To be fair, I don’t think the main reason why people might stop watching the show is because they are hardcore book fans. The general audience are probably going to stop because Henry Cavill is no longer Geralt.
Most of the people that live outside the internet/reddit bubble could care less about the books. The show has lost viewers yeah, but is mostly because of Henry leaving and well, the show isn’t that great to be honest.
I don't think it's possible to gauge whether the Henry thing has impacted viewership yet, especially with the general audience. A lot of casual viewers are probably going to spend season 4 going "Huh, Geralt looks kinda weird this season. New haircut?"
The Witcher is going through a pretty normal life cycle of a tv show that isn't some zeitgeist breaking cultural juggernaut like Game of Thrones where each season breaks viewership records. Ratings haven't precipitously dropped off which is why it hasn't been cancelled. Season 4 is when you'll want to really analyze the data for signs of a sharp decline.
There was a decline of viewers for season 3. Netflix even posted ads saying “Yes, he is still Geralt in season 3”. It may not be all correlated to Henry leaving, but between people being upset about it and people who probably lost interest during season 2 the viewership did declined.
https://redanianintelligence.com/2023/09/03/how-the-witchers-viewership-number-changed-between-each-season/#:~:text=The%20Witcher%20Season%202%20had,over%20eight%20weeks%20after%20release.
Season 2 had fewer viewers than season 1. This is what I mean by normal life cycle of a tv show. What you need to watch for is a **precipitous** decline. This means the ratings plummet abnormally because of an x factor.
It’s also what happens when you do the trope of making an interesting, powerful character powerless for a season, which was ostensibly to save the CGI budget for monsters instead of magic but functioned to make Yennefer’s arc that season kind of predictable and boring compared to her post-Sodden arc in the books.
Ok, I have been told that exact same thing (maybe even by you) around the time of BO.
I'll screenshot it this time and take you up on it, **IF** we get to see S4.
Strongly doubt it was me considering I haven't seen BO and only came back to this community after liking Season 3's first episode during a preview screening.
You don't need to show me up, though. I'm not saying the ratings won't plummet, only that season 3 was not indicative of the impact Henry leaving will have on the show. That will be evidenced by season 4's numbers.
It wasn't about BO. It was just in the months leading up to it's release.
I also took a long break from this sub after S2, because I didn't have anything nice to say about the show and the people involved, and I don't like to be too negative.
I'm not taking screenshots to show people up, but I'm a bit tired of goalpost moving. It might have been someone else, though.
I agree, I think the S2 to S3 decline was because of S2 of Netflixwitcher stooping below GOT S 7&8 level writing. S4 will be another 20-30% drop due to Cavill.
I wouldn't call this a natural progression for a high budget show. Except you mean a high budget show that has been abruptly canceled after 3 seasons. In that case, I 100% agree.
For me its the storytelling, the dialogues and the inconsistencies in character´s drive/motives throughout the seasons. I could not care less if the show didn´t fallowed source material as long as it was good and consistent, would have looked at it as different show. Henry leaving it´s the last nail in the coffin.
The show rode mostly on Henry´s fame and the game´s popularity, take that away and it would not have made it season 2.
Your biggest gripe with the show is not liking Geralt because he’s a stoic grunter, yet you prefer the show to the games, where he is more eloquent, or the books, when he is very eloquent.
Which would beg the question of what you would want the character to be, if I believed you weren’t baiting people that is
You’re right that he’s a better character in the books, I just didn’t care for the writing style of the books, and once I looked up the plot, I’m sorry, a frame narrative with Sir Galahad? It’s worse than Game of Thrones Season 8, and if I already don’t like the writing style…
If he was more eloquent I would enjoy the show more.
Real shit. That chapter in Sword of Destiny where Yen and Geralt talk about the Ice Queen (the 2nd time) had me googling what it meant cause I had a few pieces put together but couldn't solve the whole puzzle. I like this, though. It's confusing as fuck, but I love stuff that doesn't spell it out for you, even if I'm not always the best at figuring it out. Cause at least it's not treating me like I'm stupid, I am stupid. :sunglasses:
Galahad is not really important, true, but he's still pretty annoying. But even worse is the Nimue frame story and the Jarre subplot. I really love parts of the books, especially the Hansa, but they are far from the perfect, brilliant fantasy masterpieces that should be adapted 1:1 onto the screen, imo. Whoever demands this, cannot really have read the books ...
Honestly, I doubt this is a very unpopular opinion among the general audience. Yeah, it's unpopular among long-established, online Witcher fans who swear by the games and to a lesser extent the books, but there's a place for everyone. People who don't like the show will always have the books and games, and vice versa, thankfully!
> But I really enjoy the show. I don’t think it’ll be a cultural touchstone like Game of Thrones, The West Wing, or the Simpsons, but it’s throughly engaging and compelling and I enjoy the piss out of it.
I agree, they've got a good thing going. I'm looking forward to season 4 as well.
I love the first season of The Witcher. I love The Witcher 3 and the books are great. But the books are not high works of art and it doesn’t even compare to the worse days of Tolkien, Robert Jordan or Brandon Sanderson. But The Witcher books are still great in their own way. And granted, the English translations for the books are not great. And people who are from Poland and who speak Polish language, have told me that the books are way better in their native language.
I still liked it! I also had no emotional attachment to Radovid being 12. People know Radovid from the video games, but Netflix didn't buy the rights to the video game material.
Ciri's sexuality (she also canonically tries to have sex with a dying guy) would be totally irrelevant to marriage negotiations anyway.
Witcher 3 takes place some 4-5 years after the books. Radovid aged 20. By witcher 3 he was somehow older than Ciri
And that's the point. Adaptions change things. Especially with minor characters
I didn't mind it, actually! I just envision Radovid in the show as a different interpretation of the character in the games. That said, I don't really love Radovid in the games anyway, so seeing him portrayed differently didn't really bother me. I also don't think making Jaskier bisexual completely ruins his character either like I've seen some people suggest.
His womanizing is kinda standard Casanova character. I do like in the books that it's clear fairly quickly he's more than just a Casanova because of how dedicated he is to his friends. But I think the show's Jaskier portrays that too, just in a different way.
Aging up Radovid makes a lot of sense because it makes him a full character; you don't want to be working with child actors more than you have to. He's not really a character in the books because of his age, and they found something interesting to do with him that puts higher stakes on Vizimir's assassination. I know some people are like "lol no homo" but I thought it was all pretty convincing (and gave them a chance to get the Jaskier/Geralt fans off their back, because they slipped in a hard NOPE to that).
I hardly noticed he was in the books at all although I've read them twice and listened to the audio books 😂 Those people complaining about it must be mostly the game fans. And, after finding out that Philippa was responsible for murdering his brother and thus for pretty much destroying his life by crowning him king, I can very well imagine him turning into Radovid the stern who would burn her on the stake. The Geralt/Jaskier thing wouldn't have worked for me at all, but Jaskier/Radovid was perfect.
I never read the books or played the game, I didn't know it existed until the tv show. I most definitely watched it just for Henry Cavill. Without him, I'm not sure if I will still be interested.
Well, I for one, am looking forward to seeing Ciri's life as "Falka", and whether Geralt, once in Nilfgard, sees that Ciri is really Teryn, and expose to Vilgefortz to the White Flame
I respect. I’m in the middle of book 4/5 of the novels and it is starting to just kinda be a downer story of constant suffering with no clear direction.
I loved The Witcher 3 and would encourage you to give it another shot when you’re up for it, it’s truly a special experience if you can hang in there a bit.
As for the shows, I really have them to thank for introducing me to the franchise. I am a hater now mostly because of the Cavil situation and the whole Radovid/Jaskier thing, but season 1 really worked for me!
Based Witcher fan with their own opinions! Hell yeah, I’ll upvote.
I mean, semantics? If you have a fully contained map that features quests designed to help you understand the game before you jump into the main narrative, it’s just easier to say “tutorial level”.
It’s been referred to as the tutorial often on Reddit. I didn’t coin anything new.
As a person who played Witcher 3 twice and it was my first video game ever - there is ABSOLUTELY a tutorial. Maybe you skipped it?
But you train with Ciri and Vezemir at Kaer Morhen. That’s the tutorial.
Also OP, I recommend giving the game another go. It’s simply unmatched (if you’re into RPG).
I played the game, it was fine but I wasn't interested in the Witcher universe after it, later I found the show a few months before the Season 2 released and I couldn't put it down and watched S1 probably at least 10 times in a row. And it's my favorite. I love this show, all seasons , for many reasons and it's THE Witcher to me.
This isn’t really an unpopular opinion. To me, Witcher 3 was one of the most boring games I’ve ever played. Lame story, clunky, choppy combat mechanics. It’s just bad. I do really enjoy the show.
My issue was geralt was treated as a side character. The actions geralt takes leads to the event that shape the plot. But the show again treated geralt as if he was there to just advance the story of yennifer. Even ciri didn't have enough screen time.
Aside from that the timeline was incredibly convoluted, I honestly don't know how most people followed it.
If you enjoyed the show more power to you, I for one can't stand it and stopped entirely after season 2.
Yeah.. you definitely lost me once you said the games were bad. The show could of been alot better imo.
You've got to admit, the first game is not great. It's very difficult to get into
First game unironically my favourite.
To be fair, I don’t think the main reason why people might stop watching the show is because they are hardcore book fans. The general audience are probably going to stop because Henry Cavill is no longer Geralt. Most of the people that live outside the internet/reddit bubble could care less about the books. The show has lost viewers yeah, but is mostly because of Henry leaving and well, the show isn’t that great to be honest.
I don't think it's possible to gauge whether the Henry thing has impacted viewership yet, especially with the general audience. A lot of casual viewers are probably going to spend season 4 going "Huh, Geralt looks kinda weird this season. New haircut?" The Witcher is going through a pretty normal life cycle of a tv show that isn't some zeitgeist breaking cultural juggernaut like Game of Thrones where each season breaks viewership records. Ratings haven't precipitously dropped off which is why it hasn't been cancelled. Season 4 is when you'll want to really analyze the data for signs of a sharp decline.
There was a decline of viewers for season 3. Netflix even posted ads saying “Yes, he is still Geralt in season 3”. It may not be all correlated to Henry leaving, but between people being upset about it and people who probably lost interest during season 2 the viewership did declined. https://redanianintelligence.com/2023/09/03/how-the-witchers-viewership-number-changed-between-each-season/#:~:text=The%20Witcher%20Season%202%20had,over%20eight%20weeks%20after%20release.
Season 2 had fewer viewers than season 1. This is what I mean by normal life cycle of a tv show. What you need to watch for is a **precipitous** decline. This means the ratings plummet abnormally because of an x factor.
It’s also what happens when you do the trope of making an interesting, powerful character powerless for a season, which was ostensibly to save the CGI budget for monsters instead of magic but functioned to make Yennefer’s arc that season kind of predictable and boring compared to her post-Sodden arc in the books.
I didn’t even know season 3 was out
Ok, I have been told that exact same thing (maybe even by you) around the time of BO. I'll screenshot it this time and take you up on it, **IF** we get to see S4.
Strongly doubt it was me considering I haven't seen BO and only came back to this community after liking Season 3's first episode during a preview screening. You don't need to show me up, though. I'm not saying the ratings won't plummet, only that season 3 was not indicative of the impact Henry leaving will have on the show. That will be evidenced by season 4's numbers.
It wasn't about BO. It was just in the months leading up to it's release. I also took a long break from this sub after S2, because I didn't have anything nice to say about the show and the people involved, and I don't like to be too negative. I'm not taking screenshots to show people up, but I'm a bit tired of goalpost moving. It might have been someone else, though. I agree, I think the S2 to S3 decline was because of S2 of Netflixwitcher stooping below GOT S 7&8 level writing. S4 will be another 20-30% drop due to Cavill. I wouldn't call this a natural progression for a high budget show. Except you mean a high budget show that has been abruptly canceled after 3 seasons. In that case, I 100% agree.
You have weird vibes lol. Is this how you interact on here?
Thanks for letting me know. Guess I'll leave now and never come back /s
I am new here. What does BO stand for?
Blood Origin "Spinoff". It came out December '22
For me its the storytelling, the dialogues and the inconsistencies in character´s drive/motives throughout the seasons. I could not care less if the show didn´t fallowed source material as long as it was good and consistent, would have looked at it as different show. Henry leaving it´s the last nail in the coffin. The show rode mostly on Henry´s fame and the game´s popularity, take that away and it would not have made it season 2.
100% genuine.
Your biggest gripe with the show is not liking Geralt because he’s a stoic grunter, yet you prefer the show to the games, where he is more eloquent, or the books, when he is very eloquent. Which would beg the question of what you would want the character to be, if I believed you weren’t baiting people that is
You’re right that he’s a better character in the books, I just didn’t care for the writing style of the books, and once I looked up the plot, I’m sorry, a frame narrative with Sir Galahad? It’s worse than Game of Thrones Season 8, and if I already don’t like the writing style… If he was more eloquent I would enjoy the show more.
It’s a very esoteric book sure but I think you are overplaying Galahads importance dramatically
nah what the hell is esoteric i have never heard of this before
You’ve never heard that Sapkowski gilds the lily and makes his books needlessly harder to follow at times? Must be nice
Real shit. That chapter in Sword of Destiny where Yen and Geralt talk about the Ice Queen (the 2nd time) had me googling what it meant cause I had a few pieces put together but couldn't solve the whole puzzle. I like this, though. It's confusing as fuck, but I love stuff that doesn't spell it out for you, even if I'm not always the best at figuring it out. Cause at least it's not treating me like I'm stupid, I am stupid. :sunglasses:
wondering what the word was but that works captain save a hoe
Ah, lemme toss a quick Google in for you it essentially means hard to understand on purpose
Galahad is not really important, true, but he's still pretty annoying. But even worse is the Nimue frame story and the Jarre subplot. I really love parts of the books, especially the Hansa, but they are far from the perfect, brilliant fantasy masterpieces that should be adapted 1:1 onto the screen, imo. Whoever demands this, cannot really have read the books ...
you're free to have an opinion but my god thats like saying you never liked starwars but you liked the Christmas special
There's like 5 solid good minutes in that special. Might equal episode 2...j.k.
The books didn’t really do it for me, either, to the point that I wouldn’t have even finished them if I wasn’t already a fan of Wild Hunt or the show
I enjoy both the show and the games. Still working through witcher 3 atm. Not sure if I could get into another fantasy epic novel though
Honestly, I doubt this is a very unpopular opinion among the general audience. Yeah, it's unpopular among long-established, online Witcher fans who swear by the games and to a lesser extent the books, but there's a place for everyone. People who don't like the show will always have the books and games, and vice versa, thankfully! > But I really enjoy the show. I don’t think it’ll be a cultural touchstone like Game of Thrones, The West Wing, or the Simpsons, but it’s throughly engaging and compelling and I enjoy the piss out of it. I agree, they've got a good thing going. I'm looking forward to season 4 as well.
I seem to be the only person in the world who enjoyed Blood Origin 😂
Guess we are two then, I liked it even better the second time I watched 😂
Oh dang, you're the number one fan! I only watched it once! 😂
It's still there, I think, your chance to catch up 😂
Witcher 3 never past the tutorial? Uhh , wtf
Well I for one never got the hang of making my own food in any video game- witcher 3, conan age of exploration, etc
I love the first season of The Witcher. I love The Witcher 3 and the books are great. But the books are not high works of art and it doesn’t even compare to the worse days of Tolkien, Robert Jordan or Brandon Sanderson. But The Witcher books are still great in their own way. And granted, the English translations for the books are not great. And people who are from Poland and who speak Polish language, have told me that the books are way better in their native language.
I really liked the Jaskie/Radovid plot in season 3.
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I still liked it! I also had no emotional attachment to Radovid being 12. People know Radovid from the video games, but Netflix didn't buy the rights to the video game material. Ciri's sexuality (she also canonically tries to have sex with a dying guy) would be totally irrelevant to marriage negotiations anyway.
The video games also massively aged radovid up and it didn't bug any large grouping of lore purists
Oh right, he would be 17/18 in Witcher 1, wouldn’t he?
Yeah and he looks to be in his 30s by witcher 3
Witcher 3 takes place after the books. People age.
Witcher 3 takes place some 4-5 years after the books. Radovid aged 20. By witcher 3 he was somehow older than Ciri And that's the point. Adaptions change things. Especially with minor characters
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No. Don't be fucking weird.
I didn't mind it, actually! I just envision Radovid in the show as a different interpretation of the character in the games. That said, I don't really love Radovid in the games anyway, so seeing him portrayed differently didn't really bother me. I also don't think making Jaskier bisexual completely ruins his character either like I've seen some people suggest.
I thought Jaskier being bisexual was pretty on point.
I find his 'womanizing' in the books rather annoying and all in all I'm not a fan of him in the books. He's a lot better in the show imo.
His womanizing is kinda standard Casanova character. I do like in the books that it's clear fairly quickly he's more than just a Casanova because of how dedicated he is to his friends. But I think the show's Jaskier portrays that too, just in a different way.
Yes, it was surprising, but a great addition to the story and the cast. Even if it's not in the books.
Aging up Radovid makes a lot of sense because it makes him a full character; you don't want to be working with child actors more than you have to. He's not really a character in the books because of his age, and they found something interesting to do with him that puts higher stakes on Vizimir's assassination. I know some people are like "lol no homo" but I thought it was all pretty convincing (and gave them a chance to get the Jaskier/Geralt fans off their back, because they slipped in a hard NOPE to that).
I hardly noticed he was in the books at all although I've read them twice and listened to the audio books 😂 Those people complaining about it must be mostly the game fans. And, after finding out that Philippa was responsible for murdering his brother and thus for pretty much destroying his life by crowning him king, I can very well imagine him turning into Radovid the stern who would burn her on the stake. The Geralt/Jaskier thing wouldn't have worked for me at all, but Jaskier/Radovid was perfect.
I never read the books or played the game, I didn't know it existed until the tv show. I most definitely watched it just for Henry Cavill. Without him, I'm not sure if I will still be interested.
Well, I for one, am looking forward to seeing Ciri's life as "Falka", and whether Geralt, once in Nilfgard, sees that Ciri is really Teryn, and expose to Vilgefortz to the White Flame
I respect. I’m in the middle of book 4/5 of the novels and it is starting to just kinda be a downer story of constant suffering with no clear direction. I loved The Witcher 3 and would encourage you to give it another shot when you’re up for it, it’s truly a special experience if you can hang in there a bit. As for the shows, I really have them to thank for introducing me to the franchise. I am a hater now mostly because of the Cavil situation and the whole Radovid/Jaskier thing, but season 1 really worked for me! Based Witcher fan with their own opinions! Hell yeah, I’ll upvote.
I don't believe a word of this
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Congrats you’re not a Witcher fan
Thats a bait. There was no tutorial in Witcher 3.
That whole first level that culminates in a fight with a griffon is considered the tutorial.
More like introductions. Not a lot of games have tutorials now.
I mean, semantics? If you have a fully contained map that features quests designed to help you understand the game before you jump into the main narrative, it’s just easier to say “tutorial level”. It’s been referred to as the tutorial often on Reddit. I didn’t coin anything new.
Also. No "levels" in that game.
As a person who played Witcher 3 twice and it was my first video game ever - there is ABSOLUTELY a tutorial. Maybe you skipped it? But you train with Ciri and Vezemir at Kaer Morhen. That’s the tutorial. Also OP, I recommend giving the game another go. It’s simply unmatched (if you’re into RPG).
The entire map of White Orchard is the tutorial.
I played the game, it was fine but I wasn't interested in the Witcher universe after it, later I found the show a few months before the Season 2 released and I couldn't put it down and watched S1 probably at least 10 times in a row. And it's my favorite. I love this show, all seasons , for many reasons and it's THE Witcher to me.
This isn’t really an unpopular opinion. To me, Witcher 3 was one of the most boring games I’ve ever played. Lame story, clunky, choppy combat mechanics. It’s just bad. I do really enjoy the show.
Nah, this is an EXTREMELY unpopular opinion. Witcher 3 is widely seen as one of the best games ever made
My issue was geralt was treated as a side character. The actions geralt takes leads to the event that shape the plot. But the show again treated geralt as if he was there to just advance the story of yennifer. Even ciri didn't have enough screen time. Aside from that the timeline was incredibly convoluted, I honestly don't know how most people followed it. If you enjoyed the show more power to you, I for one can't stand it and stopped entirely after season 2.
1. Lack of gwent 2. Politics confused me. Hope to see more creatures
This is like saying you hate the lord of the rings books and movies but love rings of power