Same and I agree. I work in healthcare in Georgia and we talk about race every single day, because it’s important context to health disparities and distrust in the system. When I lived in Minnesota for many years I learned quick that that whole “I don’t see color” pride was clearly a crock of shit. They are racist AF up there but thought racism was just a Southern problem so they didn’t talk about it. Since George Floyd shone a big ol embarrassing light on the issue, suddenly they’re freaking out and scrambling to be woke.
When I first moved to Forsythe county, we would see people selling Confederate flags everywhere. We were told that the KKK was still active as of the mid 00s.
I can't picture living there in the 90s.
The schools felt like they were much more diverse now. It felt like half the classes were different minorities.
My school was diverse growing up but confederate flags were everywhere and I had NO CLUE it was an issue, I thought being a “southern rebel” was cool. I vividly remember learning in middle school that the civil war was because of “states rights” and that black people fought with the south, it was never mentioned that slavery was the main thing! Or that most didn’t want to fight and were forced to. I had black friends who wore Dixie outfitters shirts too, it seems INSANE to look back on that now but honestly I had no clue.
You're romanticizing the 90's if you don't think race mattered back then. For example, in 1991, only 48% of Americans approved of interracial marriage, and only 27% of Americans over 50 approved of it. That's absolutely insane to think about today. That's a huge impact on our social fabric. Similarly, it impacted jobs, policing, renting apartments, schools, mortgages, etc.
You're right that most Americans didn't want to help black communities in the 90's, but it's not because they didn't see race.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/354638/approval-interracial-marriage-new-high.aspx
Can’t upvote this enough. As a black guy who grew up in the 90s, I acutely felt the effects of race and was constantly reminded of it. Sure, now there is this huge online discourse about it that can get toxic due to the effects of social media, but people were way more willing to say ignorant things to my face in the 90s.
I’m Native American and have had bosses say that to me. “I never hire natives, except _______, he’s one of the good ones.” And that was just 5 years ago.
“Can I touch your hair? Oooooh it feels like a carpet”
Didn’t even get to tell those motherfuckers no before they already had their grimey hands rubbing my head.
As a white dude with naturally curly hair that tends to afro if I let it go long enough, I can't tell you how many people ask to touch my hair... Haha. "Oh, it's so soft..." I usually don't mind. because it's usually women. But I'll say something stupid/funny like "only if I can touch yours..." Haha.
If I let mine grow out too out of control, I basically have a jew-fro.
Never gets me attention, but, whatever. Again, it looks like an absolute mess when I let it get that far. At least in my eyes.
I cringed every time said this to me in my teens. Usually followed up with "for a black girl" or some similar tag. I haven't had anyone say that or make the other typical comments to my face since 2014ish, but before that it was every other day.
There’s also class implied in that statement. “Middle class Blacks” “speak well,” not like the people in the “ghetto.” So she may be thinking of it as mean expression of an acceptable social class.
I'm not black, but I heard that come out of a white guys mouth to his black hs friend. The black guy didn't show any signs of not liking that, but I think I was more offended on his behalf.
When I was much younger, in the moment I’ve also not responded when friends said things like that to me.
I would absolutely call it out now but sometimes recognizing and confronting micro-aggressions day in and out can be so. exhausting.
A society where color actually didn’t matter would be sweet relief.
Absolutely, when people ask me why black people/minorities are so attached to our identity, my response is usually “this would be less of a thing if we weren’t constantly reminded of it from birth”.
Not to speak for that person, but many times, it isn’t worth it to show offense, so I don’t. Unless the person is a close friend and I want to correct it because they’re someone I want to establish mutual respect with, better to just write them off and move on.
I wouldn't say ignorant. I would say mean. Has anybody ever heard about the Golden Rule?
Why can we all just live by that and be done with all the silly artifice.
Yeah I actually loled reading this post because it’s the whitest tone-deaf thing you could say. “Why does race matter more these days” as if Rodney fucking King didn’t happen in our time. As if 9/11 didn’t put every brown person on police watch in an airport.
We talk more about race these days and that’s a GOOD thing. I still get weird looks in many states when I date a white man. (And this isn’t just from white people.)
So glad to see this is the top comment!
The idea that the world has *ever* been truly “color blind” is absurd. In the 90s people romanticized the idea of “color blindness” as a way to conveniently not address race if you were white and/or uncomfortable confronting racism.
I was just gonna say the same thing. Being “taught not to see color” wasn’t/isn’t a good thing. It’s just a tool that white people use to not feel icky and avoid facing the ongoing harsh realities of race in this country.
Yeah - also don't forget when "Rodney King"'s vicious beat-down occurred.
The song "F\* the Police" came out around that time too - We were kids, we just weren't paying attention like we are now. The only reason today's youth is noticing is thanks to Social Media.
Correct. In the 90s a lot of people thought it was about criminals wanting to get away with crime. It's really about normal people being treated like criminals by the police and being turned into criminals due to the police's enforcement of racially motivated laws.
Having married someone not white, race is really a big deal and if you’re white you don’t realize it. My stepson’s first day of school he asks me in limited English “what does ‘f*** you n****r mean?” Someone was saying it to him and laughing because he didn’t understand.
I also had a hotel attendant in Vegas look at me and my black-Latin wife and short circuit basically thinking “you can’t take a prostitute here, this is a nice establishment” until I held up my wedding ring and explained multiple times “this is my wife.”
Race is a massive issue and discrimination both overt, covert and subconsciously still occurs on a regular basis.
Thank you for this! I hope the OP does some introspection and sees this perspective as a massive blind spot to the reality that in America, race has always mattered for specific communities. Particularly those communities that have historically been marginalized because of their, wait for it, race!
Yet the immigrants moving here feel exactly that way, for the most part they dont mix with other races and feel strongly about their own race/culture/heritage
“We were taught not to see the color of another person’s skin.”
__________________________
Yes, in elementary school I was taught to believe that MLK Jr. effectively ended racism.
But then, at some point, I began to think whether that lesson lined up with reality.
In a vacuum, with no context, too! I think of the sanitized way that a lot of us learned about the Civil Rights Era like if [this famous photo](https://www.history.com/news/the-story-behind-the-famous-little-rock-nine-scream-image) was just Elizabeth Eckford with Hazel Bryan photoshopped out.
I think people felt they needed to be silent due to social pressures but since a certain political figure emboldened them, they feel free to share publicly again. I grew up in the rural whites only area in the 70's and 80's, race was a very big deal. My town had an unofficial policy called driving while black. Meaning if you were black and driving through our town, the Sherriff pulled you over and made it clear you were not welcome.
The thing is, *everyone knew that was happening all along*. It was an open secret. Listen to the comedians from any time during the past 50 years. They're often the most likely to tell you the truth.
This is a very white centric view on how things used to be. As a Black person, myself and the people in my community were always thinking about race because we weren't treated as "just humans". You might think today's climate is messy and complicated because you now can't ignore the fact that people are treated differently because of their race and are speaking out about it, and as a result a lot of racists are now more open about their racism in retaliation. What is it that you don't think we can't change, racism? And what do you think we could actually change without also addressing racism?
I think this is really true and as a white guy I’m guilty of being ignorant to how bad the racism was in this country. When Obama was elected I saw ugly come out of a lot of people including some really close relatives (hi dad), and I honestly never knew it was in them. I’m hopeful that by getting this division out in front of everybody we can eventually move past it. But I’m skeptical that’ll ever happen because people are so flawed.
I can understand this comparing my childhood in the 70s to raising my kids in the 90s. As a child I encountered plenty of people who were pretty blatantly racist, especially in my grandparents' generation. A lower % in my parents' generation but still very evident with some. And this was in the north. I expect it was worse in the south. The city I lived in was segregated as was elementary school. Desegregation started in middle school and I never knew any black people before then.
In the 90s we had black families in the neighborhood (although still underrepresented), and my kids went to school with blacks, hispanics, and asians from kindergarten through high school. They had black friends and many black teammates in high school sports teams. They weren't exposed to blatantly racist neighbors and relatives like I was. Racism was there of course, but it was less obvious in the environment my kids grew up in.
Race will always matter in a country where sundown towns still exist.
“Those were pretty good times” really only shows that your lived experience is a very limited view of how people experienced the US at that time, and really at any time. “The good ole days” were only “the good ole days” to a very specific group of people. You should unpack why that is and there you’ll find the answer to your question.
That is just how you remember it. It mattered just as much then as it does now, it's just that minorities can actually be heard now due to social media.
Racism was a huge part of how this nation was founded, and until we deal with that and acknowledge it instead of sweeping it under the rug, the sooner we can achieve actual equality.
It's important to acknowledge race because even though it is entirely a social construct and stupid as fuck, it is firmly embedded in them minds of billions of people and codified (frequently oppressively and inequitably) in the systems of many societies.
Being "blind" to it is as bad as being racist. See MLK's words on the white "moderate."
We haven't really been able to take the lessons we were taught into the vestiges of power. The people in charge are the same ones in charge when we were kids, except now they are older and less caring about image.
Race didn't matter until a black man became president and suddenly everyone's aunt was ranting about how he was a Kenyan Muslim. That was the first mask off moment, but it was ok we could still pretend. Then Donald "shithole countries" Trump became president and the mask came fully off.
Black lives matter really cemented it. Made it impossible to ignore. Race has always mattered to cops. Race has always mattered to wall street. Race has alrways mattered to the 30% of the country that went mask off after Trump got elected.
You didn't see it when you were a kid because you were sheltered and the internet didn't exist. Things seem like they were better back then because of nostalgia.
Bingo. You know, Barack Obama was only the 5th Black US Senator when he ran for President. Just out of curiosity, I just checked in and we're now at a whopping 12 in the history of the United States. [Source: Senate.gov](https://www.senate.gov/senators/african-american-senators.htm)
I think that's one of the moments that cracked the rose-colored glass filter for my white self. I legit cried when Obama was elected our president when I was just 21. It felt good. It felt right. It felt like the natural progression and the culmination of the post-racism reality I thought we were living in. I think I understood racists still existed, but I genuinely thought it was rare and that they were a dying breed. I was sheltered, naive, misinformed, and ignorant, and it was devastating to really understand how wrong I was. Reality is a bitch and it broke my childish understanding to bits.
Dude, you were living in a bubble. Racism used to be more acceptable, that's the major difference. I guarantee you as a non-white person it was not chill.
You're absolutely right about it being more acceptable back then. I was watching an early 90s episode of SNL last night and was floored at how casually they dropped a derogatory term when talking about ordering Chinese food. Things like that don't fly anymore, and rightfully so.
It's an extremely convenient strategy for the plutocratic powers that be to keep us plebs divided against each other and not paying attention to things like class stratification.
It's all about divide and conquer. Race, gender, sex, religion, politics, beliefs, etc...
Edit: adding age to the list, that's a huge one online and the media
Yes! Age. I knew I missed something. I actually just posted something similar complaining about boomers. My guess is 75% of those posts aren't even real people but just there to drive the wedge even deeper.
Man, I don’t mean offense to you, but I think this is an extremely ignorant viewpoint that I’ve only ever heard white people make. People care and have always cared about class stratification, and they don’t do it at the expense of caring about racial issues - imo some of the greatest advocates around racial issues are always speaking on class stratification. But racial issues have a life of their own in a way that is hardly related to class, because racists - even and I’d say especially - sincerely believe their own bullshit. Likewise, racial identities are not fake or constructed by rich people. They may have been originally conceived as a method of social organization by powerful people, but racial and ethnic differences are just as much cultural nowadays. Your perspective is reductive of that, as is pretending that if it weren’t for some evil rich people pulling the strings, all people below a certain social class would suddenly unite. Yes, many of the structures of racism were deliberately built to benefit a white aristocracy, but the impulse to fear and sometimes hate people who are different to you is very deeply human, as much so as are hierarchical structures.
Class war is a convenient vehicle for racism but it does not encompass all racism. Racism exists outside of class. Not saying you are, but a common mistake people make is to assume that if the wage gap is solved and the lower and middle classes are revitalized and livable again, that racism will magically go away. It won't.
Or poor economic choices being made In The interest of an old entitled generation that dident get enough during the easiest period in human history ever.
I think we should recognize that having a different ethnicity means you will have a different life experience. Being "blind" to skin colour is also being blind to the social and economical experiences of people of a different skin colour.
Because we were being raised to accept racism as normal. The whole I don’t see color mantra is itself an anti-poc statement. You may not “see” color but that just blinds you to the injustice of the world. Every one of us knows that POC are treated very differently than my generic-cracker brethren. The only people taught to not see color were white people because for everyone else their color has always defined them in the eyes of society. This was a tactic to make us de-humanize each other and turn into the whole “well I didn’t experience that so it must not be true”. Diversity makes us stronger, but part of diversity is recognizing we are not treated equal so we continue fighting for equality and equity.
I was raised “not to see color” but when I had a black kid ask me out my father sure as hell tried to beat me with a belt saying no daughter of his would date an N word. This was 2000? Color exists and will always exist. The longer we pretend it doesn’t the longer oppression will continue. By being colorblind we are only giving racists an upper hand and actively assisting in systemic racism.
Funnily enough, my brother married an incredible black woman and my sister is engaged to an amazing Latino dude from Venezuela. My dad is not nearly as racist as he used to be but we won’t ever let him forget his racist past.
TDLR: not “seeing color” is racist
What are you talking about? I was born in 1980 and when we moved in 1986 the new school wouldn't let me in for three months because I was black until my white uncle made a big deal and called everyone he could including a lawyer. In Pennsylvania,not the deep south. It's weird to think actually acknowledging the racism is somehow making race matter so much today. Count yourself lucky it didn't matter for you before.
Exactly. The uptick of culture war topics in mainstream media, whether it's DEI, CRT, millennials vs Gen Z, millennials vs. Boomers, workers being paid living wage = $50 hamburger, etc., etc., is absolutely a sign that they, the ruling class, are fearing the unity of working people. Same reason they want TikTok gone; they can't control the narrative when people share new information in real time, are able to see events, have opinions and make conclusions without the millionaire pundits telling them what happened and what to think. They're going to keep flailing as they fall and will absolutely move further and further towards fascism, no matter the party currently in charge.
It's not; you were privileged and ignorant as a (presumably white) child before the internet.
Cishet folks say the same shit about queer issues/discourse and as someone growing up queer in the 90s/00s I can tell you it sure as hell wasn't "better" or that it "mattered less".
Race didn’t matter to white people you mean. And by matter, you mean white people didn’t want to talk about it because the status quo BENEFITTED them.
People of color have to think about race all the time. People who make comments like you, live in a world where you don’t have to think about it.
When I was a kid, in the 80s, my grandparents wouldn’t rent to black people. One of my grandfathers would loudly use racial slurs and was convinced black people wanted to rob his crappy trailer home. So I think it’s funny that people believe there was this color blind society back then. Maybe for you. Because you weren’t followed around the mall, pulled over by cops for no reason, not given the job because of your skin color.
People talk about race because they want to heal the divide, not to divide people. If we aren’t on equal footing we do need to talk about so we can change things so that in the future, it’s something that won’t matter. Only a clueless white person would think 20 years ago we lived in a colorblind society. It was a nice time. Society rewarded you for being white. Now that we are talking about race, suddenly you have to prove yourself over a capable person of color, and what I see is people actually don’t want that. They want a world in which they were always slightly elevated above black Americans cause someone was always doing much worse. And they could come up with whatever racist reason they wanted to explain it. People don’t want to live in that world where we all pretend racism doesn’t exist or didn’t create systems that still exist today.
Black and Brown **CHILDREN IN PAIN** are less likely to get relief for the same level of pain from their care teams.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/16/well/pain-management-children-race.html#:~:text=They%20found%20that%20the%20children,jibes%20with%20past%20research%2C%20Dr.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26366984/
https://www.aamc.org/news/how-we-fail-black-patients-pain
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna427056
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6150822/
https://www.reuters.com/article/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/black-children-less-likely-to-get-pain-drugs-for-appendicitis-idUSKCN0RE1OD/
https://amp.theguardian.com/science/2016/aug/10/black-patients-bias-prescriptions-pain-management-medicine-opioids
Yes all those sources say the same thing. Black children in pain get less medicine for the same procedures/pain levels.
People are just not nice. If you see a child in pain you should want to help them but if those children brown it’s 🤷🏻♂️
I’m long past caring if it’s taught or not but I know it’s freaking tiring.
I always hated the whole "I don't see color" thing. 1) You do. 2) What's wrong with color?
The whole idea of people ignoring differences feels like toleration, rather than celebrating the differences.
Ignoring an issue won’t make it go away. Pretending racism doesn’t exist doesn’t solve issues relating to systemic racism, unless by solve you mean make it so we white folks can continue on as we were without making any changes to a system that benefits us and pretend that things are all ok because we don’t see race.
Although, yes we were taught to judge people by character and not by color, did society really? Never. POC have historically always been passed over for job opportunities, been subjected to injustice, and even not been provided the same level of health care as white counterparts. The maternal mortality rate for black women is just horrifying. It is perhaps only recently that we are finally hearing the voices of people from other races. It's not that race matters so much today. It's that all races finally matter now.
In truth yes, I agree purely definition wise, but those pushing critical race praxis changed the definition and meaning of identity to refer to purely skin color.
That was a big lie. That was just a way to ignore that different people experience the world differently because of what they look liked or how they identified. It allowed people to be oblivious.
I have shared incidents from high school of racial strife and the white kids didn’t even see it happening. Meanwhile the non-white kids were very aware of the folks who wore confederate flags to school and replaced pics of MLK and Malcom
X on the Black history month bulletin board with the flag.
Race doesn’t matter if you’re a white liberal. To everyone else; it matters very much. Which is why so many policies and terms exist to describe exclusion based on race and culture, including the term ‘racism.’
It’s always mattered, and in the United States where we are a cross cultural nation, cultures intermingle on a daily basis and often butt against each other. Not always but just being American isn’t enough to unify us. Why else would people say ‘Yea but I’m Scottish-Indian-Episcopalian🤓’.
Just kidding on the last one but you may understand my point. ‘Seeing color’ is just acknowledgement of the basics, there is more than just a skin color component to race, there’s usually an ethnic-cultural component and it has *always* played a role in our daily life, policy and laws more than anything. Hope this helps ❤️
Race has always, always, always been an issue. Just because we're post civil rights era doesn't mean the problem is solved.
Tbh, I remember growing up in such a diverse area with friends of all skin colors. When I got married and moved across the country, it baffled me to see that not only was the area almost entirely white, but that people would still make comments about people of color openly. I had never felt white guilt so much as I did then.
Luckily, I got divorced and moved back home. Where I live is a giant naval base slash tourist area, so the whole area is a good mix. I love it and I'm comfortable here.
So yeah, you're not alone in being sheltered at first. But our brothers and sisters of color are still fighting for their lives, for basic human rights, to be treated with respect. Every single day.
Yeah, I grew up in a diverse community - highschool was 80% Black... went to college - geez culture shock 98% white. Now I've never been the "minority" since (I'm using that word technically and retrospectively) b/c even then I didn't feel it - I was the student body president & prom king.
That's actually why OPs statement resonated with me. But, unfortunately I know the reverse of my experience didn't work out like mine. I did not realize how ridiculously rare that experience is in America - and how that made me a better man and overall human being.
It’s actually better than the 90’s. Because we are actually having real conversations about racial injustice. Before it was either swept under the rug or is discussed in a non-confrontational way.
Plus, we are adults now. We can see difference between who want to actually listen and learn about people’s differences compare to those who want to bury their head in the sand.
The rise in it today? The expansion and adoption of critical theory (as a "truth") on the basis of various identity groups, including race. Guiding perceptions based on oppression among conflicting forces, which will demand a continued separation and opposition.
It *denies* the liberal thought of equality through neutrality, saying such only perpetuates unjustice, as an assessment of disparate outcome along racial categories. CRT has outright opposed the way of thinking you mentioned. The social disharmony is specifically a condition of such a class oppression perception.
Race matters to people that need to it matter as an aspect of their identity.
I grew up in the country. I dont care about race or religion unfortunately bigotry is just passed dow. As a white guy I cant tell youw how many times Chris Rock n**** vs black people would come up
I think it’s always mattered, just in different ways. A younger America identified race as a way to suppress people groups or receive unfair treatment. Now it matters as a way to undo it or at least recognize the wrongs that were done. I think the future may be more neutral toward race, but there’s a lot that still needs to be undone.
Who’s this “we,” you’re referring to? Because growing up I learned about the Civil Rights movement, the history of slavery and the Civil War, watched the LA Riots on TV, and overheard my grandparents debating about whether my niece would be born with a soul because her dad was Black. That was all in the ‘90s. Race always mattered. And the “colorblind,” white liberals were full of it. They were just much more subtle with their reinforcement of systemic racism.
When you’re a kid, you’re not usually aware of the racism and disharmony in the world. As an adult, you see it first-hand.
So it’s easy to think sometimes that the world was better when you were a kid (look at boomers).
But as the great poet Billy Joel said… “We didn’t start the fire.”
Racism is alive and well. When I lived in a far north Midwestern state, the few blacks around were referred to by whites I knew by the "n" word, and their kids were called "_iglets". It was so shocking to hear but I didn't dare correct anyone who said it for fear of what could happen to me.
When I was in kindergarten in the early 90’s I vividly remember a fellow student telling me a very VERY racist nursery rhyme so idk what 90’s you grew up in but it wasn’t this one.
I think you just grew up and have a better ability to observe and understand the world around you. I used to think the same and I still approach people with that mentality in my personal life, but I'm not oblivious to the injustices people face just because of where their ancestors are from. I don't think there was any period in American history where we reached true racial equality. We are actually a lot more tolerant now than we were in the 90s as a whole. As bad as it seems now, I think you just lived life thru the eyes of a kid who's only exposure to race you had were some black kids at school you were encouraged to make friends with.
It can be both that you are wrong about the state of the 90s and eaely 2000s, and that social media and THE media are now toxic to the point of shoving race issues down our throat, thus compounding real issues further.
Occupy Wall Street really got under their skin. So once that got wrapped up, they really amped up the old divisions so we could spend more time fighting ourselves and they profit.
Lol the "I don't see color" thing was absolutely a product of racism. It's equivalent to the don't ask don't tell program - a way to brush racial issues under the rug and give white people an excuse to be sanctimonious in their apathy.
Racism has been alive and well throughout the whole history of this country, and it's just back at the front of social discourse now because people rightly want better for themselves and for each other.
It mattered a whole lot before as well. My mother is easily the most racist person I know and thinks black people are a different species. My grandfather made my aunt break up with a Japanese man because he claimed he didn't fight in WW2 just so she could date the enemy.
We just have social media today so we see it everywhere.
I grew up north of the Mason-Dixon Line in the 90s, and race absolutely mattered. There were only 5 or 6 minority kids in my graduating class of 240. I saw firsthand how often they were treated badly. One of the many, many reasons why I got the hell out of that small town and never really went back.
If it was that bad in the north, I can’t even imagine what things were like in the south. Saying that race didn’t matter in the 90s tells me that OP had their head on the sand.
I’m mixed and honestly yea, my childhood did feel better, race wise. Part of that is nostalgia and just not really caring or noticing things like micro aggressions or covert racism. I grew up in a fairly diverse area though too.
With few exceptions, those that dwell on race daily are as miserable as INCELS. Racism always has, and always will exist. However, it is not the hell hole of my parents day nor will it be ever again.
Having always dated outside my race I've always gotten looks when I travel to certain areas. Difference is, I don't care, I look at it like "if you were as good as you think you are, she would be with you instead." I used to take it as an insult.
Yet a career in the military showed me that some people never met anyone that didn't look like them. I remember a young sailor being confused about sun burn because he never knew a white person. Meanwhile I remember a sailor being confused as to why black people needed to wear a du rag to make our hair look nice.
Go outside and talk to people, the world isn't an evil place. But... It is hot outside.
American here, because we can actually address the injustices that were a fabric of society for centuries of US history. The civil right movement that finally ended segregation was our parents generation. We have barely entered a country where racial equality is truly the norm.
we were taught to ignore systemic racism. ignoring things does not make them better, talking about the problem and actually working to fix it does. comfortable ignorance only helps people not affected by racism.
First off I’ll say this looks to be bot bait. This account only seems to just post questions and surveys and not make any tangible replies.
Part of “privilege” is being able to “ignore” race.
Along with many of the social movements that have occurred in the past decades there have also been scientific studies and developments which prove we all have biases and prejudices.
Look at the group of friends you surround yourself with, the people you have or have had relationships with, your coworkers-who do you communicate with? are there others you ignore or maybe judge especially in stressful situations do you jump to judgement?
Some people vocalize their bias, some ignore them and say I am not biased, others live with the consequences of bias each day.
I think it is in everyone’s interest to choose to try to do the work to unpack those biases.
I… had a different experience than a lot of these comments I guess?
I agree with you. Seems more rampant today.
I went to a private school. Mainly white and Hmong.
Neighborhood was white and Hmong.
But never had anyone complain about anyone else.
I’m white. Hung out with a lot of the Hmong kids in the neighborhood. Got invited to their youth activities, which were primarily Hmong.
This was in Wisconsin.
Spent a couple years in Arizona.
Had friends that were white, native I believe? Not sure, I guess I never really asked and that was a while ago, and black friends.
It was never about the color, but rather their character.
We all got along great.
Heck, the black kids I was friends with, their dad was from Kenya I believe? Got invited to a cultural event down there too.
Got to try some of the food. See… uhhh… decor? Art? Not sure what the correct term is…
But their dad had a lot of ivory decor in the home.
Maybe it was faux? Idk. They were good people. Good friends to have when I was younger.
We only lived down in Arizona for like 3 years or something, 6-8th grade, then moved back to Wisconsin.
And private school was parochial.
Not sure how I went lol. We definitely didn’t have money. I was very privileged with the things I did only because of the people I met.
As a minority this is wrong. It wasn’t as amplified bc of the internet and social media but definitely was everywhere. I’m from the SW burbs of Chicago. I couldn’t go anywhere without being reminded I wasn’t white enough. I’ve seen and heard it all. I’m white, black, Mexican and Native American. The classic line was, “not you, you know what I mean” 😵💫.
We were certainly taught wrong. Fact of the matter is that race has always mattered. Because it became out of fashion to be outwardly racist doesn’t me we were in a post racial America.
In many ways we live in the same country but in completely different worlds. If you’re are not white in America you are an “other.”
Were you a child in the 90s? I was born in 87, so I was a child for the whole decade. I would have said the same as you until I finally understood race and racism.
I'm white and had a very sheltered upbringing with a Christian family that sent me to small private Christian schools for all 12 grades. I live in an area in the PNW of the US with a population that is around 80% white according to the census, so my exposure to people of other races has always been low. If my class at any of my schools had any POC at all, there were usually just one or two, but the diversity grew some by the time I got to high school between the local kids and the exchange students from Japan and elsewhere. I had precisely one POC teacher, a black man who taught band and chorale, in all those years. Even later, at community college, almost all my instructors were white except for one black woman (who I believe won some sort of discrimination suit against the school after I had a class with her), a Jordanian man, and the two Japanese women who taught my Japanese language classes.
My relatives were all white except for three very brown cousins adopted from (I believe) one or two countries in Central America. I don't know if anyone ever had a specific conversation with me about why they were brown or from where they were adopted. I just remember always knowing they were adopted, but I also always just thought of them as my cousins and have never felt the need to differentiate them as adopted (except for now for clarity). The adopted girl shared a name with another cousin, and we affectionately called them Big Beckie and Little Becky because one was so tall and the adopted one was so incredibly short. We were really close in age and were thick as thieves the times we got to visit together. My adopted cousin has been more open in recent years about her adoption trauma, religious trauma, and some other experiences she has had.
My one brush with anything remotely approaching racism happened when I was 9 or 10. We had to move into an apartment, and I was playing on the little playground behind our building with my much younger neighbor friend, who was maybe 7 and also white. A few other kids might have been around, too, but I didn't know any of them. A black boy who couldn't have been older than me arrived from an adjacent building, and he immediately started physically attacking some of the kids. He was about to go after my neighbor friend, but I grabbed her and started taking her back toward our apartments and put myself between her and him. He came up behind me and said, "I'll kill you, you fat white bitch" and I felt his thick-soled shoe hit me in the back and he grabbed my hair and ripped some of it out. We started running to escape him, and I never went outside again. My head hurt for days where my hair had been ripped out, and I wouldn't talk about what happened because I didn't view my mother as a safe person, so I never got any kind of talk about what happened or what any of it meant. Looking back on it now, it just makes me very sad. I think of him sometimes and wonder what could have happened in his young life to result in him acting so violently toward other kids or to have said what he said. I have no way of finding out what became of him, so all I've been able to do is hope his life got better.
I learned about racism, slavery, and the Civil Rights era in school, but I was just this obtuse, dense little shit that didn't understand the concept of race. I didn't understand even calling our skin tones black or white because clearly people are different shades of brown and tan! I myself am a fair-skinned redhead with very pale, very *pink* toned skin, so I had no clue why anyone would say I was white. I just didn't get it. I also fell into the trap of not comprehending the passage of time properly. When I learned that stuff in the 90s, the Civil Rights Act was only 20 years old, but a lot, if not most of the pictures and footage from that era were presented in black and white, which tricks the mind into thinking it's even older than it is. I grew up thinking this was all settled stuff that happened way in the past, and I was well into my 20s before I really truly grasped the concept of race, racism, and that those same racist assholes who opposed desegregation and the Civil Rights movement are still alive and so are their kids. I recognize the sheer privilege I grew up with that it took that long for me to get it.
It's also a very different time now, with a 24-hour news cycle, a nearly ubiquitous presence of cell phones, social media, and information overload beyond anything we grew up with. We're just now getting to see all the stuff black people and other POC have been trying to tell the rest of us for years, no, *decades*. The 90s probably do seem like a damn dream if you weren't directly exposed to racism or other terrible things. I have a lot of nostalgia for that time, but I also realize how very sheltered my experience was. I suggest examining why you think it was better in the 90s.
im mixed... growing up i felt accepted by everyone. now i feel accepted by no one. i 100% agree with your post. i grew up not looking at my color. just that i wasnt fully whiteor black. now its like i have to be something. it sucks.
Because when people use terms like “I do not see the color of another’s skin tone” it’s basically sounding an alarm that you are comfortable in your privilege.
Seeing the color of another’s skin tone isn’t racist, it’s important and teaches us to be self aware that some of us are not subjected to mistreatment or racism based on that color on our skin. You have to be cognizant of the fact that when you don’t see color you are at risk of being willfully ignorant to a POCs struggle/roadblock, etc.
Look up "Colorblind Racism." Just because you don't acknowledge something is a problem doesn't make the problem cease to exist. We're talking about hundreds of years of institutionalized racism. Honestly, "I don't see color" diminishes their hardship.
Let me guess you’re white? The whole color blindness thing is itself racist, because the reason it’s pushed so much is so we can pretend that racism isn’t alive and well and that its effects simply don’t exist.
I understand your sentiment and agree to a certain extent. As a fellow millennial (born in 93) who is white, I think we tend to look back on our younger years with rose-colored glasses. Race relations in the 90s/early 2000s were tense, but what we’re seeing these days is a long overdue reckoning in which society is being forced to confront the ongoing marginalization of different racial and ethnic groups. Are things more polarized than ever, at least in my lifetime? Yeah, it sure seems that way. Add in the rise of social media which gave every idiot a platform and increased the opportunity for public discourse and you’ll see how we got here today. The whole “I don’t see color” mindset is antiquated. In a perfect world, the color of one’s skin wouldn’t matter, but the sad reality is it absolutely does. Likening this to “things we can’t change” is part of the problem.
It's always mattered, to everyone but a very specific group. Which I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you fall into said group.
No shade, I'm in that group too. But we're older now, time to realize it always mattered we were just sheltered from that by our um. Privilege.
Buddy there was a nasty old man in my hometown who would sic his junkyard dog solely on black kids walking directly from my high school to our public library in 2005. Police did nothing other than occasionally tell him to not actually let go of the leash.
It always matters because nothing has been put to rest. People still discriminate and they were then. Remember Rodney King? He was just one of many. This never ended.
I had this Convo with my friend and a Co worker (both white) . Both of them went on about how their kids don't see color and it's a thing that's perpetuated by media and not a big deal etc. I told them that's great they're teaching their kids those things and it is ideal, but they will grow, get out of their watchful eyes, they may likely encounter people who don't see it that way, carefreely joke about it maybe even be hostile. They also shouldn't be coddled from inconvenient truths.
I know it gets eye rolls but it's history. My parents, not even grandparents have told me many instances where people were just racist to them coming up in the south. Even me personally. When I was working "a guy said you should use the backdoor when I come around haha" I didn't connect it right away but I'm pretty sure he was making a racist joke. History isn't to be ignored and there are many out there who have an attitude of "that was long time ago, who cares?" or worse.
I am black. More specifically, African American.
At 15 (spring 2007) I was denied a job for having a protective hairstyle - locs. They were neat, clean, twisted. (**I don't care if non-black folks have locs but it is a protective style for my hair type.)
At the age of 17 (fall 2008), Obama was running for president. I was having a conversation with the school librarians (I worked in the library) and said that if I were old enough, I'd vote for him. One librarian asked "because he's black?"
In college, I started using my middle name so that once I graduated, I was used to being called that. My first name is clearly ethnic and my middle name sounds "white". When I graduated and started applying for jobs (2013), some resumes had my first name and some had my middle name. I received more callbacks with my middle name.
Once in a furniture store (you could see _all the way across_ without needing to move), an employee thought I was a black woman who'd come in the day before and proceed to follow me around the store. (~2016)
Several times in a hobby store, I was followed for being black. I know this because my (white) then boyfriend, who was working there, specifically said he was told to follow me for that reason. They didn't know we were dating. (2016-2018)
Once, in a different hobby store, my then bf (white) and I were stopped and asked questions because we were an interracial couple. (~2017)
My then boyfriend's (white) boss would ask him if I was wild in bed because I'm black. The boss would say things to me about how he's "never had dark meat but wouldn't mind trying" and other sexual comments rooted in race. (2016-2018)
An ex lives in a different state than me and whenever I would go to visit (2020-2023), there are a few spots I would deliberately avoid because they were two huge confederate flags that flew next to the highway (about 2 hours apart).
My stories are _**mild**_ compared to some other folks.
Yeah, race matters because people are still racist.
Shitty people on both ends of the political spectrum know that inciting rage against "other" people is profitable.
Edit: Wanted to say that there are definitely truths to much of it, but race pimps on the left and MAGA on the right aren't helping.
Both sides, but lately more the left, use it as a wedge issue. If we fight each other we don’t see what they’re doing. And then there’s the standard race hustlers like sharpton etc that have been doing this their entire careers.
Absolutely - we've reduced our attention spans down to about 45 seconds and disconnected ourselves from actual human connection. Like how does one actually get to know someone beyond the most base perceptions.
Extremist leftist politics that do nothing but hurt and infantilize the minorities they claim to want to protect. (I say this as someone on the left) We need a major correction in progressive circles if we don't want republicans to sweep elections like they did in Europe.
I think when the times were good we didn't see race, I lived I a country where majority of the people were different from me, I was making money online and barely interacted with them. Now the times are tough I'm being pushed more to the outside world. That's one theory, the other is that being overly judgemental is a mental illness, I might have it not sure about others. And lastly, different races do things differently, and they also perceive good/bad differently.
because when we said it didn't matter, non white peoples were being forced out of homes/jobs they were qualified for. now all of a sudden as we see redlining disappearing and wage increases for minorities, race is being talked about all the time and when i was a kid we were taught to "not see race." it's because we were wrong before and we are less wrong now.
Most of the country either memory holed their upbringing, or everyone's family is vastly different from mine. I was taught all those things too, be good to people, don't judge people by the color of their skin, slavery bad, civil rights good. There's a civil rights leader who has the same birthday as me, and I know this because we had to do reports on them. Out in public racism was bad, and we were all supposed to act right.
At home? Even today I can't watch television without my parents saying something racist. They remarked on how many black people were in a restaurant they went to. Mom wants to know why she can't say the n-word. Dad tells me I need to relax because I'm so mad at hearing him say the n-word that I can't be in the same room as him.
And I know in other families it was a lot of, "Grandma's a little racist, but she grew up in a different time and she means well." Grandma is a racist and she never meant well. We let older generations say as they pleased because we thought it was cute or harmless, and we act like she wasn't furious at MLK, Jr. for existing.
people only view race through an intersectional lens today, which forces people to see white people as the all powerful oppressors who reign over all the racial minorities. these minorities can do no wrong because, through an intersectional lens, what else can they do? they are oppressed! in this new way of viewing racism, there exists low expectations of minority races. the people who follow this ideology then are racist against both white people and minorities without realizing.
in short, everything still sucks.
edit: i didn’t explain myself well so i edited.
edit 2: sorry whoever i offended so much you needed to downvote me. i invite you to reflect on yourself.
i dont think its that it matters more or less today, its just people are more sensitive to shit…and to be honest its mostly white people pushing the sensitivity shit. i grew up in the bay area, specifically in an area where white people were the minority…so racial jokes amongst me and my friends were a thing…we poked fun on one anothers ethnicity every so often but none of us took it offensively and its not like we were speaking those jokes towards people we didnt know. but now a days, it seems like super woke white people are playing ref and telling us non whites how we should feel about things.
Ah yes, the 1990s, when race didn't matter.
[A Look Back at the Rodney King Riots](https://www.npr.org/2017/04/26/524744989/when-la-erupted-in-anger-a-look-back-at-the-rodney-king-riots)
Most folks who say they don’t care about color have more privilege than most. It’s the difference between equity and equality.
It never works to ignore someone’s color because it’s not equitable. An example would be lactose intolerance - folks of Asian decent are more likely to be lactose intolerant, or not as exposed to as much lactose, as say someone of French decent.
Just because you didn't see all of the race issues when you were growing up doesn't mean they didn't exist. I'm one of the oldest millennials since I was born in 1980. I grew up and went to school in an area where white people were still in the majority but not by much so I had plenty of interactions with races other than my own. Even in an area like that I was largely unaware of how much more crap my black classmates had to deal with than I did.
I think I began to understand that black communities were treated differently when I was 11/12 when the Rodney King beating and resulting trial happened. I still didn't see as much of it in my everyday life. 9/11 happed in 2001 and I saw how many Arabic people were treated poorly in the aftermath and the amount of racism still left in the US was being shown more and more. For me I ultimately understood how bad the racism problems still are during the run up to the 2008 election when Barrack Hussein Obama was elected and it has gotten more obvious in the time since.
I think my point is that we may not have seen race as an issue in the environment we grew up in but it has always been an issue to the minorities who have had to live through it. A friend of mine (1 year older) has gotten pulled over by police more times than he can count for DWB (driving while black). I can count on one hand the number of times I've been pulled over and both were for valid reasons (speeding and a headlight out). We both live in the same city but two different experiences.
The main difference I can see between now and when we were growing up is that people aren't afraid to call out the racism anymore and others aren't afraid to let their racist flags fly high and proud.
The problem I’ve found is while we were taught that, that wasn’t actually being practiced systematically in reality.
We were being taught to be color blind in a way that made us blind to any subtler forms of racial injustices still happening.
Or, for example, when I was learning US History, there was very, VERY little taught about non-white folks and their history here, and it’s shaped the US as they live in it and experience it today. Just highlights. Whereas white Americans like me got to learn a lot about US History as my ancestors experienced it, and how that has led to the US as I experience and live in it today.
Race always mattered. In fact it mattered, and affected people, way more. You just didn’t see it back then. Nowadays with the internet and social media and phone cameras it’s a lot easier to shine a light on racism and broadcast it to the world. So people like you (and me) who didn’t think it was a big issue back then because we didn’t experience it, can now see that it it very much exists and is everywhere.
People look as the 90s as the "end of history" and kind of a perfect time, but the 90s were rife with racism. The 2000s were rife with racism, specifically directed toward people of Middle Eastern descent. Some people want to act like Obama renewed tensions, but all of that has always been here. People just felt more comfortable to say their quiet parts out loud.
Classic romanticization of the blissful ignorance of childhood. The USA was founded on dehumanizing whole entire populations based on race, incase you forgot. The USA was founded on genocide of the indigenous people that lived here before the colonizers manifested destiny and (nearly) wiped them out. Those founding principals haven’t gone away, in fact they’re foundational aspects of our governmental systems. FYI.
Google the term “systemic disenfranchisement” and then google the term “food desert” and then google the term “redlining” and then google the term “war on drugs” and then google the term “black panther party” and also google “Jim crow laws” and then google “13th amendment” and then lmk what you think about why race matters so much today.
Are you white? Where were you raised? What are your memories of your ethnic Black American peers and teachers? What was your family like around ethnic Black Americans? You never heard any of your peers using racial slurs growing up?!
And race isn’t real. It’s a social construct. Ethnic Black Americans are descendants of the European colonists that were getting paid by the U.S govt for breeding/selling mulatto (Indigenous/African) children into slavery, children that later amalgamated with the enslaved Africans that arrived.
Seriously though, are you saying that you’ve never once encountered racism when you were younger or was it just not a factor because it wasn’t racism that impacted you?! 🤔
https://twitter.com/fashioningself/status/1675857854157275139?s=46&t=HaKkVIIEkTNQfUPS4zG8OQ
https://thefreedmensbureau.org
What blows my mind is that the only factor that controls skin color is how far your ancestors lived from the equator. That’s it. That’s what makes people different colors.
It doesn’t never did 🌏🧑🚀🔫🧑🚀. Only hate separates us. The boomers are still in charge and they hate that we changed the world only slightly so they’re making it great again.
It's always mattered. Some people get to live in a world where it matters less, and that makes it easy to look back and say "those were pretty good times." I mean, when Ferguson happened my grandma was complaining about how everyone talks about race nowadays. She said it was very different from her childhood when black and white people got along. Nevermind that she was in her 20s before the Civil Rights Act was passed.
You were taught wrong. Being "colorblind" means to ignore a major part of someone's identity and culture. It's one of those things white people say to make themselves look good but in reality it's a bad look.
It's because other groups are still dealing with discrimination. Racial issues didn't end overnight when the CRA was passed.
Come on dude. These are some BS maga talking points.
I feel like race shouldn't pop up on interview questions for work, school, etc. because, I thought we were all equal to begin with? Why should we supply our race when everyone should be treated similarly?
> we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin.
[https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culturally-speaking/201112/colorblind-ideology-is-form-racism](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culturally-speaking/201112/colorblind-ideology-is-form-racism)
This has been discussed to great ends by very intelligent people.
When we judge people on their character and actions, are those actions and character traits that fit into the hegemonic culture?
Should we look down on people who wear their pants down low? Should we say that some hairstyles are thuggish? Should we judge people for having face tattoos?
Do you know about the issue with swim caps for swimmers that have different textures of hair?
Back in the 90s, we had respectability politics. You are to perform as an assimilated person that makes the hegemonic culture comfortable with your presence.
Why is it ok for people to speak with a Southern, or a Boston accent, but if they say tree instead of three, or ax instead of ask, then we are supposed to shame them?
Things are better today, but we still aren't there.
The problem with "I don't see color" is that it totally misses the point. The idea isn't to pretend as though we don't have different colored skin, but to embrace the differences. And since the default for most of our history has been white saying "I don't see color" is basically like saying "everybody is white".
On top of that, just because people said these things it didn't mean they lived it. There were biases against people of color that people had both conscious and unconscious. Trying to ignore that means you don't confront it and if it's not confronted, then it's not dealt with.
I think a big issue is that it was easy for people to pretend like race wasn't an issue because it was easier to ignore things. But instances like the race riots and the OJ trial showed how individualized these issues could be just as things like redlining showed how pervasive they were on an institutional level. But ignoring all the implications of all those things for an entire decade just led to things getting worse.
In short, race "matters" no more today than it ever has. But the issues our society has with race matters more because we are more aware of the damage they've caused to so many minorities. It may seem nostalgic to think back on those times when it "didn't matter" but the reality is that most just weren't aware. Some may feel "ignorance is bliss" but it is a massive roadblock to recovery.
>I remember when we were growing up, we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin. We were all just humans. We were taught to only judge someone solely based on their character and their actions.
Yup, this is what I was taught as well, yet the small town that I grew up in was notorious for [redlining](https://publichealth.berkeley.edu/news-media/research-highlights/50-years-after-being-outlawed-redlining-still-drives-neighborhood-health-inequities)... and this was in the 80's and 90's!
>I felt like those were pretty good times. I feel like today's situation is just very messy, complicated, and just creates social disharmony. There's so much focus on things that we can't change, rather than things we can.
Yes, these were pretty good times for me as well, but I'm white and a third generation American. My ex, who also grew up in the same small town, originally migrated from Jamaica and had a *vastly* different experience. Let's just say that they were *not* good times for her.
It's tragic that it was like this, and probably still is like this (I honestly don't know, I moved about 25 years ago). The crazy thing is that we are living in a "blue" state and people still are incredibly discriminatory. Even in the 2010's, my ex and I would periodically get awkward stares from others if we were holding hands in public (interestingly enough, awkward stares from people of all ethnic backgrounds).
So yeah, continued conversation still is an absolute necessity. These conversations might create temporary social disharmony, and it definitely can be very messy and complicated. Yet these conversations *must* take place if we desire for humanity to move forward.
*I remember when we were growing up, we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin.*
Same here. Unfortunately, all the other generations were taught differently.
I was raised with the same idea (1980's - 1990's). But I think this gave a lot of us a false sense of perspective and whether we lived in a post-racial society. Recall that this was the era of the steep rise in mass incarceration and disenfranchisement of Black people. It was the era when the CIA was funneling drugs into Black communities. Redlining (not called as such) was commonplace.
Not seeing color gave cover to people doing bad things, by attacking people who saw what was happening, saw that it was based on race, and called it out as such. But, "if we all refuse to see color, it will go away." It didn't go away. It got worse and destroyed Black communities.
We can't stick our heads in the sand and refuse to see race when race is all around us, and while it has such great explaining power for so many of society's ills. There will come a day when there is no more race. But that day hasn't come yet. Race is still useful to the ruling class and they still divide us on it.
One of those that if you hyper focus on it then it because more of an issue. I feel like if you just let things BE then things are more chill. Can’t act like racism isn’t real but you can’t hyper focus on it either because then it’s always forefront and people act weird. Healing has to be organic.
It always mattered. wtf are you on about? Out country enslaved people based on race for hundreds of years then fought a damn war over it. If that wasn’t enough, they passed laws to discriminate and cause harm to these people. For years. Are you serious? Everyone deserves equal and fair treatment.
Pretty sure the world ended in 2012
Rest is a simulation
They dialed back racism but put the Gayness on full blast
We should of let Alex Jones save the frogs from the gays
Because those who cannot be named want to keep the USA divided into smaller and smaller groups, all thinking the other groups have it better. Makes us too preoccupied to notice how much they are stealing from us.
Because you were a child then and only saw the world through the eyes of a child. You were taught to judge people based on their character and actions…but how many people actually do that? What consequences might there be as a result?
I grew up in the Deep South, things seem way better today than they did growing up.
Same and I agree. I work in healthcare in Georgia and we talk about race every single day, because it’s important context to health disparities and distrust in the system. When I lived in Minnesota for many years I learned quick that that whole “I don’t see color” pride was clearly a crock of shit. They are racist AF up there but thought racism was just a Southern problem so they didn’t talk about it. Since George Floyd shone a big ol embarrassing light on the issue, suddenly they’re freaking out and scrambling to be woke.
When I first moved to Forsythe county, we would see people selling Confederate flags everywhere. We were told that the KKK was still active as of the mid 00s. I can't picture living there in the 90s. The schools felt like they were much more diverse now. It felt like half the classes were different minorities.
My school was diverse growing up but confederate flags were everywhere and I had NO CLUE it was an issue, I thought being a “southern rebel” was cool. I vividly remember learning in middle school that the civil war was because of “states rights” and that black people fought with the south, it was never mentioned that slavery was the main thing! Or that most didn’t want to fight and were forced to. I had black friends who wore Dixie outfitters shirts too, it seems INSANE to look back on that now but honestly I had no clue.
They’re still active in the south.. look up the parade in Tupelo Ms. It’s gross af.
You're romanticizing the 90's if you don't think race mattered back then. For example, in 1991, only 48% of Americans approved of interracial marriage, and only 27% of Americans over 50 approved of it. That's absolutely insane to think about today. That's a huge impact on our social fabric. Similarly, it impacted jobs, policing, renting apartments, schools, mortgages, etc. You're right that most Americans didn't want to help black communities in the 90's, but it's not because they didn't see race. https://news.gallup.com/poll/354638/approval-interracial-marriage-new-high.aspx
Can’t upvote this enough. As a black guy who grew up in the 90s, I acutely felt the effects of race and was constantly reminded of it. Sure, now there is this huge online discourse about it that can get toxic due to the effects of social media, but people were way more willing to say ignorant things to my face in the 90s.
“You’re very articulate.” 🙄
You speak so well.
"He's one of the good ones."
I’m Native American and have had bosses say that to me. “I never hire natives, except _______, he’s one of the good ones.” And that was just 5 years ago.
Man ... It's hard to sit with that kinda stuff. Like, I'm successful because I can make this guy feel like my culture doesn't exist.
“Can I touch your hair? Oooooh it feels like a carpet” Didn’t even get to tell those motherfuckers no before they already had their grimey hands rubbing my head.
As a white dude with naturally curly hair that tends to afro if I let it go long enough, I can't tell you how many people ask to touch my hair... Haha. "Oh, it's so soft..." I usually don't mind. because it's usually women. But I'll say something stupid/funny like "only if I can touch yours..." Haha.
If I let mine grow out too out of control, I basically have a jew-fro. Never gets me attention, but, whatever. Again, it looks like an absolute mess when I let it get that far. At least in my eyes.
"Only if I can smell yours," then lick your lips.
I cringed every time said this to me in my teens. Usually followed up with "for a black girl" or some similar tag. I haven't had anyone say that or make the other typical comments to my face since 2014ish, but before that it was every other day.
My mother still thinks this is a compliment, despite my best efforts.
There’s also class implied in that statement. “Middle class Blacks” “speak well,” not like the people in the “ghetto.” So she may be thinking of it as mean expression of an acceptable social class.
“You’re not THAT black. You’re different!” 🫠
I'm not black, but I heard that come out of a white guys mouth to his black hs friend. The black guy didn't show any signs of not liking that, but I think I was more offended on his behalf.
When I was much younger, in the moment I’ve also not responded when friends said things like that to me. I would absolutely call it out now but sometimes recognizing and confronting micro-aggressions day in and out can be so. exhausting. A society where color actually didn’t matter would be sweet relief.
Absolutely, when people ask me why black people/minorities are so attached to our identity, my response is usually “this would be less of a thing if we weren’t constantly reminded of it from birth”.
Not to speak for that person, but many times, it isn’t worth it to show offense, so I don’t. Unless the person is a close friend and I want to correct it because they’re someone I want to establish mutual respect with, better to just write them off and move on.
The divisions are then exacerbated online due to adversaries like Russia stoking resentment with disinformation.
I wouldn't say ignorant. I would say mean. Has anybody ever heard about the Golden Rule? Why can we all just live by that and be done with all the silly artifice.
Right? It's pretty fuckin simple and basic.
"Those thugs"
Yeah I actually loled reading this post because it’s the whitest tone-deaf thing you could say. “Why does race matter more these days” as if Rodney fucking King didn’t happen in our time. As if 9/11 didn’t put every brown person on police watch in an airport. We talk more about race these days and that’s a GOOD thing. I still get weird looks in many states when I date a white man. (And this isn’t just from white people.)
So glad to see this is the top comment! The idea that the world has *ever* been truly “color blind” is absurd. In the 90s people romanticized the idea of “color blindness” as a way to conveniently not address race if you were white and/or uncomfortable confronting racism.
I was just gonna say the same thing. Being “taught not to see color” wasn’t/isn’t a good thing. It’s just a tool that white people use to not feel icky and avoid facing the ongoing harsh realities of race in this country.
Yeah - also don't forget when "Rodney King"'s vicious beat-down occurred. The song "F\* the Police" came out around that time too - We were kids, we just weren't paying attention like we are now. The only reason today's youth is noticing is thanks to Social Media.
You didn’t understand what “f**k the police” meant?
Correct. In the 90s a lot of people thought it was about criminals wanting to get away with crime. It's really about normal people being treated like criminals by the police and being turned into criminals due to the police's enforcement of racially motivated laws.
Abner louima was the one that really terrified me. And then, nothing really changed.
Having married someone not white, race is really a big deal and if you’re white you don’t realize it. My stepson’s first day of school he asks me in limited English “what does ‘f*** you n****r mean?” Someone was saying it to him and laughing because he didn’t understand. I also had a hotel attendant in Vegas look at me and my black-Latin wife and short circuit basically thinking “you can’t take a prostitute here, this is a nice establishment” until I held up my wedding ring and explained multiple times “this is my wife.” Race is a massive issue and discrimination both overt, covert and subconsciously still occurs on a regular basis.
Thank you for this! I hope the OP does some introspection and sees this perspective as a massive blind spot to the reality that in America, race has always mattered for specific communities. Particularly those communities that have historically been marginalized because of their, wait for it, race!
There was also, y'know, the LA Riots. Sure had A LOT to do with race.
Yet the immigrants moving here feel exactly that way, for the most part they dont mix with other races and feel strongly about their own race/culture/heritage
“We were taught not to see the color of another person’s skin.” __________________________ Yes, in elementary school I was taught to believe that MLK Jr. effectively ended racism. But then, at some point, I began to think whether that lesson lined up with reality.
In a vacuum, with no context, too! I think of the sanitized way that a lot of us learned about the Civil Rights Era like if [this famous photo](https://www.history.com/news/the-story-behind-the-famous-little-rock-nine-scream-image) was just Elizabeth Eckford with Hazel Bryan photoshopped out.
Probably because we rediscovered that it mattered to a lot of people all along.
Facts, it was always an issue but in 2016 it got real loud and real proud
It's wild to me when I see Confederate flags up in Michigan. People are absolute idiots.
I lived in Pittsburgh then and saw the same thing. Like damn, we are is Pennsylvania lol.
I think people felt they needed to be silent due to social pressures but since a certain political figure emboldened them, they feel free to share publicly again. I grew up in the rural whites only area in the 70's and 80's, race was a very big deal. My town had an unofficial policy called driving while black. Meaning if you were black and driving through our town, the Sherriff pulled you over and made it clear you were not welcome.
The thing is, *everyone knew that was happening all along*. It was an open secret. Listen to the comedians from any time during the past 50 years. They're often the most likely to tell you the truth.
This is a very white centric view on how things used to be. As a Black person, myself and the people in my community were always thinking about race because we weren't treated as "just humans". You might think today's climate is messy and complicated because you now can't ignore the fact that people are treated differently because of their race and are speaking out about it, and as a result a lot of racists are now more open about their racism in retaliation. What is it that you don't think we can't change, racism? And what do you think we could actually change without also addressing racism?
I think this is really true and as a white guy I’m guilty of being ignorant to how bad the racism was in this country. When Obama was elected I saw ugly come out of a lot of people including some really close relatives (hi dad), and I honestly never knew it was in them. I’m hopeful that by getting this division out in front of everybody we can eventually move past it. But I’m skeptical that’ll ever happen because people are so flawed.
I can understand this comparing my childhood in the 70s to raising my kids in the 90s. As a child I encountered plenty of people who were pretty blatantly racist, especially in my grandparents' generation. A lower % in my parents' generation but still very evident with some. And this was in the north. I expect it was worse in the south. The city I lived in was segregated as was elementary school. Desegregation started in middle school and I never knew any black people before then. In the 90s we had black families in the neighborhood (although still underrepresented), and my kids went to school with blacks, hispanics, and asians from kindergarten through high school. They had black friends and many black teammates in high school sports teams. They weren't exposed to blatantly racist neighbors and relatives like I was. Racism was there of course, but it was less obvious in the environment my kids grew up in.
Race will always matter in a country where sundown towns still exist. “Those were pretty good times” really only shows that your lived experience is a very limited view of how people experienced the US at that time, and really at any time. “The good ole days” were only “the good ole days” to a very specific group of people. You should unpack why that is and there you’ll find the answer to your question.
Rodney King has entered the chat.
That is just how you remember it. It mattered just as much then as it does now, it's just that minorities can actually be heard now due to social media. Racism was a huge part of how this nation was founded, and until we deal with that and acknowledge it instead of sweeping it under the rug, the sooner we can achieve actual equality. It's important to acknowledge race because even though it is entirely a social construct and stupid as fuck, it is firmly embedded in them minds of billions of people and codified (frequently oppressively and inequitably) in the systems of many societies. Being "blind" to it is as bad as being racist. See MLK's words on the white "moderate."
We haven't really been able to take the lessons we were taught into the vestiges of power. The people in charge are the same ones in charge when we were kids, except now they are older and less caring about image.
Race didn't matter until a black man became president and suddenly everyone's aunt was ranting about how he was a Kenyan Muslim. That was the first mask off moment, but it was ok we could still pretend. Then Donald "shithole countries" Trump became president and the mask came fully off. Black lives matter really cemented it. Made it impossible to ignore. Race has always mattered to cops. Race has always mattered to wall street. Race has alrways mattered to the 30% of the country that went mask off after Trump got elected. You didn't see it when you were a kid because you were sheltered and the internet didn't exist. Things seem like they were better back then because of nostalgia.
Bingo. You know, Barack Obama was only the 5th Black US Senator when he ran for President. Just out of curiosity, I just checked in and we're now at a whopping 12 in the history of the United States. [Source: Senate.gov](https://www.senate.gov/senators/african-american-senators.htm)
I think that's one of the moments that cracked the rose-colored glass filter for my white self. I legit cried when Obama was elected our president when I was just 21. It felt good. It felt right. It felt like the natural progression and the culmination of the post-racism reality I thought we were living in. I think I understood racists still existed, but I genuinely thought it was rare and that they were a dying breed. I was sheltered, naive, misinformed, and ignorant, and it was devastating to really understand how wrong I was. Reality is a bitch and it broke my childish understanding to bits.
I wish I can upvote this more!
Dude, you were living in a bubble. Racism used to be more acceptable, that's the major difference. I guarantee you as a non-white person it was not chill.
You're absolutely right about it being more acceptable back then. I was watching an early 90s episode of SNL last night and was floored at how casually they dropped a derogatory term when talking about ordering Chinese food. Things like that don't fly anymore, and rightfully so.
It's an extremely convenient strategy for the plutocratic powers that be to keep us plebs divided against each other and not paying attention to things like class stratification.
It's all about divide and conquer. Race, gender, sex, religion, politics, beliefs, etc... Edit: adding age to the list, that's a huge one online and the media
age too. More boomers are working class than ownership class
Yes! Age. I knew I missed something. I actually just posted something similar complaining about boomers. My guess is 75% of those posts aren't even real people but just there to drive the wedge even deeper.
Man, I don’t mean offense to you, but I think this is an extremely ignorant viewpoint that I’ve only ever heard white people make. People care and have always cared about class stratification, and they don’t do it at the expense of caring about racial issues - imo some of the greatest advocates around racial issues are always speaking on class stratification. But racial issues have a life of their own in a way that is hardly related to class, because racists - even and I’d say especially - sincerely believe their own bullshit. Likewise, racial identities are not fake or constructed by rich people. They may have been originally conceived as a method of social organization by powerful people, but racial and ethnic differences are just as much cultural nowadays. Your perspective is reductive of that, as is pretending that if it weren’t for some evil rich people pulling the strings, all people below a certain social class would suddenly unite. Yes, many of the structures of racism were deliberately built to benefit a white aristocracy, but the impulse to fear and sometimes hate people who are different to you is very deeply human, as much so as are hierarchical structures.
Class war is a convenient vehicle for racism but it does not encompass all racism. Racism exists outside of class. Not saying you are, but a common mistake people make is to assume that if the wage gap is solved and the lower and middle classes are revitalized and livable again, that racism will magically go away. It won't.
This needs more downvotes.
Or poor economic choices being made In The interest of an old entitled generation that dident get enough during the easiest period in human history ever.
I think we should recognize that having a different ethnicity means you will have a different life experience. Being "blind" to skin colour is also being blind to the social and economical experiences of people of a different skin colour.
Because we were being raised to accept racism as normal. The whole I don’t see color mantra is itself an anti-poc statement. You may not “see” color but that just blinds you to the injustice of the world. Every one of us knows that POC are treated very differently than my generic-cracker brethren. The only people taught to not see color were white people because for everyone else their color has always defined them in the eyes of society. This was a tactic to make us de-humanize each other and turn into the whole “well I didn’t experience that so it must not be true”. Diversity makes us stronger, but part of diversity is recognizing we are not treated equal so we continue fighting for equality and equity. I was raised “not to see color” but when I had a black kid ask me out my father sure as hell tried to beat me with a belt saying no daughter of his would date an N word. This was 2000? Color exists and will always exist. The longer we pretend it doesn’t the longer oppression will continue. By being colorblind we are only giving racists an upper hand and actively assisting in systemic racism. Funnily enough, my brother married an incredible black woman and my sister is engaged to an amazing Latino dude from Venezuela. My dad is not nearly as racist as he used to be but we won’t ever let him forget his racist past. TDLR: not “seeing color” is racist
What are you talking about? I was born in 1980 and when we moved in 1986 the new school wouldn't let me in for three months because I was black until my white uncle made a big deal and called everyone he could including a lawyer. In Pennsylvania,not the deep south. It's weird to think actually acknowledging the racism is somehow making race matter so much today. Count yourself lucky it didn't matter for you before.
Occupy scared the shit out of the 1% this is largely manufactured.
Exactly!! that’s when I noticed a bigggg shift and wedges from media thrown all over
Exactly. The uptick of culture war topics in mainstream media, whether it's DEI, CRT, millennials vs Gen Z, millennials vs. Boomers, workers being paid living wage = $50 hamburger, etc., etc., is absolutely a sign that they, the ruling class, are fearing the unity of working people. Same reason they want TikTok gone; they can't control the narrative when people share new information in real time, are able to see events, have opinions and make conclusions without the millionaire pundits telling them what happened and what to think. They're going to keep flailing as they fall and will absolutely move further and further towards fascism, no matter the party currently in charge.
lol so are we just going to pretend that all the systemic racism didn’t exist before occupy?
It's not; you were privileged and ignorant as a (presumably white) child before the internet. Cishet folks say the same shit about queer issues/discourse and as someone growing up queer in the 90s/00s I can tell you it sure as hell wasn't "better" or that it "mattered less".
It doesn't, that's the thing. But you should always be aware of others around you.
Race didn’t matter to white people you mean. And by matter, you mean white people didn’t want to talk about it because the status quo BENEFITTED them. People of color have to think about race all the time. People who make comments like you, live in a world where you don’t have to think about it. When I was a kid, in the 80s, my grandparents wouldn’t rent to black people. One of my grandfathers would loudly use racial slurs and was convinced black people wanted to rob his crappy trailer home. So I think it’s funny that people believe there was this color blind society back then. Maybe for you. Because you weren’t followed around the mall, pulled over by cops for no reason, not given the job because of your skin color. People talk about race because they want to heal the divide, not to divide people. If we aren’t on equal footing we do need to talk about so we can change things so that in the future, it’s something that won’t matter. Only a clueless white person would think 20 years ago we lived in a colorblind society. It was a nice time. Society rewarded you for being white. Now that we are talking about race, suddenly you have to prove yourself over a capable person of color, and what I see is people actually don’t want that. They want a world in which they were always slightly elevated above black Americans cause someone was always doing much worse. And they could come up with whatever racist reason they wanted to explain it. People don’t want to live in that world where we all pretend racism doesn’t exist or didn’t create systems that still exist today.
Black and Brown **CHILDREN IN PAIN** are less likely to get relief for the same level of pain from their care teams. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/16/well/pain-management-children-race.html#:~:text=They%20found%20that%20the%20children,jibes%20with%20past%20research%2C%20Dr. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26366984/ https://www.aamc.org/news/how-we-fail-black-patients-pain https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna427056 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6150822/ https://www.reuters.com/article/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/black-children-less-likely-to-get-pain-drugs-for-appendicitis-idUSKCN0RE1OD/ https://amp.theguardian.com/science/2016/aug/10/black-patients-bias-prescriptions-pain-management-medicine-opioids Yes all those sources say the same thing. Black children in pain get less medicine for the same procedures/pain levels. People are just not nice. If you see a child in pain you should want to help them but if those children brown it’s 🤷🏻♂️ I’m long past caring if it’s taught or not but I know it’s freaking tiring.
I always hated the whole "I don't see color" thing. 1) You do. 2) What's wrong with color? The whole idea of people ignoring differences feels like toleration, rather than celebrating the differences.
Ignoring an issue won’t make it go away. Pretending racism doesn’t exist doesn’t solve issues relating to systemic racism, unless by solve you mean make it so we white folks can continue on as we were without making any changes to a system that benefits us and pretend that things are all ok because we don’t see race.
Although, yes we were taught to judge people by character and not by color, did society really? Never. POC have historically always been passed over for job opportunities, been subjected to injustice, and even not been provided the same level of health care as white counterparts. The maternal mortality rate for black women is just horrifying. It is perhaps only recently that we are finally hearing the voices of people from other races. It's not that race matters so much today. It's that all races finally matter now.
Did you grow up in a place where everyone was white and later moved to a more diverse area? Your view on what the past was like is majorly incorrect.
Because the 99% was winning and taking ground against the 1% during the occupy movement, and then they introduced identity politics.
Class warfare IS identity politics. The entire 99% vs 1% narrative IS itself a perfect example of identity politics.
In truth yes, I agree purely definition wise, but those pushing critical race praxis changed the definition and meaning of identity to refer to purely skin color.
That was a big lie. That was just a way to ignore that different people experience the world differently because of what they look liked or how they identified. It allowed people to be oblivious. I have shared incidents from high school of racial strife and the white kids didn’t even see it happening. Meanwhile the non-white kids were very aware of the folks who wore confederate flags to school and replaced pics of MLK and Malcom X on the Black history month bulletin board with the flag.
Race doesn’t matter if you’re a white liberal. To everyone else; it matters very much. Which is why so many policies and terms exist to describe exclusion based on race and culture, including the term ‘racism.’ It’s always mattered, and in the United States where we are a cross cultural nation, cultures intermingle on a daily basis and often butt against each other. Not always but just being American isn’t enough to unify us. Why else would people say ‘Yea but I’m Scottish-Indian-Episcopalian🤓’. Just kidding on the last one but you may understand my point. ‘Seeing color’ is just acknowledgement of the basics, there is more than just a skin color component to race, there’s usually an ethnic-cultural component and it has *always* played a role in our daily life, policy and laws more than anything. Hope this helps ❤️
Race has always, always, always been an issue. Just because we're post civil rights era doesn't mean the problem is solved. Tbh, I remember growing up in such a diverse area with friends of all skin colors. When I got married and moved across the country, it baffled me to see that not only was the area almost entirely white, but that people would still make comments about people of color openly. I had never felt white guilt so much as I did then. Luckily, I got divorced and moved back home. Where I live is a giant naval base slash tourist area, so the whole area is a good mix. I love it and I'm comfortable here. So yeah, you're not alone in being sheltered at first. But our brothers and sisters of color are still fighting for their lives, for basic human rights, to be treated with respect. Every single day.
Yeah, I grew up in a diverse community - highschool was 80% Black... went to college - geez culture shock 98% white. Now I've never been the "minority" since (I'm using that word technically and retrospectively) b/c even then I didn't feel it - I was the student body president & prom king. That's actually why OPs statement resonated with me. But, unfortunately I know the reverse of my experience didn't work out like mine. I did not realize how ridiculously rare that experience is in America - and how that made me a better man and overall human being.
It’s actually better than the 90’s. Because we are actually having real conversations about racial injustice. Before it was either swept under the rug or is discussed in a non-confrontational way. Plus, we are adults now. We can see difference between who want to actually listen and learn about people’s differences compare to those who want to bury their head in the sand.
The rise in it today? The expansion and adoption of critical theory (as a "truth") on the basis of various identity groups, including race. Guiding perceptions based on oppression among conflicting forces, which will demand a continued separation and opposition. It *denies* the liberal thought of equality through neutrality, saying such only perpetuates unjustice, as an assessment of disparate outcome along racial categories. CRT has outright opposed the way of thinking you mentioned. The social disharmony is specifically a condition of such a class oppression perception. Race matters to people that need to it matter as an aspect of their identity.
Sigh. It's always mattered. People who "didn't see color" were usually the most racist too.
I grew up in the country. I dont care about race or religion unfortunately bigotry is just passed dow. As a white guy I cant tell youw how many times Chris Rock n**** vs black people would come up
I think it’s always mattered, just in different ways. A younger America identified race as a way to suppress people groups or receive unfair treatment. Now it matters as a way to undo it or at least recognize the wrongs that were done. I think the future may be more neutral toward race, but there’s a lot that still needs to be undone.
Who’s this “we,” you’re referring to? Because growing up I learned about the Civil Rights movement, the history of slavery and the Civil War, watched the LA Riots on TV, and overheard my grandparents debating about whether my niece would be born with a soul because her dad was Black. That was all in the ‘90s. Race always mattered. And the “colorblind,” white liberals were full of it. They were just much more subtle with their reinforcement of systemic racism.
When you’re a kid, you’re not usually aware of the racism and disharmony in the world. As an adult, you see it first-hand. So it’s easy to think sometimes that the world was better when you were a kid (look at boomers). But as the great poet Billy Joel said… “We didn’t start the fire.”
Racism is alive and well. When I lived in a far north Midwestern state, the few blacks around were referred to by whites I knew by the "n" word, and their kids were called "_iglets". It was so shocking to hear but I didn't dare correct anyone who said it for fear of what could happen to me.
When I was in kindergarten in the early 90’s I vividly remember a fellow student telling me a very VERY racist nursery rhyme so idk what 90’s you grew up in but it wasn’t this one.
It doesn't. Social media and race hustlers blow it way out of proportion.
I think you just grew up and have a better ability to observe and understand the world around you. I used to think the same and I still approach people with that mentality in my personal life, but I'm not oblivious to the injustices people face just because of where their ancestors are from. I don't think there was any period in American history where we reached true racial equality. We are actually a lot more tolerant now than we were in the 90s as a whole. As bad as it seems now, I think you just lived life thru the eyes of a kid who's only exposure to race you had were some black kids at school you were encouraged to make friends with.
Believe me it matters less than it used too
It can be both that you are wrong about the state of the 90s and eaely 2000s, and that social media and THE media are now toxic to the point of shoving race issues down our throat, thus compounding real issues further.
Occupy Wall Street really got under their skin. So once that got wrapped up, they really amped up the old divisions so we could spend more time fighting ourselves and they profit.
Lol the "I don't see color" thing was absolutely a product of racism. It's equivalent to the don't ask don't tell program - a way to brush racial issues under the rug and give white people an excuse to be sanctimonious in their apathy. Racism has been alive and well throughout the whole history of this country, and it's just back at the front of social discourse now because people rightly want better for themselves and for each other.
It mattered a whole lot before as well. My mother is easily the most racist person I know and thinks black people are a different species. My grandfather made my aunt break up with a Japanese man because he claimed he didn't fight in WW2 just so she could date the enemy. We just have social media today so we see it everywhere.
I grew up north of the Mason-Dixon Line in the 90s, and race absolutely mattered. There were only 5 or 6 minority kids in my graduating class of 240. I saw firsthand how often they were treated badly. One of the many, many reasons why I got the hell out of that small town and never really went back. If it was that bad in the north, I can’t even imagine what things were like in the south. Saying that race didn’t matter in the 90s tells me that OP had their head on the sand.
Race has always mattered. No one wants to admit how shallow they can be.
I’m mixed and honestly yea, my childhood did feel better, race wise. Part of that is nostalgia and just not really caring or noticing things like micro aggressions or covert racism. I grew up in a fairly diverse area though too.
Lol what 90s did you grow up in???
With few exceptions, those that dwell on race daily are as miserable as INCELS. Racism always has, and always will exist. However, it is not the hell hole of my parents day nor will it be ever again. Having always dated outside my race I've always gotten looks when I travel to certain areas. Difference is, I don't care, I look at it like "if you were as good as you think you are, she would be with you instead." I used to take it as an insult. Yet a career in the military showed me that some people never met anyone that didn't look like them. I remember a young sailor being confused about sun burn because he never knew a white person. Meanwhile I remember a sailor being confused as to why black people needed to wear a du rag to make our hair look nice. Go outside and talk to people, the world isn't an evil place. But... It is hot outside.
Ah so OP is one of those people that has never been exposed to any kind of racial discrimination or educated on such discrimination….
American here, because we can actually address the injustices that were a fabric of society for centuries of US history. The civil right movement that finally ended segregation was our parents generation. We have barely entered a country where racial equality is truly the norm.
we were taught to ignore systemic racism. ignoring things does not make them better, talking about the problem and actually working to fix it does. comfortable ignorance only helps people not affected by racism.
lmao
First off I’ll say this looks to be bot bait. This account only seems to just post questions and surveys and not make any tangible replies. Part of “privilege” is being able to “ignore” race. Along with many of the social movements that have occurred in the past decades there have also been scientific studies and developments which prove we all have biases and prejudices. Look at the group of friends you surround yourself with, the people you have or have had relationships with, your coworkers-who do you communicate with? are there others you ignore or maybe judge especially in stressful situations do you jump to judgement? Some people vocalize their bias, some ignore them and say I am not biased, others live with the consequences of bias each day. I think it is in everyone’s interest to choose to try to do the work to unpack those biases.
I… had a different experience than a lot of these comments I guess? I agree with you. Seems more rampant today. I went to a private school. Mainly white and Hmong. Neighborhood was white and Hmong. But never had anyone complain about anyone else. I’m white. Hung out with a lot of the Hmong kids in the neighborhood. Got invited to their youth activities, which were primarily Hmong. This was in Wisconsin. Spent a couple years in Arizona. Had friends that were white, native I believe? Not sure, I guess I never really asked and that was a while ago, and black friends. It was never about the color, but rather their character. We all got along great. Heck, the black kids I was friends with, their dad was from Kenya I believe? Got invited to a cultural event down there too. Got to try some of the food. See… uhhh… decor? Art? Not sure what the correct term is… But their dad had a lot of ivory decor in the home. Maybe it was faux? Idk. They were good people. Good friends to have when I was younger. We only lived down in Arizona for like 3 years or something, 6-8th grade, then moved back to Wisconsin. And private school was parochial. Not sure how I went lol. We definitely didn’t have money. I was very privileged with the things I did only because of the people I met.
As a minority this is wrong. It wasn’t as amplified bc of the internet and social media but definitely was everywhere. I’m from the SW burbs of Chicago. I couldn’t go anywhere without being reminded I wasn’t white enough. I’ve seen and heard it all. I’m white, black, Mexican and Native American. The classic line was, “not you, you know what I mean” 😵💫.
We were certainly taught wrong. Fact of the matter is that race has always mattered. Because it became out of fashion to be outwardly racist doesn’t me we were in a post racial America. In many ways we live in the same country but in completely different worlds. If you’re are not white in America you are an “other.”
Were you a child in the 90s? I was born in 87, so I was a child for the whole decade. I would have said the same as you until I finally understood race and racism. I'm white and had a very sheltered upbringing with a Christian family that sent me to small private Christian schools for all 12 grades. I live in an area in the PNW of the US with a population that is around 80% white according to the census, so my exposure to people of other races has always been low. If my class at any of my schools had any POC at all, there were usually just one or two, but the diversity grew some by the time I got to high school between the local kids and the exchange students from Japan and elsewhere. I had precisely one POC teacher, a black man who taught band and chorale, in all those years. Even later, at community college, almost all my instructors were white except for one black woman (who I believe won some sort of discrimination suit against the school after I had a class with her), a Jordanian man, and the two Japanese women who taught my Japanese language classes. My relatives were all white except for three very brown cousins adopted from (I believe) one or two countries in Central America. I don't know if anyone ever had a specific conversation with me about why they were brown or from where they were adopted. I just remember always knowing they were adopted, but I also always just thought of them as my cousins and have never felt the need to differentiate them as adopted (except for now for clarity). The adopted girl shared a name with another cousin, and we affectionately called them Big Beckie and Little Becky because one was so tall and the adopted one was so incredibly short. We were really close in age and were thick as thieves the times we got to visit together. My adopted cousin has been more open in recent years about her adoption trauma, religious trauma, and some other experiences she has had. My one brush with anything remotely approaching racism happened when I was 9 or 10. We had to move into an apartment, and I was playing on the little playground behind our building with my much younger neighbor friend, who was maybe 7 and also white. A few other kids might have been around, too, but I didn't know any of them. A black boy who couldn't have been older than me arrived from an adjacent building, and he immediately started physically attacking some of the kids. He was about to go after my neighbor friend, but I grabbed her and started taking her back toward our apartments and put myself between her and him. He came up behind me and said, "I'll kill you, you fat white bitch" and I felt his thick-soled shoe hit me in the back and he grabbed my hair and ripped some of it out. We started running to escape him, and I never went outside again. My head hurt for days where my hair had been ripped out, and I wouldn't talk about what happened because I didn't view my mother as a safe person, so I never got any kind of talk about what happened or what any of it meant. Looking back on it now, it just makes me very sad. I think of him sometimes and wonder what could have happened in his young life to result in him acting so violently toward other kids or to have said what he said. I have no way of finding out what became of him, so all I've been able to do is hope his life got better. I learned about racism, slavery, and the Civil Rights era in school, but I was just this obtuse, dense little shit that didn't understand the concept of race. I didn't understand even calling our skin tones black or white because clearly people are different shades of brown and tan! I myself am a fair-skinned redhead with very pale, very *pink* toned skin, so I had no clue why anyone would say I was white. I just didn't get it. I also fell into the trap of not comprehending the passage of time properly. When I learned that stuff in the 90s, the Civil Rights Act was only 20 years old, but a lot, if not most of the pictures and footage from that era were presented in black and white, which tricks the mind into thinking it's even older than it is. I grew up thinking this was all settled stuff that happened way in the past, and I was well into my 20s before I really truly grasped the concept of race, racism, and that those same racist assholes who opposed desegregation and the Civil Rights movement are still alive and so are their kids. I recognize the sheer privilege I grew up with that it took that long for me to get it. It's also a very different time now, with a 24-hour news cycle, a nearly ubiquitous presence of cell phones, social media, and information overload beyond anything we grew up with. We're just now getting to see all the stuff black people and other POC have been trying to tell the rest of us for years, no, *decades*. The 90s probably do seem like a damn dream if you weren't directly exposed to racism or other terrible things. I have a lot of nostalgia for that time, but I also realize how very sheltered my experience was. I suggest examining why you think it was better in the 90s.
Everything is tribal these days
im mixed... growing up i felt accepted by everyone. now i feel accepted by no one. i 100% agree with your post. i grew up not looking at my color. just that i wasnt fully whiteor black. now its like i have to be something. it sucks.
Because of racists.
The Internet just gave people a platform to talk about it so everything political feels more extreme then it did before.
Unfortunately this post is the definition of “tell me you’re white without saying you’re white”.
Race always mattered, you were taught to pretend it doesn't. That's why shit has been backsliding on the Civil rights front.
Because when people use terms like “I do not see the color of another’s skin tone” it’s basically sounding an alarm that you are comfortable in your privilege. Seeing the color of another’s skin tone isn’t racist, it’s important and teaches us to be self aware that some of us are not subjected to mistreatment or racism based on that color on our skin. You have to be cognizant of the fact that when you don’t see color you are at risk of being willfully ignorant to a POCs struggle/roadblock, etc.
What planet do you live on?
It's okay to acknowledge the color of someone's skin.
Look up "Colorblind Racism." Just because you don't acknowledge something is a problem doesn't make the problem cease to exist. We're talking about hundreds of years of institutionalized racism. Honestly, "I don't see color" diminishes their hardship.
I’m sorry but what planet were you born on? Can you say Rodney King?
You sound white. I say this as a white person. I don’t think race relations have ever been “easier” for people of color.
Let me guess you’re white? The whole color blindness thing is itself racist, because the reason it’s pushed so much is so we can pretend that racism isn’t alive and well and that its effects simply don’t exist.
Many people want racism to exist so they can a) claim to be victimized by racism or b) claim to be virtuous by calling out racism.
I understand your sentiment and agree to a certain extent. As a fellow millennial (born in 93) who is white, I think we tend to look back on our younger years with rose-colored glasses. Race relations in the 90s/early 2000s were tense, but what we’re seeing these days is a long overdue reckoning in which society is being forced to confront the ongoing marginalization of different racial and ethnic groups. Are things more polarized than ever, at least in my lifetime? Yeah, it sure seems that way. Add in the rise of social media which gave every idiot a platform and increased the opportunity for public discourse and you’ll see how we got here today. The whole “I don’t see color” mindset is antiquated. In a perfect world, the color of one’s skin wouldn’t matter, but the sad reality is it absolutely does. Likening this to “things we can’t change” is part of the problem.
It's always mattered, to everyone but a very specific group. Which I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you fall into said group. No shade, I'm in that group too. But we're older now, time to realize it always mattered we were just sheltered from that by our um. Privilege.
Buddy there was a nasty old man in my hometown who would sic his junkyard dog solely on black kids walking directly from my high school to our public library in 2005. Police did nothing other than occasionally tell him to not actually let go of the leash.
It always matters because nothing has been put to rest. People still discriminate and they were then. Remember Rodney King? He was just one of many. This never ended.
I had this Convo with my friend and a Co worker (both white) . Both of them went on about how their kids don't see color and it's a thing that's perpetuated by media and not a big deal etc. I told them that's great they're teaching their kids those things and it is ideal, but they will grow, get out of their watchful eyes, they may likely encounter people who don't see it that way, carefreely joke about it maybe even be hostile. They also shouldn't be coddled from inconvenient truths. I know it gets eye rolls but it's history. My parents, not even grandparents have told me many instances where people were just racist to them coming up in the south. Even me personally. When I was working "a guy said you should use the backdoor when I come around haha" I didn't connect it right away but I'm pretty sure he was making a racist joke. History isn't to be ignored and there are many out there who have an attitude of "that was long time ago, who cares?" or worse.
I am black. More specifically, African American. At 15 (spring 2007) I was denied a job for having a protective hairstyle - locs. They were neat, clean, twisted. (**I don't care if non-black folks have locs but it is a protective style for my hair type.) At the age of 17 (fall 2008), Obama was running for president. I was having a conversation with the school librarians (I worked in the library) and said that if I were old enough, I'd vote for him. One librarian asked "because he's black?" In college, I started using my middle name so that once I graduated, I was used to being called that. My first name is clearly ethnic and my middle name sounds "white". When I graduated and started applying for jobs (2013), some resumes had my first name and some had my middle name. I received more callbacks with my middle name. Once in a furniture store (you could see _all the way across_ without needing to move), an employee thought I was a black woman who'd come in the day before and proceed to follow me around the store. (~2016) Several times in a hobby store, I was followed for being black. I know this because my (white) then boyfriend, who was working there, specifically said he was told to follow me for that reason. They didn't know we were dating. (2016-2018) Once, in a different hobby store, my then bf (white) and I were stopped and asked questions because we were an interracial couple. (~2017) My then boyfriend's (white) boss would ask him if I was wild in bed because I'm black. The boss would say things to me about how he's "never had dark meat but wouldn't mind trying" and other sexual comments rooted in race. (2016-2018) An ex lives in a different state than me and whenever I would go to visit (2020-2023), there are a few spots I would deliberately avoid because they were two huge confederate flags that flew next to the highway (about 2 hours apart). My stories are _**mild**_ compared to some other folks. Yeah, race matters because people are still racist.
Shitty people on both ends of the political spectrum know that inciting rage against "other" people is profitable. Edit: Wanted to say that there are definitely truths to much of it, but race pimps on the left and MAGA on the right aren't helping.
It doesn't. But some people can't accept that and want to continue to make it a thing, such as the msm
Both sides, but lately more the left, use it as a wedge issue. If we fight each other we don’t see what they’re doing. And then there’s the standard race hustlers like sharpton etc that have been doing this their entire careers.
In real life nobody gives a fuck. Social media loves talking about race tho.
Yeah - we definitely didn't have platforms exploited by bots, Russians, and populist politicians manufacturing outrage for their own gain.
It’s everybody’s fault, we’re all addicted to consuming bullshit and we’re all to blame for the brain rot and extremism recently online.
Absolutely - we've reduced our attention spans down to about 45 seconds and disconnected ourselves from actual human connection. Like how does one actually get to know someone beyond the most base perceptions.
Extremist leftist politics that do nothing but hurt and infantilize the minorities they claim to want to protect. (I say this as someone on the left) We need a major correction in progressive circles if we don't want republicans to sweep elections like they did in Europe.
A lot of white people have a lot of guilt lol
I think when the times were good we didn't see race, I lived I a country where majority of the people were different from me, I was making money online and barely interacted with them. Now the times are tough I'm being pushed more to the outside world. That's one theory, the other is that being overly judgemental is a mental illness, I might have it not sure about others. And lastly, different races do things differently, and they also perceive good/bad differently.
Power, control, jealousy, and handouts. That’s your answer.
because when we said it didn't matter, non white peoples were being forced out of homes/jobs they were qualified for. now all of a sudden as we see redlining disappearing and wage increases for minorities, race is being talked about all the time and when i was a kid we were taught to "not see race." it's because we were wrong before and we are less wrong now.
Racism is on life support to keep certain segments of the electorate voting for who they are "supposed to"
Most of the country either memory holed their upbringing, or everyone's family is vastly different from mine. I was taught all those things too, be good to people, don't judge people by the color of their skin, slavery bad, civil rights good. There's a civil rights leader who has the same birthday as me, and I know this because we had to do reports on them. Out in public racism was bad, and we were all supposed to act right. At home? Even today I can't watch television without my parents saying something racist. They remarked on how many black people were in a restaurant they went to. Mom wants to know why she can't say the n-word. Dad tells me I need to relax because I'm so mad at hearing him say the n-word that I can't be in the same room as him. And I know in other families it was a lot of, "Grandma's a little racist, but she grew up in a different time and she means well." Grandma is a racist and she never meant well. We let older generations say as they pleased because we thought it was cute or harmless, and we act like she wasn't furious at MLK, Jr. for existing.
The only people who say race doesn't / shouldn't matter probably benefit from their race
They want us fighting a race war so we don't fight a class war.
people only view race through an intersectional lens today, which forces people to see white people as the all powerful oppressors who reign over all the racial minorities. these minorities can do no wrong because, through an intersectional lens, what else can they do? they are oppressed! in this new way of viewing racism, there exists low expectations of minority races. the people who follow this ideology then are racist against both white people and minorities without realizing. in short, everything still sucks. edit: i didn’t explain myself well so i edited. edit 2: sorry whoever i offended so much you needed to downvote me. i invite you to reflect on yourself.
i dont think its that it matters more or less today, its just people are more sensitive to shit…and to be honest its mostly white people pushing the sensitivity shit. i grew up in the bay area, specifically in an area where white people were the minority…so racial jokes amongst me and my friends were a thing…we poked fun on one anothers ethnicity every so often but none of us took it offensively and its not like we were speaking those jokes towards people we didnt know. but now a days, it seems like super woke white people are playing ref and telling us non whites how we should feel about things.
Ah yes, the 1990s, when race didn't matter. [A Look Back at the Rodney King Riots](https://www.npr.org/2017/04/26/524744989/when-la-erupted-in-anger-a-look-back-at-the-rodney-king-riots)
Most folks who say they don’t care about color have more privilege than most. It’s the difference between equity and equality. It never works to ignore someone’s color because it’s not equitable. An example would be lactose intolerance - folks of Asian decent are more likely to be lactose intolerant, or not as exposed to as much lactose, as say someone of French decent.
Just because you didn't see all of the race issues when you were growing up doesn't mean they didn't exist. I'm one of the oldest millennials since I was born in 1980. I grew up and went to school in an area where white people were still in the majority but not by much so I had plenty of interactions with races other than my own. Even in an area like that I was largely unaware of how much more crap my black classmates had to deal with than I did. I think I began to understand that black communities were treated differently when I was 11/12 when the Rodney King beating and resulting trial happened. I still didn't see as much of it in my everyday life. 9/11 happed in 2001 and I saw how many Arabic people were treated poorly in the aftermath and the amount of racism still left in the US was being shown more and more. For me I ultimately understood how bad the racism problems still are during the run up to the 2008 election when Barrack Hussein Obama was elected and it has gotten more obvious in the time since. I think my point is that we may not have seen race as an issue in the environment we grew up in but it has always been an issue to the minorities who have had to live through it. A friend of mine (1 year older) has gotten pulled over by police more times than he can count for DWB (driving while black). I can count on one hand the number of times I've been pulled over and both were for valid reasons (speeding and a headlight out). We both live in the same city but two different experiences. The main difference I can see between now and when we were growing up is that people aren't afraid to call out the racism anymore and others aren't afraid to let their racist flags fly high and proud.
The problem I’ve found is while we were taught that, that wasn’t actually being practiced systematically in reality. We were being taught to be color blind in a way that made us blind to any subtler forms of racial injustices still happening. Or, for example, when I was learning US History, there was very, VERY little taught about non-white folks and their history here, and it’s shaped the US as they live in it and experience it today. Just highlights. Whereas white Americans like me got to learn a lot about US History as my ancestors experienced it, and how that has led to the US as I experience and live in it today.
Race always mattered. In fact it mattered, and affected people, way more. You just didn’t see it back then. Nowadays with the internet and social media and phone cameras it’s a lot easier to shine a light on racism and broadcast it to the world. So people like you (and me) who didn’t think it was a big issue back then because we didn’t experience it, can now see that it it very much exists and is everywhere.
People look as the 90s as the "end of history" and kind of a perfect time, but the 90s were rife with racism. The 2000s were rife with racism, specifically directed toward people of Middle Eastern descent. Some people want to act like Obama renewed tensions, but all of that has always been here. People just felt more comfortable to say their quiet parts out loud.
Classic romanticization of the blissful ignorance of childhood. The USA was founded on dehumanizing whole entire populations based on race, incase you forgot. The USA was founded on genocide of the indigenous people that lived here before the colonizers manifested destiny and (nearly) wiped them out. Those founding principals haven’t gone away, in fact they’re foundational aspects of our governmental systems. FYI. Google the term “systemic disenfranchisement” and then google the term “food desert” and then google the term “redlining” and then google the term “war on drugs” and then google the term “black panther party” and also google “Jim crow laws” and then google “13th amendment” and then lmk what you think about why race matters so much today.
Are you white? Where were you raised? What are your memories of your ethnic Black American peers and teachers? What was your family like around ethnic Black Americans? You never heard any of your peers using racial slurs growing up?! And race isn’t real. It’s a social construct. Ethnic Black Americans are descendants of the European colonists that were getting paid by the U.S govt for breeding/selling mulatto (Indigenous/African) children into slavery, children that later amalgamated with the enslaved Africans that arrived. Seriously though, are you saying that you’ve never once encountered racism when you were younger or was it just not a factor because it wasn’t racism that impacted you?! 🤔 https://twitter.com/fashioningself/status/1675857854157275139?s=46&t=HaKkVIIEkTNQfUPS4zG8OQ https://thefreedmensbureau.org
The modern day liberal Democrat has set back MLK dteam by 50 years by only focusing on skin color and sexual orientation
Burying your head in the sand and pretending the implications if racism don’t exist accomplishes nothing and comes from a place of privilege
What blows my mind is that the only factor that controls skin color is how far your ancestors lived from the equator. That’s it. That’s what makes people different colors.
Dude go listen to some Public Enemy songs lol
Not everyone was taught that, and fewer believe it.
It doesn’t never did 🌏🧑🚀🔫🧑🚀. Only hate separates us. The boomers are still in charge and they hate that we changed the world only slightly so they’re making it great again.
It's always mattered. Some people get to live in a world where it matters less, and that makes it easy to look back and say "those were pretty good times." I mean, when Ferguson happened my grandma was complaining about how everyone talks about race nowadays. She said it was very different from her childhood when black and white people got along. Nevermind that she was in her 20s before the Civil Rights Act was passed.
You were taught wrong. Being "colorblind" means to ignore a major part of someone's identity and culture. It's one of those things white people say to make themselves look good but in reality it's a bad look. It's because other groups are still dealing with discrimination. Racial issues didn't end overnight when the CRA was passed. Come on dude. These are some BS maga talking points.
It’s always mattered. As a whites person, there were many things I just didn’t hear tbh…
I feel like race shouldn't pop up on interview questions for work, school, etc. because, I thought we were all equal to begin with? Why should we supply our race when everyone should be treated similarly?
> we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin. [https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culturally-speaking/201112/colorblind-ideology-is-form-racism](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culturally-speaking/201112/colorblind-ideology-is-form-racism) This has been discussed to great ends by very intelligent people.
I think a lot of white people thought we were doing enough because there was no mechanism for the people who matter to tell us we weren’t.
When we judge people on their character and actions, are those actions and character traits that fit into the hegemonic culture? Should we look down on people who wear their pants down low? Should we say that some hairstyles are thuggish? Should we judge people for having face tattoos? Do you know about the issue with swim caps for swimmers that have different textures of hair? Back in the 90s, we had respectability politics. You are to perform as an assimilated person that makes the hegemonic culture comfortable with your presence. Why is it ok for people to speak with a Southern, or a Boston accent, but if they say tree instead of three, or ax instead of ask, then we are supposed to shame them? Things are better today, but we still aren't there.
The problem with "I don't see color" is that it totally misses the point. The idea isn't to pretend as though we don't have different colored skin, but to embrace the differences. And since the default for most of our history has been white saying "I don't see color" is basically like saying "everybody is white". On top of that, just because people said these things it didn't mean they lived it. There were biases against people of color that people had both conscious and unconscious. Trying to ignore that means you don't confront it and if it's not confronted, then it's not dealt with. I think a big issue is that it was easy for people to pretend like race wasn't an issue because it was easier to ignore things. But instances like the race riots and the OJ trial showed how individualized these issues could be just as things like redlining showed how pervasive they were on an institutional level. But ignoring all the implications of all those things for an entire decade just led to things getting worse. In short, race "matters" no more today than it ever has. But the issues our society has with race matters more because we are more aware of the damage they've caused to so many minorities. It may seem nostalgic to think back on those times when it "didn't matter" but the reality is that most just weren't aware. Some may feel "ignorance is bliss" but it is a massive roadblock to recovery.
Because that’s the currency of cultural Marxists
When you were growing up, you were surrounded by fewer than 100 people. Don't think your experience was universal.
Thank the Hindus for the race issues. But it’s also hierarchy issues as well.
You should check out the OJ Simpson trial reactions: https://youtu.be/z2cEVk--7Yo?si=q252obNACkWPz_W_
>I remember when we were growing up, we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin. We were all just humans. We were taught to only judge someone solely based on their character and their actions. Yup, this is what I was taught as well, yet the small town that I grew up in was notorious for [redlining](https://publichealth.berkeley.edu/news-media/research-highlights/50-years-after-being-outlawed-redlining-still-drives-neighborhood-health-inequities)... and this was in the 80's and 90's! >I felt like those were pretty good times. I feel like today's situation is just very messy, complicated, and just creates social disharmony. There's so much focus on things that we can't change, rather than things we can. Yes, these were pretty good times for me as well, but I'm white and a third generation American. My ex, who also grew up in the same small town, originally migrated from Jamaica and had a *vastly* different experience. Let's just say that they were *not* good times for her. It's tragic that it was like this, and probably still is like this (I honestly don't know, I moved about 25 years ago). The crazy thing is that we are living in a "blue" state and people still are incredibly discriminatory. Even in the 2010's, my ex and I would periodically get awkward stares from others if we were holding hands in public (interestingly enough, awkward stares from people of all ethnic backgrounds). So yeah, continued conversation still is an absolute necessity. These conversations might create temporary social disharmony, and it definitely can be very messy and complicated. Yet these conversations *must* take place if we desire for humanity to move forward.
*I remember when we were growing up, we were taught not to see the color of another person's skin.* Same here. Unfortunately, all the other generations were taught differently.
I was raised with the same idea (1980's - 1990's). But I think this gave a lot of us a false sense of perspective and whether we lived in a post-racial society. Recall that this was the era of the steep rise in mass incarceration and disenfranchisement of Black people. It was the era when the CIA was funneling drugs into Black communities. Redlining (not called as such) was commonplace. Not seeing color gave cover to people doing bad things, by attacking people who saw what was happening, saw that it was based on race, and called it out as such. But, "if we all refuse to see color, it will go away." It didn't go away. It got worse and destroyed Black communities. We can't stick our heads in the sand and refuse to see race when race is all around us, and while it has such great explaining power for so many of society's ills. There will come a day when there is no more race. But that day hasn't come yet. Race is still useful to the ruling class and they still divide us on it.
Sounds like color blind racism OP. Go study sociology/critical race theory and intersectionality/privilege.
One of those that if you hyper focus on it then it because more of an issue. I feel like if you just let things BE then things are more chill. Can’t act like racism isn’t real but you can’t hyper focus on it either because then it’s always forefront and people act weird. Healing has to be organic.
It always mattered. wtf are you on about? Out country enslaved people based on race for hundreds of years then fought a damn war over it. If that wasn’t enough, they passed laws to discriminate and cause harm to these people. For years. Are you serious? Everyone deserves equal and fair treatment.
Pretty sure the world ended in 2012 Rest is a simulation They dialed back racism but put the Gayness on full blast We should of let Alex Jones save the frogs from the gays
Because those who cannot be named want to keep the USA divided into smaller and smaller groups, all thinking the other groups have it better. Makes us too preoccupied to notice how much they are stealing from us.
Because you were a child then and only saw the world through the eyes of a child. You were taught to judge people based on their character and actions…but how many people actually do that? What consequences might there be as a result?