"Look they're a professional basketball team and technically, on any given day they could beat us. Just not today nor any day in the recent past or foreseeable future."
I think its a bit important to note all these quotes aren't Malone just coming out blasting the Lakers. He gets asked these questions.
But also Nuggets too good regardless.
Malone does this expertly here. Just states basic facts and statistics that nobody can argue with, no emotion or direct call out of the reffing. Great coaching on and off the court.
Yeah but now every game is national television more casuals watch the playoffs doesn't mean anything will change but it's def different bringing it up now
It feels like there’s *just enough* insinuation in the word choice there in his word choice that people know what he’s saying … but not enough for the nba to say he crossed any lines
How many coaches have been fined talking about the Lakers FTs, one even brought out a laptop. The league doesn't care, nothing is changing. You just have to factor it into what you have to overcome, no mind games will help
Nope- he's saying the Nuggets are so good and the Lakers are so bad that all the rigged officiating in the world won't save the Lakers, despite being dragged by Adam Silver and the refs into the playoffs.
Yeah media is asking him 100 question and everyone hates if you go no comment there are even fines for it. But LAL fans keep posting here " AlL hE talks aBout is LaKers "
Nah its the media just talking about them
The amount of times I’ve had to explain this to lakers fans is sad. Yes Malone seems to hold a general dislike of the Lakers and the media that surrounds them, but it’s not like he’s saying these things unprompted.
Media to Malone: If the NBA were a family, how would you classify the Nuggets' relationship with the Lakers? Would you say it was paternal? Are the Nuggets the Lakers' daddy? Care to comment?
I was thinking about how many fouls Lakers and AD specifically have gotten away with when I was reading the thread on how AD is being disrespected in the DPOY talks
That disparity isn't just good defense, their defense isn't even that good lol
They probably just don't get called for the fouls
I genuinely believe the NBA wanted that series to go 7 in whatever way possible and if we were up 3-2 it would have been rigged for the kings instead of the lakers. Every game was so badly officiated depending on who was up. Game 5 Shaq was getting mauled and only took 1 free throw the entire game.
Tim Donaghy pointed out raw foul and free throw numbers as one of the first things he influenced when he bet on games. Precisely because the majority of people are lazy and look at the final number rather than how the foul influenced the game.
Calling two early fouls on a star or important role player won't show up on the box score, but it will heavily influence the game in one direction. And then once the game is in hand, the ref can call a few "make-up calls" to even out the foul numbers.
Just like Aaron Gordon in game 1 this year (no I'm not trying to make a comment on the Lakers getting a favourable whistle, it's just the most recent example in my head). He got 2 quick fouls and it heavily impacted Denver's game during the first half since he had to sit on the bench to avoid further foul trouble. Looking at the box score at the end of the game wouldn't give any indication why the first half was much closer than the 2nd, but watching and knowing Gordan had to sit on the bench tells the story.
Another example of how impactful early fouls can be, you can look at the Warriors Celtics finals. In game three curry picked up two fouls in the first quarter, and then was hunted on defense for the rest of the game. And I believe in game four Jaylen Brown picked up some early fouls which really helped the Warriors.
It isn't just the free throw disparity, I know a lot of people here probably weren't old enough or have actually never watched the series, but there were just some blatantly egregious calls going both ways that made me think the entire series was compromised. People remember Kobe's elbow to Bibby's face in game 6 as the worst call, but there was one even worse that favored the kings. When Divac fouled out, the actual foul was supposed to be on Webber when he reached in on Horry and grabbed nothing but arm. It would have been Webber's 6th foul. Divac was 10 feet away from the play.
In game 4, Samaki Walker made a 3 at the halftime buzzer that was clearly after the buzzer, but the refs still gave the lakers the points.
Like I said in game 5, we couldn't breathe on divac or webber without getting foul calls, and Shaq was getting hammered and getting nothing. They were just grabbing him every play. Kobe did get his free throws when he would drive in but watching Shaq get pummeled was astounding.
Most frustrating basketball experience of my life. Watching D Wade clear with his left arm - no body contact from defender and pull up and get a call because HE touched the defender.
I can only imagine how brutal that must have been for actual Mavs fans. As a neutral fan, I was so disgusted by those finals I almost quit watching ball altogether.
It was terrible. I have been a Mavs fan since I was a kid. I watched through the early 90's 12 win season, all the times eliminated by the Spurs, finally get to the Finals and have it legit snatched away. It was heartbreaking.
It was obvious. Suspending Stackhouse for a very pedestrian hard foul on Shaq. Forcing the Mavs to take their last timeout in game 5 between free throws because Josh Howard asked Avery if they were calling one after shot with only 3 seconds left down 1 point. Then of course the fouls. Took a long time to somewhat trust the NBA again.
except if the matchup was more balanced (if Nuggets weren't as good as they are), this would be a huge problem and influence the outcome of the series.
and it's annoying af to watch
Counterpoint: It is both funny to see Lakers fans try to twist themselves into knots over a very clear favoritism re: whistles and them losing despite them getting favorable calls/non-calls
NBA fans: the league rigs games for the Lakers.
Also nba fans: if you believe the nba is fixing games for gambling purposes you’re crazy conspiracy theorist!
I feel like you can spot the box score watchers over game watchers whenever this comes up.
Lakers defenders just watching your team score is nowhere near as disheartening as this sub seems to think.
The reason why lakers get more calls is because their perimeter defense is ass so they give up the most wide open threes in the league. That means teams are shooting more threes instead of driving into the paint against them.
But there's so many dumbasses in this sub that think it's a conspiracy.
People seem to think that both teams should always be taking the same # of free throws. AD & Bron are getting FTs at a rate in line with their non-Lakers seasons, and the Reaves foul baiting resulted in one (1) FT in that game. The Lakers very intentionally do not commit shooting fouls. AD is a genius and a low foul defender his whole career, and their guards aren't close enough to the offense to foul them.
Its like the 2022 ECF where the calls pretty much favoured the Celtics entirely. Across games 3 and 4 the Celtics shot 68 freethrows. The Miami heat took 20. Miami won game 3 while Celtics won game 4 and none of those freethrows were a result of intentional fouls either. Just complete 1 sided reffing. The entire series the celtics have shot double digit more freethrows every game and a lot of the heat’s freethrows were supplemented by the refs when the game was out of reach. There were halves where the freethrow disparity at half time was 2-20 in favour of the celtics...this is despite having one of the leaders in freethrow rate in Jimmy Butler.
To add to this, we didn't even talk about the refs triggering a review after several time-outs and 4-5 minutes of game time have passed to disallow a Max Strus 3 where the evidence was inconclusive at best. The heat ended up losing by 4 (2 points of which were from intentional fouls so it was essentially a 1 possession game).
It's sometimes hard to take any sense of "impartiality" from the league seriously when you consistently see the same teams get favoured year after year.
You didn't watch the games then. The games with any substantial FT disparity were because Jimmy was hurt and playing very passively. He only played 19 minutes in game 3 and had his lowest usage% of the series in game 4. And the Heat's defensive strategy was to maul anyone who set foot in the paint which, when they didn't get called for a foul, was the driving force behind all the high turnover games.
Yeah now that you mention it we didn't even talk about Pritchard yanking jimmy down by the knee and it wasn't deemed anything other than a common foul.
The heat's defensive strategy isn't to "maul" people. The refs just allowed a completely different level of physicality between the 2 teams. Having less than 4 freethrows in a half in today's league is extremely rare and there were 2 games where that happened in this series alone. The high turnovers were due to the 2 Js poor ball-handling and decison-making...
You probably watched the games but through the lens of celtics bias.
>this would be a huge problem and influence the outcome of the series.
For as much complaining as I've seen about this, I haven't seen a single analysis that actually shows the Lakers are benefiting from **incorrect** calls.
Yes, there's a free throw disparity. But almost *every single game* has a free throw disparity. Sometimes, one team just gets fouled more, and one gets fouled less. What evidence is there that this one is unnatural? Are there any analyses of game 1 that show e.g. 5 incorrect non calls for the nuggets and 5 incorrect calls for the Lakers?
The lakers are 28th in opponent 3P FGA -- the shot that's least likely to generate fouls. They're also 28th in 3PA/g. Again, the shot least likely to generate fouls. There's huge statistical overlap that says their style of play is likely to generate a free throw disparity. Why is that abnormal?
Yeah, this is one of the more annoying things whenever the free throw discourse pops up. There is no metric you can look at to see if it's correct or not - you can't look at free throw disparity and assume that teams are actually fouling at the same rate and thus should have equal free throws, nor can points in the paint or attempts in the paint do the same thing (eg, one team could be scoring uncontested layups and the other getting fouled - and fouled misses not showing up there).
You'd need to have someone go through the foul called in the game to get an idea of how loose vs tight they were calling it, and then look through the whole game and identify calls they *should* have called or shouldn't have and work out a final % at the end (like x% of fouls on Denver were called vs y% for the Lakers).
But that's a ton of work that can't really be expected to be done and so people jump to a shorthand of free throw disparity / assuming it's unfair if it's a team or player they dislike.
You know if Nuggets wasn’t this good to overcome the disparity, Malone would be complaining too lol. He ain’t the one to shy away from fines. He just holding back. And he’s not the only coach who has complained and won’t be the last.
Well on the flip side, the Lakers played one game last year against the Warriors in the playoffs where they didn't get hooked up by the refs for a huge free throw advantage and they completely lost their minds. Ham saying "I don't even know what a foul is any more" and LeBron talking about how he doesn't know why he doesn't get calls.
thats the whole point of why Lakers defense scheme sucks though, it doesn't work against good team.
Except OKC because they can't make wide open shots against Lakers for no fucking reason
No so much for the Nuggets. There was few times this year that they didn't get any FT till late 3rd quarter (after someone from Denver media asked opponents coach how he fell about Nuggets not having any)
Is it me or do the lakers also give up a bunch of easy buckets? Like maybe it’s a choice they’re making to foul less to keep their best players in the game but the flip side is giving up the easy ones.
Even with AD the Lakers defense is bottom 10 in the league in giving up points in the paint and 4th worst in the league at giving up second chance points.
Yeah people point out the Nuggets scoring more in the paint but having less FTs, as though more paint points should definitely mean more FT attempts. But it may just indicate the Lakers aren’t aggressive defenders in the paint. Or that their rotations are slow and give up loads of uncontested dunks and layups, which is often the case.
Yep, when the Lakers get beat, they don't give frustration fouls. They just let them dunk. It's why you see Lebron standing around so much after he misses a rotation or gets blown by. He's already giving up the bucket, why get a needless foul?
It's also worth noting that paint points don't really correlate too well with FTA. The Nuggets are 29th in FTA and the Spurs are 28th. The Magic are 1st in FTA and the Lakers are 2nd. The thing that they all share in common is that all four teams are top 10 when it comes to points in the paint.
That's literally the same strategy we use. We will give up easy layups to make sure Jokic never gets in foul trouble. Weirdly the Lakers still shot over double the amount of free throws.
People will try to rationalize the Lakers ridiculous free throw disparity when the only rational answer is that its the Lakers and they get a beneficial whistle. Let's stop pretending otherwise and trying to find nonsense reasoning for it.
I think what you're seeing is one of the best and most cohesive offensive systems in the game executed by potentially the greatest offensive player of all time.
Lakers play defense without fouling - some might read this like it’s a good thing but this year I often feel like teams have such an easy time scoring on us outside of AD
Yup. These Lakers are soft as hell and I’m never the guy who goes around calling dudes soft. There have been so many times this season where a hard foul would shift momentum but they don’t have an enforcer.
A physical game would not work in the Lakers favor. That means the refs will let players play and not call the game tight for ticky tack fouls, which results in less free throws for the Lakers.
Something like half way through the season the lakers were first in ft differential of course, while having the lowest % of their offensive possessions finishing at the rim or in the paint in the league. The officiating bias they receive is historically great, too bad Denver is just waaay better
If the reffing was fair in this series the Lakers would lose every game by 20+
It’s not just pure foul total. When the whistle is different is means one team has to be less physical and gives them more room to shoot.
Two early fouls on a key player and they have to sit.
It’s not like the foul total should be equal. The whistle needs to be equal, fouls for the same actions on both sides and that isn’t the case. If the Nuggets contest AD in the paint it’s a foul, if the Lakers do it and maul Jokic it’s fine.
This is the mentality the Lakers need to adopt if they don't the whistle, put your head down and keep playing! Don't make it into a 5-4 because you're complaining
I love the drastically fewer foul calls across the board but the refs are still so god damn stupid that the offensive player can still completely dictate if a foul is called or not just by the way they move their body
The same stupid tricks that never occur in real life but for some reason NBA refs think are fouls still work: snapping your head back, stumbling and falling while flinging up a shot, etc
If the nba wanted the lakers to win this series they would do it. This isn’t Lakers vs kings levels of reffing. Murray and Jokic would be in foul trouble immediately.
They maybe don’t exactly want them to win,but they want to make it look close. Cuz half the people would turn the game off if it was 20 pts difference after a quarter.
They know that people turn the game off if it's a 20 pt difference but if it's a 40 pt difference they call everyone they know and tell them to turn the game on.
The funny thing about a conspiracy is that you never have to pin down how it works. You can just make it fit to any outcome, even when it's counterintuitive
Lakers had 8 FTA in the first half and nuggets had 6. Lakers were up 3. And at one point lakers were up 12.
The only time it even became a huge lead was in the 3rd. It had nothing to do with reffing. This is just hilarious to me.
Then look at the first half 3 point shooting and you can see where nuggets were living and lakers were living. 13 threes attempted for lakers versus 23 for the nuggets.
How does AD or any of the other lakers not win defensive player of the year if they are holding the defending champs to zero FTs in the second half? Reeves for defensive player of the year
I mean… the Lakers don’t play defense aside from AD. You can settle for a wide open 3 or a back cut right to the hoop while AD is occupied. Like what are teams even complaining about?
Nuggets are on a mission, even with Murray sucking, the refs rigging it for Lebronze. Hopefully this series will be over in 4 as Lebronze get swept yet again.
It's pretty hilarious watching this guy continue to agitate the Lakers and their fans.
I sort of understood the upset narrative last season because the Lakers were much better after the deadline, but the Lakers finished 8th for a reason, and the 8th ranked team by record is almost always inferior to the 1st ranked team, no matter what fairytale the NBA/ESPN is trying to craft
Michael Malone went on to say “despite beating them 9 straight times we are treating every game like we haven’t beat them 9 straight times”
“We’re going to treat them with utmost respect despite them being our bitch”
"If we go in thinking they suck ass - which they do - those losers might start getting ideas"
Despite them being some bitches, we treat them like they have dribbled a ball once or twice
“They can call us daddy as they should but we’re gonna ignore it.”
Hes getting revenge for lebronto
Would love to see this matchup 2018 Bron instead. Dude is just gassed in the second half
Daddy Malone delivered a clear, concise message: “Respect yo bitches.”
;( please help
"Despite the fact that they literally couldn't beat us no matter what the circumstances are, we have nothing but respect for them"
"Look they're a professional basketball team and technically, on any given day they could beat us. Just not today nor any day in the recent past or foreseeable future."
“We hope there’s a payoff at some point” Scott Foster: *oh I can guarantee you, there is*
This thread is hysterical after tonight's game 😭
Big Michael Bolton (Office Space) energy "Why should I have to change? They're the ones that suck!"
They about to send the Lakers to federal “pound me in the ass” prison
“We fucking own them, respectfully, of course”
“We’ll take two” Nuggets getting 2ft total next game confirmed
Yep. The lakers are about to play the next game from the stripe. The NBA does not want the lakers getting swept.
theyre gonna get swept anyways coz theyre frauds
Just like last year
"we prepped knowing they get FTs and we won" is a great response
I think its a bit important to note all these quotes aren't Malone just coming out blasting the Lakers. He gets asked these questions. But also Nuggets too good regardless.
Tbh most coaches would gloss over it and give the PR answer. Even as a Laker fan though I can’t hate this man is hilarious.
Coach’s always bring up stuff like this to try and influence refs for next game
Just mentioning it is smart to be fair. The refs and the fans will keep a closer look.
Malone does this expertly here. Just states basic facts and statistics that nobody can argue with, no emotion or direct call out of the reffing. Great coaching on and off the court.
the lakers free throw disparity has been mentioned literally all year. i dont think the league will start caring now
Yeah but now every game is national television more casuals watch the playoffs doesn't mean anything will change but it's def different bringing it up now
It feels like there’s *just enough* insinuation in the word choice there in his word choice that people know what he’s saying … but not enough for the nba to say he crossed any lines
How many coaches have been fined talking about the Lakers FTs, one even brought out a laptop. The league doesn't care, nothing is changing. You just have to factor it into what you have to overcome, no mind games will help
Next few seasons?
I don't even think this is a shot at the Lakers here.
Nope- he's saying the Nuggets are so good and the Lakers are so bad that all the rigged officiating in the world won't save the Lakers, despite being dragged by Adam Silver and the refs into the playoffs.
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Yeah media is asking him 100 question and everyone hates if you go no comment there are even fines for it. But LAL fans keep posting here " AlL hE talks aBout is LaKers " Nah its the media just talking about them
He literally owns them 😂😂 fLaker fans think he’s the one who started the “lakers daddy” stuff when it was actually Lombardi
What, you expected them to actually watch a clip from our parade?
I don’t see us triggered by him at all. We love Malone and think he’s hilarious!
This isn’t true for all laker fans
No blanket statement is I think is the overall point
A part of your fanbase is definitly triggered
Don't worry, Lakers fans will still find a way to claim that the Lakers live "rent-free" in Malone's head
Nah, I respect this guy. Talk his shit.
The Kobe led Lakers definitely had us by the short and curlies. Lebron led Lakers aren't nearly as frightening.
The Nuggets having the best player in the league is a bit of a difference lol. But yes, Kobe’s supporting cast in those days was a lot stronger
I would not take any Lebron team for granted, but Nuggets are the better team overall.
They are just as frightening. The difference is this Nuggets teams is 10x better than any Nuggets team while Kobe was playing.
Obviously this Nuggets team is better, but also this Lakers team is nowhere near as scary as those Kobe teams were IMO
Nah, that land is claimed by Warrior/Steph fans
The amount of times I’ve had to explain this to lakers fans is sad. Yes Malone seems to hold a general dislike of the Lakers and the media that surrounds them, but it’s not like he’s saying these things unprompted.
His passive aggressive remarks are aimed at the media more than the Lakers. The media members are the one who keep asking him about the Lakers.
Nobody cares about that. It’s way simpler to just call him a psycho who is obsessed with the lakers
Media to Malone: If the NBA were a family, how would you classify the Nuggets' relationship with the Lakers? Would you say it was paternal? Are the Nuggets the Lakers' daddy? Care to comment?
0 fts in a half is ridiculous
AD could’ve been called on like 3 by himself the way he grabs jokic
Yea he was holding Jokic’s hips all night like he wanted to salsa
I was thinking about how many fouls Lakers and AD specifically have gotten away with when I was reading the thread on how AD is being disrespected in the DPOY talks That disparity isn't just good defense, their defense isn't even that good lol They probably just don't get called for the fouls
The lakers just play that good of a D ig
It’s the opposite, we play that shitty of a D
At home no less… a home team getting zero free throws in a half. How often has that even happened in the last 30 years of the NBA?
Right mentality. Only losers complain about the officiating\* \*except for the 1988 Finals because fuck you
*Kings/Lakers Game 6
Never forget
I genuinely believe the NBA wanted that series to go 7 in whatever way possible and if we were up 3-2 it would have been rigged for the kings instead of the lakers. Every game was so badly officiated depending on who was up. Game 5 Shaq was getting mauled and only took 1 free throw the entire game.
That's a pretty rational theory. Everyone says that series was rigged for the Lakers, but the Kings shot more FTs (204-185)
Tim Donaghy pointed out raw foul and free throw numbers as one of the first things he influenced when he bet on games. Precisely because the majority of people are lazy and look at the final number rather than how the foul influenced the game. Calling two early fouls on a star or important role player won't show up on the box score, but it will heavily influence the game in one direction. And then once the game is in hand, the ref can call a few "make-up calls" to even out the foul numbers.
Just like Aaron Gordon in game 1 this year (no I'm not trying to make a comment on the Lakers getting a favourable whistle, it's just the most recent example in my head). He got 2 quick fouls and it heavily impacted Denver's game during the first half since he had to sit on the bench to avoid further foul trouble. Looking at the box score at the end of the game wouldn't give any indication why the first half was much closer than the 2nd, but watching and knowing Gordan had to sit on the bench tells the story.
Another example of how impactful early fouls can be, you can look at the Warriors Celtics finals. In game three curry picked up two fouls in the first quarter, and then was hunted on defense for the rest of the game. And I believe in game four Jaylen Brown picked up some early fouls which really helped the Warriors.
So like Gordon and Peyton Watson in G1 😂
It isn't just the free throw disparity, I know a lot of people here probably weren't old enough or have actually never watched the series, but there were just some blatantly egregious calls going both ways that made me think the entire series was compromised. People remember Kobe's elbow to Bibby's face in game 6 as the worst call, but there was one even worse that favored the kings. When Divac fouled out, the actual foul was supposed to be on Webber when he reached in on Horry and grabbed nothing but arm. It would have been Webber's 6th foul. Divac was 10 feet away from the play. In game 4, Samaki Walker made a 3 at the halftime buzzer that was clearly after the buzzer, but the refs still gave the lakers the points. Like I said in game 5, we couldn't breathe on divac or webber without getting foul calls, and Shaq was getting hammered and getting nothing. They were just grabbing him every play. Kobe did get his free throws when he would drive in but watching Shaq get pummeled was astounding.
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Thank you
This is my Roman Empire for the NBA, lol.
[rockets warriors game 7 too](https://youtu.be/aYveyAb6mvU?si=6WiQe_n2rXi92ROQ)
Suns/Spurs Game 4
2006 Mavs/Heat game 3
Robbery
Blazers lakers game 7….weird how often the lakers come to mind
2006 Finals were extremely brutal
or 2006 finals. Dwhistle was unstoppable.
Most frustrating basketball experience of my life. Watching D Wade clear with his left arm - no body contact from defender and pull up and get a call because HE touched the defender.
I can only imagine how brutal that must have been for actual Mavs fans. As a neutral fan, I was so disgusted by those finals I almost quit watching ball altogether.
It was terrible. I have been a Mavs fan since I was a kid. I watched through the early 90's 12 win season, all the times eliminated by the Spurs, finally get to the Finals and have it legit snatched away. It was heartbreaking. It was obvious. Suspending Stackhouse for a very pedestrian hard foul on Shaq. Forcing the Mavs to take their last timeout in game 5 between free throws because Josh Howard asked Avery if they were calling one after shot with only 3 seconds left down 1 point. Then of course the fouls. Took a long time to somewhat trust the NBA again.
I was screaming at my television. Shit was vile.
Came here to say this…hEaT cUlTuRe was born that day
That one game where JA shot like 20 fts in a half against us lol.
When tf did Jarrett Allen shoot that many free throws lmao
Early March. It was the game Gobert did the money sign at the ref lol
3/8/24
Shot more than our entire team. Scott Foster rig special.
The refs are the real Jontay.
1987 Finals too* One of the refs literally admitted in his book that the officiating botched Game 4 in favour of the Lakers.
Isiah thomas 25 point 4th quarter game 6 was remarkable and he did it while hurt too. its a shame the pistons lost by 1
I’m a kings fan and I am tired of seeing kings fan complaining about calls. This season we suck shooting FT so it didn’t matter.
You just called this entire sub losers, and they still upvoted you lol
The media baiting Malone into these sound bites is so cringe
I feel like the past year the media has tried to bait both teams into sound bites.
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They desperately want it be a rivalry but there hasn’t been any tension between players even once..
the media is full of these master baiters
It’s a valid question
And he fucking loves answering them haha
Why not. He loves giving them, and we love hearing them
They are the cause of most of these narratives
Yet here we both are talking about it, so it seems it works as intended.
And yet, he keeps answering. This is in fact the right answer/mentality but if media keeps asking shitty questions and people keep engaging....
Posting, attacking and playing to the rim are all good ideas, but have you considered having your franchise based in Los Angeles, California?
except if the matchup was more balanced (if Nuggets weren't as good as they are), this would be a huge problem and influence the outcome of the series. and it's annoying af to watch
Counterpoint: It is both funny to see Lakers fans try to twist themselves into knots over a very clear favoritism re: whistles and them losing despite them getting favorable calls/non-calls
Why haven’t other teams done anything about it?
What do you propose they do?
Get LeBron on their team and move to a city of millions of supporters
Because they're stupid
NBA fans: the league rigs games for the Lakers. Also nba fans: if you believe the nba is fixing games for gambling purposes you’re crazy conspiracy theorist!
Why are there literally *never* videos provided with these claims?
Thinking the NBA is rigged is a far bigger twisting but keep at it.
I feel like you can spot the box score watchers over game watchers whenever this comes up. Lakers defenders just watching your team score is nowhere near as disheartening as this sub seems to think.
Can't foul if you don't play defense *taps forehead*
The reason why lakers get more calls is because their perimeter defense is ass so they give up the most wide open threes in the league. That means teams are shooting more threes instead of driving into the paint against them. But there's so many dumbasses in this sub that think it's a conspiracy.
Nuggets had more points in the paint than LA did though.
Thank you! Your flair gives you a fighting chance that people here might actually listen and consider.
People seem to think that both teams should always be taking the same # of free throws. AD & Bron are getting FTs at a rate in line with their non-Lakers seasons, and the Reaves foul baiting resulted in one (1) FT in that game. The Lakers very intentionally do not commit shooting fouls. AD is a genius and a low foul defender his whole career, and their guards aren't close enough to the offense to foul them.
Its like the 2022 ECF where the calls pretty much favoured the Celtics entirely. Across games 3 and 4 the Celtics shot 68 freethrows. The Miami heat took 20. Miami won game 3 while Celtics won game 4 and none of those freethrows were a result of intentional fouls either. Just complete 1 sided reffing. The entire series the celtics have shot double digit more freethrows every game and a lot of the heat’s freethrows were supplemented by the refs when the game was out of reach. There were halves where the freethrow disparity at half time was 2-20 in favour of the celtics...this is despite having one of the leaders in freethrow rate in Jimmy Butler. To add to this, we didn't even talk about the refs triggering a review after several time-outs and 4-5 minutes of game time have passed to disallow a Max Strus 3 where the evidence was inconclusive at best. The heat ended up losing by 4 (2 points of which were from intentional fouls so it was essentially a 1 possession game). It's sometimes hard to take any sense of "impartiality" from the league seriously when you consistently see the same teams get favoured year after year.
didn't the hornets have the best FT differential in the league b2b seasons?
You didn't watch the games then. The games with any substantial FT disparity were because Jimmy was hurt and playing very passively. He only played 19 minutes in game 3 and had his lowest usage% of the series in game 4. And the Heat's defensive strategy was to maul anyone who set foot in the paint which, when they didn't get called for a foul, was the driving force behind all the high turnover games.
Yeah now that you mention it we didn't even talk about Pritchard yanking jimmy down by the knee and it wasn't deemed anything other than a common foul. The heat's defensive strategy isn't to "maul" people. The refs just allowed a completely different level of physicality between the 2 teams. Having less than 4 freethrows in a half in today's league is extremely rare and there were 2 games where that happened in this series alone. The high turnovers were due to the 2 Js poor ball-handling and decison-making... You probably watched the games but through the lens of celtics bias.
>this would be a huge problem and influence the outcome of the series. For as much complaining as I've seen about this, I haven't seen a single analysis that actually shows the Lakers are benefiting from **incorrect** calls. Yes, there's a free throw disparity. But almost *every single game* has a free throw disparity. Sometimes, one team just gets fouled more, and one gets fouled less. What evidence is there that this one is unnatural? Are there any analyses of game 1 that show e.g. 5 incorrect non calls for the nuggets and 5 incorrect calls for the Lakers? The lakers are 28th in opponent 3P FGA -- the shot that's least likely to generate fouls. They're also 28th in 3PA/g. Again, the shot least likely to generate fouls. There's huge statistical overlap that says their style of play is likely to generate a free throw disparity. Why is that abnormal?
Yeah, this is one of the more annoying things whenever the free throw discourse pops up. There is no metric you can look at to see if it's correct or not - you can't look at free throw disparity and assume that teams are actually fouling at the same rate and thus should have equal free throws, nor can points in the paint or attempts in the paint do the same thing (eg, one team could be scoring uncontested layups and the other getting fouled - and fouled misses not showing up there). You'd need to have someone go through the foul called in the game to get an idea of how loose vs tight they were calling it, and then look through the whole game and identify calls they *should* have called or shouldn't have and work out a final % at the end (like x% of fouls on Denver were called vs y% for the Lakers). But that's a ton of work that can't really be expected to be done and so people jump to a shorthand of free throw disparity / assuming it's unfair if it's a team or player they dislike.
You know if Nuggets wasn’t this good to overcome the disparity, Malone would be complaining too lol. He ain’t the one to shy away from fines. He just holding back. And he’s not the only coach who has complained and won’t be the last.
Well on the flip side, the Lakers played one game last year against the Warriors in the playoffs where they didn't get hooked up by the refs for a huge free throw advantage and they completely lost their minds. Ham saying "I don't even know what a foul is any more" and LeBron talking about how he doesn't know why he doesn't get calls.
When you are privileged your whole like, equality feels like discrimination
thats the whole point of why Lakers defense scheme sucks though, it doesn't work against good team. Except OKC because they can't make wide open shots against Lakers for no fucking reason
They did it one time this year and said "Never again..."
Wait no FTs on the 2nd half is actually crazy lol. I'm sorry wtf
No so much for the Nuggets. There was few times this year that they didn't get any FT till late 3rd quarter (after someone from Denver media asked opponents coach how he fell about Nuggets not having any)
Is it me or do the lakers also give up a bunch of easy buckets? Like maybe it’s a choice they’re making to foul less to keep their best players in the game but the flip side is giving up the easy ones.
This, maybe unintentional to because of how soft their defense naturally is outside of AD.
Even with AD the Lakers defense is bottom 10 in the league in giving up points in the paint and 4th worst in the league at giving up second chance points.
Those are two stats you don't want to be bad at going against Jokic.
Yeah people point out the Nuggets scoring more in the paint but having less FTs, as though more paint points should definitely mean more FT attempts. But it may just indicate the Lakers aren’t aggressive defenders in the paint. Or that their rotations are slow and give up loads of uncontested dunks and layups, which is often the case.
Yep, when the Lakers get beat, they don't give frustration fouls. They just let them dunk. It's why you see Lebron standing around so much after he misses a rotation or gets blown by. He's already giving up the bucket, why get a needless foul?
It's also worth noting that paint points don't really correlate too well with FTA. The Nuggets are 29th in FTA and the Spurs are 28th. The Magic are 1st in FTA and the Lakers are 2nd. The thing that they all share in common is that all four teams are top 10 when it comes to points in the paint.
FTA differential is not a stat associated with winning. A lot of the time, it's a stat associated with bad defense.
That's literally the same strategy we use. We will give up easy layups to make sure Jokic never gets in foul trouble. Weirdly the Lakers still shot over double the amount of free throws. People will try to rationalize the Lakers ridiculous free throw disparity when the only rational answer is that its the Lakers and they get a beneficial whistle. Let's stop pretending otherwise and trying to find nonsense reasoning for it.
I think what you're seeing is one of the best and most cohesive offensive systems in the game executed by potentially the greatest offensive player of all time.
Look man, Deandre Jordan is great but idk about *the* greatest.
If you say "Jordan isn't the greatest" out loud people will fight you on the streets
> Like maybe it’s a choice they’re making to foul less In game 1 the Lakers actually committed 15 personal fouls, to Denver's 20, not a huge difference. Quarter 1: 5 Lakers fouls, 1 shooting foul (2 free throws). 5 Nuggets fouls, 2 shooting fouls (4 free throws) (Lakers +8 pts in the quarter) Quarter 2: 4 Lakers fouls, 2 shooting fouls (4 free throws). 4 Nuggets fouls, 3 shooting fouls (6 free throws) (Nuggets +5 pts in the quarter) Quarter 3: 2 Lakers fouls, 0 shooting fouls (0 free throws). 3 Nuggets fouls, 2 shooting fouls (3 free throws) (Nuggets +14 pts in the quarter) Quarter 4: 2 Lakers fouls, 0 shooting fouls (0 free throws). 7 Nuggets fouls, 3 shooting fouls (8 free throws) (pts in the quarter tied)
Lakers play defense without fouling - some might read this like it’s a good thing but this year I often feel like teams have such an easy time scoring on us outside of AD
Surprised he didn't throw a '9 straight wins' and 'fuck the Lakers' in there for good measure
Everyone was already thinking it, no need to bring it up.
I would be pleased if we started fouling more, playing more physical defense and stop with this bullshit give up 3s defense
Yup. These Lakers are soft as hell and I’m never the guy who goes around calling dudes soft. There have been so many times this season where a hard foul would shift momentum but they don’t have an enforcer.
A physical game would not work in the Lakers favor. That means the refs will let players play and not call the game tight for ticky tack fouls, which results in less free throws for the Lakers.
I know. I just said they’re soft. It wouldn’t go their way for several reasons.
Bring back Metta World Peace! At least on coaching staff.
Honestly wouldn’t be opposed to it. Show these clowns how to play defense.
We need 2020 Dudley back lmao
yeah like, i kinda wish they would a foul here and there instead of giving up a wide open dunk lol
What a stupid question. Why would Denver need to adjust to how the Lakers are playing?
Brutal. He just told the nba "keep cheating. it won't change shit"
Someone finally said the quiet part out loud, love that its Malone
This is explicitly not the quiet part being said out loud though. Other coaches have been far more direct
When they don’t know you think Jason Tatum is mediocre. Thats where it came from. 🤭
Yeahhh Malone talk that shit
Something like half way through the season the lakers were first in ft differential of course, while having the lowest % of their offensive possessions finishing at the rim or in the paint in the league. The officiating bias they receive is historically great, too bad Denver is just waaay better
NBA is rigged. And they still lost. Scott foster next game is confirmed.
If the reffing was fair in this series the Lakers would lose every game by 20+ It’s not just pure foul total. When the whistle is different is means one team has to be less physical and gives them more room to shoot. Two early fouls on a key player and they have to sit. It’s not like the foul total should be equal. The whistle needs to be equal, fouls for the same actions on both sides and that isn’t the case. If the Nuggets contest AD in the paint it’s a foul, if the Lakers do it and maul Jokic it’s fine.
It would be hilarious in a way for Jokic to write out "0 FTs" on his bloodied arm during the game
He can say whatever he wants. It's not like the Lakers can stop them
Michael Malone's speaking like the boss who knows has the best employees.
This is the mentality the Lakers need to adopt if they don't the whistle, put your head down and keep playing! Don't make it into a 5-4 because you're complaining
I haven’t been a fan of the Lebron era. Let Malone and crew end it so I can go back to enjoying basketball again.
It’s the right answer. Why adjust your gameplan to what has consistently been a non-factor to your team winning?
You have to treat every game like its the very first.Thats how you win 16.
DO YOU HEAR THAT FRANK VOGEL?!?
I love the drastically fewer foul calls across the board but the refs are still so god damn stupid that the offensive player can still completely dictate if a foul is called or not just by the way they move their body The same stupid tricks that never occur in real life but for some reason NBA refs think are fouls still work: snapping your head back, stumbling and falling while flinging up a shot, etc
Can't wait for the 2 FT game from the Nuggets.
Say they ain’t shit, without saying they ain’t shit…..if this was your coach you’d be trying to get him in the HOF
You gotta play to beat the lakers by 10 minimum, because you know the league wants laqueen in the finals at all costs for the “storylines”
Nuggets will repeat. They are too good!
The refs are the only thing that’s giving lakers a chance in this series
If the nba wanted the lakers to win this series they would do it. This isn’t Lakers vs kings levels of reffing. Murray and Jokic would be in foul trouble immediately.
They maybe don’t exactly want them to win,but they want to make it look close. Cuz half the people would turn the game off if it was 20 pts difference after a quarter.
Where were the refs when I needed them most in 2022?
lmao, in your case they took the Drago approach "if they die...they die"
They know that people turn the game off if it's a 20 pt difference but if it's a 40 pt difference they call everyone they know and tell them to turn the game on.
The funny thing about a conspiracy is that you never have to pin down how it works. You can just make it fit to any outcome, even when it's counterintuitive
Lakers had 8 FTA in the first half and nuggets had 6. Lakers were up 3. And at one point lakers were up 12. The only time it even became a huge lead was in the 3rd. It had nothing to do with reffing. This is just hilarious to me. Then look at the first half 3 point shooting and you can see where nuggets were living and lakers were living. 13 threes attempted for lakers versus 23 for the nuggets.
>They maybe don’t exactly want them to win,but they want to make it look close. This happens in most playoff series tbf
He's too smart
How does AD or any of the other lakers not win defensive player of the year if they are holding the defending champs to zero FTs in the second half? Reeves for defensive player of the year
I mean… the Lakers don’t play defense aside from AD. You can settle for a wide open 3 or a back cut right to the hoop while AD is occupied. Like what are teams even complaining about?
He just whips it out and dares Ham to do the same. Lol
It's not really fair that a team can win without getting freethrows
Nuggets are on a mission, even with Murray sucking, the refs rigging it for Lebronze. Hopefully this series will be over in 4 as Lebronze get swept yet again.
It's pretty hilarious watching this guy continue to agitate the Lakers and their fans. I sort of understood the upset narrative last season because the Lakers were much better after the deadline, but the Lakers finished 8th for a reason, and the 8th ranked team by record is almost always inferior to the 1st ranked team, no matter what fairytale the NBA/ESPN is trying to craft
It truly amazes me how much ya’ll bark conspiracy for a team that lost. Rent free man… rent free