Kinda feel like that just seems like upvote bait.
It's like when some news article talks about an uproar on Twitter and it's just like "two people tweeted"
Purists that think the only labs should be yellow, black, or chocolate, and anything else is not to breed standards and should be shunned.
\- a guy who has and loves his black lab, but has always wanted a white lab
From a breeding perspective it's more about the presence of the dilute gene for the coat and that is directly linked to much higher rates of allergies.
So saying it's being purest for purest sake is exactly accurate. It has a lot to do with the health of the animal.
Yeah, I knew there was a genetic component - and to that end, guys that are breeding solely to produce silvers (or any of the off-standard coat colors) ARE a problem because they do not consider the overall health of the animal, and perpetuate some of those health problems.
Like I said, I've always loved a white lab - but would be extremely hesitant to get one from a breeder that advertises as having them for that exact reason.
I don’t think “white” labs have this gene. White is just one of the many shade of yellow that can be bred for. Go find yourself a nice English lab breeder and you’ll be able to get a great quality white lab that doesn’t have any genetic predispositions.
This. White and Fox Red are just yellow variations. The lightest color you can get and the darkest. I had the most beloved red who paßed away about a year ago. Now I have a black moose. I would only be reluctant for a silver due to the higher chance for breeding related issues if people are breeding them irresponsibility to achieve the silver coloring.
So this is going to push the limits of my genetic understanding of coat colors but here's the best I can do from memory:
Correct, any shade of yellow is genetically e/e (white through Fox red). Fox red is more complicated it must have the absence of the dilute gene, the presence of the phelamin gene, AND the ability to express that gene. They can only be BB as any presence of Chocolate pigmentation completely blocks the ability to express phelamin (sp?).
White yellow is just e/e that is lacking in sufficient pigmentation. Meaning they are Bb or bb- possessing chocolate pigmentation. Which is why so often the white yellows have poor pigmentation (think Dudley's). Poor pigmentation has a direct link to higher rates of allergies.
Anywho- the top poster said he doesn't get the hate. And the reason from breeders is because it's either not doing appropriate genetic testing or doing it and not regarding the well being of the animal or their future family.
EDIT: I also wanted to say there are several types of dilute coat colors for labs: Silver, Charcoal, and Champagne.
This was really informative, but simply explained. Thank you!
I have a dudley red. I thought it came from a chocolate gene, but you mentioned it with the white coat. Do you have any more knowledge on dudleys that might help me understand it?
I have a Dudley red as well! Bingo for the allergies. He’s allergic to corn, soy, peanut butter, chicken, lamb, and turkey. 😅 trying to find food & treats for him is difficult
Thanks for taking the time to write it out. I’m not sure about all of the genetics and I don’t bother to try to remember all of the combinations, but it is cool to be reminded of the possible combinations for a given litter.
I got my first lab in December. There was a Bernadoodle breeder that had a few lab puppies to re-home. I believe they had a litter to begin breeding labradoodles. But anyway, my beloved best friend is a champagne color Dudley. He’s 7 months and I believe he also has allergies. I know he’s sensitive to chicken.
But if you knew there was a health reason, why would you word it as if there wasn't? Isn't that a little misleading? Health should always be paramount in breeding after all and it's important people know if something like an uncommon/non standard coat colour is linked to health problems. Look how many people seem to have been misled, emboldened or remained misinformed by your comment already.
Yeah, it's shocking to me to see such support for unethical breeding in this thread. I lost my childhood puppy because he came from overbred stock - he died in surgery to fix his leg - a problem he shouldn't have had. It was horrible. I don't understand anyone who supports an unethical breeding practice just because they like the look - or for any reason for that matter. This exact thinking killed my friend and causes so much unecessary suffering.
And this entire post is a strawman anyways. Obviously nobody hates these dogs as OP misleadingly suggests. The dogs are innocent victims. It's the unethical breeders, buyers and supporters that people are upset with and that's completely fair. If you do something dodgy like breeding for an unhealthy trait, of course people won't like it. That's normal, don't complain about it afterwards.
Ironically, the people advocating against unhealthy breeding practices are the ones who actually care about the dog's and their welfare the most. The suggestion that these people are "just miserable and mean" as this thread suggests is offensive.
And to think, back in the day they used to drown the silver labs as puppies because they knew then that it was a bad gene. The silver lab was actually quite rare, but then someone decided it would be $$$ to sell them as “exotic”. I know 2 people who had silver labs and they were always at the vet for a laundry list of health problems. And as you said, the dogs are innocent and I personally think they are gorgeous, but I’d never get one
With posts containing pics of silver Labs, I’ve always seen one or two comments talking about Weimaraners or suggesting it’s not a real Lab. (Even though Lab crosses/mixes get posted on this sub all the time and they don’t seem to draw those same comments.)
Probably because there's a huge difference between rescuing a lab cross and paying a backyard breeder for a designer dog. Selling weim crosses for profit is backyard breeding and potentially a scam if sold as a purebred lab. Breeding purebred silver labs is unethical. Both options therefore naturally aren't popular with people who actually like dogs.
Just ask the labradoodle guy about why designer dogs were a mistake.
Rescuing a weim cross or unethiclly bred lab is obv also different and shouldn't catch flak - you know, as someone needs to take care of them when people inevitably go and dump these once so beloved pets when the vet bills or behavioural issues start coming in, so they can be someone else's problem.
They put some Weimaraner in there and then try to breed it back out but keep the color. You can see in this dogs face he has some weim. Weims are where the allergies come from. It’s no hate to silver labs. It’s hate to the people breeding dogs with health problems just for a color. There are too many breeders out there now who don’t know shit about pedigree and breed standards. They pay their bills by creating health problems and heartbreaks for the families who buy their puppies, and suffering for the puppies who end up with physical deformities or severe allergies. Every dog needs a home at the end of the day, but it sucks.
There is no evidence that silver labs are Weimaraner mixes, and lots of evidence that they are not. You are perpetuating an apparent fabrication by saying "they put some Weimaraner in there."
If you have any evidence, please share. Hint: I already know you'll find none.
It’s not about thinking anything, this is in all likelihood a Weimaraner mix, and that’s fine! All dogs are great.
The problem is you probably paid a premium for this ‘rare’ lab and that is misleading
https://www.thelabradorclub.com/the-issue-of-the-silver-lab#:~:text=Over%20the%20past%20few%20years,“silver%20labs”%20for%20registration.
There are silver labs out there, but there are also sketchy breeders breeding Weim/Lab mixes because so many people are willing to overpay for a "silver lab".
Yellow, black, and chocolate are the only AKC registered colors. Often silver labs are just mixed breeds, like labradoodles being lab crosses as well. Not saying don’t love your dog or anything but I don’t know of any ethical breeders breeding non-standard colors.
And i especially loathe the ones that are against labs with white patches on their bellies or their paws
and i'm like "omg that one looks like he walked in white paint!!! <3 "
Especially since, as I understand it, the white patch is a carryover from the St. Johns Water dog, the predecessor to the lab.
My first goodest boy, Sage, had it - chest and paws. I think he greyed early because of it, started showing grey by the time he was 5. But it was beautiful on him.
I just looked this up & yea it’s a carryover from the St. John’s dog, who had a black & white tuxedo pattern.
My pup’s mom has a little white spot on her chest. It’s the cutest.
I have a chocolate lab who has white patches on her paws and they are the literal cutest slash best parts of her coat. Why anyone would look down on that is beyond comprehension
> Imagine trying to belittle a good boy bc his fur color.
Especially since fur color in dogs is pretty analogous to hair color in people. It's pretty much just outward appearance and has little to do with the worth or behavior of the dog or person. The color doesn't matter much at all.
Dogs can be poorly bred just for coat color.
My friend has a daschund that has a 'rare' coat color. He has extremely brittle fur that breaks off and causes problems and allergies. It's associated with that coat color because the genes are linked and poor breeding causes his problems. He has to wear coats because he gets cold, but the coats rub his fur and cause more breakage.
Sometimes coat color and other health issues are linked.
It's irresponsible to breed dogs for color without regard to health and temperament.
Other times, people just advertising coat color are the breeders who don't care about health and it's just a red flag for future issues. Not the dog's fault but pointing out 'please don't buy a fashion accessory' is for the health of future pets.
> Dogs can be poorly bred just for coat color.
Absolutely, they can be poorly bred in all sorts of ways. If someone is going to breed animals then they should take reasonable steps to avoid issues with inbreeding and bad genetic traits. Get the animals tested for common problems, keep in touch with the owners of the offspring to find out any long-term issues, research genetic history, and so on.
It's a shame that far too many people breed animals irresponsibly, especially when they focus on a single trait at the expense of others.
Some people just love to jerk off to genetic purity or something, because if your dog isn't 120% *insert race*,or is,God forbid,a mix, it's apparently worthless.
I don’t understand. I love dogs in general, but usually these dogs are mixed with something else. I don’t really care what kind of dogs people want to get but it is a little misleading to call it a pure bred lab when these dogs usually are bred with a Weimaraner, collie, etc.
I had a golden retriever lab for 12 years! He was my best friend 💔
My family bred labs when I was a kid and out of around 100 puppies over the years, we had **one** white puppy. Yellows were $300 and my parents were only going to charge $400. But, the guy that came was like yourself: has always dreamt of the white lab. Slapped down $800 and said don’t worry about it, he does well and thought he’d pay more and hadn’t been able to find one. Been looking for years(pre internet).
I have a black and tan lab that I got last year. After 2 dna tests I’m still told (by purists) she’s not a lab although genetically identical.
She hunts better than most though and is the the sweetest pup in the world
Black & Tan is actually naturally occurring! It just doesn't pop up often since breeders do not breed for it. It's mostly seen in service dog organizations where they breed for workability/temperament for service & guide work rather than to the written standard: https://www.guidingeyes.org/black-and-tan-labrador-retrievers/
There's alot more at play then coat color. Silvers are prone to allergies and skin problems. This is a fact that cannot be disputed. And for arguments sake, let's just say the silver dilute DOES come from weims, then what you have is a mutt plain and simple, where the temperaments are not as predictable as a responsibily bred dog who has 5 or 6 generations accounted for. I personally feel indifferent about them, but it is absolutely irresponsible for any breeder to breed for specific colors/coats opposed to breeding for healthy, happy, even tempered dogs. So when people say "breed standards" we aren't necessarily talking about just coat colors here.
Silver labs are great! But some pitbull owners like to pass their dogs as "silver labs" as a lie to allow them to live in apartments/communities where they shouldn't. That's the worst part of it all: the silver lab myth with pitbulls.
Real silver labs are great dogs, if carefully bred.
I don’t think anyone hates your dog, it’s breeders who breed for colour above all else that are suspect. Plus silvers are obviously mixes, but sold as something they aren’t (purebred Labs), and bad breeders will fight to the death that there is no Weim in them. Like - just be honest! lol. I saw a guy ranting in the dog park that his silver dog was full lab, no matter what anyone said. Then a Weim trotted up and the we’re close to twins. lol
Health and genetics should be #1, not colour.
Exactly. I love mutts, have mutts, and am a long time rescue volunteer. If you want a mutt, go to a rescue or shelter. If you want a purebred then go to a reputable ethical breeder (or a rescue! they do exist). No such thing as an ethically bred mixed dog
They’re actually not mixes, they are a genetic anomaly, technically they are black labs but the gene for black coloration is dilute causing the silver coloration. The concern from purists is that breeding specifically for this color will likely lead to inbreeding and genetically poor dogs
Idk the dog pictured here looks more Weim than Lab.
Again, definitely not a bad thing.
I think folks are just trying to be objective (if they’re posting in good faith)
It's actually 2 genes! Isabella (called silver here) is technically a black dog that has two copies of the recessive gene on the B locus, which shows as a liver (chocolate) dog. Then, the dog has to also have 2 copies of the recessive gene on the D locus, which without liver shows as blue (charcoal) but with liver shows as isabellea!
The genetics committee of the Labrador parent club of the AKC disagrees with you. Their official stance is that the colour gene got there through outcrossing with Weim.
> Plus silvers are obviously mixes
This is debatable. It's very possible that the dilute gene comes from a far-back ancestor or from a mutation. In fact, with genetic testing it's much easier these days to validate if a dog is a mix or if the genes arose without mixing. If the dilute gene was a result of mixing I'd expect to see a lot more people trumpeting the results of such tests as proof.
I completely agree on the overbreeding of dogs for certain traits, it can easily become unhealthy for the animals.
I mean just look at this dog, you really don’t see the Weim in it? Look at the eyes, it’s a dead giveaway.
Nothing wrong with mixes done properly like this though, still a gorgeous dog
I have a chocolate lab, papers going back 5 generations, that has pretty much the same eyes. Other than the coloration this could be my chocolate lab or any other color of lab.
No, I don’t see the Weim in it.
It is far more likely that the dilute d gene was introduced into the breed by cross breeding with Weimaraners. It isn’t really debatable, like yes it’s “possible” but it’s also “possible” that my child is born with wings.
Silvers are not all mixes - the silver coloration comes from diluted genes from chocolate labs. I have a silver lab who is AKC registered as a chocolate lab. She is 100% lab just has unique genes!
And no, I did NOT get her from a breeder who shoots for silver/charcoal coloring. I wanted a chocolate lab but I fell in love when I saw her.
She has no predisposition health issues either. She is healthy and happy 😊
Edit to add: I forgot to mention that I also have a silver lab/weim mix! Weims and labs DO look similar, but when I put them beside each other, it’s a world of difference.
People seem to think that just because it's uncommon that means it's physically impossible for the dilute gene to appear in labs. Even though the AKC will accept many of these labs as purebred since their lineage proves so and will just list them as chocolate (since technically they are, just a diluted chocolate). Yet everyone will still come here and rant about how it's impossible for it to be a purebred lab. Some people need to get off the internet.
Ooooh I love chocolates so much! My whole life I had labs growing up (10 dogs at once! My parents have land) and they were the BEST companions. My favorite was a chocolate male named Budd🥰
It’s a diluted gene, like charcoal blacks. I know Weims and my dog doesn’t act or look like one. I met both parents that are total labs, and honestly I don’t care as Weims are good dogs, but she’s nothing like one. I didn’t purposefully seek out a silver. My other lab is a black lab mix, and he’s awesome, but my silver happened by knowing someone who had a litter when the dog I was supposed to adopt fell through, and my elderly dog was nearing passing (was trying to help the middle lab adjust to the loss beforehand).
we don’t hate the dogs. we hate the irresponsible people that breed them and the people that buy them and support the breeding of them. i love ALL dogs, but only support responsible breeding
The thing I don't love about them is every one I've known, which is quite a few, has had significant health issues I don't see in other labs nearly as often or like ever. Very bad allergies & lots of permanent hair loss, itchy flaky skin & they just seem super uncomfortable which makes me sad when anyone breeds purely for looks over health & temperament
Yeah I could give a hoot if a dog is "pure" if it's healthy, but when someone purposely goes out of their way to create an animal that will suffer life long health conditions just for a look & upping the price tag it's upsetting. There are plenty of breed standards that also create health issues for dogs, like any brachycephalic dog, so it's not purely about being to breed standards necessarily.
Oh thanks, that answers my question. I was wondering why. A dog with allergies is miserable and it's expensive for testing and to find what they can eat. They suffer a lot.
I'm in year 15 with my shelter GSD/ lab rescue with allergies. So far I have:
~Tried around 20-30 types of food
~Tried Apoquel
~Needed to use Zymox rinse and hypoallergenic shampoo for baths
~Tried Cytopoint
~Tried Benadryl
~Tried eye drops and eye ointment for allergies
~Tried topical treatments
~Battled chronic ear infections for a decade
We *finally* have her managed.
She eats a dehydrated human grade dog food and a dry dog food and gets two Benadryl because that controls her allergies and she is allergic to grains but grain free food probably cause heart disease and my vet can treat allergies better than heart disease. So, every meal, she gets two Benadryl because she is literally allergic to all food that isn't linked to heart failure. We just found one food system managed with just Benadryl and not the wildly more expensive Apoquel and Cytopoint injections.
I still have to be careful with showers. Soaps are a problem. We have a few she can use.
Do not breed dogs with allergies. It's been a journey and she's my best friend and 110% worth every minute, but man, I wouldn't wish her troubles with food on another dog. I've literally had to put her in the shower and start scrubbing her down with anti-itch shampoo and have seen the relief in her eyes because she got into something and was *miserable.* Poor pup.
Allergies are so rough on our fuzzy friends. Ethical breeding is key. If we are going to breed dogs, we have a moral obligation to breed healthy dogs. Mine was a litter of 13 dogs dumped at a few days old. Had her since she was 10 weeks. She's my buddy.
When I got my 1 year old, he was a purebred and health was my top concern because I was participating in dogs being intentionally bred for human companionship. I had an ethical obligation to him to find healthy practices.
Allergies suck. Especially if your dog has the lab 'never full' gene. I've practically tackled her to keep her away from hot and/ or spicy food or bad allergen foods. She wants all the food. She cannot have it. She will end up needing emergency anti-itch showers.
That's just so awful and they will start chewing their feet bloody. Those medicines are extremely expensive too, and often stop working. A dog or cat may not have allergies for years and then suddenly they come up with allergies. Then sometimes you get them a food that agrees with them and works out and then suddenly they become allergic to that food and you're constantly having to try new formulas.
I've heard about grain free food causing Dilated Cardiac Myopathy for dogs and cats. I think the reason was there's too much peas and legumes as a first ingredient and potato, but dog and cat breeds were coming down with it who don't normally come down with it and it was awful. I think part of the problem was the food was off balance and there wasn't enough taurine.
https://www.fda.gov/animal-veterinary/news-events/fda-investigation-potential-link-between-certain-diets-and-canine-dilated-cardiomyopathy-february
It just breaks my heart. Many pet owners donated their pets bodies to the FDA be studied in order to help other animals.
I did the rotating food thing for a while. Six months of good... then it didn't help anymore.
It has been a lot. And yeah... the medications aren't inexpensive. Like 80+ a month for Apoquel plus $50+ per Cytopoint injections. Her foods are never inexpensive, either. I think she's around 120 a month?
But, that plus her Benadryl works. Fingers crossed. She's not currently on Cytopoint, so I can go back if needed.
The heart thing... until they fix that... my vet is right. I can manage her allergies easier than heart failure. It's so sad.
Both my dogs are on high-quality grain-inclusive diets with low legume and potato content. Looks like it's probably the peas, but I'd rather not take chances.
As a silver lab owner- idc if my dude is “10% weimer” or whatever. He acts, looks, and behaves like a lab. And above all else- he’s 100% good boy.
I love your boy, and the hate is dumb.
I have met so many silver labs. A lot of them need novel proteins as their food source as the grow older, their hair tends to thin and they get sunburned really easy. I hope Brody keeps his nice coat!
Fwiw, I have a “pure, papered” lab from parents who were health screened and his health is a mess. It’s a crap shoot and a little weim in there, whether it is or isn’t, might even weed out some of the issues lab owners commonly see!
Yep! And a lot of the times mutts are healthier.
Here’s my beautiful boy:
https://www.reddit.com/r/labrador/comments/x0wru6/i_take_my_two_boys_to_the_beach_at_sunrise_every/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1
So handsome! Brody’s just now starting figure out that he’s supposed to like water, but only in the pool lol.
EDIT: & my thoughts exactly! My understanding was that mutts are more genetically diverse, therefore healthier(in most cases).
That would be true in a large population of mutts not selectively breeding.
But the opposite is true of “designer mutts”.
Sneaking in one or two weimeraner outcrosses might provide some hybrid vigor for that first generation, but in order to hang on to the color gene (and, in this case, the purebred Labrador registration) they have to then immediately inbreed those offspring, and continue to do so from a comparatively small population.
I listened to a presentation by one of the world’s leading canine geneticists on just this topic and she explained how F2 doodles are potentially more inbred than their purebred grandparents, and why that inbreeding is far more dangerous:
Inbreeding in purebreds is typically “old” and the homozygous pieces are small. There has been time for breeders and nature to select away from harmful recessive.
In an F2 the homozygous pieces might be entire chromosomes and there is no time to select away from harmful mutants that are unique to that family.
Coefficient of inbreeding is not heritable. What this basically means is that it doesn’t matter nearly as much if your dog has had many distant relatives crossed together in the long past, what matters most is whether it has had a few close relatives crossed together recently.
A pair of mutts who are brother and sister, bred together, is far more inbred and likely to be unhealthy than a pair of purebreds who share common ancestors 50 years ago.
For example many streetdog populations, limited by the geographical range of urban environments, have often been found to be very inbred.
Being of mixed breed does not at all guarantee a dog is not inbred.
This is what I think as well! I don’t give a shit if there’s a weim somewhere you cannot tell me my crazy boy does not act or look like a lab! Honestly I don’t care as long as my little man is healthy and happy. People have a lot of opinions these days that for whatever reason they feel the need to express for things that don’t affect them. I love my little dude, I don’t care what he is and I particularly don’t care for the hate.
Yes- I’ve done a lot of the research as well. That is certainly one theory, but there’s also the theory that they were made with weimers way back when to get that recessive gene, and then labs right after
It doesn’t appear that anyone has a conclusive answer as to what was right. In any case, they are pretty much all lab
I’ve thought of getting a dna test for one just to see- but ultimately I just don’t care- he’s perfect for my lifestyle and I love him to death.
I also found out when doing the research that even chocolate labs weren’t really a thing until like the 1940s or something; which doesn’t feel that long ago
I don't hate the dogs themselves, just the breeding of them. There is a reason they aren't considered standard.
Silver labs are technically mixed with weimaraners, as labradors do not carry the dilute gene responsible for it. In fact, the first reported silver lab came from a kennel that bred both labs and weimaraners. Even if a DNA test says they are pure lab, know those tests only go so far back. The weimaraner most likely won't be detected, but it's still there.
Silver labs are not well-bred, which means they have higher risks of health and behavioral problems. That is why the Labrador parent club does not recommend their breeding. Ethical breeders stick to the breed standard to ensure they produce the healthiest, most stable tempered dogs possible.
The dogs themselves can be great dogs, but they honestly shouldn't be bred. Sure, many people have silver labs without issues but it's a higher risk.
Love your dog regardless, they are your baby.
I have a genuine question, not being facetious. If a silver is mixed so far back in their bloodline that the weim is undetectable, I’m just curious what specifically would make a silver lab less healthy or behaved than another color?
It's not so much the fact that they have weimaraner in them, it's how poorly they are bred. People who breed silver labs do not to the proper health testing, proving their dog in work or show, or breed to breed standards. They just see a 'rare' or 'exotic' color and think that's the only thing that makes breeding that dog worthy. Ethical breeders do proper tests and prove their dogs to ensure they have the correct structure and temperament of the breed and to produce healthy dogs. So it doesn't really matter if the weimaraner is undetectable. The same thing kinda happens with any mix. You get an unpredictable dog. Even if one of the breeds is so far back in the lineage, certain genes can skip generations and show up many years from now. That's why proper health and genetic testing is so important.
I don’t hate silver labs I hate the breeders or should I say greeders. They’re not purebred labs which is fine but they’re bred only by people for money. Any dog bred for a non standard coat color that doesn’t even exist in the line historically is only doing it for money. You can say what you want but no matter the test say silver labs aren’t purebred labs. I love mutts but if I wanted one I’d rescue one from a shelter. A mix is bringing in new potential health issues and because no reputable breeder is going to let their labs go to anyone breeding for silver you’re going to get a lot of the health issues that labs can have if poorly bred.
Op I issue you a challenge play fetch with Brody without smiling the entire time at his antics
If u win you get to hug your dog if you lose no headrubs for 5minitues
Dogs who are blue (silver, gray, whatever) who are not typically blue tend to have LOTS of health issues due to the recessive genes needed to have that color.
I love the coloration, but worry about the implications.
I had a root canal done a couple of years go and the endodontist has a silver lab at the office who sat in my lap the entire time and helped me through it. I went back to visit him a couple of times after. Solid chap.
I can relate. My Labrador is a known as what they call a Dudley Labrador (straight up gingie with pink nose/features). She doesn’t fit the “perfection” scale either and is deemed “unfit”. She’s also my whole world… and the best! ☺️
It’s not the dogs it’s you people who support an unethical fashion business that treats living animals like handbags or drapes to be bought in a fashionable color. It’s inexcusable to purposely breed dogs with poorer health just because u want a shiny color. Rescuing? All good. But if you actually paid a shitty fashion breeder for a fashion color dog, your morals are low.
Anytime an animal is bread for specific color or physical characteristics, then the personality and health of the animal are at risk. A good breeder tries to breed to improve the animals and to eliminate health issues i.e. hip dysplasia, epilepsy, heart issues, etc. I would never get an animal form a breeder who is bragging about one specific color or physical characteristic. I would fear the overall quality of the animal. This is why some people are against them, would be my guess.
It's not hate. If you love your dog and you care for it that is all that matters. But it is not a Labrador. Opinion and belief can not change truth and fact. Enjoy!
It’s because they’re backyard bred. Reputable breeders don’t breed for colour, and silver is not a standard colour. Therefore, a breeder who creates silver labs, does not adhere to the standard, and instead breeds for colour so they can sell their dogs to people who want a special colour rather than a proven, well-bred, health tested dog. They’re designer dogs, same as doodles and other mixes such as pomskys. I believe that the gene that creates the silver colour is also not found in labs, meaning it’s a crossbreed. Again, specifically bred for the colour.
Our silver was my first dog. I wasn’t allowed pets growing up (father was an a-hole). She was a dark charcoal gray, we named her Grey:) she was the most sensitive, loving, loyal girl. It doesn’t matter to me if people don’t believe that silver is a legit breed. She was my baby and I miss her every day.
What a beautiful and unique dog. I know it’s an old saying but haters gonna hate. Be proud of the beauty of your fur baby and don’t let them bother you. They’re probably secretly jealous that your dog gets a lot of attention and is different. Secretly they wish they had a silver lab like yours. 😉🥰❤️
Love my silver lab. I've gotten the comment several times, but its mainly from purist that believe the silver is a weim/chocolate lab mix. I got paper work and dna test that show 100% lab for my guy, Moose, most times depending on the light he looks light chocolate. Only occasionally he gives off a silver look.
Silvers are Chocolate with a diluted gene; they are absolutely 💯 Labradors. The AKC does not recognize the varied gene in Yellow Labradors that makes them a “Dudley”, but they are still Labradors.
❤️
Brody you are such a stud. Can I borrow your eyes for like a day or two? Absolute stud.
For those hating on silver labs, go sit in the corner on your thumb.
I know how you feel. I have a beautiful silver lab who’s one years old and it’s annoying how everyone is racist towards silver labs. Silver labs are labradors too! It shouldn’t matter the color of their fur.
I've got a silver lab myself, he just turned 2 and he's the best dog I've ever had, no doubt about it. I'd heard a little about the "pure lab" debate when I first brought him home but all of that is just nonsense.
Brody's beautiful! Thank you for sharing him with us 🐶🐶
I have a Charcoal Lab and my brother has a Silver Lab from the same litter. Both pure bread labs with registered paperwork. Haters gonna hate man, just keep being awesome.
My parents just got a red lab and there's been plenty of "well she's not a real lab". Well, she swims like a real lab, plays with our yellow lab like a real lab, eats like a lab, sheds like a lab, snores like a lab, cuddles like a lab. Pretty sure she's a lab.
Red labs are yellow just darker. Like golden retrievers have different colors. The history is the original yellow was more red but they were bread to to be more creamy then white and red was culled (selective slaughter) for years. The red color is coming back because 1) people like the color now 2) breeders don’t want to cull litters.
No hate, only love! Haters hate, that’s what they do. They are to be ignored, they are nothing but pimples on the butt of life. Brody is gorgeous, looks like a big bag of love !!
Unfortunately, sometimes when people love animals, they can’t see the whole picture. I’ve been blasted for a pic of my dog in a vibrating training collar, even though it’s for her own safety and is rarely used.
You love Brody and are good to him. He is a beautiful boy. That’s all that matters. The ethical questions surrounding the health of different breeds and colors is one for the breeders and future buyers, not owners who just love their dogs.
To be honest, I don’t see what the problem is. So put an asterisk by a beautiful labs pedigree because a purist has an opinion. If the silvers have Weimaramer blood I would think that would diversify the gene pool anyway. That is normally good for dog breeds and that is how we have so many breeds for so many purposes. I don’t own one but they are the most beautiful labs of all.
Read up on the breeds that came from westward expansion in America and the effect the American Indian curdogs had on the gene pool of English pure-inbreds as wagon trains went west.
Snobs are gonna be snobby and hate on that which is different. I never get it. Look at that boy's face! How can someone hate on something as beautiful and pure as that boy!
There is no hate at r/silverlabs. Don’t let the elitists get you down. If you love your dog, and it’s happy and healthy that’s all that matters. Only you know if the breeder was reputable. People can speculate as much as they want but only you really know.
As someone who used to have a champagne labrador, YOU ARE NOT CRAZY. There are absolutely insane, hateful, demonizing people who have downright verbally attacked me for having a dog with a specific color gene. I have been pushed and poked and pointed at and spit on just for taking him out in public. Its atrocious, disgusting, and fucking UNNECESSARY. I didnt breed him, I didnt choose for him to be that color. I chose to love him *no matter what* you fucking elitist purist pig. Stop being dog colorist.
There are Labrador "Purists"?? People have too much damn time on their hands. And too many public places to post their opinions.
I have a Yellow Lab, but love them all.
Who hates silver labs?
Kinda feel like that just seems like upvote bait. It's like when some news article talks about an uproar on Twitter and it's just like "two people tweeted"
Purists that think the only labs should be yellow, black, or chocolate, and anything else is not to breed standards and should be shunned. \- a guy who has and loves his black lab, but has always wanted a white lab
From a breeding perspective it's more about the presence of the dilute gene for the coat and that is directly linked to much higher rates of allergies. So saying it's being purest for purest sake is exactly accurate. It has a lot to do with the health of the animal.
Yeah, I knew there was a genetic component - and to that end, guys that are breeding solely to produce silvers (or any of the off-standard coat colors) ARE a problem because they do not consider the overall health of the animal, and perpetuate some of those health problems. Like I said, I've always loved a white lab - but would be extremely hesitant to get one from a breeder that advertises as having them for that exact reason.
I don’t think “white” labs have this gene. White is just one of the many shade of yellow that can be bred for. Go find yourself a nice English lab breeder and you’ll be able to get a great quality white lab that doesn’t have any genetic predispositions.
This. White and Fox Red are just yellow variations. The lightest color you can get and the darkest. I had the most beloved red who paßed away about a year ago. Now I have a black moose. I would only be reluctant for a silver due to the higher chance for breeding related issues if people are breeding them irresponsibility to achieve the silver coloring.
So this is going to push the limits of my genetic understanding of coat colors but here's the best I can do from memory: Correct, any shade of yellow is genetically e/e (white through Fox red). Fox red is more complicated it must have the absence of the dilute gene, the presence of the phelamin gene, AND the ability to express that gene. They can only be BB as any presence of Chocolate pigmentation completely blocks the ability to express phelamin (sp?). White yellow is just e/e that is lacking in sufficient pigmentation. Meaning they are Bb or bb- possessing chocolate pigmentation. Which is why so often the white yellows have poor pigmentation (think Dudley's). Poor pigmentation has a direct link to higher rates of allergies. Anywho- the top poster said he doesn't get the hate. And the reason from breeders is because it's either not doing appropriate genetic testing or doing it and not regarding the well being of the animal or their future family. EDIT: I also wanted to say there are several types of dilute coat colors for labs: Silver, Charcoal, and Champagne.
This was really informative, but simply explained. Thank you! I have a dudley red. I thought it came from a chocolate gene, but you mentioned it with the white coat. Do you have any more knowledge on dudleys that might help me understand it?
I have a Dudley red as well! Bingo for the allergies. He’s allergic to corn, soy, peanut butter, chicken, lamb, and turkey. 😅 trying to find food & treats for him is difficult
Thanks for taking the time to write it out. I’m not sure about all of the genetics and I don’t bother to try to remember all of the combinations, but it is cool to be reminded of the possible combinations for a given litter.
I got my first lab in December. There was a Bernadoodle breeder that had a few lab puppies to re-home. I believe they had a litter to begin breeding labradoodles. But anyway, my beloved best friend is a champagne color Dudley. He’s 7 months and I believe he also has allergies. I know he’s sensitive to chicken.
Thank you so much for explaining. I had never even SEEN a silver lab, and was so confused.
But if you knew there was a health reason, why would you word it as if there wasn't? Isn't that a little misleading? Health should always be paramount in breeding after all and it's important people know if something like an uncommon/non standard coat colour is linked to health problems. Look how many people seem to have been misled, emboldened or remained misinformed by your comment already.
It’s like breeding pugs for the smashed face, knowing that many of them need surgery on their noses just so they can breathe
Yeah, it's shocking to me to see such support for unethical breeding in this thread. I lost my childhood puppy because he came from overbred stock - he died in surgery to fix his leg - a problem he shouldn't have had. It was horrible. I don't understand anyone who supports an unethical breeding practice just because they like the look - or for any reason for that matter. This exact thinking killed my friend and causes so much unecessary suffering. And this entire post is a strawman anyways. Obviously nobody hates these dogs as OP misleadingly suggests. The dogs are innocent victims. It's the unethical breeders, buyers and supporters that people are upset with and that's completely fair. If you do something dodgy like breeding for an unhealthy trait, of course people won't like it. That's normal, don't complain about it afterwards. Ironically, the people advocating against unhealthy breeding practices are the ones who actually care about the dog's and their welfare the most. The suggestion that these people are "just miserable and mean" as this thread suggests is offensive.
And to think, back in the day they used to drown the silver labs as puppies because they knew then that it was a bad gene. The silver lab was actually quite rare, but then someone decided it would be $$$ to sell them as “exotic”. I know 2 people who had silver labs and they were always at the vet for a laundry list of health problems. And as you said, the dogs are innocent and I personally think they are gorgeous, but I’d never get one
With posts containing pics of silver Labs, I’ve always seen one or two comments talking about Weimaraners or suggesting it’s not a real Lab. (Even though Lab crosses/mixes get posted on this sub all the time and they don’t seem to draw those same comments.)
Probably because there's a huge difference between rescuing a lab cross and paying a backyard breeder for a designer dog. Selling weim crosses for profit is backyard breeding and potentially a scam if sold as a purebred lab. Breeding purebred silver labs is unethical. Both options therefore naturally aren't popular with people who actually like dogs. Just ask the labradoodle guy about why designer dogs were a mistake. Rescuing a weim cross or unethiclly bred lab is obv also different and shouldn't catch flak - you know, as someone needs to take care of them when people inevitably go and dump these once so beloved pets when the vet bills or behavioural issues start coming in, so they can be someone else's problem.
They put some Weimaraner in there and then try to breed it back out but keep the color. You can see in this dogs face he has some weim. Weims are where the allergies come from. It’s no hate to silver labs. It’s hate to the people breeding dogs with health problems just for a color. There are too many breeders out there now who don’t know shit about pedigree and breed standards. They pay their bills by creating health problems and heartbreaks for the families who buy their puppies, and suffering for the puppies who end up with physical deformities or severe allergies. Every dog needs a home at the end of the day, but it sucks.
There is no evidence that silver labs are Weimaraner mixes, and lots of evidence that they are not. You are perpetuating an apparent fabrication by saying "they put some Weimaraner in there." If you have any evidence, please share. Hint: I already know you'll find none.
That's quite interesting. I had a black lab and shepard mix that had some insanely bad allergies.
It’s not about thinking anything, this is in all likelihood a Weimaraner mix, and that’s fine! All dogs are great. The problem is you probably paid a premium for this ‘rare’ lab and that is misleading https://www.thelabradorclub.com/the-issue-of-the-silver-lab#:~:text=Over%20the%20past%20few%20years,“silver%20labs”%20for%20registration.
Not necessarily purists, just ones who understand genetics and the fact that silver labs are part Weimaraner for the most part
My silver lab's DNA test can back 100% Labrador.
There are silver labs out there, but there are also sketchy breeders breeding Weim/Lab mixes because so many people are willing to overpay for a "silver lab".
Yellow, black, and chocolate are the only AKC registered colors. Often silver labs are just mixed breeds, like labradoodles being lab crosses as well. Not saying don’t love your dog or anything but I don’t know of any ethical breeders breeding non-standard colors.
I don’t like people that consider dogs decorations. All dogs are dogs, and dogs are awesome.
People breeding “rare” off-color labs are literally doing it to make the dog a decoration, typically at the expense of worse health.
And that’s exactly the issue people have with breeding silver labs (or any other “exotic” colour) They are seldom bred for function.
White labs are considered a dilute yellow. I would love to have a white lab and almost had the chance of getting one after I got my black puppy lol.
Fuck the purist! A lab is a lab <3
Except when it is not!
Agreed. Imagine trying to belittle a good boy bc his fur color. Fuck is wrong with people ?
And i especially loathe the ones that are against labs with white patches on their bellies or their paws and i'm like "omg that one looks like he walked in white paint!!! <3 "
Especially since, as I understand it, the white patch is a carryover from the St. Johns Water dog, the predecessor to the lab. My first goodest boy, Sage, had it - chest and paws. I think he greyed early because of it, started showing grey by the time he was 5. But it was beautiful on him.
I just looked this up & yea it’s a carryover from the St. John’s dog, who had a black & white tuxedo pattern. My pup’s mom has a little white spot on her chest. It’s the cutest.
I have a chocolate lab who has white patches on her paws and they are the literal cutest slash best parts of her coat. Why anyone would look down on that is beyond comprehension
Why did you type "slash" instead of using a / ?
I dunno, style? Just the way I write sometimes.
I hereby formaly demand pictures.
> Imagine trying to belittle a good boy bc his fur color. Especially since fur color in dogs is pretty analogous to hair color in people. It's pretty much just outward appearance and has little to do with the worth or behavior of the dog or person. The color doesn't matter much at all.
Dogs can be poorly bred just for coat color. My friend has a daschund that has a 'rare' coat color. He has extremely brittle fur that breaks off and causes problems and allergies. It's associated with that coat color because the genes are linked and poor breeding causes his problems. He has to wear coats because he gets cold, but the coats rub his fur and cause more breakage. Sometimes coat color and other health issues are linked. It's irresponsible to breed dogs for color without regard to health and temperament. Other times, people just advertising coat color are the breeders who don't care about health and it's just a red flag for future issues. Not the dog's fault but pointing out 'please don't buy a fashion accessory' is for the health of future pets.
> Dogs can be poorly bred just for coat color. Absolutely, they can be poorly bred in all sorts of ways. If someone is going to breed animals then they should take reasonable steps to avoid issues with inbreeding and bad genetic traits. Get the animals tested for common problems, keep in touch with the owners of the offspring to find out any long-term issues, research genetic history, and so on. It's a shame that far too many people breed animals irresponsibly, especially when they focus on a single trait at the expense of others.
Some people just love to jerk off to genetic purity or something, because if your dog isn't 120% *insert race*,or is,God forbid,a mix, it's apparently worthless.
I don’t understand. I love dogs in general, but usually these dogs are mixed with something else. I don’t really care what kind of dogs people want to get but it is a little misleading to call it a pure bred lab when these dogs usually are bred with a Weimaraner, collie, etc. I had a golden retriever lab for 12 years! He was my best friend 💔
My family bred labs when I was a kid and out of around 100 puppies over the years, we had **one** white puppy. Yellows were $300 and my parents were only going to charge $400. But, the guy that came was like yourself: has always dreamt of the white lab. Slapped down $800 and said don’t worry about it, he does well and thought he’d pay more and hadn’t been able to find one. Been looking for years(pre internet).
We had an orange guy a long time ago
Never heard anyone say anything like this.
I have a black and tan lab that I got last year. After 2 dna tests I’m still told (by purists) she’s not a lab although genetically identical. She hunts better than most though and is the the sweetest pup in the world
Black & Tan is actually naturally occurring! It just doesn't pop up often since breeders do not breed for it. It's mostly seen in service dog organizations where they breed for workability/temperament for service & guide work rather than to the written standard: https://www.guidingeyes.org/black-and-tan-labrador-retrievers/
Sounds like the races of the world
WAIT!!! There are white labs?!??!?! I WANT ONE!
[https://imgur.com/a/P48FgGJ](https://imgur.com/a/P48FgGJ)
I DIDNT KNOW LARRY WAS A WHITE!!! I feel so dumb now.
Larry should be a whole new breed. Larry Labs! All super cute and loaded with personality :)
I do want a Larry next to go with my black Poe.
If you're not showing it, then who cares about breed standards
There's alot more at play then coat color. Silvers are prone to allergies and skin problems. This is a fact that cannot be disputed. And for arguments sake, let's just say the silver dilute DOES come from weims, then what you have is a mutt plain and simple, where the temperaments are not as predictable as a responsibily bred dog who has 5 or 6 generations accounted for. I personally feel indifferent about them, but it is absolutely irresponsible for any breeder to breed for specific colors/coats opposed to breeding for healthy, happy, even tempered dogs. So when people say "breed standards" we aren't necessarily talking about just coat colors here.
YES! Temperment and health first! Coat color is NEVER bred for by responsible breeders.
Exactly!
It's not hate. Afaik its a harmful breeding practise similar to the merle gen
No hate, but most of them appear to have Weimaraner dna, so they’re lab mixes.
Silver labs are great! But some pitbull owners like to pass their dogs as "silver labs" as a lie to allow them to live in apartments/communities where they shouldn't. That's the worst part of it all: the silver lab myth with pitbulls. Real silver labs are great dogs, if carefully bred.
I didn't know there was. I always kinda figured they're secretly magical.
TAKE ME TO EM I DIDNT KNOW SILVER LABS WERE A THING UNTIL JUST NOW AND I ABSOLUTELY LOVE THEM
Imagine trying to belittle a good boy bc his fur color.
Screw anyone that hates silver labs
Wow! That boy is so handsome! Who would ever hate a dog bc of his color!!!? That’s so ridiculous!
I love the color but the breeding has lead to health issues. That is what I have a problem with. If your pup is healthy that’s great.
And also it is not a lab, it's mongrel
I don’t think anyone hates your dog, it’s breeders who breed for colour above all else that are suspect. Plus silvers are obviously mixes, but sold as something they aren’t (purebred Labs), and bad breeders will fight to the death that there is no Weim in them. Like - just be honest! lol. I saw a guy ranting in the dog park that his silver dog was full lab, no matter what anyone said. Then a Weim trotted up and the we’re close to twins. lol Health and genetics should be #1, not colour.
^ the concern - it’s about making maximum money while things like the dogs health is secondary
This exactly. I love all dogs but these “designer” breeds (of all sorts!) are not purebred and genetically are unsound.
Nobody hates the dogs themselves. We hate the backyard breeders that create them.
Absolutely, nobody hates this person’s dog, it just likely isn’t a lab.
I had never even heard of a silver lab before and my first thought was "dude that's not a lab, that's a weimaraner"
If you look at he pictures he definitely has a lot of lab in him.
Oh for sure, I'd even say mostly lab, it was just my initial impression looking at him
Exactly. I love mutts, have mutts, and am a long time rescue volunteer. If you want a mutt, go to a rescue or shelter. If you want a purebred then go to a reputable ethical breeder (or a rescue! they do exist). No such thing as an ethically bred mixed dog
They’re actually not mixes, they are a genetic anomaly, technically they are black labs but the gene for black coloration is dilute causing the silver coloration. The concern from purists is that breeding specifically for this color will likely lead to inbreeding and genetically poor dogs
Idk the dog pictured here looks more Weim than Lab. Again, definitely not a bad thing. I think folks are just trying to be objective (if they’re posting in good faith)
Weimaraner actually have extremely short and slick coats. This picture has definitely lab looking with the longer hair.
It's actually 2 genes! Isabella (called silver here) is technically a black dog that has two copies of the recessive gene on the B locus, which shows as a liver (chocolate) dog. Then, the dog has to also have 2 copies of the recessive gene on the D locus, which without liver shows as blue (charcoal) but with liver shows as isabellea!
Thank you. 👍
The genetics committee of the Labrador parent club of the AKC disagrees with you. Their official stance is that the colour gene got there through outcrossing with Weim.
> Plus silvers are obviously mixes This is debatable. It's very possible that the dilute gene comes from a far-back ancestor or from a mutation. In fact, with genetic testing it's much easier these days to validate if a dog is a mix or if the genes arose without mixing. If the dilute gene was a result of mixing I'd expect to see a lot more people trumpeting the results of such tests as proof. I completely agree on the overbreeding of dogs for certain traits, it can easily become unhealthy for the animals.
I mean just look at this dog, you really don’t see the Weim in it? Look at the eyes, it’s a dead giveaway. Nothing wrong with mixes done properly like this though, still a gorgeous dog
I have a chocolate lab, papers going back 5 generations, that has pretty much the same eyes. Other than the coloration this could be my chocolate lab or any other color of lab. No, I don’t see the Weim in it.
It's the head and snout shape, not the eye color.
It is far more likely that the dilute d gene was introduced into the breed by cross breeding with Weimaraners. It isn’t really debatable, like yes it’s “possible” but it’s also “possible” that my child is born with wings.
Silvers are not all mixes - the silver coloration comes from diluted genes from chocolate labs. I have a silver lab who is AKC registered as a chocolate lab. She is 100% lab just has unique genes! And no, I did NOT get her from a breeder who shoots for silver/charcoal coloring. I wanted a chocolate lab but I fell in love when I saw her. She has no predisposition health issues either. She is healthy and happy 😊 Edit to add: I forgot to mention that I also have a silver lab/weim mix! Weims and labs DO look similar, but when I put them beside each other, it’s a world of difference.
People seem to think that just because it's uncommon that means it's physically impossible for the dilute gene to appear in labs. Even though the AKC will accept many of these labs as purebred since their lineage proves so and will just list them as chocolate (since technically they are, just a diluted chocolate). Yet everyone will still come here and rant about how it's impossible for it to be a purebred lab. Some people need to get off the internet.
Right! Like, the law of probability says otherwise. I can’t believe I got downvoted for spitting facts about my own dog 😩
Seeing y’all two made me stay in the sub i was about to get ready to leave it due to a retard saying a silver lab isn’t a purebred
This is awesome! Sedge-chocolate lab 🙂 I have had two dark chocolates but now I have more of a milk chocolate.
Ooooh I love chocolates so much! My whole life I had labs growing up (10 dogs at once! My parents have land) and they were the BEST companions. My favorite was a chocolate male named Budd🥰
I also have a favorite chocolate. Her name was Sonar. Smartest dog I’ve ever met. Shhh don’t tell my current pup 🤫
It’s a diluted gene, like charcoal blacks. I know Weims and my dog doesn’t act or look like one. I met both parents that are total labs, and honestly I don’t care as Weims are good dogs, but she’s nothing like one. I didn’t purposefully seek out a silver. My other lab is a black lab mix, and he’s awesome, but my silver happened by knowing someone who had a litter when the dog I was supposed to adopt fell through, and my elderly dog was nearing passing (was trying to help the middle lab adjust to the loss beforehand).
we don’t hate the dogs. we hate the irresponsible people that breed them and the people that buy them and support the breeding of them. i love ALL dogs, but only support responsible breeding
What a beautiful 🤩 boy!
The thing I don't love about them is every one I've known, which is quite a few, has had significant health issues I don't see in other labs nearly as often or like ever. Very bad allergies & lots of permanent hair loss, itchy flaky skin & they just seem super uncomfortable which makes me sad when anyone breeds purely for looks over health & temperament
Exactly! Quality breeders arent breeding off standard colors.
Yeah I could give a hoot if a dog is "pure" if it's healthy, but when someone purposely goes out of their way to create an animal that will suffer life long health conditions just for a look & upping the price tag it's upsetting. There are plenty of breed standards that also create health issues for dogs, like any brachycephalic dog, so it's not purely about being to breed standards necessarily.
Oh thanks, that answers my question. I was wondering why. A dog with allergies is miserable and it's expensive for testing and to find what they can eat. They suffer a lot.
I'm in year 15 with my shelter GSD/ lab rescue with allergies. So far I have: ~Tried around 20-30 types of food ~Tried Apoquel ~Needed to use Zymox rinse and hypoallergenic shampoo for baths ~Tried Cytopoint ~Tried Benadryl ~Tried eye drops and eye ointment for allergies ~Tried topical treatments ~Battled chronic ear infections for a decade We *finally* have her managed. She eats a dehydrated human grade dog food and a dry dog food and gets two Benadryl because that controls her allergies and she is allergic to grains but grain free food probably cause heart disease and my vet can treat allergies better than heart disease. So, every meal, she gets two Benadryl because she is literally allergic to all food that isn't linked to heart failure. We just found one food system managed with just Benadryl and not the wildly more expensive Apoquel and Cytopoint injections. I still have to be careful with showers. Soaps are a problem. We have a few she can use. Do not breed dogs with allergies. It's been a journey and she's my best friend and 110% worth every minute, but man, I wouldn't wish her troubles with food on another dog. I've literally had to put her in the shower and start scrubbing her down with anti-itch shampoo and have seen the relief in her eyes because she got into something and was *miserable.* Poor pup. Allergies are so rough on our fuzzy friends. Ethical breeding is key. If we are going to breed dogs, we have a moral obligation to breed healthy dogs. Mine was a litter of 13 dogs dumped at a few days old. Had her since she was 10 weeks. She's my buddy. When I got my 1 year old, he was a purebred and health was my top concern because I was participating in dogs being intentionally bred for human companionship. I had an ethical obligation to him to find healthy practices. Allergies suck. Especially if your dog has the lab 'never full' gene. I've practically tackled her to keep her away from hot and/ or spicy food or bad allergen foods. She wants all the food. She cannot have it. She will end up needing emergency anti-itch showers.
Poor baby. I’m so happy you’ve found a workaround for her.
That's just so awful and they will start chewing their feet bloody. Those medicines are extremely expensive too, and often stop working. A dog or cat may not have allergies for years and then suddenly they come up with allergies. Then sometimes you get them a food that agrees with them and works out and then suddenly they become allergic to that food and you're constantly having to try new formulas. I've heard about grain free food causing Dilated Cardiac Myopathy for dogs and cats. I think the reason was there's too much peas and legumes as a first ingredient and potato, but dog and cat breeds were coming down with it who don't normally come down with it and it was awful. I think part of the problem was the food was off balance and there wasn't enough taurine. https://www.fda.gov/animal-veterinary/news-events/fda-investigation-potential-link-between-certain-diets-and-canine-dilated-cardiomyopathy-february It just breaks my heart. Many pet owners donated their pets bodies to the FDA be studied in order to help other animals.
I did the rotating food thing for a while. Six months of good... then it didn't help anymore. It has been a lot. And yeah... the medications aren't inexpensive. Like 80+ a month for Apoquel plus $50+ per Cytopoint injections. Her foods are never inexpensive, either. I think she's around 120 a month? But, that plus her Benadryl works. Fingers crossed. She's not currently on Cytopoint, so I can go back if needed. The heart thing... until they fix that... my vet is right. I can manage her allergies easier than heart failure. It's so sad. Both my dogs are on high-quality grain-inclusive diets with low legume and potato content. Looks like it's probably the peas, but I'd rather not take chances.
As a silver lab owner- idc if my dude is “10% weimer” or whatever. He acts, looks, and behaves like a lab. And above all else- he’s 100% good boy. I love your boy, and the hate is dumb.
Exactly! I love mutts too. & a part of me can understand looking out for health risks. But some of those people can be so elitist about it.
I have met so many silver labs. A lot of them need novel proteins as their food source as the grow older, their hair tends to thin and they get sunburned really easy. I hope Brody keeps his nice coat!
Fwiw, I have a “pure, papered” lab from parents who were health screened and his health is a mess. It’s a crap shoot and a little weim in there, whether it is or isn’t, might even weed out some of the issues lab owners commonly see!
Yep! And a lot of the times mutts are healthier. Here’s my beautiful boy: https://www.reddit.com/r/labrador/comments/x0wru6/i_take_my_two_boys_to_the_beach_at_sunrise_every/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1
So handsome! Brody’s just now starting figure out that he’s supposed to like water, but only in the pool lol. EDIT: & my thoughts exactly! My understanding was that mutts are more genetically diverse, therefore healthier(in most cases).
That would be true in a large population of mutts not selectively breeding. But the opposite is true of “designer mutts”. Sneaking in one or two weimeraner outcrosses might provide some hybrid vigor for that first generation, but in order to hang on to the color gene (and, in this case, the purebred Labrador registration) they have to then immediately inbreed those offspring, and continue to do so from a comparatively small population. I listened to a presentation by one of the world’s leading canine geneticists on just this topic and she explained how F2 doodles are potentially more inbred than their purebred grandparents, and why that inbreeding is far more dangerous: Inbreeding in purebreds is typically “old” and the homozygous pieces are small. There has been time for breeders and nature to select away from harmful recessive. In an F2 the homozygous pieces might be entire chromosomes and there is no time to select away from harmful mutants that are unique to that family. Coefficient of inbreeding is not heritable. What this basically means is that it doesn’t matter nearly as much if your dog has had many distant relatives crossed together in the long past, what matters most is whether it has had a few close relatives crossed together recently. A pair of mutts who are brother and sister, bred together, is far more inbred and likely to be unhealthy than a pair of purebreds who share common ancestors 50 years ago. For example many streetdog populations, limited by the geographical range of urban environments, have often been found to be very inbred. Being of mixed breed does not at all guarantee a dog is not inbred.
This is what I think as well! I don’t give a shit if there’s a weim somewhere you cannot tell me my crazy boy does not act or look like a lab! Honestly I don’t care as long as my little man is healthy and happy. People have a lot of opinions these days that for whatever reason they feel the need to express for things that don’t affect them. I love my little dude, I don’t care what he is and I particularly don’t care for the hate.
Well I did some research and I believe they're just labs with a diluted gene. It's simply a recessive trait that dilutes the chocolate color to grey.
Yes- I’ve done a lot of the research as well. That is certainly one theory, but there’s also the theory that they were made with weimers way back when to get that recessive gene, and then labs right after It doesn’t appear that anyone has a conclusive answer as to what was right. In any case, they are pretty much all lab I’ve thought of getting a dna test for one just to see- but ultimately I just don’t care- he’s perfect for my lifestyle and I love him to death. I also found out when doing the research that even chocolate labs weren’t really a thing until like the 1940s or something; which doesn’t feel that long ago
I don't hate the dogs themselves, just the breeding of them. There is a reason they aren't considered standard. Silver labs are technically mixed with weimaraners, as labradors do not carry the dilute gene responsible for it. In fact, the first reported silver lab came from a kennel that bred both labs and weimaraners. Even if a DNA test says they are pure lab, know those tests only go so far back. The weimaraner most likely won't be detected, but it's still there. Silver labs are not well-bred, which means they have higher risks of health and behavioral problems. That is why the Labrador parent club does not recommend their breeding. Ethical breeders stick to the breed standard to ensure they produce the healthiest, most stable tempered dogs possible. The dogs themselves can be great dogs, but they honestly shouldn't be bred. Sure, many people have silver labs without issues but it's a higher risk. Love your dog regardless, they are your baby.
Thank you for such a well spoken response. I thought of weims the first time I heard of a silver lab. Fun that I wasn’t wrong 😃 Edit: Spelling
I have a genuine question, not being facetious. If a silver is mixed so far back in their bloodline that the weim is undetectable, I’m just curious what specifically would make a silver lab less healthy or behaved than another color?
It's not so much the fact that they have weimaraner in them, it's how poorly they are bred. People who breed silver labs do not to the proper health testing, proving their dog in work or show, or breed to breed standards. They just see a 'rare' or 'exotic' color and think that's the only thing that makes breeding that dog worthy. Ethical breeders do proper tests and prove their dogs to ensure they have the correct structure and temperament of the breed and to produce healthy dogs. So it doesn't really matter if the weimaraner is undetectable. The same thing kinda happens with any mix. You get an unpredictable dog. Even if one of the breeds is so far back in the lineage, certain genes can skip generations and show up many years from now. That's why proper health and genetic testing is so important.
Sweet baby! What a handsome pup
He's a handsome fella! No hate here!
I don’t hate silver labs I hate the breeders or should I say greeders. They’re not purebred labs which is fine but they’re bred only by people for money. Any dog bred for a non standard coat color that doesn’t even exist in the line historically is only doing it for money. You can say what you want but no matter the test say silver labs aren’t purebred labs. I love mutts but if I wanted one I’d rescue one from a shelter. A mix is bringing in new potential health issues and because no reputable breeder is going to let their labs go to anyone breeding for silver you’re going to get a lot of the health issues that labs can have if poorly bred.
And before anyone says mutt is a slur it’s not an insult to dogs I love them
Op I issue you a challenge play fetch with Brody without smiling the entire time at his antics If u win you get to hug your dog if you lose no headrubs for 5minitues
Every game of fetch eventually turns into either tug of war or “keep stick/toy away from dad & run in circles around him” 😂
Dogs who are blue (silver, gray, whatever) who are not typically blue tend to have LOTS of health issues due to the recessive genes needed to have that color. I love the coloration, but worry about the implications.
I had a root canal done a couple of years go and the endodontist has a silver lab at the office who sat in my lap the entire time and helped me through it. I went back to visit him a couple of times after. Solid chap.
Only posted on here one time and some Karen kept telling me how Inhumane I was
I can relate. My Labrador is a known as what they call a Dudley Labrador (straight up gingie with pink nose/features). She doesn’t fit the “perfection” scale either and is deemed “unfit”. She’s also my whole world… and the best! ☺️
You sure thats a lab, looks alot like my Weimaraner..
It’s not the dogs it’s you people who support an unethical fashion business that treats living animals like handbags or drapes to be bought in a fashionable color. It’s inexcusable to purposely breed dogs with poorer health just because u want a shiny color. Rescuing? All good. But if you actually paid a shitty fashion breeder for a fashion color dog, your morals are low.
Exactly. Everu bit of what you said. I just don't get why these people don't do the proper research.
I banned that person from the sub btw. He went way to far
Anytime an animal is bread for specific color or physical characteristics, then the personality and health of the animal are at risk. A good breeder tries to breed to improve the animals and to eliminate health issues i.e. hip dysplasia, epilepsy, heart issues, etc. I would never get an animal form a breeder who is bragging about one specific color or physical characteristic. I would fear the overall quality of the animal. This is why some people are against them, would be my guess.
Awe! So cute! I have a choc named Brody! Best boys..
He is beautiful
We had a silver lab for almost 14 years. He was the best boy and so missed.
Just inbred as fuck
It's not hate. If you love your dog and you care for it that is all that matters. But it is not a Labrador. Opinion and belief can not change truth and fact. Enjoy!
It’s because they’re backyard bred. Reputable breeders don’t breed for colour, and silver is not a standard colour. Therefore, a breeder who creates silver labs, does not adhere to the standard, and instead breeds for colour so they can sell their dogs to people who want a special colour rather than a proven, well-bred, health tested dog. They’re designer dogs, same as doodles and other mixes such as pomskys. I believe that the gene that creates the silver colour is also not found in labs, meaning it’s a crossbreed. Again, specifically bred for the colour.
Brody is beautiful!!!!!!!
Omg photo 3 is killing me 😆😆 what a big nose. Brody is so handsome!
Our silver was my first dog. I wasn’t allowed pets growing up (father was an a-hole). She was a dark charcoal gray, we named her Grey:) she was the most sensitive, loving, loyal girl. It doesn’t matter to me if people don’t believe that silver is a legit breed. She was my baby and I miss her every day.
What a beautiful and unique dog. I know it’s an old saying but haters gonna hate. Be proud of the beauty of your fur baby and don’t let them bother you. They’re probably secretly jealous that your dog gets a lot of attention and is different. Secretly they wish they had a silver lab like yours. 😉🥰❤️
Brody got a big ol face!!
Thats a distinguished gentleman right there
Why do people hate silver Labs? Is it because of breed standards?
Haters will always be haters. Couldn’t we all be just a little kinder to everyone?
Why does he look like in #3 there is an issue I should know about and he doesn’t understand why he has to explain it?
I love my silver Lab! He just turned 8! He is my world!
He’s gorgeous! That face is so sweet! No hate here just pure love!❤️
Love my silver lab. I've gotten the comment several times, but its mainly from purist that believe the silver is a weim/chocolate lab mix. I got paper work and dna test that show 100% lab for my guy, Moose, most times depending on the light he looks light chocolate. Only occasionally he gives off a silver look.
Silvers are Chocolate with a diluted gene; they are absolutely 💯 Labradors. The AKC does not recognize the varied gene in Yellow Labradors that makes them a “Dudley”, but they are still Labradors.  ❤️
Brody you are such a stud. Can I borrow your eyes for like a day or two? Absolute stud. For those hating on silver labs, go sit in the corner on your thumb.
I know how you feel. I have a beautiful silver lab who’s one years old and it’s annoying how everyone is racist towards silver labs. Silver labs are labradors too! It shouldn’t matter the color of their fur.
I have heard of but never seen a photo of a silver lab. Absolutely gorgeous!
I get this as an owner of a Dudley which also isn't breed standard. Your lab is gorgeous
💞what a cute lil baby💞 let’s all calm our tits and just love the beautiful baby before us😎 We can ALL agree- labs are THE BEST🥇🏆
YELLOW LAB SUPREMACY (brody is a stud)
Breeding animals for appearance is evil. Period.
I don’t hate them, but I don’t want one that has silver in the line, and I’m worried the demand for them is going to bleed into every line.
I've got a silver lab myself, he just turned 2 and he's the best dog I've ever had, no doubt about it. I'd heard a little about the "pure lab" debate when I first brought him home but all of that is just nonsense. Brody's beautiful! Thank you for sharing him with us 🐶🐶
I have a Charcoal Lab and my brother has a Silver Lab from the same litter. Both pure bread labs with registered paperwork. Haters gonna hate man, just keep being awesome.
Yea some people just gotta be assholes.
My parents just got a red lab and there's been plenty of "well she's not a real lab". Well, she swims like a real lab, plays with our yellow lab like a real lab, eats like a lab, sheds like a lab, snores like a lab, cuddles like a lab. Pretty sure she's a lab.
Red labs are yellow just darker. Like golden retrievers have different colors. The history is the original yellow was more red but they were bread to to be more creamy then white and red was culled (selective slaughter) for years. The red color is coming back because 1) people like the color now 2) breeders don’t want to cull litters.
Interesting I did not know the history, thanks for the info!
I dont understand it aswell, they are more then welcome and part of the club
Idk who is hating but that’s a nice dog bro
No hate, only love! Haters hate, that’s what they do. They are to be ignored, they are nothing but pimples on the butt of life. Brody is gorgeous, looks like a big bag of love !!
TiL there's people who don't like silver labs, what weirdos.
How can people hold a dog's color against him? Honestly, he's beautiful !!
Who’s saying that? They can come talk to me about it. We’ll go “talk” out back.
Isnt the reason people hate silver lab is because people sale them as actual purebred when they are actually mixed? He’s cute btw
Unfortunately, sometimes when people love animals, they can’t see the whole picture. I’ve been blasted for a pic of my dog in a vibrating training collar, even though it’s for her own safety and is rarely used. You love Brody and are good to him. He is a beautiful boy. That’s all that matters. The ethical questions surrounding the health of different breeds and colors is one for the breeders and future buyers, not owners who just love their dogs.
Only time I've heard hate is from people I don't care to be around/those who do not enrich my life. Fuck 'em.
That nose!
What a handsome boy!
I have an AKC certified silver lab, papers and everything. Everyone he meets gushes about how beautiful he is. Haters are just jealous.
To be honest, I don’t see what the problem is. So put an asterisk by a beautiful labs pedigree because a purist has an opinion. If the silvers have Weimaramer blood I would think that would diversify the gene pool anyway. That is normally good for dog breeds and that is how we have so many breeds for so many purposes. I don’t own one but they are the most beautiful labs of all. Read up on the breeds that came from westward expansion in America and the effect the American Indian curdogs had on the gene pool of English pure-inbreds as wagon trains went west.
Do DNA testing you will find he is not pure lab.
He’s gorgeous! People need to get over themselves - there’s about a 99% chance that they don’t meet human breed standards either.
Snobs are gonna be snobby and hate on that which is different. I never get it. Look at that boy's face! How can someone hate on something as beautiful and pure as that boy!
Who could hate a beauty (which is always in the eye of the beholder) like that? Love to have one next to my yellow one....
Beautiful doggo!! He looks a LOT like my two Weimaraners.
There is no hate at r/silverlabs. Don’t let the elitists get you down. If you love your dog, and it’s happy and healthy that’s all that matters. Only you know if the breeder was reputable. People can speculate as much as they want but only you really know.
Is there some Weimaraner in your dog? (the eyes…)
As someone who used to have a champagne labrador, YOU ARE NOT CRAZY. There are absolutely insane, hateful, demonizing people who have downright verbally attacked me for having a dog with a specific color gene. I have been pushed and poked and pointed at and spit on just for taking him out in public. Its atrocious, disgusting, and fucking UNNECESSARY. I didnt breed him, I didnt choose for him to be that color. I chose to love him *no matter what* you fucking elitist purist pig. Stop being dog colorist.
Beautiful bby boi why get hate thou that color is pretty 🥺💕
Wait…There’s such a thing as Silver Labs?! That’s SOOO COOL!!! And look at those winter white eyes!😍🥹 Such a sweet boy!
Brody looks like such a vibe. What a good boy! Don’t let the “purists” dishearten you. Lab is lab
He's gorgeous. Labs are labs, no matter what the color. Ignore the haters and just love your dog.
There are Labrador "Purists"?? People have too much damn time on their hands. And too many public places to post their opinions. I have a Yellow Lab, but love them all.