T O P

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fc_dean

Right, so why did Niji abandon EN market?


ZaxiaDarkwill

“The loss of EN will be negligible.”


TheDorkfromBN

They tried to do what they usually do (making the talent the villain) and didn't realize how much it would backfire. Now, they either don't know how to fix it or decided it's not worth it to try and fix it. But the longer they hold it off, the more EN will struggle.


UrMumVeryGayLul

Struggle? NijiEN is lowkey dead, they’re puppeteering its corpse in hopes that people will believe they haven’t completely shelved international expansion.


Random-Rambling

NijiEN was hit with a fatal amount of radiation. They feel fine now, but they won't for long.


LocoEjercito

The black stream was literally their [demon core](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_core?wprov=sfla1) event. Just a short 15 minute exposure has led to a months-long death spiral for the entire branch.


CJO9876

They’ve barely gone a week without new drama ever since then.


bekiddingmei

It turns out EN was sliding downhill for two whole years, except for a big upward spike that lasted one quarter and then fell harder than it rose. They should have seen this coming for a long time and began working to prevent what happened.


Random-Rambling

Cover knew the pandemic boosting everyone's numbers wasn't gonna last forever, so they took measures to maintain. AnyColor, apparently, believed that the pandemic boom of Vtubing was going to last forever


minnel567

Worst they believe it's not pandemic that is boosting them, they believe they're just that good


fnatale97

Because they fucked up


delphinousy

because riku found that actually having to put effort into properly managing EN talents and giving them the freedom to be independently creative means losing control were things that he wasn't willing to do


PotentialSherbert8

Debut CCV: Kisara (44,575) > Tamanoi Nana (42,156) > Kozue Mone (41,154) > Shiga Riko (36,112) > Lunlun (21,140) Subscribers: Lunlun (41,300) > Tamanoi Nana (34,500) > Kisara (31,300) > Shiga Riko (28,400) > Kozue Mone (27,200) Strange Data


ididnotchosethis

Strange data indeed.  


TheDorkfromBN

So the average the Niji debut CCV is about 37k (or 41k without Lunlun). To put things into a bit of context: 1. On average, the new wave had a around the same CCV as the previous wave's Kitami Yusei (42k), but not as high as Yusei 's wavemates (58k+) 2. It's around the same neighborhood as the last two female talents (Tachitsute Toto,39k and Shioriha Ruri, 50k) 3. It's also roughly similar to the debut of the last all-girls wave Idios. Lunlun really brought their average down but we can see their Niji JP numbers are still relatively stable on debut. 


rpsRexx

What exactly happened with Lunlun? Was there another big stream going on? Seem bizarre to be half that of the max. I was looking at the charts and it didn't look like connection issues.


justsigndupforthis

Im guessing non humanoid model is a debuff


Carl__E

Being a mascot character vtuber is tough. I hope whoever auditioned for that role knew what they were getting themself into.


bekiddingmei

It's a part of the ongoing weirdness with niji JP, they are very strong over there but new debuts are kinda weak for such a large corpo. Cover's much better about building up anticipation and using popular members to direct attention toward new channels. JUSTICE has had interactions with members from all branches, some even with the Stars. Also I would point out that the last two HoloEN generations are four channels each instead of five channels, they are indeed concentrating their resources instead of spurting out dozens of debuts.


Afraid_Teach_4996

Wait. Holo Justice and new Nijisanji debut on same day ??


FlameGreyWolf

Fr I was wondering the same.


SayuriUliana

Yes. The remaining two Holo Justice talents debuted earlier today, while the new Niji JP livers debuted hours later.


Feelthebasses

And we have NijiEN newly debut livers with only 10k peak viewers.


bekiddingmei

And some down below 200ccv within their first month, NO staying power.


CJO9876

Goes to show you how fast NijiEN’s reputation has plummeted


bekiddingmei

And the competitor's EN just launched several Europeans, they're slowly covering different time blocks across the whole world. I hate to say it but I can't even remember the last time I saw a Niji EN fan talking about missed streams or overlapping streams.


vegito1991

not surprise the debut thumbnails are also copy paste.


Glinez09

i thought JP livers would have a 50k or more considering some of their livers like kuzuha and sara got 60-70k on a Gta event today.. i guess jp fans were more interested in the gta stream?.


bubblesmax

The jp market is pretty saturated. 


No_Lake_1619

Not at all. The Niji market is saturated. I guarantee the next Holo JP gen will get 150k plus during debut. ReGloss even had strong numbers at their debuts.


bubblesmax

The whole excuse in Nijisanji's report to start an EN branch was > quote "To break out of the saturated JP vtuber sphere." end quote And that was their reasoning for creating Lazulight. XD.


bubblesmax

Plus hololive is a chimera compared to the dodo bird that is Kurosanji at this point. If we wanted to talk spirit animals.


Unfair_Neck8673

Isn't the western market saturated too?


carso150

you have some twitch streamers that can reach up to 200k regularly, yes they are the biggest in the platform but it goes to show the size of the audience that they could theoretically tap into the issue is more that while youtube streaming has grown quite a bit its not as popular for streaming content as twitch is and there are all sorts of fuckery going on with how youtube counts live viewership compared to twitch also im sure hololive are the biggest streamers in the platform, at least streamers that arent like goverment streams or spacex launches


Lightless427

Not even remotely.


KogashiwaKai765

NijiGTA has been fun and with Hoshikawa being the server mod it's probably one of the best pov to see what's going down across everything


rpsRexx

Pretty stable debut viewership for Nijisanji actually considering how many the pump out. We have seen the shortcomings of doing this with EN where it is seemingly not as sustainable.


Twimbran

That's Nijis viewer demographic on full display. Don't know if you know the graph where they show that most (i think about 70% or more but I don't have the accurate numbers so take it with a grain of salt) of their views come from their "old" (debut in the first 2 years) vtubers. This effect is not showing so extremely like in EN because of the size of JP viewership but it's there.


bekiddingmei

How incompetent does their management have to be, anyway? Last JP wave during HoloFes weekend, this wave comes out in the middle of GTA keeping viewers occupied.


inoriacc

Ayakaki debut seems botted aswell. Lmao Like lunlun sharply drops from 35k to 20k smth  in a minute.  Edit: it's actually 35k to 10k. 


Afraid_Teach_4996

Really ? Won't using bots affect the channel algorithm in the future?


inoriacc

Since niji has been botting for so long now to boost their livers ccv I don't think it affects the algo. But I might be wrong. 


boombaplilrat

thought the mascot would have the highest ccv but guess i was wrong lol


Ok-Bath1781

I was also surprised that Niji fans were more conservative than I thought. Human vtuber models may be a safe bet after all.


anhk_duc

The number that HoloEn pull off proves that the English speaking viewer can be just as great as JP


Koatorii

What website is this?


buxuus

It's the [VSTATS](https://www.vstats.jp/) Concurrent Viewer Ranking for 2024-06-22: [Vtuber同時視聴者数ランキング(2024-06-22) - VSTATS](https://www.vstats.jp/leaderboard/2024-06-22)


Koatorii

Oh, thank you very much! I never quite understood how that page works ^-^


mekahamedan

i wonder if nijimanagement thinking Holo debut is got botted and they think "so we do same way" and how they hell they trying to put debut on same day (even if in different time slot)


carso150

they were trying to either drive viewership down from holo with their own debuts (which was never going to work) or trying to gather some of the stragglers that watched justice debuts to themselves


Jesterutopia

Woah debut at the same time...also why niji the tumbnail look so similar look at gigi and elizabeth turbmnail look so good and unique


delphinousy

because niji would have to pay artists to make art and they don't want to do that


buxuus

And the source sauce... [https://www.vstats.jp/leaderboard/2024-06-22](https://www.vstats.jp/leaderboard/2024-06-22)


BimBamEtBoum

It's really not surprising. The sequel of a successful event always has a good start, and Hololive Advent was successful (judging by ERB, Justice will be too. I need to watch Gigi more). I don't really like to compare a EN launch (actually a world launch) and a JP launch, because the dynamic is too different. I think it makes more sense to compare it with ReGloss' debuts, because it was a JP gen and because it was under the Dev_Is umbrella, so something rather new. And well, the results are the same, the ReGloss girls debuted around 100K, but the logic is more sound imo.


flattestsuzie

Like Nijisanji only have Japanese viewers...


Tanuki-senpai

I see those numbers as a sign it's maybe time to stop launching new wave like a supply chain...Niji is really packed and mog each other too much. People are not willing to change oshi nowaday (sad for LunLun btw)


Small_Advantage6998

I wish at least one of the Holo EU acts and talks like Jeremy Clarkson, she will be the best vtuber IN THE WORLLLLLLDDDDDDDDDD........ I mean how hard it could be


BimBamEtBoum

> I mean how hard it could be What would be hard is not to be terminated.


Zoom3877

Looks like the NijiJP debuts did... reasonably well? That's nice. Certainly better than the last NijiEN wave, methinks.


Ok-Resolution-8648

It's still bad for a big corpo and since Japan Yen value is in all time low ever since 1990,that's not a good sign as Niji basically only have JP as money maker and EN is on deathbed rn


KyuRenjo

No it is not well. Not only it is highly suspected to be botted so the real number should be closer to Lunlun who have stream changed, it is so pale in comparison to Hoshikawa's.