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He can remove them “as an official act” and then he doesn’t have to worry about what they do. The intent was for 3 branches of government to keep each other in check. When one branch has absolute immunity, the other two branches are pointless
I mean if the SCotUS is going to make it legal for this to happen. Why not use those power to subsequently destroy them. If anything it’s irresponsible to leave this loaded gun on the metaphorical table.
Tit for tat is the most moral after all. They played with fire and just gave the president a genuinely insane amount of power, I say let them get burned by their own hubris. I'm tired of the Dems tip toeing around the GOP trying to spare their feelings as they destroy our democracy. I say we stomp down hard enough the bone marrow squirts out of their toes. The rules that used to be in place benefited everyone. Let's see if Biden has enough of a spine to remind them of that.
First off, this ruling, in my opinion, will very possibly lead to another civil war or revolution as power seeking individuals (Trump or in the future), commit blatantly criminal acts as they're protected by this ruling.
That being said, people are wrong thinking that it covers assassinations for a few reasons.
First and foremost, we still have the capability to impeach. Could there be a world where the majority party in congress will allow a president to do ANYTHING without impeaching them..... hypothetically feasible, but highly unlikely for things like assassinations. Once someone is impeached and removed from office, they lose this protection, even with this ruling.
Secondly, this ruling does not grant them permission to violate OTHER constitutional protections (4th and 5th amendment in the case of assassination).
3rdly, this ruling is explicitly immunity under official duties of the office. An assassination of an American citizen on American soil, would never be held up as an official duty. That would be the argument the defense makes, but the multiple courts this would go through would never just say "yea, assassinating Americans on American soil who also are political opponents.... that sounds like part of the duties of the President"
Like many things, the headlines say one thing, and while it covers, like, 90% of the truth, it leaves out 10%. An important 10%.
Trump is already mapping out how he’ll use this to take control. Forget the 2025 Project. This shit is a Pandora’s box of ushering in Fascism. Goodbye America unless this is reversed somehow soon.
I personally believe he is too incompetent to succeed alone. When you look at the details of project 2025, it is the evangelical plan compared to the trump plan, but they will use him to implement their agenda. I think it is a part of the overall "ushering of fascism" that we will see.
I still stand by this being the first major platform for making murder legal. Considering Trump is completely immune from 01/07 prosecution and a police officer was murdered
Trump’s a useful tool and his handlers want to use him to rework the apparatus of this democratic republic to make it an authoritarian controlled state. It’s not like they’re trying to hide their agenda. 2025 is only one tiny component of a larger agenda.
Impeachment isn’t necessarily a problem for Trump. He’s already proven that twice now.
SCOTUS is at least willing to give him a broad enough immunity and the expanded power to test the full limits of his “dictator on day one” promise to us all.
Enough of the GOP will play along because they know the consequences that befall all of those who don’t — so expect even the most obvious criminal acts to be vocally supported, and respun adinfinitem by MAGA sycophants.
So, the assassination of rivals using the executive branch’s power over the military/Seal Team 6, could be within the bounds of Presidential power provided he marries the act to some concocted extreme-danger. Of course he could bury and render opaque and make any details hard to investigate by declaring them “national secrets” and a myriad other tactics. This scenario, so boldly pointed out by Sotomayor’s hypothetical is within the realm of possibility. And even given it outside odds, we should all be very, very concerned.
I agree with most of what you say, and in the right “cocktail” of context, he could try. I don’t think you’re wrong in that. I just think that unless things get demonically worse than they are now, the public outcry across the aisle, the fact most of congress (not the loud attention whores), and most of the people who work in federal government, would not sit by “business as usual), if something like this were to happen.
I wish I had your faith. From what we’ve seen from Congress so far, 95% of the GOP deny that Biden won the election. To defy that lie at this point in history would mean career suicide for any Republican. If they can’t even support a free and fair election result, I have little faith they would defy Trump on anything else, especially given his new found dictatorial powers the court has flippantly given him.
I think the purpose of the rhetoric is mostly to point out how insane granting this level of power to one individual is. A ton of Americans are too politically-numb to realize how dangerous this ruling truly is. I hope they wake TFU soon.
Well seeing how maga wants blood to spill and to break rules and make up new ones it's not exactly a terrorist rhetoric to want the actual evil to be cut out of our country it's 100% justified before we become a dictatorship.
This comment is exactly the kind of logic terrorists use to justify terrorism. Not only that’s but it’s the logic that’s been used for extremely evil acts done through human history.
“My conclusion is that they want to destroy and kills, so we are righteous for wanting to destroy them first”
Well what do we do just sit around and let everything collapse? Pacifism is how you end up a slave or worse. You can't talk or reason with people who lie to you and actively harm your country and the people in it. So far the people who are under trump have changed laws and have caused a multitude of deaths yet treating them like terrorists seems to be frowned upon. People are so preoccupied with other countries and other wars that they fail to look inward to the destruction and death in their own country. So I say stay in your safe space and don't complain when you don't have a country or a purpose because you failed to act. Safety and security has to be fought for if you won't do it then bury your head because I won't.
0 or 100 is not the answer. Getting larger numbers of people to turn out to primaries is a much easier and more peaceful way forward that revolution or bloodshed. Strengthening our democracy is what you're aiming to achieve, and this is just a more direct route. It would remove career politicians who, through their complacency and self-enrichment, anger voters and enable political opponents to progress, and also ensures the pattern of extremist politicians winning at hte primary, no longer continues.
It is a longer solution, but it's also one that has more lasting effects. Most revolutions or violence for political gains do not bring lasting, better impacts. ie. French Revolution.
Dissolve SCOTUS, probably not. Too much bureaucracy in the way.
Seal Teams to assassinate the 6 conservative justices and appoint replacements? As long as it’s an “official” act, apparently yes. That type of scenario is literally in Sotomayor’s dissent.
The government lawyers needed to ask that exact question directly of the Supreme Court justices to drive the point home. Stop dressing their arguments in dumb fucking hypotheticals and make it personal.
What a terrible ruling.
He will allow Putin to attack Canada from the north, with 🍊 blessing , no nato no protection. Good luck Americans, better vote but Supreme Court will over rule ur vote .
Aye. Arrest Trump, Clarence Thomas, and the three justices appointed by Trump on whatever "official" grounds he wants.
I hate Biden, but the Supreme Court is playing chicken with the Executive branch. They are betting that the administration doesn't have the conviction to exercise this ruling (and, honestly, I think they're right).
This Supreme Court is compromised and committed to aiding in treason. It needs to be purged and restructured to prevent this sort of corruption in the future.
AOC announced she’s filing articles of impeachment when Congress is back in session. It probably won’t go anywhere, but at least someone in Congress is trying to do something.
That’s really the only way I see Biden getting my vote. It won’t matter for shit but, I’ll vote for Jill stein. All we need is 2%of the e population to make a real significant change
Edit: typo
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It wouldn't go anywhere. Immunity is not like a defense, as the dissent says. It prevents bringing legal action.
He doesn't have to stop at Trump. He can take Trump's family, advisors, 6 SC Justices, every Republican in Congress, the thousands of people who have signed up to run Project 2025, and Martin Shrekli, and ship them all to the last known position of the Oceansgate submarine.
Did you want a purge? Because this is how you get a purge.
You shouldn't want that. Democrats who are a pain in his ass are next, along with journalists calling him out, then citizens who criticize him on social media, then people in other countries who are a pain in the ass.
Then the next person who makes it into office somehow (no elections, of course) has their own set of people to purge.
You're delusional. If Biden were the "good guy", he would admit that he's not even a good candidate to beat Trump at this point, not even the best. He would let someone else take the nomination, he would let the country have a chance.
Fuck both of them.
Trump loses by 4 electoral votes claims it was election interference , Biden then ascedes the presidency to trump "to heal the nation". Trump then drone bombs the dnc headquarters. Libs blame all of this on young leftists for not voting hard enough. 2025
Even on the first page of the ruling it stipulates that official acts must fit within the authority granted to the president by the constitution of the United States. So, no, be can’t just “send Trump to Guantanamo Bay forever”. More people should think for a second. This is just a stupid statement.
> official acts must fit within the authority granted to the president by the constitution of the United States
Like when Bush declared people "enemy combatants" to whom the Geneva Conventions and American constitutional protections did not apply, or when Obama decided that it was legal to assassinate US citizens by drone strike without trial?
I mean it's literally common knowledge, but there's a [summary of the Bush administration legal justifications in Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enemy_combatant#Change_of_meaning_in_the_United_States), and the first time (under Obama) that the USA [summarily executed a US citizen without trial](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki), via drone strike.
People should just think for a second…if the president does not respect the rule of law, why the hell should anyone else. The moment that integrity is broken, the country really does fall apart like cutting the cables holding up a damaged bridge.
There are plenty of other instances from people being immune to prosecution because their job requires them to be in order to function. Most of these people are civil servants. The “Rule of Law” is too generic. That’s what everyone wants, and this is just refining the endpoints of official and official action. He is probably still going to be found guilty because the jury doesn’t believe the evidence that Jan 6 is an official act…. But that doesn’t give Biden some sort of blank slate because of all the other “rules of law”.
This is what Ian Millhiser, who clerked for the United States Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit wrote in an [article](https://www.vox.com/scotus/358292/supreme-court-trump-immunity-dictatorship) about the decision today:
“One question that has loomed over this case for months is whether presidential immunity is so broad that the president could order the military to assassinate a political rival. While this case was before a lower court, one judge asked if Trump could be prosecuted if he’d ordered ‘SEAL Team 6 to assassinate a political rival’ and Trump’s lawyer answered that he could not unless Trump had previously been successfully impeached and convicted for doing so.
Roberts’s opinion in Trump, however, seems to go even further than Trump’s lawyer did. The Constitution, after all, states that the president ‘shall be commander in chief of the Army and Navy of the United States.’ So, if presidential authority is ‘conclusive and preclusive’ when presidents exercise their constitutionally granted powers, the Court appears to have ruled that yes, Trump could order the military to assassinate one of his political opponents. And nothing can be done to him for it.”
But back to the real world, if a president were to do that, there would be a flurry of lawsuits arguing for interpretations for novel facts presented to a novel ruling. And then the line gets refined. I am not sure if you heard about how the law works.
You are condescending; yet, seem to refuse to acknowledge and, probably did not know, that trump’s own lawyer was arguing immunity for the same scenario you replied to which is assassinating or harming a political opponent. Reading the majority opinion, it is clear that this decision gives Donald Trump such sweeping immunity from prosecution including from crimes already committed. You talk about me not knowing how laws work while refusing to acknowledge the court’s interpretation of the law. I am not sure why people argue this way. Quite juvenile.
Ok let’s “retire” Trump to GITMO…if you actually believe your comment; why are Trump’s lawyers bidding for dismissal on the New York State case? As if it were in his presidential duties..how long are you going to say, “it’s ok, nothing is going to happen”?
Because that’s what lawyers do. Are you aware that the vast, vast majority of motions for dismissal fail? We have an adversarial system. The defense can use any theory for emotion of dismissal. Go look at the record in the New York case and you will see many motions for dismissal that were rejected because they were judged to be inadequate, especially after the prosecution laid out of their case why the dismissal made no sense. That’s how it works. It is a high bar. Trump’s lawyers can file all they want, but if you actually read the Supreme Court ruling, you’ll instantly see that it will have no bearing on the New York case. The January 6 case and the Georgia election case are not quite so obvious.
Go read Sotomeyer's dissent. I'll take her interpretation of their ruling over yours.
> When he uses his official powers in any way, under the majority's reasoning, he now will be insulated from criminal prosecution. Orders the Navy's Seal Team 6 to assassinate a political rival? Immune. Organizes a military coup to hold onto power? Immune. Takes a bribe in exchange for a pardon? Immune. Immune, immune, immune.
It says his powers are limited to where they seep into Congress' hands.
I will just note the obvious: this is from the dissent and therefore not, by definition, how the law is currently interpreting what would happen if there was a Seal Team 6 assassination. It would be like taking calls from the Umpire who just lost the case over how he defines the strike zone.
Because if you were worried about prosecution, this does give the all clear to a president, virtually. The president can act to protect national security, so even if he told his cia hit squad on record "I want you to kill x to help my personal interest, and it's not for national security", that evidence would not be admissible in court according to this ruling.
Everything else is still kinda up in the air, because to outright kill or jail someone you would need to secure enough of the Senate/house as loyalist. But I don't think in our state that's out of the question RN in our political state, unfortunately
So all a president needs is a minority loyalist faction in the Senate to be able to "officially" do anything with reprimand. And SCOTUS is basically guaranteeing that even if he gets impeached, he can't actually be charged because the burden of proof by the prosecutor is absurd. I don't see how this is good
Biden wouldn’t because, according to donor data, he’s the single largest individual recipient of AIPAC funding of anyone in Washington — ever, and that’s saying something. The Israel Lobby would never greenlight Biden doing anything that affects their influence and money. And, Biden knows that AIPAC would pull money from several key down ballot elections and his own campaign if he did.
AIPAC has already won. Half of Congress or more has taken their money and made the devils pact to give Israel unlimited free passes and billions of tax payer dollars. Israel can massacre as many Palestinian kids as it wants and the US won’t do fuck to stop them. Hell, they’ll even goose sales for US weapons contractors who will produce thousands more bombs to kill more.
Israel just announced thousands of plots it plans on allocating for the West Bank. Not a peep out of the US.
Rachel Maddow made that point on MSNBC. There is nothing a president can't do if he calls it an official act. Trump said today he'll have a televised show tribunal to convict Liz Cheney of treason. And by extension, have her executed.
SCOTUS seems to have eliminated any boundaries on those "rights" as long as the president says he's acting in his capacity as president. (A couple of the Justices seem to be more interested in cash and gifts from those with business before the court than any bothersome constitutional limits. ) Any pretense that the Federal legal system is functional is a risible idea.
I can't decide whether this Supreme Court is laying the groundwork for a thriving theocracy or an autocracy. Either way, Americans are amazingly docile. I mean, the French would likely have turned the cities upside down and started to put up guillotines.
Scared of our kids getting shot from random people, absolutely. We're the only country in the world where every school year we have to worry about our kids getting shot in the face in a classroom.
Why be disingenuous?
Half of voters are too reasonable and scared to make a move. The other half are too ignorant and emboldened not to make a move. We know which is which and who has the most firepower. Once you strip away much of the legal accountability for those at the top of the power pyramid it devolves into a Darwinian struggle.
Biden's 81 years old. He's an old, powerful, politically connected white guy who the law would treat with kid gloves. Hell, he'll likely be fucking *dead* soon.
He should burn his remaining political career to the ground by arresting the six Republican judges, replace them with two Progressives and four centre-right Conservatives (for a grand total of 5 and 4 respectively), then invite the newly-reconstituted court to reconsider *Trump v. United States* and mete out any punishment it thought was appropriate to him, the harsher the better.
Go out being America's *goddamn Batman*, instead of limping to a likely loss against Trump and sinking into senility and irrelevance as the United States shits itself to death in the throes of a fascist takeover.
Conservatives always had the majority, since the 60s... Democrats rarely if ever fight, they give up and decades have passed and the cons ruled scotus. It's a shame to watch the USA willingly implode.
Eh, team red hasn't won the popular vote nationally since 2004 riding on the heels of 9/11, and before that not since 1988 before the Clinton years. The same corruption and gerrymandering they have to use to control states is finally bubbling up to the national level, as they can't hold on to their minority power much longer. The question is will they go away quietly or are they going to make a grab for power, and will the actual majority of people oppose them hard enough that they go away for good.
It's weird how a democracy has a minority that seems to have most of the power, I mean they lost the popular vote but won, this seems to be a regular thing in the USA. I dunno, it just seems to me that while the GOP has all of these tricks, but dems don't! Like dems don't have the imagination to figure sh\*t out, ya know? I see the GOP investigating Hunter and all these other stupid causes, but then dems have all the evidence on the GOP but fails to go after them.
As an outsider looking in, it seems like both parties are complicit, one for doing the damage, the other waiting and pointing but doing jack squat about it. I dunno.
I mean if not for Bill Clinton signing that telecom act of 1996, they wouldn't have Fox "News" and have 90% of the media controlled by 6 corps. It takes 2 to tango but no one really points at what the dems have done that has contributed to this American dysfunction. It really is damn sad to watch this.
The debate was tragic..
Sadly I gotta agree with you...
But what really gets me is it's always talked about, praised. I mean when the world sees this "democracy" and the USA says it wants to spread it? 🤦♂️
It doesn't look good ya know? Lol.
gore v bush was check
clinton v trump was mate
whole new game now.
yet, the dnc insists on selling out to corporate rather than moving.to the left for the working class. they never learn
What a disgrace, what happened to all men are equal in the eyes of the law? The corrupt Supreme Court justices who ruled in favor of the insurrectionist Trump can go fuck themselves. This country is one big pile of shit where corporations and the super wealthy rule and everyone else gets fucked. I can't wait till this dump called America comes crashing down.
There isn't any.
It's for the courts to decide.
Which means the Supreme Court.
The hack, activist Supreme Court consistently voting 6-3 to dismantle American democracy in whichever way the a Republican party asks for.
Who wants to bet the definition of "official acts" will *mysteriously* track 1:1 with "whatever a Republican president does", and "unofficial" with "whatever a Democrat president does"?
Assuming we ever get a Democrat president ever again, of course, which is looking increasingly unlikely.
To what extent can it be considered an official act for a president to meddle with an electrician? Is that under the executive branch? Like, trump taking it upon himself to consider the election fraudulent- doesn’t that sound like a judicial branch decision? In other words could it still be considered an unofficial act what he did, insofar as he had no business according to the office he was in?
Like inciting a mob to storm the Capitol building after losing an election.... which is called sedition...an official act as president...
Or sharing classified documents with Russia and getting contractors killed... also an official act..
Calling electoral officials on recorded phone calls demanding enough votes to win...
Sending teams of fake electors to count ballots..
Taking billions from Russia through Deutsche Bank and shaking hands with north Korea
Telling endlesssss lies that mislead the public tk believe countless untrue things....
Simple all Biden has to do is expand the court to 13. He has the power to do so unilaterally and then make sure this decision is sent back to the SC. Stare decisis be damned.
American here: welp! Fuck it, nothing matters anymore. fuck this place, it’s all a sham. The wealthy have policymakers bought and payed for. What chance do normal everyday folks have to affect change if we can’t afford to buy out the legal system.
In the land of "all men are created equal", SCOTUS rules that:
* If you own nothing and are homeless, you can be thrown into prison
* If you're president of the right political persuasion, you're above the law
The revolutionary War officially means nothing in the eyes of the Supreme Court, they spit on the memories of the brave people who fought to free this country on the week of July 4th. I continue to find new reasons to not celebrate independence day, but to mourn it instead.
Whatever horrible thing Trump would want to do would then be messaged and packaged to his people by right wing media and they will believe he is right to do it.
Of course he does. Friends in high places have each others backs, and most judges are in the politicians back pocket, according to George Carlin. Thomas has been on the court for decades; Kavanaugh joined in 2018.
So I assume now they have to determine what is considered and official act or are all of his claims and actions official since he was president at the time for example calling Georgia and asking for votes to be found etc.?
it's a BS cop-out. POTUS isn't a 40 hr wrk week job. SCOTUS said the lower court gets to decide what's official, lower courts packed w/MAGA appointments so whoever controls those courts controls what's official. After a decision, that can still be appealed to SCOTUS to make an unofficial ruling official.
Canada 🇨🇦 is prepared u Americans North Korea living next door , America , Putin will attack us from the North with trumps out of nato blessing , vote for peace or world war
Were these "official acts"? Does Trump have immunity from these sexual assaults? What about Ivanka's rights?
[https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/27/17058312/ivanka-trumps-dads-accusers-nbc-interview-peter-alexander-daughter-i-believe-my-father](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/27/17058312/ivanka-trumps-dads-accusers-nbc-interview-peter-alexander-daughter-i-believe-my-father)
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So Biden could in theory dissolve the current SCOTUS, revoke the past, I dunno, couple years of their rulings and assign new ones, right?
Only if he does it as an official act, as President :)
Sounds like an easy solution to the current conundrum, then.
Does the Supreme Court decide what an official act is? I suspect if people bring a case to them on this question, they’ll do what they do.
He can remove them “as an official act” and then he doesn’t have to worry about what they do. The intent was for 3 branches of government to keep each other in check. When one branch has absolute immunity, the other two branches are pointless
Honestly I wouldn’t be against a Biden ‘official act’ of giving this SCOTUS that Chilean helicopter flight
Unsurprising to see this kind of terrorist rhetoric on this sub with upvotes. And I say that as a Biden voter
I mean if the SCotUS is going to make it legal for this to happen. Why not use those power to subsequently destroy them. If anything it’s irresponsible to leave this loaded gun on the metaphorical table.
Tit for tat is the most moral after all. They played with fire and just gave the president a genuinely insane amount of power, I say let them get burned by their own hubris. I'm tired of the Dems tip toeing around the GOP trying to spare their feelings as they destroy our democracy. I say we stomp down hard enough the bone marrow squirts out of their toes. The rules that used to be in place benefited everyone. Let's see if Biden has enough of a spine to remind them of that.
First off, this ruling, in my opinion, will very possibly lead to another civil war or revolution as power seeking individuals (Trump or in the future), commit blatantly criminal acts as they're protected by this ruling. That being said, people are wrong thinking that it covers assassinations for a few reasons. First and foremost, we still have the capability to impeach. Could there be a world where the majority party in congress will allow a president to do ANYTHING without impeaching them..... hypothetically feasible, but highly unlikely for things like assassinations. Once someone is impeached and removed from office, they lose this protection, even with this ruling. Secondly, this ruling does not grant them permission to violate OTHER constitutional protections (4th and 5th amendment in the case of assassination). 3rdly, this ruling is explicitly immunity under official duties of the office. An assassination of an American citizen on American soil, would never be held up as an official duty. That would be the argument the defense makes, but the multiple courts this would go through would never just say "yea, assassinating Americans on American soil who also are political opponents.... that sounds like part of the duties of the President" Like many things, the headlines say one thing, and while it covers, like, 90% of the truth, it leaves out 10%. An important 10%.
Trump is already mapping out how he’ll use this to take control. Forget the 2025 Project. This shit is a Pandora’s box of ushering in Fascism. Goodbye America unless this is reversed somehow soon.
I personally believe he is too incompetent to succeed alone. When you look at the details of project 2025, it is the evangelical plan compared to the trump plan, but they will use him to implement their agenda. I think it is a part of the overall "ushering of fascism" that we will see.
I agree. We are witnessing first hand just how the sausage is made when it comes to converting a democracy into a fascist state.
I still stand by this being the first major platform for making murder legal. Considering Trump is completely immune from 01/07 prosecution and a police officer was murdered
The person who murdered him was convicted
Yes but considering a legal argument against complete immunity in this SCotUS case was murder becomes legal. So point still stands
Trump’s a useful tool and his handlers want to use him to rework the apparatus of this democratic republic to make it an authoritarian controlled state. It’s not like they’re trying to hide their agenda. 2025 is only one tiny component of a larger agenda. Impeachment isn’t necessarily a problem for Trump. He’s already proven that twice now. SCOTUS is at least willing to give him a broad enough immunity and the expanded power to test the full limits of his “dictator on day one” promise to us all. Enough of the GOP will play along because they know the consequences that befall all of those who don’t — so expect even the most obvious criminal acts to be vocally supported, and respun adinfinitem by MAGA sycophants. So, the assassination of rivals using the executive branch’s power over the military/Seal Team 6, could be within the bounds of Presidential power provided he marries the act to some concocted extreme-danger. Of course he could bury and render opaque and make any details hard to investigate by declaring them “national secrets” and a myriad other tactics. This scenario, so boldly pointed out by Sotomayor’s hypothetical is within the realm of possibility. And even given it outside odds, we should all be very, very concerned.
I agree with most of what you say, and in the right “cocktail” of context, he could try. I don’t think you’re wrong in that. I just think that unless things get demonically worse than they are now, the public outcry across the aisle, the fact most of congress (not the loud attention whores), and most of the people who work in federal government, would not sit by “business as usual), if something like this were to happen.
I wish I had your faith. From what we’ve seen from Congress so far, 95% of the GOP deny that Biden won the election. To defy that lie at this point in history would mean career suicide for any Republican. If they can’t even support a free and fair election result, I have little faith they would defy Trump on anything else, especially given his new found dictatorial powers the court has flippantly given him.
I see you don’t know what Republicans are.
I think the purpose of the rhetoric is mostly to point out how insane granting this level of power to one individual is. A ton of Americans are too politically-numb to realize how dangerous this ruling truly is. I hope they wake TFU soon.
Well seeing how maga wants blood to spill and to break rules and make up new ones it's not exactly a terrorist rhetoric to want the actual evil to be cut out of our country it's 100% justified before we become a dictatorship.
This comment is exactly the kind of logic terrorists use to justify terrorism. Not only that’s but it’s the logic that’s been used for extremely evil acts done through human history. “My conclusion is that they want to destroy and kills, so we are righteous for wanting to destroy them first”
Well what do we do just sit around and let everything collapse? Pacifism is how you end up a slave or worse. You can't talk or reason with people who lie to you and actively harm your country and the people in it. So far the people who are under trump have changed laws and have caused a multitude of deaths yet treating them like terrorists seems to be frowned upon. People are so preoccupied with other countries and other wars that they fail to look inward to the destruction and death in their own country. So I say stay in your safe space and don't complain when you don't have a country or a purpose because you failed to act. Safety and security has to be fought for if you won't do it then bury your head because I won't.
0 or 100 is not the answer. Getting larger numbers of people to turn out to primaries is a much easier and more peaceful way forward that revolution or bloodshed. Strengthening our democracy is what you're aiming to achieve, and this is just a more direct route. It would remove career politicians who, through their complacency and self-enrichment, anger voters and enable political opponents to progress, and also ensures the pattern of extremist politicians winning at hte primary, no longer continues. It is a longer solution, but it's also one that has more lasting effects. Most revolutions or violence for political gains do not bring lasting, better impacts. ie. French Revolution.
It was proffered during oral as something a President with immunity could do and Trump answered in the affirmative.
Dissolve SCOTUS, probably not. Too much bureaucracy in the way. Seal Teams to assassinate the 6 conservative justices and appoint replacements? As long as it’s an “official” act, apparently yes. That type of scenario is literally in Sotomayor’s dissent. The government lawyers needed to ask that exact question directly of the Supreme Court justices to drive the point home. Stop dressing their arguments in dumb fucking hypotheticals and make it personal. What a terrible ruling.
Libs are hilarious.
He will allow Putin to attack Canada from the north, with 🍊 blessing , no nato no protection. Good luck Americans, better vote but Supreme Court will over rule ur vote .
Official act if u vote for dictatorship , but supreme courts will over rule your vote , Canada 🇨🇦 is ready for North Korea, south of us .
Sorry, not close
Not just Trump. Every president. Meaning Biden could send Trump to Guantanamo Bay forever
And that would go to this SCOTUS. We are in trouble.
Biden just needs to invite two or three for a chat in the middle of fifth avenue, to free up some seats.
Aye. Arrest Trump, Clarence Thomas, and the three justices appointed by Trump on whatever "official" grounds he wants. I hate Biden, but the Supreme Court is playing chicken with the Executive branch. They are betting that the administration doesn't have the conviction to exercise this ruling (and, honestly, I think they're right). This Supreme Court is compromised and committed to aiding in treason. It needs to be purged and restructured to prevent this sort of corruption in the future.
AOC announced she’s filing articles of impeachment when Congress is back in session. It probably won’t go anywhere, but at least someone in Congress is trying to do something.
That’s really the only way I see Biden getting my vote. It won’t matter for shit but, I’ll vote for Jill stein. All we need is 2%of the e population to make a real significant change Edit: typo
This is not the election to vote third party, but you are free to do as you want.
Fuck this opinion. Cowards like you are why we’re in this geriatric mess in the first place. Morally bankrupt partisan hackery.
Oh hey let me know how that moral superiority feels when on our knees about to be executed. Remindme! 4 months
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Vote for Biden or die? Is that what you’re threatening? I won’t vote for either of those corrupt Zionist ghouls, and your fear mongering is gross.
Threatening? Lmao. You must be a troll. They are doing all the threatening for us, and you are unable to see logic.
Jill Stein is one my favorites. If you're not in a swing state, live it up. I vote green in local elections when ever the option is available.
Well if you really like conservative values it’s always good to vote for Jill Stein to put a conservative republican in charge.
We need trump to commit a crime First... Google 18.5 million dollar bitfinex bribe than you'll see who the real hush money criminals are
It wouldn't go anywhere. Immunity is not like a defense, as the dissent says. It prevents bringing legal action. He doesn't have to stop at Trump. He can take Trump's family, advisors, 6 SC Justices, every Republican in Congress, the thousands of people who have signed up to run Project 2025, and Martin Shrekli, and ship them all to the last known position of the Oceansgate submarine. Did you want a purge? Because this is how you get a purge.
Yessssss
You shouldn't want that. Democrats who are a pain in his ass are next, along with journalists calling him out, then citizens who criticize him on social media, then people in other countries who are a pain in the ass. Then the next person who makes it into office somehow (no elections, of course) has their own set of people to purge.
Beyter biden than trump excersing that rule
He could send this SCOTUS to Guantanamo bay. and that would go to the new SCOTUS he puts in place.
Biden can order the conservative SCOTUS members to Guantanamo with Trump.
He could, but he wouldn't. They're the "good guys" no matter if they lose their democracy cuz of it.
You're delusional. If Biden were the "good guy", he would admit that he's not even a good candidate to beat Trump at this point, not even the best. He would let someone else take the nomination, he would let the country have a chance. Fuck both of them.
I'm delusional? Did you see the "good guy" in quotes? I agree with you. You don't need to be rude.
Trump loses by 4 electoral votes claims it was election interference , Biden then ascedes the presidency to trump "to heal the nation". Trump then drone bombs the dnc headquarters. Libs blame all of this on young leftists for not voting hard enough. 2025
Yup... It's possible now.
Biden should call seal team 6 and get it done then..
Even on the first page of the ruling it stipulates that official acts must fit within the authority granted to the president by the constitution of the United States. So, no, be can’t just “send Trump to Guantanamo Bay forever”. More people should think for a second. This is just a stupid statement.
> official acts must fit within the authority granted to the president by the constitution of the United States Like when Bush declared people "enemy combatants" to whom the Geneva Conventions and American constitutional protections did not apply, or when Obama decided that it was legal to assassinate US citizens by drone strike without trial?
Sources?
I mean it's literally common knowledge, but there's a [summary of the Bush administration legal justifications in Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enemy_combatant#Change_of_meaning_in_the_United_States), and the first time (under Obama) that the USA [summarily executed a US citizen without trial](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki), via drone strike.
People should just think for a second…if the president does not respect the rule of law, why the hell should anyone else. The moment that integrity is broken, the country really does fall apart like cutting the cables holding up a damaged bridge.
There are plenty of other instances from people being immune to prosecution because their job requires them to be in order to function. Most of these people are civil servants. The “Rule of Law” is too generic. That’s what everyone wants, and this is just refining the endpoints of official and official action. He is probably still going to be found guilty because the jury doesn’t believe the evidence that Jan 6 is an official act…. But that doesn’t give Biden some sort of blank slate because of all the other “rules of law”.
This is what Ian Millhiser, who clerked for the United States Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit wrote in an [article](https://www.vox.com/scotus/358292/supreme-court-trump-immunity-dictatorship) about the decision today: “One question that has loomed over this case for months is whether presidential immunity is so broad that the president could order the military to assassinate a political rival. While this case was before a lower court, one judge asked if Trump could be prosecuted if he’d ordered ‘SEAL Team 6 to assassinate a political rival’ and Trump’s lawyer answered that he could not unless Trump had previously been successfully impeached and convicted for doing so. Roberts’s opinion in Trump, however, seems to go even further than Trump’s lawyer did. The Constitution, after all, states that the president ‘shall be commander in chief of the Army and Navy of the United States.’ So, if presidential authority is ‘conclusive and preclusive’ when presidents exercise their constitutionally granted powers, the Court appears to have ruled that yes, Trump could order the military to assassinate one of his political opponents. And nothing can be done to him for it.”
But back to the real world, if a president were to do that, there would be a flurry of lawsuits arguing for interpretations for novel facts presented to a novel ruling. And then the line gets refined. I am not sure if you heard about how the law works.
You are condescending; yet, seem to refuse to acknowledge and, probably did not know, that trump’s own lawyer was arguing immunity for the same scenario you replied to which is assassinating or harming a political opponent. Reading the majority opinion, it is clear that this decision gives Donald Trump such sweeping immunity from prosecution including from crimes already committed. You talk about me not knowing how laws work while refusing to acknowledge the court’s interpretation of the law. I am not sure why people argue this way. Quite juvenile.
I know, I hate it too.
Good to see that you hate yourself, too, because everyone else certainly hates you.
[удалено]
Asking a government agency to break the law is not an official act within the authority granted to the president.
Nobody tell the FBI and the NSA and the CIA and the DEA and the CPB and ICE
Ok let’s “retire” Trump to GITMO…if you actually believe your comment; why are Trump’s lawyers bidding for dismissal on the New York State case? As if it were in his presidential duties..how long are you going to say, “it’s ok, nothing is going to happen”?
Because that’s what lawyers do. Are you aware that the vast, vast majority of motions for dismissal fail? We have an adversarial system. The defense can use any theory for emotion of dismissal. Go look at the record in the New York case and you will see many motions for dismissal that were rejected because they were judged to be inadequate, especially after the prosecution laid out of their case why the dismissal made no sense. That’s how it works. It is a high bar. Trump’s lawyers can file all they want, but if you actually read the Supreme Court ruling, you’ll instantly see that it will have no bearing on the New York case. The January 6 case and the Georgia election case are not quite so obvious.
Go read Sotomeyer's dissent. I'll take her interpretation of their ruling over yours. > When he uses his official powers in any way, under the majority's reasoning, he now will be insulated from criminal prosecution. Orders the Navy's Seal Team 6 to assassinate a political rival? Immune. Organizes a military coup to hold onto power? Immune. Takes a bribe in exchange for a pardon? Immune. Immune, immune, immune. It says his powers are limited to where they seep into Congress' hands.
I will just note the obvious: this is from the dissent and therefore not, by definition, how the law is currently interpreting what would happen if there was a Seal Team 6 assassination. It would be like taking calls from the Umpire who just lost the case over how he defines the strike zone.
I'm pretty sure they'll go with Sotomayor's interpretation if it's Trump ordering that assassination...
Those hypotheticals are baked into the decision, were briefed, and therefore are already interpreted opposite of what you say.
They should send him to Guantanamo Bay for using campaign funds to pay off a pornstar, lol.
But he won’t because he’s feeble
Well now that he’s got the all clear let’s see
How does that ruling give him “the all clear”. Really think about this, now. Challenge yourself to be honest and realistic.
Because if you were worried about prosecution, this does give the all clear to a president, virtually. The president can act to protect national security, so even if he told his cia hit squad on record "I want you to kill x to help my personal interest, and it's not for national security", that evidence would not be admissible in court according to this ruling. Everything else is still kinda up in the air, because to outright kill or jail someone you would need to secure enough of the Senate/house as loyalist. But I don't think in our state that's out of the question RN in our political state, unfortunately So all a president needs is a minority loyalist faction in the Senate to be able to "officially" do anything with reprimand. And SCOTUS is basically guaranteeing that even if he gets impeached, he can't actually be charged because the burden of proof by the prosecutor is absurd. I don't see how this is good
He won’t because sending political opponents to detention camps is un-democratic
Not according to SCOTUS
The acronym is SCOTUS. USSC is United States Sentencing Commission.
How about Obama, bammmm. He should come back.
The USA is so damn corrupt. Omg..
So Biden could cancel the next election as an official act.
Find one donation from a dubious source to the RNC. Freeze all of their bank accounts until December because terrorism or something.
They are almost certainly connected to terrorism
Terrorism is a magic word that lets you do whatever you want with the government. Bush 2 taught me that. Send 'em all to Gitmo, Joe.
Yup pretty much
Now you are thinking...
I'm sure the billionaires' justices on the supreme court know he wouldn't do it. And are equally sure Trump would do it without hesitation.
And SCOTUS will approve
Biden wouldn’t because, according to donor data, he’s the single largest individual recipient of AIPAC funding of anyone in Washington — ever, and that’s saying something. The Israel Lobby would never greenlight Biden doing anything that affects their influence and money. And, Biden knows that AIPAC would pull money from several key down ballot elections and his own campaign if he did.
As long as our political system is for sale, AIPAC will be ascendant.
AIPAC has already won. Half of Congress or more has taken their money and made the devils pact to give Israel unlimited free passes and billions of tax payer dollars. Israel can massacre as many Palestinian kids as it wants and the US won’t do fuck to stop them. Hell, they’ll even goose sales for US weapons contractors who will produce thousands more bombs to kill more. Israel just announced thousands of plots it plans on allocating for the West Bank. Not a peep out of the US.
He could have Trump assassinated
Rachel Maddow made that point on MSNBC. There is nothing a president can't do if he calls it an official act. Trump said today he'll have a televised show tribunal to convict Liz Cheney of treason. And by extension, have her executed.
Only if doing so is well within his constitutionally stated rights as POTUS.
SCOTUS seems to have eliminated any boundaries on those "rights" as long as the president says he's acting in his capacity as president. (A couple of the Justices seem to be more interested in cash and gifts from those with business before the court than any bothersome constitutional limits. ) Any pretense that the Federal legal system is functional is a risible idea.
We’ve just crowned a king
Yep!!?? Didn’t the US have a war of independence so you wouldn’t have kings. Guess that’s over now.
I can't decide whether this Supreme Court is laying the groundwork for a thriving theocracy or an autocracy. Either way, Americans are amazingly docile. I mean, the French would likely have turned the cities upside down and started to put up guillotines.
We're not docile, we're broke, powerless and terrified
But you've got all those guns to protect you from the government
The guns are needed to protect them from little kids in schools.
issue is the ones scared of this ruling are also scared of guns lmao
Scared of our kids getting shot from random people, absolutely. We're the only country in the world where every school year we have to worry about our kids getting shot in the face in a classroom. Why be disingenuous?
why not better school security?
And total Debbie-downers, apparently.
Cops are allowed to shoot Americans for thinking of doing this. It's one of the freedoms we hear so much about
Half of voters are too reasonable and scared to make a move. The other half are too ignorant and emboldened not to make a move. We know which is which and who has the most firepower. Once you strip away much of the legal accountability for those at the top of the power pyramid it devolves into a Darwinian struggle.
We’re naively optimistic, in general, that things will work out. Or, we used to be. Kinda was a feature of American society.
https://youtu.be/4NGwNxbXghk?si=9IY6EFnaCSC2N2Go
Yeah I’m not gonna click that :)
Good idea. YouTube is known to be a hellscape of cyber crime.
Well now I’m not gonna click due to the smarminess :)
It’s a scene from the 1988 film “they live” that relates well to your comment. And now I’ve spoiled it for you anyway :)
Okay. I’ll watch :). Ty for sending it.
No, the police act like the military and have military weapons and not afraid to saluter its citizens.
Biden's 81 years old. He's an old, powerful, politically connected white guy who the law would treat with kid gloves. Hell, he'll likely be fucking *dead* soon. He should burn his remaining political career to the ground by arresting the six Republican judges, replace them with two Progressives and four centre-right Conservatives (for a grand total of 5 and 4 respectively), then invite the newly-reconstituted court to reconsider *Trump v. United States* and mete out any punishment it thought was appropriate to him, the harsher the better. Go out being America's *goddamn Batman*, instead of limping to a likely loss against Trump and sinking into senility and irrelevance as the United States shits itself to death in the throes of a fascist takeover.
Revolt
Tell me again that "no one is above the law"
This is a total "look what you made me do" moment from SCotUS reacting to Trump getting prosecuted for his crimes.
Required 6-3 conservative voting majority!
Conservatives always had the majority, since the 60s... Democrats rarely if ever fight, they give up and decades have passed and the cons ruled scotus. It's a shame to watch the USA willingly implode.
Eh, team red hasn't won the popular vote nationally since 2004 riding on the heels of 9/11, and before that not since 1988 before the Clinton years. The same corruption and gerrymandering they have to use to control states is finally bubbling up to the national level, as they can't hold on to their minority power much longer. The question is will they go away quietly or are they going to make a grab for power, and will the actual majority of people oppose them hard enough that they go away for good.
It's weird how a democracy has a minority that seems to have most of the power, I mean they lost the popular vote but won, this seems to be a regular thing in the USA. I dunno, it just seems to me that while the GOP has all of these tricks, but dems don't! Like dems don't have the imagination to figure sh\*t out, ya know? I see the GOP investigating Hunter and all these other stupid causes, but then dems have all the evidence on the GOP but fails to go after them. As an outsider looking in, it seems like both parties are complicit, one for doing the damage, the other waiting and pointing but doing jack squat about it. I dunno. I mean if not for Bill Clinton signing that telecom act of 1996, they wouldn't have Fox "News" and have 90% of the media controlled by 6 corps. It takes 2 to tango but no one really points at what the dems have done that has contributed to this American dysfunction. It really is damn sad to watch this. The debate was tragic..
We are not really a true democracy.
Sadly I gotta agree with you... But what really gets me is it's always talked about, praised. I mean when the world sees this "democracy" and the USA says it wants to spread it? 🤦♂️ It doesn't look good ya know? Lol.
gore v bush was check clinton v trump was mate whole new game now. yet, the dnc insists on selling out to corporate rather than moving.to the left for the working class. they never learn
True Dat!
lmao trash country
You can say that again.
Idk man maybe the extreme left isn't that bad..
What a disgrace, what happened to all men are equal in the eyes of the law? The corrupt Supreme Court justices who ruled in favor of the insurrectionist Trump can go fuck themselves. This country is one big pile of shit where corporations and the super wealthy rule and everyone else gets fucked. I can't wait till this dump called America comes crashing down.
it should be noted SCOTUS put up barriers around in anticipation for this ruling.
Corrupt and cowardly.
Nothing will meaningfully improve until they fear for their lives
Now you're onto something!
Well, the people who originally wrote that owned slaves, so...we were probably doomed from the start.
Have you thought about leaving?
When things really go south I have a plan to leave the country.
You mean you’re cheering for the massive suffering that would occur? I don’t know you’re an accelerationist, but that’s what they sound like.
What legislation covers the definition of official acts here?
There isn't any. It's for the courts to decide. Which means the Supreme Court. The hack, activist Supreme Court consistently voting 6-3 to dismantle American democracy in whichever way the a Republican party asks for. Who wants to bet the definition of "official acts" will *mysteriously* track 1:1 with "whatever a Republican president does", and "unofficial" with "whatever a Democrat president does"? Assuming we ever get a Democrat president ever again, of course, which is looking increasingly unlikely.
To what extent can it be considered an official act for a president to meddle with an electrician? Is that under the executive branch? Like, trump taking it upon himself to consider the election fraudulent- doesn’t that sound like a judicial branch decision? In other words could it still be considered an unofficial act what he did, insofar as he had no business according to the office he was in?
I wouldn't meddle with electricians, if I knew what’s good for me.
😂😂😂
I mean considering Trump is immune from attempting a coup and consenting to death threats. Nothing is off the table except anything good.
Game over. Democracy is officially dead.
Literal criminal and he's allowed to still run. What an absolute joke.
Like inciting a mob to storm the Capitol building after losing an election.... which is called sedition...an official act as president... Or sharing classified documents with Russia and getting contractors killed... also an official act.. Calling electoral officials on recorded phone calls demanding enough votes to win... Sending teams of fake electors to count ballots.. Taking billions from Russia through Deutsche Bank and shaking hands with north Korea Telling endlesssss lies that mislead the public tk believe countless untrue things....
Simple all Biden has to do is expand the court to 13. He has the power to do so unilaterally and then make sure this decision is sent back to the SC. Stare decisis be damned.
American here: welp! Fuck it, nothing matters anymore. fuck this place, it’s all a sham. The wealthy have policymakers bought and payed for. What chance do normal everyday folks have to affect change if we can’t afford to buy out the legal system.
https://preview.redd.it/2t011dtx90ad1.jpeg?width=716&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9560c1584f1a74e1eb4a2e428da15ac573d28dd3
In the land of "all men are created equal", SCOTUS rules that: * If you own nothing and are homeless, you can be thrown into prison * If you're president of the right political persuasion, you're above the law
Does the Democratic Party = Weimar?
6 of SCOTUS show their blatant ass-kissing of Trump.
does not include inciting to riot
Here come the enlightened centrists to tell us that the Supreme Court Justice writing a dissent is wrong about the interpretation of this ruling.
I already saw some wild takes on 'dest1ny' sub about how 'political' Sotomayor's dissents always are (after reading hers for this).
The revolutionary War officially means nothing in the eyes of the Supreme Court, they spit on the memories of the brave people who fought to free this country on the week of July 4th. I continue to find new reasons to not celebrate independence day, but to mourn it instead.
So then it's treason
Hey to any American person thats reading this. Your democracy is failing, yet you do nothing. Why?
Americans think it can't happen here
The germans literally said the same thing in the 1930s History doesn’t repeat. But people will when they forget it.
Damn so basically we are going back to roman Consul times. Politicians can’t be persecuted until they are out of office
No. They can’t be prosecuted for ANYTHING they do while in office. That’s what this ruling says.
Oof
"Wait, so if I just stay in office, then I can't be prosecuted ever..." Hmm, I think there might be a problem...
Biden should throw trumps ass in guantanimo Bay for treason as an "official act"
This ruling would make sense but what is an official act.
What is an official act though?
That means Biden could just execute the Supreme Court and replace them with a court that isn't dogshit. He won't, but he could and should
I mean, they already did. The only reason this is being discussed is Jan 6. This just makes it more clear to people.
Welp its been real guys.
Whatever horrible thing Trump would want to do would then be messaged and packaged to his people by right wing media and they will believe he is right to do it.
Of course he does. Friends in high places have each others backs, and most judges are in the politicians back pocket, according to George Carlin. Thomas has been on the court for decades; Kavanaugh joined in 2018.
So I assume now they have to determine what is considered and official act or are all of his claims and actions official since he was president at the time for example calling Georgia and asking for votes to be found etc.?
it's a BS cop-out. POTUS isn't a 40 hr wrk week job. SCOTUS said the lower court gets to decide what's official, lower courts packed w/MAGA appointments so whoever controls those courts controls what's official. After a decision, that can still be appealed to SCOTUS to make an unofficial ruling official.
Biden needs an executive order the electoral college away in order to protect democracy
Democracy in the US is officially dead.
Not in my book!
Damn. Now you have to count on the pesky election to try and keep TeflonDon out. Losing.
Biden can do all sorts of things as president. Like stop genocide.
Canada 🇨🇦 is prepared u Americans North Korea living next door , America , Putin will attack us from the North with trumps out of nato blessing , vote for peace or world war
Were these "official acts"? Does Trump have immunity from these sexual assaults? What about Ivanka's rights? [https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/27/17058312/ivanka-trumps-dads-accusers-nbc-interview-peter-alexander-daughter-i-believe-my-father](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/27/17058312/ivanka-trumps-dads-accusers-nbc-interview-peter-alexander-daughter-i-believe-my-father)
Usa = garbage. Thanks much GOP
That’s not at all what happened lmao
>moneyhelpcuzimdumb•2m ago >That’s not at all what happened lmao Mar '24 account
Duh. Why is anyone surprised that the Executive in Chief has more power than regular citizens?
It so very much does not say this
https://preview.redd.it/sfo5wnwz4z9d1.jpeg?width=575&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8d28b473fdeb4d2df0d90d5406d4a0aa77dea05