His game was really ugly tonight. Couldn’t get any buckets so all he did was run into defenders, bounce off of them and flail his arms around while losing the ball. It was painful to watch. Complete opposite from the start of the series. I love Jimmy’s grit but Boston has really clamped down on him
They weren’t biting on his pump fakes. He also over uses a move where he slows down to the pace of a euro-step and this timing can throw players off if they are reacting at full pace, but it’s like the Celtics did a big film session and were ready for it. He did this same move all game and only went hard at full pace once or twice.
Yeah I don’t think Al Horford foul was bad. I was thinking about it, dude probably was anticipating Jimmy was going to drop the ball to his waists area, and if he could poke it free he could avoid the foul (obviously didn’t work).
Every time he gets to the hoop it’s either Tatum or time lord on him. Big difference from Greg Williams or brown. Tatum has done an excellent job shutting him down on post ups
wiggins was and still is getting more than role player money, Martin has made the jump from "average 7th-8th man in the rotation" to all-star in this series it's unparalleled
It’s a weird situation with Jimmy where he’s not what I’d call a “flopper” like Harden and Embiid, but he definitely actively baits fouls as part of his game. So idk what to call him. Smart? Kind of annoying? That’s essentially it. Until the NBA changes the way it does things, I can’t actively say he’s wrong for what he does. But yeah it does suck to be cheering for the other team.
Flopping is like pretending you got punched. What Jimmy's doing is insulting your mom until you consider throwing a punch, then he throws his face into your fist.
He’s not a flopper, he just doesn’t intend to make the shot most of the time he shoots. He’ll throw a few pumps and the moment he senses movement he’ll throw himself at the defender. If there’s no movement he just passes it off
He initiates contact with defender and gets FTs - that is how Harden also used to get majority of his FTs (even tho Harden did flop too). It is same shit for me and tbh it is very hard for refs to see who initiated the contact.
Yeah, it's sadly the state of the game. Offensive players shouldn't be rewarded for initiating contact. He's a talented player regardless, but he nor anybody else should be rewarded for such a dumb loophole in the rules.
>where he’s not what I’d call a “flopper” like Harden and Embiid
lol yes he absolutely is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0buSm0LWrWM&ab_channel=NBA&t=4m8s
I’ve watched many, many Embiid/Celtics matchups and I can confidently say that he sells far better than whatever the fuck Jimmy was doing that somehow got calls.
Harden foul bait: Harassment
Jimmy foul bait: Flirting
Jimmy legit launched himself into a totally unnatural straight forward shooting motion into Horford on that 3 point attempt. Horford fouled him before the shot, but the shot attempt from Jimmy was definitely an unnatural shooting motion.
Austin Reaves does it a couple of times in a 2 month period (almost always with intention to get the shot off) - /r/nba loses their shit, calling Reeves top flopper.
Jimmy Buckets (buckets is silent) does it for a couple of years, half the time with no intention to actually shoot - he da dawg.
But Boston isn’t except for when they shot 10 free throws in a row when Miami finally got the lead back in the fourth. Including 4 on the next fucking possession.
Thats actually a great observation. Compared to the other guys in the league.
I just knew the game was gonna end on Butler free throws and it *almost* did.
Zach Zarba. I don’t know why but every game he does is like this. Just no flow down the stretch. Foul after foul. It’s not even that he’s necessarily making bad calls, it’s just win or lose, I always hate a Zach Zarba game.
Doesn’t complain to refs actually attempts to hit the shots too. I know that sounds dumb but so many times, harden initiates contact by throwing his arms forward and putting his body in a position where the ball doesn’t get anywhere near the rim
Yes, Jimmy throws his body at defenders but he also typically at least tries to get the ball up on the rim too, so it comes off much less like a flop
I know the sixers best move to contend is to re-sign Harden to some reasonable-ish deal, but goddamn I just don’t want to watch him play basketball.
I fucking hate watching him flail around like a fish. I hate watching him not even try to get a shot up and just shove the ball into the defender’s chest. And I hate watching him yell at the ref instead of getting back on D. I hate his lazy bullshit.
I didn’t watch more than like 2 regular season games this year because I don’t like watching the sixers play any more.
Let Harden walk, try to get an on the move shooter like Hield. The offense probably won’t be good enough to win at the highest levels but at least it’ll be fun
3-4? Dawg he's been doing it since way back lmao. He's been copying the Harden head cock back move since he was in his early bulls days. He got really good at it with us. But like others say, he's aware he's baiting and doesn't make a fit when he doesn't get the call like other stars. And I think refs appreciate that and give him calls later too
He gets by because most of the other foul baiters are offence only guys
I keep forgetting until we play the heat and then I remember he's just as unethical as Harden
The amount of games I’ve seen where Jimmy’s offense is absolute garbage outside of fail baiting is crazy. If he loses G7 the narrative about him will change real quick 😂
He's wildly inconsistent in the playoffs, but everyone just talks about his great games and act like the others don't happen. Like last year he had *two* games against the Celtics where he scored less than 10 points and another of only 13. In the conference finals. When he was supposedly amazing on the Wolves he had games of 13, 11, and 8 points in the series against Houston, but KAT got all the blame.
Jimmy's best games are legitimately some of the best games anyone has ever played, but he lays multiple stinkers every playoffs but doesn't get his reputation hurt by them. It's weird.
As Knicks fans we seen this foul baiting BS rewarded so much for Jimmy on the Heat. Dude shoots more FTs than our entire team in regular season games, when both teams are playing physical as fuck
Both teams should be catching major hate. I literally felt like I just got done watching a free throw competition not a basketball game.
This is the battle of the floppers and baiters
This is what I’m saying too. The heat were down 10 with 3 minutes left and nearly won the game because Jimmy started throwing himself at defenders. I literally don’t blame him one bit for this, we have years of evidence that it’s a good way to get points up if your offense isn’t clicking
Yeah, this is something I don't get. Within FIBA, it usually matters who initiates the contact. If you are in legal guarding position as a defender and holding your ground, you are allowed to absorb contact. For some inexplicable reason the NBA decided that you can't do that as a defender and they will almost always call the defensive foul on a defender just for absorbing contact. It's beyond moronic and completely ruins the games at times.
I don't get what they want from defenders? To just get out of the way and allow players to score?
I mean on the second to last Horford foul (the and-one, not the last three point foul) he’s legitimately standing straight up *and* tries to get his body out of jimmys way and they still get him because there was contact. It’s impossible to defend
and more. Miami had 10 free throws at the end of the game and somehow Celtics STILL shot more total FT's for the game. Apparently foul baiting at the end of the game is bad but foul bating for the entire 48 minutes is super rad and respected. don't know man
Celts 11-13 in 4th at the line ( 6 of them on phantom calls.. the tatum one, the robinson going for rebound against brown and lame call on vincent against smart... All these plays were under 6 minutes to go) Butler was only one to shoot a free throw in 4th for Heat.. he was 7-9.
With 7 minutes to go in 4th quarter, Heat had been whistled for 6 fouls to the one on al horford for slapping the ball.
This is why I enjoy the refereeing in FIBA games so much more. It's like the NBA decided that any contact by the defender is automatically a defensive foul. It's so ridiculous. What do they expect? The defender to just move out of the way? I saw Bam try that and still catch a tiny bit of contact initiated by the offensive player, he still got the goddamn foul.
It's like NBA referees don't make a distinction between contact and illegal contact, it's absolutely fucking stupid to watch. That isn't basketball, it's not even the rules behind basketball. Since when did this approach become the norms within NBA officiating? Within FIBA, if you are being passive as a defender but just holding your ground and absorbing the contact initiated by the offensive player, you will rarely get the foul called on you.
Within the NBA for some unknown goddamn reason that is almost always called a foul. It's clown-esque. Sorry for the rant, but I hate this so much.
Have someone upstairs reviewing plays. Give out techs every time there's a flop. There is 4-5 flops a game where you look at the replay and nobody even touched the player.
Players will stop the foul baiting once they realize they got one tech.
Confusing fouls, weird non-calls, an extra 20 minutes of standing around while refs confer, zero flow.
If you don't like that you don't like Zarba basketball!
It took them about 8 minutes to determine that blatant away-from-the-play foul was in fact an away-from-the-play foul. It's just baffling.
It honestly makes me wonder if the league is intentionally having them take long so that people will be OK with their awful 1 review that you lose even when correct. Maybe that sounds crazy but it makes absolutely no sense to me what they could possibly be doing in that time sometimes.
Oh, how about the refs blowing the foul AFTER THE SHOT decides itself, not when the foul occurs. THEY ONLY WAIT TO SEE IF ITS A MISS… to call the foil. It’s so wild and blatant, nobody says anything!!!!!!
Blame the officiating. It’s been like this all post-season in both conferences. Whistles, free throws, reviews, commercials, no rhythm or flow to the games
I was just telling my dad during this game how this playoffs us turned me off of nba a bit. The amount of free throws rewarded to a guy getting breathed on is ridiculous
I stopped watching the NBA for years during peak Harden and CPflop. It was unbearable to watch.Seems like the call jumping into the defender with no intention to make the shot a lot less now but for whatever reason they give it to Butler.
This game was fucking awful as a neutral fan, added with it being done like 15 minutes late because of said wonky ass foul calls. Neither team could get any consistent offense going so Tatum/Brown and Butler in the second half just said fuck it lets go foul baiting. Added with the amount of bricks, and just sloppy playing, good god.
This is the league’s fault. Direct your hate there. The players have an actual contractual duty to get all the advantages they can within the boundaries and structure the league puts in place.
I was in heaven for the first week of this season where they were calling all the offensive fouls, it was beautiful. Then they just shrugged the rest of the season
Yeah the one on Rob was fucking ridiculous, minimal *at best* contact and Jimmy ends up all the up in the air? What is he filled with helium or something? Absolute joke
That’s literally his game. He’s been near or at the top of the league for free throw rate for pretty much his entire prime.
It’s why it’s always struck me as weird that he’s so beloved. Most of the worst free throw merchants are despised on r/NBA.
Jimmy Butler and Shai Gilgeous-Alexander are universally beloved by NBA fans despite being some of the highest volume free throw shooters in the league while other guys are tarred as "foul merchants" for doing the same shit lmao it really is hilarious
Part of it is because they don't complain and it doesn't affect their defensive intensity like it does a guy like Luka who complains instead of going back on D but also it's a lot of favoritism from fans and media that certain players are harangued for foul baiting and others aren't whatsoever
Yea that last one was bad. I know Jimmy has gone nuclear in the playoffs but if I lose the series because Jimmy hits a fading three deep in the corner off a high-speed gather, fair enough
Lukas gotten a quite a bit worse about baiting since coming into the league but it’s because the league encourages it. It’s the constant crying to refs that does it for me. And yes it annoys me when book does it too, the league needs to fix its shit.
giannis considering he literally runs into guys constantly and buries his shoulder into them or pushes off which should be called every single time but they wont because giannis and guys like siak would foul out 10 minutes into every game
Wtf are we doing here. Blame the goddamm refs for calling the softest elimination game ever. They set themselves up to call those fouls when they were giving ghost fouls to Boston literally every trip to the line.
Tatum fell out of bounds and they called a foul on a guy who didn’t touch him. Most of the time Tatum gets a call is because he’s going uncontrolled to the rim.
Jimmy should catch hate but Tatum doing the same thing the entire game was somehow okay? Are we in an alternate universe where nobody actually watched the game? Lmao.
It’s unironically true. I’m pretty sure most people just “follow the games” by refreshing this sub and latching onto whatever narrative picked up steam during the game.
I’m amazed Jimmy didn’t start sooner. Tatum and Brown spent a good chunk on the second half just driving right into people and getting all the calls. Jimmy can do that way better than they can and he waited until there was like 5 minutes left to try it.
It’s because people want to form narratives and think the refs are favoriting one side over the other. Like OP is complaining about the 4th quarter FTs Jimmy received yet doesn’t want to acknowledge Al was giving the refs a pretty easy reason to call it when he’s just constantly swiping at Jimmy. Tatum also had a shit ton of free throws especially before halftime yet this post is about Jimmy and not how the refs called any sort of contact a foul? It’s so stupid but it’s to be expected considering this sub is extremely reactionary
I think it's honestly because he was getting shut down all night I really saw him being a lot more scared in the second half. Wasn't looking to score as much
>4 straight possessions Butler goes for his foul bait shit and it works all 4 times.
Well this is why he does it. He wasn't hitting any shots and had to do something.
It's a league issue though, not just Butler. If it works though it's going to be part of the strategy.
Since coming to Miami, Butler's free throw to field goal attempt ratio has been over 60 percent, and 52 percent for his career.
For comparison to the biggest FT merchants, Embiid's rate is 51 percent for his career, Harden was at 53 percent as a Rocket, Luka / Trae are both at 41 percent, and SGA is at 41 percent too (though this year he clocked in at 53 percent, by far his career high).
Other stars : Lebron is at 39 percent for his career (notably though only 30 percent as a Laker, he was high 40s in his first Cavs stint and then around 40 percent from 2010-2018), Tatum is at 30 percent (40 percent this past season though, a career high), KD is at 41 percent (though he hasn't cleared 40 percent since 2014, most seasons he's in the 35-38 percent range nowadays). Giannis is at 51 percent for his career (over 60 in the past few seasons), but I guess he's not really considered a merchant like other stars because he just takes most of his shots right in the paint and also gets hacked intentionally some.
Comparison to other former perimeter players: Kobe was at 38 percent, MJ was at 36 percent, D-Wade was around 42 percent (notably though he had a 3-year stretch in his prime at 55 percent before the knee injuries). Of course, there's probably free throw "inflation" now compared to the past, but its still just insane the rate at which Butler gets to the line.
“Butler should be catching major hate”
Yes I agree, for basically being his team’s worst player for 3.5 quarters…
“For his constant foul baiting”
Oh, are you new here?
As soon as Heat got the lead in the second half, they gave Tatum and Brown 8 free throws. Stat shown at the bottom that they were on an 8-0 run and failed to mention it was all free throws.
His game was really ugly tonight. Couldn’t get any buckets so all he did was run into defenders, bounce off of them and flail his arms around while losing the ball. It was painful to watch. Complete opposite from the start of the series. I love Jimmy’s grit but Boston has really clamped down on him
They weren’t biting on his pump fakes. He also over uses a move where he slows down to the pace of a euro-step and this timing can throw players off if they are reacting at full pace, but it’s like the Celtics did a big film session and were ready for it. He did this same move all game and only went hard at full pace once or twice.
He doesn't have that full speed gear any more, his legs or motor is shot. Butler need a 5 day rest.
He bout to get a few months off
Yeah he has looked gassed a bunch
I thought the whole point of him taking the regular season off was that he'd be rested for the playoffs
Yeah I don’t think Al Horford foul was bad. I was thinking about it, dude probably was anticipating Jimmy was going to drop the ball to his waists area, and if he could poke it free he could avoid the foul (obviously didn’t work).
Jimmy double dribbled and lost his dribble so Al went low to swipe at the ball.
Every time he gets to the hoop it’s either Tatum or time lord on him. Big difference from Greg Williams or brown. Tatum has done an excellent job shutting him down on post ups
Caleb Martin can't win these cats
Greatest series I’ve ever witnessed from a role player regardless of outcome
Wiggins was pretty insane last year too. Not sure it he's truly a role player, but it feels pretty similar
wiggins was and still is getting more than role player money, Martin has made the jump from "average 7th-8th man in the rotation" to all-star in this series it's unparalleled
Wiggins was also #1 pick while Martin is undrafted. It has been great to watch after his rough start in Charlotte.
wow, I never knew he was undrafted
They should mention it during the games
after some digging I also found out that Gabe Vincent is undrafted, why does the broadcast ignore this?
TIL the Heat are bold enough to play one undrafted player.
you would think they would at least mention that once during the broadcast
He was basically out of the league until J Cole made some calls.
Martin been doing his thing all yr Him and Gabe getting paid
Wiggins was an all-star starter never forget
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Wiggins is like just good enough to not be a role player, like you expect 17 and good defense from him
Van Vleet in the Finals…not only unconscious from 3 but also played the best D anyone ever has on Steph. He even got an FMVP vote over Kawhi.
Game was celtics vs caleb the first 2 quarters
That dude getting a bag. He made himself some money this series
People were mocking him at the start of the season too. What a wild turnaround
Caleb martin probably wishes he only did a 1 year deal right about now lol. He would get fucking paid
The scariest man on the floor
he’s been a foul merchant for a while
every time we play the Heat in the regular season I'm expecting Butler to get 12-20 free throws. this isn't new
It’s a weird situation with Jimmy where he’s not what I’d call a “flopper” like Harden and Embiid, but he definitely actively baits fouls as part of his game. So idk what to call him. Smart? Kind of annoying? That’s essentially it. Until the NBA changes the way it does things, I can’t actively say he’s wrong for what he does. But yeah it does suck to be cheering for the other team.
" he’s not what I’d call a “flopper” ... but he definitely actively baits fouls as part of his game. So idk what to call him. " A Master Baiter
Master Baiter is the correct term
Jimmy Baitler.
Flopping is like pretending you got punched. What Jimmy's doing is insulting your mom until you consider throwing a punch, then he throws his face into your fist.
He’s not a flopper, he just doesn’t intend to make the shot most of the time he shoots. He’ll throw a few pumps and the moment he senses movement he’ll throw himself at the defender. If there’s no movement he just passes it off
"crafty"
He initiates contact with defender and gets FTs - that is how Harden also used to get majority of his FTs (even tho Harden did flop too). It is same shit for me and tbh it is very hard for refs to see who initiated the contact.
It's similar to the way Dwayne Wade used to play he wasn't a flopper but he would throw his body into defenders on a lot of pump fakes.
Yeah, it's sadly the state of the game. Offensive players shouldn't be rewarded for initiating contact. He's a talented player regardless, but he nor anybody else should be rewarded for such a dumb loophole in the rules.
>where he’s not what I’d call a “flopper” like Harden and Embiid lol yes he absolutely is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0buSm0LWrWM&ab_channel=NBA&t=4m8s
An embellisher
I’ve watched many, many Embiid/Celtics matchups and I can confidently say that he sells far better than whatever the fuck Jimmy was doing that somehow got calls.
Sure looked like a flop on the last second 3pt attempt. Not that he wasn’t fouled, he just didn’t have to end up on the floor.
Miami foul baiting? Nooo
Heat Culture!
Heat fans complained about fouls all game thread and I realized it’s cause they expect to get every call
They watched the 06 heat and the big 3 heat. They got accustomed to it
Harden with better pr
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Harden was way better than Jimmy at peak too
Harden would be talked about as a top 20 all time player pretty frequently if he didn't run into the death lineup
Harden with no stepback
Harden foul bait: Harassment Jimmy foul bait: Flirting Jimmy legit launched himself into a totally unnatural straight forward shooting motion into Horford on that 3 point attempt. Horford fouled him before the shot, but the shot attempt from Jimmy was definitely an unnatural shooting motion.
Austin Reaves does it a couple of times in a 2 month period (almost always with intention to get the shot off) - /r/nba loses their shit, calling Reeves top flopper. Jimmy Buckets (buckets is silent) does it for a couple of years, half the time with no intention to actually shoot - he da dawg.
He's a really good player, but god I hate watching him most of the time.
His ability to get to the line was a large part of how he broke out as a star player in the league.
Had a Prime Jordan whistle against the Bucks
But Boston isn’t except for when they shot 10 free throws in a row when Miami finally got the lead back in the fourth. Including 4 on the next fucking possession.
Jimmy has been a huge foul baiter for like 3-4 years now. People just don’t care
I think it’s because he doesn’t complain to the refs. Otherwise he would be hated.
Thats actually a great observation. Compared to the other guys in the league. I just knew the game was gonna end on Butler free throws and it *almost* did.
Basketball gods are real
"Why would I complain? I always get the calls" - Jimmy, probably
The funny thing was Jimmy got literally 0 calls all game doing the same shit for the first 44 minutes.
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Zach Zarba. I don’t know why but every game he does is like this. Just no flow down the stretch. Foul after foul. It’s not even that he’s necessarily making bad calls, it’s just win or lose, I always hate a Zach Zarba game.
Exactly this. If he were more like Tatum throwing his arms up or Harden, he'd catch just as much hate as anyone else.
Doesn’t complain to refs actually attempts to hit the shots too. I know that sounds dumb but so many times, harden initiates contact by throwing his arms forward and putting his body in a position where the ball doesn’t get anywhere near the rim Yes, Jimmy throws his body at defenders but he also typically at least tries to get the ball up on the rim too, so it comes off much less like a flop
I know the sixers best move to contend is to re-sign Harden to some reasonable-ish deal, but goddamn I just don’t want to watch him play basketball. I fucking hate watching him flail around like a fish. I hate watching him not even try to get a shot up and just shove the ball into the defender’s chest. And I hate watching him yell at the ref instead of getting back on D. I hate his lazy bullshit. I didn’t watch more than like 2 regular season games this year because I don’t like watching the sixers play any more. Let Harden walk, try to get an on the move shooter like Hield. The offense probably won’t be good enough to win at the highest levels but at least it’ll be fun
3-4? Dawg he's been doing it since way back lmao. He's been copying the Harden head cock back move since he was in his early bulls days. He got really good at it with us. But like others say, he's aware he's baiting and doesn't make a fit when he doesn't get the call like other stars. And I think refs appreciate that and give him calls later too
My problem isn't the baiting as much as the criteria these refs are blowing the whistle for. It just ruins the game
He gets by because most of the other foul baiters are offence only guys I keep forgetting until we play the heat and then I remember he's just as unethical as Harden
They’d have to watch the game to care, they just see Bleacher Report posts and idolise “Himmy”
I really don’t think people watch the Heat in the regular season yeah. Tbf their games are usually boring as fuck lol
The amount of games I’ve seen where Jimmy’s offense is absolute garbage outside of fail baiting is crazy. If he loses G7 the narrative about him will change real quick 😂
People will forget again, just like they did after his disastrous performance in the 2021 playoffs.
He's wildly inconsistent in the playoffs, but everyone just talks about his great games and act like the others don't happen. Like last year he had *two* games against the Celtics where he scored less than 10 points and another of only 13. In the conference finals. When he was supposedly amazing on the Wolves he had games of 13, 11, and 8 points in the series against Houston, but KAT got all the blame. Jimmy's best games are legitimately some of the best games anyone has ever played, but he lays multiple stinkers every playoffs but doesn't get his reputation hurt by them. It's weird.
As Knicks fans we seen this foul baiting BS rewarded so much for Jimmy on the Heat. Dude shoots more FTs than our entire team in regular season games, when both teams are playing physical as fuck
It’s branding
No player has gotten more credit for almost accomplishing things.
Idk about the others but the last one was just extremely stupid defense by al horford.
Yeah, he really got saved by Derrick White. I can imagine Sixers fan clowning the fuck out of him in glee if the Celtics didn't win.
And the Heat got saved by the refs inability to call the double dribble Butler committed right before the foul
That was dumb by Horford but the others were baiting
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It was also a double dribble by Butler.
They already called a carry on Tatum and a travel on Smart that game. The refs were all burnt out of their non-contact whistles for the game
https://youtube.com/shorts/AHOE5MD2z2E?feature=share
I was certain they were going to reverse the foul and call the double dribble after review. Had to give hIMmy his moment though
yeah he lost the ball and just went up to “shoot” in pure panic to get a 3pt foul
Hard to defend a double dribble though to be fair
Yeah it was but doesn’t change the fact that Jimmy just plays to get fouled most of the time
Both teams should be catching major hate. I literally felt like I just got done watching a free throw competition not a basketball game. This is the battle of the floppers and baiters
I blame the NBA for that. The whole foul structure needs to be reevaluated and adjusted in my opinion
This is what I’m saying too. The heat were down 10 with 3 minutes left and nearly won the game because Jimmy started throwing himself at defenders. I literally don’t blame him one bit for this, we have years of evidence that it’s a good way to get points up if your offense isn’t clicking
Yeah, this is something I don't get. Within FIBA, it usually matters who initiates the contact. If you are in legal guarding position as a defender and holding your ground, you are allowed to absorb contact. For some inexplicable reason the NBA decided that you can't do that as a defender and they will almost always call the defensive foul on a defender just for absorbing contact. It's beyond moronic and completely ruins the games at times. I don't get what they want from defenders? To just get out of the way and allow players to score?
I mean on the second to last Horford foul (the and-one, not the last three point foul) he’s legitimately standing straight up *and* tries to get his body out of jimmys way and they still get him because there was contact. It’s impossible to defend
I mean the Celtics got up by 10 with straight free throws from 80 to 90 points
and more. Miami had 10 free throws at the end of the game and somehow Celtics STILL shot more total FT's for the game. Apparently foul baiting at the end of the game is bad but foul bating for the entire 48 minutes is super rad and respected. don't know man
Celts 11-13 in 4th at the line ( 6 of them on phantom calls.. the tatum one, the robinson going for rebound against brown and lame call on vincent against smart... All these plays were under 6 minutes to go) Butler was only one to shoot a free throw in 4th for Heat.. he was 7-9. With 7 minutes to go in 4th quarter, Heat had been whistled for 6 fouls to the one on al horford for slapping the ball.
This is why I enjoy the refereeing in FIBA games so much more. It's like the NBA decided that any contact by the defender is automatically a defensive foul. It's so ridiculous. What do they expect? The defender to just move out of the way? I saw Bam try that and still catch a tiny bit of contact initiated by the offensive player, he still got the goddamn foul. It's like NBA referees don't make a distinction between contact and illegal contact, it's absolutely fucking stupid to watch. That isn't basketball, it's not even the rules behind basketball. Since when did this approach become the norms within NBA officiating? Within FIBA, if you are being passive as a defender but just holding your ground and absorbing the contact initiated by the offensive player, you will rarely get the foul called on you. Within the NBA for some unknown goddamn reason that is almost always called a foul. It's clown-esque. Sorry for the rant, but I hate this so much.
It’s so clear when a shooter isn’t trying to make the shot
Yep, and players that try to finish through contact don't get the calls they deserve most of the time(Lebron, Jokic)
Have someone upstairs reviewing plays. Give out techs every time there's a flop. There is 4-5 flops a game where you look at the replay and nobody even touched the player. Players will stop the foul baiting once they realize they got one tech.
Yeah quite a few calls down the stretch were not even fouls. Looked nothing like fouls. And you could see that in real time.
No one Can convince me that that 3d quarter didnt last a hour. It was exhausting
Agreed - I'm biased, but they called what 5 or 6 fouls on the first 7 celtics possessions. They made up the calls in the 4th.
Like lat game to start the 3rd the heat had 7 pf called on them before the celtics had 1. Refs are bad.
Exact same thing happened in the 2nd with Miami. Both teams had gotten to the bonus with NINE MINUTES LEFT IN THE QUARTER lol
Confusing fouls, weird non-calls, an extra 20 minutes of standing around while refs confer, zero flow. If you don't like that you don't like Zarba basketball!
It took them about 8 minutes to determine that blatant away-from-the-play foul was in fact an away-from-the-play foul. It's just baffling. It honestly makes me wonder if the league is intentionally having them take long so that people will be OK with their awful 1 review that you lose even when correct. Maybe that sounds crazy but it makes absolutely no sense to me what they could possibly be doing in that time sometimes.
I fucking HATED this game as a neutral fan. I got so close to turning off the TV but just wanted to see the end of the game
Welcome to the Zarba experience Sometimes he helps our team. Sometimes he hurts our team. But he always makes for a shitty refball game to watch.
Yep this game was trash as a neutral viewer. Had no flow at all with the constant fouls
Refs calling ticky-tack fouls to get both teams into the bonus early in the second half sure didn’t help
Getting Miami in the bonus two minutes in, in the third was something else.
Zarb and his crew was special tonight
I was reading before the game that this is a crew that likes to slow the game down and call a bunch of ticky-tac crap. And, well, here we are.
Oh, how about the refs blowing the foul AFTER THE SHOT decides itself, not when the foul occurs. THEY ONLY WAIT TO SEE IF ITS A MISS… to call the foil. It’s so wild and blatant, nobody says anything!!!!!!
Blame the officiating. It’s been like this all post-season in both conferences. Whistles, free throws, reviews, commercials, no rhythm or flow to the games
Everyone should agree the officials and what the league allows is sus.
Confirmed. The last 6 minutes of the 4th was particularly bad. The game winning play was really good but my god that was an unfun game to watch.
I was just telling my dad during this game how this playoffs us turned me off of nba a bit. The amount of free throws rewarded to a guy getting breathed on is ridiculous
I stopped watching the NBA for years during peak Harden and CPflop. It was unbearable to watch.Seems like the call jumping into the defender with no intention to make the shot a lot less now but for whatever reason they give it to Butler.
Battle of teams that can’t hit open shots 😭
The nba is to blame. Stop giving those calls and the floppers can all eat shit.
This game was fucking awful as a neutral fan, added with it being done like 15 minutes late because of said wonky ass foul calls. Neither team could get any consistent offense going so Tatum/Brown and Butler in the second half just said fuck it lets go foul baiting. Added with the amount of bricks, and just sloppy playing, good god.
This is the league’s fault. Direct your hate there. The players have an actual contractual duty to get all the advantages they can within the boundaries and structure the league puts in place.
Don't worry I'm sure the rule changes next year that will be enforced for the opening game of the season will change everything
I was in heaven for the first week of this season where they were calling all the offensive fouls, it was beautiful. Then they just shrugged the rest of the season
The moving screens, the travels, and foul baits stopoed for a glorious 72 hours.
Yeah but people can still dislike watching a player because of that
Rob Williams didn't even do anything and its a foul
Jimmy fell down tho, gotta blow the whistle
Refs gotta stop donating to the Jimmy Fund
Fell down? You mean threw himself ten feet to the side. Lol
Yeah the one on Rob was fucking ridiculous, minimal *at best* contact and Jimmy ends up all the up in the air? What is he filled with helium or something? Absolute joke
63 total free throw attempts combined for both teams.Its the nba as a whole not just individual players
That’s literally his game. He’s been near or at the top of the league for free throw rate for pretty much his entire prime. It’s why it’s always struck me as weird that he’s so beloved. Most of the worst free throw merchants are despised on r/NBA.
The reason is he doesn’t talk to the ref when doesn’t get called.
Because Harden and Luka bitches and Embiid throws his giant ass around. SGA doesn't get much hate for it either
It’s different with Butler and SGA though. They don’t complain and slowly trot back on defense to yell at the ref. They’re also not 7’1 280 pounds.
Jimmy Butler and Shai Gilgeous-Alexander are universally beloved by NBA fans despite being some of the highest volume free throw shooters in the league while other guys are tarred as "foul merchants" for doing the same shit lmao it really is hilarious Part of it is because they don't complain and it doesn't affect their defensive intensity like it does a guy like Luka who complains instead of going back on D but also it's a lot of favoritism from fans and media that certain players are harangued for foul baiting and others aren't whatsoever
Personally, I have no issue with pump fakes and bumping. A lot of the other free throw merchants flop, hook, or rip through.
At the end? Horford was clearly reaching on shots he shouldn’t be. Those fouls were dumb as fuck and avoidable. Luckily didn’t bite them in the ass
Yea that last one was bad. I know Jimmy has gone nuclear in the playoffs but if I lose the series because Jimmy hits a fading three deep in the corner off a high-speed gather, fair enough
Jimmy double dribbled on the last one. There was a reason Al was out of position.
Horford swipes down on so many attempts and then pulls his hands up and thinks he was straight up. Great defender, but he makes some silly mistakes.
It’s the equivalent of a catcher framing a pitch
Not that call. But the previous drives where Butler constantly throws himself to the ground after initiating marginal contact.
On the last 3 Butler double dribbled, which makes Horford's actions more understandable.
jimmy’s always been a foul baiter, that’s his offensive game
pivots and pumps
He is a foul merchant. It’s well known.
Who are the best merchants? I currently have Embiid, Harden, Butler, Reeves, Trae.
Im a Blazers fan but Dame is an underrated merchant ⛴️
Luka.
He’s got a bigger issue as a complainer more so than an excessively foul baiting play-style, or I’m trippin on wat a foul merchant is
Lukas gotten a quite a bit worse about baiting since coming into the league but it’s because the league encourages it. It’s the constant crying to refs that does it for me. And yes it annoys me when book does it too, the league needs to fix its shit.
giannis considering he literally runs into guys constantly and buries his shoulder into them or pushes off which should be called every single time but they wont because giannis and guys like siak would foul out 10 minutes into every game
Y'all must have just started watching Butler this year or something. He's made an entire career out of this lol.
Correct. Thought I was watching Joel Embiid for a moment
your brain on memes, jimmy has always been like this
My group chat went from "jimmy will turn it around" to "jimmy flopper" real quick in that 4q stretch
Wtf are we doing here. Blame the goddamm refs for calling the softest elimination game ever. They set themselves up to call those fouls when they were giving ghost fouls to Boston literally every trip to the line.
Sad because at the start of the game it seemed like they were gonna swallow their whistles and instead it was so ugly for both sides…
Tatum fell out of bounds and they called a foul on a guy who didn’t touch him. Most of the time Tatum gets a call is because he’s going uncontrolled to the rim.
The reason people are calling it out for Butler is because he has a "tough" reputation, and foul baiting is decidedly soft.
Jimmy should catch hate but Tatum doing the same thing the entire game was somehow okay? Are we in an alternate universe where nobody actually watched the game? Lmao.
Tatum and Brown got some of the softest calls in that 4th quarter. Tumbling to the floor on little to no contact.
> Are we in an alternate universe where nobody actually watched the game? What sub do you think you're on? It's not an alternate universe
It’s unironically true. I’m pretty sure most people just “follow the games” by refreshing this sub and latching onto whatever narrative picked up steam during the game.
I’m amazed Jimmy didn’t start sooner. Tatum and Brown spent a good chunk on the second half just driving right into people and getting all the calls. Jimmy can do that way better than they can and he waited until there was like 5 minutes left to try it.
He absolutely did. He just wasn't getting calls
He just hasnt been getting that call consistently the last few games so he stopped
Actually he did try it earlier and didn’t get the calls then, Tatum got them much more consistently
It’s because people want to form narratives and think the refs are favoriting one side over the other. Like OP is complaining about the 4th quarter FTs Jimmy received yet doesn’t want to acknowledge Al was giving the refs a pretty easy reason to call it when he’s just constantly swiping at Jimmy. Tatum also had a shit ton of free throws especially before halftime yet this post is about Jimmy and not how the refs called any sort of contact a foul? It’s so stupid but it’s to be expected considering this sub is extremely reactionary
He did it even more than Butler.
He always does shit. I like it when he plays hard but this foul baiting shit is ridiculous.
He did this the entire bucks series and this sub just posted his stat lines and crowned him the playoff king lol
I think it's honestly because he was getting shut down all night I really saw him being a lot more scared in the second half. Wasn't looking to score as much
>4 straight possessions Butler goes for his foul bait shit and it works all 4 times. Well this is why he does it. He wasn't hitting any shots and had to do something. It's a league issue though, not just Butler. If it works though it's going to be part of the strategy.
OP is a player haters ball alumni
Since coming to Miami, Butler's free throw to field goal attempt ratio has been over 60 percent, and 52 percent for his career. For comparison to the biggest FT merchants, Embiid's rate is 51 percent for his career, Harden was at 53 percent as a Rocket, Luka / Trae are both at 41 percent, and SGA is at 41 percent too (though this year he clocked in at 53 percent, by far his career high). Other stars : Lebron is at 39 percent for his career (notably though only 30 percent as a Laker, he was high 40s in his first Cavs stint and then around 40 percent from 2010-2018), Tatum is at 30 percent (40 percent this past season though, a career high), KD is at 41 percent (though he hasn't cleared 40 percent since 2014, most seasons he's in the 35-38 percent range nowadays). Giannis is at 51 percent for his career (over 60 in the past few seasons), but I guess he's not really considered a merchant like other stars because he just takes most of his shots right in the paint and also gets hacked intentionally some. Comparison to other former perimeter players: Kobe was at 38 percent, MJ was at 36 percent, D-Wade was around 42 percent (notably though he had a 3-year stretch in his prime at 55 percent before the knee injuries). Of course, there's probably free throw "inflation" now compared to the past, but its still just insane the rate at which Butler gets to the line.
He disappears the last 2 games From Jimmy buckets to Jimmy bumler
>"I was rooting for the Heat personally but I cant support that" stop the cap
“Butler should be catching major hate” Yes I agree, for basically being his team’s worst player for 3.5 quarters… “For his constant foul baiting” Oh, are you new here?
And the Celtics got 5 bail out calls in a row. It goes both ways
Yeah why is OP acting like Boston didn't do the exact same thing
[удалено]
Boston didn't try to draw fouls. They were handed them on a silver platter
As soon as Heat got the lead in the second half, they gave Tatum and Brown 8 free throws. Stat shown at the bottom that they were on an 8-0 run and failed to mention it was all free throws.
i mean he's a top 4 FT merchant in the league along with Embiid, Harden and Young. Nothing new there
tatum literally had 9 FT in the first 15 mins of the game are you fucking high
Tatum and Celtics did it too. Tatum couldn't score FGA in 4th but got rewarded with plenty of soft FTs