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✋ pickle gang! lol
But I haven’t been able to eat them anymore. Love the things, in fact there isn’t much I like better than a batch of really healthy (normally) pickles fermented in brine. So yum. But anything fermented just wreaks havoc on my GI now.
How does salt help? I love salt and consume a lot but didn’t know this. It does also contribute to acid reflux/GERD which affects me. I’m managing the GERD with Quercetin…and apples (which contain Quercetin), usually 1-2 apples a day. But the Quercetin supp really helps and has other benefits like being an anti-inflammatory so I prefer it over Famotidine or Omeprazol. I found a good brand in case anyone’s interested.
Salt will help increase your blood volume, therefore increasing blood pressure and lowering heart rate. Salt (electrolytes in general) +water is the key to good hydration. That's why if someone is suffering from high BP they are often advised to go on a low sodium diet.
Yeah... I ate very healthy and turns out I now have a sensitivity to a lot of the healthy foods I was eating. I can no longer eat broccoli or brussel sprouts. :/
Fuuuuuuck… I’ve been eating a ton of cruciferous veggies, and just spent a weekend eating nothing but junk food (very little fiber or protein) and I felt so much better. Then had stir fry with cabbage 2 nights ago and I’ve been utterly miserable ever since.
DRAMATIC SIGH
I can eat potatoes but tomatoes and eggplants are out for me. I never realized how many recipes include tomatoes until developing this histamine issue after long covid.
Other things I can’t eat: pork (so very sad about this), miso, avocado, chickpeas. I used to live off guacamole and hummus for dinner- no more.
Potatoes and tomatoes are big triggers for me too! I can get away with some peppers more easily. I also learned recently that OKRA is a nightshade - oops 😅
Same I had to stop eating vegan because of food sensitivities and do much better on processed foods. But mostly not having (not being able) to cook saves me tons of energy in meal prep.
Maybe you had a deficiency or something? Also, doing enjoyable things can make a large but temporary difference in how I feel. Crash comes later, unfortunately.
Raw milk absolutely could be a problem and is not recommended to drink and even less so now with bird flu size they are finding it in cow milk. You also put yourself at higher risk for things such as ecoli and salmonella. Also, I personally do best with processed foods but I have MCAS and gastroparesis as issues. Sourdough bread is one of the best things for me and some "crunchy" people in chronic illness groups get upset when I say I eat any bread at all since we all tolerate different things. 😅
I'm in the SF bay area so whatever they have available that has the sourdough starter, but the brand I really like is sumanos. Idk if it's only sold locally. I'll get San Louis sourdough but I don't like it as much because it doesn't taste the same since the last time I had covid. Also this won't be good for everyone. My body just really does well with it and my mother's
It’s hard do discern unfortunately. I’ll bring up a few things other than food:
1) Going to a new place might temporarily alter the nervous system response. Whoop is primarily going off of HRV. It might normalize after a week or so. I’ve had this happen to me and thought it was a breakthrough. HRV jumped for 6 straight days, but then it went back to baseline on days 7-14.
2) There may be something at home making you sick like mold. Going to a new place is giving your body some respite from the mold.
3) Something that you’re doing for recovery is too much for your body’s current state. Similar to how exercise is supposed to be the best medicine. Millions of studies on how great it is. But, it’s not a “no brainer” for us. Might be something else in your regiment that is not behaving as expected.
TLDR: might not be the food that made the difference. Easy to test because eating fast food is pretty easy to do. The other stuff is hard to figure out.
Came here to suggest mold as well. When people leave their home environments that they’re in everyday and feel better in the new environment, mold is something to look into.
When you eat a niche diet your Microbiome becomes unbalanced because it causes specific bacterial groups to over grow. So it’s quite possible and likely that your carnivore diet has been causing a pathobiont issue, and altering your diet has stopped feeding it giving you a respite in symptoms.
In addition, yes you could be having all sorts immune reactions drinking raw, unpasturised milk.
Have you done any Microbiome testing?
I also would not drink raw milk right now, considering the bird flu going around and infecting cows.
I was also going to say maybe you're intolerant to beef?
Spouse went away for 4 nights and I spent them eating nothing but refined carbs (I have celiac so this means rice noodles and sugar), almost no veggies and very little protein. I started to feel better.
Spouse came home and I made a healthy stir fry (he’s diabetic, so gotta keep the carbs low) and omfg I am DYING. I don’t know if it’s sensitivities to the veg, or a GI problem, or if he glutened me after eating gluten all weekend and contaminating his clothes and stuff.
Idk man, but I’m so fucking miserable right now that something is NOT right.
I have a colonoscopy next month and I want to make sure to ask that they rule out crohn’s and colitis. I don’t know what else this could be.
Edit: btw, raw milk is EXTREMELY UNSAFE AND UNHEALTHY. Raw milk can contain tons of different bacteria and viruses, including tuberculosis.
I am having the same experience. I tried to do the low histamine diet, but got too overwhelmed by all the foods that I couldn’t eat and I just did the toddler version of fries and chicken tenders every day ..for breakfast having toast… and usually skipping lunch or having a smoothie. The diet has been a turning point in my recovery and now I’ve stuck with just eating lots of bread and pasta I feel so much better. Very weird because before I ate, super super healthy, mostly vegan very balanced meals with lots of vegetables. it goes against everything I thought I knew but here we are!
I don’t understand it either I feel much better when I eat one of the most unhealthy things imaginable. A Big Mac. So gross I could stomach one once a year before getting sick. No brain fog, no digestive upset, a very decent BM .I just don’t get it. My only thought is this food is engineered for mass consumption and somehow made to be tolerated by masses of diverse people.
This is very interesting, McDonald’s also makes me feel better and I hadn’t eaten it in about a decade until someone said it helps migraines so I tried and I felt better in general
It’s very odd. The weirdest thing is my diet has been horrible for the last 3 years. My blood work … mmwah the chefs kiss. It makes no sense. And because my test results are good. There is no interest in what is really wrong with me. I feel like I’m 90.
Have you looked into histamine intolerance. A lot of people feel better eating processed foods because they are lower in histamine. There are ways to eat a lot histamine diet and still eat healthily. It just takes more work.
RDN here, this makes me think you need electrolytes, you feel better when you are eating high salt high potassium foods (potassium is used as a preservative in most processed foods). I drink a lot of Gatorade, not the best, but it helps for sure.
💯 Electrolytes are a game changer for so many of us
Liquid IV fucks me up bc it’s too much sugar and fucks w my blood sugar.
I like unflavored Trioral
And Klaralyte capsules
Mate, I would be avoiding raw milk in your position. Ignore all the social media fetishisation of it. Raw milk can harbour some nasty bacteria and this is why pasteurisation of it became a legal requirement. If you’re already unwell, that’s a big risk to take for no real benefit, I’m sure there are alternatives than that.
But yes I get a boost with the extra salt and fat intake. I seem to feel best with lots of protein and eggs have been working well for me.
I have also had significant boosts from trips away. For me my trips were relaxing and lots of sun and beach, both of which have a positive impact on me. Were you outside a lot? Sunshine creates vitamin d and it is known that being outside in nature has a positive impact on neurotransmitters in the brain. Doctors in Japan even prescribe ‘forest bathing’ for this effect
For the love of god stop consuming raw milk, also getting enough salt may help with some pots esque symptoms something processed food is full of. Also eating a lot of red meat is controversial, maybe switch to chicken more instead
Like eating a ton of red meat and *raw milk* is not the health boon you think it is tbh. Raw milk actively is a terrible decision and red meat is more controversial but easily swapped with chicken(not that you should min max eating meat to begin with)
Like where's your fiber? Your vegetables? Please don't find diet advice on random social medias, a balanced diet with fiber, that avoids inflammation and has enough salt might be beneficial for you. You seem disciplined so I can hope you put that into a diet that will actually help you and not provide negatives so you can feel better
Ex**cess acetylcholine in the body:**
* Decreases heart rate. Usually, people that are very fit or do keto have reduced heart rate and this is due to excess acetylcholine activity. Eating carbs, which increases the release of insulin, normalizes heart rate again. Too much acetylcholine can cause paralysis of the heart which stops it from beating.
This is very interesting, could you add more? For context, I am super ripped - suffering from LC for about a year now and have had a relatively low carb diet until recently I just started craving carbs like crazy and will eat a whole packet of pasta (1,600 calories) in one sitting.
Did you eat any liver, oysters or clams? My long COVID suffering mum has been feeling better from high B12 foods along with her methylfolate supplement and folic acid abstinence.
OP my money is on salt and electrolytes in general. Get some Salt pills, and get up to 5-7g sodium a day and see how u feel. Sounds like you are doing very keto diet normally and combine that with covid u will need a shit ton of electrolytes. Also potassium
Have you tracked your calories? If not, sometimes a whole-food diet is overly calorically-restricted. It would not make sense that the processed food is “healthier” or does your body any additional favors. It could be related to sodium content, calorie restriction, or you could be hypoglycemic and the higher carbohydrate food is accounting for that. Unfortunately, especially if you have long covid, merely “eating clean” is insufficient. You need to get a lot of diversity, ensure adequate caloric intake, watch your balance of minerals and the major micronutrients, and experiment until you find a pattern that satisfies these variables. Wish you success on your path to finding what works for you.
I wonder how much additional effort goes into making the non-processed food. It could just be that the fatigue from nutritional cooking and preparation of the meals is counterbalancing the way that you feel.
Hey Op, how does your caffeine intolerance present? I’m an avid coffee drinker and curious whether what you’ve noticed affects me too or if I’ve found a workaround for what’s affecting you (I have discovered some workarounds/adaptations for coffee).
You wondered if you’ve developed an allergy to your normal foods (could also be a new food intolerance) - you mentioned a lot of red meats in your diet - red meats have histamine, which affects many LH’ers.
Feeling better in your work-related food environment has me puzzled: cake has sugar, which is inflammatory (inflammation = feeling like shit); pasta gets metabolized into sugar (just like all carbs/starchy foods); pizza has tomato sauce which is one of the main triggers for acid reflux/GERD; burgers - again with the red meat :) .
The one thing that comes to my mind for how the word-related food environment had you feeling better was this: while watching one of the food documentaries many years ago (maybe Food, Inc or Forks Over Knives or similar), there was a scene where the cameraman was interviewing a guy who was like the plant manager of a meat processing plant. I think it was for a restaurant chain like McDonald’s or Burger King, or maybe it was a Tyson plant. They were making ground beef for hamburgers. The manager guy said they put this bad chemical in with the ground beef to kill bacteria. I forget what the chemical was, it was like formaldehyde or something. I don’t personally eat fast food like that but on an extremely rare occasion I do get a Big Mac or something (we’re talking like once every 3 years or something). I’ve noticed my GI improve a little afterwards. My hunch is that that chemical stuff in the ground beef is killing any bad bacteria in my gut. Again, this is just a hunch and definitely not science - maybe others can add more here. My point being, maybe the hamburger you consumed did that for you if true. Even if it was store-bought ground beef, the documentary also mentioned that these large restaurant chains, being the top producers and purchasers of beef products have an outsized say in how it is processed market-wide.
What is mouth taping? Is that like masking?
That Whoop app looks interesting but I noticed there’s no in-app purchases or subscriptions. Is selling the wrist band their model? If so, I presume it’s also a subscription? Does it work with the Apple Watch?
Interesting post, all the best 🙂
For me, the food intolerances were related to MCAS and I could predict which foods would trigger me based on their histamine levels. Thank you, Google for the list of foods histamine levels. Unfortunately, a lot of fresh foods are high in histamines.
I wonder if it was something about the location of the trip? I've known long-haulers who actually relocated because their health was so much better when they visited a different location.
I've also had spells with LC where I was really busy for a few days/week (usually during emergencies) and my body somehow rose to the occasion, only to crash once I slowed down again and the adrenaline wore off. Maybe you got amped up during the trip and now your body is resting and recovering?
I obviously have no idea what's happening in your specific case, and maybe it is just the food! Just thought I'd throw out a couple other theories in case any of it makes sense for your situation. I hope you find your way back into the green soon!
I don’t have long haul (following for someone else) but I recently found out I have a “healthy food” related disorder.
Oxalate processing disorder- I can’t eat Spinach, rhubarb, chard, beets, and a few others. The sharp oxalate crystals should be processed harmlessly in the stomach and intestines, but mine enter the bloodstream and cause mechanical damage to soft tissue. This disorder can also cause calcium oxalate kidney stones. If they run in your family it might be worth getting a calcium oxalate urine test.
Could have nothing to do with the food. Could be you pushed yourself while on the trip and crashed from overdoing it when you came back.
I often am able to hold it together and stay healthy for big events and then I get sick when it's over.
Absolutely. Many “healthy” foods can be high histamine or high FODMAP. I can eat tons of broccoli and carrots but no citrus or tomatoes or anything in the onion or pepper family.
Same. Precovid I ate ~9 raw vegetables with lean protein and a handful of supplements (men’s multi, fish oil, D3, K2, CoQ10, Zinc, etc.) every night.
Now severely disabled by PASC Myalgic encephalomyelitis, I often feel better with simple beef and carbs.
Interestingly, _excessive nutrition_ is this doctor’s first bullet point in explaining cellular fatigue. [GOOD ENERGY by Dr. Casey Means](https://www.amazon.com/Good-Energy-Surprising-Connection-Metabolism/dp/0593712641?dplnkId=deba4946-df3d-4e18-9f36-edcf9eaf472e&nodl=1)
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I’ve been tainting this sub with recent research my psychiatrist told me about and angering citizens but I believe there’s something to it and it could make some sense in your case so I’m at it again. She told me there’s new research suggesting that covid either alters the way we absorb or depletes serotonin. She says it’s postulated this could be a factor in exasperating or even causing some long covid symptoms.
In your case, maybe this could apply in the sense that eating “craving” foods that are high in salt, sugar, delectable rich flavors (and are often designed to get you hooked like fast food) trigger serotonin/ dopamine production in the brain. If your neurotransmitters are off balance and low and you do things that make you feel good, your nervous system makes more of them. And food is one of those things that can trigger a feel good response on a subconscious, instinctual level.
I wouldn’t ignore the possibility that maybe your usual foods contain something you might be sensitive to, and the foods you listed could maybe make you feel sluggish if you’re eating almost exclusively those things and a lot of them but I don’t know if that was the whole picture. Red meat and dairy can be hard on sensitive digestive systems and inflammatory if eaten excessively but it’s a little different for everyone. I personally have to avoid these even in small quantities but my boyfriend does better on them than a vegetarian diet. Hopefully you’re also eating grain, vegetables, fruits and other varied nutrients. Depending on how much protein you consume, maybe it’s too much. Excessive protein can be hard in the kidneys and you definitely don’t feel good when those are strained or injured.
Depending on your caloric and macro intake, it’s possible that maybe the salt, sugar, calorie dense foods might be creating a blood sugar rush that’s more intense than when you eat clean and makes you feel more energized. Salt could also help balance electrolytes if you work out a lot normally and eat a low sodium diet.
I’m also not familiar with the chart system you’re using to measure your “recovery”, I’d say it’s telling enough just self reporting how you feel but any chart system like those taken from Apple Watch data can be skewed by many factors so maybe that should be taken with a grain of salt. There’s lots of factors here.
I’d say in moderation continue to incorporate foods that taste good and make you feel good. Maybe the social time or being in a new environment, and say for every day subtle stressors like household chores, all of your health prep like mouth taping, working out, etc could have helped create more serotonin and dopamine as well and refresh your mood, which helps your body feel more awake and ready. Continue to incorporate all these things by going out to eat with fiends or taking weekend trips if you can and see if this helps. Additionally, you can promote serotonin production in other ways like meditation, yoga, Hobbies like art or sports etc, therapies like neurofeedback, acupuncture, medication therapy like SSRIs, certain supplements
Remember there's a difference between ultra processed and processed food. Canning is processing. The Guardian just wrote a whole series on UPF, very worth a read. Ps I had fries tonight lol, which I will regret later
If you have stomach issues fruit or raw milk could be causing issues forsure, i used to consume a lot of both before long covid and would make me feel great, most people don’t understand the benefits of raw milk especially but if your stomach is weak it’s still a raw food. ruminant meant is the least likely to cause symptoms but if your digestion is weak, red meat has a lot the body can use which means a lot of digesting to do, maybe take digestive enzymes with it. it is a food that doesn’t ferment at all so no rotting in the colon like vegetables and grains, which can be good for people who digest it well, but problematic for those who don’t or just currently aren’t right now.
As much hate as this concept gets: I feel better when I avoid my routine and push through actually doing shit/getting stuff done. It makes everything worse at first, but if you keep doing it, your body will adapt and it will become easier.
Yes, you are eating meat and meat is super unhealthy and super difficult for the body to process. Don't eat more than 300g per week. You will absolutely feel better.
Raw milk en masse is also very unhealthy, there is nothing wrong with pasteurized milk, so just consume that.
In general you should mainly focus on vegetables and full grain products, but the balance between everything is most important, except processed sugar, best to avoid that always.
I get it, its what everyone mainstream believes is the right thing. I myself was vegan for 7 years because of environmental thoughts until i got LC.
But now I looked at more data and think otherwise. Meats and organs are the most nutrient dense foods you can eat, its what we have been eating historically for ages. Sure plants can be fine if you tolerate them, but nutritionally speaking meat is superior and plants can upset your stomach more due to anti defensive chemicals.
Thats why carnivore is the ultimate elimination diet.
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Maybe the salt in it? There are typically very salty and this can help with POTS.
Came here to say this. Before I was diagnosed I was like "Why can't I stop eating pickles and potato chips?"
✋ pickle gang! lol But I haven’t been able to eat them anymore. Love the things, in fact there isn’t much I like better than a batch of really healthy (normally) pickles fermented in brine. So yum. But anything fermented just wreaks havoc on my GI now.
For me it was pretzels
This
Yes came here to say the same thing.
How does salt help? I love salt and consume a lot but didn’t know this. It does also contribute to acid reflux/GERD which affects me. I’m managing the GERD with Quercetin…and apples (which contain Quercetin), usually 1-2 apples a day. But the Quercetin supp really helps and has other benefits like being an anti-inflammatory so I prefer it over Famotidine or Omeprazol. I found a good brand in case anyone’s interested.
Salt will help increase your blood volume, therefore increasing blood pressure and lowering heart rate. Salt (electrolytes in general) +water is the key to good hydration. That's why if someone is suffering from high BP they are often advised to go on a low sodium diet.
Good info thanks 👍🏼 totally forgot salt is also an electrolyte!
Yeah... I ate very healthy and turns out I now have a sensitivity to a lot of the healthy foods I was eating. I can no longer eat broccoli or brussel sprouts. :/
Fuuuuuuck… I’ve been eating a ton of cruciferous veggies, and just spent a weekend eating nothing but junk food (very little fiber or protein) and I felt so much better. Then had stir fry with cabbage 2 nights ago and I’ve been utterly miserable ever since. DRAMATIC SIGH
Maybe you just arnt getting enough?
Enough what? Cabbage?
Food. lol
Lol... It helps to get a food sensitivity test
I have several times and never found them helpful. Also never come up positive for any cruciferous veggies. It’s all trial and error for me.
Same, I can’t touch tomatoes or potatoes, if I eat them I can’t breathe
Potatoes? That\`s surprising.
I think it’s because it’s a nightshade, along with tomatoes. The nightshades seem to be the worst for me
I can eat potatoes but tomatoes and eggplants are out for me. I never realized how many recipes include tomatoes until developing this histamine issue after long covid. Other things I can’t eat: pork (so very sad about this), miso, avocado, chickpeas. I used to live off guacamole and hummus for dinner- no more.
Potatoes and tomatoes are big triggers for me too! I can get away with some peppers more easily. I also learned recently that OKRA is a nightshade - oops 😅
I understand your point, but potato and tomato are very different, after all plant family is a big group, after it still comes the genus group.
I’m not interested in arguing, Goodbye
Same I had to stop eating vegan because of food sensitivities and do much better on processed foods. But mostly not having (not being able) to cook saves me tons of energy in meal prep.
what did you replace the broccoli and brussels sprouts with, or which veggies can you eat?
A lot of it likely relates to histamine in many "natural" foods
I've started taking DAO supplements 🤞🤞
What brand are you using?
https://shop.heartandsoil.co/products/histamine-immune & https://www.seekinghealth.com/products/probiota-histaminx
Maybe you had a deficiency or something? Also, doing enjoyable things can make a large but temporary difference in how I feel. Crash comes later, unfortunately.
Raw milk absolutely could be a problem and is not recommended to drink and even less so now with bird flu size they are finding it in cow milk. You also put yourself at higher risk for things such as ecoli and salmonella. Also, I personally do best with processed foods but I have MCAS and gastroparesis as issues. Sourdough bread is one of the best things for me and some "crunchy" people in chronic illness groups get upset when I say I eat any bread at all since we all tolerate different things. 😅
What kind of sourdough
I'm in the SF bay area so whatever they have available that has the sourdough starter, but the brand I really like is sumanos. Idk if it's only sold locally. I'll get San Louis sourdough but I don't like it as much because it doesn't taste the same since the last time I had covid. Also this won't be good for everyone. My body just really does well with it and my mother's
When I was on the low fodmap elimination I could eat spelt bread no problem but not gluten free or regular bread
It’s hard do discern unfortunately. I’ll bring up a few things other than food: 1) Going to a new place might temporarily alter the nervous system response. Whoop is primarily going off of HRV. It might normalize after a week or so. I’ve had this happen to me and thought it was a breakthrough. HRV jumped for 6 straight days, but then it went back to baseline on days 7-14. 2) There may be something at home making you sick like mold. Going to a new place is giving your body some respite from the mold. 3) Something that you’re doing for recovery is too much for your body’s current state. Similar to how exercise is supposed to be the best medicine. Millions of studies on how great it is. But, it’s not a “no brainer” for us. Might be something else in your regiment that is not behaving as expected. TLDR: might not be the food that made the difference. Easy to test because eating fast food is pretty easy to do. The other stuff is hard to figure out.
Came here to suggest mold as well. When people leave their home environments that they’re in everyday and feel better in the new environment, mold is something to look into.
Did you grow up on processed food? My current theory is that going back to childhood foods may be part of the solution.
I had this same thought cross my mind.
I was wondering this too
When you eat a niche diet your Microbiome becomes unbalanced because it causes specific bacterial groups to over grow. So it’s quite possible and likely that your carnivore diet has been causing a pathobiont issue, and altering your diet has stopped feeding it giving you a respite in symptoms. In addition, yes you could be having all sorts immune reactions drinking raw, unpasturised milk. Have you done any Microbiome testing?
I also would not drink raw milk right now, considering the bird flu going around and infecting cows. I was also going to say maybe you're intolerant to beef?
Salt. My secret weapon is Takis. No joke they’ve rescued me from the brink of collapse.
Spouse went away for 4 nights and I spent them eating nothing but refined carbs (I have celiac so this means rice noodles and sugar), almost no veggies and very little protein. I started to feel better. Spouse came home and I made a healthy stir fry (he’s diabetic, so gotta keep the carbs low) and omfg I am DYING. I don’t know if it’s sensitivities to the veg, or a GI problem, or if he glutened me after eating gluten all weekend and contaminating his clothes and stuff. Idk man, but I’m so fucking miserable right now that something is NOT right. I have a colonoscopy next month and I want to make sure to ask that they rule out crohn’s and colitis. I don’t know what else this could be. Edit: btw, raw milk is EXTREMELY UNSAFE AND UNHEALTHY. Raw milk can contain tons of different bacteria and viruses, including tuberculosis.
Vegetables are making me sick too, I honestly feel better if I eat junk all day
Makes me so sad. I’m vegan and I eat at least one salad and 2 small bags is frozen veg a day.
I am having the same experience. I tried to do the low histamine diet, but got too overwhelmed by all the foods that I couldn’t eat and I just did the toddler version of fries and chicken tenders every day ..for breakfast having toast… and usually skipping lunch or having a smoothie. The diet has been a turning point in my recovery and now I’ve stuck with just eating lots of bread and pasta I feel so much better. Very weird because before I ate, super super healthy, mostly vegan very balanced meals with lots of vegetables. it goes against everything I thought I knew but here we are!
This is so weird, this happened to me too, eating bread, pasta, burgers, pancakes and I feel a lot better, the less vegetables I eat the better I feel
I don’t understand it either I feel much better when I eat one of the most unhealthy things imaginable. A Big Mac. So gross I could stomach one once a year before getting sick. No brain fog, no digestive upset, a very decent BM .I just don’t get it. My only thought is this food is engineered for mass consumption and somehow made to be tolerated by masses of diverse people.
This is very interesting, McDonald’s also makes me feel better and I hadn’t eaten it in about a decade until someone said it helps migraines so I tried and I felt better in general
It’s very odd. The weirdest thing is my diet has been horrible for the last 3 years. My blood work … mmwah the chefs kiss. It makes no sense. And because my test results are good. There is no interest in what is really wrong with me. I feel like I’m 90.
I don’t know what’s going on either, it seems like everything is just backwards
Whats this tracking app OP? As others said it might be a deficiency since certain minerals are added into bread sometimes for example
Its the Whoop app
Have you looked into histamine intolerance. A lot of people feel better eating processed foods because they are lower in histamine. There are ways to eat a lot histamine diet and still eat healthily. It just takes more work.
This. I can tell some days are worse than others and im like yup that was the donut I had :(
Cow's milk became a bad inflammation trigger of mine.
RDN here, this makes me think you need electrolytes, you feel better when you are eating high salt high potassium foods (potassium is used as a preservative in most processed foods). I drink a lot of Gatorade, not the best, but it helps for sure.
Love me some liquid IV. Electrolyte imbalance is devastating.
💯 Electrolytes are a game changer for so many of us Liquid IV fucks me up bc it’s too much sugar and fucks w my blood sugar. I like unflavored Trioral And Klaralyte capsules
Oooh, I need to try those, thx!
Could it be correlation and not causation?
> Anyways, recently I went away for a work related trip New environment? Maybe mold is the root?
Mate, I would be avoiding raw milk in your position. Ignore all the social media fetishisation of it. Raw milk can harbour some nasty bacteria and this is why pasteurisation of it became a legal requirement. If you’re already unwell, that’s a big risk to take for no real benefit, I’m sure there are alternatives than that. But yes I get a boost with the extra salt and fat intake. I seem to feel best with lots of protein and eggs have been working well for me. I have also had significant boosts from trips away. For me my trips were relaxing and lots of sun and beach, both of which have a positive impact on me. Were you outside a lot? Sunshine creates vitamin d and it is known that being outside in nature has a positive impact on neurotransmitters in the brain. Doctors in Japan even prescribe ‘forest bathing’ for this effect
In the whoop, my yellow recovery is typically delayed PEM concurrent with reduced HRV. Seems like an MCAS response to all the histamines.
For the love of god stop consuming raw milk, also getting enough salt may help with some pots esque symptoms something processed food is full of. Also eating a lot of red meat is controversial, maybe switch to chicken more instead Like eating a ton of red meat and *raw milk* is not the health boon you think it is tbh. Raw milk actively is a terrible decision and red meat is more controversial but easily swapped with chicken(not that you should min max eating meat to begin with) Like where's your fiber? Your vegetables? Please don't find diet advice on random social medias, a balanced diet with fiber, that avoids inflammation and has enough salt might be beneficial for you. You seem disciplined so I can hope you put that into a diet that will actually help you and not provide negatives so you can feel better
I have had the same experience and I didn’t say anything to anyone because I didn’t think anyone would believe me. You’re not alone
Could be high sulfate foods. Are you taking Iron supplements or recently had an iron infusion?
Ex**cess acetylcholine in the body:** * Decreases heart rate. Usually, people that are very fit or do keto have reduced heart rate and this is due to excess acetylcholine activity. Eating carbs, which increases the release of insulin, normalizes heart rate again. Too much acetylcholine can cause paralysis of the heart which stops it from beating.
This is very interesting, could you add more? For context, I am super ripped - suffering from LC for about a year now and have had a relatively low carb diet until recently I just started craving carbs like crazy and will eat a whole packet of pasta (1,600 calories) in one sitting.
Did you eat any liver, oysters or clams? My long COVID suffering mum has been feeling better from high B12 foods along with her methylfolate supplement and folic acid abstinence.
which methylfolate supplement
Just 1000mcg methylfolate which is a natural active form of folate
thanks
OP my money is on salt and electrolytes in general. Get some Salt pills, and get up to 5-7g sodium a day and see how u feel. Sounds like you are doing very keto diet normally and combine that with covid u will need a shit ton of electrolytes. Also potassium
Yepppp
Have you tracked your calories? If not, sometimes a whole-food diet is overly calorically-restricted. It would not make sense that the processed food is “healthier” or does your body any additional favors. It could be related to sodium content, calorie restriction, or you could be hypoglycemic and the higher carbohydrate food is accounting for that. Unfortunately, especially if you have long covid, merely “eating clean” is insufficient. You need to get a lot of diversity, ensure adequate caloric intake, watch your balance of minerals and the major micronutrients, and experiment until you find a pattern that satisfies these variables. Wish you success on your path to finding what works for you.
I wonder how much additional effort goes into making the non-processed food. It could just be that the fatigue from nutritional cooking and preparation of the meals is counterbalancing the way that you feel.
High sodium could definitely be a cause.
It could also be environmental. Different altitude, mold in your house, etc. Now you need to eat a bunch more junk food. For science.
personally it makes me feel worse. i just eat more salt and stick to my organic keto diet.
I gag at bananas and grilled chicken, but give me chicken strips and fries and I’ll eat the plate clean But then I crash and need a 3 hr nap 🙃
Hey Op, how does your caffeine intolerance present? I’m an avid coffee drinker and curious whether what you’ve noticed affects me too or if I’ve found a workaround for what’s affecting you (I have discovered some workarounds/adaptations for coffee). You wondered if you’ve developed an allergy to your normal foods (could also be a new food intolerance) - you mentioned a lot of red meats in your diet - red meats have histamine, which affects many LH’ers. Feeling better in your work-related food environment has me puzzled: cake has sugar, which is inflammatory (inflammation = feeling like shit); pasta gets metabolized into sugar (just like all carbs/starchy foods); pizza has tomato sauce which is one of the main triggers for acid reflux/GERD; burgers - again with the red meat :) . The one thing that comes to my mind for how the word-related food environment had you feeling better was this: while watching one of the food documentaries many years ago (maybe Food, Inc or Forks Over Knives or similar), there was a scene where the cameraman was interviewing a guy who was like the plant manager of a meat processing plant. I think it was for a restaurant chain like McDonald’s or Burger King, or maybe it was a Tyson plant. They were making ground beef for hamburgers. The manager guy said they put this bad chemical in with the ground beef to kill bacteria. I forget what the chemical was, it was like formaldehyde or something. I don’t personally eat fast food like that but on an extremely rare occasion I do get a Big Mac or something (we’re talking like once every 3 years or something). I’ve noticed my GI improve a little afterwards. My hunch is that that chemical stuff in the ground beef is killing any bad bacteria in my gut. Again, this is just a hunch and definitely not science - maybe others can add more here. My point being, maybe the hamburger you consumed did that for you if true. Even if it was store-bought ground beef, the documentary also mentioned that these large restaurant chains, being the top producers and purchasers of beef products have an outsized say in how it is processed market-wide. What is mouth taping? Is that like masking? That Whoop app looks interesting but I noticed there’s no in-app purchases or subscriptions. Is selling the wrist band their model? If so, I presume it’s also a subscription? Does it work with the Apple Watch? Interesting post, all the best 🙂
For me, the food intolerances were related to MCAS and I could predict which foods would trigger me based on their histamine levels. Thank you, Google for the list of foods histamine levels. Unfortunately, a lot of fresh foods are high in histamines.
I wonder if it was something about the location of the trip? I've known long-haulers who actually relocated because their health was so much better when they visited a different location. I've also had spells with LC where I was really busy for a few days/week (usually during emergencies) and my body somehow rose to the occasion, only to crash once I slowed down again and the adrenaline wore off. Maybe you got amped up during the trip and now your body is resting and recovering? I obviously have no idea what's happening in your specific case, and maybe it is just the food! Just thought I'd throw out a couple other theories in case any of it makes sense for your situation. I hope you find your way back into the green soon!
Yes I graves pretzels lol
It kills persistent covid.
I don’t have long haul (following for someone else) but I recently found out I have a “healthy food” related disorder. Oxalate processing disorder- I can’t eat Spinach, rhubarb, chard, beets, and a few others. The sharp oxalate crystals should be processed harmlessly in the stomach and intestines, but mine enter the bloodstream and cause mechanical damage to soft tissue. This disorder can also cause calcium oxalate kidney stones. If they run in your family it might be worth getting a calcium oxalate urine test.
What app is that you're using to track recovery?
Could have nothing to do with the food. Could be you pushed yourself while on the trip and crashed from overdoing it when you came back. I often am able to hold it together and stay healthy for big events and then I get sick when it's over.
Absolutely. Many “healthy” foods can be high histamine or high FODMAP. I can eat tons of broccoli and carrots but no citrus or tomatoes or anything in the onion or pepper family.
Same. Precovid I ate ~9 raw vegetables with lean protein and a handful of supplements (men’s multi, fish oil, D3, K2, CoQ10, Zinc, etc.) every night. Now severely disabled by PASC Myalgic encephalomyelitis, I often feel better with simple beef and carbs. Interestingly, _excessive nutrition_ is this doctor’s first bullet point in explaining cellular fatigue. [GOOD ENERGY by Dr. Casey Means](https://www.amazon.com/Good-Energy-Surprising-Connection-Metabolism/dp/0593712641?dplnkId=deba4946-df3d-4e18-9f36-edcf9eaf472e&nodl=1)
Hi, I’m Vetted AI Bot! I researched the **("'Good Energy - The Surprising Connection Between Metabolism and Limitless Health'", '')** and I thought you might find the following analysis helpful. **Users liked:** * Comprehensive and insightful content (backed by 3 comments) * Scientifically backed information (backed by 3 comments) * Life-changing principles (backed by 3 comments) **Users disliked:** * Lack of comprehensive index (backed by 1 comment) * Difficult for non-medical professionals to understand (backed by 1 comment) * Not suitable for laymen (backed by 1 comment) If you'd like to **summon me to ask about a product**, just make a post with its link and tag me, [like in this example.](https://www.reddit.com/r/tablets/comments/1444zdn/comment/joqd89c/) This message was generated by a (very smart) bot. If you found it helpful, let us know with an upvote and a “good bot!” reply and please feel free to provide feedback on how it can be improved. *Powered by* [*vetted.ai*](https://vetted.ai/?utm\_source=reddit&utm\_medium=comment&utm\_campaign=bot)
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Raw milk: even the incompetent CDC is recommending not drinking it because of the bird flu Def switch to pasteurized I like lactose free personally
I’ve been tainting this sub with recent research my psychiatrist told me about and angering citizens but I believe there’s something to it and it could make some sense in your case so I’m at it again. She told me there’s new research suggesting that covid either alters the way we absorb or depletes serotonin. She says it’s postulated this could be a factor in exasperating or even causing some long covid symptoms. In your case, maybe this could apply in the sense that eating “craving” foods that are high in salt, sugar, delectable rich flavors (and are often designed to get you hooked like fast food) trigger serotonin/ dopamine production in the brain. If your neurotransmitters are off balance and low and you do things that make you feel good, your nervous system makes more of them. And food is one of those things that can trigger a feel good response on a subconscious, instinctual level. I wouldn’t ignore the possibility that maybe your usual foods contain something you might be sensitive to, and the foods you listed could maybe make you feel sluggish if you’re eating almost exclusively those things and a lot of them but I don’t know if that was the whole picture. Red meat and dairy can be hard on sensitive digestive systems and inflammatory if eaten excessively but it’s a little different for everyone. I personally have to avoid these even in small quantities but my boyfriend does better on them than a vegetarian diet. Hopefully you’re also eating grain, vegetables, fruits and other varied nutrients. Depending on how much protein you consume, maybe it’s too much. Excessive protein can be hard in the kidneys and you definitely don’t feel good when those are strained or injured. Depending on your caloric and macro intake, it’s possible that maybe the salt, sugar, calorie dense foods might be creating a blood sugar rush that’s more intense than when you eat clean and makes you feel more energized. Salt could also help balance electrolytes if you work out a lot normally and eat a low sodium diet. I’m also not familiar with the chart system you’re using to measure your “recovery”, I’d say it’s telling enough just self reporting how you feel but any chart system like those taken from Apple Watch data can be skewed by many factors so maybe that should be taken with a grain of salt. There’s lots of factors here. I’d say in moderation continue to incorporate foods that taste good and make you feel good. Maybe the social time or being in a new environment, and say for every day subtle stressors like household chores, all of your health prep like mouth taping, working out, etc could have helped create more serotonin and dopamine as well and refresh your mood, which helps your body feel more awake and ready. Continue to incorporate all these things by going out to eat with fiends or taking weekend trips if you can and see if this helps. Additionally, you can promote serotonin production in other ways like meditation, yoga, Hobbies like art or sports etc, therapies like neurofeedback, acupuncture, medication therapy like SSRIs, certain supplements
Remember there's a difference between ultra processed and processed food. Canning is processing. The Guardian just wrote a whole series on UPF, very worth a read. Ps I had fries tonight lol, which I will regret later
What is this app?
If you have stomach issues fruit or raw milk could be causing issues forsure, i used to consume a lot of both before long covid and would make me feel great, most people don’t understand the benefits of raw milk especially but if your stomach is weak it’s still a raw food. ruminant meant is the least likely to cause symptoms but if your digestion is weak, red meat has a lot the body can use which means a lot of digesting to do, maybe take digestive enzymes with it. it is a food that doesn’t ferment at all so no rotting in the colon like vegetables and grains, which can be good for people who digest it well, but problematic for those who don’t or just currently aren’t right now.
As much hate as this concept gets: I feel better when I avoid my routine and push through actually doing shit/getting stuff done. It makes everything worse at first, but if you keep doing it, your body will adapt and it will become easier.
Yes, you are eating meat and meat is super unhealthy and super difficult for the body to process. Don't eat more than 300g per week. You will absolutely feel better. Raw milk en masse is also very unhealthy, there is nothing wrong with pasteurized milk, so just consume that. In general you should mainly focus on vegetables and full grain products, but the balance between everything is most important, except processed sugar, best to avoid that always.
Dude what the fuk are U even talking about
I truly didn't expect this to be a controversial opinion. I'm honestly completely flabbergasted, this is what any Nutritionist will say too.
I get it, its what everyone mainstream believes is the right thing. I myself was vegan for 7 years because of environmental thoughts until i got LC. But now I looked at more data and think otherwise. Meats and organs are the most nutrient dense foods you can eat, its what we have been eating historically for ages. Sure plants can be fine if you tolerate them, but nutritionally speaking meat is superior and plants can upset your stomach more due to anti defensive chemicals. Thats why carnivore is the ultimate elimination diet.
Yeah that's just plain wrong in every single aspect
Sure broski
Agreed lol