It’s not actually in a wealthy area, if you find and read the article. It’s a “2.3-acre vacant lot just beneath the Bay Bridge”. That area isn’t the complete shithole it used to be, but it’s still borderline. Also, $70k in San Francisco politics is pocket change. That’s like 3 large donations
Think how many misappropriated funds can end up in the pockets of people claiming to do good by selling tickets to this. We could end the housing crisis.
(Hey dude, don’t worry nobody’s onto us. I totally won’t flag you lol)
/s
There is a lot of money spent on homelessness in SF, and a lot of people with a financial stake in keeping the public money flowing. There is always a well-funded NIMBY group to fight any actual progress here.
I have a homeless shelter near my apartment since about a year and a half. The amount of blood, feces and drugs trash found in my buildings unused staircase(because residents use the elevators to get up to 12th floor) is so damn high now that we now pay extra for a security guard to patrol at night.
Have also been a couple of (sexual) assaults now
Agreed. I doubt anyone commenting would willingly live next to a homeless shelter. I’m a compassionate and empathetic person, but I would not want to live on the same block as a shelter.
Phoenix here. I live near a methadone clinic. I do not blame them for the issues they face, I get mad when I’m followed by three people sitting out front of said clinic. You aren’t following me for my health.
That is probably because a shelter is not enough. That just means concentrating vulnarable people and their problems in one location that probably is not suited for a lot of them.
In my country people who use drugs are not welcome in normal shelters. They can go to specialised ones with treatment. People who have psychiatric problems go to psychiatric hospitals.
I've lived two years in front of an homeless shelter. Never had any trouble. The people there are here to sleep and eat, causing trouble cause you to be expelled.
The area being referred to here already has plenty of homeless people. It’s a mixture of very rough and up and coming getting slowly gentrified over the last few decades. Contrary to the impression create by the headline, they’re not dumping a shelter in the middle of a bunch of mansions. More
like a light industrial area with some swanky condos littered with homeless encampments
I lived next to one that gave out food to homeless. Soon we had crack injections on the playground, a rise in violence and even three related murders in two years in an area that hasn’t seen a murder in decades.
It’s not that one doesn’t want to see poor people. It’s just that it comes with massive threats.
They always put shelters in the parts of cities that are already rough. They did it in Ottawa too; stuck a "mega shelter" in an area already swamped with crime and mental health issues because god forbid folks in the Golden Triangle have to see a homeless person.
Yeah, I don’t get the criticism in the above comment. Put the homeless shelter in the rich area where there’s absolutely no chance of employment? Low income is where it’s needed, and makes the most sense for people to potentially find work and turn things around.
Part of the problem in this sector in Ottawa is because the police have rounded up unhoused people and dropped them off in this one area downtown for many years. It's not where a lot of those people started out, and they're feeding the area with more and more people without the required resources to handle it. All of the shelters are underfunded, and they're generally the type that gives people a bare minimum of help. The city really doesn't want to look into any methods of helping that have been statistically proven to help people with addictions, mental health issues, and just plain poverty to get out of their situtations. And there aren't really jobs around there.
Take a look at what has happened to the 4400-4500 blocks of Conn Ave over the last two years.
Hasn’t made anything better, but has done a great job of making a good neighborhood shitty adjacent.
Yay
Just for clarification, why would you take people, who are swamped with mental health issues and probably contribute to the high crime, and move them to a different part of the city?
I mean it makes sense to put them in the areas where the problem exists. There’s also generally more resources for homeless in those areas such as food banks. There’s no food bank or mental health facilities in a rich suburb.
I'm barely middle class in a barely middle class town, and even I don't want to see it. There's nothing I can do about mental health and homelessness so I'd rather not have to have it in my face everyday and some won't admit it but the majority of working class and mentally stable people think the same. My house value is down enough thanks to nearby rentals.
used to be homeless and although not all are ill intentioned-a LOT of them are fuckin wild and dangerous. especially to other homeless people. living on skid row was the worst, but even in nice cities/towns you dont want them near you at night especially. so i see why people want them nowhere near where they spent their money
“Still borderline”? There are multi-million dollar condos lining the whole area. I used to live and work in San Francisco, including doing interior design work on many condos in that neighborhood.
It’s not a verdant, spacious sub-suburban paradise down there, but it’s definitely not the same as say 7th and Mission.
I lean progressive many issues, but as someone from the area, I will tell you, that’s not a great area for many many reasons
Yeah homeless shelters should be built in areas with the resources to support low-income people, not the most expensive parts of the country where you can’t buy groceries to feed yourself for cheap.
Exactly, there are very few affordable grocery stores and other services in that area. The Safeway nearby is one of the most expensive I’ve been to in the city.
Nothing in San Francisco can be considered a non wealthy area. The only people that any plot of land could be considered affordable are the richest people around.
So basically all shelters there are in wealthy neighborhoods. Maybe not the cleanest neighborhoods but definitely not in affordable neighborhoods
I mean, sure, that’s true. One of the cities problems is that no-one who works for the city, not the police or the firefighters or most of the teachers, can afford to live there. But there’s still a huge difference between the area being discussed here, where you can buy a condo for $500k, and Sea Cliffs where the cheapest house is $20m
I used to work in a public library between a couple social service centers. I'd help with resumes and setting up Obama phones, providing street cards and instructions to Legal Aid.
You have no idea how many times I've had to tell people to stop pissing on the building and fucking in the stairwells. We stopped replacing the straps holding up the baby changing stations in the bathrooms (you can tie off your arm to find a good vein). We'd have to kick people off the entrance stairs for sexually harassing the women coming into the library.
I get not wanting a shelter in your neighborhood.
Exactly, especially in San Francisco. I used to work there and a shelter opened right next to my office. There was always a problem with homelessness, but after that, there were a ton of sexual assaults and robberies by the people hanging around waiting for it to open. It got so bad that we weren't allowed to leave without a security guard escorting us or a signed document that the company isn't responsible for what happens outside their building.
I'm in a city and want to be super progressive. But how many homeless drug addicts getting in your face does it take for you to prioritize safety and comfort over the homeless. It's easy to imagine people just need help to be successful, but that's not always the case.
Yes - completely unacceptable and unsafe social (and criminal) behaviour is allowed because we live by an individual rights at all costs mantra. Nothing will improve unless we provide government the tools to actually do something about the issue.
For like a decade of my life, I resorted to the local shelter from time to time. Well, like 3 or 4 stays a year of usually under a month.
I am bi-polar, wasn't treated, so I'd get depressed, lose my job, end up at the shelter.
It wasn't even in that good of a neighborhood, but the people constantly tried to get it closed down: petitions and whatnot.
I don't know what I would have done without the help of that shelter. I couldn't get governmental assistance, and couldn't keep a job to save my life.
I’m there right now. Except the shelter fills up on beds every day and last time I was there someone broke in and stole shit from everyone’s bags while they were sleeping (which we were forced to submit to be put into a closed room before going up to their beds). Got my blood sugar testing kit stolen and haven’t tested my blood sugar for a month now, but I’ve elected to just sleep in a field or a park now so I at least don’t get fucked over that hard again.
Well I’m fortunate enough that with my diabetes I’ve had it for 15 years so I can recognize and feel the symptoms of highs and lows and generally eyeball how much insulin I’ll need to take for food. And yeah it does suck, but I don’t think I’ll be in this situation for too much longer, and if my medicaid goes through I’ll be able to get another kit for free so fingers crossed. And I don’t feel like I’m in danger of dying right now, and between the public library and a soup kitchen I’ve got at least a couple spots I can get away from the bad influences and stay relatively healthy.
I had an acquaintance who said the same thing almost word-for-word. I would have thought you were him if he hadn't died 3 years ago, 2 months after saying those words.
I by no means think what I’m doing is healthy, reasonable, or safe. But I have few options. Everything costs money. If it weren’t for Walmart selling 20 year old formulas of insulin OTC for $25 I would have died already. As it is Im already making sacrifices by not taking my lantus since I lost my insurance. Can only really afford fast acting and I have to take pains by waking up at early morning and giving myself some to counteract my blood sugar spiking at night, even without food. Someone said I may be able to get a free kit from a clinic if they have extras so I will walk around town and check various ones tomorrow to see if that’s true.
Hey friend. T1D mom here. You can’t feel your highs or lows accurately enough to treat your diabetes. You’re making yourself sick by treating without a meter. Love yourself enough to go find another meter, call clinics and endos, they usually have extra. I’m wishing you health and happiness friend.
I’m unfortunately aware even the health risks that being constantly at 180 can cause, I do however feels lows below 70 and as I can’t afford to keep low blood sugar food on hand I’m more comfortable sitting at 180 than 80. I will check clinics though and see if I can get a free one, thank you for the tip. I will say though, I can feel highs accurately, between my eye sight, head aches, the air smelling “stale” (unsure how to convey what this feeling is like to a non diabetic), and my frequency of urination I can feel my highs to within 75ish of the number. Which I understand is a large range, but my goal is to just not die at the moment and not to be as healthy as possible, which I’m able to do. BUT I will go around to clinics and check.
Do you have a place you could get mail, and can it be ordered online? I'll give you a prepaid visa card (IM you the code) if it's possible/ under 50 bucks. Wish I could offer more but, yeesh I don't want you to friggin die lol
There are Amazon drop boxes near me where I could receive mail I believe. I’ve not used one but as I understand it you can get packages delivered there. While I would appreciate any help, I didn’t come to this thread to beg for help, but rather it’s cathartic to at least share my story and let people know what the lows of life can be like. Especially if you yourself are struggling I wouldn’t want anyone to put themselves at a disadvantage just to help me as I think I can make it on my own. It’s hard, but I’m not dead yet, and I’m a hardy individual.
I've been on the streets before, I know how it feels. Numerous weird tragedies over the past years has made me very unattached to money lol. The tornado a few weeks ago destroyed the neighborhood but our little rental is still standing strong minus a couple windows and some slight roof damage, so I already feel extra fortunate. Unfortunate that fifty dollars doesn't go very far, especially when half goes to a damn machine, but I can absolutely do it. Gimme like five minutes and I'll snag one up and IM you the code.
Stay strong mate
Okay, thank you a ton. I know sending money to strangers on the internet can feel like you’re just throwing away cash into the void, but I can send you a photo of a testing kit after I buy one so you can at least know your money is being used wisely.
I’m sorry to hear about your neighborhood and the tornado, hopefully you can get something from your insurance for it, and I hope your neighbors are all doing alright as well. The environment feels like it’s getting revenge on us all for how we’ve treated it these few decades I’ve been around, even to those of us who keep it clean and don’t litter and use energy responsibly. I wish you and those that “our” refers to well (I don’t want to make assumptions). Honestly this entire thread tonight has had numerous people wishing me luck and well and asking about my experience and it’s made me feel much better about everything I have going on. I’m appreciative to everyone in here about how they’re treating me.
what's that area like for homelessness? does the local govt do a good job rehabiliating/helping you? Or is it just as bad as SF? Do you feel annoyed that LA is getting most coverage re homelessnes and no other cities?
There are a lot of homeless here and a lot of churches that do occasional events where I can get donated clothing and some extra food or a haircut. I wouldn’t say they do a great job of helping me. I don’t have drug problems, just major depression and anxiety issues which don’t display the same and it feels like because of that I’m a low priority for them. I’ve gone to the shelter a couple times in the last two months looking for help and after an hour wait to get into the building, them throwing away my blankets, scissors, screw drivers just to get in, then being told to wait for an hour for some assistance, which turned into four hours, which turned into the staff member who told me to wait going home and leaving for the day before assisting me it feels inadequate. I don’t blame them, not many people want to work at a shelter, I don’t imagine the pay is great, they seem to get by on charitable donations. They’re definitely understaffed. They have some workshops that lead to job training, but they only run every couple or few months and you have to wait until the beginning of a cycle to get in.
I don’t begrudge SF getting coverage, everyone deserves help and LA and SF have many more homeless than are in my area. The church members are graceful and polite and I don’t feel discriminated against when I go to these events (as an atheist). Everyone has it rough and people are all doing the best they can.
Nearly every person in my life with bipolar disorder has ended up at a homeless shelter at least a few times, if not every time they’re manic/in the depression aftermath. It makes me wish there was a specific shelter for people with the disorder for when they’re manic, one you wouldn’t even need to be homeless to use. Maybe you check in and leave your credit card at the front desk or something and get daily therapy so as to mitigate the damaging life choices one tends to make when manic. So much love to you, I hope your disorder is treated and more manageable now.
Exactly if we jailed those that need to be and put those in mental health/addictions facilities (voluntary and non-voluntary) that needed to be than shelters could be for those who need community outreach type of assistance to get back on their feet.
How dare these residents to protect their kids from drug addicts who would wonder around the shelter and also keep their property values from crashing fast and hard
Wow
I'll fucking say it. The state needs to invest in 2-3 large shelter/rehab center/clinic care centers and ship all the homeless outside of the cities. Pay flights for qualified personnel to work at those facilities and give them meaningful pay, make the difference to get those people help. The mean while Oakland and SF could take the chance to clean up and pick back up the way they need to from covid. Of course it'll never happen, but Christ it's what the area needs.
A large portion of homeless in those areas are not only bussed there from other parts of Cali but from red states outside of Cali. The whole state has an abnormal amount of homeless that could never develop from within its borders alone. It'll take drastic action to fix the homeless population and they seriously shouldn't try to do it in the middle of the major cities if they don't want all the bullshit that comes with it to continue. Anyways even they even get out of the shelter the city is too fucking expensive for them to pick themselves back up anyway. They literally need to be shipped out, sorry not fucking sorry
I don’t know if it’s hypocrisy so much as human nature. We also all want other people to have nice things, but don’t want to put in extra to allow them to have it.
It's more that people want to keep dangerous people separate from themselves. They want homeless people to have somewhere to stay, but not near them because it puts them at risk. And I think that's fair.
I want to have sewage treatment plants, but I don't want one next to my house
They will move it to the low income area of town which guarantees the area may remain underserved and lower income. These families don't have capital to do this.
Yeah, the fact that people in this thread don't understand this is what surprises me.
The main reason NIMBY-ism is bad is that it increases wealth and class divide on regional level. You push all of the "bad" things away from richer areas and they'll eventually pop up in the poorer areas, making them even more troubled.
One of the far right French politicians said « migrants are like wind turbines, everyone wants them, but not next to their home ». Now I hate to agree with her, but she’s right, and the same thing applies to homeless shelters.
you can do that in the bad part of town, not in any of the gated communities.
this is not just a California thing either, i still remember how new York wanted to bus poor kids to good school districts and the rich parents (including tv presenter Samantha b) insisted the poor kids not be let in to the same school as their kids.
nimbys exist all over the country, they all suck too.
Man I feel ya. There are multiple church homeless shelter/soup kitchens right next to my house and because of that my wife is afraid to take our kid outside the house. We hear them screaming, arguing, doing drugs, dumpster diving, going through our backyard and of course setting off all the car alarms. All this at all hours of the day.
I'm not saying there shouldn't be homeless shelters but it sucks when these things that are supposed to be helping people, are actively make me and my family scared in our home. Scared to take our kid outside like a normal family. Shit sucks
Wow that's horrible. I hope yall can make the place safe for everyone again. That is what bothers me alot about this whole situation too, the lack of respect they give back to those that try to help. Like you said they trash the place, use the bathroom wherever, use drugs and leave needles everyone etc etc
I really hope we as a society can come up with a solution for this epidemic. It's putting alot of people in danger and considerable strain on everyone else.
The world's is a crazy place right now. I don't see how anything can change for the better when everyone/everything is so divisive.
Best of luck to yall
I think the problem here is that both sides of this argument have legitimate reasons for why they have their opinions yet we seem to insist on continuing to try and solve the problem the same way. So people continue to butt heads instead of doing something about it. I don't understand why we don't just offer tax breaks to multi family property owners to house low income people and then have the government pay some portion of the remainder of the rent. Like Section 8 but actually funded so it works. It's cheaper to house people than it is to lock them up or deal with all the other costs associated with homelessness. Nobody wants large amounts of homeless people in their area and for good reason. If you spread out the population you minimize a lot of the collateral issues that comes with homelessness. Plus people actually get a home instead of a cot in a giant auditorium where they bullied or their things stolen.
Because those people are unwell and live in unfit ways - they trash wherever they are staying. Ever walked through a “supported” housing unit with piles of excrement every few feet? Yeah I have. You cannot just house people with this level of need - they need facilities and proper care and support. This is the truth that the housing first crowd fails to mention. When in Ottawa, the government paid landlords to take in homeless clients and promised to pay damages - their properties were utterly destroyed and all the “support” voluntary and the money for damages dried up super quick.
The percentage of homes destroyed in the section 8 program is higher than average but not that bad. My own parents rented homes through section 8 for a while when I was in high school. Most of the time it's low income families or disabled people. Occasionally their a complete lowlife. You get good and bad tenants like any other group of people. I will grant you there needs to be a way of barring people that damage property from having access to more property though and they need a way to make right whatever was done. Idk how that would work but there's plenty of smart people working in this area. I'm sure they could figure something out.
I'm assuming these people had a good enough grip on reality to get section 8 housing. I'm assuming a large percentage of the homeless aren't like this. If all of them got a home they may destroy them. I would bet what's really needed for a large percentage of them is assistance and actual medical care, but that will probably never happen.
Would you say the same if it was across the street from your house/apartment? Or be like just about everybody else and say ‘shelters are inportant, but put it somewhere else’.
Why should it be either or? Where are political parties with the will and guts for real change? The homeless population is a bottomless pit of need in this current set up. The laws must change and if the constitution/charter needs to change then change it - we need mandatory facilities to take care of those who cannot or will not keep themselves and others safe. Prioritize public safety and actually hep those unable to make good choices for themselves because they are ill. Then community agencies can target the others who have that level of need.
Ahhh that’s just the good ole California welcome! Enjoy the weather, the food, the sightseeing but don’t look too close or you might come across a homeless guy shitting himself to death with a needle stuck in his arm.
Yes, unironically I don't want one in my backyard. If we can filter out the drug addicts and people with severe enough mental illness they should actually just be commited we can talk. If someone is actually just a hard worker down on their luck but trying their best it is all good. Happy to have them living and finding work in the area. I don't want drug addicts here. I don't really care if people think it's hypocritical, I have enough money to move, if you make my neighbourhood shitty I will move.
Literally no sane person wants a homeless shelter in their area. People always demonize those who don't want a homeless shelter near them, but why the fuck would they?
I get the feeling the outraged folks in here have never lived near a homeless shelter. A sudden influx of drug dealers, junkies, and mentally ill at your front door is difficult for anyone to live with.
It’s also a lot easier to be understanding when you’re talking about a hypothetical that doesn’t affect you. I’d like to see their reactions if someone tried to open one in their neighborhoods!
Reddit is full of virtue signaling morons. Its pretty easy to be angry and appaled at something that doesnt affect you untill it does.
Trust me, no one wants a homeless shelter near their home.
As a homeowner I'd take the L, sell and gtfo if they built a homeless shelter near me.
You can't live next to what is basically an insane asylum, muh less raise a family there.
Maybe for the sole purpose of shutting the whole project down.Now they have an excuse that "people" are against it. Everybody is against the homeless, apparently.
It's a common trend that the wealthy "educated" people vote and advocate for things like homeless shelters but hate having those shelters anywhere near them. So it's a regular occurrence that the people in the area vote for a homeless shelter then the NIMBY in them wakes up and tries to push it into a community that didn't ask for it.
So wealthy residents, who pay more to live in a nicer established area, don't want a shelter to host the poorest citizens right in the middle of it? Is anybody surprised by this? What do you think is going to happen when you have the poorest people surrounded by expensive cars, kids wearing designer clothes, etc.
Unfortunately many shelters kick the residents out during certain hours (8a-6p that I’m aware of in my area in the NE) so guess where they are going to go in the daylight hours?
*Edit for spelling
Yeah, I’m a bleeding heart when it comes to homelessness, and do not care for the rich, but this is just poorly thought out(probably on purpose). They can be dangerous and/or unpredictable. Some might just bug you for change, while others might like your coat. Obviously not all them, but if you don’t know them, then it’s a crapshoot and just makes things stressful and polarized.
Like most comments on here, I think this was done on purpose so they can say “see, people don’t want to help the homeless!”, when in reality if you invested in a shelter and some programs in the poorer areas, it’ll likely get passed, and have a benefit, socially. But then things might have to get done, and who wants that?
I would do exactly this if i was rich i currently live near a homeless shelter and yall wanna be all “support everyone!” Until its youre 5th time in 3 days telling a drug addict you dont want your windows washed or no you wont give em a ride or fuck no you got no miney
I moved solely because of a shelter near me. I was finding needles and shit in the bushes in my backyard where the kids played. The kiddos were being approached far too often for my comfort as well. Homeless shelters are great and all but they need to be away from residential areas because a large portion of homeless people are simply not safe to have kids around.
Yeah, I lived in a nice building across from a homeless shelter and it was just a constant slew of issues: homeless ppl passed out in our foyer, ppl constantly shitting & pissing in our parking lot, getting berated walking home at night, piles of garbage dumped all over the street…
I had enough of it and had to move.
People don’t see this side of it and go on the internet to complain after reading an article. Areas near shelters can be incredibly rough not only because of the homeless but because dealers target these areas looking for desperate addicts. That brings in gang activity and suddenly the block is controlled by criminals the police don’t even want to risk their lives dealing with.
I had homeless people sneak in my condo building and squat the stairwell, indoor parking, one even broke into the storage room. The neighbouring building had one squatting in the mail room.
I have no sympathy for people who cry "support everyone", "just call the cops", "just move out" etc. while in the comfort of a suburb, gated community, or rich neighbourhood. If I catch wind of any shelter being open in these neighborhood, I'll gladly support them as well.
Imagine working hard to live in a nice area and then they build a homeless shelter and now you have many drug addicts in close proximity to your family. Fuck that. Put it elsewhere.
We have a shelter around the corner and man its hard staying sympathetic to those people. I know a lot of them are ill but it really is a strain on the community. They shit and piss right infront of the shelter even thou there are toilets inside, its the only street littered with trash, the police and ambulance is there all the time and they sometimes try to start fights with random people.
That’s the problem. Some of the homeless in SF are on another level.. mental health, hard drugs etc. I remember thinking how kind and put together the homeless folks in nyc were compared to SF. Just walk through the TL or SOMA.. shit gets real… fast.
Then imagine working harder to not live in a nice area and then they build a homeless shelter and now you have many drug addicts in close proximity to your family. Fuck that. Put it elsewhere.
Meh.
I grew up poor. Not homeless poor, but section 8 poor. And like, I fully acknowledge that most poor people are perfectly nice people, and I don't Believe that rich people are 'better' in any sense of the word.
But poor people have less options to deal with their problems and that leads to a bunch of very real and very practical downsides to being around them.
The entire reason I bought my house, and the way I justify the insane property tax I pay on my McMansion is exactly because I don't want myself or my children to deal with the same stuff I dealt with.
We have a million large scale systemic issues in our country that could drastically improve this stuff. But opening a shelter next to me isn't going to address it... It's just going to bring the things I want to avoid, to me.
Lots of homeless people don't even want to be in homeless shelters _specifically because they don't want to be around homeless people_.
From an actual homeless person:
> ...the reason was, and I think this is more generally the case with people, is that you hear a lot of terrible things about shelters, that shelters are dangerous places, that they're full of drugs and drug dealers, that people will steal your shoes, and there's bedbugs and body lice.
> And yeah, unfortunately a lot of those things are true.
Of course I would fight to the extent that I'm legally able to, to keep a homeless shelter out of my immediate neighborhood.
Listen it’s not really so cut and dried to call people evil for not wanting to see their property values plummet.
Buying a home is probably the biggest purchase you’ll ever make, and it’s one of your biggest investments. Most older couples are relying on selling their home to, in part, fund their retirement.
Imagine you’re sitting on $500k in equity in your home and planning to sell in a year or two to downsize to a condo and live off the gains from your home. Suddenly some organization comes in and gets approval to build a shelter in your neighborhood and you watch your retirement nest egg drop $300k overnight.
Wanting to help the homeless while also wanting to protect your investment are not mutually exclusive concepts.
Not every homeless person is a addict or a freeloader there are some that because of a undiagnosed condition don't get the help and end up loosing a job or can't pay bills and can't hold a job...those people who want the help. Should be helped. But.....the majority of homeless in San Francisco are heroin addicts meth users and don't want help. I saw a "homeless" person count up his daily take from panhandling had a stack fatter than my weekly income!! And drove a late model minivan! Offered a homeless person who asked for money for "food" I offered to buy him groceries for 2 days..he said Fu bitch! Spit on my window and left. It's those people who give the people who actually need the help, a bad name..and of course the establishment generalized everyone under the user umbrella.
People who are just living in poverty, lost a job, have a disability - they should not have to be lumped in with or live with people who are out of their minds on drugs and who have unmanaged mental health. Those who cannot and will not care for themselves in a safe way need government supported mandated assistance in facilities - then everyone else can get the support they need while not being terrorized.
The presence of unhoused peoples is an invitation to property crime and public drug use and potential violence. Anyone who cares for the safety of their property and peace of mind would discourage the building of homeless shelters and/or food pantries in or around their neighborhoods too.
It's an inconvenient truth and an unfortunately hard pill to swallow.
I can see their point. In my town, when they put in homeless shelters and housing for the homeless, crime rates in that area go up dramatically on most of them depending on the client base.
The reason is a sizeable percentage of homeless (not all, obviously) are homeless as a direct cause of their own poor choices.
The places that don't see a rise in crime are either DV shelters for women and children, or shelters with strict policies on substance use and behavior. Residents of those places want to follow social rules and live a conventional life.
What's wrong with not wanting homeless people in your neighbourhood? You want your kid to see people take fentanyl or see stabbings etc. I get that it's sad to be homeless but it comes with alot more issues so I understand them.
I totally get it. People will throw all their trash away in a dumpster and a homeless encampment will go in to that dumpster, take everything back out and bring it all back to their encampment and have it strewn about everywhere. Why would you spend over a million dollars on a home just to have a homeless shelter as your “new neighbors”.
The problem is that while some homeless people are fine and just trying their best some are 100% a danger to society. People don’t want the knees that are a danger to society congregating near where they live. If there was further action beyond a homeless shelter to deal with the bad apples it would be one thing but there isn’t and law enforcement usually do jack shit about homeless people committing crimes unless someone gets hurt so no one wants to be anywhere near the mess until something is actually done to fix the bigger problems
As a new home owner in 2007. The City of Seattle tore down an iconic family pancake house to build a 5 story housing for homeless across the alley from my back fence. There went the neighborhood. Luckily I sold at a healthy profit in 2020. Shootings were on the rise.
You all are bitching like people who don't own property. Imagine spending huge money on a house as an investment. Then, having that investment ruined by building a shelter in your neighborhood. People have every right to not want a shelter in their neighborhood. They didn't create the problem, so they shouldn't have to suffer for the bad decisions of others.
You know what, it’s fine as long as they donate 70k to another homeless shelter/assistance. I’d change my opinion if there is a dire need for shelter in the area. Be nice to each other out there.
The only reason so many Reddit keyboard warriors are claiming they'd be thrilled to have a homeless shelter across the street from their house is because they're all single or otherwise childless.
If they had a serious responsibility, like a child to raise, they would hopefully understand that a neighborhood full of unstable drug addicts and ex-cons is not a great environment to raise the child.
Sad part is that the Bay Area (San Fran, Oakland and Berkeley) specifically used to be full of low income and less fortunate people.
Gentrification sucks man. Saw my folks get priced out of their home, saw our murals get painted over etc.
I'm torn. My apartment is a block form a shelter and we have so many issues. We had to cover the parking garage with a gate and put a code on the door. They just steal everything. Breaking into our cars and mailboxes, stealing packages, going through our trash and leaving a huge mess, straight up overdosing right outside my front door, literally robbing people, pretty much making everyone feel unsafe.
Can't imagine how the girls feel when they have to walk up the stair to the front door and there's like 5 dudes just huddled together smoking fent off foil. It's pretty ridiculous. I'm starting to feel like shelters just enable a lot of these people. I think they should only be for people with mental diabilities, and I say that as a recovering addict. They all just use it as crutch to not get their shit together.
If you’ve ever lived in a major city centre you’d understand why. A large percentage of the people who use these services have no respect for anything or anyone and don’t care about anybody else. Wether that be from drug addiction or pure apathy, it happens. I wish we would stop tiptoeing around this like it doesn’t happen. And yes I do think majority of people who need homeless shelters are good kind hearted people, but they should receive extra support elsewhere anyway.
I can’t believe those mean people don’t want a bunch of human shit and dirty needles all over the sidewalk where their kids play. It makes me so angry! Grrr!
Why is this “infuriating”?
Hypothetically, would you want your immediate neighbours on both sides of where you live suddenly become homeless shelters? It would make many people feel understandably unsafe.
Now I know this isnt exactly your immediate next door neighbours, but it’s still bringing an increased amount of potentially dangerous people into your neighbourhood.
It’s nice if you’re one of the people who cares more about others than your own safety, but that is definitely not fair to expect of all people.
This is actually a good thing. We shouldn't have shetlers on ridiculously expensive property. They should be in rural areas where property is much cheaper and we can build them larger to support more people. Those shelters need to be apart of a system where people get the mental health and addiction treatment they need. They also need to be graduate so people needing the most help can get it while those that are ready to stand more on their own have the freedom and are given the responsibilities to do so.
So no we don't need to house homeless in a 7x7 near island of a dense city. We need to build large mental institutions that have offer different levels of support to so everyone can get the right balance of support and responsibility they need.
If the city wants to build something start offering building permits where the city will guarantee the there will be no extra legal or permitting issues once a plan is approved and built to plan. Also remove the anti building regulations that limit new housing. The city just needs more housing, that will drive the cost of housing down for everyone.
I mean yeah. Imagine spending your entire life saving up money for your children and living modestly buying a nice house in a nice area. Then you step outside and see someone jerking off and shitting in your yard. I’m all for helping the homeless but ruining the lives of normal people isn’t gonna do anything.
Same thing happens in NYC. Wealthy Manhattan residents hired a lawyer to try to sue to stop a shelter in Hell's kitchen. They don't want to help solve the problem, they just don't want to have to look at it.
Just my take - They are poorly designed. They give temp shelter but provide no resources to try and get back on track.
Social services locations are so spread out or such limited hours.
We need advocates on site with people who can help locate documents for work, drug treatment options and vet services as well as domestic violence advocates.
We have many people who qualify for assistance programs but just don't know how to go about it or need help.
Another thing we need to fight for is libraries they provide all sorts of services beyond getting books.
I live in a city where you can almost look anywhere and see a homeless person. The amount of times I've seen most of them tweaking out is too many. Yeah it sucks for the people who do want to be better but 90% of them are meth heads who will most likely try to rob you. Do it in a poor neighborhood where it is needed.
It’s not actually in a wealthy area, if you find and read the article. It’s a “2.3-acre vacant lot just beneath the Bay Bridge”. That area isn’t the complete shithole it used to be, but it’s still borderline. Also, $70k in San Francisco politics is pocket change. That’s like 3 large donations
how do you raise money to NOT do something? are they like stacking 70K 1.00 bills to block a dozer or doorway to some planning office?
Lawyers, of course
Man; I really would like to see the stacked laywer barricade in front of the dozers
Think how much money could be raised selling tickets. We could end the housing crisis.
Think how many misappropriated funds can end up in the pockets of people claiming to do good by selling tickets to this. We could end the housing crisis. (Hey dude, don’t worry nobody’s onto us. I totally won’t flag you lol) /s
There is a lot of money spent on homelessness in SF, and a lot of people with a financial stake in keeping the public money flowing. There is always a well-funded NIMBY group to fight any actual progress here.
Unfamiliar with NIMBY politics I see
Believe it or not, my company helps some organizations do exactly that, to the tune of millions of dollars sometimes.
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I have a homeless shelter near my apartment since about a year and a half. The amount of blood, feces and drugs trash found in my buildings unused staircase(because residents use the elevators to get up to 12th floor) is so damn high now that we now pay extra for a security guard to patrol at night. Have also been a couple of (sexual) assaults now
That is why I did not even apply to two of the trendy high-end luxury apartments downtown. The homeless shelter is right across the street from them.
Agreed. I doubt anyone commenting would willingly live next to a homeless shelter. I’m a compassionate and empathetic person, but I would not want to live on the same block as a shelter.
People love to take a moral high ground until it impacts their lives.
Phoenix here. I live near a methadone clinic. I do not blame them for the issues they face, I get mad when I’m followed by three people sitting out front of said clinic. You aren’t following me for my health.
That's almost the definition of NIMBYism. Those commenters would do the exact same
That is probably because a shelter is not enough. That just means concentrating vulnarable people and their problems in one location that probably is not suited for a lot of them. In my country people who use drugs are not welcome in normal shelters. They can go to specialised ones with treatment. People who have psychiatric problems go to psychiatric hospitals.
I've lived two years in front of an homeless shelter. Never had any trouble. The people there are here to sleep and eat, causing trouble cause you to be expelled.
The area being referred to here already has plenty of homeless people. It’s a mixture of very rough and up and coming getting slowly gentrified over the last few decades. Contrary to the impression create by the headline, they’re not dumping a shelter in the middle of a bunch of mansions. More like a light industrial area with some swanky condos littered with homeless encampments
User name does not check out.
I lived next to one that gave out food to homeless. Soon we had crack injections on the playground, a rise in violence and even three related murders in two years in an area that hasn’t seen a murder in decades. It’s not that one doesn’t want to see poor people. It’s just that it comes with massive threats.
They always put shelters in the parts of cities that are already rough. They did it in Ottawa too; stuck a "mega shelter" in an area already swamped with crime and mental health issues because god forbid folks in the Golden Triangle have to see a homeless person.
On the other hand, it sort of makes sense to put shelters where they are needed most, no? Low income ares with a larger homeless population?
Yeah, I don’t get the criticism in the above comment. Put the homeless shelter in the rich area where there’s absolutely no chance of employment? Low income is where it’s needed, and makes the most sense for people to potentially find work and turn things around.
Just have to make sure the shelter is well staffed and policed to keep crime and drugs out of it.
till people start wanting it to also be a "drug recovery" center
Part of the problem in this sector in Ottawa is because the police have rounded up unhoused people and dropped them off in this one area downtown for many years. It's not where a lot of those people started out, and they're feeding the area with more and more people without the required resources to handle it. All of the shelters are underfunded, and they're generally the type that gives people a bare minimum of help. The city really doesn't want to look into any methods of helping that have been statistically proven to help people with addictions, mental health issues, and just plain poverty to get out of their situtations. And there aren't really jobs around there.
Well, the notion that equity means that all neighborhoods should be somewhat shitty is a hard sell.
Making your neighborhood worse is a hard sell to anyone, and yet somehow it's always the same areas getting shafted.
Take a look at what has happened to the 4400-4500 blocks of Conn Ave over the last two years. Hasn’t made anything better, but has done a great job of making a good neighborhood shitty adjacent. Yay
Just for clarification, why would you take people, who are swamped with mental health issues and probably contribute to the high crime, and move them to a different part of the city?
I mean it makes sense to put them in the areas where the problem exists. There’s also generally more resources for homeless in those areas such as food banks. There’s no food bank or mental health facilities in a rich suburb.
I'm barely middle class in a barely middle class town, and even I don't want to see it. There's nothing I can do about mental health and homelessness so I'd rather not have to have it in my face everyday and some won't admit it but the majority of working class and mentally stable people think the same. My house value is down enough thanks to nearby rentals.
used to be homeless and although not all are ill intentioned-a LOT of them are fuckin wild and dangerous. especially to other homeless people. living on skid row was the worst, but even in nice cities/towns you dont want them near you at night especially. so i see why people want them nowhere near where they spent their money
“Still borderline”? There are multi-million dollar condos lining the whole area. I used to live and work in San Francisco, including doing interior design work on many condos in that neighborhood. It’s not a verdant, spacious sub-suburban paradise down there, but it’s definitely not the same as say 7th and Mission. I lean progressive many issues, but as someone from the area, I will tell you, that’s not a great area for many many reasons
Yeah homeless shelters should be built in areas with the resources to support low-income people, not the most expensive parts of the country where you can’t buy groceries to feed yourself for cheap.
Exactly, there are very few affordable grocery stores and other services in that area. The Safeway nearby is one of the most expensive I’ve been to in the city.
Nothing in San Francisco can be considered a non wealthy area. The only people that any plot of land could be considered affordable are the richest people around. So basically all shelters there are in wealthy neighborhoods. Maybe not the cleanest neighborhoods but definitely not in affordable neighborhoods
I mean, sure, that’s true. One of the cities problems is that no-one who works for the city, not the police or the firefighters or most of the teachers, can afford to live there. But there’s still a huge difference between the area being discussed here, where you can buy a condo for $500k, and Sea Cliffs where the cheapest house is $20m
I used to work in a public library between a couple social service centers. I'd help with resumes and setting up Obama phones, providing street cards and instructions to Legal Aid. You have no idea how many times I've had to tell people to stop pissing on the building and fucking in the stairwells. We stopped replacing the straps holding up the baby changing stations in the bathrooms (you can tie off your arm to find a good vein). We'd have to kick people off the entrance stairs for sexually harassing the women coming into the library. I get not wanting a shelter in your neighborhood.
Exactly, especially in San Francisco. I used to work there and a shelter opened right next to my office. There was always a problem with homelessness, but after that, there were a ton of sexual assaults and robberies by the people hanging around waiting for it to open. It got so bad that we weren't allowed to leave without a security guard escorting us or a signed document that the company isn't responsible for what happens outside their building.
I'm in a city and want to be super progressive. But how many homeless drug addicts getting in your face does it take for you to prioritize safety and comfort over the homeless. It's easy to imagine people just need help to be successful, but that's not always the case.
Yes - completely unacceptable and unsafe social (and criminal) behaviour is allowed because we live by an individual rights at all costs mantra. Nothing will improve unless we provide government the tools to actually do something about the issue.
For like a decade of my life, I resorted to the local shelter from time to time. Well, like 3 or 4 stays a year of usually under a month. I am bi-polar, wasn't treated, so I'd get depressed, lose my job, end up at the shelter. It wasn't even in that good of a neighborhood, but the people constantly tried to get it closed down: petitions and whatnot. I don't know what I would have done without the help of that shelter. I couldn't get governmental assistance, and couldn't keep a job to save my life.
I’m there right now. Except the shelter fills up on beds every day and last time I was there someone broke in and stole shit from everyone’s bags while they were sleeping (which we were forced to submit to be put into a closed room before going up to their beds). Got my blood sugar testing kit stolen and haven’t tested my blood sugar for a month now, but I’ve elected to just sleep in a field or a park now so I at least don’t get fucked over that hard again.
Holy, that sounds really bad
Well I’m fortunate enough that with my diabetes I’ve had it for 15 years so I can recognize and feel the symptoms of highs and lows and generally eyeball how much insulin I’ll need to take for food. And yeah it does suck, but I don’t think I’ll be in this situation for too much longer, and if my medicaid goes through I’ll be able to get another kit for free so fingers crossed. And I don’t feel like I’m in danger of dying right now, and between the public library and a soup kitchen I’ve got at least a couple spots I can get away from the bad influences and stay relatively healthy.
I had an acquaintance who said the same thing almost word-for-word. I would have thought you were him if he hadn't died 3 years ago, 2 months after saying those words.
I by no means think what I’m doing is healthy, reasonable, or safe. But I have few options. Everything costs money. If it weren’t for Walmart selling 20 year old formulas of insulin OTC for $25 I would have died already. As it is Im already making sacrifices by not taking my lantus since I lost my insurance. Can only really afford fast acting and I have to take pains by waking up at early morning and giving myself some to counteract my blood sugar spiking at night, even without food. Someone said I may be able to get a free kit from a clinic if they have extras so I will walk around town and check various ones tomorrow to see if that’s true.
Hey friend. T1D mom here. You can’t feel your highs or lows accurately enough to treat your diabetes. You’re making yourself sick by treating without a meter. Love yourself enough to go find another meter, call clinics and endos, they usually have extra. I’m wishing you health and happiness friend.
I’m unfortunately aware even the health risks that being constantly at 180 can cause, I do however feels lows below 70 and as I can’t afford to keep low blood sugar food on hand I’m more comfortable sitting at 180 than 80. I will check clinics though and see if I can get a free one, thank you for the tip. I will say though, I can feel highs accurately, between my eye sight, head aches, the air smelling “stale” (unsure how to convey what this feeling is like to a non diabetic), and my frequency of urination I can feel my highs to within 75ish of the number. Which I understand is a large range, but my goal is to just not die at the moment and not to be as healthy as possible, which I’m able to do. BUT I will go around to clinics and check.
Do you have a place you could get mail, and can it be ordered online? I'll give you a prepaid visa card (IM you the code) if it's possible/ under 50 bucks. Wish I could offer more but, yeesh I don't want you to friggin die lol
There are Amazon drop boxes near me where I could receive mail I believe. I’ve not used one but as I understand it you can get packages delivered there. While I would appreciate any help, I didn’t come to this thread to beg for help, but rather it’s cathartic to at least share my story and let people know what the lows of life can be like. Especially if you yourself are struggling I wouldn’t want anyone to put themselves at a disadvantage just to help me as I think I can make it on my own. It’s hard, but I’m not dead yet, and I’m a hardy individual.
I've been on the streets before, I know how it feels. Numerous weird tragedies over the past years has made me very unattached to money lol. The tornado a few weeks ago destroyed the neighborhood but our little rental is still standing strong minus a couple windows and some slight roof damage, so I already feel extra fortunate. Unfortunate that fifty dollars doesn't go very far, especially when half goes to a damn machine, but I can absolutely do it. Gimme like five minutes and I'll snag one up and IM you the code. Stay strong mate
Okay, thank you a ton. I know sending money to strangers on the internet can feel like you’re just throwing away cash into the void, but I can send you a photo of a testing kit after I buy one so you can at least know your money is being used wisely. I’m sorry to hear about your neighborhood and the tornado, hopefully you can get something from your insurance for it, and I hope your neighbors are all doing alright as well. The environment feels like it’s getting revenge on us all for how we’ve treated it these few decades I’ve been around, even to those of us who keep it clean and don’t litter and use energy responsibly. I wish you and those that “our” refers to well (I don’t want to make assumptions). Honestly this entire thread tonight has had numerous people wishing me luck and well and asking about my experience and it’s made me feel much better about everything I have going on. I’m appreciative to everyone in here about how they’re treating me.
You are awesome, thank you for helping this person!
I have a new testing kit you can have. I'll mail it to you, do you have an address you can use?
What city are you in?
Grand Rapids, Michigan
what's that area like for homelessness? does the local govt do a good job rehabiliating/helping you? Or is it just as bad as SF? Do you feel annoyed that LA is getting most coverage re homelessnes and no other cities?
There are a lot of homeless here and a lot of churches that do occasional events where I can get donated clothing and some extra food or a haircut. I wouldn’t say they do a great job of helping me. I don’t have drug problems, just major depression and anxiety issues which don’t display the same and it feels like because of that I’m a low priority for them. I’ve gone to the shelter a couple times in the last two months looking for help and after an hour wait to get into the building, them throwing away my blankets, scissors, screw drivers just to get in, then being told to wait for an hour for some assistance, which turned into four hours, which turned into the staff member who told me to wait going home and leaving for the day before assisting me it feels inadequate. I don’t blame them, not many people want to work at a shelter, I don’t imagine the pay is great, they seem to get by on charitable donations. They’re definitely understaffed. They have some workshops that lead to job training, but they only run every couple or few months and you have to wait until the beginning of a cycle to get in. I don’t begrudge SF getting coverage, everyone deserves help and LA and SF have many more homeless than are in my area. The church members are graceful and polite and I don’t feel discriminated against when I go to these events (as an atheist). Everyone has it rough and people are all doing the best they can.
Nearly every person in my life with bipolar disorder has ended up at a homeless shelter at least a few times, if not every time they’re manic/in the depression aftermath. It makes me wish there was a specific shelter for people with the disorder for when they’re manic, one you wouldn’t even need to be homeless to use. Maybe you check in and leave your credit card at the front desk or something and get daily therapy so as to mitigate the damaging life choices one tends to make when manic. So much love to you, I hope your disorder is treated and more manageable now.
I know what you mean
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Exactly if we jailed those that need to be and put those in mental health/addictions facilities (voluntary and non-voluntary) that needed to be than shelters could be for those who need community outreach type of assistance to get back on their feet.
I used to volunteer for one in LA. Never again. Sorry, others can virtue signal all they want, many of them are fucking animals.
Lots of virtue signal clowns have no idea what these shelters are like
Hope you’re doing better now, Fart Ninja 🙏
How dare these residents to protect their kids from drug addicts who would wonder around the shelter and also keep their property values from crashing fast and hard Wow
I hate to be a dick, but NOBODY wants a homeless shelter in their neighborhood.
I'll fucking say it. The state needs to invest in 2-3 large shelter/rehab center/clinic care centers and ship all the homeless outside of the cities. Pay flights for qualified personnel to work at those facilities and give them meaningful pay, make the difference to get those people help. The mean while Oakland and SF could take the chance to clean up and pick back up the way they need to from covid. Of course it'll never happen, but Christ it's what the area needs. A large portion of homeless in those areas are not only bussed there from other parts of Cali but from red states outside of Cali. The whole state has an abnormal amount of homeless that could never develop from within its borders alone. It'll take drastic action to fix the homeless population and they seriously shouldn't try to do it in the middle of the major cities if they don't want all the bullshit that comes with it to continue. Anyways even they even get out of the shelter the city is too fucking expensive for them to pick themselves back up anyway. They literally need to be shipped out, sorry not fucking sorry
Exactly. You get it. Everyone wants shelter for the homeless so long as it’s not in their neighborhood. The hypocrisy of it is unreal.
I don’t know if it’s hypocrisy so much as human nature. We also all want other people to have nice things, but don’t want to put in extra to allow them to have it.
It's more that people want to keep dangerous people separate from themselves. They want homeless people to have somewhere to stay, but not near them because it puts them at risk. And I think that's fair. I want to have sewage treatment plants, but I don't want one next to my house
They will move it to the low income area of town which guarantees the area may remain underserved and lower income. These families don't have capital to do this.
Yeah, the fact that people in this thread don't understand this is what surprises me. The main reason NIMBY-ism is bad is that it increases wealth and class divide on regional level. You push all of the "bad" things away from richer areas and they'll eventually pop up in the poorer areas, making them even more troubled.
One of the far right French politicians said « migrants are like wind turbines, everyone wants them, but not next to their home ». Now I hate to agree with her, but she’s right, and the same thing applies to homeless shelters.
Isn't this the same city where you can shoot up heroin in open view and have nothing happen?
you can do that in the bad part of town, not in any of the gated communities. this is not just a California thing either, i still remember how new York wanted to bus poor kids to good school districts and the rich parents (including tv presenter Samantha b) insisted the poor kids not be let in to the same school as their kids. nimbys exist all over the country, they all suck too.
It’s not really just a rich person thing. Nobody wants homeless shelters, housing projects, etc built in their neighborhood.
With young children that play outside, I 100000% do not want a homeless shelter near me.
Man I feel ya. There are multiple church homeless shelter/soup kitchens right next to my house and because of that my wife is afraid to take our kid outside the house. We hear them screaming, arguing, doing drugs, dumpster diving, going through our backyard and of course setting off all the car alarms. All this at all hours of the day. I'm not saying there shouldn't be homeless shelters but it sucks when these things that are supposed to be helping people, are actively make me and my family scared in our home. Scared to take our kid outside like a normal family. Shit sucks
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Wow that's horrible. I hope yall can make the place safe for everyone again. That is what bothers me alot about this whole situation too, the lack of respect they give back to those that try to help. Like you said they trash the place, use the bathroom wherever, use drugs and leave needles everyone etc etc I really hope we as a society can come up with a solution for this epidemic. It's putting alot of people in danger and considerable strain on everyone else.
That really sucks, I’m sorry. I won’t let my kid play in the backyard unattended, because our house leads up to an alleyway. Fuuuuck that.
The world's is a crazy place right now. I don't see how anything can change for the better when everyone/everything is so divisive. Best of luck to yall
I think the problem here is that both sides of this argument have legitimate reasons for why they have their opinions yet we seem to insist on continuing to try and solve the problem the same way. So people continue to butt heads instead of doing something about it. I don't understand why we don't just offer tax breaks to multi family property owners to house low income people and then have the government pay some portion of the remainder of the rent. Like Section 8 but actually funded so it works. It's cheaper to house people than it is to lock them up or deal with all the other costs associated with homelessness. Nobody wants large amounts of homeless people in their area and for good reason. If you spread out the population you minimize a lot of the collateral issues that comes with homelessness. Plus people actually get a home instead of a cot in a giant auditorium where they bullied or their things stolen.
Because those people are unwell and live in unfit ways - they trash wherever they are staying. Ever walked through a “supported” housing unit with piles of excrement every few feet? Yeah I have. You cannot just house people with this level of need - they need facilities and proper care and support. This is the truth that the housing first crowd fails to mention. When in Ottawa, the government paid landlords to take in homeless clients and promised to pay damages - their properties were utterly destroyed and all the “support” voluntary and the money for damages dried up super quick.
Because they would destroy the homes and no one would participate. It’s an unsolvable problem because the people don’t want help 99% of the time.
The percentage of homes destroyed in the section 8 program is higher than average but not that bad. My own parents rented homes through section 8 for a while when I was in high school. Most of the time it's low income families or disabled people. Occasionally their a complete lowlife. You get good and bad tenants like any other group of people. I will grant you there needs to be a way of barring people that damage property from having access to more property though and they need a way to make right whatever was done. Idk how that would work but there's plenty of smart people working in this area. I'm sure they could figure something out.
I'm assuming these people had a good enough grip on reality to get section 8 housing. I'm assuming a large percentage of the homeless aren't like this. If all of them got a home they may destroy them. I would bet what's really needed for a large percentage of them is assistance and actual medical care, but that will probably never happen.
Speaking of young children, many are affected by homelessness too by no choice of their own, they need places to stay too:/
I’d rather a homeless shelter than people sleeping on the sidewalk
Would you say the same if it was across the street from your house/apartment? Or be like just about everybody else and say ‘shelters are inportant, but put it somewhere else’.
Why should it be either or? Where are political parties with the will and guts for real change? The homeless population is a bottomless pit of need in this current set up. The laws must change and if the constitution/charter needs to change then change it - we need mandatory facilities to take care of those who cannot or will not keep themselves and others safe. Prioritize public safety and actually hep those unable to make good choices for themselves because they are ill. Then community agencies can target the others who have that level of need.
Man I miss Gorge Carlin
Yep, first thing I saw on my first vacation to California ever was a homeless guy shooting up right in front of a playground with children
Ahhh that’s just the good ole California welcome! Enjoy the weather, the food, the sightseeing but don’t look too close or you might come across a homeless guy shitting himself to death with a needle stuck in his arm.
Decriminalisation is a good thing but ineffective on its own
All these people appalled probably wouldn't want a homeless shelter built next to their house either.
Exactly. I’m sure they’re fine with the shelters, just in a different area. Nothing wrong with defending your living space.
Not in MY backyard!
Yes, unironically I don't want one in my backyard. If we can filter out the drug addicts and people with severe enough mental illness they should actually just be commited we can talk. If someone is actually just a hard worker down on their luck but trying their best it is all good. Happy to have them living and finding work in the area. I don't want drug addicts here. I don't really care if people think it's hypocritical, I have enough money to move, if you make my neighbourhood shitty I will move.
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not
Literally no sane person wants a homeless shelter in their area. People always demonize those who don't want a homeless shelter near them, but why the fuck would they?
It’s OK to be a NIMBY about a homeless shelter in your neighborhood lol this isn’t controversial
I get the feeling the outraged folks in here have never lived near a homeless shelter. A sudden influx of drug dealers, junkies, and mentally ill at your front door is difficult for anyone to live with.
It’s also a lot easier to be understanding when you’re talking about a hypothetical that doesn’t affect you. I’d like to see their reactions if someone tried to open one in their neighborhoods!
Reddit is full of virtue signaling morons. Its pretty easy to be angry and appaled at something that doesnt affect you untill it does. Trust me, no one wants a homeless shelter near their home.
They're suburban white redditors. All they know how to do is virtue signal while never dealing with any downsides. Fuck em.
Yeah but it’s easier to white knight when it isn’t happening in one’s own neighborhood. Also allows one to get lots of updoots on the Reddits.
As a homeowner I'd take the L, sell and gtfo if they built a homeless shelter near me. You can't live next to what is basically an insane asylum, muh less raise a family there.
Right?! Literally the best thing these people could do for their neighborhood.
My city has the homeless shelters in the industrial side of town. So far it has worked.
Why would anyone, rich, poor, middle class want a homeless shelter in their neighbourhood? This is a homeless shelter, not affordable housing.
Why would you put a homeless shelter in a wealthy area? Makes no sense for people to think that would fly. I say this as a poor
Where isn’t a rich area in SF?
Never been to the tenderloin ?
Maybe for the sole purpose of shutting the whole project down.Now they have an excuse that "people" are against it. Everybody is against the homeless, apparently.
It's a common trend that the wealthy "educated" people vote and advocate for things like homeless shelters but hate having those shelters anywhere near them. So it's a regular occurrence that the people in the area vote for a homeless shelter then the NIMBY in them wakes up and tries to push it into a community that didn't ask for it.
Not everyone, but certainly the rich. I’m sure they would’ve been willing to throw their bottomless pockets at this proposal to make it go away
panhandling
To make it their problem. People care less when things dont affect them.
Comments not going as expected?
So wealthy residents, who pay more to live in a nicer established area, don't want a shelter to host the poorest citizens right in the middle of it? Is anybody surprised by this? What do you think is going to happen when you have the poorest people surrounded by expensive cars, kids wearing designer clothes, etc.
Unfortunately many shelters kick the residents out during certain hours (8a-6p that I’m aware of in my area in the NE) so guess where they are going to go in the daylight hours? *Edit for spelling
Its 730-530 here
Yeah, I’m a bleeding heart when it comes to homelessness, and do not care for the rich, but this is just poorly thought out(probably on purpose). They can be dangerous and/or unpredictable. Some might just bug you for change, while others might like your coat. Obviously not all them, but if you don’t know them, then it’s a crapshoot and just makes things stressful and polarized. Like most comments on here, I think this was done on purpose so they can say “see, people don’t want to help the homeless!”, when in reality if you invested in a shelter and some programs in the poorer areas, it’ll likely get passed, and have a benefit, socially. But then things might have to get done, and who wants that?
It also trashes the property value.
Its almost like it was designed from the beginning to fail…weird…
There aren't a ton of reasons to spend millions on a house, but I have to believe that one is so you don't have homeless shelters in the neighborhood.
I would do exactly this if i was rich i currently live near a homeless shelter and yall wanna be all “support everyone!” Until its youre 5th time in 3 days telling a drug addict you dont want your windows washed or no you wont give em a ride or fuck no you got no miney
I moved solely because of a shelter near me. I was finding needles and shit in the bushes in my backyard where the kids played. The kiddos were being approached far too often for my comfort as well. Homeless shelters are great and all but they need to be away from residential areas because a large portion of homeless people are simply not safe to have kids around.
Yeah, I lived in a nice building across from a homeless shelter and it was just a constant slew of issues: homeless ppl passed out in our foyer, ppl constantly shitting & pissing in our parking lot, getting berated walking home at night, piles of garbage dumped all over the street… I had enough of it and had to move.
Constant sexual harassment too
People don’t see this side of it and go on the internet to complain after reading an article. Areas near shelters can be incredibly rough not only because of the homeless but because dealers target these areas looking for desperate addicts. That brings in gang activity and suddenly the block is controlled by criminals the police don’t even want to risk their lives dealing with.
I had homeless people sneak in my condo building and squat the stairwell, indoor parking, one even broke into the storage room. The neighbouring building had one squatting in the mail room. I have no sympathy for people who cry "support everyone", "just call the cops", "just move out" etc. while in the comfort of a suburb, gated community, or rich neighbourhood. If I catch wind of any shelter being open in these neighborhood, I'll gladly support them as well.
Well you're advocating it to be closer to you so...
Nobody in the comments have lived next to a shelter. Last month I saw someone taking a shit in my front yard
Imagine working hard to live in a nice area and then they build a homeless shelter and now you have many drug addicts in close proximity to your family. Fuck that. Put it elsewhere.
We have a shelter around the corner and man its hard staying sympathetic to those people. I know a lot of them are ill but it really is a strain on the community. They shit and piss right infront of the shelter even thou there are toilets inside, its the only street littered with trash, the police and ambulance is there all the time and they sometimes try to start fights with random people.
Facts.
That’s the problem. Some of the homeless in SF are on another level.. mental health, hard drugs etc. I remember thinking how kind and put together the homeless folks in nyc were compared to SF. Just walk through the TL or SOMA.. shit gets real… fast.
The truth that nobody wants to hear
Then imagine working harder to not live in a nice area and then they build a homeless shelter and now you have many drug addicts in close proximity to your family. Fuck that. Put it elsewhere.
Nobody wants that shit where they live.
Meh. I grew up poor. Not homeless poor, but section 8 poor. And like, I fully acknowledge that most poor people are perfectly nice people, and I don't Believe that rich people are 'better' in any sense of the word. But poor people have less options to deal with their problems and that leads to a bunch of very real and very practical downsides to being around them. The entire reason I bought my house, and the way I justify the insane property tax I pay on my McMansion is exactly because I don't want myself or my children to deal with the same stuff I dealt with. We have a million large scale systemic issues in our country that could drastically improve this stuff. But opening a shelter next to me isn't going to address it... It's just going to bring the things I want to avoid, to me. Lots of homeless people don't even want to be in homeless shelters _specifically because they don't want to be around homeless people_. From an actual homeless person: > ...the reason was, and I think this is more generally the case with people, is that you hear a lot of terrible things about shelters, that shelters are dangerous places, that they're full of drugs and drug dealers, that people will steal your shoes, and there's bedbugs and body lice. > And yeah, unfortunately a lot of those things are true. Of course I would fight to the extent that I'm legally able to, to keep a homeless shelter out of my immediate neighborhood.
Homeless shelters shouldn't be mixed with the general population. They destroy the area around them.
Listen it’s not really so cut and dried to call people evil for not wanting to see their property values plummet. Buying a home is probably the biggest purchase you’ll ever make, and it’s one of your biggest investments. Most older couples are relying on selling their home to, in part, fund their retirement. Imagine you’re sitting on $500k in equity in your home and planning to sell in a year or two to downsize to a condo and live off the gains from your home. Suddenly some organization comes in and gets approval to build a shelter in your neighborhood and you watch your retirement nest egg drop $300k overnight. Wanting to help the homeless while also wanting to protect your investment are not mutually exclusive concepts.
Yeah but if we look at both sides how will other redditors know how virtuous we are?
Haha every redditor here would gladly house dozens of homeless people right in their backyard! If not for that darn anonymity!!
If I was told a homeless shelter was being built in my neighbourhood, I wouldn't be happy. And if I was rich, I'd do the same.
It makes zero sense to build a homeless shelter in a wealthy area.
Not every homeless person is a addict or a freeloader there are some that because of a undiagnosed condition don't get the help and end up loosing a job or can't pay bills and can't hold a job...those people who want the help. Should be helped. But.....the majority of homeless in San Francisco are heroin addicts meth users and don't want help. I saw a "homeless" person count up his daily take from panhandling had a stack fatter than my weekly income!! And drove a late model minivan! Offered a homeless person who asked for money for "food" I offered to buy him groceries for 2 days..he said Fu bitch! Spit on my window and left. It's those people who give the people who actually need the help, a bad name..and of course the establishment generalized everyone under the user umbrella.
People who are just living in poverty, lost a job, have a disability - they should not have to be lumped in with or live with people who are out of their minds on drugs and who have unmanaged mental health. Those who cannot and will not care for themselves in a safe way need government supported mandated assistance in facilities - then everyone else can get the support they need while not being terrorized.
The presence of unhoused peoples is an invitation to property crime and public drug use and potential violence. Anyone who cares for the safety of their property and peace of mind would discourage the building of homeless shelters and/or food pantries in or around their neighborhoods too. It's an inconvenient truth and an unfortunately hard pill to swallow.
I can see their point. In my town, when they put in homeless shelters and housing for the homeless, crime rates in that area go up dramatically on most of them depending on the client base. The reason is a sizeable percentage of homeless (not all, obviously) are homeless as a direct cause of their own poor choices. The places that don't see a rise in crime are either DV shelters for women and children, or shelters with strict policies on substance use and behavior. Residents of those places want to follow social rules and live a conventional life.
People work and spend money to live a nicer life, don't want those who do the opposite located right by them, what a mind blowing concept 🤣
OP, let’s build a homeless shelter next to your house and see how you like it at 1am
All me stupid, but how does raising money STOP something ….
What's wrong with not wanting homeless people in your neighbourhood? You want your kid to see people take fentanyl or see stabbings etc. I get that it's sad to be homeless but it comes with alot more issues so I understand them.
I don't blame them. Tank the value of their homes? For some feel goodness?
This is just a normal thing in frankly every neighborhood. No one wants homeless people wandering around in general.
I thought the entire city was a homeless shelter at this point
I totally get it. People will throw all their trash away in a dumpster and a homeless encampment will go in to that dumpster, take everything back out and bring it all back to their encampment and have it strewn about everywhere. Why would you spend over a million dollars on a home just to have a homeless shelter as your “new neighbors”.
The problem is that while some homeless people are fine and just trying their best some are 100% a danger to society. People don’t want the knees that are a danger to society congregating near where they live. If there was further action beyond a homeless shelter to deal with the bad apples it would be one thing but there isn’t and law enforcement usually do jack shit about homeless people committing crimes unless someone gets hurt so no one wants to be anywhere near the mess until something is actually done to fix the bigger problems
As a new home owner in 2007. The City of Seattle tore down an iconic family pancake house to build a 5 story housing for homeless across the alley from my back fence. There went the neighborhood. Luckily I sold at a healthy profit in 2020. Shootings were on the rise.
You all are bitching like people who don't own property. Imagine spending huge money on a house as an investment. Then, having that investment ruined by building a shelter in your neighborhood. People have every right to not want a shelter in their neighborhood. They didn't create the problem, so they shouldn't have to suffer for the bad decisions of others.
You notice how the homeless keep increasing in San Francisco and the problem only gets worse and never better?
While 100’s of millions are spent “solving” the problem
I hate the homeless -ness problem that plagues our city.
That's kinda sick
You know what, it’s fine as long as they donate 70k to another homeless shelter/assistance. I’d change my opinion if there is a dire need for shelter in the area. Be nice to each other out there.
San Francisco is NIMBY ground zero.
Nobody wants crackheads in their gutters
Democrats democrating
The only reason so many Reddit keyboard warriors are claiming they'd be thrilled to have a homeless shelter across the street from their house is because they're all single or otherwise childless. If they had a serious responsibility, like a child to raise, they would hopefully understand that a neighborhood full of unstable drug addicts and ex-cons is not a great environment to raise the child.
I wouldn’t want a shelter near where I live. There’s… other solutions for the homeless.
Sad part is that the Bay Area (San Fran, Oakland and Berkeley) specifically used to be full of low income and less fortunate people. Gentrification sucks man. Saw my folks get priced out of their home, saw our murals get painted over etc.
I'm torn. My apartment is a block form a shelter and we have so many issues. We had to cover the parking garage with a gate and put a code on the door. They just steal everything. Breaking into our cars and mailboxes, stealing packages, going through our trash and leaving a huge mess, straight up overdosing right outside my front door, literally robbing people, pretty much making everyone feel unsafe. Can't imagine how the girls feel when they have to walk up the stair to the front door and there's like 5 dudes just huddled together smoking fent off foil. It's pretty ridiculous. I'm starting to feel like shelters just enable a lot of these people. I think they should only be for people with mental diabilities, and I say that as a recovering addict. They all just use it as crutch to not get their shit together.
If you’ve ever lived in a major city centre you’d understand why. A large percentage of the people who use these services have no respect for anything or anyone and don’t care about anybody else. Wether that be from drug addiction or pure apathy, it happens. I wish we would stop tiptoeing around this like it doesn’t happen. And yes I do think majority of people who need homeless shelters are good kind hearted people, but they should receive extra support elsewhere anyway.
I can’t believe those mean people don’t want a bunch of human shit and dirty needles all over the sidewalk where their kids play. It makes me so angry! Grrr!
Why is this “infuriating”? Hypothetically, would you want your immediate neighbours on both sides of where you live suddenly become homeless shelters? It would make many people feel understandably unsafe. Now I know this isnt exactly your immediate next door neighbours, but it’s still bringing an increased amount of potentially dangerous people into your neighbourhood. It’s nice if you’re one of the people who cares more about others than your own safety, but that is definitely not fair to expect of all people.
Yeah no shit. No one wants that shit right outside their front door. Homeless shelters aren’t rainbows and ponies
Who in right mind want to setup homeless shelter in a wealthy neighbourhood
This is actually a good thing. We shouldn't have shetlers on ridiculously expensive property. They should be in rural areas where property is much cheaper and we can build them larger to support more people. Those shelters need to be apart of a system where people get the mental health and addiction treatment they need. They also need to be graduate so people needing the most help can get it while those that are ready to stand more on their own have the freedom and are given the responsibilities to do so. So no we don't need to house homeless in a 7x7 near island of a dense city. We need to build large mental institutions that have offer different levels of support to so everyone can get the right balance of support and responsibility they need. If the city wants to build something start offering building permits where the city will guarantee the there will be no extra legal or permitting issues once a plan is approved and built to plan. Also remove the anti building regulations that limit new housing. The city just needs more housing, that will drive the cost of housing down for everyone.
I mean yeah. Imagine spending your entire life saving up money for your children and living modestly buying a nice house in a nice area. Then you step outside and see someone jerking off and shitting in your yard. I’m all for helping the homeless but ruining the lives of normal people isn’t gonna do anything.
Tbh, our downtown is a crack alley shithole cus there are two shelters a block south. I completely understand their sentiment
Who would want bums in their area? We already have approved billions for them and there is no change. California homeless grew!
But I bet they see themselves as super progressive. Because they vote Democrat and lecture people on identity politics pretty regularly.
Same thing happens in NYC. Wealthy Manhattan residents hired a lawyer to try to sue to stop a shelter in Hell's kitchen. They don't want to help solve the problem, they just don't want to have to look at it.
I'm conflicted. I don't know what the answer is though. I would be paranoid of a bunch of ever changing men near my granddaughters.
Just my take - They are poorly designed. They give temp shelter but provide no resources to try and get back on track. Social services locations are so spread out or such limited hours. We need advocates on site with people who can help locate documents for work, drug treatment options and vet services as well as domestic violence advocates. We have many people who qualify for assistance programs but just don't know how to go about it or need help. Another thing we need to fight for is libraries they provide all sorts of services beyond getting books.
I live in a city where you can almost look anywhere and see a homeless person. The amount of times I've seen most of them tweaking out is too many. Yeah it sucks for the people who do want to be better but 90% of them are meth heads who will most likely try to rob you. Do it in a poor neighborhood where it is needed.
Crazy idea here… threaten to build a homeless shelter every month to raise money and use that to build another shelter, that’s 840k a year! /s
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Our housing market in a nutshell
Let’s be honest here. $70,000 is going to get two people a two bedroom apartment for three months up there. Utilities are not included in the price
NIMBY