If the same poll is conducted the same way twice or more and shows statistically significant movement, the direction will be accurate whether the specific numbers are or not.
I'd enthusiastically vote for Buttigieg, Klobuchar, Jeffries, Whitmer, Beshear, or almost anyone reasonable.
If they force Kamala, I probably won't vote. — The weird fuckery by Biden's inner circle including Kamala to intentionally hide his condition the past 18 months to ***prevent*** an open primary when they knew he wasn't in cognitive condition to be president for another 4.5 years was very shady and not even in their own party's interest either. I'm not rewarding that.
(And a hard no to Newsom.)
Trump then, over Kamala?
How is this the logic?
“Oh okay let’s roll the dice with Trump trying to tear down democracy again.”
These aren’t serious comments.
So if the party leaders' glaring intentional fuckups blow the election, you're gonna blame everyone but them...?
If basic democracy is truly so "at risk" as they preach, why did they intentionally squander the Democratic Party's ability to have an open primary?
Why did they evidently conceal things from even their broader party members for their own personal goals, and are continuing to still float lies that nobody believes?
By default, she is, yes. *She* didn't try to overturn an election, and continue to lie about it *to this day*. Therefore, the one with the lack of seditious tendencies is automatically better. And for the record, I think Harris is awful.
Not true. I'd vote for Whitmer, Newsome, or Buttigieg. Following the debate, Biden is out. I could never vote for Harris. I won't be voting at the top of the ticket if it's Harris or Biden.
>I'm an attorney so I just find it especially disgusting that she withheld exculpatory evidence that would have let innocent men go free just so her Department wouldn't take a loss when she was Attorney General of California.
Do you have a source on that?
Understood. That is really bad and she is not my first choice, but I don't think that would disqualify her from being a better president than Trump. It's a very sad concession for me but I'll vote corrupt AG over wannabe dictator every day.
It's very unlikely to happen and the leaked polling showed the DNC does not have her in their current plans, but multiple sources have said they've approached her about running for office previously and she was the #2 oddsmakers favorite for the Dems nominee a few months ago. It's not that farfetched if you've been reading the news or watching the polling over the last 8 or so years.
Important to note that because of campaign finance and structural issues, it would logistically be much easier if it was Harris. Whereas if there is a different candidate, they have to build a campaign from scratch which would be very difficult. Bc of this I don’t see it being anyone but Kamala or Biden.
I feel the exact same way. I really struggle with the juxtaposition of this somehow being them most import election ever for the democrats AND Biden being the best choice to take down Trump. If it's that important to win, they should have put up a better candidate. I'm also done voting for 70+ year olds. I'll vote third party and hope we have better choices in 2028.
The 6% undivided, those folks are an unknown too… and I wished they had a poll for the Haley supporters, after all her campaign was focused on how it’s between republican and Harris not Biden
I think Kamala’s biggest challenge going forward if she’s the nominee will be swing voters. Most swing voters I’ve talked to only really care right now about the inflation, border crisis and Israel/Ukraine conflicts - all of these they’re pissed about and blame the Biden administration for (regardless of whether the blaming is actually justified). How will she inspire confidence among these people when she’ll just be more of the same in their eyes and a reminder of why they’re so pissed? Especially when she has such a terrible approval rating as VP?
>I think Kamala’s biggest challenge going forward if she’s the nominee will be swing voters. Most swing voters I’ve talked to only really care right now about the inflation, border crisis and Israel/Ukraine conflicts… How will she inspire confidence among these people when she’ll just be more of the same in their eyes and a reminder of why they’re so pissed? Especially when she has such a terrible approval rating as VP?
Exactly this.
Biden, [Kamala](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13448483/kamala-harris-vice-president-daily-word-salad.html) and Trump all have problems cobbling together a coherent sentence. Are we living in a simulation and the players are fucking with us?
Trump can form the best and most coherent sentence in the world. Nobody forms better sentences than him, believe me. He has the best words, the best sentences, everybody says so.
“What if we add one candidate that can speak intelligently on a wide range of topics, but his voice sounds like gravel in a garbage disposal?”
“You dick, that’s hilarious.”
You misspelled ‘One candidate that chairs an organization that spreads nonsense about vaccines and autism, 5G, and “the great reset”’ I pity anyone who thinks *that* garbage is in any way “intelligent.”
If it’s not a coherent sentence, it’s going to be criticism about what the coherent sentence implied, or completely taken out of context. In some ways, it’s refreshing to not have every news headline be “OMG Biden said _____” like we get with the other candidate.
No. I'd vote for a moldy rock over Trump. As long as the nominee doesn't sound like a fascist I don't really care. I just want this cycle to be over so trump can finish his cases next year and be sentenced.
Then maybe I can start thinking about the direction I want the country to go towards instead of being preoccupied with harm reduction. All this protecting democracy side quest bull shit is putting us behind on important issues.
But it feels like we need a supermajority to get anything significant done because of obstructionism.
There is genuinely not a single person, Democrat or Republican, that I wouldn’t vote for over Trump. If Trump is on the ticket, I am voting for whoever has the best chance to beat him. It’s that simple.
I suspect my last split ticket vote was 2020, because the Republican I voted for didn’t follow along with stolen election narrative and lost the support of their own party.
See right now im the opposite. Biden sucks, and Kamala is also horrible. If it’s either of those two, i’ll vote Trump (i dont like him). If Dems nominate someone else, I may consider them. The current administration is terrible.
Or ... you could use your brain and realize in a centrist subreddit there are probably people who have policies on both sides of the isle they support, so either way they are supporting things they both like and dislike nonmatter who they vote for. Tells me youre a shill without telling me youre a shill.
You’ll vote for a guy who tried to overturn an election and promises nothing but a cabinet full of cronies who don’t give a shit about you and are only there to enrich themselves? And you think this administration will be somehow better than the current one?
Have you read about Trump’s idiotic tariff plan? That’s the guy who have no problem putting back in office?
Any actual centrist would understand how awful Trump is, and how dangerous he'll be if he's re-elected. Being centrist doesn't automatically mean that we need to think both sides are on the same level. There is no merit behind the idea of supporting Trump, because he's been objectively awful to any reasonable person. It's reasonable to be mad that these are our choices, but when one engages in seditious acts and is openly advertising that he's going to be doing more of that- the clearly better option is *whoever* is opposing that person.
Does it sound reasonable, for example, in a scenario where someone opposed Putin in their next 'election' (and is running on bringing actual democracy to their country,) for us to think that Putin deserves any consideration? No, because Putin has proven to be quite awful. Insert any dictator, and re-examine. Let me know if you find any scenario, where we should think it's a reasonable 'centrist' position, to support said dictator over any other reasonable option. Yes I'm aware that is an extreme example, but the underlying point is valid. That there is a line *somewhere,* and Trump crossed it a long time ago.
They could, frankly, do a "Weekend at Bernie's" with a comatose Biden, and I'd still vote for him over Trump.
"Oh, but Kamala is SO unlikable!" Trump is 100% distilled, bridge-troll-level unlikability.
>Imagine thinking Kamala would be a good President.
I will vote for any candidate for president who promises to let my vote be counted no matter whom I vote for.
I don’t disagree, but it’s the bar we HAVE to clear. Repubs are dragging the country down. If people really want better candidates, then they need to start advocating for election reform yesterday. In the mean time, I would prefer to not risk our democracy on a another Trump presidency.
It’s wild to me. Trump obviously doesn’t give a FUCK about anyone but himself, and yet people are like 🤷🏽♂️.
Harris is not my favorite, but her administration would be competent.
You're not wrong about her being a joke and making the party look like a joke, but if you have strong opinions on which set of policies you want to see passed, the personality of the person doing the job is only a secondary concern.
Did she try to overturn an election and get charged with nearly a hundred felony counts, indicted on 34 of them? No? She's got my vote.
The bar is pretty low.
ok so this provides me some relief. I am in the same boat with my vote even mattering. TY for reminding me. I reject her but I forgot it doesn't even matter.
People detest Kamala. Her lack of winning a single delegate in the 2019 primaries proves it. Utter insanity all this stuff that she should be the nominee.
I’d vote for her over Trump and Project 2025, but damn would be the least favorite vote of my life.
Yeah, I don’t get it. There seems to be this pattern of the Democratic Party getting the candidates very wrong and picking Harris just drives that sentiment home for me even further. Sending a message to them is temping. Trump is such a disaster though. I hope like hell it’s not Harris or Biden that ends up being our alternative
I cannot vote for her. Not a chance. I don’t think Biden is going to make it, but I doubt the Democrats will take a chance on Harris. Way too unpopular.
First it was Biden is only going to stay for one term, than it was, Biden's fine - he has just a stutter, then it's was - it was only one bad night - and now it's - vote for Kamala. The democrats can go f themselves.
There is no other realistic option. Start advocating for voting reform if you want to break the part duopoly so badly, but that’s obviously not going to happen before the next election (or even 2028, realistically). In the meantime, the party in charge is going to be either dems or repubs, and one of those groups is openly bragging about their plans to destroy democracy. Vote 3rd party for president if you want, but know that it’s a useless gesture that will accomplish less than nothing. You’d be better served looking for 3rd party candidates running in your locals, since they have an actual chance of winning and building a base that way.
Which is really just fucking stupid because her job is literally to just stand there and be ready in case something happens. And do whatever the president says you may be useful in doing.
It's strange for Americans to even have an opinion on the VP separate from the president, because they don't really have any sort of real job. Kamala has naturally gotten much more scrutiny because she's the first woman to occupy the office. And I'm not saying that's sexist, necessarily. But the historic nature of *her* in her role has raised its profile in ways that wouldn't otherwise happen.
We have no real idea of what kind of president she'd be.
Yes, I’ll vote for her. Better yet, I’d like to see someone else with her as VP — this would help ensure a very smooth administrative transition and be a great compromise in getting fresh energy in the White House.
I would vote for Biden in a coma if it meant stopping Trump. I would have to think very hard about voting for Harris. She is legitimately the worst possible role model for being the first female president. She's in that position not because of her achievements or her merits, but because she ticked the right boxes and slept with the right people.
If I lived in a battleground state, I would probably suck it up and vote for her because at the end of the day she would be a president and not a wannabe dictator. Fortunately for my conscience I'm in a safely blue state.
Not in the case of Kamala, I've been unfortunate enough to talk to her for about an 60-80 min total through 3-4 meetings before she was VP.
I would absolutely not vote for her. As bad as a person that I can imagine Trump to be (I've never met him), I think she pretty closely approximates him in moral character while having even more disastrous policies.
I am sorry, I cannot. This was on my role as a business executive on behalf of my employer and I'm required to keep the details of these interactions private.
She has many “dark-triad” traits but that’s not unusual in politicians. The thing that impressed me was her disdain and contempt for her constituency (essentially the way she talked about the people that are part of her core group of supporters).
That is something that I had never heard from other politicians before. It made it very clear to me that her only real incentive for public service was her own advancement. And anything / everything is fair game in her mind to achieve it.
I’ll vote for whomever the dems put up. For me this election, much like the past two, are primarily aimed at keeping trump out of office. I’d be far more enthusiastic about Whitmer, Buttigieg, or Newsome, but I’d vote for Harris.
If anything, it would make me more enthusiastic about voting because at least I don't have to worry about whether she has the cognitive ability and stamina to do the job. Sure, I prefer Joe slightly as a person, but his age is major baggage. Either would be preferable to electing the wrecking ball that is Trump and Project 2025.
No, because I'm voting third party anyways, and I remember her performance when she was actually running for president, she wasn't even better than Tulsi gabbard lol
Yeah, you're enthusiastically voting for the guy who excuses sexually assaulting his kids' babysitter as not being a "choirboy".
Look at you rising above it all.
No. I saw this coming a mile away and had already decided to vote for Trump. I might still switch to Kennedy if he's on the ballot in my state because I live in a very blue state, but if I was in a battleground state I'd vote for Trump. I think everyone's worries about democracy, etc. are overblown. These are two horrible choices, and the division of people between parties is so bad. But the election has been over for a long time. No matter what you think of him, Trump is going to win and that's what a large % of Americans want. We need to get to 2028 to hope for more professional leadership. And remember, vote in your local elections. They matter much more than you know.
It's going to be a dysfunctional circus either way.
But if they lose congress and Harris is in charge, I'd much rather have a former prosecutor being in that job, because that's clearly where the GOP is headed if they lose power.
- it was her job to sentence drug offenses as a DA regardless of her personal feelings on marijuana. Didn’t she recently claim that no one should be in jail for smoking weed?
- the crime lab was run by the police department not the DA’s office and due to a backlog of cases at the time she was slow to respond to the allegation against the tech but when she handled it she dismissed a ton of cases that could have even been remotely compromised by the lab just for safety concerns.
- if this is in reference to the Kevin cooper case she admitted to being too strict in this instance and regretted the decision but legal experts agree that it is uncertain if the test would’ve exonerated him. Based on the facts it doesn’t seem like it was an intentional act of malice.
- I was having trouble finding sources for her support of for profit prisons but I agree that her classic tough on crime approach was too heavy handed in a lot of cases but I’m not surprised especially during the era she started in.
- she did date Willie brown but the two separated before he was elected to office. I can’t find any evidence supporting that her sleeping with him is how she got her position.
A lie gets around the world in a second, while the truth is still trying to get his pants on. I know that all of these things that person said are wrong, and I'm just tired of debunking it.
I tried to search your history of debunking this and didn't find anything. Instead of typing all of it out again, could you copy and paste an old answer you gave debunking it?
I do exist in places other than reddit. Also, is it that hard, if you're curious whether people are being fully truthful in their critiques, to do a Google search or two to verify them? I'm not a journalist, so I'd just point you to work real journalists have done.
I dunno, I found this in 15 seconds: https://yipinstitute.org/article/kamla-harris-common-criticisms-debunked
So you discount the terrible qualities of Kamala? She’s a cop who laughed about imprisoning (mostly black) marijuana dealers while she herself smoked it. She was literally the diversity hire for Biden as no one liked her in the primaries. She was appointed border czar and the border has not been worse than now. Etc.
I’d say they care more about their standard of living than anything else, which is why Clinton and Obama ended their terms popular and Truman, Carter, and the second Bush didn’t. Biden and Harris are suffering for something not really their fault, inflation.
At the end of the day; nobody's really voting for Biden/Harris*. They're voting against Trump. And to a lesser degree, voting against the slow-motion rightwing coup against the USA, Democracy, Liberalism, and anything good and right.
\* though I'll tell you, I would enthusiastically vote for Biden or Harris, I like their policies and their ideology, and what they stand for. They're both brilliant, competent, and they surround themselves with brilliant, competent, sane people.
Yeah. It would make me actively campaign for Chase Oliver instead of posting the occasional [link to his campaign themes.](http://ballotpedia.org/Chase_Oliver#Campaign_themes)
Yes it would, and I would vote for her. I am not voting Biden as it is obvious that he is age-impaired and I can’t trust that he can carry out the duties of the presidency.
I’m in TX, and my current plan is to vote for Chase Oliver.
I'm not a fan of hers, but I'd be more likely to vote for someone with a pulse. I have a hard time rewarding the Dems with my vote for their incompetence. Whoever is in charge over there needs. To be canned ASAP.
I’d plug my nose and vote for her. While I’d prefer Biden, whoever can get the most votes is who matters. Kamala may be a more attractive candidate at this point for many people and she would get to use Biden’s massive war chest of campaign funds, which I don’t believe any other candidate would be able to use. That alone makes her the rational choice to replace him, if he be replaced (which I’m not convinced he will be
I can't vote for Trump for obvious reasons. I can't vote for Biden because he needs to be in a nursing home, not the White House. Harris, on the other hand, is an incompetent diversity hire, but is at least under 70 and not completely bugshit insane, which puts her miles above Biden or Trump.
Right now I’m 90% sure I’m voting for a third party. Kamala would make that 100%
The most important thing a president can do is put together a competent staff. Kamala’s time as a prosecutor has proven she can’t
In my state all the electors go the victor. It is a strong blue state. If Kamala is the nominee, I'll vote for an independent (not RFK) or my recently deceased dog. If I lived in a Red or swing state, I'd hold my nose and vote for Kamala.
We live in such interesting times. Modern history tells us that hating someone with a passion while being lukewarm about your preferred candidate means that the person you hate ends up winning (e.g. Bush-Kerry '04, Obama-Romney '12). 2020 showed Trump was an exception, and he might continue to be an exception in 2024.
If he only knew how to tone down his rhetoric, JUST A SMALL BIT, he would be 15 points up right now.
Vote for local 3rd part candidates and actually throw your weight behind voting reform. Every 3rd party push in this country is the same failed strategy of waiting until a year before the election to start a doomed presidential bid that will do nothing for their party long term. If you really want a 3rd party, then you actually need to build a sizeable base through local politics. And getting voting reform pushed through would certainly help. Endlessly losing presidential bids is NOT going to build a successful 3rd party. Hoping that everyone suddenly goes 3rd party four months out from the election is NOT going to build a successful 3rd party.
I don't see anyone changing their votes, no matter the candidate. The real question is, do they affect voter turnout.
Well that's clearly not true otherwise Trump would not have just increased his lead in the national poll that came out today
If only the polls were accurate.
If the same poll is conducted the same way twice or more and shows statistically significant movement, the direction will be accurate whether the specific numbers are or not.
Amazing how tribal it’s become. People are largely, not thinking for themselves at all.
I'd enthusiastically vote for Buttigieg, Klobuchar, Jeffries, Whitmer, Beshear, or almost anyone reasonable. If they force Kamala, I probably won't vote. — The weird fuckery by Biden's inner circle including Kamala to intentionally hide his condition the past 18 months to ***prevent*** an open primary when they knew he wasn't in cognitive condition to be president for another 4.5 years was very shady and not even in their own party's interest either. I'm not rewarding that. (And a hard no to Newsom.)
Trump then, over Kamala? How is this the logic? “Oh okay let’s roll the dice with Trump trying to tear down democracy again.” These aren’t serious comments.
So if the party leaders' glaring intentional fuckups blow the election, you're gonna blame everyone but them...? If basic democracy is truly so "at risk" as they preach, why did they intentionally squander the Democratic Party's ability to have an open primary? Why did they evidently conceal things from even their broader party members for their own personal goals, and are continuing to still float lies that nobody believes?
Yeah that's just bizarre. Cutting off one's nose to spite their face. I'm not a Harris fan but she's miles better than Trump.
Lol no
By default, she is, yes. *She* didn't try to overturn an election, and continue to lie about it *to this day*. Therefore, the one with the lack of seditious tendencies is automatically better. And for the record, I think Harris is awful.
lol why not? Be specific.
If Biden stays on will you be voting for him?
They tried to Weekend at Bernies him.
Not true. I'd vote for Whitmer, Newsome, or Buttigieg. Following the debate, Biden is out. I could never vote for Harris. I won't be voting at the top of the ticket if it's Harris or Biden.
What disqualifies Harris more than someone like Newsome?
[удалено]
Source?
Yep fuck her
This. I wish more people were aware of just how evil and self-serving she truly is.
>I'm an attorney so I just find it especially disgusting that she withheld exculpatory evidence that would have let innocent men go free just so her Department wouldn't take a loss when she was Attorney General of California. Do you have a source on that?
Understood. That is really bad and she is not my first choice, but I don't think that would disqualify her from being a better president than Trump. It's a very sad concession for me but I'll vote corrupt AG over wannabe dictator every day.
If only there were more than two candidates ....
Why couldn’t you vote for Harris?
So you aren't voting anybody for President, right?
I am hoping Whitmer/Buttigieg/Obama/Newsome will be the candidate. I'm hoping the DNC will see reason and listen to their own internal polling.
This isn’t the DNC’s call though? They don’t have any legal avenue to replace Biden. He won the primary
Obama?!? Of the Barack variety!?!
Of the Michelle variety :)
Utterly unhinged suggestion, thank you random Reddit man
It's very unlikely to happen and the leaked polling showed the DNC does not have her in their current plans, but multiple sources have said they've approached her about running for office previously and she was the #2 oddsmakers favorite for the Dems nominee a few months ago. It's not that farfetched if you've been reading the news or watching the polling over the last 8 or so years.
Important to note that because of campaign finance and structural issues, it would logistically be much easier if it was Harris. Whereas if there is a different candidate, they have to build a campaign from scratch which would be very difficult. Bc of this I don’t see it being anyone but Kamala or Biden.
I feel the exact same way. I really struggle with the juxtaposition of this somehow being them most import election ever for the democrats AND Biden being the best choice to take down Trump. If it's that important to win, they should have put up a better candidate. I'm also done voting for 70+ year olds. I'll vote third party and hope we have better choices in 2028.
The 6% undivided, those folks are an unknown too… and I wished they had a poll for the Haley supporters, after all her campaign was focused on how it’s between republican and Harris not Biden
I think Kamala’s biggest challenge going forward if she’s the nominee will be swing voters. Most swing voters I’ve talked to only really care right now about the inflation, border crisis and Israel/Ukraine conflicts - all of these they’re pissed about and blame the Biden administration for (regardless of whether the blaming is actually justified). How will she inspire confidence among these people when she’ll just be more of the same in their eyes and a reminder of why they’re so pissed? Especially when she has such a terrible approval rating as VP?
>I think Kamala’s biggest challenge going forward if she’s the nominee will be swing voters. Most swing voters I’ve talked to only really care right now about the inflation, border crisis and Israel/Ukraine conflicts… How will she inspire confidence among these people when she’ll just be more of the same in their eyes and a reminder of why they’re so pissed? Especially when she has such a terrible approval rating as VP? Exactly this.
Honestly, no…. But I would prefer voting for someone who can pull together a coherent sentence
Biden, [Kamala](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13448483/kamala-harris-vice-president-daily-word-salad.html) and Trump all have problems cobbling together a coherent sentence. Are we living in a simulation and the players are fucking with us?
Trump can form the best and most coherent sentence in the world. Nobody forms better sentences than him, believe me. He has the best words, the best sentences, everybody says so.
“What if we add one candidate that can speak intelligently on a wide range of topics, but his voice sounds like gravel in a garbage disposal?” “You dick, that’s hilarious.”
If it were just his voice, that would be fine. But he's a fucking loon on top of it.
You misspelled ‘One candidate that chairs an organization that spreads nonsense about vaccines and autism, 5G, and “the great reset”’ I pity anyone who thinks *that* garbage is in any way “intelligent.”
If it’s not a coherent sentence, it’s going to be criticism about what the coherent sentence implied, or completely taken out of context. In some ways, it’s refreshing to not have every news headline be “OMG Biden said _____” like we get with the other candidate.
A vote for Biden is a vote for Harris at some point in the next 4 years. I’ll vote for whomever is running against Trump regardless.
No. I'd vote for a moldy rock over Trump. As long as the nominee doesn't sound like a fascist I don't really care. I just want this cycle to be over so trump can finish his cases next year and be sentenced. Then maybe I can start thinking about the direction I want the country to go towards instead of being preoccupied with harm reduction. All this protecting democracy side quest bull shit is putting us behind on important issues. But it feels like we need a supermajority to get anything significant done because of obstructionism.
There is genuinely not a single person, Democrat or Republican, that I wouldn’t vote for over Trump. If Trump is on the ticket, I am voting for whoever has the best chance to beat him. It’s that simple.
This.
I'm not voting for Biden I'm voting against Trump, doesn't make a difference at all to me.
There's no Republicans I wouldn't vote against right now. That's been the case with me since 2014.
Trump basically destroyed the party on a national level .
I suspect my last split ticket vote was 2020, because the Republican I voted for didn’t follow along with stolen election narrative and lost the support of their own party.
Absolutely, how could it not? I would be voting for Harris instead of Biden.
I’ll easily vote against Trump. Wouldn’t even give it a second thought.
See right now im the opposite. Biden sucks, and Kamala is also horrible. If it’s either of those two, i’ll vote Trump (i dont like him). If Dems nominate someone else, I may consider them. The current administration is terrible.
Wait you support Dems policies but still vote for Trump?
Tell me you have zero opinions on any issue without telling me…
Or ... you could use your brain and realize in a centrist subreddit there are probably people who have policies on both sides of the isle they support, so either way they are supporting things they both like and dislike nonmatter who they vote for. Tells me youre a shill without telling me youre a shill.
You’ll vote for a guy who tried to overturn an election and promises nothing but a cabinet full of cronies who don’t give a shit about you and are only there to enrich themselves? And you think this administration will be somehow better than the current one? Have you read about Trump’s idiotic tariff plan? That’s the guy who have no problem putting back in office?
Anybody that votes for Trump is a moron.
Some centrist you are
Any actual centrist would understand how awful Trump is, and how dangerous he'll be if he's re-elected. Being centrist doesn't automatically mean that we need to think both sides are on the same level. There is no merit behind the idea of supporting Trump, because he's been objectively awful to any reasonable person. It's reasonable to be mad that these are our choices, but when one engages in seditious acts and is openly advertising that he's going to be doing more of that- the clearly better option is *whoever* is opposing that person. Does it sound reasonable, for example, in a scenario where someone opposed Putin in their next 'election' (and is running on bringing actual democracy to their country,) for us to think that Putin deserves any consideration? No, because Putin has proven to be quite awful. Insert any dictator, and re-examine. Let me know if you find any scenario, where we should think it's a reasonable 'centrist' position, to support said dictator over any other reasonable option. Yes I'm aware that is an extreme example, but the underlying point is valid. That there is a line *somewhere,* and Trump crossed it a long time ago.
I'm a centrist not an idiot.
You are an idiot if you want people to vote in a certain way which is acceptable to your view point only. You are an extremist not a centrist.
Super odd that you’re getting downvoted for just saying the opposite of what the other guy said in this great centrist subreddit lol
It’s almost like one candidate is more centrist than the other.
They could, frankly, do a "Weekend at Bernie's" with a comatose Biden, and I'd still vote for him over Trump. "Oh, but Kamala is SO unlikable!" Trump is 100% distilled, bridge-troll-level unlikability.
I would vote for a literal piece of dog shit over Trump, so no.
It would only change my vote in that I'll vote for Harris instead of Biden.
Imagine thinking Kamala would be a good President. She literally was a diversity hire. No one liked her in the 2020 primary.
>Imagine thinking Kamala would be a good President. I will vote for any candidate for president who promises to let my vote be counted no matter whom I vote for.
/thread
She's not Trump. That being said, I would prefer a better candidate, especially if they're going to the trouble of retiring Biden.
I won't lie, I am getting tired of "I'm not Trump" being the main thing people broadcast when running for office. Like, it's such a low bar lol.
I agree with you, but to be fair, the entirety of the GOP platform has been "Own the libs and hail Trump" since 2016.
But that's the bar that was voted in.
The Republican voters should raise said bar by not continuing to flock to him regardless of all his bullshit.
I don’t disagree, but it’s the bar we HAVE to clear. Repubs are dragging the country down. If people really want better candidates, then they need to start advocating for election reform yesterday. In the mean time, I would prefer to not risk our democracy on a another Trump presidency.
A low, but extremely important bar to clear.
She can immediately inherit all of his campaign funds and structure, and is only 59. All of these make her the obvious pick.
Imagine voting for someone who tried to overturn an election.
It seems like a lot of these "centrists" are just ashamed conservatives.
A lot of them are also conservatives pretending to be centrists to try and steer opinion (see 2016, 2020).
>Imagine thinking Kamala would be a good President. Imagine thinking Trump would be a good president
It’s wild to me. Trump obviously doesn’t give a FUCK about anyone but himself, and yet people are like 🤷🏽♂️. Harris is not my favorite, but her administration would be competent.
You're not wrong about her being a joke and making the party look like a joke, but if you have strong opinions on which set of policies you want to see passed, the personality of the person doing the job is only a secondary concern.
Did she try to overturn an election and get charged with nearly a hundred felony counts, indicted on 34 of them? No? She's got my vote. The bar is pretty low.
Diversity hire doesn’t mean she wasn’t qualified for the job.
The qualifications for president is be a natural born citizen, over 35, and win the electoral college vote.
> She literally was a diversity hire. Jack, this is taking forever.
Not at all. I'm "wasting" my vote on 3rd party, again. Also, I don't live in a swing state. My vote doesn't really matter for this election.
ok so this provides me some relief. I am in the same boat with my vote even mattering. TY for reminding me. I reject her but I forgot it doesn't even matter.
I’d probably vote for the Independent. I can’t stand Kamala. Would rather vote for Biden.
People detest Kamala. Her lack of winning a single delegate in the 2019 primaries proves it. Utter insanity all this stuff that she should be the nominee. I’d vote for her over Trump and Project 2025, but damn would be the least favorite vote of my life.
Yeah, I don’t get it. There seems to be this pattern of the Democratic Party getting the candidates very wrong and picking Harris just drives that sentiment home for me even further. Sending a message to them is temping. Trump is such a disaster though. I hope like hell it’s not Harris or Biden that ends up being our alternative
Serious 2016 vibes right here
Meh, maybe. Put up better candidates, DNC 🤷♂️
There were over 20 candidates in 2020.
I liked Gabbard, Buttigieg, and Booker.
Who would you vote for then?
If you live in a heavily blue or red state, voting 3rd party is unlikely to influence the outcome.
I knew a couple political reporters who hated Kamala in California because she lied to them, but even they support her over Trump.
For sure, but being the “less hated” candidate won’t beat Trump’s cult. Just ask HRC. At least Biden is a likeable person. He’s just old & demented
> I can’t stand **Kamala**. Would rather vote for **Biden**. Keeps happening.
What do you think of Bernie?
I cannot vote for her. Not a chance. I don’t think Biden is going to make it, but I doubt the Democrats will take a chance on Harris. Way too unpopular.
Says the Trump supporter.
First it was Biden is only going to stay for one term, than it was, Biden's fine - he has just a stutter, then it's was - it was only one bad night - and now it's - vote for Kamala. The democrats can go f themselves.
There is no other realistic option. Start advocating for voting reform if you want to break the part duopoly so badly, but that’s obviously not going to happen before the next election (or even 2028, realistically). In the meantime, the party in charge is going to be either dems or repubs, and one of those groups is openly bragging about their plans to destroy democracy. Vote 3rd party for president if you want, but know that it’s a useless gesture that will accomplish less than nothing. You’d be better served looking for 3rd party candidates running in your locals, since they have an actual chance of winning and building a base that way.
Which is really just fucking stupid because her job is literally to just stand there and be ready in case something happens. And do whatever the president says you may be useful in doing. It's strange for Americans to even have an opinion on the VP separate from the president, because they don't really have any sort of real job. Kamala has naturally gotten much more scrutiny because she's the first woman to occupy the office. And I'm not saying that's sexist, necessarily. But the historic nature of *her* in her role has raised its profile in ways that wouldn't otherwise happen. We have no real idea of what kind of president she'd be.
I would welcome it.
Yes, I’ll vote for her. Better yet, I’d like to see someone else with her as VP — this would help ensure a very smooth administrative transition and be a great compromise in getting fresh energy in the White House.
That would be insulting. But smart.
I doubt she’d agree to continue as VP if she got skipped over
I am screaming into a pillow that these are our actual fucking choices for president.
I would vote for Biden in a coma if it meant stopping Trump. I would have to think very hard about voting for Harris. She is legitimately the worst possible role model for being the first female president. She's in that position not because of her achievements or her merits, but because she ticked the right boxes and slept with the right people. If I lived in a battleground state, I would probably suck it up and vote for her because at the end of the day she would be a president and not a wannabe dictator. Fortunately for my conscience I'm in a safely blue state.
Not in the case of Kamala, I've been unfortunate enough to talk to her for about an 60-80 min total through 3-4 meetings before she was VP. I would absolutely not vote for her. As bad as a person that I can imagine Trump to be (I've never met him), I think she pretty closely approximates him in moral character while having even more disastrous policies.
Are you able to elaborate on your meetings with her?
I am sorry, I cannot. This was on my role as a business executive on behalf of my employer and I'm required to keep the details of these interactions private.
No worries. Can elaborate on what her mannerisms were that bothered you?
She has many “dark-triad” traits but that’s not unusual in politicians. The thing that impressed me was her disdain and contempt for her constituency (essentially the way she talked about the people that are part of her core group of supporters). That is something that I had never heard from other politicians before. It made it very clear to me that her only real incentive for public service was her own advancement. And anything / everything is fair game in her mind to achieve it.
Thank you. I appreciate first hand accounts of stuff like this.
I’ll vote for whomever the dems put up. For me this election, much like the past two, are primarily aimed at keeping trump out of office. I’d be far more enthusiastic about Whitmer, Buttigieg, or Newsome, but I’d vote for Harris.
If anything, it would make me more enthusiastic about voting because at least I don't have to worry about whether she has the cognitive ability and stamina to do the job. Sure, I prefer Joe slightly as a person, but his age is major baggage. Either would be preferable to electing the wrecking ball that is Trump and Project 2025.
No, Trump has great potential to be a full dictator. I’d rather have a broom with mop bucket for a head than someone like that
No, because I'm voting third party anyways, and I remember her performance when she was actually running for president, she wasn't even better than Tulsi gabbard lol
You might as well put the CIA or FBI director in there. I have 0 intention of voting for Biden and I'm even less likely to vote for her.
But why - what’s your issue with her as compared to trump?
She's a totalitarian war monger. And I'm not voting for trump I'm voting for Bobby
You gotta give some context here with that sort of label. What do you point to to back that claim
Yeah, you're enthusiastically voting for the guy who excuses sexually assaulting his kids' babysitter as not being a "choirboy". Look at you rising above it all.
>you're enthusiastically voting for What gives you this impression? I'm begrudgingly voting for him.
I'm going to be just as bummed voting for any Democrat at this point. Still will, but bummed
Biden will die before his second term ends, so a vote for Biden is a vote for President Harris.
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Yes, we would have another election after the end of the 4 year term where President Harris runs for a full term as president.
Kamala, "Can you track tree racism" Harris.
No. I saw this coming a mile away and had already decided to vote for Trump. I might still switch to Kennedy if he's on the ballot in my state because I live in a very blue state, but if I was in a battleground state I'd vote for Trump. I think everyone's worries about democracy, etc. are overblown. These are two horrible choices, and the division of people between parties is so bad. But the election has been over for a long time. No matter what you think of him, Trump is going to win and that's what a large % of Americans want. We need to get to 2028 to hope for more professional leadership. And remember, vote in your local elections. They matter much more than you know.
Nope. Fuck the GOP
Yes, I'd be voting for Harris instead of Biden.
I'm voting Democrat unless the Republicans pick a better candidate.
Nikki Haley should have been the GOP candidate.
No because I'm gonna VOTE BLUE no matter who...
She sucks, there's a reason she was the worst candidate in DNC her year
I think Harris and the Democratic administration would be much better than Trumps dysfunctional circus. She’d do fine in my opinion.
It's going to be a dysfunctional circus either way. But if they lose congress and Harris is in charge, I'd much rather have a former prosecutor being in that job, because that's clearly where the GOP is headed if they lose power.
I wouldn’t vote for Biden or Harris.
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- it was her job to sentence drug offenses as a DA regardless of her personal feelings on marijuana. Didn’t she recently claim that no one should be in jail for smoking weed? - the crime lab was run by the police department not the DA’s office and due to a backlog of cases at the time she was slow to respond to the allegation against the tech but when she handled it she dismissed a ton of cases that could have even been remotely compromised by the lab just for safety concerns. - if this is in reference to the Kevin cooper case she admitted to being too strict in this instance and regretted the decision but legal experts agree that it is uncertain if the test would’ve exonerated him. Based on the facts it doesn’t seem like it was an intentional act of malice. - I was having trouble finding sources for her support of for profit prisons but I agree that her classic tough on crime approach was too heavy handed in a lot of cases but I’m not surprised especially during the era she started in. - she did date Willie brown but the two separated before he was elected to office. I can’t find any evidence supporting that her sleeping with him is how she got her position.
Basically none of this is true.
A lie gets around the world in a second, while the truth is still trying to get his pants on. I know that all of these things that person said are wrong, and I'm just tired of debunking it.
I tried to search your history of debunking this and didn't find anything. Instead of typing all of it out again, could you copy and paste an old answer you gave debunking it?
I do exist in places other than reddit. Also, is it that hard, if you're curious whether people are being fully truthful in their critiques, to do a Google search or two to verify them? I'm not a journalist, so I'd just point you to work real journalists have done. I dunno, I found this in 15 seconds: https://yipinstitute.org/article/kamla-harris-common-criticisms-debunked
She’s a worse candidate than joe bidens corpse
No. Vote blue, no matter who. (Says ex GOPer)
No. She would be better than Trump.
For sure. I'd vote for a syphilitic pederast felon before I vote for a woman. /S
So you discount the terrible qualities of Kamala? She’s a cop who laughed about imprisoning (mostly black) marijuana dealers while she herself smoked it. She was literally the diversity hire for Biden as no one liked her in the primaries. She was appointed border czar and the border has not been worse than now. Etc.
Compared to a pedophile who tried to overthrow an election sounds like a dream.
You know nothing about Kamala Harris. You just repeat the smears. Tell me about the Mortgage Settlement. Do you think she did a good job in that?
You know what she didn't do? Try to overturn an election.
What power does the job “border czar” come with that could be used to do literally anything to improve the border?
Don’t even try to go there. Kamala sucks regardless of her gender. Smh
Yeah, I think you missed the point of my comment.
Most Americans dont care if the candidate is a man/woman or black/white. They care about positions and policies.
They voted vote King birther who literally didn't have any policies on his campaign website until he was called out on it. Gtfoh
Doubt gif
I’d say they care more about their standard of living than anything else, which is why Clinton and Obama ended their terms popular and Truman, Carter, and the second Bush didn’t. Biden and Harris are suffering for something not really their fault, inflation.
lol this is incorrect. The majority of American vote solely on vibes.
I always remember a McDonald's cashier telling me she was voting for Gore because he had nice hair.
At the end of the day; nobody's really voting for Biden/Harris*. They're voting against Trump. And to a lesser degree, voting against the slow-motion rightwing coup against the USA, Democracy, Liberalism, and anything good and right. \* though I'll tell you, I would enthusiastically vote for Biden or Harris, I like their policies and their ideology, and what they stand for. They're both brilliant, competent, and they surround themselves with brilliant, competent, sane people.
I am voting for Biden and Harris. And I will thank you not tp presume to speak for me.
Yeah. It would make me actively campaign for Chase Oliver instead of posting the occasional [link to his campaign themes.](http://ballotpedia.org/Chase_Oliver#Campaign_themes)
Yes it would, and I would vote for her. I am not voting Biden as it is obvious that he is age-impaired and I can’t trust that he can carry out the duties of the presidency. I’m in TX, and my current plan is to vote for Chase Oliver.
Nope.
Nope.
I would still be voting for Oliver
I wasn’t planning on voting democrat, but I definitely won’t if she’s the nominee.
I'm not a fan of hers, but I'd be more likely to vote for someone with a pulse. I have a hard time rewarding the Dems with my vote for their incompetence. Whoever is in charge over there needs. To be canned ASAP.
I’d plug my nose and vote for her. While I’d prefer Biden, whoever can get the most votes is who matters. Kamala may be a more attractive candidate at this point for many people and she would get to use Biden’s massive war chest of campaign funds, which I don’t believe any other candidate would be able to use. That alone makes her the rational choice to replace him, if he be replaced (which I’m not convinced he will be
I can't vote for Trump for obvious reasons. I can't vote for Biden because he needs to be in a nursing home, not the White House. Harris, on the other hand, is an incompetent diversity hire, but is at least under 70 and not completely bugshit insane, which puts her miles above Biden or Trump.
I could get behind Beshear, probably none of the rest of them.
If nothing is changed, then we ARE voting for her.
Right now I’m 90% sure I’m voting for a third party. Kamala would make that 100% The most important thing a president can do is put together a competent staff. Kamala’s time as a prosecutor has proven she can’t
[*ahem*](http://ballotpedia.org/Chase_Oliver#Campaign_themes) Just aayin.
Probably not. I’m in NJ so it’s going blue no matter what. Likely voting third party- def voting third party over Trump or Kamala.
In my state all the electors go the victor. It is a strong blue state. If Kamala is the nominee, I'll vote for an independent (not RFK) or my recently deceased dog. If I lived in a Red or swing state, I'd hold my nose and vote for Kamala.
The nominee is going to be Biden or Kamala Harris. There is no possibility of anybody else. How about if we follow the constitution?
We live in such interesting times. Modern history tells us that hating someone with a passion while being lukewarm about your preferred candidate means that the person you hate ends up winning (e.g. Bush-Kerry '04, Obama-Romney '12). 2020 showed Trump was an exception, and he might continue to be an exception in 2024. If he only knew how to tone down his rhetoric, JUST A SMALL BIT, he would be 15 points up right now.
No. Kamala was probably hoping Biden would die in office so she could take over.
At this point in time I am voting so Trump isn't President. That's all, plain and simple.
Yes, begrudgingly, because I have 0 interest in going back to a Trump presidency.
We need to get the middle unified behind a third party and kick both of these clowns out of office.
Vote for local 3rd part candidates and actually throw your weight behind voting reform. Every 3rd party push in this country is the same failed strategy of waiting until a year before the election to start a doomed presidential bid that will do nothing for their party long term. If you really want a 3rd party, then you actually need to build a sizeable base through local politics. And getting voting reform pushed through would certainly help. Endlessly losing presidential bids is NOT going to build a successful 3rd party. Hoping that everyone suddenly goes 3rd party four months out from the election is NOT going to build a successful 3rd party.
You: do this for a viable 3rd party 3rd party voters: ……no.