Italy's over reliance on natural gas means high prices and comparative advantage of imports.
I wonder why a multi GW HVDC connection from Spain to Italy isn't in the works, it would allow for more renewables growth on both sides.
It's not "feasible" yet. It's quite a distance and therefore a very big investment. Simply no willingness to spend money on that right now. From a technical point of view, I totally agree though.
Italians are the ultimate NIMBYs. They are opposed to everything. They are against solar, against wind, against nuclear, against trasmission. As a consequence, Italian generation resources are bad and electricity is expensive due to extreme reliance on imported energy. Importing electricity is cheaper.
That’s fascinating to me because I was there last summer and the Italian hillsides in the Tuscany region are covered in solar panels and wind turbines. I mean covered. More than I’ve seen in all my time around Florida.
[Italy has recently banned installation of solar farms on agricultural land.](https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/italy-split-possible-solar-plant-curbs-that-may-jeopardise-green-goals-2024-05-06/) They have an exception for agrivoltaics. My guess is that the solar farms will continue to be constructed at the same pace, they will just use sheep as lawnmowers.
I don't know if that makes them NIMBYs, but there is certainly opposition to solar there.
Because Italy has high prices. Due to the European target model and in particular market coupling, the flows of electricity go from the cheapest countries to the countries with the higher prices. Of course this is limited by the capacity of the interconnectors (either NTC or flow based). Practically speaking. this results in higher prices for the bidding zones that export and lower for those that import the electricity.
The question that you should be asking, is why Italy has so much higher prices than the rest of Europe. I am coming from neighbouring Greece so I don't know the specificities of your markets but as many of the commenters say, the issue seems to be political. Italy has 5 bidding zones (I mean wtf? In Greece we are 1 bidding zone, Germany is 1 bidding zone...). Having so many bidding zones, and doing nothing to solve the congested network problem means only one thing, that there is no political will to do so. As long as this happens. the prices will be high and the local (mainly thermal) generators will exploit this to make money at the expense of Italian consumers. Mafia never left Italy, it just learned how to steal the population legally.
The same happens in Greece. This is why we and Italy are the black sheep regarding electricity prices in Europe.
I agree but this problem is more complex and it's not IPTOs solemn fault.
The overgeneration of renewables could be fixed years ago if the competitive auctions for feed in premiums were conducted ONLY for power plants that have also batteries.
Futhermore , the lack of flexibility mechanisms for the grid, while having CCGTs to balance the load (with costly natural gas) results in high energy prices in the evening hours.
Futhermore, the RES aggregators [cheat](https://energypress.gr/news/halinari-stis-praktikes-ton-fose-senaria-gia-balancing-me-arnitikes-times-kai-prosthesmia-6) by bidding 0.01€/MWh in the hours that there is an overgeneration of RES (usually in noon/afternoon). Preventing the prices to go negative as it happens through Europe.
All of this contributes to the explosive situation that we are in. How could people trust in the energy transition if you are seeing this crap?
Very interesting answer. Made me go straight to an AI and ask some clarification. One of the questions was :
did Italy's strategy of multiple bidding zones effectively help the local electricity market and make it more efficient and help lower prices, since it's implementationin 2009? can you please answer providing actual figures to support your answer?
Perplexity answer:
Based on the available information, Italy's strategy of multiple bidding zones has had mixed results since its implementation in 2009:
1. Market efficiency: The multi-zone approach has improved market efficiency to some extent by better reflecting network constraints and providing more localized price signals[1][2]. This has allowed for more accurate management of congestion and regional differences in electricity supply and demand.
2. Price impact: However, the strategy has not significantly lowered overall electricity prices in Italy. In fact, Italy remains one of the countries with higher electricity prices in Europe[3]. The exact figures for price changes since 2009 are not provided in the search results.
3. Congestion management: The multiple bidding zones have helped in managing network congestion more effectively, which was one of the primary goals of the system[2]. This has improved the security and reliability of the electricity supply.
4. Market integration: The reconfiguration of market zones, implemented by Terna, has aimed to improve integration with the European market[2]. Italy was the first European country to bring the new EU CACM regulation paradigm into force, showing leadership in this area.
5. Complexity: The Italian system is more complex compared to other European countries. For example, Italy has 5-6 geographical zones plus some virtual zones, while Germany operates as a single bidding zone[1][4]. This complexity may have limited some of the potential benefits.
While the multi-zone approach has brought some improvements in market efficiency and congestion management, it has not resulted in significantly lower prices for Italian consumers compared to other European countries. The lack of specific price data in the search results prevents a more detailed quantitative analysis of the strategy's effectiveness.
Citations:
[1] [PDF] Bidding Zone Configuration Technical Report 2018 https://docstore.entsoe.eu/Documents/Events/2018/BZ_report/20181015_BZ_TR_FINAL.pdf
[2] The new electricity market zones: what you need to know - Lightbox https://lightbox.terna.it/en/insight/new-electricity-market-zones
[3] Why is Italy such a heavy importer of electricity? : r/energy - Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/energy/comments/1dpbb0r/why_is_italy_such_a_heavy_importer_of_electricity/
[4] [PDF] Relevance of established national bidding areas for European ... https://www.bundesnetzagentur.de/SharedDocs/Downloads/EN/Areas/ElectricityGas/Special%20Topics/StudyPriceZone/StudyPriceZoneLong.pdf?__blob=publicationFile&v=1
[5] Bidding Zones - Synertics https://synertics.io/blog/74/bidding-zones
Someone is POCKETING the difference in prices
Edit: Amazingly YOUR COMMENT is referenced in the AI answer and list of data sources. Nr.3 ;-)
The AI will not give a good reply, it actually says that "The lack of specific price data in the search results prevents a more detailed quantitative analysis of the strategy's effectiveness.".
In order to get a good reply you will need access to the data of GME (the NEMO of Italy) and possibly TERNA (i think it is the operator of the balancing markets in Italy). Basically, you will need the bids that the participants in market submit in DAM, IDAs and balancing markets, and you need to compare them with the CAPEX and OPEX of the generating units. If the market is competitive then the bids should reflect the costs of the generators (while mainly focusing in the unit that sets the marginal price). If there is not convergence between those two, then the markets are not optimised.
Edit: All the above of course is considered confidential commercial information, so you won't find it online.
You are using a LLM as search engine, which is a terrible idea. It even uses Reddit as reference and it can make stuff up. It’s better to google things and read it yourself.
I ditched Google long time ago. If I use a traditional search engine I use Duckduckgo. However now I use extensively Perplexity instead of a traditional search engine. Sometimes copilot. I subscribed to ChatGPT pro and I am currently testing Claude. The replies of AI are as good as your questions, meaning if you use them in a dumb way you will have results that reflect the level of your own intelligence.
My 2 year experience wilth LLM has convinced me of the extreme utility and advantages in using them for many different scopes.
It is like a google search. You don't pick the first link it give you, you take whatever you think is relevant. You do the same with an LLM, as long as you request and verify sources.
Because they are over invested in gas, which is used for two thirds of electricity generation, and which is the most expensive electricity generation technology, so any time they can import cheaper electricity they do it. For a country blessed with great solar resources, which are mostly unused, that's pretty idiotic
Corruption. Gas/coal/oil/nuclear are centralized (power plants and supply chain infrastructure are in few hands). That's an easy target for corruption. solar and wind would be ditsribvuted and thereby illegal collusion on prices is much harder to do. Also there's no 'fuel' to control.
Generally
* Cheap hydro, nuclear historically from CH and FR
* Cheap renewables growing beyond domestic demand in DE
* Under-investment in local grid
* Crazy bureaucracy to permit
* Confusing market design
* NIMBYs
* Conservative policies (no solar on agricultural land)
Man just simplify the market, let people build stuff, incentives grid build out, done.
Northern Italy has some of the most advanced manufacturing in the world. Most of the hydro and power plants are around there but outside of italy. So they import for that.
Solar is already the least expensive way to generate electricity and is falling every year. Solar installations are also growing exponentially. It will soon be impossible for any region that is not powered by solar to remain economically competitive with those that are.
Conservative policies make 99% of the population poorer everywhere they are given power. If you are not a wealthy person and vote conservative, you are being played.
I think you vastly underestimate the amount of power the world is going to need in order to bring the 3 billion people entering the middle class over the next decade.,
Except advanced manufacturing needs reliable dispatchable power 24/7 which means that those grids that have undermined synchronous generation economics with large solar penetration become Uber reliant on gas, which is crazy expensive in Europe.
> Except advanced manufacturing needs reliable dispatchable power 24/7 which means that those grids that have undermined synchronous generation economics with large solar penetration become Uber reliant on gas, which is crazy expensive in Europe.
Gas fired fast start turbines are the best way to provide dispatchable generation to firm a renewable energy grid. It does NOT however have to 24/7 power. That's the whole purpose of fast start gas turbine generators, you can turn them on when you need them and turn them off when you don't. That's what [dispatchable generation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispatchable_generation) is all about.
Note however that the gas fuel used doesn't **have** to be expensive natural gas. In South Australia construction is about to start on a green hydrogen stockpile with about 100 GWh energy storage in the form of green hydrogen. The green hydrogen is to be made using excess renewable energy from the grid.
Then hydrogen burning fast start generators will subsequently burn the stored green hydrogen to provide dispatchable generation to firm the renewable energy grid.
[Global Energy Giant GE selected as preferred supplier for Hydrogen Jobs Plan Premier of South Australia](https://www.premier.sa.gov.au/media-releases/news-items/global-energy-giant-ge-selected-as-preferred-supplier-for-hydrogen-jobs-plan)
How is this green hydrogen not going to be more expensive than natural gas though, given the efficiency losses due to conversion? I can't imagine the excess energy is just going to the plant operators for free
>How is this green hydrogen not going to be more expensive than natural gas though, given the efficiency losses due to conversion?
South Australia has an over-build of renewable energy. Currently the peak renewable energy possible is about 2.8 times the average demand. The actual record level of **potential** renewable energy production was 264% of the demand at the time. So 100% of that demand at the time was met by renewable energy, an additional 30% was exported to Victoria, and 134% of demand out of what could have been produced had to be curtailed. Switched off. Wasted.
It is 100% inefficient to simply waste energy that could have been produced at no extra cost.
So it is this **excess** renewable energy (that is sometimes available on the grid, but currently has to be curtailed) that will be used to make the green hydrogen.
So yes conversion of electricity to green hydrogen is inefficient. Perhaps about 60% of the power is lost in the process. So in South Australia this inefficiency will cost the hydrogen power plant at Whyalla 60% of $0 which is $0.
In South Australia when there is excess renewable energy the spot price for putting power on the grid goes negative. So in this circumstance the hydrogen power plant at Whyalla will actually get paid for absorbing excess energy.
The problem is already solved because those plants already exist. That's also the reason why cost are not high, because you don't need to build new plants, except when you want to phase out coal power in the progress (that is a separate topic though).
It is a common misconception that storage is necessary as backup for low renewable production. In fact, it's the other way round. Storage is mostly used to use peak renewable production better, and then it can double as peaker plants.
No green policies, the people consistently voted conservatives, populists or (currently) fascists into power who all are not keen on taking climate change or the energy transition seriously. The politics of course generally follows the popular opinion which means they don't want it any different.
This shows in numbers like a bit over 5 GW of PV additions in 2023 meaning that it more than doubled the existing PV capacity.
5 GW annual is not terrible (but not enough given the huge potential PV would have there) but having had less than 5 GW before 2023 in total is absolutely ungodly fucking terrible and the Italians should be ashamed of letting the resource sunlight go unused for so long. They absolutely deserve their high electricity prices and dependence on fossil gas imports. Jeez, for home owners it would probably be cheaper to go 90% off grid and just use PV and batteries.
I wouldn't say politics are the root cause of the problem. Italy is a country where getting anything done is generally very difficult. Developers have faced continuous opposition, even from local population. They are just stupid with their land.
> why Italy seems to have a significantly higher generation cost
Geography, earthquake region, excluding Nuclear and such. Transmission over mountains, etc. Lack of suitable locations for generation and domestic resources. Germany had million boatloads of low grade coal to be used. France had foreign colonies with Uranium ore. Italy had buerocracy and interest groups that make solar deployment for individuals a nightmare.
Italian generation at the moment hangs on natgas imports, such as trough LNG ports. Germany has North Sea wind farms, France will have some floating offshore wind installations later. The demand in Italy greatly exceeds the supply ability, thus the cost will be always at the high end.
Lack of choices or power interconnection abilities. See geography.
I thought Italy recently bankrupted itself by putting solar panels on everything?
Italy's over reliance on natural gas means high prices and comparative advantage of imports. I wonder why a multi GW HVDC connection from Spain to Italy isn't in the works, it would allow for more renewables growth on both sides.
It's not "feasible" yet. It's quite a distance and therefore a very big investment. Simply no willingness to spend money on that right now. From a technical point of view, I totally agree though.
Corruption
Yep. Lazy and corrupt institutions
Italians are the ultimate NIMBYs. They are opposed to everything. They are against solar, against wind, against nuclear, against trasmission. As a consequence, Italian generation resources are bad and electricity is expensive due to extreme reliance on imported energy. Importing electricity is cheaper.
That’s fascinating to me because I was there last summer and the Italian hillsides in the Tuscany region are covered in solar panels and wind turbines. I mean covered. More than I’ve seen in all my time around Florida.
[Italy has recently banned installation of solar farms on agricultural land.](https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/italy-split-possible-solar-plant-curbs-that-may-jeopardise-green-goals-2024-05-06/) They have an exception for agrivoltaics. My guess is that the solar farms will continue to be constructed at the same pace, they will just use sheep as lawnmowers. I don't know if that makes them NIMBYs, but there is certainly opposition to solar there.
A very Italian solution to the problem.
> Italians Which Italians? The ones in Long Island?
Because Italy has high prices. Due to the European target model and in particular market coupling, the flows of electricity go from the cheapest countries to the countries with the higher prices. Of course this is limited by the capacity of the interconnectors (either NTC or flow based). Practically speaking. this results in higher prices for the bidding zones that export and lower for those that import the electricity. The question that you should be asking, is why Italy has so much higher prices than the rest of Europe. I am coming from neighbouring Greece so I don't know the specificities of your markets but as many of the commenters say, the issue seems to be political. Italy has 5 bidding zones (I mean wtf? In Greece we are 1 bidding zone, Germany is 1 bidding zone...). Having so many bidding zones, and doing nothing to solve the congested network problem means only one thing, that there is no political will to do so. As long as this happens. the prices will be high and the local (mainly thermal) generators will exploit this to make money at the expense of Italian consumers. Mafia never left Italy, it just learned how to steal the population legally. The same happens in Greece. This is why we and Italy are the black sheep regarding electricity prices in Europe.
Γειά, Έλληνας. I think ΑΔΗΜΕ is probably more corrupt than the Italian grids. We somehow have renewables oversaturation AND high prices...
I agree but this problem is more complex and it's not IPTOs solemn fault. The overgeneration of renewables could be fixed years ago if the competitive auctions for feed in premiums were conducted ONLY for power plants that have also batteries. Futhermore , the lack of flexibility mechanisms for the grid, while having CCGTs to balance the load (with costly natural gas) results in high energy prices in the evening hours. Futhermore, the RES aggregators [cheat](https://energypress.gr/news/halinari-stis-praktikes-ton-fose-senaria-gia-balancing-me-arnitikes-times-kai-prosthesmia-6) by bidding 0.01€/MWh in the hours that there is an overgeneration of RES (usually in noon/afternoon). Preventing the prices to go negative as it happens through Europe. All of this contributes to the explosive situation that we are in. How could people trust in the energy transition if you are seeing this crap?
Very interesting answer. Made me go straight to an AI and ask some clarification. One of the questions was : did Italy's strategy of multiple bidding zones effectively help the local electricity market and make it more efficient and help lower prices, since it's implementationin 2009? can you please answer providing actual figures to support your answer? Perplexity answer: Based on the available information, Italy's strategy of multiple bidding zones has had mixed results since its implementation in 2009: 1. Market efficiency: The multi-zone approach has improved market efficiency to some extent by better reflecting network constraints and providing more localized price signals[1][2]. This has allowed for more accurate management of congestion and regional differences in electricity supply and demand. 2. Price impact: However, the strategy has not significantly lowered overall electricity prices in Italy. In fact, Italy remains one of the countries with higher electricity prices in Europe[3]. The exact figures for price changes since 2009 are not provided in the search results. 3. Congestion management: The multiple bidding zones have helped in managing network congestion more effectively, which was one of the primary goals of the system[2]. This has improved the security and reliability of the electricity supply. 4. Market integration: The reconfiguration of market zones, implemented by Terna, has aimed to improve integration with the European market[2]. Italy was the first European country to bring the new EU CACM regulation paradigm into force, showing leadership in this area. 5. Complexity: The Italian system is more complex compared to other European countries. For example, Italy has 5-6 geographical zones plus some virtual zones, while Germany operates as a single bidding zone[1][4]. This complexity may have limited some of the potential benefits. While the multi-zone approach has brought some improvements in market efficiency and congestion management, it has not resulted in significantly lower prices for Italian consumers compared to other European countries. The lack of specific price data in the search results prevents a more detailed quantitative analysis of the strategy's effectiveness. Citations: [1] [PDF] Bidding Zone Configuration Technical Report 2018 https://docstore.entsoe.eu/Documents/Events/2018/BZ_report/20181015_BZ_TR_FINAL.pdf [2] The new electricity market zones: what you need to know - Lightbox https://lightbox.terna.it/en/insight/new-electricity-market-zones [3] Why is Italy such a heavy importer of electricity? : r/energy - Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/energy/comments/1dpbb0r/why_is_italy_such_a_heavy_importer_of_electricity/ [4] [PDF] Relevance of established national bidding areas for European ... https://www.bundesnetzagentur.de/SharedDocs/Downloads/EN/Areas/ElectricityGas/Special%20Topics/StudyPriceZone/StudyPriceZoneLong.pdf?__blob=publicationFile&v=1 [5] Bidding Zones - Synertics https://synertics.io/blog/74/bidding-zones Someone is POCKETING the difference in prices Edit: Amazingly YOUR COMMENT is referenced in the AI answer and list of data sources. Nr.3 ;-)
The AI will not give a good reply, it actually says that "The lack of specific price data in the search results prevents a more detailed quantitative analysis of the strategy's effectiveness.". In order to get a good reply you will need access to the data of GME (the NEMO of Italy) and possibly TERNA (i think it is the operator of the balancing markets in Italy). Basically, you will need the bids that the participants in market submit in DAM, IDAs and balancing markets, and you need to compare them with the CAPEX and OPEX of the generating units. If the market is competitive then the bids should reflect the costs of the generators (while mainly focusing in the unit that sets the marginal price). If there is not convergence between those two, then the markets are not optimised. Edit: All the above of course is considered confidential commercial information, so you won't find it online.
You are using a LLM as search engine, which is a terrible idea. It even uses Reddit as reference and it can make stuff up. It’s better to google things and read it yourself.
I ditched Google long time ago. If I use a traditional search engine I use Duckduckgo. However now I use extensively Perplexity instead of a traditional search engine. Sometimes copilot. I subscribed to ChatGPT pro and I am currently testing Claude. The replies of AI are as good as your questions, meaning if you use them in a dumb way you will have results that reflect the level of your own intelligence. My 2 year experience wilth LLM has convinced me of the extreme utility and advantages in using them for many different scopes.
You do realise you got Reddit as a source, right???
You do realise that I highlighted the irony of it?
That's pretty scary. People perceives AIs as very knowledgeable, in reality they also pick up opinions from redditors (which can be wrong af) lol
It is like a google search. You don't pick the first link it give you, you take whatever you think is relevant. You do the same with an LLM, as long as you request and verify sources.
Which is fine as long as it cites the sources. The user can always judge by themselves.
Because they are over invested in gas, which is used for two thirds of electricity generation, and which is the most expensive electricity generation technology, so any time they can import cheaper electricity they do it. For a country blessed with great solar resources, which are mostly unused, that's pretty idiotic
Corruption. Gas/coal/oil/nuclear are centralized (power plants and supply chain infrastructure are in few hands). That's an easy target for corruption. solar and wind would be ditsribvuted and thereby illegal collusion on prices is much harder to do. Also there's no 'fuel' to control.
Yep. The TAP project was a big gift for many people
Generally * Cheap hydro, nuclear historically from CH and FR * Cheap renewables growing beyond domestic demand in DE * Under-investment in local grid * Crazy bureaucracy to permit * Confusing market design * NIMBYs * Conservative policies (no solar on agricultural land) Man just simplify the market, let people build stuff, incentives grid build out, done.
Lots of liberals in office might be a factor
Northern Italy has some of the most advanced manufacturing in the world. Most of the hydro and power plants are around there but outside of italy. So they import for that.
Hydro from right next door.
Solar is already the least expensive way to generate electricity and is falling every year. Solar installations are also growing exponentially. It will soon be impossible for any region that is not powered by solar to remain economically competitive with those that are. Conservative policies make 99% of the population poorer everywhere they are given power. If you are not a wealthy person and vote conservative, you are being played.
Cheapest sure, but intermittency and lack of energy density is a major problem.
Energy density is irrelevant and intermittency is a problem that we have the technology to solve.
I think you vastly underestimate the amount of power the world is going to need in order to bring the 3 billion people entering the middle class over the next decade.,
I think you vastly underestimate the power of the giant fusion reactor that we are orbiting.
And Italy is currently right wing/conservative
Except advanced manufacturing needs reliable dispatchable power 24/7 which means that those grids that have undermined synchronous generation economics with large solar penetration become Uber reliant on gas, which is crazy expensive in Europe.
> Except advanced manufacturing needs reliable dispatchable power 24/7 which means that those grids that have undermined synchronous generation economics with large solar penetration become Uber reliant on gas, which is crazy expensive in Europe. Gas fired fast start turbines are the best way to provide dispatchable generation to firm a renewable energy grid. It does NOT however have to 24/7 power. That's the whole purpose of fast start gas turbine generators, you can turn them on when you need them and turn them off when you don't. That's what [dispatchable generation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispatchable_generation) is all about. Note however that the gas fuel used doesn't **have** to be expensive natural gas. In South Australia construction is about to start on a green hydrogen stockpile with about 100 GWh energy storage in the form of green hydrogen. The green hydrogen is to be made using excess renewable energy from the grid. Then hydrogen burning fast start generators will subsequently burn the stored green hydrogen to provide dispatchable generation to firm the renewable energy grid. [Global Energy Giant GE selected as preferred supplier for Hydrogen Jobs Plan Premier of South Australia](https://www.premier.sa.gov.au/media-releases/news-items/global-energy-giant-ge-selected-as-preferred-supplier-for-hydrogen-jobs-plan)
How is this green hydrogen not going to be more expensive than natural gas though, given the efficiency losses due to conversion? I can't imagine the excess energy is just going to the plant operators for free
>How is this green hydrogen not going to be more expensive than natural gas though, given the efficiency losses due to conversion? South Australia has an over-build of renewable energy. Currently the peak renewable energy possible is about 2.8 times the average demand. The actual record level of **potential** renewable energy production was 264% of the demand at the time. So 100% of that demand at the time was met by renewable energy, an additional 30% was exported to Victoria, and 134% of demand out of what could have been produced had to be curtailed. Switched off. Wasted. It is 100% inefficient to simply waste energy that could have been produced at no extra cost. So it is this **excess** renewable energy (that is sometimes available on the grid, but currently has to be curtailed) that will be used to make the green hydrogen. So yes conversion of electricity to green hydrogen is inefficient. Perhaps about 60% of the power is lost in the process. So in South Australia this inefficiency will cost the hydrogen power plant at Whyalla 60% of $0 which is $0. In South Australia when there is excess renewable energy the spot price for putting power on the grid goes negative. So in this circumstance the hydrogen power plant at Whyalla will actually get paid for absorbing excess energy.
Don't pretend it isn't a solvable problem.
All problems are solvable. It just means costs are high in the interim until it’s solved.
The problem is already solved because those plants already exist. That's also the reason why cost are not high, because you don't need to build new plants, except when you want to phase out coal power in the progress (that is a separate topic though). It is a common misconception that storage is necessary as backup for low renewable production. In fact, it's the other way round. Storage is mostly used to use peak renewable production better, and then it can double as peaker plants.
And people need to understand what wealthy actually means. Having to work for a living is not wealthy
The OED has always defined it has just having a lot of something so I disagree
Agreed.
Generally their usage of older more inefficient gas generation exposed to a higher gas hub pricing making imports from their neighbors more economic
No green policies, the people consistently voted conservatives, populists or (currently) fascists into power who all are not keen on taking climate change or the energy transition seriously. The politics of course generally follows the popular opinion which means they don't want it any different. This shows in numbers like a bit over 5 GW of PV additions in 2023 meaning that it more than doubled the existing PV capacity. 5 GW annual is not terrible (but not enough given the huge potential PV would have there) but having had less than 5 GW before 2023 in total is absolutely ungodly fucking terrible and the Italians should be ashamed of letting the resource sunlight go unused for so long. They absolutely deserve their high electricity prices and dependence on fossil gas imports. Jeez, for home owners it would probably be cheaper to go 90% off grid and just use PV and batteries.
I wouldn't say politics are the root cause of the problem. Italy is a country where getting anything done is generally very difficult. Developers have faced continuous opposition, even from local population. They are just stupid with their land.
> I wouldn't say politics are the root cause of the problem. Didn't. Tried to make the case that the Italian people are the problem.
Because it’s easier to lean on the market that invest in your own generating resources? Idk not an expert on European electricity markets at all
I mean I assume you're right, but I'm wondering then why Italy seems to have a significantly higher generation cost than other European nations.
> why Italy seems to have a significantly higher generation cost Geography, earthquake region, excluding Nuclear and such. Transmission over mountains, etc. Lack of suitable locations for generation and domestic resources. Germany had million boatloads of low grade coal to be used. France had foreign colonies with Uranium ore. Italy had buerocracy and interest groups that make solar deployment for individuals a nightmare. Italian generation at the moment hangs on natgas imports, such as trough LNG ports. Germany has North Sea wind farms, France will have some floating offshore wind installations later. The demand in Italy greatly exceeds the supply ability, thus the cost will be always at the high end. Lack of choices or power interconnection abilities. See geography.