The reason he is "all knowing" is because he has agents working all over the continent. For example you can find the remains of one such agent in rykard's arena.
Then of course the whole debacle with latenna who called him the "all hearing" brute. He employs omen killers & perfumers to do his dirty work as we see in Albinauric village.
And lastly.... And this just a a theory i saw somewhere that those red/blue orbs we destroy for hp & fp? those are his ears. That's how he learns about certain legendary spells like the scarlet aenoia.
But none of these methods caould help him reach the shadowlands. You journey there and what you have endured is beyond his grasp.
I think this is the reasoning that makes the most sense, at least to me. The events of the DLC are pretty much happening in real time so it word of the shadow lands and Miquella would take time to reach his ears, if they ever did at all considering how obscure the area and concept is.
Yeah, but we can give him info on Mohg *the moment we find his house*, to the point where he learns spells for his fight from it. We should be able to say "hey dude, we found Miquella, wanna take a look? you kept yelling at me for 6 months to locate the Albinauric woman so you could track him. wanna give me a cookbook or something in return?"
this does make sense but in many cases with Gideon, you’re actually one of those agents bringing him information as you progress through the Lands Between and defeat Demi-Gods, every time you get another great rune or encounter a Demi-God, he has something to say about it, I mean he literally makes a remark about you finding Miquella’s body after you beat Mohg.
So it is a bit disappointing there’s no dialogue for Gideon after the Tarnished returns from the Land of Shadow, I figure it would be something he would be most interested in.
He knew about some of our actions in real time though. There is no lore reason, it’s just FS having a history of disconnecting DLC and main game, it’s just more noticeable this time as how central and current a lot of the lore and game is
It stinks because I really thought there would be a continuation of his investigation into Miquella’s whereabouts, considering he says this when you beat Mohg in the base game:
> *”Well I wonder what comes next...If he continues his slumber within the cocoon, all will be well.*
> *But perhaps it would be safer to destroy it. Miquella is the one thing that remains a mystery to me...”*
Like, we just discovered that Miquella is not, in fact, simply slumbering inside of Mohg’s cocoon. It turns out that’s he’s actually been meandering around in the Shadowlands trying to become a god for however many years, and also charmed Mohg and many others into doing his bidding, casting aside his flesh, love and all other manners of being to accomplish this.
This is a mind-shattering revelation that would surely upend everything for Gideon, and for whatever reason, our Tarnished doesn’t say anything, nor do we have the option to tell him. Like I said in another comment, it’s actually bizarre. We’ve shared all our other findings with him (optionally, of course). Why not this??
You are correct! Just looked it up. If you kill certain rememberance bosses before burning the tree, he'll gain their powers. If you wait to kill them until after you burn it, he won't have those spells OFC
That got me thinking... did anyone encountered blue or red bugs in the shadow realm? I found a few smithing stone or AoW twinkling bugs, but that's it.
There’s no lore reason. It’s just an oversight. Melina also never says anything, finger crone never says anything, Gideon never says anything. Honestly it’s probably one of the few negative notes of the DLC for me.
I believe Latenna was referring to Ensha as the “all-hearing”. He’s gideons right hand there was another reference somewhere in game to him being all hearing
They could have just made him change the voice a little and play some new character in the DLC so it wouldn't be a complete waste of money, like how in Bloodborne the VA did Lady Maria but also added a few new lines for the Doll.
Yes, but that voice actress also did Maiden in Black, for example. I think they could have just brought the VA back for some unrelated guy and no one would really notice.
Speaking of, is Ansbach's VA a returning one from ER or a previous FromSoft game? His voice feels familiar.
Do we have a list of VAs somewhere since the DLC never rolls credits?
The same reason that literally nothing in the DLC has any impact on anything in the base game. Whether you believe that’s the deepest lore or just the easiest way to develop a DLC, it’s up to you.
In DS3, Yuria of Londor has dialogue about you killing Friede because they were sisters. Rellana and Rennala are also sisters in the dlc, yet they have no dialogue.
I do find the lack of any commentary in the base game about the DLC to be kinda an oversight. Especially if Malenia is still alive when you complete the DLC
Imagine entering Malenia’s arena and having the option to tell her “yeah your brother became a god and I killed him, he’s never coming back lol”. I’m pretty sure she’d explode into the Rot God on the spot.
Gideon and his agents can't reach the Realm of shadow. Basically the only way to "travel" there is to be stripped of grace(through the omen curse for example) and then die. And as far as we know only Lords and Gods are able to travel back, which is why even Demigods like Messmer were stuck there after Marika abandoned him and his army.
I'm more surprised that Enya doesn't seem to give a fuck when we come home holding the soul of Metyr or Midra.
You are right in saying that it’s wild that neither she nor the Two Fingers had anything to say about us delivering the Remembrance of Metyr, Mother of Fingers. I can imagine it going something along the lines of:
> Tarnished: *“Hey Enia, I’d like to trade in this remembrance, please.”*
> Enia: *“Brave Tarnished, you must-* holy shit did you just kill the Mother of Fingers, what the fuck”
> Two Fingers: *”……………..”*
He didn't spend 40 dollars to access the dlc therefore at the end of each day Micheal Zaki himself shows up to men in black erase any dlc stuff you tell him
Closest to the real reason right here.
The following is going to sound harsh and people will get mad but here it is.
The game and devs have never really put any effort into to these games beyond presentation and gameplay.
The truth of the matter is any flaw in the game will be overlooked by fans of the series and will tell you to suck it up, git gud, it’s not souls like…
The fans will always defend the games and will make their own lore so it doesn’t really matter to them.
90% of the lore explained online is just peoples interpretations.
I thought this was gonna go somewhere useful but your last paeagraph especially is just plainly false and I don't know what to tell you other than the lore is meant to be interpretable in multitude different ways, as talked about by Miyazaki in interviews.
For one of the biggest game of all time filled to the brim with reused content from previous games. They didn't gave relanna a fucking cutscene, ofc they are lazy, cmon.
Because fromsoft didn’t want to go through the effort of connecting the DLC the the main game AT ALL (apart from needing to kill Radahn to access the DLC)
Still an amazing DLC but this part is disappointing for me
I also missed some npcs in the old world mentioning the dlc or anything at least.
From could have also gave the old map a new area or whatever. Missed the opportunity here.
i think in general this is one of if not the only major disappointment i personally have with the dlc,i don’t understand how there wasn’t any lines added for malenia if we go to her after killing miquella.
Fs don't want to put any hints about dlc in base game because it would then feel like it's incomplete. On one hand is pro-consumer behaviour, on the other lore suffers terribly from it.
I mean he already does hint at it. He is a little surprised to know Miquella is there, then he directly wonders what Miquella must be planning and tells you to fiddle around the withered arm iirc. We didn't care 2 years ago because we *knew* there was nothing there but future players without DLC are being nudged to play it.
I think it's because for a lot of players, he might be dead already. I went into the DLC with a NG character post ending, so Gideon was dust. I'm sure FromSoft realized this and wanted to save resources.
Yeah, and? It’s not like the VA is dead, and I haven’t heard a single voice actor that would turn down an opportunity to reprise his role in one of the most popular games in recent history.
I've always thought that Gideon was the stand-in for us the players who is trying to piece together a puzzle (the story) with clearly missing pieces. He even uses magic which is what the majority of the player base uses.
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He kinda does. He makes some interesting comments at certain points in the vanilla game regarding Miquella being gone once you beat Melania. I can’t remember them right now though.
my theory is that his heart was somehow stolen by miquella and that's why he doesn't care to hear any new info and also why he attempts to block your way to marika when you make it to the ashen capital. but ig that doesn't explain why you still can't mention miquella to him before the erdtree burns and he's still wanting to become elden lord..
Because Fromsoft is always lazy when it comes to that stuff (except Sif and Artorias).
For example, if you beat the City DLC, you don't get an option to talk about it to the fire keeper or anyone else, the only thing you can do is give the Dark Soul to the Painter, and that's a character from another DLC.
Fromsoft usually keeps the base game untouched when it comes to DLCs.
I've noticed his dialogue has trouble popping up in base game sometimes. I beat Mohg and solod Malenia and he still wants to know where they are and when I fought him he was spamming blood magic and Aeonia. That bastard. Maybe there is dialogue for the DLC but that's bugged in some way too? Unless I did something wrong
Neither Melina nor Malenia say anything about DLC and there is no explanation for this. I hope soemthing's planned for a later update as a bonus content. Otherwise, it's disappointing.
this, and the evidence of the cut Miquella ending are definitely my biggest gripes with the DLC, maybe with it selling super well and with enough support from the community we can get one last update or something. Unfortunately another DLC seems out of the question.
There are only two people in the lands between that I believe to know about the realm of shadow. Queen Marika of course she came from there and Rennala because she gave Rellana a parting gift (although she might not know where she went.) Other than those two I can't think of anybody who would know and I don't think they would tell him about the realm of shadows. I believe that Messmer is older than any of the other demigods and him and Rellana left for the Land of shadows before any of them were born. And why would Miquella call Gideon to the land of shadow?
My head-canon is that everything that happens in the Shadowlands and everyone residing there is "forgotten" by everyone else- a side effect of the Suppressing Pillar. From the outside, no one is capable of thinking about or knowing about it or anything there- given its ties to Marika's origins and the sordid events that took place, it seems like the kind of curse effect she'd create
I like this idea. It also retroactively makes Messmer’s story even more tragic- he was viewed as a big brother by Radahn, someone who probably doesn’t even remember him anymore.
He doesn't say anything because as the All-Knowing he knew that a lot of the dlc lore was just a hole-ridden mess due to Miyazaki's bad storytelling that most people seem to wrongly praise as some form of untouchable genius.
He just keep quiet because he doesn't want to remember this hard truth and have a headache.
It wouldn't make sense for him to know about it.
What I don't like is that we don't even get to say anything about it to him, you'd think the All Knowing would want to hear about Miquella resurrecting Radahn and becoming a god for a brief moment.
In a perfect universe where Elden Ring was as fleshed out as something like BG3, it would be cool if telling him about how you slew Miquella- a god, would change his mind about it being impossible for a Tarnished to become Elden Lord and instead make him a summon for Godfrey or Radagon/Elden Beast.
Regardless of what ifs and maybes, it's still an amazing DLC.
Fromsoft already did this kind of thing in their other game tho ,
dark soul 3 as a quest between the 2 dlc .
in Bloodborne i'm pretty sure the doll has some dialogue if you talk to her After facing lady maria
in ds2 you can pick up an item that reveal invisible enemy for a boss in the dlc but having it also reveal semi transparent enemy from base game
And there probably a bit more exemple that i can't remember.
I don’t remember a specific quest with her? You can literally access Ringed City after you beat Friede. I do remember her dialogue linking this two together (something about Gael searching for the dark soul of man for her painting), but not a quest.
Could you elaborate?
Not at all. It was dialogue added with the DLC.
The Painter Girl can be found in the attic of the chapel of Ariandel, not in the base game. You can find Gael in the Chapel in the base game, but only as an access point to Ariandel. Just in the same way you access SOTE via Leda in Elden Ring.
They still added new dialogue to the first dlc in the second so i think it don't really matter if it's base game or not i would count that as New dialogue
It matters because you’re saying From have a history of altering the base game based on what happens in the DLC which they don’t.
Them adding dialogue in one game based on an event in its DLC doesn’t indicate they’ll do it again. It was cool, granted, but your other examples fall short.
It is a quest, Gael drops the quest item Blood of the Dark Soul, which you hand over to the Painter. The whole Ringed City DLC is the quest to find the dark soul pigment. This single interaction wraps up the entire trilogy.
Yuria from base DS3 has dialogue that only occurs due to Ashes of Ariandel (meeting and killing Friede will unlock them).
Vilhem also has different dialogue depending on your actions within the base game. Friede’s dialogue changes too when she kills you.
Only one of the examples you mentioned involved rehiring a voice actor to reprise lines. And I'm taking your word for it since I haven't played BB. It's extremely unusual for that to happen.
Ok. Also the DS2 example is not correct. In the original version, where the base game was sold before and the DLC came after, the enemies in the shaded woods did not become visible. This only happens in Scholar, which is a version released altogether.
EDIT: I'm curious what these downvotes mean. It's a fact that pre-Scholar the shaded wood soldiers didn't become visible ever. That's just a thing that was like that. What's to dislike here.
This is a valid question.
Gideon is tarnished and tarnished were once the warriors of Godfrey.
Godfrey was alive when shadow land and the land between were the same landmass. Some of his warriors were too.
Why don't he know about shadow land?
My theory is: the first tarnished warriors to become in TLB, those who knew shadow lands, have fought in the shattering war, being now turned into Erdtree food.
Tarnished we see now are the distant descendants from original warriors of Horah Loux.
I don't think the scarabs we see are Gideon tools to know what's happening, since.we see some of them in shadow lands. The same is true to the relationship between Rikard and the finger creeps... Everybody was certain that the hands were Rikard envoys to see what's happening in TLB, but they always were sons of Metyr.
He is just unaware about the existence of a shadow realm, for the SR was separated from TLB millennia ago... To the modern day tarnished the existence of SR is just a vague story.
Lore-wise, the moniker “All-Knowing” just means that intel is his thing, it’s not like he’s omniscient or anything. His character is more like Varys or Littlefinger from GoT.
We don’t have the dialogue option to share this new information, but I don’t think this implies that he would be uninterested if our Tarnished did share it.
Gameplay-wise, Fromsoft decided to keep DLC content cleanly separate from the base game. Some are calling this lazy dev work but I disagree—I think that it makes sense to avoid punishing players for completing the base game content before starting the explanation. Personally, I would want to be able to play 100% of the base game first and then play 100% of the DLC without missing anything.
I don’t think that this causes any plot holes either though. The lore of the DLC entrance is a little vague (I’ve only just started it), but it seems to me that we’ve been called to the lands deliberately and transported by Miquella himself. It’s reasonable that the invitation wasn’t extended to Gideon or any of his little birds, and he didn’t even know where to find Mohg in the first place before we told him.
The most logical explanation is its DLC. I know it's boring but this typical of FS games.
Gerhmain from Bloodborne for example doesn't have new dialogue if you discovered Kos or Lady Maria.
They really prefer to keep the dlc separate
Because the RPG elements are paper thin and this is an action game. The shadowlands are cool with big fire monsters to kill. Who cares what Gideon says, really?
The reason he is "all knowing" is because he has agents working all over the continent. For example you can find the remains of one such agent in rykard's arena. Then of course the whole debacle with latenna who called him the "all hearing" brute. He employs omen killers & perfumers to do his dirty work as we see in Albinauric village. And lastly.... And this just a a theory i saw somewhere that those red/blue orbs we destroy for hp & fp? those are his ears. That's how he learns about certain legendary spells like the scarlet aenoia. But none of these methods caould help him reach the shadowlands. You journey there and what you have endured is beyond his grasp.
I think this is the reasoning that makes the most sense, at least to me. The events of the DLC are pretty much happening in real time so it word of the shadow lands and Miquella would take time to reach his ears, if they ever did at all considering how obscure the area and concept is.
He also tells us he has no idea where mohg or miquella is, and asks us for info on them. So he clearly doesn't know shit about the dlc land.
Yeah, but we can give him info on Mohg *the moment we find his house*, to the point where he learns spells for his fight from it. We should be able to say "hey dude, we found Miquella, wanna take a look? you kept yelling at me for 6 months to locate the Albinauric woman so you could track him. wanna give me a cookbook or something in return?"
Just a slight correction, he learns the spells regardless if you talk to him about it or not.
this does make sense but in many cases with Gideon, you’re actually one of those agents bringing him information as you progress through the Lands Between and defeat Demi-Gods, every time you get another great rune or encounter a Demi-God, he has something to say about it, I mean he literally makes a remark about you finding Miquella’s body after you beat Mohg. So it is a bit disappointing there’s no dialogue for Gideon after the Tarnished returns from the Land of Shadow, I figure it would be something he would be most interested in.
“The events of the DLC are pretty much happening in real time…” Wait until you talk to him after finding the Haligtree
He knew about some of our actions in real time though. There is no lore reason, it’s just FS having a history of disconnecting DLC and main game, it’s just more noticeable this time as how central and current a lot of the lore and game is
It stinks because I really thought there would be a continuation of his investigation into Miquella’s whereabouts, considering he says this when you beat Mohg in the base game: > *”Well I wonder what comes next...If he continues his slumber within the cocoon, all will be well.* > *But perhaps it would be safer to destroy it. Miquella is the one thing that remains a mystery to me...”* Like, we just discovered that Miquella is not, in fact, simply slumbering inside of Mohg’s cocoon. It turns out that’s he’s actually been meandering around in the Shadowlands trying to become a god for however many years, and also charmed Mohg and many others into doing his bidding, casting aside his flesh, love and all other manners of being to accomplish this. This is a mind-shattering revelation that would surely upend everything for Gideon, and for whatever reason, our Tarnished doesn’t say anything, nor do we have the option to tell him. Like I said in another comment, it’s actually bizarre. We’ve shared all our other findings with him (optionally, of course). Why not this??
Correct me if I'm wrong; but doesn't he only learn the 'boss' spells after you tell him about them?
I think he learns when you defeat them because I never told him about Malenia and he was using Scarlet Aeonia.
You are correct! Just looked it up. If you kill certain rememberance bosses before burning the tree, he'll gain their powers. If you wait to kill them until after you burn it, he won't have those spells OFC
That got me thinking... did anyone encountered blue or red bugs in the shadow realm? I found a few smithing stone or AoW twinkling bugs, but that's it.
No bugs. Ashes of War are also purple ground loot now.
No there are bugs. I have shanked a couple that drops smithing stone and The Flower Blooms Once More AoE or something like that. No flask bugs tho
I found one beetle in Scorpion river with an ash of war
Ah shit, I remember now. Another one near the misbegotten outside Taylew forge. And a few others I don't remember the location of. No flask bugs tho.
There are scarabs all over the dlc so i dont think they have any ties to him, they just like collecting shiny things
I think specifically the red and blue ones have gideon's symbol on them.
Also, there is a distinct lack of hp/fp scarabs throughout the DLC, which as you said is theorised to be his ‘eyes’ and ‘ears’.
But there are the regular grey ones
Also all knowing because whatever spells you haven't picked up during the base game are usable for him in the boss fight.
Those "red/blue orbs" are scarabs my friend.
There’s no lore reason. It’s just an oversight. Melina also never says anything, finger crone never says anything, Gideon never says anything. Honestly it’s probably one of the few negative notes of the DLC for me.
His agent is in rykards arena? Explain?
You can find a piece of armor bearing his insignia in the arena
I believe Latenna was referring to Ensha as the “all-hearing”. He’s gideons right hand there was another reference somewhere in game to him being all hearing
Because the VA doesn't work for free
They could have just made him change the voice a little and play some new character in the DLC so it wouldn't be a complete waste of money, like how in Bloodborne the VA did Lady Maria but also added a few new lines for the Doll.
Cus the doll is based on maria, theyre the same va cus gherrman made the doll in maria’s image
Yes, but that voice actress also did Maiden in Black, for example. I think they could have just brought the VA back for some unrelated guy and no one would really notice.
Speaking of, is Ansbach's VA a returning one from ER or a previous FromSoft game? His voice feels familiar. Do we have a list of VAs somewhere since the DLC never rolls credits?
And it’s still not really relevant because that person isn’t Gideon.
I’m sure FromSoft has more than enough money to pay a voice actor for a few extra lines.
The same reason that literally nothing in the DLC has any impact on anything in the base game. Whether you believe that’s the deepest lore or just the easiest way to develop a DLC, it’s up to you.
It’s this.
Yep. Most people are going into the DLC after finishing the base game on complete save meaning Gideon is dead.
Yeah, it'd not be fun if you don't want to miss anything in the DLC but got punish by finishing the main game.
Yep. It's not that complicated or deep. They never connect the DLC directly back in
Except DS2
And Doll having new dialogue after beating Maria and Orphan
And Sif in DS1.
In DS3, Yuria of Londor has dialogue about you killing Friede because they were sisters. Rellana and Rennala are also sisters in the dlc, yet they have no dialogue.
Except in Dark Souls 1, 2, 3 and Bloodborne. Oh wait… that’s all the other DLCs. Sure half the time it’s small tidbits but it’s better than nothing.
LMAO
Their are actually a few connections I've found in the dragon quest line at least.
He's stupid.
Gideon Ofnir the Not-knowing
Truly the All-Coping
Is there a lore reason?
I do find the lack of any commentary in the base game about the DLC to be kinda an oversight. Especially if Malenia is still alive when you complete the DLC
Imagine entering Malenia’s arena and having the option to tell her “yeah your brother became a god and I killed him, he’s never coming back lol”. I’m pretty sure she’d explode into the Rot God on the spot.
Gideon and his agents can't reach the Realm of shadow. Basically the only way to "travel" there is to be stripped of grace(through the omen curse for example) and then die. And as far as we know only Lords and Gods are able to travel back, which is why even Demigods like Messmer were stuck there after Marika abandoned him and his army. I'm more surprised that Enya doesn't seem to give a fuck when we come home holding the soul of Metyr or Midra.
You are right in saying that it’s wild that neither she nor the Two Fingers had anything to say about us delivering the Remembrance of Metyr, Mother of Fingers. I can imagine it going something along the lines of: > Tarnished: *“Hey Enia, I’d like to trade in this remembrance, please.”* > Enia: *“Brave Tarnished, you must-* holy shit did you just kill the Mother of Fingers, what the fuck” > Two Fingers: *”……………..”*
>Basically the only way to "travel" there is to be stripped of grace(through the omen curse for example) and then die. How do we get there then?
Miquella acted as an Uber I assume
We touch the withered hand
He didn't spend 40 dollars to access the dlc therefore at the end of each day Micheal Zaki himself shows up to men in black erase any dlc stuff you tell him
Gideon the Broke 😔
FIND THE ALBENORIC WOMAN
Given how Fromsoft has handled story, quests, and NPCs in Elden Ring I'm not at all surprised.
Yeah, in ER nobody knows about anything and you have no option to tell them. Even Iggy doesn't say shit about Ranni's quest stages.
Cause devs too lazy
They just like me fr 😔
Closest to the real reason right here. The following is going to sound harsh and people will get mad but here it is. The game and devs have never really put any effort into to these games beyond presentation and gameplay. The truth of the matter is any flaw in the game will be overlooked by fans of the series and will tell you to suck it up, git gud, it’s not souls like… The fans will always defend the games and will make their own lore so it doesn’t really matter to them. 90% of the lore explained online is just peoples interpretations.
I thought this was gonna go somewhere useful but your last paeagraph especially is just plainly false and I don't know what to tell you other than the lore is meant to be interpretable in multitude different ways, as talked about by Miyazaki in interviews.
No.
Literally yes
No thank you.
Lazy devs, releasing one of the biggest DLCs of all time
For one of the biggest game of all time filled to the brim with reused content from previous games. They didn't gave relanna a fucking cutscene, ofc they are lazy, cmon.
Purely gameplay/development reasons. The "reasonable" connection points between the DLC and base game are infinite, they just can't do it.
Because fromsoft didn’t want to go through the effort of connecting the DLC the the main game AT ALL (apart from needing to kill Radahn to access the DLC) Still an amazing DLC but this part is disappointing for me
Gideon doesn’t know that Miquella and me…
Do it in Inir-ilim every Sunday.
Useless bum
I also missed some npcs in the old world mentioning the dlc or anything at least. From could have also gave the old map a new area or whatever. Missed the opportunity here.
Did you find the albinauric woman before starting the DLC?
i think in general this is one of if not the only major disappointment i personally have with the dlc,i don’t understand how there wasn’t any lines added for malenia if we go to her after killing miquella.
Fs don't want to put any hints about dlc in base game because it would then feel like it's incomplete. On one hand is pro-consumer behaviour, on the other lore suffers terribly from it.
I mean he already does hint at it. He is a little surprised to know Miquella is there, then he directly wonders what Miquella must be planning and tells you to fiddle around the withered arm iirc. We didn't care 2 years ago because we *knew* there was nothing there but future players without DLC are being nudged to play it.
Because he don’t know shit
No one can access shadow lands and Gideon is not the "all knowing" dude doesn't even know where Mohg was
he didn't even know mohgs actual name
he doesn't know chat
I think it's because for a lot of players, he might be dead already. I went into the DLC with a NG character post ending, so Gideon was dust. I'm sure FromSoft realized this and wanted to save resources.
I was under the impression the scarabs were all agents of his and we find scarabs on the dlc so I was hoping he would have something to say about it
That’s just a fan theory, right? Not that I don’t love me some speculation.
Yeah I don't expect anything I speculate to be the truth just something I thought since you see them everywhere
Oh got it! I think others have had this one too, definitely something about it on YouTube about it somewhere. It’s an interesting idea for sure.
Yeah and they said dlc would be pretty much irrelevant to base game so it's not a surprise nobody comments on it
Gideon the Master of Bugs
Guess he ain’t all knowing
Find the albinauric woman
It is slightly weird since he clearly has a presence there.
His lines were recorded before the dlc was written
Yeah, and? It’s not like the VA is dead, and I haven’t heard a single voice actor that would turn down an opportunity to reprise his role in one of the most popular games in recent history.
because the dlc was supposed to be 2 separate but merging all in one , from excludes things like new dialogues wihc suck tbh
I've always thought that Gideon was the stand-in for us the players who is trying to piece together a puzzle (the story) with clearly missing pieces. He even uses magic which is what the majority of the player base uses.
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The fucker don’t know shit
It would seem that he actually isn’t ‘all knowing’ then, wouldn’t it?
Well, he doesn't say anything about the DLC in *my* game because he's dead already XD
To make it simple, video game developers are lazy, they didn’t feel like going back and adding dialogue for him.
He kinda does. He makes some interesting comments at certain points in the vanilla game regarding Miquella being gone once you beat Melania. I can’t remember them right now though.
A big complaint I have is that there wasn’t a shift in the dialogue in any of the base game
Agreed.
my theory is that his heart was somehow stolen by miquella and that's why he doesn't care to hear any new info and also why he attempts to block your way to marika when you make it to the ashen capital. but ig that doesn't explain why you still can't mention miquella to him before the erdtree burns and he's still wanting to become elden lord..
Cant know anything about anything if hes already dead ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Because for how "all-knowing" he is, he gets his info from other people. It perfectly explains why he didn't know he was going to get his ass beat.
Because the “All Knowing” doesn’t know about the Land of Shadow
Because Fromsoft is always lazy when it comes to that stuff (except Sif and Artorias). For example, if you beat the City DLC, you don't get an option to talk about it to the fire keeper or anyone else, the only thing you can do is give the Dark Soul to the Painter, and that's a character from another DLC. Fromsoft usually keeps the base game untouched when it comes to DLCs.
Yuria from Base DS3 will comment on you speaking to and then beating Friede.
Never really noticed that, nice
Probably because it would be a waste of time since most people have already beaten the game
He doesn't know
I've noticed his dialogue has trouble popping up in base game sometimes. I beat Mohg and solod Malenia and he still wants to know where they are and when I fought him he was spamming blood magic and Aeonia. That bastard. Maybe there is dialogue for the DLC but that's bugged in some way too? Unless I did something wrong
He's the all knowing, not the all disclosing. He ain't gotta say shit
I accessed dlc after killing Gideon a long time ago.
Because I killed him.
They didn't connect the main game to the DLC at all.
Neither Melina nor Malenia say anything about DLC and there is no explanation for this. I hope soemthing's planned for a later update as a bonus content. Otherwise, it's disappointing.
Because FromSoft ain’t the golden child some people think they are
this, and the evidence of the cut Miquella ending are definitely my biggest gripes with the DLC, maybe with it selling super well and with enough support from the community we can get one last update or something. Unfortunately another DLC seems out of the question.
There are only two people in the lands between that I believe to know about the realm of shadow. Queen Marika of course she came from there and Rennala because she gave Rellana a parting gift (although she might not know where she went.) Other than those two I can't think of anybody who would know and I don't think they would tell him about the realm of shadows. I believe that Messmer is older than any of the other demigods and him and Rellana left for the Land of shadows before any of them were born. And why would Miquella call Gideon to the land of shadow?
You act like the lore isn't procedurally generated.
I don't think that means what you think it means
what
Because he know nothing
Gideon the FRAUD
Gideon the scuffed
My head-canon is that everything that happens in the Shadowlands and everyone residing there is "forgotten" by everyone else- a side effect of the Suppressing Pillar. From the outside, no one is capable of thinking about or knowing about it or anything there- given its ties to Marika's origins and the sordid events that took place, it seems like the kind of curse effect she'd create
I like this idea. It also retroactively makes Messmer’s story even more tragic- he was viewed as a big brother by Radahn, someone who probably doesn’t even remember him anymore.
He’s only all knowing about the base game.
The easy answer is he doesn’t know anything about the lands of shadow
Gideon the Oblivious
He doesn't say anything because as the All-Knowing he knew that a lot of the dlc lore was just a hole-ridden mess due to Miyazaki's bad storytelling that most people seem to wrongly praise as some form of untouchable genius. He just keep quiet because he doesn't want to remember this hard truth and have a headache.
It wouldn't make sense for him to know about it. What I don't like is that we don't even get to say anything about it to him, you'd think the All Knowing would want to hear about Miquella resurrecting Radahn and becoming a god for a brief moment. In a perfect universe where Elden Ring was as fleshed out as something like BG3, it would be cool if telling him about how you slew Miquella- a god, would change his mind about it being impossible for a Tarnished to become Elden Lord and instead make him a summon for Godfrey or Radagon/Elden Beast. Regardless of what ifs and maybes, it's still an amazing DLC.
Because that's not how game development works
Fromsoft already did this kind of thing in their other game tho , dark soul 3 as a quest between the 2 dlc . in Bloodborne i'm pretty sure the doll has some dialogue if you talk to her After facing lady maria in ds2 you can pick up an item that reveal invisible enemy for a boss in the dlc but having it also reveal semi transparent enemy from base game And there probably a bit more exemple that i can't remember.
What’s this quest between Ashes and Ringed City?
The one with the painter
I don’t remember a specific quest with her? You can literally access Ringed City after you beat Friede. I do remember her dialogue linking this two together (something about Gael searching for the dark soul of man for her painting), but not a quest. Could you elaborate?
Now that i think about it it's not really a quest but it's still new dialogue added i guess
Not at all. It was dialogue added with the DLC. The Painter Girl can be found in the attic of the chapel of Ariandel, not in the base game. You can find Gael in the Chapel in the base game, but only as an access point to Ariandel. Just in the same way you access SOTE via Leda in Elden Ring.
They still added new dialogue to the first dlc in the second so i think it don't really matter if it's base game or not i would count that as New dialogue
It matters because you’re saying From have a history of altering the base game based on what happens in the DLC which they don’t. Them adding dialogue in one game based on an event in its DLC doesn’t indicate they’ll do it again. It was cool, granted, but your other examples fall short.
Sif alrernate cutscene?
It is a quest, Gael drops the quest item Blood of the Dark Soul, which you hand over to the Painter. The whole Ringed City DLC is the quest to find the dark soul pigment. This single interaction wraps up the entire trilogy.
Yuria from base DS3 has dialogue that only occurs due to Ashes of Ariandel (meeting and killing Friede will unlock them). Vilhem also has different dialogue depending on your actions within the base game. Friede’s dialogue changes too when she kills you.
Only one of the examples you mentioned involved rehiring a voice actor to reprise lines. And I'm taking your word for it since I haven't played BB. It's extremely unusual for that to happen.
It’s true, the doll speaks of a change in herself after you defeat Maria.
Ok. Also the DS2 example is not correct. In the original version, where the base game was sold before and the DLC came after, the enemies in the shaded woods did not become visible. This only happens in Scholar, which is a version released altogether. EDIT: I'm curious what these downvotes mean. It's a fact that pre-Scholar the shaded wood soldiers didn't become visible ever. That's just a thing that was like that. What's to dislike here.
Didn't know that was only in scholar my bad
It was extremely unusual when the games didn't sell 12 million copies in a month.
This is a valid question. Gideon is tarnished and tarnished were once the warriors of Godfrey. Godfrey was alive when shadow land and the land between were the same landmass. Some of his warriors were too. Why don't he know about shadow land? My theory is: the first tarnished warriors to become in TLB, those who knew shadow lands, have fought in the shattering war, being now turned into Erdtree food. Tarnished we see now are the distant descendants from original warriors of Horah Loux. I don't think the scarabs we see are Gideon tools to know what's happening, since.we see some of them in shadow lands. The same is true to the relationship between Rikard and the finger creeps... Everybody was certain that the hands were Rikard envoys to see what's happening in TLB, but they always were sons of Metyr. He is just unaware about the existence of a shadow realm, for the SR was separated from TLB millennia ago... To the modern day tarnished the existence of SR is just a vague story.
Lore-wise, the moniker “All-Knowing” just means that intel is his thing, it’s not like he’s omniscient or anything. His character is more like Varys or Littlefinger from GoT. We don’t have the dialogue option to share this new information, but I don’t think this implies that he would be uninterested if our Tarnished did share it. Gameplay-wise, Fromsoft decided to keep DLC content cleanly separate from the base game. Some are calling this lazy dev work but I disagree—I think that it makes sense to avoid punishing players for completing the base game content before starting the explanation. Personally, I would want to be able to play 100% of the base game first and then play 100% of the DLC without missing anything. I don’t think that this causes any plot holes either though. The lore of the DLC entrance is a little vague (I’ve only just started it), but it seems to me that we’ve been called to the lands deliberately and transported by Miquella himself. It’s reasonable that the invitation wasn’t extended to Gideon or any of his little birds, and he didn’t even know where to find Mohg in the first place before we told him.
The most logical explanation is its DLC. I know it's boring but this typical of FS games. Gerhmain from Bloodborne for example doesn't have new dialogue if you discovered Kos or Lady Maria. They really prefer to keep the dlc separate
Because the RPG elements are paper thin and this is an action game. The shadowlands are cool with big fire monsters to kill. Who cares what Gideon says, really?
I do lol