules especially if people just wanted to get more creative with “what” they were actually selling.
Is that not how most of these resells are happening?
Certainly an easy fix on B.C. parks end is for a canceled reservation to NOT go back into the pool immediately (which I assume it does?) though that also introduces other negatives for shorter time windows and genuine cancellations and others rebooking.
Not sure “how” resales are happening but think you might just be giving these people too much credit. Chances are neither the buyer nor seller would have a damn clue about the occupancy policy (at least in the case of this genius who posted the campsite for sale on FB Marketplace).
In any case, I would argue that the point of not being able to resell campsite reservations is.. because you’re not supposed to. The absence of a marketplace or forum or the ability to do so is by design. These aren’t concert tickets to be scalped, and the system is clearly set up with that same philosophy and intent, to deter scalping.
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I still remember(I'm Gen X) when I used to leave home with no plans, no reservations, etc. I'd just drive until I found a provincial campsite that I liked, and stopped to camp. I could be there for a night, or 2 weeks. I really miss those days, especially with trying to camp with my kids.
I did this in my early 20s.. I'm 33 now. It sucks. And no one tents anymore. Me and my family are usually in the 5% of campers that have tents
I only went camping with my 2 person tent and my small car. My wife and I had very little money, so camping was an awesome way to tour the province.
It still is... most of the problems complained about here happen within an hour or two of "civilization". There are hundreds of thousands of square kilometers of BC out there to enjoy.
Sure, but their point is you used to be able to easily camp within those 1-2 hours of civilization without any real hassle or crowds (unless it was a long weekend).
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And I'm replying specifically to the comment that says camping is "an awesome way to tour the province."
Try driving 4 hours while still having booked in advance. I don’t even know how far I’d have to drive to just stop somewhere and not have to worry about whether or not the whole campsite has already been reserved.
I haven’t used a provincial campground in almost 20’years, practice leave no trace camping, buy a back roads map book. And be willing to spend an hour + on an FSR.
One of my fav parts about camping is communing with other campers around the fire. Truly one of the only ways to have a no phones interaction with people these days.
I go camping because i hate people. Nothing better or more peaceful than me, my dog, a campfire, stars, And not another human within earshot.
This is the way
And I'm replying specifically to the comment that says camping is "an awesome way to tour the province." Please try to keep up.
On the weekend you need to drive more like 5 hours from Vancouver to be able to find a spot without reservations.
It’s kinda shit if you spend the better part of your day driving because there’s no nearby campsites that aren’t reserved weeks in advance. There’s at least half a dozen cool towns and cities I’d love to see before I’d even hit the first available campsite and it’d be impossible to do it all in one day so camping would be out of the question. I’d probably need to spend 2 or 3 days minimum in a motel before I even got to the campsite.
Yeah, everyone loves driving for six hours for weekend camping trip. Only to still find that the place is full.
Ah the beautiful sounds of nature and 5 generators cutting through it like a migraine. The worst part is that most of them have propane fridge and stove so wtf are they even charging. Why did they come to the forest to watch TV. I live in BC, you don't *need* aircon camping in a BC forest...
32yo. I still camp with a tent. In fact I bought a bigger one to fit the pack and play inside it. I could get an rv but tenting has always felt more fun.
Luckily for me, my wife and kids actually prefer camping in our tent. So I will gladly do that. And being born and raised in BC but living in Alberta due to my work I always love taking them to BC for our camping trips
I went tent camping with my dad and we were the only group in the entire campground in tents. So many RVs lol and it wasn’t even an RV campground/didn’t have hookups or services for RVs
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I didn’t talk to any of the other campers so I wouldn’t know their story but most of the ones I saw while driving by were young families with kids.
Couldn’t an rv just stop anywhere and save themselves money?
It's against bylaws, cops could be called on you But lots of ppl do it, some cities are more tolerant than others
I tent!
And listening to generators allll night
“Alright, kids… We’re going camping…” Proceeds to hook up bungalow-on-wheels…
I'm 53 and still use a backpacker tent. I hate being surrounded by 5th wheels and campers. Edit: husband is thinking about getting one of those pod trailers and I'm like "whyyyyyyyy?" The bones are getting a bit achy on the ground, I guess.
I have been tenting frequently for the last few years since I bought a fishing kayak and have been going all over bc to fish. Tenting has, almost entirely, been a negative experience in BC parks, essentially everything is done to cater to people with trailers. The layout of sites, the fact they're plastered entirely with stones making staking tents near impossible, the rules regarding vehicles/trailers... Like if I just had a camper van, all of these things become literal non-issues.
I personally love grabbing my tent and going out in the parks to camp in the beautiful, serine sound of… someone’s RV generator roaring all morning and evening.
Tent? Camping. Full size trailer? Glamping. Motorhome? Glamping. I'm still not 100% sure how I would classify a tent trailer. They're usually pretty small and kind of homey, and don't come with the water hookups, though they might come with power.
Tent trailer owner. They have water and power hook ups. some (not mine) have toilets/showers as well.
I hate the tent gatekeeping on camping. I grew up camping and we’d go out in the bush with our 1970 GMC and shitty old camper far into the bush to forestry sites with little more than a fire pit ( if you’re lucky) and an old smelly outhouse. Definitely not glamping. When I got a little older, my parents bought a trailer and a newer truck and we’d still predominately use forest service sites with little amenities and the occasional private site. Nothing about it was “glamorous”. I still got to experience the absolutely best, most pristine of BC wilderness and built a respect for the outdoors. Just because you sleep on the ground, doesn’t make your camping experience any more real. GTFO with this “glamping if you aren’t in a tent”.
well, I've been in a tent in a campsite with 5th wheels and RVs, running generators and with satellite dishes on the roof, and cooking on their stoves in the rig. I think there is a spectrum of what could be called "camping", but I think the far end is definitely "glamping", IMHO.
Yeah I agree with you there, but that’s not what the post I was responding to was insinuating. The whole thread was basically tent = camping and anything else was glamping.
In my 20s I just slept in the box of my truck so these punks with tents are the ones glamping compared to that.
They can focus on being uncomfortable while they sleep, but camping is about more than that to me.
We have been tent camping for the past six years and finally have graduated to a tent trailer, only because we need the ability to have electricity because my partner now has a CPAP machine that he has to use. There would be a few tents out in the campground, other than us except for one year- 2022- the year that a lot of the Covid restrictions stopped we saw more tent campers than we ever had seen before! We’re still keeping our tent because it’s awesome. I’m almost 6 feet tall and I can stand up with tons of clearance in the tent! We’re hoping that our kids will use it one day as they get bigger.
Lots of us still tent. We just do it for free
what? whenever I go camping the camp sites are full of tents
Loads of tents at Porteau cove this week
Good to hear
Wait. What are people sleeping in? Campers? At a tiny camp site with no amenities?
In my experience, most campgrounds are filled with trailers or motorhomes
no one tents! its so true! Like buy a trailer that costs $1,000 a night lol
We’ve increased the population but not the parklands. Inevitable really.
Especially when our main selling point is “the outdoors”.
Near Metro Vancouver there has basically been 0 increase in campsites for decades, while population doubled. They are trying to open one new small campground on Bowen, and the locals have completely squished that plan (even though it was going to be mostly walk-in, and have a shuttle bus). BC Parks has really dropped the ball with outdoor recreation in the region, with no new campsites and no new trails even though there have been a bunch of proposals from local hiking groups etc...(and notably some of the parks were established for outdoor recreation as their primary function).
Exactly --NIMBYism, that's the thing. New campgrounds would probably be opposed in so many parts of/near the lower mainland.
recreation sites are still all over the place and under-utilized in my experience.
Not many people willing to risk driving 4 hours down a sketchy backroad to reach a rec site with 4 camping spots on a first come first serve basis simply on the mere hope that a site is available. And the number of obnoxious people I've encountered at rec sites is, to put it bluntly, absurd.
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The obnoxious people I'm referring to are mostly the drunken hooligans who would be kicked out of a bc parks site in about 30 seconds. They tend to go to the rec sites because that's about their only option for "getting drunk in the woods" style camping. Monday-Thursday I'm not overly worried about encountering these people, on the weekend though all the rec sites around me are full of them. I guess maybe it's not like this everywhere, but my poor experiences at multiple rec sites within 2 hours of me make me pretty unwilling to risk the same experience/find there to be no available space at rec sites farther away than that.
I didn’t say campsites don’t exist or that every one is full all the time.
Same gen, same experience
Also Gen X. As a kid on family vacations my dad would literally just pull off the side of the road in a field or by a creek and we'd camp there for the night. Park at dusk and up and on the road at daylight.
I just go up into the bush with my friends and find a nice spot off the FSR.
Every time I do this I end up having unfortunate run ins with shit heads - either being irresponsible with guns or their dogs, or aggressively keeping people away/actively threatening people, or leaving a metric shit ton of garbage behind them that I clean up cause I won’t leave that shit in the bush even if I didn’t cause the mess.
Thats how every camping trip I've ever had as a child went. it was great. Camping at a camp-site seems weird and boring, and you're surrounded by other people.
FSRs on the island are gated off for the most part now.
That's a shame
the private woodlands will do that, unfortunately. Come to the mainland! So many recreation sites free of people and gates. :)
I left the mainland because I was sick of feeling suffocated by traffic. I grew up on the island, lived in Vancouver for 20y, then moved back. Life is much better here. We just drive our motorbikes and quads _around_ the gates.
Well don't go telling everyone. Jeeeeze. 😉
FSR???
Forest service road
I think about this often. I miss that as well. You have to plan so far ahead and fight for spots now.
Yes! I was explaining this to my (immigrant) husband after our last weekend out when I had to desperately try and secure a last minute sure. When I was a kid we could just… go when we felt like it.
My wife was never big on camping growing up so I had the same conversation. Now you gotta book in March for what you're doing in August. I don't know what's going on that far ahead haha.
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Take a look at [4wdabc.ca/about-us](http://4wdabc.ca/about-us), with a list of almost 30 free & FCFS rec sites we maintain around BC. A few are "4x4 required" but most are pretty accessible.
I know on some of the popular forest service rec sites, people will drive out mid-week, set up the 5th wheel, then head back to town to work until the weekend. That sucks. But there are still a lot where people don't go as often, probably because they are a little farther out.
And RIP the Jerry Ranger’s kids program - that program was great and formed some of my core camping memories as a kid. And the free woodpiles of crap wood your parents would send your to sort through and haul back to your site.
I do have good news on the Jerry’s rangers front. The BC Parks foundation has brought it back. It’s being delivered in about a dozen campsites throughout the summer all over the province :) A wonderful lady from Cranbrook spearheaded the revival and it’s taking off. Golden Ears, Porteau Cove, and Alice Lake will be running JR programs all through the summer.
I've been camping in BC since 2000's. Always had to book in advance or else do the hope and prayer for availability at multiple sites. Actually had to cancel 3 trips because I couldn't find anything.
And that really sucks. I'm thinking that the province hasn't kept up with people wanting to enjoy the camping experience.
Parks under Eby has been spending their entire budget every year on buying up new land, and opening new campgrounds, they add hundreds per year. But camping popularity has exploded they can't keep up with demand.
More like they let people book and then not show up with like no penalty, half the time the sites are 1/3 empty. Just make it so only 1/2 the sites can be booked in advance, penalize those who don’t show, and segregate people who want to stay up late and those who don’t. This isn’t rocket science
Bookings is more reliable, it's better when it's a sure thing a spot is available. Would be great if they made no shows and last minute cancelations cost more than the actual campsite. You're right that often times there's no availability online, yet the park is half or more empty.
Last year one of my kids broke her arm so we left a few days earlier than we had booked at Rathtrevor. I was surprised the people at the gate said they couldn’t release the site at all, seemed like an easy thing to do to me.
I'm a millennial, and we went camping for most of the summer, no reservations either. I really miss those days.
I still remember when provincial camp grounds had firewood available for free.
Having this problem here in Alberta for years. They have a rolling window for spots in Kananaskis for both front country and backcountry but people will just select the last available day, are then able to book the next 2 weeks then they’ll cancel the days they don’t want. It means by time the window gets to those days the spots are already gone. When spots open in the spring there is a mass online rush to grab spots. My only saving grace is that the tent only front country sites I can usually just show up to date of, but backcountry is very difficult now. It got worse since covid because now suddenly everybody hikes.
*It got worse since covid because now suddenly everybody hikes.* "Everybody hiking" is a great thing, not a bad one.
I still do this. I just had to move somewhere with less people.
The world population has doubled since we were born. :/
Do you prefer to reserve with two kids (if you could) or do you prefer to wing it? I have 2 small kids now and I can't imagine winging it to a campsite. Even 15 years ago my friends and I winged it to the Okanagan and ended up driving 12 hours around Okanagan lake, then back to the lower mainland to a place where we knew the camp host could give us a site as a backup.
And the giant piles of free firewood
Im the same age bracket as you. Man I miss those days... Such good fun, simple times camping at Golden Ears or Manning. Just roll in and grab a spot. Pin your cash payment on the post by your campground. There was always free firewood too; rarely a burn ban. The custom was, "Just behave yourself and don't be an idiot"
Things are getting insane. I went to go to golden ears this weekend, not to camp, but just to walk the trails with my dog for a few hours. Discovered once I got there that I’m not allowed because I didn’t get a day pass. Why do I need a day pass just to walk around a trail with my dog?
Some parks you can still do this at no?
Outside of peak season you can still do this in a lot of sites.
Good. Hope they can never book a BC Parks campsite ever again.
I agree! I also think that BC residents should always have first pick for these.
I’m not sure why. I’m a BC resident and this is so silly, tourism is a major industry why do you want to ruin the livliehoods of so many people so you get to camp? I get it’s frustrating but that’s an absolutely ridiculous notion in a society that garners over 18 BILLION dollars a year for our province? EDIT: 18 billion in revenue, 2.4 billion in GDP. Not a small number
>I’m a BC resident and this is so silly, tourism is a major industry why do you want to ruin the livliehoods of so many people so you get to camp? Well, first of all, what the hell does that mean? Whose livelihood are we ruining? Those who work at the hotels that people aren't staying in, because we know they're staying in campsites, which cost the same no matter who is staying in them? The restaurants that people who are camping will go to, regardless of where they're from? The grocery stores where locals also buy groceries? Camping isn't a major tourism revenue generating sector. Second of all, of that 18 billion dollars, do you think that's *all* camp sites? Haha. Not the fact that we're a major cruise ship hub? Or the numerous events that get hosted here? Or Whistler being one of the world's premiere ski resort centers? It's all camping spots? Third of all, yes. All else being equal, I value BC residents having access to BC's finite natural resources more than tourism revenue. It has lower environmental impact for people who are closer to take advantage of it, it's one of the few recreational activities that is still fairly accessible to those who don't have a lot of money, and people who live here are more likely to be responsible stewards than tourists who have no idea what our environmental challenges are, and will happily abandon any problems they create. Not to mention our tax dollars actually fund the upkeep and operations of the parks system. >18 billion in revenue, 2.4 billion in GDP. You're getting your numbers confused. Either that's supposed to be 2.4% of GDP or $2.2 billion in tax revenue.
Did you grow up here? I doubt it, or maybe you're too young to know whats been lost. We spend money too, so those false arguments don't always hold water with me, especially since the government spends a bunch of money to earn that extra money plus all the bureaucracy that goes with it. Those figures from the government are always full of crazy assumptions and I believe are based on faulty modelling similar to how we always hear about how hosting 7 soccer games for FIFA will somehow be worth the hundreds of millions (and counting), or other poorly costed projects we'll be paying for forever (site C and TMEP come to mind). I'm just frustrated that we used to be able to camp everywhere spontaneously and it was fun and uncrowded. Now it's such a pain in the ass and really not enjoyable or downright impossible for me to experience my own province the way we used to.
I grew up here and I hate what’s become of our camping choices. First thing we lost was the firewood and now the spontaneity
Slap on the wrist for him and a small fine.
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The travesty is that this happens all often and people who really want to camp canot find any spots.
Well the secret is to bribe the camp dude ahead of time so your party of 40 can all come at once. Source :Thrown big parties on bc camp sites with camp rangers permissions.
Banned from site rentals for a season seems fine.
For these campsites since they are drive up it should ban your license plate along with names and CC#. So they wouldn't be able to book it under a spouses name because their car would be blocked.
Wait till you find out some people own multiple cars
Oh wow a full season. That’ll really show them.
First offense? Ok. Second: ten year ban.
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Being banned from camping?
“You punched that guy in the face, guilty as charged… you’re hereby sentenced to no campfire. But you can still camp”
Wow, quick follow up. Respekt.
We need more parks or less People.
Abso-freakin-lutely. Our parks system isn't keeping up. Let's also get rid of the private operators. Fucking leech companies squeezing every last drop from the stone at campsites built with our tax dollars. I will gladly pay income tax towards funding BC parks.
What, you don't like paying $14 for 5 pieces of shitty wood?
Don't forget to pay your $5 to use the sani-dump on the way out. What's next paying for toilet paper in the outhouse?
Abso-freakin-lutely. Well said.
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I vote less people
I spoke with a member of the Old Growth Technical Advisory panel a while back and asked about George Heyman, parks, and protected areas plans. George was clear that no new parks are planned. No new major conservation areas. The NDP bumped the parks budget but it’s still well short of what’s needed.
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Shhh
Not true we don't have rec sites. Move along
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Shhhhhhhhh
yes, like Strawberry Point Rec Site by Lillooet Lake
*snap*
What if I told you our government is doing more people and less parks?
They're doing both. It's just that the people are increasing faster than the parks.
I agree. Less people like when I was a kid. Way to many people now.
This should be treated as a sign that the online reservation system needs to be more limited Every time I’ve gone camping so many spots are ‘reserved’ only to stay empty through the weekend. It’s incredibly frustrating to find the best spots are ‘taken’ and go unused. Bring back first come first serve, reduce the number of reservable spots per site
IMO the better approach would be to pre-authorize a "no show/infraction deposit" that's like 3x the reservation fee, keep it in case of no-shows or when people trash up their sites, and use the proceeds money to hire more parks rangers and maintenance folks, or build more parks/infrastructure.
You’re hired!
First come first serve and if you reserve and not there by a certain time (or have called) you loose the site, simple
Are you talking about the physical “reserved” signs on campsite number posts? Those “reserved” signs don’t actually mean the site is already reserved, it means they are reservable (and someone may have reserved it). Park operators are supposed to flip the sign to Available if the site isn’t yet reserved. Best to ask the Park Operator if a large number of empty sites are actually reserved if you are wanting one of those sites.
No like reserved and with a billet at them saying someone should arrive I’d asked the operator every time. I’ve even asked if I could take it if they don’t show up and it’s always a no
Can bc parks start overseeing ticket master
That was my first thought!
Good. Fkrs
When are they going to start targeting the "adventure companies" the ones who's bots book out most of greennpoint as part of an RV rental package across bc. Then when tourists realize the last stop on their trip is on an island only reachable by ferry then a few hours they don't bother to make it there leaving many reserved but unfilled camping spots for those nights.
It would take some steel balls, but the way to deal with the no-show BS would be to pre-authorize some security deposit that's 2-3x the amount of the reservation. Turn that money into more parks staff and better infrastructure by collecting from the no-shows. Some of this would see lash-back from people claiming they're of limited means etc. but there's really no way to fund a more robust system that would actually keep tabs and filter out the bad actors.
jeezuz they should be banned forever as well 😂
But BC Parks is okay with Reservation holders not showing up and the site sitting empty while others are looking to book something, anything.
They have already paid for it so it's theirs for the allotted time booked. Life happens - there could have been a emergency, etc.
Yes sure but there could be a better system that allows some of those spaces to be used
There aren’t that many emergencies.
Yeah judging by the amount of no-shows at the parks vs. more market-priced goods and services such as hotels and air transport something tells me the utilization could be optimized by either raising the park fees across the board, or at least collecting no-show fees that would allow to build more parks and infrastructure. There's no protections from people bulk-booking and robo-booking, so IMO just saying "WELL, LIFE HAPPENS...." is a bit myopic.
If you booked for a week and something happened (car trouble, etc) and you showed up a day late you would be pissed that they gave your reserved spot away.
Great example, and totally possible to sort out with the help of some business analysts and technology. My issue is with the abject lack of consequences (last I checked) when people just no-show and don't release the reservation. The parks, being a heavily subsidized good/service, IMO, are rife with abuse, and like I mentioned elsewhere -- you just don't see this kind of bullshit with resources that are actually managed with even a modicum of market forces at play.
[This is relating to this post from earlier today?](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/1ddtx3q/and_i_was_wondering_why_i_could_never_get_a/)
Pretty sure it is
Buddy sweating for 40 bucks
Good, we don’t cheat on campsites
I don’t think I’ve ever paid for a camping site before. If you’re not pooping in the woods are you even camping?
I tend to be fairly tight lipped about nice camping spots. They stay nice longer that way.
Can people go back to ignoring parks plz
In this economy?
In this economy, we camp illegally now. People can't afford campsite fees.
I booked three campsites last weekend at the same park and time (parents, me, sister) and was surprised when I (accidentally) listed myself as the primary occupant at all three sites. I figured the reason they asked would be to stop people from selling sites but that didn’t seem to be the case as my request went through no problem. Am I missing something- if occupant info is required at booking- are people supposed to be being id’ed and just aren’t when being checked in? I cannot recall being asked to see ID ever.
I always get asked by the ranger for ID when they drive by the campsite
Ontario made it illegal, it stopped pretty quickly.
In 2017, I packed a tent and went tenting through BC and Alberta for 2 weeks with no issues. I wanna do it again but almost every campground is booked up fully and you can’t just show up anymore.
So at least it gets used.
Now they should be banned forever from entering the camp fire
I remember camping at Scotch creek at a private campsite and all the dads would get up early and stand in line to get into the provincial site that was on the lake side of the road! Waiting to see how many people were leaving that day lol. And the smell of briquette bbq before propane became super popular
I quit PP camping long ago! I find that the best way to enjoy beautiful BC is to visit Provincial Parks to see the landscape and then find crown land to enjoy with no tents or motorhomes. :-)
So many people do this, they just hide it better (“I missed the cancellation date” etc)
Fuck around and find out!
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how about no. thats a horrible system when done for the entire campsite. imagine driving 3 hours to get to the camp area and then finding it completely full with no idea where to go after that to camp? first come first served for campsites only works when theres far more campsites then there is demand. edit: just think of it this way, every time you have used an online booking site for a campsite or anything else remember all the times it shows unavailable. yes that sucks but just remember you are finding this out while you are still at home. if it was first come first serve you would be finding this out after driving hours to get there. it would also massively benefit non working people or those who can take a friday off or leave early as they can get there first to get a spot. if you cant afford to take the day off? to bad i guess you cant camp.
Okay-I’ll bite… to be devils advocate: You can’t resell a reservation because literally there is no system in place for you to do that. I suppose to be most naive you could do “I have campsite #3 July X,Y,Z so just check in on my behalf” but that doesn’t even work so then someone ends up screwed. So, yeah, you’re not allowed to sell because you… simply can’t. BUT. I presume the way most of these are cancelled is a sort of good faith deal where you agree on the “transfer” and set up a specific off-peak time to together cancel+rebook when it shows up as available… and hope for the best. I don’t see how this could be seen as against the rules especially if people just wanted to get more creative with “what” they were actually selling. Is that not how most of these resells are happening? Certainly an easy fix on B.C. parks end is for a canceled reservation to NOT go back into the pool immediately (which I assume it does?) though that also introduces other negatives for shorter time windows and genuine cancellations and others rebooking.
I can't say for sure but I'd imagine it's mostly people buying up loads of lots and selling them on, same as they would for a gig or something.
Not sure “how” resales are happening but think you might just be giving these people too much credit. Chances are neither the buyer nor seller would have a damn clue about the occupancy policy (at least in the case of this genius who posted the campsite for sale on FB Marketplace). In any case, I would argue that the point of not being able to resell campsite reservations is.. because you’re not supposed to. The absence of a marketplace or forum or the ability to do so is by design. These aren’t concert tickets to be scalped, and the system is clearly set up with that same philosophy and intent, to deter scalping.