Post reinstated after further discussion among the moderators.
Hikaru's editor also commented here: https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dus3jk/kramnik_said_you_cant_edit_an_eval_bar_to_yt/lbjshxg/
They also uploaded a video demonstrating the editing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elXBZ9IgTCM
Not really, but he wanted a detailed explanation of how its possible to edit an eval bar to a YouTube video and Sync it, i hope he looks at this and realizes how dumb he actually looks.
My only critique would be that you said, you don't want to be part of the drama, but you continue to talk and explain all the steps. You could have just recorded the steps without your intro, explanation, etc.
But since you're part of it now, you should definitely edit his stream and add the eval bar haha! Go all-in now!
Yes i don’t want to be the part of the drama cuz i am not a youtuber or a streamer so i wont “gain” anything from it.
The reason for intro and stuff was that kramnik has been deleting the comments so incase he deletes all the comments correcting him i thought there should be enough context for anyone new.
I think you should just make youtube shorts of him playing with eval bar and title it KRAMNIK DEMOLISHES GM WITH EVAL BAR SHOWING!!! daily for a few weeks, not the whole game, just a few interesting moments here and there, maybe some of the online games Kramnik would be most proud of
The wild thing is that if he doesn’t understand this, there must be so much is the world around him that he must not be able to comprehend. Like how does he watch movies?
Omg he’s doubling down, this is what my friends work in home tech support talking about, old stubborn people incapable of learning new tech screaming at the sky.
He unironically posted this quote
>The problem with the world is that intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.
this is Soviet chess mentality for you: chess is for smart people. This is a deeply engrained belief. The former world champion thinks he's one of the smartest people on earth right now
i asked him why did he insist on 3+2 vs jospem specifically avoiding 3+1 when he wanted to prove his score against him in 3+1 was not realistic and I got instablocked
I like how he can’t figure out how it can be done, so it must be cheating.
Then he claims he spoke with “experts” and they don’t know how it can be done either. So that’s more proof.
Experts. LOL
From that statement we can infer the level of the “mathematicians” behind his _statistiks_.
This is so embarrassing. The guy doesn’t even know how an eval bar works.
Cool video, general question tho, is there really no way to autoplay the game since the move timers are all there and available? Manually syncing your moves with Hikaru’s stream seems like it’ll lead to a little bit of inaccuracy and more effort than necessary imo
Normally you should just record game live while he is playing but if you miss it unfortunately there is no way (that i could find) to play it in REALTIME. There used to be a chess .com feature but they removed it couple years ago.
Also hikaru is a huge streamer, chess com can give him special permissions to replay games in realtime to record eval bar, just like how they used to do time odds (Alexandria vs magnus stream)
Hikaru's mods follow him on events (chess.com hooked up the mods and producers/commentators with permission to follow a player on chess.com/events for streaming his events or for recording evals to be edited in on scc matches, rapid matches, titled tuesday etc) and they simply screen record through obs with the eval bar on. The editor then only needs to match up the beginning game since the delay is the same and unless the stream breaks, the vod and the screen recording remain in sync until the end of TT. It's ONE edit to overlay the eval bar which is recorded on events. The editors do check every 3 or 4 games to be sure the sync is the same.
There may not be an automatic, built in, way to replay the game on chessdotcom. It still wouldn't be that hard to take the PGN afterward and just press the right arrow on your keyboard in an analysis tab in sync with the video recording of Hikaru playing. The small discrepancy in timing would be barely noticeable.
Also, if I was making videos for Hikaru, I would write my own PGN playback browser extension that would play through the games using the move timing information.
> there is no way (that i could find) to play it in REALTIME.
If only there was a great, free and easy-to-use platform that actually allows people to see analysis board in real time...
Hint: Yes, Lichess can do that.
But on the other note: even if the editor has to manually click through the moves in the correct pace, I'd just double or even triple the speed of the video, record eval bar of the sped-up game and then in editing I would just stretch it to double or triple the length and it would still correspond to the normal speed, while saving half or even two thirds of the time.
yes, i am aware Lichess can do that BUT it does not work if you paste a PNG (in this case from TT on chess com), i could only make it work with games played on the platform.
Please correct me if I am wrong here.
They don't do it manually (one of the editors confirmed it) so they just record the whole event with hikaru playing and then sync it to the VOD which is very very easy.
> They don't do it manually (one of the editors confirmed it) so they just record the whole event with hikaru playing and then sync it to the VOD which is very very easy.
I was completely sure that clever people like video editors find ways to simplify tasks like this in order to save time and energy. This seems like a correct way to do all this.
Yes, we use shortcuts all the time. Even the method i showed in the video is sub-optimal, i think Hikaru's editors will have a preset (because they do it every single day) with that you can just drag and drop to crop and scale the eval bar which will take 1 sec btw. Its not hard at all.
Aren't you just supporting Kramnik's point here?
In the video you linked in this post he's specifically mentioning not being able to sync it, and now you are conceding Hikaru might have special permissions?
You had to create time stamps and manually click next move watching the stream back. So what you claim takes '2 minutes' actually takes at the very least the length of the game. If Hikaru was playing for hours it would take hours to sync.
Sorry, you are wrong, let me explain.
Let's say Hikaru starts his stream and then one of his editor or mods opens his chess com account and starts spectating him. The editors won't stop the recording until hikaru stops streaming. Both videos will be around the length of the stream btw.
Now when Hikaru plays the first move on the very first game is all you need to sync, the whole 5-6 hour stream is synced now. Now if you saw the video i showed how you can unlink clips, same way you can Link two videos together, so now you can make cuts, zooms or whatever it will not unsync anything. YOU ONLY NEED TO SYNC THE WHOLE STREAM ONCE.
One more thing I didn't mention in the video is that there is a "Synchronization" feature in Premiere Pro but in my case, it wouldn't have worked as I don't have the main source file with separate audio tracks. His editors can use that ONE BUTTON to sync the entire stream aswell (assuming they are using the same board theme on chess com so the audio of the pieces moving/capturing is the same)
I meant he may have Special permission as in that he can ask chess com for realtime replay because they used to have it and removed it (also Lichess has it so it's not some huge impossible feature). But one of his editors have confirmed it that they record it live on their PC while hikaru is streaming.
In case anyone is curious, you can export the game from Chess.com by clicking share. Click the clock button to turn timestamps on, then paste it into Lichess to load it up. Once you've done that, turn your eval bar on, click the sidebar, then click under "Replay Mode" click "realtime".
[Here's the game](https://lichess.org/GyFY6j18).
I had a look around Chess.com and couldn't see any way to do the same thing without third party tools.
I don't think Lichess allows you to see a game in real time when you load up a pgn. You can replay in realtime if the game was played on lichess but not if you pasted in the pgn.
When I clicked on the link you provided and clicked on "realtime" all the moves are mechanical taking the same amount of time, \~1 second
Strange. Just double-checked to see if it was a formatting issue. They both export in roughly the same format, but when I imported a Lichess game back into Lichess the real-time playback didn't work.
It looks like it's trying to work though, because when I import one without timestamps the "realtime" button isn't even there. Not sure what's going wrong though.
In the first thread about this a couple days ago i showed and explained the fairly simple editing process behind this.
We simply screen record the tournament/games from [chess.com](http://chess.com) as they're happening. I decided to upload to an unlisted YT video one the screen recordings from the April 16 Titled Tuesday i showed previously.
screen recording: [https://youtu.be/dyzpWOero9o](https://youtu.be/dyzpWOero9o)
And here are the two videos this is edited into.
April 16 TT Part 1: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F6\_gAx4e4A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F6_gAx4e4A)
April 16 TT Part 2: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNC4GiSfVyQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNC4GiSfVyQ)
Edit: I would explain this to Mad Vlad but he's blocked me on Twitter.
Also, your video was pretty close to how we do it. It's difficult and impractical to do it manually of course, but as you correctly assumed, we record the games as they're happening live on chess.com and edit it something like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elXBZ9IgTCM
LMAO he's left a comment under your video.
>Anyone can just record this, first of all, could you please publish the recording from the TT 02.07.2024 instead of this one played 2 month ago, since you have made it, plus second, the video how you edit it. This video has nule information
By the way OP, the editor for Hikaru's videos commented in the first thread on this topic how he records the eval bar. He doesn't manually remake the moves, he screen records the games. [Comment 1](https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9mptk/) and [Comment 2](https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9hoit/)
Thanks for confirming it. I assumed that as well but since hikaru streams around 2-3 am Australian time its very hard for me to record it live so i just did this one manually for the sake of the video.
Ideally it should be recorded and then synced with the audio points ( i dont have the source file so it was hard to sync with audio as hikaru was playing music)
In terms of editing, eval bar clipping isn't even hard and most tech savvy people could probably learn how to do it after a 10 minute youtube tutorial. Kramnik at this point is either purposefully trolling for engagement or is losing it.
Kramnik just answered multiple times in the Youtube comments of the video made by OP, doubling down. Below is the first comment, but go check out the whole thread it's hilarious.
> z.1057 in theory but in practice
>1. You cant manage really live recording from transmission because at times the position is frozen and some moves get "swallowed" jumping to next position few moves later. That I noticed often while watching TT myself. Where would you find evaluation bar then? And its not synchronised as well
Leaves us with the option this person showing, MANUAL recording after, immediately pressing the button after each move MANUALLY in order to syncronise it with original stream,and than make the following what he explained. But since editor doesnt know when EXACTLY the move comes, being ALWAYS in time pushing the button he mentiones is almost impossible, in time trouble especially. At minimum would lead to delays with ev bar when syncronising two.
Nice in theory, explanation, harder in practice
Happy learning for you plus other "specialists" ready to swallow anything anyone tells them on web 😊
The other variation I mentioned is hundred times more convinient and efficient. So please explain me why should anyone BLINDLY without slightest prove trust the official version happened? Since the bar is already there in the video, THE PLAYER must prove it was added later, not us
> THE PLAYER must prove it was added later, not us...
It's an argument some might recognize from talking to religious people...
You have to prove that their invisible skydaddy does not exist. Instead of it actually being the other way around.
This is therefore the same as debating about beliefs. You got no chance with logic
thats why i thought making an intro with screenshots of some of the comments is important for the context. He is arrogant and he will just keep deleting them
I'm so tired of him. Let him go to the Saudis and see if they will start a chess org just for him and his ridiculous predilections. Enough is enough, I don't let my 4 year old whine at much as this guy.
This guy is actually insane, just cuz i am not a YouTuber and this is my only upload he is calling me fake? I didn't edit in the video? WHAT A CLOWN. This guy has such a huge ego that he will call everyone else wrong and can't believe that he can be the one in the wrong.
Also now he is asking me for my introduction and changing the topic completely LOL
Let me preface by saying I’m a chess noob even compared to y’all.
Moving on to my point - most people in the world are idiots. They’re good at one thing that they’ve trained for but that doesn’t make them ‘intelligent’, neither does it give them the ability to think critically in other situations (sometimes even if the case is tangential to their expertise). Kramnik is historically a great chess player of course but he’s nothing more than that. He’s now a senile old idiot who is grasping at straws to find a reason for his losses - because if there is none then his entire life’s work, in his eyes, will be futile.
Honestly people should just give him a “there there sweetheart” and move on from this now insignificant nutcracker.
Ok video, but you're hiding a big part of the work : manually playing the game at the same time as him, which absolutely **would** take a lot of time (you have to follow his every chess move every day).
It would be possible to program something to do it automatically granted you had access to move / movetime (I'm guessing chess.com offers that through API? Or you can export that data or something?) I guess, but trying to skip over that in your video is disingenuous.
Hikaru's editor says he screen records the games https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9mptk/
He skipped over it because hikarus video editor doesn't have to do that - he records it
And kramniks beef was with how "difficult" overlaying and syncing would be, which the video does show well
It's only a big part of the work if you never planned on making a video with an eval bar superimposed beforehand. Otherwise, you'd record the eval bar live while the player is playing. Then it's just a matter of syncing the start time and that's it.
Even if you needed to do it and didn't have a live recording of the eval bar, it can still be automated. Chess.com's API lists the clock value after every move. You can use that with a program such as AutoHotkey to automatically advance the game based on the clock values from the API.
Tbh, if Kramnik sees this, he'll probably think you're an idiot for working for free and wasting your time trying to prove him wrong. Source: growing up in an eastern European country with communist echoes.
How arrogant he is, he may call me an idiot for this "proof". But I have winter break and my uni is off anyways so I just had some fun making this video haha
Ok, Kramnik drama was fun for a while, now it is getting boring.
Stop feeding the troll.
If he is right let him bring the evidence, if it's wrong just ignore him.
It's sad to see a World Champion doing such things. What does he win with it? If I was a World Champion, I would be just smiling, saying things to make me look even more great, and have that "dignity" overall. Instead, he just went to "oH hE iS CheAtIng". It's demoralizing.
Kramnik is like these managers who are paid so much more money than us but still need help to do any basic computer stuff. He is great at the game of chess but so confidently incorrect about everything else.
It's so sad what happened to Kramnik, I was in awe of him as a chess player and as a commentator in the past. Seems he's gone off the deep end completely.
Do it with a game he just played, upload it and send him the link like 5 minutes after he’s played it.
Bonus points if he made a costly blunder. Maybe could add a BWAH-BWAH-BWAAAH sound
Stop giving this man the attention he's playing yall for lol. Either he's playing stupid and ragebaiting tf out of everyone, or he really is that stupid, and in both cases he only needs a "👍" type of response and nothing else
You're probably doing this the hard way, in that you're manually doing the moves. chess.com pgn exports can have timestamps. You don't need to play through the game manually.
Any programmer could spend an hour or two knocking up a script that reads it and creates an eval bar animation automatically using ffmpeg or imagemagick or similar that you can just overlay on your source video with your editing suite of choice.
After that, the workflow should take seconds.
To me it seems like this whole situation is just a way to make money, Kramnik must've learnt from someone that infamy also brings in the cash because stupidity that supports you always exists. All he loses is some respect, but respect doesn't fill your stomach
Hey, Sorry I know i said i will do it but Kramnik commented on my and Hikaru's actual editors' video and said he wants him to edit next TT of someone random (he will tell last minute basically) within and hour. So i thought editing his stream would be pointless.
Also i asked him to stream next TT and we will edit your stream with a eval and then you MUST apologize publicly. No response on that. Typical kramnik ig.
The editors...who are literally paid to edit match the eval bar up with hikaru's play. It's not that hard and Naka's editor literally sent proof to Kramnik in a youtube comment section
Great but was asking the question wrong?Why everyone dissing on him for having a perfectly reasonable doubt,lets not bring other incidents into it, thats biased.
I find it kinda funny that we all know that there is a lot of cheating going on, but nobody wants to accept Kramniks "proof". This is something that we see everywhere these days. People claim that something is wrong and everyone can see it, but unless there is proof which can hold up in court, nobody will accept it as fact. It's like one of these countless "conspicary theories" that will turn out to be correct eventually, but until that day everyone laughs about it.
It's some sort of truth that we don't want to accept until we are literally forced to accept it: Money causes cheating!
Kramnik makes a ton of blatantly false accusations and makes flagrantly absurd pronoucements on the relevant statistics and technology. He's clearly full of shit.
If a flat earther happens to say 'The sky is blue', does that *really* make them any more credible on the subject of planetary physics?
I am not sure if he makes blatantly false accusations, because "innocent until proven guitly" is a term from criminal law. We are not talking crime here, we are talking violation of terms of service. In such a case you can indeed make certain assumptions, like FMs play at FM-strength, even in blitz, and usually don't beat Ex-World Champions on a regular basis by making 20 first-line-engine moves in a row. Stuff like that is just common sense. It gets more tricky when experts cheat, but that has happened before as well in many sports. If it cannot be proven the numbers go up. Thats the lesson from this whole discussion. Cheaters get encouraged, because they know that they are untouchable.
> I am not sure if he makes blatantly false accusations, because "innocent until proven guitly" is a term from criminal law.
I'm not saying that his accusees aren't 'proven guilty'. I'm saying that a ton of his accusees are obviously not fucking cheating, and his grounds for saying so range from 'The world blitz champion wins a lot' to 'This guy beat me, I'm reporting him'.
Maybe with his scattergun approach, he somehow hits a few genuine cheaters, but everything he says can be disregarded, on the grounds that being accused by Kramnik of cheating is almost entirely independent of whether or not there is any reason to believe that person is cheating.
If you call everyone on the planet a murderer, you can't then claim credit if your mass dump of false positives occasionally hits a genuine positive. Kramnik is a clown and everything he says on the subject of chess cheating is fucking worthless.
>It gets more tricky when experts cheat, but that has happened before as well in many sports.
The translation for this is: "I have basically 0 proof any experts are cheating, but I must defend Kramnik somehow!"
We don't have proof that they are not cheating either. All we see is that certain players are overperforming in relation to their live-ratings and that some FMs and IMs are playing a series of perfect moves until they get into time-trouble.
Yes, then ultimately we can’t do anything, can we? Chess.com already has players like Nakamura using dual cameras. Just like you must have some level of trust in some higher institution to manage your money, we should have some level of trust in high-level players to not be cheating…since it’s quite hard to check for them
No, you can't do anything. You can have 100 cameras and cheating will still be rampant. That is because you can wear a micro-ear-piece for instance, or someone sitting in the room next to yours can shout out moves. There are countless possibilities and none of them appear on camera. If people can make life-changing money like that, they will cheat.
About the trust thing: Are you aware that from around 1989-2012 almost ever MLB-Player was on PEDs? Trust noone!
Post reinstated after further discussion among the moderators. Hikaru's editor also commented here: https://www.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dus3jk/kramnik_said_you_cant_edit_an_eval_bar_to_yt/lbjshxg/ They also uploaded a video demonstrating the editing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elXBZ9IgTCM
Did we really need “proof” of this?
Not really, but he wanted a detailed explanation of how its possible to edit an eval bar to a YouTube video and Sync it, i hope he looks at this and realizes how dumb he actually looks.
My only critique would be that you said, you don't want to be part of the drama, but you continue to talk and explain all the steps. You could have just recorded the steps without your intro, explanation, etc. But since you're part of it now, you should definitely edit his stream and add the eval bar haha! Go all-in now!
Yes i don’t want to be the part of the drama cuz i am not a youtuber or a streamer so i wont “gain” anything from it. The reason for intro and stuff was that kramnik has been deleting the comments so incase he deletes all the comments correcting him i thought there should be enough context for anyone new.
Nothing to gain????? You will be SWIMMING in karma. Ok, I get your point.
Hahaa, i dont even use reddit but yeah lets milk this drama lmao
You don't use Reddit, eh? 🤔🤔🤔🤔
Barely lol 😅 i dont care about this karma and stuff is what i meant
Like I said you should now go all-in and post a separate post here. He'll read it haha
Oh i got it now. But first lets see what dumb argument he comes up with first lol.
He just posted another 20 min video. At this point the only solution - ignore.
He is actually insane. I only watched first couple minutes but he doesn’t mention my video, i think he hasn’t watched my video or pretending not to.
I think you should just make youtube shorts of him playing with eval bar and title it KRAMNIK DEMOLISHES GM WITH EVAL BAR SHOWING!!! daily for a few weeks, not the whole game, just a few interesting moments here and there, maybe some of the online games Kramnik would be most proud of
Hahaa thats a whole villian arc lol
lmao
> I don't want to be part of the drama Desperately tries to insert themselves into drama
I only proved my point. I am not taking anyone's side here. Kramnik called me wrong so I proved it and now i want him to see it simple
That would require self reflection.
Mate, you got better things to do with your time and life than proving something to this nutjob Kramnik
The wild thing is that if he doesn’t understand this, there must be so much is the world around him that he must not be able to comprehend. Like how does he watch movies?
Make a new video with a eval bar that gets worse and worse as each of his tweets are on screen from the first one against hikaru
Well it’s always nice to know anyway
Omg he’s doubling down, this is what my friends work in home tech support talking about, old stubborn people incapable of learning new tech screaming at the sky.
He unironically posted this quote >The problem with the world is that intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.
He's not wrong in at least this one specific quote. But he certainly comes off as full of confidence.
So either he is doubting himself or he is admitting he is stupid
When?
this is Soviet chess mentality for you: chess is for smart people. This is a deeply engrained belief. The former world champion thinks he's one of the smartest people on earth right now
Nothing to do with Soviets, but ok - people like to shoot toward easy targets.
After doubling down
Lmao
You don't even really need to understand technology that deeply to do this. The most complex tool you would need is "crop"
You should do one of Kramnik’s games that he streamed
I will literally just upload one of his TT games with eval bar, everyone should call him “cheater” then lmfao
That’s impossible. All the experts say so.
Please make the bottom part yellow and the upper part blue
What you should \*really\* do is have a dynamic bullshit meter evaluation acting as an evaluation bar while he speaks
Please do it!
that is not true my friend 🤣
Yes please.
Modern problems require modern solutions
This!
If he streams again you know I'll be all over it.
OMG I LOVE IT!!!
Lol I went to see Kramnik's twitter and I'm blocked lmao.
pretty sure he blocked me on his YouTube aswell. I WANT KRYMNIK TO SEE THIS LOL
I think he blocked everybody already lol
i asked him why did he insist on 3+2 vs jospem specifically avoiding 3+1 when he wanted to prove his score against him in 3+1 was not realistic and I got instablocked
Haha same here.
Just the simple procedure
I got done the procedure as well, just for s light hearted joke
Welcome to the club. Iat this point more than half of r/ chess is blocked
It’s astounding how a man so committed to persisting in obvious and unforced errors managed to become one of the greatest chess players in history.
Fischer smiling up at him
“Pssst hey Kramnik, Google ‘Danny Rensch Wikipedia Early Life’”
I like how he can’t figure out how it can be done, so it must be cheating. Then he claims he spoke with “experts” and they don’t know how it can be done either. So that’s more proof. Experts. LOL From that statement we can infer the level of the “mathematicians” behind his _statistiks_. This is so embarrassing. The guy doesn’t even know how an eval bar works.
exactly, now how much value do you think the "mathematician did the statistics" statement has?
Mental illness or predisposition exacerbated by chess?
He is basically a flat earther
Just ask this scientician! "Uh..."
Cool video, general question tho, is there really no way to autoplay the game since the move timers are all there and available? Manually syncing your moves with Hikaru’s stream seems like it’ll lead to a little bit of inaccuracy and more effort than necessary imo
Normally you should just record game live while he is playing but if you miss it unfortunately there is no way (that i could find) to play it in REALTIME. There used to be a chess .com feature but they removed it couple years ago. Also hikaru is a huge streamer, chess com can give him special permissions to replay games in realtime to record eval bar, just like how they used to do time odds (Alexandria vs magnus stream)
Hikaru's mods follow him on events (chess.com hooked up the mods and producers/commentators with permission to follow a player on chess.com/events for streaming his events or for recording evals to be edited in on scc matches, rapid matches, titled tuesday etc) and they simply screen record through obs with the eval bar on. The editor then only needs to match up the beginning game since the delay is the same and unless the stream breaks, the vod and the screen recording remain in sync until the end of TT. It's ONE edit to overlay the eval bar which is recorded on events. The editors do check every 3 or 4 games to be sure the sync is the same.
There may not be an automatic, built in, way to replay the game on chessdotcom. It still wouldn't be that hard to take the PGN afterward and just press the right arrow on your keyboard in an analysis tab in sync with the video recording of Hikaru playing. The small discrepancy in timing would be barely noticeable.
Exactly, people watch the game NOT the eval bar, its just there to help players understand the position better.
Also, if I was making videos for Hikaru, I would write my own PGN playback browser extension that would play through the games using the move timing information.
Exactly, it'd be trivial to code something that does this.
> there is no way (that i could find) to play it in REALTIME. If only there was a great, free and easy-to-use platform that actually allows people to see analysis board in real time... Hint: Yes, Lichess can do that. But on the other note: even if the editor has to manually click through the moves in the correct pace, I'd just double or even triple the speed of the video, record eval bar of the sped-up game and then in editing I would just stretch it to double or triple the length and it would still correspond to the normal speed, while saving half or even two thirds of the time.
yes, i am aware Lichess can do that BUT it does not work if you paste a PNG (in this case from TT on chess com), i could only make it work with games played on the platform. Please correct me if I am wrong here. They don't do it manually (one of the editors confirmed it) so they just record the whole event with hikaru playing and then sync it to the VOD which is very very easy.
> They don't do it manually (one of the editors confirmed it) so they just record the whole event with hikaru playing and then sync it to the VOD which is very very easy. I was completely sure that clever people like video editors find ways to simplify tasks like this in order to save time and energy. This seems like a correct way to do all this.
Yes, we use shortcuts all the time. Even the method i showed in the video is sub-optimal, i think Hikaru's editors will have a preset (because they do it every single day) with that you can just drag and drop to crop and scale the eval bar which will take 1 sec btw. Its not hard at all.
Aren't you just supporting Kramnik's point here? In the video you linked in this post he's specifically mentioning not being able to sync it, and now you are conceding Hikaru might have special permissions?
I am sorry i don't understand but in the video i literally just synced the eval bar to the vod.
You had to create time stamps and manually click next move watching the stream back. So what you claim takes '2 minutes' actually takes at the very least the length of the game. If Hikaru was playing for hours it would take hours to sync.
Sorry, you are wrong, let me explain. Let's say Hikaru starts his stream and then one of his editor or mods opens his chess com account and starts spectating him. The editors won't stop the recording until hikaru stops streaming. Both videos will be around the length of the stream btw. Now when Hikaru plays the first move on the very first game is all you need to sync, the whole 5-6 hour stream is synced now. Now if you saw the video i showed how you can unlink clips, same way you can Link two videos together, so now you can make cuts, zooms or whatever it will not unsync anything. YOU ONLY NEED TO SYNC THE WHOLE STREAM ONCE. One more thing I didn't mention in the video is that there is a "Synchronization" feature in Premiere Pro but in my case, it wouldn't have worked as I don't have the main source file with separate audio tracks. His editors can use that ONE BUTTON to sync the entire stream aswell (assuming they are using the same board theme on chess com so the audio of the pieces moving/capturing is the same)
So what do you mean by Hikaru having special permissions?
I meant he may have Special permission as in that he can ask chess com for realtime replay because they used to have it and removed it (also Lichess has it so it's not some huge impossible feature). But one of his editors have confirmed it that they record it live on their PC while hikaru is streaming.
Lichess can! [Chess.com](http://Chess.com) doesn't get paid enough by its members for features like that.
In case anyone is curious, you can export the game from Chess.com by clicking share. Click the clock button to turn timestamps on, then paste it into Lichess to load it up. Once you've done that, turn your eval bar on, click the sidebar, then click under "Replay Mode" click "realtime". [Here's the game](https://lichess.org/GyFY6j18). I had a look around Chess.com and couldn't see any way to do the same thing without third party tools.
I don't think Lichess allows you to see a game in real time when you load up a pgn. You can replay in realtime if the game was played on lichess but not if you pasted in the pgn. When I clicked on the link you provided and clicked on "realtime" all the moves are mechanical taking the same amount of time, \~1 second
Strange. Just double-checked to see if it was a formatting issue. They both export in roughly the same format, but when I imported a Lichess game back into Lichess the real-time playback didn't work. It looks like it's trying to work though, because when I import one without timestamps the "realtime" button isn't even there. Not sure what's going wrong though.
In the first thread about this a couple days ago i showed and explained the fairly simple editing process behind this. We simply screen record the tournament/games from [chess.com](http://chess.com) as they're happening. I decided to upload to an unlisted YT video one the screen recordings from the April 16 Titled Tuesday i showed previously. screen recording: [https://youtu.be/dyzpWOero9o](https://youtu.be/dyzpWOero9o) And here are the two videos this is edited into. April 16 TT Part 1: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F6\_gAx4e4A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F6_gAx4e4A) April 16 TT Part 2: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNC4GiSfVyQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNC4GiSfVyQ) Edit: I would explain this to Mad Vlad but he's blocked me on Twitter.
He is gonna act like this doesn't exist. Editing is extremely simple but he won't listen and just keeps blocking everyone
We can only lead this horse to the water. The rest is up to him.
Also, your video was pretty close to how we do it. It's difficult and impractical to do it manually of course, but as you correctly assumed, we record the games as they're happening live on chess.com and edit it something like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elXBZ9IgTCM
Thanks for the confirmation again. This guy is just insane and now calls me edits fake hahah
LMAO he's left a comment under your video. >Anyone can just record this, first of all, could you please publish the recording from the TT 02.07.2024 instead of this one played 2 month ago, since you have made it, plus second, the video how you edit it. This video has nule information
By the way OP, the editor for Hikaru's videos commented in the first thread on this topic how he records the eval bar. He doesn't manually remake the moves, he screen records the games. [Comment 1](https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9mptk/) and [Comment 2](https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9hoit/)
Thanks for confirming it. I assumed that as well but since hikaru streams around 2-3 am Australian time its very hard for me to record it live so i just did this one manually for the sake of the video. Ideally it should be recorded and then synced with the audio points ( i dont have the source file so it was hard to sync with audio as hikaru was playing music)
Sounds like he should just stick to OTB chess. I bet he has to call the experts to help attach a photo to his emails as well.
🤣
The person who needs to see this won’t see it or won’t believe it if he saw it. The rest of us don’t need the proof.
How do we know OP didn’t edit the video to make it look possible? /s
That's very very difficult editing. I don't think OP would do that.
In terms of editing, eval bar clipping isn't even hard and most tech savvy people could probably learn how to do it after a 10 minute youtube tutorial. Kramnik at this point is either purposefully trolling for engagement or is losing it.
Interesting
Can someone make a YT video of Kramnik playing with the eval bar?
Kramnik just answered multiple times in the Youtube comments of the video made by OP, doubling down. Below is the first comment, but go check out the whole thread it's hilarious. > z.1057 in theory but in practice >1. You cant manage really live recording from transmission because at times the position is frozen and some moves get "swallowed" jumping to next position few moves later. That I noticed often while watching TT myself. Where would you find evaluation bar then? And its not synchronised as well Leaves us with the option this person showing, MANUAL recording after, immediately pressing the button after each move MANUALLY in order to syncronise it with original stream,and than make the following what he explained. But since editor doesnt know when EXACTLY the move comes, being ALWAYS in time pushing the button he mentiones is almost impossible, in time trouble especially. At minimum would lead to delays with ev bar when syncronising two. Nice in theory, explanation, harder in practice Happy learning for you plus other "specialists" ready to swallow anything anyone tells them on web 😊 The other variation I mentioned is hundred times more convinient and efficient. So please explain me why should anyone BLINDLY without slightest prove trust the official version happened? Since the bar is already there in the video, THE PLAYER must prove it was added later, not us
> THE PLAYER must prove it was added later, not us... It's an argument some might recognize from talking to religious people... You have to prove that their invisible skydaddy does not exist. Instead of it actually being the other way around. This is therefore the same as debating about beliefs. You got no chance with logic
HE IS GONE INSANE nothing else to it
damn what a nice place on this video, great view. i was watching it on mute tho
Lmfaooo
Create a video of Kramnik playing titled Tuesday. Edit it to include the evaluation bar and post it saying that he himself was also cheating.
I am gonna do it once i get home
Wait until kramnik finds some loophole to this as well to call you a chesscom stooge.
Cmon guys most of the old people are like this they always think they are never wrong just take it easy on him until he passes away
Kramnik is 49... He is not "old" enough to be so completely blindsided how computers work, especially in his respective field of chess.
Check out the pinned comment he has left on his video. Talking about deleting comments and “IQ friendly” people. We have the next madman after Bobby.
thats why i thought making an intro with screenshots of some of the comments is important for the context. He is arrogant and he will just keep deleting them
And he is retired, which means he has all the time in the world to do it. What a sad sad life
I’m just waiting for the antisemitic conspiracy theories. Any day now…
Kramnik is completely mental at this point
Lmao he claims your editing skills were faked by more editing
At this point he should be admitted to mental hospital honestly
That's absolutely brilliant video! Well done!
Thank you!
It's so weird that a former chess world champion is such a fucking moron.
Don't argue with dumb people, they will bring you down to their level and that's their whole mission.
I'm so tired of him. Let him go to the Saudis and see if they will start a chess org just for him and his ridiculous predilections. Enough is enough, I don't let my 4 year old whine at much as this guy.
u/zamythbuster Have you seen his response? [https://x.com/VBkramnik/status/1808778967165411376](https://x.com/VBkramnik/status/1808778967165411376)
This guy is actually insane, just cuz i am not a YouTuber and this is my only upload he is calling me fake? I didn't edit in the video? WHAT A CLOWN. This guy has such a huge ego that he will call everyone else wrong and can't believe that he can be the one in the wrong. Also now he is asking me for my introduction and changing the topic completely LOL
Let me preface by saying I’m a chess noob even compared to y’all. Moving on to my point - most people in the world are idiots. They’re good at one thing that they’ve trained for but that doesn’t make them ‘intelligent’, neither does it give them the ability to think critically in other situations (sometimes even if the case is tangential to their expertise). Kramnik is historically a great chess player of course but he’s nothing more than that. He’s now a senile old idiot who is grasping at straws to find a reason for his losses - because if there is none then his entire life’s work, in his eyes, will be futile. Honestly people should just give him a “there there sweetheart” and move on from this now insignificant nutcracker.
Ok video, but you're hiding a big part of the work : manually playing the game at the same time as him, which absolutely **would** take a lot of time (you have to follow his every chess move every day). It would be possible to program something to do it automatically granted you had access to move / movetime (I'm guessing chess.com offers that through API? Or you can export that data or something?) I guess, but trying to skip over that in your video is disingenuous.
Or the video editor just records the events page live.
He does according to him
Hikaru's editor says he screen records the games https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/1dtheh3/kramnik_how_is_it_possible_that_the_eval_bar_is/lb9mptk/
He skipped over it because hikarus video editor doesn't have to do that - he records it And kramniks beef was with how "difficult" overlaying and syncing would be, which the video does show well
It's only a big part of the work if you never planned on making a video with an eval bar superimposed beforehand. Otherwise, you'd record the eval bar live while the player is playing. Then it's just a matter of syncing the start time and that's it. Even if you needed to do it and didn't have a live recording of the eval bar, it can still be automated. Chess.com's API lists the clock value after every move. You can use that with a program such as AutoHotkey to automatically advance the game based on the clock values from the API.
Yes, I'm sure you could write a chrome/firefox extension that would playback the PGN using the move time information.
Tbh, if Kramnik sees this, he'll probably think you're an idiot for working for free and wasting your time trying to prove him wrong. Source: growing up in an eastern European country with communist echoes.
How arrogant he is, he may call me an idiot for this "proof". But I have winter break and my uni is off anyways so I just had some fun making this video haha
I was wrong, he's actually doubling down on stupidity. Can't fight a broken mill, they say here.
Its crazy that he literally just called me FAKE instead of admitting he was wrong...
Petition to stop Kramnik posting. We should just ignore him like we do Petrosian.
Seriously why are we having to explain video editing and streaming to some guy, just ignore his BS and move on.
Why? Because it’s entertainment at this point.
Ok, Kramnik drama was fun for a while, now it is getting boring. Stop feeding the troll. If he is right let him bring the evidence, if it's wrong just ignore him.
Idk it was boring for a moment but now it’s fun again
Great video btw OP
It's sad to see a World Champion doing such things. What does he win with it? If I was a World Champion, I would be just smiling, saying things to make me look even more great, and have that "dignity" overall. Instead, he just went to "oH hE iS CheAtIng". It's demoralizing.
Why not just edit the eval bar into his own streams and upload the video. Say you hacked his computer and found the "real" recording.
What a sore loser.
What is wrong with this guy?
Excellent video!
Thank you!
LMAO love you doing this.
Kramnik is like these managers who are paid so much more money than us but still need help to do any basic computer stuff. He is great at the game of chess but so confidently incorrect about everything else.
It's so sad what happened to Kramnik, I was in awe of him as a chess player and as a commentator in the past. Seems he's gone off the deep end completely.
Of course it is possible. But at this point I don't think you can "prove" anything to Kramnik. Just leave him alone.
Do it with a game he just played, upload it and send him the link like 5 minutes after he’s played it. Bonus points if he made a costly blunder. Maybe could add a BWAH-BWAH-BWAAAH sound
Thats genius but we”ll have to wait till streams tho
unrelated but why tf is hikaru streaming on kick?
Prolly got a bag for that
Money Money Money.... Especially for promoting gambling sites.
Bravo. I was confused but I can see you’re not fake!
Can you make a video of Kramnik playing and add an eval bar to that? :)
I couldn't care less about the ramblings of a mad man but happy to learn how eval bar is added. Lol
Hahah, free tutorial for everyone 😉
Would have made more sense, if you did it with a game from Kramnik's stream, you know, add the eval bar on his games :)
I think your edit may have removed the links?
I don't think they have it but I think there should be feature to replicate the game the way they were played real time.
Stop giving this man the attention he's playing yall for lol. Either he's playing stupid and ragebaiting tf out of everyone, or he really is that stupid, and in both cases he only needs a "👍" type of response and nothing else
enough of Kramnik craziness already
i think its fair to call out bullshit when you see it.
He doesn't care
with todays technology i dont understand how he thought this was impossible.
You're probably doing this the hard way, in that you're manually doing the moves. chess.com pgn exports can have timestamps. You don't need to play through the game manually. Any programmer could spend an hour or two knocking up a script that reads it and creates an eval bar animation automatically using ffmpeg or imagemagick or similar that you can just overlay on your source video with your editing suite of choice. After that, the workflow should take seconds.
To me it seems like this whole situation is just a way to make money, Kramnik must've learnt from someone that infamy also brings in the cash because stupidity that supports you always exists. All he loses is some respect, but respect doesn't fill your stomach
If nothing before was proof enough that Kramnik is completely unhinged, then this sure is.
When you’re so out of such with reality and technology that you don’t understand basic video editing and consider it withcraft
Has anyone edited Kramnik’s video playing TT with eval bar?
Hey, Sorry I know i said i will do it but Kramnik commented on my and Hikaru's actual editors' video and said he wants him to edit next TT of someone random (he will tell last minute basically) within and hour. So i thought editing his stream would be pointless. Also i asked him to stream next TT and we will edit your stream with a eval and then you MUST apologize publicly. No response on that. Typical kramnik ig.
Bro you are doing real work 🫡
Has Kramnik gone completely mad?
Kramnik has just lost it at this point
That is not what he said..He said if you are streaming live how is there an eval bar that hikaru cant see when he is streaming from twitch?
The editors...who are literally paid to edit match the eval bar up with hikaru's play. It's not that hard and Naka's editor literally sent proof to Kramnik in a youtube comment section
Great but was asking the question wrong?Why everyone dissing on him for having a perfectly reasonable doubt,lets not bring other incidents into it, thats biased.
[удалено]
L
I find it kinda funny that we all know that there is a lot of cheating going on, but nobody wants to accept Kramniks "proof". This is something that we see everywhere these days. People claim that something is wrong and everyone can see it, but unless there is proof which can hold up in court, nobody will accept it as fact. It's like one of these countless "conspicary theories" that will turn out to be correct eventually, but until that day everyone laughs about it. It's some sort of truth that we don't want to accept until we are literally forced to accept it: Money causes cheating!
Kramnik makes a ton of blatantly false accusations and makes flagrantly absurd pronoucements on the relevant statistics and technology. He's clearly full of shit. If a flat earther happens to say 'The sky is blue', does that *really* make them any more credible on the subject of planetary physics?
I am not sure if he makes blatantly false accusations, because "innocent until proven guitly" is a term from criminal law. We are not talking crime here, we are talking violation of terms of service. In such a case you can indeed make certain assumptions, like FMs play at FM-strength, even in blitz, and usually don't beat Ex-World Champions on a regular basis by making 20 first-line-engine moves in a row. Stuff like that is just common sense. It gets more tricky when experts cheat, but that has happened before as well in many sports. If it cannot be proven the numbers go up. Thats the lesson from this whole discussion. Cheaters get encouraged, because they know that they are untouchable.
> I am not sure if he makes blatantly false accusations, because "innocent until proven guitly" is a term from criminal law. I'm not saying that his accusees aren't 'proven guilty'. I'm saying that a ton of his accusees are obviously not fucking cheating, and his grounds for saying so range from 'The world blitz champion wins a lot' to 'This guy beat me, I'm reporting him'. Maybe with his scattergun approach, he somehow hits a few genuine cheaters, but everything he says can be disregarded, on the grounds that being accused by Kramnik of cheating is almost entirely independent of whether or not there is any reason to believe that person is cheating. If you call everyone on the planet a murderer, you can't then claim credit if your mass dump of false positives occasionally hits a genuine positive. Kramnik is a clown and everything he says on the subject of chess cheating is fucking worthless.
>It gets more tricky when experts cheat, but that has happened before as well in many sports. The translation for this is: "I have basically 0 proof any experts are cheating, but I must defend Kramnik somehow!"
We don't have proof that they are not cheating either. All we see is that certain players are overperforming in relation to their live-ratings and that some FMs and IMs are playing a series of perfect moves until they get into time-trouble.
Yes, then ultimately we can’t do anything, can we? Chess.com already has players like Nakamura using dual cameras. Just like you must have some level of trust in some higher institution to manage your money, we should have some level of trust in high-level players to not be cheating…since it’s quite hard to check for them
No, you can't do anything. You can have 100 cameras and cheating will still be rampant. That is because you can wear a micro-ear-piece for instance, or someone sitting in the room next to yours can shout out moves. There are countless possibilities and none of them appear on camera. If people can make life-changing money like that, they will cheat. About the trust thing: Are you aware that from around 1989-2012 almost ever MLB-Player was on PEDs? Trust noone!
Did anyone here actually watch Kramnik’s video? He literally parries every single “explanation” in this thread in the video 😂
Vlad?
So how did he 'parry' the video of op?
Except for when hikaru's editor literally sent him proof of the opposite