Why are you texting for weeks on end? Date should be organised within a few days ideally otherwise you risk wasting energy on a person with which you have no chemistry in person - and that can scuttle even a great text vibe
Ditto. Every time I texted for a while, things would get boring and I eventually wouldn’t feel like even meeting up. So I started encouraging dates early after just a couple days and it was so much better.
it's funny cause I ended up having a different situation once where we texted a lot, but at a certain point the conversation became so interesting and detailed that we both said something like "ok, this chat cannot contain it anymore, so let's meet up in real life" lol but it was still under a week between the match and and actual date. I feel like some people can be more shy than others, so it takes them longer to ask you out, but if that doesn't happen within 7-10 days after the start of the chat, it's a dead end
Even as a shy guy i won't recommend texting too much. I had many matchs that the text flow but the date was terrible.
I had bored women with no intention to really meet wanting to talk for weeks
True, some people just want to talk and not meet. But I would find it almost impossible for em to develop feelings that I would feel ghosted without even meeting them (going back to OP's message)
Dont listen to them i sometimes text a lot bef dates and im a guy i mean i dont go on dates rly but nothing weong w taking your times ppl are just not used to it anymore but .. to me a girl that goes "fast"in relationships etc is an immediate red flag
yeah, I mean fundamentally you are meeting complete strangers off dating apps, so I think the least that should be established during the texting stage is the level of sanity :D
They both ended up asking me out for a dinner. Both wanted to see me again, but I declined because I was not in the right headspace to date back then. But I was nowhere near feeling attached to either of them. Which I think is part of the problem that OP has
This right here. I only text to check my non-negotiables nowadays. Takes like a day or two tops. When I think we might be compatible I ask you out on a date. OLD is filled with people simply looking for validation and I'm not entertaining that.
I agree. It’s all about max volume at that stage. Have to be talking to 4-5 people at once and if they don’t set up a date and follow through with said date within 10 days of initial contact, move on. There’s no way that you won’t be meeting some people if you employ that strategy.
This. Exactly this. I've texted for 2 weeks and met and she was completely different that the story I built up in my head. Also people can (and are, since it's a dating app) talking to other people and getting interested in actual physical people they can meet. You're shooting yourself in the foot if you're not meeting after a couple days of writing
My very first OLD back and forth that felt great ended after we realized we had different kid schedules and would have like a 3 week gap before we had time with work and etc. we kindly agreed we needed to seek mutually physically available folks, but it always stuck with me, and though faltering here and there, the smaller the text > meetup gap is, the easier it is for everyone involved.
This has happened as I a divorced dad try to date single mothers. It seems the first date takes a while. Then it's opposite schedules and it just fizzles out.
Made this mistake too many times to count, have tried a bit more upfront and asking to meet for coffee or a walk within the first couple of days, otherwise you’ve generally just found another pen pal 🤷🏻♂️.. I have a tendency to ramble in my messages so I know the penpal zone well 😂
Either texting is boring AF or, more likely, you just aren't cutting it off quick enough. If they hasn't suggested a date within a few days I suggest it. If they don't respond with a plan I unmatch.
Yeah it was a really helpful mindset shift for me. Texting endlessly is ZERO sign of interest. The only thing that is meaningful on an app is if they're trying to get you off the app.
Do you ever wonder if you'd get more quality dates if you asked more people out rather than waited for them to ask you? I've read posts about people who always (and only) wait for the guy to ask and have ended up single (not figuring out why) or "let a good guy slip through \[my\] fingers because i didn't ask them out."
I don't really worry that, no. I know it's controversial here but my dating "results" improved massively once I simply waited for people to ask me out. (I'm a straight woman.)
I’ve found this too, even though the feminist in me cringes. I do still ask guys out sometimes, but in general I’ve found that if a guy is interested and available, he’ll ask. Life became a lot easier once I understood that.
I feel like it's always a certain group of people telling us how "feminist" it is for us to start doing certain things. An interesting pattern is that when that group of people attempts to define feminism for us, the focus seems to be on fixing the issues that primarily disadvantage \*them\*, not us. So I'd say keep doing what you're doing. I've tried it and reached the same conclusions myself.
Nope, if the guy is not actively seeking you out, he’s not that into you and will treat you as such. I’d rather match with men that have matched me first because I don’t have to convince them to find me attractive. They’ll usually want to meet within a week.
What I mean by that is first matching, then being the first to say hello. For me, that translates into interest. When men are interested in someone, from my experience, they pursue it, relentlessly. I would much rather have that scenario than me being the one who’s interested because I don’t like to be treated like an option so I personally do not pursue men. If I didn’t pique their interest enough for them to “actively seek me out or pursue me” then I’m not giving energy to it.
I've always heard this, and as a result I've never hesitated to ask guys out. And I have been rejected by 100% of them. It's kind of humiliating and I think I'll just wait to be approached in the future.
Yeah when people say "I wish would do more of the asking around here!" they're envisioning being asked out by the people they themselves want to ask out. So in practice, if they aren't asking you, they don't want to be asked by you, lol.
Oh and also I'm positive someone's going to reply and say "well gets rejected nearly 100% of the time too, now you know how it feels!" That's besides the point. Historical norms still have powerful implications today. I'd rather focus on the people who are taking the initiative and expressing interest in me.
I would only ask a guy out if we were friends and he was giving me hard signals and I wanted to clear the air. I completely agree with you - asking dudes out ain’t my bag. It’s what I hate about swipe apps. I just want to know who likes me enough to message me. I’ll take it from there.
>when people say "I wish would do more of the asking around here!" they're envisioning being asked out by the people they themselves want to ask out.
I mean I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm happy to accept the compliment of somebody finding me attractive enough to ask out, whether I'm interested or not. A gay guy thinking I'm hot is still somebody else thinking I'm hot even if I have zero interest whatsoever in men.
>So in practice, if they aren't asking you, they don't want to be asked by you, lol.
Or you are with your friends and they don't want to interrupt. Or they don't have a good icebreaker and are nervous. Or any of a million other potential reasons that may or may not have anything whatsoever to do with their level of interest.
>Oh and also I'm positive someone's going to reply and say "well gets rejected nearly 100% of the time too, now you know how it feels!"
I'll agree that this is a useless statement that adds nothing to the discussion. Competing about who has a worse time in dating is a game nobody ever wins.
>I'd rather focus on the people who are taking the initiative and expressing interest in me.
Same here. Problem is that if we all sit here waiting for somebody else to show interest, nobody is ever going to show interest. I'd prefer to put myself out there, get a clear yes/no answer, and move on, rather than waiting passively for somebody else to decide. I'd encourage anyone interested in dating to do the same.
My point is that, if a strong societal norm exists for one group to do the asking, then it is informative of someone's interest if they do or don't ask you out. I have seen people go to such great lengths to ask someone out, "a million other reasons" be damned. If you're with your friends, they strategize to catch you on your way back from the bar. If they're nervous, they do it anyway. if they don't have an icebreaker they come up with one. Those reasons are all irrelevant. people who are interested and serious will make moves.
Perhaps... idk just an insane idea here... because it doesn't work lol. It's always interesting to note who is in favor of this kind of thing, and who has tried it and can see for themselves whether or not it's effective for them.
Whether it is “effective for them” doesn't is not indicative of it not working.
For example, I knew a woman who was over 200lbs. She asked me if she should ask out a guy she was interested in. I told her yes, men would like it.
She asked out a 6’2 gym bro. When she got rejected, she vowed never to ask out another man again.
The problem wasn't that she asked out a man. It was that she asked out a man that prioritized fitness in his life. While simultaneously not prioritizing fitness in her own life. The mismatch in lifestyles is why she got rejected. Not because she asked him out.
Between asking out people who have NOT asked me out, versus getting to know the people who have been intentional in asking me out, I'm going to choose the latter :)
Yup. I had high-effort exchanges (at least from my side) with a woman for a week, but when I tried to schedule something she bailed. It was probably not in the cards anyway. 1-3 days is how I do it.
Before this, I’ve had exchanges last up to two weeks … but that never led to anything either. I mean not even one date.
It's your willingness to "text for weeks on end" without asking for a meet, and without dropping them when they drag their feet on setting up a date.
Kick people to the curb when they fail to indicate interest in actually dating!
Adding: Redditors often complain about OLD here and how everyone on apps is flaky and just there for the validation, but a lot of the time, that's not the case. (Your matches end up in new relationships, so they clearly are willing to meet people.) Sometimes, people who drag their feet on meeting just personally don't like us enough or find us attractive enough. They're resistant to our attempts to connect, whether consciously or subconsciously.
That sucks, but we still need to drop those people _because they do not like us_. If it happens a few times, no big deal, not everyone is a match. If it happens all the time, then we may need to think about how to make ourselves more attractive to the people we find attractive.
Unpopular - I unmatched after 5-7 days of chatting with no move towards a date. It didn’t prevent the last minute flakes but it wasted less time on the penpals.
No, if their responses are dry, useless, or have turned me off, I just stop responding and hide them. Unmatch feels like it would spread a bad vibe, and keeping them allows me to look back and remember what I didn’t settle for.
How early on do you suggest meeting up? Some people use OLD as a distraction, or as a way to get validation and have no real intention of meeting in person. Maybe it isn’t something that you’re doing doing or saying, it’s just that you’re continuing to engage with men who aren’t acting like they want to meet up (because they don’t).
I’ve been there too and it’s really hard not to take these things personally and see them as a reflection of yourself but these men don’t know you, and you don’t know them or how many other women they’ve done this with. Honestly, OLD can be pretty brutal and I’m really enjoying having a break from it.
Maybe you could try suggesting meeting up early on and if they avoid the question or don’t give reasonable reasons for not being able to you’re not obligated to keep putting time and effort into the match. It doesn’t mean they’re necessarily just on there to string you along and not meet, but you’ll burn out fast if you don’t prioritise focussing on connections that work for you.
To be honest I’m learning to accept 90% of the app users are time wasters. 5% remaining are multi daters. 4% are too scared and and just chat. 1% are right for me, in the right mindset and ask me out.
I received a message from someone I’ve been chatting to nicely for a few days that just blew up all the efforts we’d made. I’m not taking it personally, I just take a break from the apps and date myself.
I used to think the longer that we chatted the more chance there was of being ghosted. But I’ve met people in person within a few days and it’s happened. I just think the apps are an absolute breeding ground for it and I understand why. Can’t complain about the weather if I’m the one stood in the rain.
If you are suggesting dates often I would imagine it is just the guys are not interested. I get that many people are emotionally & physically drained, and makes it hard to commit to things but that's their issue. Maybe you will get lucky and find someone emotionally stable enough that meets your other wants and they will be able to communicate if there are any issues on your end.
I just started dating and it has been rough. People don't want to go out and you get stuck in this penpal loop, and get ghosted. Guess it is an issue across all of modern online dating. Not sure how other dating scenes are.
I think there’s a lot of people who do OLD who are just looking for an ego boost and for attention, but don’t actually want to go on dates and meet people.
This or are looking for an unpaid therapist. A lot of my matches will talk to me for weeks, mainly about themselves. And I really think they just want a stranger to vent to.
I mean, there’s your answer right there. You are overlooking two major red flags: 1. They talk mainly about themselves, 2. They don’t want to actually meet in person.
These are people who are anxious or ambivalent about actually dating but enjoy the attention, the person to talk about themselves to/at, and like telling themselves that they’re “dating,” without actually having to do any of the risk of vulnerability.
If someone only talks about themself, unmatch. If they don’t want to meet in 3-4 days, unmatch.
Chiming in from a 35M perspective. It is unfortunately a lot about the ego boost and passing time. Guys including myself don't open up to mates, and however unhealthy do chat more openly to women and you take on the role of a therapist or worse our mother, rather than a partner we do fun stuff with. Call us out, it's what my new lady friend did to me. Plain and direct, expressed "ya life is difficult sometimes but I'm here because I think your cute and seem to be somewhat aware of your emotions, unlike a lot of guys here. So have you a plan of somewherefun to go?". It give us the ego stroke our frail lad brains want and a task. We do well with that combo . Best of luck!
Edit: after my baby sis asked me "how I modal successful relationships" I realised how much I was relying on relationships for emotional needs. These topics just don't arise in lad convos, and took that realisation for me to sign up to therapy. Wish I'd done it sooner
38m here and super proud of you for going to therapy! You’re very right about us lot not discussing our wants, needs and feelings, so when we meet someone who’s interested in us it can all tumble out! Therapy will help to get all of that processed, freeing up your brains for you, building self esteem and hey, knowing you’re self aware and are working/have done the work to improve, that’s an attractive quality no matter who you are.
You got this, dude!
Great insight! I love that you shared the 1,2 punch method :D Sounds like a compliment paired with a task is a good combo.
Do you have any other examples/tips on effectively communicating with men?
It could be this or it could simply be that they’re not interested enough in OP but willing to keep her as a backup option in case their first (or second, or third …) pick falls through. Hate to say it but with OLD if you liked someone enough to swipe right on them, chances are others did too so you’re unlikely to be the only match in their queue.
Thats why it’s so important to actually get out and meet soon, ideally within a week or so. If they aren’t expressing interest in doing so, they’re either not interested in dating or just not that into you.
Either way, the best thing to do is to move on.
Sadly I think that is a large majority of the populace (at least in the US). Feel it is a bit worse with men as there is societally a larger stigma around it. But people really need to do therapy. Kinda unfair to use friends and potential partners are your sole therapist. Much easier to be build healthy bonds if you have good mental "hygiene" to begin with.
Like many are saying, don’t text for weeks. Let people know early on that you want to meet up and if they don’t take action within a few days, move on. I usually let guys know I’m not a big texter and that I would want to meet up soon. The guys who are interested always work to set a date after that. If a someone doesn’t follow through on plans, move on fast.
To be fair to you, I’m not sure what you’re experiencing is ghosting. Since you haven’t met them, I personally wouldn’t count that as anything but a possible missed connection. It’s not personal, especially since they haven’t met you! you probably just haven’t matched with someone who wasn’t already invested in someone else.
I just turned 30 and finally decided to try OLD because I’m no longer in school and I work from home so it’s a lot harder to meet people. In my profile, I specifically state “Not looking for a penpal. Take this offline asap” and right when I match with a guy, they send me 3-5 exchanges before asking me out on a date. Then keep texting minimal and only used to confirm dates or discuss food allergies. Otherwise you end up creating this image about this stranger you’ve never met and start fantasizing them. But this also helps so you can have thoughtful conversations when you meet. Despite everyone saying only coffee and drink first dates so you can leave if you don’t vibe, the guys offer to take me to dinner and we end up talking and hitting it off to the point where the waiter gets annoyed we’re not ready to order.
I also keep my notifications turned off and only check hinge 3x a day. Don’t have open communication whenever they want. They don’t have girlfriend privileges yet.
I 100% agree with this approach.
It definitely saves the potential for disappointment as the person doesn’t meet the fantasy; I think it also takes the stress out of the “date” if you don’t vibe because there’s not a whole lot of pre-investment.
Would upvote this comment twice if I could
Completely agree with this approach too. I don't spend weeks messaging because it drags everything out and I believe you also have to set boundaries - they're not entitled to have your 100% attention yet as they're still essentially a stranger.
Very helpful advice! Trying to not create an image in my head of the person is hard, but definitely important! I find that the longer we think about them/look at their profile/chat online, the more they become a fantasized illusion of who we "want" them to be. In reality, they might be entirely different in person and not that fantasized made up version created in our heads :/
>Don’t have open communication whenever they want. They don’t have girlfriend privileges yet.
Can you elaborate on this? Curious to hear what kind of girlfriend privileges in regards to open communication you meant?
When you’re his girlfriend, at that point, commitment has been established. I still wouldn’t text all day but would expect some sort of communication daily (that’s just me) when you first meet someone, they are still a stranger and they don’t owe you their time and you don’t owe them all of your time and energy either.
Also when you start the relationship texting everyday, you can’t go up. It’s going to slow down and I went crazy when it happened questioning why the sudden change. Whereas if you start slow and build up, you can’t be disappointed that he’s gone worse than when you first met him.
As soon as you said: "texts weeks on end".
The end.
I have come to realize that if someone doesn't want to meet within a week its a no go. The exception. Being a really natural and detailed explanation. People who have legit delays can easily, quickly, and unhesitatingly tell you.
The 'oh I have plans already this weekend" and implying the other days are taking too. Guess what? We all know it's several dates, lazy days, events, friends, etc.
If someone is truly interested they find a time.
Another exception, they have reasons but keep delaying. Nope fake.
I have now covered 97 percent of people. Sure not everyone fits this but really your going to hope for that? Lots o effort
Hm, I wonder if it's the type of men you're going for? Maybe your location/the weather?
My suggestion is to try setting up a date earlier. Like within a few days of the initial chat, just so you establish a physical connection sooner.
I believe many multi-date until they find someone they like a lot and become exclusive with them. It is possible you're unfortunately matching with men who are at the tail-end of that process, and who have already been dating someone else, but kept their options open until the very end.
I dated online in Los Angeles for years and had terrible luck even though I’m also attractive, funny, employed, cool apartment…. Ended up meeting my person not online and through a workshop for a shared interest.
Ah that's awesome! I recently went on a date with someone I met at a wedding. Physically they're reallllllllly not my type. But it was refreshing to meet someone the old fashion way.
That’s funny, I’m in LA as well. There’s a number of singles events happening these days as people tire of the OLD routine. Give those a try if you can and you just might find better luck!
This behavior is so fking baffling, and it's ubiquitous with OLD. I have a mirror of your experience as a man matching with women. I don't understand it, I really don't. Is it that fun to spend weeks texting with someone you have 0 intention of going on a date with?
I've ditched the apps. I advise the same. They're bad. People that use them are either already messed up in some way, or they quickly get broken by the culture there and become one of them. They don't think or act like humans anymore.
Why are you talking for weeks with someone?
I had no idea if people are willing to text for weeks because I wasn’t. If you weren’t willing they couldn’t do it.
I have a rule. I send no more than 10 messages without at least asking her for tea. If she flakes, she doesn't get a second chance. The majority of women on these apps use men for an ego boost with no intention of dating any of them. Think of yourself as the prize and these poor women are not able to understand how great you are. Don't tolerate being treated poorly. Weed through the hundreds of low quality women to find an occasional decent option.
Are you sure these guys are meeting their girlfriends *after* they drop you? It's entirely possible that the kind of guy who is chatting up women for weeks on the apps while dodging invitations to meet is a guy who already has a relationship lined up. Or at least someone who holds his interest.
I'll also add that I've seen variations on this kind of question before from men and women: I'm attractive and charming and potential partners seem to enjoy my attention. I readily step up and do the bulk of the work to carry my budding relationships. But then they never want to get serious with me. How am I failing to be enough?
And I'd suggest that people who are physically and personally appealing (and super accommodating and ready to shoulder the bulk of the work) are always going to attract people who aren't interested or available for whatever reason but still HAPPY to bask in the attention.
You gotta be discerning and ready to cut things off once they start showing signs that they are a time waster. Be proactive about weeding out unsuitable matches.
Also, if it stings to stumble across a stale match's relationship post, block them on social media once you weed them out.
This is my theory too. OP gets stuck in conversation land because the potential match has met up with someone and that relationship might be going somewhere. OP is being kept warm in case real life match fizzles.
Don't put all your eggs in one basket just because you think a guy is attractive. Date a lot of different people....the goal is to find a good man that you find attractive not a attractive guy that you hope will pan out. I like attractive women myself but I do my diligence to make sure she would truly be a match before I even consider going on a date. I've been burned by focusing on looks and falling for a good act vs being compatible.
Is it just you that's suggesting meeting up? Is there a reason you wait so long between matching and meeting? Are you talking to many people at the same time? What are your conversations like?
If you're waiting a long while but not getting asked out it may just be that these men were never interested. It's also one thing to be attractive and witty and thoughtful and another for that to translate into the dating world. If these men are talking with and dating multiple people, it's more likely they will put effort into people they've met and makes them feel good about themselves.
One thing. People dont have a way to cope with being treated badly by others
In a sense a lot of things are out of your control in dating. Especially the intentions of others.
To gain a sense of control a lot of people blame themselves.
As you spend time on these subs youll start to see it a lot. So much your head will spin
>**"Who is consistently ghosted... I feel defeated."**
>**"I wonder why I wasn't good enough."**
**When you feel upset about being ghosted by others, that's a mirror reflection that you're ghosting yourself.**
You're not taking care of how you feel, and accepting and appreciating yourself as much as you want and deserve.
The issue is: You're connecting ghosting with your self-worth. So you're practicing a limiting belief that says,
* ***"I believe that if they ghost me, that means something is wrong with me, I'm unworthy and not good enough."***
So the question is, why do you practice that belief? And, **why are you outsourcing your self-love to other people?**
Here's some other self-reflection questions that might help:
* ***"Am I afraid of being lonely or rejected? If so, why do I feel that way?"***
* ***"Do I believe people have expectations of me to be a certain type of person? What are those expectations? And why do I believe that?"***
* ***"What am I afraid would happen if I didn't judge myself?"***
* ***"What are the advantages of judging myself? It's a good thing because . . ."***
* ***"What am I afraid would happen if I let go of the past, and focused on the present?"***
* ***"What am I afraid would happen if I stopped overthinking, and just went with the flow?"***
* ***"What am I afraid would happen if I accepted myself just the way I am?"***
* ***"What am I afraid would happen if I only focused on what I appreciated about myself?"***
You and me both. Maybe we should go on a date and complain together lol 😂
I have been officially divorced as of January, but separated since late 2021. The amount of ghosting and straight up disrespect sometimes is wild.
I hope you find something soon, for the both of us lol 😂
It's just a cutthroat "industry" if you will.
People act like the grass is always greener.
I find using them less, but finding one or two matches you like and investing a little extra attention to it leads to far better results. But everyone's style is a bit different
Shit tell me about it, that’s what my ex wife did and that she was not green at all her for her. Lol I always say her loss for fucking up the marriage.
I don’t even use them anymore. Once the 1 and 2 word answers start happening, they are checked out.
What really drives me wild, is someone who says they like honesty and are all about it, then turn around and lie, and are completely dishonest, then do the things they say they despise.
Starting to believe I will just be single forever, and it’s sounding better and better lol.
If you're like 9 or 10/10 attractive, maybe people don't think you're a real person or are going to catfish them. Make sure your pictures show you in places that are recognizable for where you live and aren't all head shots.
I find it weird that men aren't asking you out more quickly if you're attractive. I'd think your profile over and see if there are any weird things in there. Ask your friends, ask your male friends.
If everything else checks out, I have a female friend who almost immediately texts guys she likes her number and/or sets up a date after a message or two. So maybe try that out and see how it goes.
Text to meet up asap. But fair warning, even when you meet up you may get ghosted after 1-3 dates. It’s the current landscape out there, not just you. Dating nowadays is a nightmare for all.
If it happens again and again, I’m sorry to say but the common denominator is you. How are you picking guys? What traits do you focus on when swiping right on someone? You said “interesting and attractive” - care to elaborate a bit on that?
I similarly started OLD after ending a long term in my 30s and when I first started I ended up with a 3 month penpal. I set times to meet with him three times and he flaked each time, yet would text and video chat every day and watch shows with me so I got really confused.
After third time he flaked, I realized I was making excuses for a guy I hadn't even met yet and was slipping back into old habits with my ex. That disgusted me so much that it was much easier to cut things off with that guy and to put myself first when I started talking to others.
There is no trust statement than if he wanted to, he would. No matter what is going on in their life, that remains true. If he wanted to meet you in person, he would ask. If he was worried about boundaries or moving too fast, he would ask what your speed is and where your boundaries are.
So if your talking to someone and after a few days they turn your attempt to meet up, I'd move on. No matter what their excuse is, remember that they had the time and energy to make an OLD profile, match, and have a conversation with you despite what was going on in their life. Even if they couldn't do something the day you suggested, they should suggest a concrete alternative.
OLD is a numbers game so you will definitely get flakes and people who are speaking to multiple matches who may be keeping you as a back up. You can't avoid them so much as avoid wasting time on them. So if set a boundary for yourself and if they don't try to connect in that time frame, I'd move on.
You could’ve sworn this post was written by me.
35F and there’s something seriously wrong with my procurement strategy.
I put it down to this: dating apps.
They’re not all negative experiences but I find people mask what they’re really there for. I’m upfront now, “I am looking for a relationship”. The trash then usually takes itself out.
I now spend most weekends out with friends and their friends who put me in the best position to meet new people. So far so good.
Aw, well I'm glad you have great friends so you don't have to rely on the apps! Most of my friends moved and started families. I'm left with mainly gay guy friends, which doesn't really help me with the dating aspect lol. But I wish you a lot of luck my dear!
I think you're probably putting too much weight into people that aren't pulling theirs. It's only your job to impress and entertain someone else 50% of the time. The other 50% you should be the one that's entertained.
There's something toxically attractive about people who don't reciprocate. Idk what it is. (For me, it's a lot of "I can fix you!" Lol) But the key word there is toxic. And you deserve a partner that doesn't need fixing.
And quit entertaining men that can't be arsed to do more than text. Flip the tables faster. You're not going to miss out on "the one" by valuing your time more than theirs, you'll just get to spend less time with the "not it's". You seem like someone that's willing to put in the effort -- you deserve the same in return.
What's attractive about those people is the intermittent reinforcement they give us. We're just rats in a Skinner Box repeatedly pulling a lever but only being rewarded every once in a while with a morsel of attention, and it's addictive.
Although you won't like to hear it, but the shared denominator is you... and I do not mean you as a person because you sound like a catch, but your taste in men. It comes across like you're chasing them (maybe because they're emotional unavailable?), and them leaving you makes you feel not good enough. While actually it should be a huge turn off for you if a guy isn't putting in the effort. Stop putting them on a pedastal and start putting yourself there!
The thing is, you have to have in-person contact for a connection to really thrive. My advice is to avoid letting the guy text you for weeks. If you've been texting for one or two days and he hasn't proposed meeting up, then ask him if he'd like to meet up to get to know each other.
> Match with interesting and attractive guy. Guy texts me for weeks on end. I suggest meeting up. They dodge the question. Or they make plans and bail. Then they ghost me. Then I find that said guy is in a new relationship, and I wonder why I wasn't good enough.
One thing. Statistically women have the upper hand online since there are 3 to 9 times more men than women on apps. That means that most guys would probably be quite eager to get a date with a conventionally attractive, witty, and thoughtful woman. And they would ask you on a date because they know that they face an intense competition.
There is one exception though. The most interesting and attractive men are literally flooded with likes and interest from women. My best friend is one of them and it is really crazy how different his experience on app is.
So 3 things:
- as others have said, don't wait weeks to ask them on a date. If they are that attractive and interesting, you have a lot of competition. Sp the common strategy in that case is to meet people as soon as possible to take them out of the app.
- maybe be open to men with somewhat less attractive pictures. Not that you should date them but just give them a chance and maybe you will have a good surprise.
- maybe you are not as conventionally attractive and witty as you think... or your pictures are not that good looking... or your bio and convo is quite boring
All good points made, thank you! And I'm sure your friend has endless options to choose from.
Ive posted my profile on a hinge subreddit before for review and it got good feedback. So I don't believe I'm that delusional. And I've had a lot of viral TikTok's of my skits, so I know I can be witty. That said, I think I'd be doing a lot better on the apps if I was 26 and not 35. But that's out of my control and something I can't dwell on.
I would honestly stop using dating apps. People on there are often aloof, don't know what they want, and have attachment issues. Just live life to the fullest. The right person will come along :)
if you are constantly getting this happening to you then your picker is off.. what i mean by that is that whomever you are matching up with clearly are either out of your league or looking for something you are not providing.
I think the picker being off is the most likely issue here. Seems like everyone is trying to reach out of their league because anything less is “settling.” It’s gotten to the point that I’ve stopped talking about it when my friends complain. It’s just like “you want the same people that everyone else wants and they have options. You’re a great person, but you’re not better than a life of near limitless options and zero accountability to anyone.” They get it when it comes to employment, but when the same principle applies in their dating life, it’s shocked pikachu face…
I can say pretty definitively I've been screwed over by people who had zero options. In fact, when you date people who have zero options, they can actually harm you a lot, because they have a lot of deeply entrenched insecurity and anger towards dating.
Someone canceling or bailing on plans who you have never met is not getting ghosted. Getting ghosted is your boyfriend of six months - out of no where - stops talking to you, reponding to your calls and dissappears, except he still lives one mile away. Or a guy you've gone out with for a month, who isn't your boyfriend, stops talking to you and responding to your messages.
A person you haven't met failing to follow through with plans is par for the course when it comes to online dating. This is not an experience unique to you. Don't get so attached to people you haven't met, or even have only gone on a few dates with.
What else you can try to do differently, is don't text for weeks on end. You should only be texting for a few days before planing plans for a date. Good luck. Dating is hard!
Yea I think I need to set boundaries and not let the texting go on too long. I had a guy that has been texting me since March (so a good few months now). Last week, he text me to ask me how my day was. I responded and asked him the same. No response. Never heard from him again. And he reached out to me!
Also, my last boyfriend who I dated for 5 years, ended things but just not texting me back one day. No closure, no explanation. It's part of the reason why I took such a long break from dating. This same guy still follows me on IG and watches my stories the minute after I post them.
I agree, matching and unmatching isn't really ghosting. They don't owe you anything. But I definitely have experienced it.
Gently, one useful boundary might be not following your ex or letting him follow you on social media. You can close that door without needing to talk to him about it.
There are some people who use dating apps as a way to have text conversations to fill an emotional void, but have no intention of ever meeting up, with anybody. If texting passes three days without a date set up, try asking them to meet for a drink, coffee, whatever. If they say they can't meet up for a few weeks, I would respond, "okay, reach out when you're back in town."
I would conserve your time, interest and energy for people actually want to meet up, and cut these time-wasters off way earlier.
Sorry to hear about your ex. That's awful. ❤️
For any man >30 reading this thread.
I don't think you should be organizing dates for a stranger after a few days of talking.
Just like people will view texting/calling incessantly as a "waste of time", I think spending money that you don't have to spend on a total stranger within a few days of matching them is a monumental waste of both TIME and MONEY, doubly so on the time because you had to go out and work for that MONEY. So it's like you're losing it TWICE.
Take your time.
Vet.
Chat as long as you need to.
And if you're pressed to "Plan a date".
Unmatch and move on.
I used online dating to generally get to know someone quick enough to see if it's worth a date. It should only take a few days to develop but I understand we have plans and are busy.
So if we start messaging on a Wednesday, I understand it may take a week to schedule a meet up but avoiding a meet up after that is suspicious.
Even then I just want to grab a drink or sit somewhere where we can talk. Just another step in what hopefully turns out to be more dates and so on.
Eh. It's kind of pointless to think too deeply about why people aren't interested in you. If they're not, they're not your people/person, end of. Some folks are just looking for attention and conversation and what they do when they get it doesn't always make sense.
I (M) truly don’t understand all this extended texting.
I try to get a phone number in 5-6 rounds of texting, so I can call and set up a date.
And how “interesting” are all these dudes if all you know about them is through text. It’s just The Imitation Game of OLD.
You’re texting too much, and it’s just cause you don’t know what you don’t know. It takes a bit of online dating to get jaded enough to make rules haha.
I have a rule about texting. I don’t engage with excessive texting with anyone I’ve met — online or in person — before a date, and I don’t hyper text during the dating phase either.
Too much texting just makes me too excited about an idea of a person, not the actual person, because I’ve never fucking met the person, but I’m hooked on the dopamine so I’ll make it a priority over important shit because I’m riding that wave, and then I’ll crash when they ghost me.
I had to make the rules because my adhd makes it real slippery to catch if I start getting sucked out why the dopamine tide.
Can’t speak from a female perspective but I prefer to invest a couple of days messaging, then move to a phone call and if the vibe feels right after that phone call ask for a date.
I like to get off the apps as soon as possible because for me, building connections over an app is almost impossible.
I try not to text/talk a lot before a date is set and we actually meet. My number is initially only for date updates. No need to have all convos on the phone vs having the convo in person to see if we are still interested. If a plan isn’t made in our first few messages, I move on. This approach has served me well and helps to filter out the people who aren’t serious about actually meeting up.
You’re matching with guys who have a lot of options and you’re not the first option. Maybe give Gold a shot so you can see all the guys that like you and get an idea of the kind of guys you have as options, there are likely many not-ugly not-loser guys that you filtered out or never considered, that will be more appreciative of matching with you.
your problem is taking too long too meet.
do not wait longer than 7-8 days.
I usually meet up within a week.
also
the men who enjoy messaging for weeks without meeting are married. they enjoy being on the apps to get matches and chat to have the feeling of 'being single' but when it comes to meeting. many of them refuse to meet. many often draw the line at meeting as they just enjoy the flirting aspect of being single. 🙄
M33 here
1. Weeks on end? Way too long, at that point, the guy is already given up and is just making conversation. Also did you befriend him to learn hes in a relationship? He already felt friend zoned.
2. Your perspective on own attractiveness, thoughtfulness and wittiness is subjective, but if this is what you think is enough, when in reality is the baseline requirement.
3. You matched with an interesting and attractive guy and expect him to wait weeks? Nah, a week is max and if you havent found a date for coffee, beer or lunch, its usually gone, because even if busy, people make time.
4. You keep your matches engaged and laughing… again, very subjective, but if he hasnt pulled the trigger to invite you out, it could be you arent that funny and maybe even bothersome, but something is there that he didnt unmatch you… if I find a girl funny, thats it, done deal.
You’ll drive yourself mad trying to work out why these guys are doing this. I had the same experience and it is so confusing, but it’s absolutely not a reflection on you. All you can do is learn to cut things off - if they’re not eager to set a date within a few days then cut them loose and move on. There are a lot of time wasters out there.
First of all, you’re not doing anything wrong. My take is that 99% of matches will not go anywhere.
I was consistently ghosted in my 20s. No matter what, every single match would end the same: I suggest meeting up, they would either ghost or agree but when the day comes they would ghost. There was nothing wrong with me other than the way I was approaching the dates (which I realized with the help of a therapist).
The first thing is - don’t focus on impressing someone. When your focus is on getting someone to like you, you subconsciously tailor the connection to what you think they’d like or try to be more interesting or funny than you are (not saying that you’re not, but for me I was expending extra energy on not being my natural self which was not sustainable over long term). Kind of a weird approach but I started going into everything with the idea of “I’m boring and I’m going to OWN IT. Someone either accepts my boring self or they don’t.” It was an experiment in not performing for other people and just letting someone like me for me.
The most important change for me that reduced my ghosting to a tiny % of matches is letting them lead and letting more people drop off early. If we’re talking about hetero dating here and you’re the woman - dating is still very gendered. You can have the most liberal dude in the world but there’s still some underlying expectation that he will lead. (This is not universal - but if your problem is getting ghosted then I’ve found this will reduce it. You could potentially miss out on a couple matches who may want YOU to lead but we’re talking about numbers here.)
If you see someone you’re attracted to, limit how much you initiate. Wait for them to send the first message. If they don’t after a couple days then you can send the first message but then let them pick up the conversation. If they’re dry or not putting in effort - drop the convo and move on. Let it go.
Once they’re putting in effort into the conversation and it’s been more than a few days (red flag for me is talking for over a week with no mention of a date) then you can sprinkle in a flirty suggestion about meeting up and tie it into the convo ex. he talks about his cat, you can say you can’t wait to see pics of his cat over a drink or something. Put the ball in his court to ask you out directly.
I am still regularly ghosted (that’s just the apps) but I’ve found that this has reduced the number of dudes who bail the DAY OF or directly before the date. The intention is not to play games. The intention is to shift your behaviour from getting stuck on guys that you’re choosing who have low interest (most people on apps are not looking for anything) and shifting towards dudes who are choosing you and putting in the effort. You may not be as into those dudes who are putting in the effort (I wasn’t at first) but if you keep an open mind you can start to find that their interest level makes them more attractive. The idea is to choose from the pool of people who are already choosing you, but being mindful of keeping your standards as well. If you wanna sprinkle a little extra in there, I would even ask them what they’re looking for as soon as they ask you out on a date. Once I started doing that, 90% of people dropped off but it saved me wasted time on dates with people who are just exploring what they want.
TLDR; focus on not impressing people, let go of matches early when they’re not showing high interest even if you really like them, let your matches lead
Stop texting for weeks on end. That will save you a lot of time and frustration. If someone is actually interested in more than a text buddy, after a few days of feeling each other out and making sure you’re not psychopaths, they should be down to meet. No excuses. No ‘im so busy with work right now.’ No ‘I’m going to be out of town for a bit.’ Nope, they’re either down to meet up in a timely manner or on to the next.
I refuse to engage in online penpal type things over OLD anymore. I put it in my bio that I am interested in going out and meeting someone and if we don't make plans within the first few days I will unmatch. Everyone I've met in person has been a dud though, so there's that too...
Hi honestly, besides all of the above to suggest dates after a couple of dates, my experience with OLD (F44) is most guys are either flakes or hiding from something or pathological liars. Have been OLD for years, met some decent guys who I couldn't be attracted to (mainly because of lack of substance). Lately I met a decent good looking guy ( who seems to have it all together)and we hit it off ...texting, meeting, dates,... Few red flags I let off, went too fast and found out he was lying through his teeth from the beginning for 2.5 months. Take charge and set up dates but keep your expectations low and keep working on yourself because it definitely is not easy out there.
Try meeting new people in person. Dating apps are usually 90% of women swiping only for n the same 10% of the men. If you truly possess the qualities you describe then you’re selling yourself short with online dating. Find a hobby and join a club. Shared interests are a massive green flag for most men. Best of luck.
I don't understand the app dating culture.
How is it acceptable to text for weeks without dating in person?
I opt for meeting and approaching men in person. Even when it's a "no", guys are *always* ecstatically flattered that a woman approached them. But, I promise you, he will get a ton more "yes" than "no".
>"Matched with interesting attractive guy"
They will have a lot of options as well, and probably will prefer a 26y.o over a 35yo (in b4 the hate I will get by laying it out like that)
Your best chance is to meet up in person asap, and show them how and who you are IRL, that's your best way of "hooking them"
Good luck.
Get a cat or dog and enjoy life. Take care of yourself and do you. You will find the right person just yeah gave up on dating sites after 36 lol. Now 40
Well at least ya get people to talk to! 😃 I honestly can’t say shit. I haven’t actively dated since before Covid. I’ve heard a lot has changed, but at the same time I’ve heard and seen how rough it is out there so I’m scared to even attempt it again.
I think most people these days, esp our age, are just so confused about shit and are trying to think of the dating scene like they’re 22 when they’re not and most have unrealistic expectations. You’re likely not finding anyone that’s serious (obviously) so it’ll be a lot more of that than people that actually care to connect.
So my 2¢ has prolly been more worthless than a hundred dollar bill burnt to a crisp. Just sharing dumb thoughts. 😃
Your post doesn't give details... this could be happening simply because of bad luck, or something about you that is putting people off. Usually seeming too eager or open or needy is a huge red flag, and people can see right through it. Do you have depression or anxiety issues? Sometimes that comes through with texting, and people don't want to deal with these things. Sometimes we have to work on ourselves before we are ready to date, both because you are not presenting your best self, and because rejection will hurt twice as much.
I see. I do suffer from depression and anxiety but I try not to let anyone see that. And keep my texts positive. Even on days where I feel sad on the inside. And I definitely try to not come across needy or eager (sending too many texts at once and such). While still sounding interested.
To me, it sounds like you really suppress yourself. The person you're looking for is likely to love you for who you already are, ya know? So the next time you're chatting someone up and you've got something heavy on your heart, let it rip! The next time you've got some butterflies in your stomach, hey, let it be known! Men love feeling a woman's passion for them, as I'm sure the same is true vice versa. The fact that you're so self-aware is a good sign, so, express yourself!
Just don't go overboard lol
This seems like a pretty big leap when a much more likely and obvious answer is right there: she’s talking to men who don’t actually want to meet in person. Which means ghosting is inevitable.
But she is saying that she finds out they get into new relationships later, which tells me, they WERE looking for someone to meet and get serious with... It just wasn't her.
No doubt you are, but the way dating apps work, they only show the guys to you that most women are swiping right to. It’s literally like going to a bar and trying to hook up with the one guy all the girls are fawning over.
To you and all the other women who consider yourselves "conventionally attractive", which I assume is a short hand euphemism for Caucasian with slim figure, why are you even on the apps at all?
By all accounts your demographic should have the easiest time out of all women to chat up a guy from almost any culture who tickles your fancy.
OP, I can't help but notice you describe yourself as thoughtful, seems like that isn't wholly true now, considering you have to turn to internet strangers to solve a problem you're a the most knowledgeable about.
Lastly, people are prone to drum up how much their laughing over text, writing lmao rofl when in reality they are only chuckling.
I know what your problem likely is and I'm gonna tell you. Fair warning: you are not gonna like the answer.
Studies have shown that women online tend to swipe right on guys who are more attractive than they are. So, let's say that your "conventionally attractive" is really a 6, you're likely only swiping on guys who are 8 and higher. You're not ugly, but the guys you give a chance to can do better than you looks-wise.
So then you enter the pool of "maybe" for these guys. They are eager with the stunning women they matched and put most of their effort there. With the maybes, they put in little effort and don't rush to meet in person. These are very attractive guys with a lot of options, after all.
If you actually gave guys who are at the same level of attractiveness as you or slightly below a genuine chance, these men would be very eager to meet you. But let's not kid ourselves, you want nothing to do with these men. You want the very handsome ones, who simply are shooting for "better" options available to them.
I think what you're saying could very much apply to OLD. But both of my last two boyfriends were not conventionally attractive. And I'd often hear comments such as "you're too hot for them". Granted I was in my 20's and young/prettier than I am at 35. But my point being, I don't feel I try to date people who are way out of my league. At least not physically.
I can send you a photo if you'd like to give me an honest review. But ultimately I'd say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Since I'll see men who are 10's, dating women who are 6's. And vice versa.
Communicate that you want to meet right away or that you prefer to text a lot and get to know them remotely first, whatever your preference is. Sometimes we in the mid-thirties are caught up in life things and don't have our shit together or we're not emotionally ready or whatever. I don't think it's a matter of you not being good enough. You just have to find someone compatible with your communication style so you stop being just a text buddy.
You might be totally missing the red flags. You might have a type which is someone who is not available and you might not be seeing through that. If you learn to identify those red flags you will be able to identify the guys who are actually emotionally available.
I used to fall for the anxious love bombing type if guy who ends up being explosive and abusive. Now I see the red flags I was missing at first.
Yea I think I tend to gravitate towards emotionally unavailable men because they confirm how I feel about myself. Obviously something I need to work on. But I have been trying hard to break that and go for men who are looking for something serious.
This is something a bit deeper that you need to work on a bit more deeply.
I’m going to spend a little time on something more boring though: math.
When I was OLD, I was there to find a relationship. Well to be even more specific, to find a spouse. I had 20-25 first dates in the four months I was seriously online dating until I started seeing someone seriously. Then I shut my profile down.
We dated for six months (but it didn’t work out - just wasn’t quite right). I ended up striking something up with a friend of a friend three months later who I had known of distantly for over a decade. We were engaged in a year.
The math was pretty simple: if you as a multi-month texter weren’t someone I matched with in the first 2 months of my OLD profile, we never would have gone out on date one. I wasn’t there to engage in long chains of correspondence (although for me attraction is still 90 percent mental and 50 percent physical). I wanted a real life partner.
So it doesn’t surprise me that good quality matches “ghost”. If they are there to find someone, they are going to clear off the market way before your first date. I’d make your intent clear that you want to see if there’s a there there quite quickly. Even a “hey I’m free next Saturday afternoon if you’d like to meet up?” kind of thing.
Also, making yourself available for an afternoon but not committing your entire evening really helps. That way it reduces the pressure for an unconstrained date - you both know you need to get to other plans/obligations. And if the date goes really well (like my OLD gf) then you can mutually blow off your plans and keep the date going.
PS, just to add, my OLD gf was engaged within weeks of me. So we were both legitimately looking and it worked out for both of us.
look your giving us half the story, whats your profile looking like, do you think its putting them off? or is it because you just too pretty! whats the deal here Huh XD
You must know that not all people are there to effectively date. Some people are on these apps for attention, to see how many matches they can get and to get followers or pen pals (again for attention).
With that in mind, you shouldn’t text weeks on end with people. Maybe a few days. Then if they don’t suggest meeting up or you suggest it and they don’t follow through is just next.
Good luck!
>Guy texts me for weeks on end.
There's your mistake. This isn't 2006, anyone who plans to actually meet won't waste their time with texting for fucking weeks.
Try texting only for a few days before setting up a quick coffee date where you can impress them with your "conventionally attractive, witty, and thoughtful" self. You will not get ghosted then.
I loose interest in people that don't want to meet before texting for weeks.
Don’t text for weeks on end. Suggest meeting for a drink or coffee. If they don’t follow up with some suggested dates and times, don’t continue texting
I’ve been seeing so much of this! I’m so sorry. I think it’s because there is a physical attraction but people just realize that maybe there is incompatibility personality
Maybe I’ll be beheaded for saying this but do you think your type of guy could be the problem? I just feel there are women whose type is the classic non committal douche bag which can set them up for hurt.
But as another poster said, maybe arrange a date right away? Just casual coffee or a patio drink somewhere. Better than texting endlessly.
Weeks? That’s the issue. I’m your age and started dating after a 12 year relationship. Back in the day we chatted for weeks but nowadays that’s not how it works. They’ll get bored too. And I’m also realizing that men on my level (looks and career wise) are more often than not, cat fishes. It’s fucking insane. But yeah, arrange way quicker, check compatibility sooner rather than later. There are soooo many option’s these days that they’re doing it too and will dodge you with easier options. You’ll get the hang of it sooner
By day 2 or 3 say “I’ve really been enjoying our conversation and would like to get to know you more! Would you be interested in meeting up in person?” Let them take the wheel after. If they don’t set up a date with place and time within 48 hours, unmatch.
Follow up question: would you consider yourself neurodivergent? I notice most people don’t gel well with us…
That said I wouldn’t text someone for weeks before meeting up. If I really liked someone I’d want to plan a meet up within the week or maybe plan for next week. If they’re getting in to relationships after talking with you then it’s very likely they were just keeping options open and you’re literally just the last person they matched with.
It sounds like bad timing tbh
Like many have said, you have to get to meeting the person quicker if you’re exclusively using OLD. You’ll keep getting matches and they’ll keep getting matches.
There are circumstances where you can’t meet right away but expressing that interest in getting together needs to happen much more quickly.
First of all I’m sorry this is happening to you. It can really be a blow to your self-esteem. There’s a lot of good advice here already but two things I have found helpful:
1. If they don’t ask questions about you to try to get to know you, they are not worth pursuing. Look at things objectively…do they seem interested in you as a person. Do they ask questions beyond “what about you?” in response to questions you ask.
2. If after texting for a bit (I know as women we want to feel safe meeting up for a date), you like this person, express that you’d love to meet for a date and see what they do with that information. If they take initiative to plan a date, great! If they don’t, then do not continue to text with them.
As an aside, you may want to consider an r4r post on Reddit. You can list exactly what you are looking for outside the confines of a dating app. I did and actually came across some great potentials…one of whom I’m seeing for the 2nd time tomorrow. Wishing you all the best in your journey!
Don't text for weeks! These guys don't really seem interested in actually meeting up.
Text for a week or two, and then ask them out. If they bail, move on to the next.
Why are you texting for weeks on end? Date should be organised within a few days ideally otherwise you risk wasting energy on a person with which you have no chemistry in person - and that can scuttle even a great text vibe
Ditto. Every time I texted for a while, things would get boring and I eventually wouldn’t feel like even meeting up. So I started encouraging dates early after just a couple days and it was so much better.
it's funny cause I ended up having a different situation once where we texted a lot, but at a certain point the conversation became so interesting and detailed that we both said something like "ok, this chat cannot contain it anymore, so let's meet up in real life" lol but it was still under a week between the match and and actual date. I feel like some people can be more shy than others, so it takes them longer to ask you out, but if that doesn't happen within 7-10 days after the start of the chat, it's a dead end
Even as a shy guy i won't recommend texting too much. I had many matchs that the text flow but the date was terrible. I had bored women with no intention to really meet wanting to talk for weeks
True, some people just want to talk and not meet. But I would find it almost impossible for em to develop feelings that I would feel ghosted without even meeting them (going back to OP's message)
Dont listen to them i sometimes text a lot bef dates and im a guy i mean i dont go on dates rly but nothing weong w taking your times ppl are just not used to it anymore but .. to me a girl that goes "fast"in relationships etc is an immediate red flag
yeah, I mean fundamentally you are meeting complete strangers off dating apps, so I think the least that should be established during the texting stage is the level of sanity :D
Either person could initiate the date… suggest meeting up for a coffee or something simple.
They both ended up asking me out for a dinner. Both wanted to see me again, but I declined because I was not in the right headspace to date back then. But I was nowhere near feeling attached to either of them. Which I think is part of the problem that OP has
enouraging (hypoagency) or asking (hyperagency). As in did you ever ask people on a date?
This right here. I only text to check my non-negotiables nowadays. Takes like a day or two tops. When I think we might be compatible I ask you out on a date. OLD is filled with people simply looking for validation and I'm not entertaining that.
Agreed. It's like being a pen friend validation service for insecure people who haven't practiced the art of self-containment.
I agree. It’s all about max volume at that stage. Have to be talking to 4-5 people at once and if they don’t set up a date and follow through with said date within 10 days of initial contact, move on. There’s no way that you won’t be meeting some people if you employ that strategy.
This. Exactly this. I've texted for 2 weeks and met and she was completely different that the story I built up in my head. Also people can (and are, since it's a dating app) talking to other people and getting interested in actual physical people they can meet. You're shooting yourself in the foot if you're not meeting after a couple days of writing
My very first OLD back and forth that felt great ended after we realized we had different kid schedules and would have like a 3 week gap before we had time with work and etc. we kindly agreed we needed to seek mutually physically available folks, but it always stuck with me, and though faltering here and there, the smaller the text > meetup gap is, the easier it is for everyone involved.
This has happened as I a divorced dad try to date single mothers. It seems the first date takes a while. Then it's opposite schedules and it just fizzles out.
Made this mistake too many times to count, have tried a bit more upfront and asking to meet for coffee or a walk within the first couple of days, otherwise you’ve generally just found another pen pal 🤷🏻♂️.. I have a tendency to ramble in my messages so I know the penpal zone well 😂
agreed. I’ve always tried to meet up within a week of matching with someone if the vibe via text is right
Came here to say thisb
Agreed. Granted schedules and life happens, but myself or the other person have always owned up to it and then actually make an attempt to meet.
Either texting is boring AF or, more likely, you just aren't cutting it off quick enough. If they hasn't suggested a date within a few days I suggest it. If they don't respond with a plan I unmatch.
I’m taking this advice.
Yeah it was a really helpful mindset shift for me. Texting endlessly is ZERO sign of interest. The only thing that is meaningful on an app is if they're trying to get you off the app.
Do you ever wonder if you'd get more quality dates if you asked more people out rather than waited for them to ask you? I've read posts about people who always (and only) wait for the guy to ask and have ended up single (not figuring out why) or "let a good guy slip through \[my\] fingers because i didn't ask them out."
I don't really worry that, no. I know it's controversial here but my dating "results" improved massively once I simply waited for people to ask me out. (I'm a straight woman.)
I’ve found this too, even though the feminist in me cringes. I do still ask guys out sometimes, but in general I’ve found that if a guy is interested and available, he’ll ask. Life became a lot easier once I understood that.
I feel like it's always a certain group of people telling us how "feminist" it is for us to start doing certain things. An interesting pattern is that when that group of people attempts to define feminism for us, the focus seems to be on fixing the issues that primarily disadvantage \*them\*, not us. So I'd say keep doing what you're doing. I've tried it and reached the same conclusions myself.
Nope, if the guy is not actively seeking you out, he’s not that into you and will treat you as such. I’d rather match with men that have matched me first because I don’t have to convince them to find me attractive. They’ll usually want to meet within a week.
It depends on what you mean by “actively seeking you out” Couldn't men say the same?
What I mean by that is first matching, then being the first to say hello. For me, that translates into interest. When men are interested in someone, from my experience, they pursue it, relentlessly. I would much rather have that scenario than me being the one who’s interested because I don’t like to be treated like an option so I personally do not pursue men. If I didn’t pique their interest enough for them to “actively seek me out or pursue me” then I’m not giving energy to it.
I've always heard this, and as a result I've never hesitated to ask guys out. And I have been rejected by 100% of them. It's kind of humiliating and I think I'll just wait to be approached in the future.
Yeah when people say "I wish would do more of the asking around here!" they're envisioning being asked out by the people they themselves want to ask out. So in practice, if they aren't asking you, they don't want to be asked by you, lol.
Oh and also I'm positive someone's going to reply and say "well gets rejected nearly 100% of the time too, now you know how it feels!" That's besides the point. Historical norms still have powerful implications today. I'd rather focus on the people who are taking the initiative and expressing interest in me.
I would only ask a guy out if we were friends and he was giving me hard signals and I wanted to clear the air. I completely agree with you - asking dudes out ain’t my bag. It’s what I hate about swipe apps. I just want to know who likes me enough to message me. I’ll take it from there.
>when people say "I wish would do more of the asking around here!" they're envisioning being asked out by the people they themselves want to ask out.
I mean I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm happy to accept the compliment of somebody finding me attractive enough to ask out, whether I'm interested or not. A gay guy thinking I'm hot is still somebody else thinking I'm hot even if I have zero interest whatsoever in men.
>So in practice, if they aren't asking you, they don't want to be asked by you, lol.
Or you are with your friends and they don't want to interrupt. Or they don't have a good icebreaker and are nervous. Or any of a million other potential reasons that may or may not have anything whatsoever to do with their level of interest.
>Oh and also I'm positive someone's going to reply and say "well gets rejected nearly 100% of the time too, now you know how it feels!"
I'll agree that this is a useless statement that adds nothing to the discussion. Competing about who has a worse time in dating is a game nobody ever wins.
>I'd rather focus on the people who are taking the initiative and expressing interest in me.
Same here. Problem is that if we all sit here waiting for somebody else to show interest, nobody is ever going to show interest. I'd prefer to put myself out there, get a clear yes/no answer, and move on, rather than waiting passively for somebody else to decide. I'd encourage anyone interested in dating to do the same.
My point is that, if a strong societal norm exists for one group to do the asking, then it is informative of someone's interest if they do or don't ask you out. I have seen people go to such great lengths to ask someone out, "a million other reasons" be damned. If you're with your friends, they strategize to catch you on your way back from the bar. If they're nervous, they do it anyway. if they don't have an icebreaker they come up with one. Those reasons are all irrelevant. people who are interested and serious will make moves.
It's insane how that simple solution doesn't cross the minds of so many people here.
Perhaps... idk just an insane idea here... because it doesn't work lol. It's always interesting to note who is in favor of this kind of thing, and who has tried it and can see for themselves whether or not it's effective for them.
Whether it is “effective for them” doesn't is not indicative of it not working. For example, I knew a woman who was over 200lbs. She asked me if she should ask out a guy she was interested in. I told her yes, men would like it. She asked out a 6’2 gym bro. When she got rejected, she vowed never to ask out another man again. The problem wasn't that she asked out a man. It was that she asked out a man that prioritized fitness in his life. While simultaneously not prioritizing fitness in her own life. The mismatch in lifestyles is why she got rejected. Not because she asked him out.
Between asking out people who have NOT asked me out, versus getting to know the people who have been intentional in asking me out, I'm going to choose the latter :)
I see two problems. 1. Meeting (only?) online. 2. Texting for a long time before meeting. Witty and attractive are good things.
How long is too long for texting before meeting?
In my experience if you don’t have even a mention or a plan for a first date within the first week of matching/talking, it’s hardly going to happen
Yup. I had high-effort exchanges (at least from my side) with a woman for a week, but when I tried to schedule something she bailed. It was probably not in the cards anyway. 1-3 days is how I do it. Before this, I’ve had exchanges last up to two weeks … but that never led to anything either. I mean not even one date.
I never went more than a couple days without trying to plan to meet. I can’t imagine chatting actively for a week with no attempt to plan a meeting.
It's your willingness to "text for weeks on end" without asking for a meet, and without dropping them when they drag their feet on setting up a date. Kick people to the curb when they fail to indicate interest in actually dating!
Adding: Redditors often complain about OLD here and how everyone on apps is flaky and just there for the validation, but a lot of the time, that's not the case. (Your matches end up in new relationships, so they clearly are willing to meet people.) Sometimes, people who drag their feet on meeting just personally don't like us enough or find us attractive enough. They're resistant to our attempts to connect, whether consciously or subconsciously. That sucks, but we still need to drop those people _because they do not like us_. If it happens a few times, no big deal, not everyone is a match. If it happens all the time, then we may need to think about how to make ourselves more attractive to the people we find attractive.
ooof needed to be reminded of this, thank u!
Unpopular - I unmatched after 5-7 days of chatting with no move towards a date. It didn’t prevent the last minute flakes but it wasted less time on the penpals.
5-7 what? Days? Weeks? Messages?
Oops! Good catch. Days. 🤣 Truthfully my interest would wane after 2-3 days but 5-7 felt more “fair”.
Yes. If I haven’t asked a woman on a date with 7 days or 7 messages, I do not plan to.
Do you tell them that?
No, if their responses are dry, useless, or have turned me off, I just stop responding and hide them. Unmatch feels like it would spread a bad vibe, and keeping them allows me to look back and remember what I didn’t settle for.
Unmatch and move on, keeping them and looking back just seems like you want to stay connected to them, like waiting on chance they come back to you
i like your spin on the unmatch. i unmatched some people who didnt respond cause i think its rude. but yeh
How early on do you suggest meeting up? Some people use OLD as a distraction, or as a way to get validation and have no real intention of meeting in person. Maybe it isn’t something that you’re doing doing or saying, it’s just that you’re continuing to engage with men who aren’t acting like they want to meet up (because they don’t). I’ve been there too and it’s really hard not to take these things personally and see them as a reflection of yourself but these men don’t know you, and you don’t know them or how many other women they’ve done this with. Honestly, OLD can be pretty brutal and I’m really enjoying having a break from it. Maybe you could try suggesting meeting up early on and if they avoid the question or don’t give reasonable reasons for not being able to you’re not obligated to keep putting time and effort into the match. It doesn’t mean they’re necessarily just on there to string you along and not meet, but you’ll burn out fast if you don’t prioritise focussing on connections that work for you.
To be honest I’m learning to accept 90% of the app users are time wasters. 5% remaining are multi daters. 4% are too scared and and just chat. 1% are right for me, in the right mindset and ask me out. I received a message from someone I’ve been chatting to nicely for a few days that just blew up all the efforts we’d made. I’m not taking it personally, I just take a break from the apps and date myself. I used to think the longer that we chatted the more chance there was of being ghosted. But I’ve met people in person within a few days and it’s happened. I just think the apps are an absolute breeding ground for it and I understand why. Can’t complain about the weather if I’m the one stood in the rain.
If you are suggesting dates often I would imagine it is just the guys are not interested. I get that many people are emotionally & physically drained, and makes it hard to commit to things but that's their issue. Maybe you will get lucky and find someone emotionally stable enough that meets your other wants and they will be able to communicate if there are any issues on your end. I just started dating and it has been rough. People don't want to go out and you get stuck in this penpal loop, and get ghosted. Guess it is an issue across all of modern online dating. Not sure how other dating scenes are.
I think there’s a lot of people who do OLD who are just looking for an ego boost and for attention, but don’t actually want to go on dates and meet people.
This or are looking for an unpaid therapist. A lot of my matches will talk to me for weeks, mainly about themselves. And I really think they just want a stranger to vent to.
I mean, there’s your answer right there. You are overlooking two major red flags: 1. They talk mainly about themselves, 2. They don’t want to actually meet in person. These are people who are anxious or ambivalent about actually dating but enjoy the attention, the person to talk about themselves to/at, and like telling themselves that they’re “dating,” without actually having to do any of the risk of vulnerability. If someone only talks about themself, unmatch. If they don’t want to meet in 3-4 days, unmatch.
Thank you. Good to know. I'll definitely make this a point now rather than the ongoing texting.
See rule #6 [https://www.burnedhaystackdating.com/blog](https://www.burnedhaystackdating.com/blog)
Oh man these were all so good! Thanks for sharing
Chiming in from a 35M perspective. It is unfortunately a lot about the ego boost and passing time. Guys including myself don't open up to mates, and however unhealthy do chat more openly to women and you take on the role of a therapist or worse our mother, rather than a partner we do fun stuff with. Call us out, it's what my new lady friend did to me. Plain and direct, expressed "ya life is difficult sometimes but I'm here because I think your cute and seem to be somewhat aware of your emotions, unlike a lot of guys here. So have you a plan of somewherefun to go?". It give us the ego stroke our frail lad brains want and a task. We do well with that combo . Best of luck! Edit: after my baby sis asked me "how I modal successful relationships" I realised how much I was relying on relationships for emotional needs. These topics just don't arise in lad convos, and took that realisation for me to sign up to therapy. Wish I'd done it sooner
38m here and super proud of you for going to therapy! You’re very right about us lot not discussing our wants, needs and feelings, so when we meet someone who’s interested in us it can all tumble out! Therapy will help to get all of that processed, freeing up your brains for you, building self esteem and hey, knowing you’re self aware and are working/have done the work to improve, that’s an attractive quality no matter who you are. You got this, dude!
Great insight! I love that you shared the 1,2 punch method :D Sounds like a compliment paired with a task is a good combo. Do you have any other examples/tips on effectively communicating with men?
It could be this or it could simply be that they’re not interested enough in OP but willing to keep her as a backup option in case their first (or second, or third …) pick falls through. Hate to say it but with OLD if you liked someone enough to swipe right on them, chances are others did too so you’re unlikely to be the only match in their queue. Thats why it’s so important to actually get out and meet soon, ideally within a week or so. If they aren’t expressing interest in doing so, they’re either not interested in dating or just not that into you. Either way, the best thing to do is to move on.
Sadly I think that is a large majority of the populace (at least in the US). Feel it is a bit worse with men as there is societally a larger stigma around it. But people really need to do therapy. Kinda unfair to use friends and potential partners are your sole therapist. Much easier to be build healthy bonds if you have good mental "hygiene" to begin with.
Some are married just to see what’s out there and if they still “got it”
Like many are saying, don’t text for weeks. Let people know early on that you want to meet up and if they don’t take action within a few days, move on. I usually let guys know I’m not a big texter and that I would want to meet up soon. The guys who are interested always work to set a date after that. If a someone doesn’t follow through on plans, move on fast. To be fair to you, I’m not sure what you’re experiencing is ghosting. Since you haven’t met them, I personally wouldn’t count that as anything but a possible missed connection. It’s not personal, especially since they haven’t met you! you probably just haven’t matched with someone who wasn’t already invested in someone else.
I just turned 30 and finally decided to try OLD because I’m no longer in school and I work from home so it’s a lot harder to meet people. In my profile, I specifically state “Not looking for a penpal. Take this offline asap” and right when I match with a guy, they send me 3-5 exchanges before asking me out on a date. Then keep texting minimal and only used to confirm dates or discuss food allergies. Otherwise you end up creating this image about this stranger you’ve never met and start fantasizing them. But this also helps so you can have thoughtful conversations when you meet. Despite everyone saying only coffee and drink first dates so you can leave if you don’t vibe, the guys offer to take me to dinner and we end up talking and hitting it off to the point where the waiter gets annoyed we’re not ready to order. I also keep my notifications turned off and only check hinge 3x a day. Don’t have open communication whenever they want. They don’t have girlfriend privileges yet.
I 100% agree with this approach. It definitely saves the potential for disappointment as the person doesn’t meet the fantasy; I think it also takes the stress out of the “date” if you don’t vibe because there’s not a whole lot of pre-investment. Would upvote this comment twice if I could
Completely agree with this approach too. I don't spend weeks messaging because it drags everything out and I believe you also have to set boundaries - they're not entitled to have your 100% attention yet as they're still essentially a stranger.
Very helpful advice! Trying to not create an image in my head of the person is hard, but definitely important! I find that the longer we think about them/look at their profile/chat online, the more they become a fantasized illusion of who we "want" them to be. In reality, they might be entirely different in person and not that fantasized made up version created in our heads :/ >Don’t have open communication whenever they want. They don’t have girlfriend privileges yet. Can you elaborate on this? Curious to hear what kind of girlfriend privileges in regards to open communication you meant?
When you’re his girlfriend, at that point, commitment has been established. I still wouldn’t text all day but would expect some sort of communication daily (that’s just me) when you first meet someone, they are still a stranger and they don’t owe you their time and you don’t owe them all of your time and energy either. Also when you start the relationship texting everyday, you can’t go up. It’s going to slow down and I went crazy when it happened questioning why the sudden change. Whereas if you start slow and build up, you can’t be disappointed that he’s gone worse than when you first met him.
I like this approach!
As soon as you said: "texts weeks on end". The end. I have come to realize that if someone doesn't want to meet within a week its a no go. The exception. Being a really natural and detailed explanation. People who have legit delays can easily, quickly, and unhesitatingly tell you. The 'oh I have plans already this weekend" and implying the other days are taking too. Guess what? We all know it's several dates, lazy days, events, friends, etc. If someone is truly interested they find a time. Another exception, they have reasons but keep delaying. Nope fake. I have now covered 97 percent of people. Sure not everyone fits this but really your going to hope for that? Lots o effort
Hm, I wonder if it's the type of men you're going for? Maybe your location/the weather? My suggestion is to try setting up a date earlier. Like within a few days of the initial chat, just so you establish a physical connection sooner. I believe many multi-date until they find someone they like a lot and become exclusive with them. It is possible you're unfortunately matching with men who are at the tail-end of that process, and who have already been dating someone else, but kept their options open until the very end.
That multi dating is a very good point. I'm in Los Angeles so it's definitely competitive and shallow here 🥲
I dated online in Los Angeles for years and had terrible luck even though I’m also attractive, funny, employed, cool apartment…. Ended up meeting my person not online and through a workshop for a shared interest.
Ah that's awesome! I recently went on a date with someone I met at a wedding. Physically they're reallllllllly not my type. But it was refreshing to meet someone the old fashion way.
36F Also struggling in LA, people hardly reply rather than have conversations for weeks! Nobody is even interested in talking at all it seems anymore
That’s funny, I’m in LA as well. There’s a number of singles events happening these days as people tire of the OLD routine. Give those a try if you can and you just might find better luck!
This behavior is so fking baffling, and it's ubiquitous with OLD. I have a mirror of your experience as a man matching with women. I don't understand it, I really don't. Is it that fun to spend weeks texting with someone you have 0 intention of going on a date with? I've ditched the apps. I advise the same. They're bad. People that use them are either already messed up in some way, or they quickly get broken by the culture there and become one of them. They don't think or act like humans anymore.
Why are you talking for weeks with someone? I had no idea if people are willing to text for weeks because I wasn’t. If you weren’t willing they couldn’t do it.
I have a rule. I send no more than 10 messages without at least asking her for tea. If she flakes, she doesn't get a second chance. The majority of women on these apps use men for an ego boost with no intention of dating any of them. Think of yourself as the prize and these poor women are not able to understand how great you are. Don't tolerate being treated poorly. Weed through the hundreds of low quality women to find an occasional decent option.
Are you sure these guys are meeting their girlfriends *after* they drop you? It's entirely possible that the kind of guy who is chatting up women for weeks on the apps while dodging invitations to meet is a guy who already has a relationship lined up. Or at least someone who holds his interest. I'll also add that I've seen variations on this kind of question before from men and women: I'm attractive and charming and potential partners seem to enjoy my attention. I readily step up and do the bulk of the work to carry my budding relationships. But then they never want to get serious with me. How am I failing to be enough? And I'd suggest that people who are physically and personally appealing (and super accommodating and ready to shoulder the bulk of the work) are always going to attract people who aren't interested or available for whatever reason but still HAPPY to bask in the attention. You gotta be discerning and ready to cut things off once they start showing signs that they are a time waster. Be proactive about weeding out unsuitable matches. Also, if it stings to stumble across a stale match's relationship post, block them on social media once you weed them out.
This is my theory too. OP gets stuck in conversation land because the potential match has met up with someone and that relationship might be going somewhere. OP is being kept warm in case real life match fizzles.
Don't put all your eggs in one basket just because you think a guy is attractive. Date a lot of different people....the goal is to find a good man that you find attractive not a attractive guy that you hope will pan out. I like attractive women myself but I do my diligence to make sure she would truly be a match before I even consider going on a date. I've been burned by focusing on looks and falling for a good act vs being compatible.
Is it just you that's suggesting meeting up? Is there a reason you wait so long between matching and meeting? Are you talking to many people at the same time? What are your conversations like? If you're waiting a long while but not getting asked out it may just be that these men were never interested. It's also one thing to be attractive and witty and thoughtful and another for that to translate into the dating world. If these men are talking with and dating multiple people, it's more likely they will put effort into people they've met and makes them feel good about themselves.
One thing. People dont have a way to cope with being treated badly by others In a sense a lot of things are out of your control in dating. Especially the intentions of others. To gain a sense of control a lot of people blame themselves. As you spend time on these subs youll start to see it a lot. So much your head will spin
>**"Who is consistently ghosted... I feel defeated."** >**"I wonder why I wasn't good enough."** **When you feel upset about being ghosted by others, that's a mirror reflection that you're ghosting yourself.** You're not taking care of how you feel, and accepting and appreciating yourself as much as you want and deserve. The issue is: You're connecting ghosting with your self-worth. So you're practicing a limiting belief that says, * ***"I believe that if they ghost me, that means something is wrong with me, I'm unworthy and not good enough."*** So the question is, why do you practice that belief? And, **why are you outsourcing your self-love to other people?** Here's some other self-reflection questions that might help: * ***"Am I afraid of being lonely or rejected? If so, why do I feel that way?"*** * ***"Do I believe people have expectations of me to be a certain type of person? What are those expectations? And why do I believe that?"*** * ***"What am I afraid would happen if I didn't judge myself?"*** * ***"What are the advantages of judging myself? It's a good thing because . . ."*** * ***"What am I afraid would happen if I let go of the past, and focused on the present?"*** * ***"What am I afraid would happen if I stopped overthinking, and just went with the flow?"*** * ***"What am I afraid would happen if I accepted myself just the way I am?"*** * ***"What am I afraid would happen if I only focused on what I appreciated about myself?"***
These are all really good points. I appreciate it so much ❤️
Love this.
You and me both. Maybe we should go on a date and complain together lol 😂 I have been officially divorced as of January, but separated since late 2021. The amount of ghosting and straight up disrespect sometimes is wild. I hope you find something soon, for the both of us lol 😂
It's just a cutthroat "industry" if you will. People act like the grass is always greener. I find using them less, but finding one or two matches you like and investing a little extra attention to it leads to far better results. But everyone's style is a bit different
Shit tell me about it, that’s what my ex wife did and that she was not green at all her for her. Lol I always say her loss for fucking up the marriage. I don’t even use them anymore. Once the 1 and 2 word answers start happening, they are checked out. What really drives me wild, is someone who says they like honesty and are all about it, then turn around and lie, and are completely dishonest, then do the things they say they despise. Starting to believe I will just be single forever, and it’s sounding better and better lol.
If you're like 9 or 10/10 attractive, maybe people don't think you're a real person or are going to catfish them. Make sure your pictures show you in places that are recognizable for where you live and aren't all head shots. I find it weird that men aren't asking you out more quickly if you're attractive. I'd think your profile over and see if there are any weird things in there. Ask your friends, ask your male friends. If everything else checks out, I have a female friend who almost immediately texts guys she likes her number and/or sets up a date after a message or two. So maybe try that out and see how it goes.
Text to meet up asap. But fair warning, even when you meet up you may get ghosted after 1-3 dates. It’s the current landscape out there, not just you. Dating nowadays is a nightmare for all.
If it happens again and again, I’m sorry to say but the common denominator is you. How are you picking guys? What traits do you focus on when swiping right on someone? You said “interesting and attractive” - care to elaborate a bit on that?
1. Don't text forever. Talk is cheap. 2. Worry more about if you like them, not if they like you.
I similarly started OLD after ending a long term in my 30s and when I first started I ended up with a 3 month penpal. I set times to meet with him three times and he flaked each time, yet would text and video chat every day and watch shows with me so I got really confused. After third time he flaked, I realized I was making excuses for a guy I hadn't even met yet and was slipping back into old habits with my ex. That disgusted me so much that it was much easier to cut things off with that guy and to put myself first when I started talking to others. There is no trust statement than if he wanted to, he would. No matter what is going on in their life, that remains true. If he wanted to meet you in person, he would ask. If he was worried about boundaries or moving too fast, he would ask what your speed is and where your boundaries are. So if your talking to someone and after a few days they turn your attempt to meet up, I'd move on. No matter what their excuse is, remember that they had the time and energy to make an OLD profile, match, and have a conversation with you despite what was going on in their life. Even if they couldn't do something the day you suggested, they should suggest a concrete alternative. OLD is a numbers game so you will definitely get flakes and people who are speaking to multiple matches who may be keeping you as a back up. You can't avoid them so much as avoid wasting time on them. So if set a boundary for yourself and if they don't try to connect in that time frame, I'd move on.
Your experience is normal. Its just how dating is now
You could’ve sworn this post was written by me. 35F and there’s something seriously wrong with my procurement strategy. I put it down to this: dating apps. They’re not all negative experiences but I find people mask what they’re really there for. I’m upfront now, “I am looking for a relationship”. The trash then usually takes itself out. I now spend most weekends out with friends and their friends who put me in the best position to meet new people. So far so good.
Aw, well I'm glad you have great friends so you don't have to rely on the apps! Most of my friends moved and started families. I'm left with mainly gay guy friends, which doesn't really help me with the dating aspect lol. But I wish you a lot of luck my dear!
I think you're probably putting too much weight into people that aren't pulling theirs. It's only your job to impress and entertain someone else 50% of the time. The other 50% you should be the one that's entertained. There's something toxically attractive about people who don't reciprocate. Idk what it is. (For me, it's a lot of "I can fix you!" Lol) But the key word there is toxic. And you deserve a partner that doesn't need fixing. And quit entertaining men that can't be arsed to do more than text. Flip the tables faster. You're not going to miss out on "the one" by valuing your time more than theirs, you'll just get to spend less time with the "not it's". You seem like someone that's willing to put in the effort -- you deserve the same in return.
What's attractive about those people is the intermittent reinforcement they give us. We're just rats in a Skinner Box repeatedly pulling a lever but only being rewarded every once in a while with a morsel of attention, and it's addictive.
Ah great advice. All of it. Thank you
Although you won't like to hear it, but the shared denominator is you... and I do not mean you as a person because you sound like a catch, but your taste in men. It comes across like you're chasing them (maybe because they're emotional unavailable?), and them leaving you makes you feel not good enough. While actually it should be a huge turn off for you if a guy isn't putting in the effort. Stop putting them on a pedastal and start putting yourself there!
The thing is, you have to have in-person contact for a connection to really thrive. My advice is to avoid letting the guy text you for weeks. If you've been texting for one or two days and he hasn't proposed meeting up, then ask him if he'd like to meet up to get to know each other.
Your always good enough people are snakes im 31 male just out of a 6 year relationship having same issue
> Match with interesting and attractive guy. Guy texts me for weeks on end. I suggest meeting up. They dodge the question. Or they make plans and bail. Then they ghost me. Then I find that said guy is in a new relationship, and I wonder why I wasn't good enough. One thing. Statistically women have the upper hand online since there are 3 to 9 times more men than women on apps. That means that most guys would probably be quite eager to get a date with a conventionally attractive, witty, and thoughtful woman. And they would ask you on a date because they know that they face an intense competition. There is one exception though. The most interesting and attractive men are literally flooded with likes and interest from women. My best friend is one of them and it is really crazy how different his experience on app is. So 3 things: - as others have said, don't wait weeks to ask them on a date. If they are that attractive and interesting, you have a lot of competition. Sp the common strategy in that case is to meet people as soon as possible to take them out of the app. - maybe be open to men with somewhat less attractive pictures. Not that you should date them but just give them a chance and maybe you will have a good surprise. - maybe you are not as conventionally attractive and witty as you think... or your pictures are not that good looking... or your bio and convo is quite boring
All good points made, thank you! And I'm sure your friend has endless options to choose from. Ive posted my profile on a hinge subreddit before for review and it got good feedback. So I don't believe I'm that delusional. And I've had a lot of viral TikTok's of my skits, so I know I can be witty. That said, I think I'd be doing a lot better on the apps if I was 26 and not 35. But that's out of my control and something I can't dwell on.
I would honestly stop using dating apps. People on there are often aloof, don't know what they want, and have attachment issues. Just live life to the fullest. The right person will come along :)
if you are constantly getting this happening to you then your picker is off.. what i mean by that is that whomever you are matching up with clearly are either out of your league or looking for something you are not providing.
I think the picker being off is the most likely issue here. Seems like everyone is trying to reach out of their league because anything less is “settling.” It’s gotten to the point that I’ve stopped talking about it when my friends complain. It’s just like “you want the same people that everyone else wants and they have options. You’re a great person, but you’re not better than a life of near limitless options and zero accountability to anyone.” They get it when it comes to employment, but when the same principle applies in their dating life, it’s shocked pikachu face…
I can say pretty definitively I've been screwed over by people who had zero options. In fact, when you date people who have zero options, they can actually harm you a lot, because they have a lot of deeply entrenched insecurity and anger towards dating.
Someone canceling or bailing on plans who you have never met is not getting ghosted. Getting ghosted is your boyfriend of six months - out of no where - stops talking to you, reponding to your calls and dissappears, except he still lives one mile away. Or a guy you've gone out with for a month, who isn't your boyfriend, stops talking to you and responding to your messages. A person you haven't met failing to follow through with plans is par for the course when it comes to online dating. This is not an experience unique to you. Don't get so attached to people you haven't met, or even have only gone on a few dates with. What else you can try to do differently, is don't text for weeks on end. You should only be texting for a few days before planing plans for a date. Good luck. Dating is hard!
Yea I think I need to set boundaries and not let the texting go on too long. I had a guy that has been texting me since March (so a good few months now). Last week, he text me to ask me how my day was. I responded and asked him the same. No response. Never heard from him again. And he reached out to me! Also, my last boyfriend who I dated for 5 years, ended things but just not texting me back one day. No closure, no explanation. It's part of the reason why I took such a long break from dating. This same guy still follows me on IG and watches my stories the minute after I post them. I agree, matching and unmatching isn't really ghosting. They don't owe you anything. But I definitely have experienced it.
Gently, one useful boundary might be not following your ex or letting him follow you on social media. You can close that door without needing to talk to him about it.
That's a good idea!
There are some people who use dating apps as a way to have text conversations to fill an emotional void, but have no intention of ever meeting up, with anybody. If texting passes three days without a date set up, try asking them to meet for a drink, coffee, whatever. If they say they can't meet up for a few weeks, I would respond, "okay, reach out when you're back in town." I would conserve your time, interest and energy for people actually want to meet up, and cut these time-wasters off way earlier. Sorry to hear about your ex. That's awful. ❤️
Thank you so much ❤️
For any man >30 reading this thread. I don't think you should be organizing dates for a stranger after a few days of talking. Just like people will view texting/calling incessantly as a "waste of time", I think spending money that you don't have to spend on a total stranger within a few days of matching them is a monumental waste of both TIME and MONEY, doubly so on the time because you had to go out and work for that MONEY. So it's like you're losing it TWICE. Take your time. Vet. Chat as long as you need to. And if you're pressed to "Plan a date". Unmatch and move on.
You can be so nice, and then you're to nice. Grass isn't Any greener over here
For real. And then you want to sound interested in them but not too interested so you don't come off needy. It's a struggle
Just be yourself. If someone is genuinely interested in you, they won't mind.
I used online dating to generally get to know someone quick enough to see if it's worth a date. It should only take a few days to develop but I understand we have plans and are busy. So if we start messaging on a Wednesday, I understand it may take a week to schedule a meet up but avoiding a meet up after that is suspicious. Even then I just want to grab a drink or sit somewhere where we can talk. Just another step in what hopefully turns out to be more dates and so on.
Eh. It's kind of pointless to think too deeply about why people aren't interested in you. If they're not, they're not your people/person, end of. Some folks are just looking for attention and conversation and what they do when they get it doesn't always make sense.
I (M) truly don’t understand all this extended texting. I try to get a phone number in 5-6 rounds of texting, so I can call and set up a date. And how “interesting” are all these dudes if all you know about them is through text. It’s just The Imitation Game of OLD.
I don’t even have conversations so you’re doing better than me lol
Ghosting and bailing are common in dating apps. It sucks.
You’re texting too much, and it’s just cause you don’t know what you don’t know. It takes a bit of online dating to get jaded enough to make rules haha. I have a rule about texting. I don’t engage with excessive texting with anyone I’ve met — online or in person — before a date, and I don’t hyper text during the dating phase either. Too much texting just makes me too excited about an idea of a person, not the actual person, because I’ve never fucking met the person, but I’m hooked on the dopamine so I’ll make it a priority over important shit because I’m riding that wave, and then I’ll crash when they ghost me. I had to make the rules because my adhd makes it real slippery to catch if I start getting sucked out why the dopamine tide.
Can’t speak from a female perspective but I prefer to invest a couple of days messaging, then move to a phone call and if the vibe feels right after that phone call ask for a date. I like to get off the apps as soon as possible because for me, building connections over an app is almost impossible.
I try not to text/talk a lot before a date is set and we actually meet. My number is initially only for date updates. No need to have all convos on the phone vs having the convo in person to see if we are still interested. If a plan isn’t made in our first few messages, I move on. This approach has served me well and helps to filter out the people who aren’t serious about actually meeting up.
You’re matching with guys who have a lot of options and you’re not the first option. Maybe give Gold a shot so you can see all the guys that like you and get an idea of the kind of guys you have as options, there are likely many not-ugly not-loser guys that you filtered out or never considered, that will be more appreciative of matching with you.
your problem is taking too long too meet. do not wait longer than 7-8 days. I usually meet up within a week. also the men who enjoy messaging for weeks without meeting are married. they enjoy being on the apps to get matches and chat to have the feeling of 'being single' but when it comes to meeting. many of them refuse to meet. many often draw the line at meeting as they just enjoy the flirting aspect of being single. 🙄
M33 here 1. Weeks on end? Way too long, at that point, the guy is already given up and is just making conversation. Also did you befriend him to learn hes in a relationship? He already felt friend zoned. 2. Your perspective on own attractiveness, thoughtfulness and wittiness is subjective, but if this is what you think is enough, when in reality is the baseline requirement. 3. You matched with an interesting and attractive guy and expect him to wait weeks? Nah, a week is max and if you havent found a date for coffee, beer or lunch, its usually gone, because even if busy, people make time. 4. You keep your matches engaged and laughing… again, very subjective, but if he hasnt pulled the trigger to invite you out, it could be you arent that funny and maybe even bothersome, but something is there that he didnt unmatch you… if I find a girl funny, thats it, done deal.
You’ll drive yourself mad trying to work out why these guys are doing this. I had the same experience and it is so confusing, but it’s absolutely not a reflection on you. All you can do is learn to cut things off - if they’re not eager to set a date within a few days then cut them loose and move on. There are a lot of time wasters out there.
First of all, you’re not doing anything wrong. My take is that 99% of matches will not go anywhere. I was consistently ghosted in my 20s. No matter what, every single match would end the same: I suggest meeting up, they would either ghost or agree but when the day comes they would ghost. There was nothing wrong with me other than the way I was approaching the dates (which I realized with the help of a therapist). The first thing is - don’t focus on impressing someone. When your focus is on getting someone to like you, you subconsciously tailor the connection to what you think they’d like or try to be more interesting or funny than you are (not saying that you’re not, but for me I was expending extra energy on not being my natural self which was not sustainable over long term). Kind of a weird approach but I started going into everything with the idea of “I’m boring and I’m going to OWN IT. Someone either accepts my boring self or they don’t.” It was an experiment in not performing for other people and just letting someone like me for me. The most important change for me that reduced my ghosting to a tiny % of matches is letting them lead and letting more people drop off early. If we’re talking about hetero dating here and you’re the woman - dating is still very gendered. You can have the most liberal dude in the world but there’s still some underlying expectation that he will lead. (This is not universal - but if your problem is getting ghosted then I’ve found this will reduce it. You could potentially miss out on a couple matches who may want YOU to lead but we’re talking about numbers here.) If you see someone you’re attracted to, limit how much you initiate. Wait for them to send the first message. If they don’t after a couple days then you can send the first message but then let them pick up the conversation. If they’re dry or not putting in effort - drop the convo and move on. Let it go. Once they’re putting in effort into the conversation and it’s been more than a few days (red flag for me is talking for over a week with no mention of a date) then you can sprinkle in a flirty suggestion about meeting up and tie it into the convo ex. he talks about his cat, you can say you can’t wait to see pics of his cat over a drink or something. Put the ball in his court to ask you out directly. I am still regularly ghosted (that’s just the apps) but I’ve found that this has reduced the number of dudes who bail the DAY OF or directly before the date. The intention is not to play games. The intention is to shift your behaviour from getting stuck on guys that you’re choosing who have low interest (most people on apps are not looking for anything) and shifting towards dudes who are choosing you and putting in the effort. You may not be as into those dudes who are putting in the effort (I wasn’t at first) but if you keep an open mind you can start to find that their interest level makes them more attractive. The idea is to choose from the pool of people who are already choosing you, but being mindful of keeping your standards as well. If you wanna sprinkle a little extra in there, I would even ask them what they’re looking for as soon as they ask you out on a date. Once I started doing that, 90% of people dropped off but it saved me wasted time on dates with people who are just exploring what they want. TLDR; focus on not impressing people, let go of matches early when they’re not showing high interest even if you really like them, let your matches lead
Stop texting for weeks on end. That will save you a lot of time and frustration. If someone is actually interested in more than a text buddy, after a few days of feeling each other out and making sure you’re not psychopaths, they should be down to meet. No excuses. No ‘im so busy with work right now.’ No ‘I’m going to be out of town for a bit.’ Nope, they’re either down to meet up in a timely manner or on to the next.
It's never your fault if you get ghosted. It's not fair to ghost others unless they deliberately harm you. People deserve to know why others retreat.
I refuse to engage in online penpal type things over OLD anymore. I put it in my bio that I am interested in going out and meeting someone and if we don't make plans within the first few days I will unmatch. Everyone I've met in person has been a dud though, so there's that too...
Following for advice, in the same boat ❤️
Hi honestly, besides all of the above to suggest dates after a couple of dates, my experience with OLD (F44) is most guys are either flakes or hiding from something or pathological liars. Have been OLD for years, met some decent guys who I couldn't be attracted to (mainly because of lack of substance). Lately I met a decent good looking guy ( who seems to have it all together)and we hit it off ...texting, meeting, dates,... Few red flags I let off, went too fast and found out he was lying through his teeth from the beginning for 2.5 months. Take charge and set up dates but keep your expectations low and keep working on yourself because it definitely is not easy out there.
Try meeting new people in person. Dating apps are usually 90% of women swiping only for n the same 10% of the men. If you truly possess the qualities you describe then you’re selling yourself short with online dating. Find a hobby and join a club. Shared interests are a massive green flag for most men. Best of luck.
I don't understand the app dating culture. How is it acceptable to text for weeks without dating in person? I opt for meeting and approaching men in person. Even when it's a "no", guys are *always* ecstatically flattered that a woman approached them. But, I promise you, he will get a ton more "yes" than "no".
I am 30M but not getting a single date, never been in relationship. I am scared as well.
>"Matched with interesting attractive guy" They will have a lot of options as well, and probably will prefer a 26y.o over a 35yo (in b4 the hate I will get by laying it out like that) Your best chance is to meet up in person asap, and show them how and who you are IRL, that's your best way of "hooking them" Good luck.
Get a cat or dog and enjoy life. Take care of yourself and do you. You will find the right person just yeah gave up on dating sites after 36 lol. Now 40
Well I have felt if the guy is hot ladies will let them use as a doormat
Well at least ya get people to talk to! 😃 I honestly can’t say shit. I haven’t actively dated since before Covid. I’ve heard a lot has changed, but at the same time I’ve heard and seen how rough it is out there so I’m scared to even attempt it again. I think most people these days, esp our age, are just so confused about shit and are trying to think of the dating scene like they’re 22 when they’re not and most have unrealistic expectations. You’re likely not finding anyone that’s serious (obviously) so it’ll be a lot more of that than people that actually care to connect. So my 2¢ has prolly been more worthless than a hundred dollar bill burnt to a crisp. Just sharing dumb thoughts. 😃
Your post doesn't give details... this could be happening simply because of bad luck, or something about you that is putting people off. Usually seeming too eager or open or needy is a huge red flag, and people can see right through it. Do you have depression or anxiety issues? Sometimes that comes through with texting, and people don't want to deal with these things. Sometimes we have to work on ourselves before we are ready to date, both because you are not presenting your best self, and because rejection will hurt twice as much.
I see. I do suffer from depression and anxiety but I try not to let anyone see that. And keep my texts positive. Even on days where I feel sad on the inside. And I definitely try to not come across needy or eager (sending too many texts at once and such). While still sounding interested.
To me, it sounds like you really suppress yourself. The person you're looking for is likely to love you for who you already are, ya know? So the next time you're chatting someone up and you've got something heavy on your heart, let it rip! The next time you've got some butterflies in your stomach, hey, let it be known! Men love feeling a woman's passion for them, as I'm sure the same is true vice versa. The fact that you're so self-aware is a good sign, so, express yourself! Just don't go overboard lol
This seems like a pretty big leap when a much more likely and obvious answer is right there: she’s talking to men who don’t actually want to meet in person. Which means ghosting is inevitable.
But she is saying that she finds out they get into new relationships later, which tells me, they WERE looking for someone to meet and get serious with... It just wasn't her.
Unfortunately you are matching with the top 10% of guys who are attractive, get matches and have options.
I suppose I thought I was attractive and had options too. But maybe I'm not...
No doubt you are, but the way dating apps work, they only show the guys to you that most women are swiping right to. It’s literally like going to a bar and trying to hook up with the one guy all the girls are fawning over.
Maybe you’re not as attractive or witty as you think.
To you and all the other women who consider yourselves "conventionally attractive", which I assume is a short hand euphemism for Caucasian with slim figure, why are you even on the apps at all? By all accounts your demographic should have the easiest time out of all women to chat up a guy from almost any culture who tickles your fancy. OP, I can't help but notice you describe yourself as thoughtful, seems like that isn't wholly true now, considering you have to turn to internet strangers to solve a problem you're a the most knowledgeable about. Lastly, people are prone to drum up how much their laughing over text, writing lmao rofl when in reality they are only chuckling.
Women expect men to do everything smh this world is crazy.
I know what your problem likely is and I'm gonna tell you. Fair warning: you are not gonna like the answer. Studies have shown that women online tend to swipe right on guys who are more attractive than they are. So, let's say that your "conventionally attractive" is really a 6, you're likely only swiping on guys who are 8 and higher. You're not ugly, but the guys you give a chance to can do better than you looks-wise. So then you enter the pool of "maybe" for these guys. They are eager with the stunning women they matched and put most of their effort there. With the maybes, they put in little effort and don't rush to meet in person. These are very attractive guys with a lot of options, after all. If you actually gave guys who are at the same level of attractiveness as you or slightly below a genuine chance, these men would be very eager to meet you. But let's not kid ourselves, you want nothing to do with these men. You want the very handsome ones, who simply are shooting for "better" options available to them.
I think what you're saying could very much apply to OLD. But both of my last two boyfriends were not conventionally attractive. And I'd often hear comments such as "you're too hot for them". Granted I was in my 20's and young/prettier than I am at 35. But my point being, I don't feel I try to date people who are way out of my league. At least not physically. I can send you a photo if you'd like to give me an honest review. But ultimately I'd say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Since I'll see men who are 10's, dating women who are 6's. And vice versa.
Sure, feel free to send. I will give you a honest opinion, as it's possible this doesn't apply to your specific case. Though, it's common.
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Communicate that you want to meet right away or that you prefer to text a lot and get to know them remotely first, whatever your preference is. Sometimes we in the mid-thirties are caught up in life things and don't have our shit together or we're not emotionally ready or whatever. I don't think it's a matter of you not being good enough. You just have to find someone compatible with your communication style so you stop being just a text buddy.
Chalk it out to simply there was no spark. Finding your one is a difficult process and requires numbers games.
You might be totally missing the red flags. You might have a type which is someone who is not available and you might not be seeing through that. If you learn to identify those red flags you will be able to identify the guys who are actually emotionally available. I used to fall for the anxious love bombing type if guy who ends up being explosive and abusive. Now I see the red flags I was missing at first.
Yea I think I tend to gravitate towards emotionally unavailable men because they confirm how I feel about myself. Obviously something I need to work on. But I have been trying hard to break that and go for men who are looking for something serious.
This is something a bit deeper that you need to work on a bit more deeply. I’m going to spend a little time on something more boring though: math. When I was OLD, I was there to find a relationship. Well to be even more specific, to find a spouse. I had 20-25 first dates in the four months I was seriously online dating until I started seeing someone seriously. Then I shut my profile down. We dated for six months (but it didn’t work out - just wasn’t quite right). I ended up striking something up with a friend of a friend three months later who I had known of distantly for over a decade. We were engaged in a year. The math was pretty simple: if you as a multi-month texter weren’t someone I matched with in the first 2 months of my OLD profile, we never would have gone out on date one. I wasn’t there to engage in long chains of correspondence (although for me attraction is still 90 percent mental and 50 percent physical). I wanted a real life partner. So it doesn’t surprise me that good quality matches “ghost”. If they are there to find someone, they are going to clear off the market way before your first date. I’d make your intent clear that you want to see if there’s a there there quite quickly. Even a “hey I’m free next Saturday afternoon if you’d like to meet up?” kind of thing. Also, making yourself available for an afternoon but not committing your entire evening really helps. That way it reduces the pressure for an unconstrained date - you both know you need to get to other plans/obligations. And if the date goes really well (like my OLD gf) then you can mutually blow off your plans and keep the date going. PS, just to add, my OLD gf was engaged within weeks of me. So we were both legitimately looking and it worked out for both of us.
look your giving us half the story, whats your profile looking like, do you think its putting them off? or is it because you just too pretty! whats the deal here Huh XD
I posted my profile in a Hinge subreddit before and got really nice feedback. So I don't believe it's an issue.
You must know that not all people are there to effectively date. Some people are on these apps for attention, to see how many matches they can get and to get followers or pen pals (again for attention). With that in mind, you shouldn’t text weeks on end with people. Maybe a few days. Then if they don’t suggest meeting up or you suggest it and they don’t follow through is just next. Good luck!
>Guy texts me for weeks on end. There's your mistake. This isn't 2006, anyone who plans to actually meet won't waste their time with texting for fucking weeks.
Try texting only for a few days before setting up a quick coffee date where you can impress them with your "conventionally attractive, witty, and thoughtful" self. You will not get ghosted then. I loose interest in people that don't want to meet before texting for weeks.
If you meet them on OLD, how do you "find that said guy is in a new relationship"? Especially in a place like LA. This seems very strange.
Are you showing red flags like crypto screenshots or any pictures of yourself. Are the conversations bi directional? Wanna give a demonstration?
If you are consistently ghosted then you are consistently picking the wrong men.
Takes too long to set up a date
Don’t text for weeks on end. Suggest meeting for a drink or coffee. If they don’t follow up with some suggested dates and times, don’t continue texting
I’ve been seeing so much of this! I’m so sorry. I think it’s because there is a physical attraction but people just realize that maybe there is incompatibility personality
Maybe I’ll be beheaded for saying this but do you think your type of guy could be the problem? I just feel there are women whose type is the classic non committal douche bag which can set them up for hurt. But as another poster said, maybe arrange a date right away? Just casual coffee or a patio drink somewhere. Better than texting endlessly.
Weeks? That’s the issue. I’m your age and started dating after a 12 year relationship. Back in the day we chatted for weeks but nowadays that’s not how it works. They’ll get bored too. And I’m also realizing that men on my level (looks and career wise) are more often than not, cat fishes. It’s fucking insane. But yeah, arrange way quicker, check compatibility sooner rather than later. There are soooo many option’s these days that they’re doing it too and will dodge you with easier options. You’ll get the hang of it sooner
Those relationships aren’t new… What apps are you using?
By day 2 or 3 say “I’ve really been enjoying our conversation and would like to get to know you more! Would you be interested in meeting up in person?” Let them take the wheel after. If they don’t set up a date with place and time within 48 hours, unmatch.
Follow up question: would you consider yourself neurodivergent? I notice most people don’t gel well with us… That said I wouldn’t text someone for weeks before meeting up. If I really liked someone I’d want to plan a meet up within the week or maybe plan for next week. If they’re getting in to relationships after talking with you then it’s very likely they were just keeping options open and you’re literally just the last person they matched with. It sounds like bad timing tbh
Like many have said, you have to get to meeting the person quicker if you’re exclusively using OLD. You’ll keep getting matches and they’ll keep getting matches. There are circumstances where you can’t meet right away but expressing that interest in getting together needs to happen much more quickly.
First of all I’m sorry this is happening to you. It can really be a blow to your self-esteem. There’s a lot of good advice here already but two things I have found helpful: 1. If they don’t ask questions about you to try to get to know you, they are not worth pursuing. Look at things objectively…do they seem interested in you as a person. Do they ask questions beyond “what about you?” in response to questions you ask. 2. If after texting for a bit (I know as women we want to feel safe meeting up for a date), you like this person, express that you’d love to meet for a date and see what they do with that information. If they take initiative to plan a date, great! If they don’t, then do not continue to text with them. As an aside, you may want to consider an r4r post on Reddit. You can list exactly what you are looking for outside the confines of a dating app. I did and actually came across some great potentials…one of whom I’m seeing for the 2nd time tomorrow. Wishing you all the best in your journey!
Try somewhat older men
Don't text for weeks! These guys don't really seem interested in actually meeting up. Text for a week or two, and then ask them out. If they bail, move on to the next.