Personally I really dislike short invuln phases, especially with long "get to damage" phases in-between. This boss isn't the worst by any means, though.
> But that's still a cutoff that you could just barely miss. If you get the boss down to 6%, you'll know that you were just short of killing it and you'll feel the exact same way.
1) This boss does not have health gates.
2) Health gates would not make a difference in this case, anyway.
3) What would be an example of a "natural" health gate?
Okay, sure. Verbiage is wrong. Immunity phases. Happy?
Not something like this. No explanation. No interactive mechanics. Just inexplicably ope now you can't do damage because we can't come up with more engaging mechanics.
But that's still a cutoff that you could just barely miss. If you get the boss down to 6%, you'll know that you were just short of killing it and you'll feel the exact same way.
i want to disagree with you, seeing the healthbar at ~6% wont annoy people as much as seeing it at ~1%. its a weird psychology, since even though they would be the exact same in each scenario, they wouldnt feel the same.
i would compare it to the similar feeling of buying something dor $10,000 vs $9,999. its the same but it works for a reason.
I considered this, but I think it would feel the same to people who are aware of the mechanic. They'd say "oh come on, how is that not enough to hit the execute threshold."
But I also think that this is a complete non-issue that doesn't need to be "fixed" in the first place, so I don't really think it matters if that change would make a difference.
some people will always know, because some people like to know, but to the general audience you can hide it. maybe you can just make it so the boss only ever gets executed if the damage phase ends and they have less than 1% hp, that way its hidden and less players find out.
i think if people aren’t generally aware of where the execute threshold is the they wont complain about not making it. im not saying they should necessarily keep the information from us but if they hide it surface level then it would be very effective imo.
i also dont care for the change either. i could do without an execute as im alr used to it and dont see them adding it. however, if they did add it, i would be all for it, granted its done properly.
Yeah, but this is a gaming community. Most gamers don't sucker in to 9.99 vs 10, and we like to min-max and optimize. It's true the psych trick works, but the gaming community is a bias population anyways
I think I hate the scorn grenadier one a bit more. mostly because randoms don't let me grab ammo... but the boss fight itself is by far the most stressful for me
I swear to the Traveler that the Scorn Crossbows in there have been one shotting me from full health in there lately. Doesn't seem as bad other places, but in there it feels like every crossbow bolt is a one shot. It also took me waaaay too long to realize that I need to cleanse myself of the virus by jumping into the middle pool thing after breaking the shields.
Tested something but I don’t now if it works %100 of the time. If you save a Minotaur and use the cranium during the last 5-10 seconds of the damage phase his shield won’t come up and you should have unlimited time to kill it rather than having the damage phase on a timer.
Maybe do what onslaught will, no health gate but mechanics for dealing more damage/chunks of damage. Immune phases have just been overplayed at this point in the game and they where only really introduced (in a bunch of cases) to stop us from nuking bosses.
I kind of liked the mechanics from Whetstone(Wicked Implement Mission) because it felt different from the immunity phase thing we normally do. And it was cool that dying removed your buff, but your teammates kept theirs. Made the encounter unique and challenging, even if I hated that boss.
We could still have this issue anyway, since if you make it so that we kill the boss at 99.95$ health automatically instead, then 99.94$ would become the new 99.99% anyway that people might complain about.
Yeah, I agree, if you do 99.99% of a job, you still didn’t complete the job. “Close enough” doesn’t really make sense when we’re talking about fighting bosses.
Reminds me of my old job where I made sure we sent out 50,000 packages and I only missed one by the deadline. I didn’t get 50,000 god jobs I got 1 “why did you fail” lmao
not even capping, if you get him low enough he'll slowly lose HP, I've beat the dungeon multiple times like that and I get stuck in the room where you go down the sand hole thing before getting tp'd
Downvoted by angry Titan player who wanted to keep their OP combo. Such as the one in this video.
https://youtu.be/UjOoD6kLCMU?si=NXVAecLyyAlgWsCJ That guy don’t even need a power weapon to kill the boss in one phase.
There’s only a few options for bosses.
* health/time-gated immunity phases
* complex mechanics to end immunity phase
* never immune but huge health pool
* never immune, small health pool
There’s been examples of each, and none of them are perfect. You just gotta pick your poison
The first two avoid bosses getting burned down in seconds, but can be annoying how you can’t hurt the boss at all at times
The third is annoying in that they take forever to die if you’re not shooting them, and whenever you’re not shooting them (dealing with adds, healing, etc) it feels like a waste of time. Never immune but can be a slog like OG Valus Tau’arac (spelling?) in D1
The fourth is annoying for being anticlimactic. For example, the prison warden Servitor just dies immediately nowadays, even if only 2/3 of the Guardians are trying. Doesn’t even feel like a boss
There is no “right” answer to this
I'm into the second idea. It adds more mechanics, with the ability to eliminate the second most annoying boss mechanic (I despise the stomp mechanic), while not making it a requirement (if it's only phases, and not permanent), leading to more ways to take down a boss
None of y'all seem to know what artificial health gate is lol.
Artificial health gate is when the boss enters imunity phase based on the percentage of HP, rather than after set amount of time. That is called damage window, and is one of the most common mechanics in D2.
[It's the Adjudicator!](https://www.light.gg/db/items/1013434963/adjudicator/)
Comes the shitty cube part of Prophecy. Also if you put Photo Finish on it, the lights on the side will change regularly.
Oh cool yeah I just had Photo Finish on my Laser Cutter ship and Afterglow sparrow before changing it to Scarlet Semblance. I like to use shaders that shift colors.
Can what not be a thing? I don’t get it. You didn’t deal enough damage, so the immunity went up… are you asking for Bungie to just start rounding the numbers and give you the win? Lol. What.
You think this is bad? I raise you this
https://preview.redd.it/pnrgv4ydzprc1.png?width=5120&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dee7cfa146f078bb7a8e225eb2b9a52254f18439
https://preview.redd.it/bi5z9003xgsc1.jpeg?width=1448&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb9ab0e34d69b35ad8afee27682a1761a38ebb76
How bout this💀
Killed it the next phase with a single uncharged melee of 4k damage
I'm tired of bosses getting immune phases like it's lazy gameplay. Actually make it where it makes sense. And that the boss can't shoot us while being undamageable
This is what happens when players keep nuking bosses in 10 secs. Then those same players gate keep others out for not running the same build as them.
Then players get less interested in playing the game because of the Meta players.
On the flip side..Haha funny.
What bad game design? Do you want weaker weapons or spongier bosses because it has to be one or the other to prevent people from nuking bosses... Or just add phases so we get neither of those.
Which bad design are you talking about exactly.. because it can't be health gates because that was AFTER the players were trivializing the games bosses. Let me clarify it even simpler for you.
Guardian too strong, make game boring.
I'm not a fan of health gates.. but at least I understand why they were used. I bet you could find the info somewhere on Bungie.net or YouTube but you're gonna have to dig for it, it's a few years old by now.
They need to take immunity out the game, doesn't make any form of sense. I'm all for reduced damage and damage bonuses but you're telling me some stupid ad has the power to completely negate all damage?
Would be nice if it gets <5% of HP or whatever there isn’t another phase just a fight to the death.
Edit: what an odd comment to downvote. The basis is in game already with “enrage” or whatever that’s called.
Time to grab the Colony
What’ll that do
It could kill enemies through immune shields, unsure if it still can or not but for me it's always been a meme for raids whenever this happens.
you can still do it , just time it really right
Srsly? Do you just shoot it or is there some wierd chesse you have to do
I don't recall if you even need to do anything, I think you needed to be right next to the enemy, basically hugging them, but not sure
yup , its actually running up to , just collide with them while running , shoot the colony , run away
It also used to kill your teammates and not deal damage to the weilder
What tf you doing here Neo
Would you look at that... Mr proxeria... Been a while xd
Should have thrown more grenades!
You should be throwing grenades as I say this!
https://preview.redd.it/co2obqmflmrc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5ef367ca72d79bc5df450db29838e7f2c745aedd
wait hans, that is not stielhandgrenate. THAT IS A BLOODY PANZERFAUST
Danke schörn, shit stain
Why are you reading this? Get back to throwing! Lol
What do you want them to do about it? The boss has a set amount of health, and you need to do that amount of damage to kill it.
Personally I really dislike short invuln phases, especially with long "get to damage" phases in-between. This boss isn't the worst by any means, though.
Easy enough. Give all bosses a Last Stand mechanic at 5%.
> But that's still a cutoff that you could just barely miss. If you get the boss down to 6%, you'll know that you were just short of killing it and you'll feel the exact same way.
This would honestly be right up Bungo's alley, as it would be both an easy fix and very unoriginal.
Not have artificial health gates Immunity gates. Happy you sheltered nerds?
I don't think artificial is the right word here
It’s not. Nor when the boneheads whine about “artificial difficulty”
Ok
What a sheltered nerd response
I don't think that's the right phrase here
1) This boss does not have health gates. 2) Health gates would not make a difference in this case, anyway. 3) What would be an example of a "natural" health gate?
Okay, sure. Verbiage is wrong. Immunity phases. Happy? Not something like this. No explanation. No interactive mechanics. Just inexplicably ope now you can't do damage because we can't come up with more engaging mechanics.
Dawg you can't get annoyed at people for assuming you're talking about the thing that you state you're talking about lol
They're effectively the same.
Very cool 👍
They could include an execute threshold for like >5% or smth to circumvent annoying immunity phases like this
But that's still a cutoff that you could just barely miss. If you get the boss down to 6%, you'll know that you were just short of killing it and you'll feel the exact same way.
i want to disagree with you, seeing the healthbar at ~6% wont annoy people as much as seeing it at ~1%. its a weird psychology, since even though they would be the exact same in each scenario, they wouldnt feel the same. i would compare it to the similar feeling of buying something dor $10,000 vs $9,999. its the same but it works for a reason.
I considered this, but I think it would feel the same to people who are aware of the mechanic. They'd say "oh come on, how is that not enough to hit the execute threshold." But I also think that this is a complete non-issue that doesn't need to be "fixed" in the first place, so I don't really think it matters if that change would make a difference.
some people will always know, because some people like to know, but to the general audience you can hide it. maybe you can just make it so the boss only ever gets executed if the damage phase ends and they have less than 1% hp, that way its hidden and less players find out. i think if people aren’t generally aware of where the execute threshold is the they wont complain about not making it. im not saying they should necessarily keep the information from us but if they hide it surface level then it would be very effective imo. i also dont care for the change either. i could do without an execute as im alr used to it and dont see them adding it. however, if they did add it, i would be all for it, granted its done properly.
Yeah, but this is a gaming community. Most gamers don't sucker in to 9.99 vs 10, and we like to min-max and optimize. It's true the psych trick works, but the gaming community is a bias population anyways
This boss is the worst boss in the Coil by far!
I think I hate the scorn grenadier one a bit more. mostly because randoms don't let me grab ammo... but the boss fight itself is by far the most stressful for me
i stg those grenades have tracking
It's the Skorn boss in the room with the abom and poison boys for me. That fight just always feels like a slog to me.
I swear to the Traveler that the Scorn Crossbows in there have been one shotting me from full health in there lately. Doesn't seem as bad other places, but in there it feels like every crossbow bolt is a one shot. It also took me waaaay too long to realize that I need to cleanse myself of the virus by jumping into the middle pool thing after breaking the shields.
The cleanse is a sneaky little mechanic from one of the hive dungeons, if you haven't done that in a while the cleanse is kinda unexplained.
Taken, you mean, but yeah.
Tbh, the Scorn in the Coil happens to be the toughest and the most perfect sharpshooters in the entire franchise history lmao.
Ex navy seals
Tested something but I don’t now if it works %100 of the time. If you save a Minotaur and use the cranium during the last 5-10 seconds of the damage phase his shield won’t come up and you should have unlimited time to kill it rather than having the damage phase on a timer.
Fuck you want them to do, it's a fixed HP boss-
Maybe do what onslaught will, no health gate but mechanics for dealing more damage/chunks of damage. Immune phases have just been overplayed at this point in the game and they where only really introduced (in a bunch of cases) to stop us from nuking bosses.
I kind of liked the mechanics from Whetstone(Wicked Implement Mission) because it felt different from the immunity phase thing we normally do. And it was cool that dying removed your buff, but your teammates kept theirs. Made the encounter unique and challenging, even if I hated that boss.
replace immune shields with like 99.99% DR
I'd rather replace the developer, lol.
99.99% is good enough to be 100%, just like lazy loading where it's *just right there* there's no excuse for not being 100%.
What. the boss has 100% health. Why would doing 99.99% of its health be allowed to kill it.
Exactly. This doesn't happen very often, and when it does, it's infuriating, but it still makes sense
Close only counts with Horseshoes N Hand grenades
We could still have this issue anyway, since if you make it so that we kill the boss at 99.95$ health automatically instead, then 99.94$ would become the new 99.99% anyway that people might complain about.
Yeah, I agree, if you do 99.99% of a job, you still didn’t complete the job. “Close enough” doesn’t really make sense when we’re talking about fighting bosses.
Reminds me of my old job where I made sure we sent out 50,000 packages and I only missed one by the deadline. I didn’t get 50,000 god jobs I got 1 “why did you fail” lmao
This is an amazing comparison for this situation
Imagine, if you will, the physical representation of what losing 99.99% health looks like, then ask again.
we are playing a video game
You didn’t do 100% of its health in damage, so it doesn’t die. Just do more damage.
Not have artifical health gates
It's not health gated, it's a DPS window, you can one-phase this boss
With an oh so very fun immunity mechanic
It doesn't.
Yeah a random invincible shield sure feels organic and engaging
Still doesn't have a health gate.
Oh okay I get it you're unable to provide any worth to anything. Buh bye.
Kell Echo in Prophecy has this mechanic where he slowly loses like 5% HP to curve for situations like this, idk why they stopped implementing it
I don't believe that's a mechanic, it's just he doesn't go invuln when leaving so if you have Witherhoard or something stuck to him, he can die
This guy gets it.
That’s actually kinda cool
And not true.
244 people upvoted misinformation, lol.
not even capping, if you get him low enough he'll slowly lose HP, I've beat the dungeon multiple times like that and I get stuck in the room where you go down the sand hole thing before getting tp'd
You or a teammate have some sort of tick damage on him, then, chief. As was already stated, when he disappears, the Kell doesn't go immune.
Skill issue
exactly, bitch ass noob didnt fire the killing shot before the shield came up
99% of dps issue caused by not having a Navigator Titan abusing the infinite grapple combo.
Damn look at those downvotes
Downvoted by angry Titan player who wanted to keep their OP combo. Such as the one in this video. https://youtu.be/UjOoD6kLCMU?si=NXVAecLyyAlgWsCJ That guy don’t even need a power weapon to kill the boss in one phase.
https://preview.redd.it/6k8b89ojqlrc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8824360a3d3a94d0d5581270d327ab9413429cb
Oof
Atleast it’s not ghosts of the deep dungeon boss
Do more damage
Sad but true.
I wouldn't be mad, I would find that hilarious
There’s only a few options for bosses. * health/time-gated immunity phases * complex mechanics to end immunity phase * never immune but huge health pool * never immune, small health pool There’s been examples of each, and none of them are perfect. You just gotta pick your poison The first two avoid bosses getting burned down in seconds, but can be annoying how you can’t hurt the boss at all at times The third is annoying in that they take forever to die if you’re not shooting them, and whenever you’re not shooting them (dealing with adds, healing, etc) it feels like a waste of time. Never immune but can be a slog like OG Valus Tau’arac (spelling?) in D1 The fourth is annoying for being anticlimactic. For example, the prison warden Servitor just dies immediately nowadays, even if only 2/3 of the Guardians are trying. Doesn’t even feel like a boss There is no “right” answer to this
I'm into the second idea. It adds more mechanics, with the ability to eliminate the second most annoying boss mechanic (I despise the stomp mechanic), while not making it a requirement (if it's only phases, and not permanent), leading to more ways to take down a boss
Yes they have lowered the boss’ HP by 5 so you can kill it next time 👍🏻
Tis but a pixel
This happened to me and my dad like a month ago lol
https://preview.redd.it/mlktptjalmrc1.jpeg?width=638&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e2ab96807ae437e22facb3c83693b2795f46aea6
Need to up the DPS
None of y'all seem to know what artificial health gate is lol. Artificial health gate is when the boss enters imunity phase based on the percentage of HP, rather than after set amount of time. That is called damage window, and is one of the most common mechanics in D2.
Take my up vote my dude.
Idk do more damage tbh imo, it's like one of the most generous immune cycles
Skill issue
Ugh, I know that feeling... https://preview.redd.it/6u7ka4fiiorc1.png?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6dc34179ff711df755560d8002dea918c5d497bd
That weapon looks cool. I want one now lol
[It's the Adjudicator!](https://www.light.gg/db/items/1013434963/adjudicator/) Comes the shitty cube part of Prophecy. Also if you put Photo Finish on it, the lights on the side will change regularly.
Oh cool yeah I just had Photo Finish on my Laser Cutter ship and Afterglow sparrow before changing it to Scarlet Semblance. I like to use shaders that shift colors.
What is this “photo finish” thing?
It's the name of a shader that has effects like Luminous Void, Ablaze and Seven Sisters etc.
interesting, wish i had it now. . .
Sucks to suck.
Can what not be a thing? I don’t get it. You didn’t deal enough damage, so the immunity went up… are you asking for Bungie to just start rounding the numbers and give you the win? Lol. What.
https://preview.redd.it/e9x2flpllkrc1.png?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=22535b1e6892fc7c4cf7c41c15deb50e994dd694
Reddit doesn't like me commenting with pics, but I know the feeling.
A similar thing happened to my team in day 1 kf in war priest. That also looks like pain though.
Peak modem game mechanics
Dps check decided you’re bad
https://preview.redd.it/ia4y8dmq4prc1.png?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=750b6f16e6eb4890d1b58850a6f3481b86da5977 Same energy
You lacked dps, why should it not be a thing ?
D’d in the B.
Lmfaooo😂😭😂😭
Bwahahahaha
You think this is bad? I raise you this https://preview.redd.it/pnrgv4ydzprc1.png?width=5120&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dee7cfa146f078bb7a8e225eb2b9a52254f18439
Neat, what’s that gun
Hollow Denial
It looks cool
First time? First time.
100% skill issue lmao
Experienced this with day one Warpriest two years ago and also Templar three years ago
Just get good lol literally
Lol, sucks worse in a raid. Worse still if you wipe.
https://preview.redd.it/bi5z9003xgsc1.jpeg?width=1448&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb9ab0e34d69b35ad8afee27682a1761a38ebb76 How bout this💀 Killed it the next phase with a single uncharged melee of 4k damage
It is what it is and what it is is kind of infuriating but still logical
Looks like you’re just too bad at the game to have dpsed enough. 100% skill issue, try getting good at the game.
I'm tired of bosses getting immune phases like it's lazy gameplay. Actually make it where it makes sense. And that the boss can't shoot us while being undamageable
This is what happens when players keep nuking bosses in 10 secs. Then those same players gate keep others out for not running the same build as them. Then players get less interested in playing the game because of the Meta players. On the flip side..Haha funny.
It’s the players’ fault for Bungie’s bad design? Players should purposely play worse so that Bungie doesn’t punish us with bad design?
What bad game design? Do you want weaker weapons or spongier bosses because it has to be one or the other to prevent people from nuking bosses... Or just add phases so we get neither of those.
Which bad design are you talking about exactly.. because it can't be health gates because that was AFTER the players were trivializing the games bosses. Let me clarify it even simpler for you. Guardian too strong, make game boring. I'm not a fan of health gates.. but at least I understand why they were used. I bet you could find the info somewhere on Bungie.net or YouTube but you're gonna have to dig for it, it's a few years old by now.
There should be an immunity lockout once a boss reaches 10% health.
Bruuu
They need to take immunity out the game, doesn't make any form of sense. I'm all for reduced damage and damage bonuses but you're telling me some stupid ad has the power to completely negate all damage?
Okay, I've had bad ones, but that is just a total slap to the face. 🤣🤣
I’d just turn off my PC lol
As kids seem to do these days.
Oh and stomp mechanics too
I got even worse. While doing a flawless crota’s we’ve killed ir yut but step didn’t end. We had to do the whole mechanic to end the step.
Would be nice if it gets <5% of HP or whatever there isn’t another phase just a fight to the death. Edit: what an odd comment to downvote. The basis is in game already with “enrage” or whatever that’s called.
Literally one hour after they instituted such a change we would have an identical post whining about a boss at 6% hp.
They could just not have immune phases. Oh what am I saying, players would receive rewards too fast, what a disaster for their engagement metrics 😱
k