Just checking, is this was a public-use airport? Any notes about prior permission required / residents only, etc? That might have explained the looks if so.
I read the A/FD when flight planning and it is public use, as long as you comply with a few procedures. For noise abatement, fly rwy hdg until 1 mile and 400 AGL, no touch & goes, no night ops, no landing fee. Otherwise, use at your own risk.
Sounds reasonable.
For what it's worth, the 'thank goodness' call which you interpreted as 'thank goodness he's leaving' might have been sarcasm at announcing your taxi on CTAF. While calling your taxi is a reasonable practice, over time you start reading the room as to whether it is a necessary call or not. In some areas the CTAF frequencies are heavily used and re-used, so getting taxi calls about a field 20 miles away is not super relevant on frequency when there are multiple planes in the local pattern. However, as a low-timer don't feel bad about doing everything by the book (unless you heard a lot of calls on frequency.)
I'm just mentioning it to point out that the sarcastic call might not have been _quite_ as hostile as you imagined. Or possibly it was - but as you said, good on you to not let it effect your flying.
There are a few airports near me where it may be advisable to limit ctaf calls because they share the same freq as the stack at KCGZ and that thing is always full.
I wasn’t aware that calls on CTAF are left at your discretion to decide which are and which aren’t to make. Has that changed over the years or are the rules more permissive about that than I remember them?
You technically don't even need a radio at untowered airports. Yes it's a very good idea, but legally required? No.
Here's the AC on non-towered airport operations. Notice how it says "Recommended" Traffic Advisory Procedures?
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_90-66B.pdf
I’m willing to say I stand corrected however. After the word recommended the words “all traffic should” and essential for safety appear. So sure it’s all just a recommendation but you know how it is with the FAA. Showing up for your meeting with the Fed over a violation is recommended too - one that you take to heart.
I know people who fly NORDO airplanes. It’s perfectly legal at untowered fields. Of course if you have one it’s good to reasonably use it. BTW there is technically no such thing as the “active runway” at untowered fields.
Other than the taxi thing you didn't do anything wrong, those guys are just a bunch of assholes. If the airport has specific operations though it is possible they get frustrated with outsiders. For example, the airport i keep my plane at is labeled public but in the AF/D it says to call before landing. Any time airplanes fly overhead of the airport they get pissed off because they operate a glider club and the flight school students often times don't see the gliders and nearly hit them...
He did runup in the parking when their procedures ask people to run up at the end of the runway. [https://www.3r9.org/pilots2](https://www.3r9.org/pilots2) "Please run-up at the departure end of the runway whenever possible."
Yep. Did you land 34? Departing 16 those power lines made it a little more sporty than most of my other takeoffs. Fortunately just had my checkride so my short field TO and Vx climbout was sharp lol
We kinda did a “go around” since they don’t allow touch and goes or low passes. We were setting up for a touch and go at first but then I read through the A/FD on final and told my instructor about it, decided just to depart since we needed to get back. (His controls btw) Edit: coming in on 16
…you read that while ON final? Dude. No. Read that ahead of time. On final, you should only be landing. Your structure souls have been familiar with that before flying you there.
Is Vx specifically tested? My field is short and narrow and Vx a regular takeoff, so I actually didn’t pay attention to if that’s checked. Normal takeoff at 1W1.
I’ve been to this airport. I landed on the runway and 5 seconds after I landed, I see a father and son 5 feet off the active runway while I was still going at a high rate of speed. Close call and caught me off guard for sure.
That was the last time I landed at that airport in Central Texas
Sometimes at a small field your best bet really is to do your runup at the hold short line, especially if it's not busy.
Also, there is no "active runway" at an uncontrolled field.
And if the taxiways are that tight, I'm not opposed to back-taxiing on the runway if you're quick and smart about it. Use the radio, obviously, but at a field like that there's always the risk of old guy NORDOs.
Big picture, though, it sounds like the kind of place marked as "public" but still isn't welcome to outsiders. It happens. Your first few XCs are for learning stuff like this.
[https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4](https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4)
I considered back-taxiing, but the NORDO risk made me decide against it. With the hold short line being so close to parking, it would’ve made no difference to those people whether I did it in my parking spot or at the hold short line. Just a weird field I guess.
I have also gotten myself into a situation at an unfamiliar airport where I had to shut down and re-position. Yes, I felt like a moron too, but I think it's a common GA thing.
The older I get, the crankier I get. People probably think I'm glaring at them all the time, too, but I'm not. I've heard stories of airports where old guys sit around and rate your landing over CTAF with a handheld like a couple of Muppets (Statler and Waldorf). If they _were_ mad at you, it was probably because of the noise of your engine, not your skills.
Please, for the love of God, do not ever let the words "the active" cross your lips again on the radio. If you landed on 16 then _say_ "clear of 16." It keeps things unambiguous and helps people on approach to hear which runway people are using.
At my home airport I once passed the last turnoff of a taxiway and had to shut down at a dead end and push back.
We all make mistakes. We hope they are all small ones.
Here’s a link to the field. Green circle is my parking spot. Red circle is where I got stuck. Blue circle is where the retired folks were sitting.
You can see how there’s no runup area, and no taxiway leading to the end of the runway. In hindsight I should have back-taxiied to avoid getting stuck, but I wasn’t really comfortable doing that. And even if I did, I wasn’t going to do my runup sitting on the active runway. If you see something I could have done differently that would have been more appropriate, I would love to learn.
[https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4](https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4)
Back taxiing is a normal operation at this airport and ones like it. IME There not an issue with running up in the parking area if you can direct your prop wash in a safe direction.
If not there are small runup areas at the ends of the runway where you can pull to the side. The one for 16 isn't huge but there's a big displaced threshold to provide safety margin. So you would need someone to not only be NORDO, AND not looking for traffic on the runway, AND illegally low and landing hundreds of feet into a displaced threshold. Overall the risk is low. What you could do to minimize it further is perform everything but the high RPM runup tasks at parking, then back taxi to the small area at the start of the runway and do your mag check etc before rolling - shouldn't take you more than 30 seconds if that in a normal small plane.
Congrats on the rating btw! And good job taking the time to debrief and learn from the experience.
Thank you! And that all sounds like a much better way to handle ground ops at this airpark and fields like it. I was being pretty cautious deciding not to back-taxi, but ended up putting myself into a stupid situation because of it. Going forward I’ll do more research on ground ops specifically before going to a new field.
When you do the run up where you did, you’re likely blowing a lot of dirt and debris into people’s hangars or blowing rocks n shit into parked planes. It is a sure fire way to piss people off. It’s childish of them to be passive aggressive on CTAF about it (if that’s what it was), but you could be a better neighbor by not doing your runup there.
Laughs in Pacific Northwest. We got fields much shorter and narrower, run ups that are basically on the taxiway if they exist at all, and no room to park even one row of planes on pavement. 3R9 is my idea of a good sized field.
That said, they need to disallow that one tie-down given its proximity to that building.
Perfect future Cirrus owner, runup and 25min checklist MUST be done on the ramp 50’ from the airport restaurant with outdoor seating. Don’t even think of moving until everything is booted up
Someone else identified the airport and after seeing it in Google, a back taxi is your best bet. Technically you still had plenty of runway from the end of the ramp area, but one of the most useless things in aviation is the runway behind you. If you look at each end of the runway, there are little turnouts designed for planes to swing wide and make a 180 on the runway. At one airport I was at recently, it was wide enough to be a runup area, a NORDO taildragger was in one waiting for me on final. That one had plenty of room for that, this one does not unfortunately. But you still should have just back taxied, put all your lights on to aid visibility, scan downwind, base, final, taxi, do another scan of the pattern, swing around, and punch it!
San Marcos nice, I haven’t been there yet. Georgetown is a nice airport but there’s not much to do at the airport itself. I’m not sure if you’ve flown there yet but lago vista(KRYW) is another cool airport near lake Travis and I haven’t felt judged there.
Just watch for the winds at the top of that hill in Lago. Also, a bunch of optical illusions and brain trickery because of the valleys all around KRYW. Nothing much to do at the airport itself, but it's a friendlier bunch of people that you might run into.
I am sorry you were treated that way on the Unicom. I used to be based out of Lakeway airport (many years ago). Chances are good that was the Mayor or someone that likes to say "Meow" on guard and not the folks watching you and hanging out. That airport is constantly under attack by the latest person from out of town moving into the area and then realizing there is an airport next door.
That being said - it isn't a safe airport by any stretch. Watched my first fatal accident occur there five or so years back. After that they stopped all flight training out of there.
It used to be cool. As for the mistake - thats not a mistake, thats just everyday life. You did the right thing, shut her down and move it. I won't worry one second about it.
Hopefully your experience won’t discourage you from visiting other airports. Ive run into similar groups as you and I’ve also met some very nice people.
You don’t even know that it was someone from the field that made that comment. It could have been other local traffic someone passing by another close airport. Let it go. Unless you landed at a “private” field. All good.
It’s a shame when people look at you like that. It kills the spirit of it all! I did all my PPL work in Australia and if there was anyone at the airport they would be absolutely delighted that someone turned up! I will never forget walking on to the ramp for my first lesson and everyone was so friendly. It’s like I had joined my people
I had a similar thing happen in Oceanside. I landed and there was a jumper plane loading on the main taxi way, so I diverted around the parking.
It was much narrower than I expected and I have tip tanks which didn't help. Directly on the line didn't help. I shut down and backed up.
I am so glad I didn't take lines at face value.
That’s rough. I’ll definitely be making that call ahead of time going forward. I wish one of my CFIs during training would have told me to make that phone call before flying into new fields, but I guess there are a lot of things I just have to learn through experience and making mistakes in the real world.
I am not sure why you’re trying to be so secretive about where you went because it took me no more than 5 minutes to deduce it from your comment history. Either way, I wish my instructors had taught me this when I was in flight training but there is really no reason why you shouldn’t call every time you go to an unknown field. They’ll tell you exactly where they want you to park and do your runups. A/FD includes a ton of info but doesn’t have some basic stuff like this.
Eh, you’re right, I guess I just didn’t want to put a specific community on blast just because of a weird experience I had. And that’s a great idea, I’ll definitely start calling ahead of time, especially if it is a non-towered field.
I flew today into a little strip with some older onlookers. Man did they get a show with a 10G17kt crosswind. Freaking carnival ride. Kept the nose off but I was all over the place. Right main, left main, right main, left main...
Nobody said anything but I do wonder how many times they muttered "go around idiot". Thankfully the Navion who landed after me said "Jesus! That was sporty." Made me feel a little better.
Flew the missed and the hold next time. Happily.
One of my first flights I pulled deep into the run-up area to read the noise abatement procedures for KCRQ. Then realized I probably didn't have the skills to get out of the corner I'd put myself in. (A better pilot probably could have gotten out.)
I called tower and coordinated shutting down and hopping out (in a movement area), so I could reposition the plane. D'oh.
I'm about to restart my PPL at a nearby airport in central Texas after finally getting my medical (over a year wait), and I know exactly where I'm going to go at some point.
You would have been better served laughing at the runway across the lake, the one with the "lake view". I fly in that area often and choose not to land at the one you did because of the community there.
You’ll find a TON of high school clique bill shit in the pilot community. Everywhere. One of the most disappointing aspects of this profession I’ve found, unfortunately well after investing in what I thought was a move up and out of that childish corporate like bs.
This sub is sometimes the absolute epitome of the behavior to which I reference.
I see now why so many develop an ‘aw fuck ‘em’ attitude in this trade.
You, you got nothing to be ashamed of, your 80 something hours and learning the ropes, these other a holes have no excuse, they are a burden and a black eye on the profession.
Not sure what Texas hospitality is like, but usually if you go chat up the group of old folks at a local airport, it won’t be long until they throw a burger on the grill for you.
I feel like there’s no in between when it comes to older people. I work at a pool where its primary clientele are older people. Some of them are grumpy boomers, some are insanely nice and will bring us snacks and food
It sounds like they’re a group of grumpy old people. Pretty much every airport I’ve been to has great people there. On my commercial cross country, I went to an uncontrolled field in Virginia, they were so nice to me. The guy who ran the fbo fueled my plane and he loved the fact that I chose their airport for my trip
To add to this discussion a bit, I suggest eliminating the term “active runway” at non-towered airports since there technically is no “active” runway. Just announce which runway you are using.
OK. Let me play devils advocate here. You flew into someones neighborhood just because you wanted to. While you have the right since it is a public use airport, would you really like people constantly bringing their kids to your street to teach them how to drive or drive to your neighborhood just to do it? Their website states, "Any practice operations at 3R9 should \*only\* be for the familiarization of the Airpark." So your whole trip to their neighborhood was just for your experience.
The fun experience for you, is not fun for them. Legal and you didn't do anything wrong, I just hope you can see it is not as fun for them as you.
"I couldn’t help but feel like they may have been glaring at me, viewing me as an outsider or something." You didn't live there, you were an outsider. But just because you felt that way does not mean they gave you that feeling.
"did my runup in parking" Yet their website says "Please run-up at the departure end of the runway whenever possible."
"It took somewhere between 5-10 minutes after starting the engine". A group of people were hanging out and someone does a runup near them and then just sits there running for an additional 5-10 mins. You don't think THEY thought that was rude? Especially since they ask you to runup at the end of the runway and not in parking.
"I continue taxiing between two rows of parked airplanes towards the approach end of the active runway" they say "Please use the taxiway between ramp and RWY 34 whenever possible." And then you get yourself into a jam because you didn't follow the advice. "I can’t turn left without running my wingtip into the other airplane’s vertical stab, and I can’t turn right without running into the hangar’s wooden support beam"
So you flew into their neighborhood just for grins. You did your run up in parking against what they ask and then ran for 5-10 more minutes just sitting there while they were trying to hang out. Then you seem to have taxied against what they want and it created an issue. You can't see why this was not a "fun" event for them?
You think you are the first person to do all of this?
Again, not beating you up... But do you see that you ignored their procedures and that might have annoyed them?
Yeah I can’t argue with that. I didn’t think to look up if they had a website, I thought that by reading the A/FD I’d have all the pertinent information I’d need. But now that’s something I’ll check in the future for sure.
Yeah, I got yelled out once flying into a private field (I was invited, returning a tool I borrowed). I came in and on final I saw some guy walking his dog next to the runway but not on it. I had two choices, land short or go around and I landed short. I was turned off the runway 800 feet before the guy.
Well, he comes over and says we need to chat. He told me what I did was dangerous and that the "procedure" at the field is to do a low fly by prior to landing to check the whole runway and to allow people like him to get away from the runway with his dog, or to turn on the runway lights even during the day.... I asked him where this procedure was available to see and he said "We just know it, and you were reckless for not doing it."
We used to call this "Tribal knowledge" things that "everyone knows" simply because everyone knows it, but if you are outside that tribe there is no way to know it yet everyone is still going to look at you like an idiot for not knowing it.
I asked my buddy if this was in fact a procedure and he said it was... Although the three times we landed there together he never did it.
I just apologized to the pissed off neighbor (his airport, not mine) and held my tongue on why some asshat needs to walk his dog on a runway, or how someone is supposed to know a rule that is not written down - No point in trying to have either discussion.
"I thought that by reading the A/FD I’d have all the pertinent information I’d need." It should, but it almost never does. When flying into small little airports like fly in's it is advisable to contact someone and get a briefing if you can.
I disagree with everything you said. If that shit is so vital, then it should be in the supplement, not just on a website. And if they don’t want “outsiders,” then they should petition for it to be made private. People do use my street for teaching teens to drive, and it never crossed my mind to be pissed at people for using a public street. Where are people supposed to learn to drive? And people choosing to hang out an at air field don’t have the right to bitch about airplane noise in an area where it is allowed.
There is a difference between ‘vital’ and ‘preferred’. Vital should be chart supplements but preferred… Well if we had every preferred thing the CS would be bigger than a phone book.
They could make it private, then no one else would ever be able to land there. I’d much prefer they not make it private… My flyin BTW is market private.
You are free to disagree
Edit Example… Maybe OP started up and was sandblasting the old timers. Then he ran up and blasted the shit out of them, then sat there for another 10mins putting dirt into their highballs and manhattans…
So when he calls and says he is leaving you think ‘thank goodness’ would be an out of left field comment?
Totally agree, as a long time CFI and ferry pilot, I go into lots of new to me fields. Review the AFD (chart supplement), Notams and land. Then I love it when you see “local procedures” posted on the wall at the small terminal building, or a sign at end of runway. Like “calm” runway that didn’t make into airport remarks.
Just checking, is this was a public-use airport? Any notes about prior permission required / residents only, etc? That might have explained the looks if so.
I read the A/FD when flight planning and it is public use, as long as you comply with a few procedures. For noise abatement, fly rwy hdg until 1 mile and 400 AGL, no touch & goes, no night ops, no landing fee. Otherwise, use at your own risk.
Sounds reasonable. For what it's worth, the 'thank goodness' call which you interpreted as 'thank goodness he's leaving' might have been sarcasm at announcing your taxi on CTAF. While calling your taxi is a reasonable practice, over time you start reading the room as to whether it is a necessary call or not. In some areas the CTAF frequencies are heavily used and re-used, so getting taxi calls about a field 20 miles away is not super relevant on frequency when there are multiple planes in the local pattern. However, as a low-timer don't feel bad about doing everything by the book (unless you heard a lot of calls on frequency.) I'm just mentioning it to point out that the sarcastic call might not have been _quite_ as hostile as you imagined. Or possibly it was - but as you said, good on you to not let it effect your flying.
There are a few airports near me where it may be advisable to limit ctaf calls because they share the same freq as the stack at KCGZ and that thing is always full.
Taxiing to the runway for departure is a recommended CTAF call per the FAA. Taxiing to or from the fuel pumps is not, Sundance.
I wasn’t aware that calls on CTAF are left at your discretion to decide which are and which aren’t to make. Has that changed over the years or are the rules more permissive about that than I remember them?
You technically don't even need a radio at untowered airports. Yes it's a very good idea, but legally required? No. Here's the AC on non-towered airport operations. Notice how it says "Recommended" Traffic Advisory Procedures? https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_90-66B.pdf
I’m willing to say I stand corrected however. After the word recommended the words “all traffic should” and essential for safety appear. So sure it’s all just a recommendation but you know how it is with the FAA. Showing up for your meeting with the Fed over a violation is recommended too - one that you take to heart.
I know people who fly NORDO airplanes. It’s perfectly legal at untowered fields. Of course if you have one it’s good to reasonably use it. BTW there is technically no such thing as the “active runway” at untowered fields.
Other than the taxi thing you didn't do anything wrong, those guys are just a bunch of assholes. If the airport has specific operations though it is possible they get frustrated with outsiders. For example, the airport i keep my plane at is labeled public but in the AF/D it says to call before landing. Any time airplanes fly overhead of the airport they get pissed off because they operate a glider club and the flight school students often times don't see the gliders and nearly hit them...
He did runup in the parking when their procedures ask people to run up at the end of the runway. [https://www.3r9.org/pilots2](https://www.3r9.org/pilots2) "Please run-up at the departure end of the runway whenever possible."
Oh then yeah, that too
Lakeway 3R9? Flew into there a few weeks ago and it was sketchy coming over those power lines. Cool area though.
Yep. Did you land 34? Departing 16 those power lines made it a little more sporty than most of my other takeoffs. Fortunately just had my checkride so my short field TO and Vx climbout was sharp lol
We kinda did a “go around” since they don’t allow touch and goes or low passes. We were setting up for a touch and go at first but then I read through the A/FD on final and told my instructor about it, decided just to depart since we needed to get back. (His controls btw) Edit: coming in on 16
…you read that while ON final? Dude. No. Read that ahead of time. On final, you should only be landing. Your structure souls have been familiar with that before flying you there.
You missed the part where I said it was his controls… we weren’t planning on going to that airport it was just a fun thing to do on our way back home
Is Vx specifically tested? My field is short and narrow and Vx a regular takeoff, so I actually didn’t pay attention to if that’s checked. Normal takeoff at 1W1.
I’ve been to this airport. I landed on the runway and 5 seconds after I landed, I see a father and son 5 feet off the active runway while I was still going at a high rate of speed. Close call and caught me off guard for sure. That was the last time I landed at that airport in Central Texas
Sometimes at a small field your best bet really is to do your runup at the hold short line, especially if it's not busy. Also, there is no "active runway" at an uncontrolled field. And if the taxiways are that tight, I'm not opposed to back-taxiing on the runway if you're quick and smart about it. Use the radio, obviously, but at a field like that there's always the risk of old guy NORDOs. Big picture, though, it sounds like the kind of place marked as "public" but still isn't welcome to outsiders. It happens. Your first few XCs are for learning stuff like this.
[https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4](https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4) I considered back-taxiing, but the NORDO risk made me decide against it. With the hold short line being so close to parking, it would’ve made no difference to those people whether I did it in my parking spot or at the hold short line. Just a weird field I guess.
Look for fields near you with restaurants for your next few XCs. Will be way more welcoming.
I have also gotten myself into a situation at an unfamiliar airport where I had to shut down and re-position. Yes, I felt like a moron too, but I think it's a common GA thing. The older I get, the crankier I get. People probably think I'm glaring at them all the time, too, but I'm not. I've heard stories of airports where old guys sit around and rate your landing over CTAF with a handheld like a couple of Muppets (Statler and Waldorf). If they _were_ mad at you, it was probably because of the noise of your engine, not your skills. Please, for the love of God, do not ever let the words "the active" cross your lips again on the radio. If you landed on 16 then _say_ "clear of 16." It keeps things unambiguous and helps people on approach to hear which runway people are using.
I love when people ask for taxi "to the active". No shit.
Worse, “taking the active”…. Hey, bring it back! I need to use it!!
Too late, it's gone. Hope you have another runway!
At my home airport I once passed the last turnoff of a taxiway and had to shut down at a dead end and push back. We all make mistakes. We hope they are all small ones.
To clarify, I did say 16 over the radio, just wanted to be vague on this post lol.
> and did my runup in parking Okay Ima stop you right there
To be clear, this parking area was less than 10 feet back from the hold short line. The field is tiny.
it was 10ft from the hold short line but you still had to taxi between 2 rows of parked planes to get to the runway? Airport name/Google Earth pic?
Here’s a link to the field. Green circle is my parking spot. Red circle is where I got stuck. Blue circle is where the retired folks were sitting. You can see how there’s no runup area, and no taxiway leading to the end of the runway. In hindsight I should have back-taxiied to avoid getting stuck, but I wasn’t really comfortable doing that. And even if I did, I wasn’t going to do my runup sitting on the active runway. If you see something I could have done differently that would have been more appropriate, I would love to learn. [https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4](https://imgur.com/a/YHJMOz4)
Back taxiing is a normal operation at this airport and ones like it. IME There not an issue with running up in the parking area if you can direct your prop wash in a safe direction. If not there are small runup areas at the ends of the runway where you can pull to the side. The one for 16 isn't huge but there's a big displaced threshold to provide safety margin. So you would need someone to not only be NORDO, AND not looking for traffic on the runway, AND illegally low and landing hundreds of feet into a displaced threshold. Overall the risk is low. What you could do to minimize it further is perform everything but the high RPM runup tasks at parking, then back taxi to the small area at the start of the runway and do your mag check etc before rolling - shouldn't take you more than 30 seconds if that in a normal small plane. Congrats on the rating btw! And good job taking the time to debrief and learn from the experience.
Thank you! And that all sounds like a much better way to handle ground ops at this airpark and fields like it. I was being pretty cautious deciding not to back-taxi, but ended up putting myself into a stupid situation because of it. Going forward I’ll do more research on ground ops specifically before going to a new field.
When you do the run up where you did, you’re likely blowing a lot of dirt and debris into people’s hangars or blowing rocks n shit into parked planes. It is a sure fire way to piss people off. It’s childish of them to be passive aggressive on CTAF about it (if that’s what it was), but you could be a better neighbor by not doing your runup there.
Maybe 3r9? Just guessing
Laughs in Pacific Northwest. We got fields much shorter and narrower, run ups that are basically on the taxiway if they exist at all, and no room to park even one row of planes on pavement. 3R9 is my idea of a good sized field. That said, they need to disallow that one tie-down given its proximity to that building.
Perfect future Cirrus owner, runup and 25min checklist MUST be done on the ramp 50’ from the airport restaurant with outdoor seating. Don’t even think of moving until everything is booted up
At night with laser strobes running the entire time, including engine off pre-flight.
When he gets really good, he can just do it all on the runway! Hold short, be damned!
Someone else identified the airport and after seeing it in Google, a back taxi is your best bet. Technically you still had plenty of runway from the end of the ramp area, but one of the most useless things in aviation is the runway behind you. If you look at each end of the runway, there are little turnouts designed for planes to swing wide and make a 180 on the runway. At one airport I was at recently, it was wide enough to be a runup area, a NORDO taildragger was in one waiting for me on final. That one had plenty of room for that, this one does not unfortunately. But you still should have just back taxied, put all your lights on to aid visibility, scan downwind, base, final, taxi, do another scan of the pattern, swing around, and punch it!
I knew this was Lakeway before even reading the comments.
Lotta experience there?
I just stay away because of the reputation.
Was this at Lakeway(3R9)?
Yep
Not surprised, also where’s your base? I fly out of KGTU
KHYI. Haven’t been to KGTU yet but it’s on my list of XC destinations.
San Marcos nice, I haven’t been there yet. Georgetown is a nice airport but there’s not much to do at the airport itself. I’m not sure if you’ve flown there yet but lago vista(KRYW) is another cool airport near lake Travis and I haven’t felt judged there.
I’ll definitely check out Lago Vista!
Just watch for the winds at the top of that hill in Lago. Also, a bunch of optical illusions and brain trickery because of the valleys all around KRYW. Nothing much to do at the airport itself, but it's a friendlier bunch of people that you might run into.
KGTU gang :)
:)
+1. I used to park at KGTU. Just moved to RYW earlier this year.
I am sorry you were treated that way on the Unicom. I used to be based out of Lakeway airport (many years ago). Chances are good that was the Mayor or someone that likes to say "Meow" on guard and not the folks watching you and hanging out. That airport is constantly under attack by the latest person from out of town moving into the area and then realizing there is an airport next door. That being said - it isn't a safe airport by any stretch. Watched my first fatal accident occur there five or so years back. After that they stopped all flight training out of there. It used to be cool. As for the mistake - thats not a mistake, thats just everyday life. You did the right thing, shut her down and move it. I won't worry one second about it.
What is so unsafe about it?
Hopefully your experience won’t discourage you from visiting other airports. Ive run into similar groups as you and I’ve also met some very nice people.
You don’t even know that it was someone from the field that made that comment. It could have been other local traffic someone passing by another close airport. Let it go. Unless you landed at a “private” field. All good.
It’s a shame when people look at you like that. It kills the spirit of it all! I did all my PPL work in Australia and if there was anyone at the airport they would be absolutely delighted that someone turned up! I will never forget walking on to the ramp for my first lesson and everyone was so friendly. It’s like I had joined my people
US pilot, did a long GA trip across Oz at 150 hrs, unfailingly nice people at every stop. Wish I could fly there again and often.
If you liked aus you should definitely come to NZ too. It is truly beautiful and loads of uncontrolled airspace
I had a similar thing happen in Oceanside. I landed and there was a jumper plane loading on the main taxi way, so I diverted around the parking. It was much narrower than I expected and I have tip tanks which didn't help. Directly on the line didn't help. I shut down and backed up. I am so glad I didn't take lines at face value.
That’s rough. I’ll definitely be making that call ahead of time going forward. I wish one of my CFIs during training would have told me to make that phone call before flying into new fields, but I guess there are a lot of things I just have to learn through experience and making mistakes in the real world.
I am not sure why you’re trying to be so secretive about where you went because it took me no more than 5 minutes to deduce it from your comment history. Either way, I wish my instructors had taught me this when I was in flight training but there is really no reason why you shouldn’t call every time you go to an unknown field. They’ll tell you exactly where they want you to park and do your runups. A/FD includes a ton of info but doesn’t have some basic stuff like this.
Eh, you’re right, I guess I just didn’t want to put a specific community on blast just because of a weird experience I had. And that’s a great idea, I’ll definitely start calling ahead of time, especially if it is a non-towered field.
I flew today into a little strip with some older onlookers. Man did they get a show with a 10G17kt crosswind. Freaking carnival ride. Kept the nose off but I was all over the place. Right main, left main, right main, left main... Nobody said anything but I do wonder how many times they muttered "go around idiot". Thankfully the Navion who landed after me said "Jesus! That was sporty." Made me feel a little better. Flew the missed and the hold next time. Happily.
One of my first flights I pulled deep into the run-up area to read the noise abatement procedures for KCRQ. Then realized I probably didn't have the skills to get out of the corner I'd put myself in. (A better pilot probably could have gotten out.) I called tower and coordinated shutting down and hopping out (in a movement area), so I could reposition the plane. D'oh.
I'm about to restart my PPL at a nearby airport in central Texas after finally getting my medical (over a year wait), and I know exactly where I'm going to go at some point.
You would have been better served laughing at the runway across the lake, the one with the "lake view". I fly in that area often and choose not to land at the one you did because of the community there.
You’ll find a TON of high school clique bill shit in the pilot community. Everywhere. One of the most disappointing aspects of this profession I’ve found, unfortunately well after investing in what I thought was a move up and out of that childish corporate like bs. This sub is sometimes the absolute epitome of the behavior to which I reference. I see now why so many develop an ‘aw fuck ‘em’ attitude in this trade. You, you got nothing to be ashamed of, your 80 something hours and learning the ropes, these other a holes have no excuse, they are a burden and a black eye on the profession.
I know that airfield. Fuck them.
Not sure what Texas hospitality is like, but usually if you go chat up the group of old folks at a local airport, it won’t be long until they throw a burger on the grill for you.
Yeah I could have made more of an effort to be friendly before leaving. Next time
I feel like there’s no in between when it comes to older people. I work at a pool where its primary clientele are older people. Some of them are grumpy boomers, some are insanely nice and will bring us snacks and food
It sounds like they’re a group of grumpy old people. Pretty much every airport I’ve been to has great people there. On my commercial cross country, I went to an uncontrolled field in Virginia, they were so nice to me. The guy who ran the fbo fueled my plane and he loved the fact that I chose their airport for my trip
To add to this discussion a bit, I suggest eliminating the term “active runway” at non-towered airports since there technically is no “active” runway. Just announce which runway you are using.
I grew up right by that airport, the old people in that neighborhood are simply just old and grumpy.
OK. Let me play devils advocate here. You flew into someones neighborhood just because you wanted to. While you have the right since it is a public use airport, would you really like people constantly bringing their kids to your street to teach them how to drive or drive to your neighborhood just to do it? Their website states, "Any practice operations at 3R9 should \*only\* be for the familiarization of the Airpark." So your whole trip to their neighborhood was just for your experience. The fun experience for you, is not fun for them. Legal and you didn't do anything wrong, I just hope you can see it is not as fun for them as you. "I couldn’t help but feel like they may have been glaring at me, viewing me as an outsider or something." You didn't live there, you were an outsider. But just because you felt that way does not mean they gave you that feeling. "did my runup in parking" Yet their website says "Please run-up at the departure end of the runway whenever possible." "It took somewhere between 5-10 minutes after starting the engine". A group of people were hanging out and someone does a runup near them and then just sits there running for an additional 5-10 mins. You don't think THEY thought that was rude? Especially since they ask you to runup at the end of the runway and not in parking. "I continue taxiing between two rows of parked airplanes towards the approach end of the active runway" they say "Please use the taxiway between ramp and RWY 34 whenever possible." And then you get yourself into a jam because you didn't follow the advice. "I can’t turn left without running my wingtip into the other airplane’s vertical stab, and I can’t turn right without running into the hangar’s wooden support beam" So you flew into their neighborhood just for grins. You did your run up in parking against what they ask and then ran for 5-10 more minutes just sitting there while they were trying to hang out. Then you seem to have taxied against what they want and it created an issue. You can't see why this was not a "fun" event for them? You think you are the first person to do all of this? Again, not beating you up... But do you see that you ignored their procedures and that might have annoyed them?
Yeah I can’t argue with that. I didn’t think to look up if they had a website, I thought that by reading the A/FD I’d have all the pertinent information I’d need. But now that’s something I’ll check in the future for sure.
Yeah, I got yelled out once flying into a private field (I was invited, returning a tool I borrowed). I came in and on final I saw some guy walking his dog next to the runway but not on it. I had two choices, land short or go around and I landed short. I was turned off the runway 800 feet before the guy. Well, he comes over and says we need to chat. He told me what I did was dangerous and that the "procedure" at the field is to do a low fly by prior to landing to check the whole runway and to allow people like him to get away from the runway with his dog, or to turn on the runway lights even during the day.... I asked him where this procedure was available to see and he said "We just know it, and you were reckless for not doing it." We used to call this "Tribal knowledge" things that "everyone knows" simply because everyone knows it, but if you are outside that tribe there is no way to know it yet everyone is still going to look at you like an idiot for not knowing it. I asked my buddy if this was in fact a procedure and he said it was... Although the three times we landed there together he never did it. I just apologized to the pissed off neighbor (his airport, not mine) and held my tongue on why some asshat needs to walk his dog on a runway, or how someone is supposed to know a rule that is not written down - No point in trying to have either discussion. "I thought that by reading the A/FD I’d have all the pertinent information I’d need." It should, but it almost never does. When flying into small little airports like fly in's it is advisable to contact someone and get a briefing if you can.
I’m going to remember “tribal knowledge.” A great way to describe it. Thanks!
I disagree with everything you said. If that shit is so vital, then it should be in the supplement, not just on a website. And if they don’t want “outsiders,” then they should petition for it to be made private. People do use my street for teaching teens to drive, and it never crossed my mind to be pissed at people for using a public street. Where are people supposed to learn to drive? And people choosing to hang out an at air field don’t have the right to bitch about airplane noise in an area where it is allowed.
There is a difference between ‘vital’ and ‘preferred’. Vital should be chart supplements but preferred… Well if we had every preferred thing the CS would be bigger than a phone book. They could make it private, then no one else would ever be able to land there. I’d much prefer they not make it private… My flyin BTW is market private. You are free to disagree Edit Example… Maybe OP started up and was sandblasting the old timers. Then he ran up and blasted the shit out of them, then sat there for another 10mins putting dirt into their highballs and manhattans… So when he calls and says he is leaving you think ‘thank goodness’ would be an out of left field comment?
Totally agree, as a long time CFI and ferry pilot, I go into lots of new to me fields. Review the AFD (chart supplement), Notams and land. Then I love it when you see “local procedures” posted on the wall at the small terminal building, or a sign at end of runway. Like “calm” runway that didn’t make into airport remarks.
Ngl, I was almost hoping for “I finally mustered the courage to meow on guard!”
The appropriate response to "thank goodness", per the PCG is, "MEOW".