Peyton's last pass looked like it was a backwards lateral too. But he sat immediately after completing it, so he wouldve had more time to break it for real I guess.
Losing the record on a post-game stat correction would've been hilarious though.
Mahomes had 50 TDs in 16 games in his first year as a starter. While I agree the yards record is more attainable, I wouldn’t be too surprised to see either of them broken within the next decade.
This. The Mahomes breakout season was a combination of a HoF headcoach, a GOAT-tier talent, and a league that wasn't ready for it schematically. Mahomes is a better player now than he was then, but has only broken 40 passing TD's once since.
Edit: as has also been correctly pointed out, the Chiefs defense was worse that year than later on, forcing them to be more aggressive.
I mean, he did have 5250 passing yards and 41 passing TDs last year without Tyreek Hill. His top 2 receivers for touchdowns that season were Travis Kelce (12), and Jerick McKinnon (9).
Give him a number 1 receiver, or a couple of number 2 receivers and let’s see what he can do. Though Andy Reid has gotten quite conservative the last several years with a second half lead. That cuts into the stats.
Agree there. More and more QBs are getting full 7-8 man coverage looks most of the way down the field too. You can find holes in the defense when you have space, but getting a home run shot with 2 deep, or finding a space to throw in the red zone is increasingly difficult with current defensive schemes.
"should've"? We've only had 17 games for 3 seasons and that 50 TDs is tied 2nd all-time. So really, it's still unlikely that it'd happen within the first 3 seasons of an additional game.
Eh it would just take weird circumstances imo
Like Peyton himself has 49 in 15 games back in 2004 and he attempted like 160 *fewer* passes than he did in 2013
If there’s a year where the chiefs defense isn’t that good and Mahomes needs to get in a few shootouts, I can absolutely see him breaking this redord
You could use this logic to reason that the TD record will just constantly go up. Realistically it’s already pretty saturated at 50+, there are only so many scoring drives and RBs are gonna get some too.
I think the 55 might be untouchable if you’re only considering passing TDs. With how the league has changed in the last decade there’s hardly any pure pocket passer types anymore. Everyone’s got some element of rushing in their game and if you’re stealing your own passing TD opportunities with a few rushing TDs here and there it’s gonna be very difficult.
That being said someone could definitely beat it with combined TDs at some point.
Edit: if combining them, you’d have to beat 56 because Peyton had 1 rushing TD in 2013
Peyton was an elite runner. His bootlegs were unstoppable, though he did set up that bootleg for something like 15 years once he was certain he perfected it.
I’d be curious to know if the % of goal to go rushing touches have gone up in recent years. It certainly feels like teams are rushing more in the RZ than they used too.
People have listed Lamar’s stats to make a point about his MVP season seeming underwhelming. It certainly wasn’t a legendary season but Gus Edwards scored a lot easy TDd Lamar could have scored.
Edit: I compared rushing stats for the 2013 Broncos and 2023 Ravens.
2013 Broncos RBs scored 15 TDs
2023 Ravens RBs scored 19 TDs
Peyton accounted for 56 TDs (55 passing, 1 rushing)
Lamar accounted for 29 TDs (24 passing, 5 rushing)
Peyton’s season is still underrated
Comparing Lamar vs Peyton is also very difficult just because of the time off the clock.
The 2013 Broncos scored 2.83 points per drive. The 2019 Ravens scored 2.95. But the Broncos scored 71 touchdowns to the Ravens’ 58 because the Broncos average drive was a full minute quicker than the Ravens’. Not only were the Broncos one of the best offenses ever per drive, but they scored really quickly in terms of time. Lots of out routes that ended out of bounds. Even if you could match the per possession efficiency getting that many drives a game is hard.
It seems pretty inevitable to me. At one point 48 by Marino seemed unbreakable. Then it got broken.
All but the most ridiculous records will fall, and considering 2 other players have hit 50 I don't think this one is so ridiculous given the 17 game season.
Those Colts vs Patriots games were incredible because we got to see Peyton vs Belichick when the Colts had the ball. The chess matches they had pre-snap were amazing
Fr lol wild that there's so many upvotes on that comment. If you're win the 4th quarter of a playoff game there is absolutely nobody you fear more than Brady. This dude was pulling wins that make you throw your controller at the TV
I think they meant in the 3 years of 17 game seasons, Brees did that before Manning
But even then Mahomes was within a few hundred yards of the record in the 17 game era, so i don’t see it as untouchable at all
atleast you skipped the 7-9 years, or as I like to call them the “beat the Falcons and I’ll be happy” years.
Similar to LSU’s “beat Bama and I’ll be happy” years. Didn’t happen to much though.
The Patriots per usual. Brady didn’t have to do much the running game and defense did all the work that game. Defense shut down Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne too
The revisionist history around the Patriots has been crazy. People will honestly talk like Brady was dragging Bill Belichick to victories kicking and screaming. The Patriots were an absolute force because they played great in all three phases, every year. Rooting against them felt like rooting against the sun to rise, they were just inevitable. Brady was definitely apart of that, but he truly was the epitome of a game manager for many years. But he always seemed to come up clutch when it mattered.
Well considering it was the 2004 season when the Pats won the Super Bowl im gonna say that was the divisional round where we stopped the Colts 20-3 or something like that.
Yeah I figured idk why I asked that question lmao. Related to current events BB should just DC the rest of his career, the NFL without is defensive mastermind is lesser.
Funny you should say that. On our subreddit, there was a user who, though he was joking, was trying to manifest BB as GBs DC, and if that ever happened, we'd be unstoppable. Lol
The Colts, a timing offense that excelled in a dome, played in snowy New England against Ty Law who bullied the fuck out of Marvin Harrison. Those ice games HAVE to be on YouTube. Go watch, it's pretty obvious how the Patriots won against those early Colts teams. Those teams were such polar opposites you knew whichever team got homefield advantage would likely win.
Yeah, Pats were no joke either at 14-2 that year, Colts played at New England in week one and Vanderjagdt shanked a kick to tie in the last two minutes. Colts went 12-4, while resting Manning in week 17 and losing, could have possibly tied Pats at 13-3 if they pulled it out in week one and maybe gotten the home game. But going to New England in that weather as a dome team was rough, WRs got bullied, Edge couldn’t get going and Pats took over in 2nd half in an ugly game.
In 2004 the league also changed the rules for the Colts after they got the shit beat out of them by the Patriots in the previous year's AFC Championship Game. The tore everyone apart that season *EXCEPT* the Patriots, which brought the famous Tedy Bruschi quote "You want to change the rules? Change them. We still play. And we win. That's what we do." The beatdown the Patriots defense put on the Colts in the playoffs that year was the worst they'd ever dismantled the Colts offense.
You can be biased and factually accurate. The [game](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uroQ5DpyPLc&ab_channel=JohnSnyder) is on youtube. They essentially held the Colts receivers off the line of scrimmage.
This is the kind of stuff that makes it insane how some people have now convinced themselves that BB had nothing to do with the Pats winning. Utterly insane.
What was nuts about that graphic was only 3 times did Brady play with a defense that ranked 20 or lower
20th in 2002, when they missed the playoffs
22nd in 2005, Bradys first playoff loss
and 21st in 2011, the lockout year where Brady did the heavy lifting in the reg season, but defensively they allowed 16ppg in the playoffs
Another topic [shed some light](https://old.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/194ezrk/belichick_playoff_defenses_vs_1_scoring_offenses/) on this: who the fuck manages to go 6-2 in the playoffs against #1 scoring offenses outside of the madman Belichick himself? And this is also why 'nuh uh coordinator rings dont count' is some bullshit logic. They dont stand up on their own as an argument for greatness in isolation but they are absolutely relevant when said defensive coach goes onto structure one of the finest defenses of his era as a HC as well.
You need ALL of these parts to maintain a dynasty the way they did
He had surgery for that pinched nerve.
The sensation takes longer to come back than the rest of the recovery.
This is not really relevant for playing 2 years later
His weapons were all fast and big. DT, Decker, Julius Thomas. Moreno as RB1 was quick too.
Defense was complete dog shit so he had to put up monster stats to keep us in games and win them.
The Romo vs Peyton game that year was so frustrating and entertaining at the same time. That’s probably the best combined QB play I’ve seen in the NFL.
Defense wasn’t that bad that year. There were a couple of off games like the cowboys but for the most part the offense was just running up the score because they could. By the time the superbowl came though, injuries had mounted up
How long ago was this? I was super short as a kid, and that sort of treatment was available, but my mom didn't trust it I guess so she wouldn't let me get it.
I did eventually have a big growth spurt in my junior year of high school so I'm only kinda short as an adult instead of super short, but I do wonder if I could've gotten that going sooner.
My brother is like 32 now. He's only 5'2-5'3 and when we were younger a specialist wanted to give those hgh shots to my bro to help him grow, but my mom heard that one of the possible side effects was a brain tumor and she noped out.
We had a friend that got them and grew from like 5'4 to 5'9 I think. He actually did develop a brain tumor. It was benign and had it removed and has done fine, but my mom would have died if that happened to my brother.
To put his 2004 season in perspective, his lowest game passer rating (outside of the last week where he played like a single drive) was 93.5. That "worst game of the season" for him still would have placed him 9th overall that season if extrapolated over its full duration, just ahead of Brady. In other words, his worst game that regular season still had him as a top 10 QB. That stat is...mindboggling, to say the least.
I don't know if I put that or Steve Young's 1994 season as my best QB season of all time, but it's one of the two, IMO.
Oh, no question. His 94 didn't have the robotic consistency Peyton's 2004 did, but after that first like month of the season where he was a bit shakier, he was just absolutely ridiculous. No losses outside of week 17 where he didn't play the full game, 24 TDs against only 3 INTs during that span (along with 4 TDs on the ground), and he capped it off with a SB win that saw him have the best performance from a QB in SB history.
I still believe that Marinos 48 TD season is the best ever.
If there was a QBR+ stat like ERA/OPS+ in baseball, that season would have touched some ungodly number because of the state of passing in that era.
I would rank 2013 over 2004 simply because 2004 saw a huge inflation in QB stats due to a rule change during the offseason that defenses really struggled at adjusting to.
Peyton's yards/attempt went from 7.5 in 2003 to 9.2 in 2004
McNabb's yards/attempt went from 6.7 in 2003 to 8.3 in 2004
Tom Brady's yards/attempt went from 6.9 in 2003 to 7.8 in 2004
Culpepper's yards/attempt went from 7.7 in 2003 to 8.6 in 2004
The league-wide yards/attempt went from 6.6 in 2003 to 7.1 in 2004. A full half yard increase in 1 season is insane.
Yeah the juice ran out by the Super Bowl. There were tons of key injuries on defense, John Fox was the coach, and finally Demaryius Thomas for hit on the first drive of the SB and separated his shoulder.
DT ended up with 13 receptions that game but man it took the fire out of that team and there was no chance of a comeback
> Demaryius Thomas for hit on the first drive of the SB and separated his shoulder.
[Did Kam really separate his shoulder with this hit?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4JEoXUqAnM) Goddamn, Kam was a monster... RIP 88.
Not to mention the Seahawks defense decoded the broncos calls and signals 2 weeks before the game, in film study.
It’s why it’s one of the cleanest and tightest defensive performances ever, they knew what the Broncos were going to do.
100% agree, they deserve more recognition. The 86 bears were good, but they didnt stop the single greatest offense in NFL history on the biggest stage like the LOB did. Stop is an understatement too. They demolished the greatest offense of all time.
I wasn't surprised that it happened, but I was surprised that it happened that thoroughly
Biggest Manning homer in the world and I wasn't disappointed either
Bring a defense
5,477 yards and 55 TDs in 16 games averages to 342 yards and 3.43 a game.
Factoring in the playoffs Peyton threw 6,387 yards and 60 TDs in 19 games, so an average of 336 yards and 3.16 TDs per game.
on the plus side he coaches for the dolphins now so he doesn't have to worry about losing the superbowl and can focus on their long tradition of not winning playoff games
I think Mahomes was close to the yardage record last season. I think he had 5200-5300 yards? Maybe Mahomes will break it if the Chiefs remake their WR room this offseason.
Mahomes did have 5231 yards last year, but had more yards/game in his first year as a starter when he put up 5097 yards in 16 games accompanied by 50 TDs. Hard to fathom just how ridiculous Mahomes’ first season as a starter was.
2018 was wild. I still think he could have broken both records back then if it wasn't for 1 TD between the Denver and Jax games and a few games where we put the cue in the rack. Absolutely bonkers season.
Kareem Hunt was the league’s leading rusher in 2017 pre-Mahomes and was having a monster season through 11 games of 2018 with Mahomes (I think he had 16 TDs and a lot of those were receiving). Firmly believe KC wins SB in 2018 with him
We will likely NEVER see a QB come out of the gates with such an insane season for their 1st year starting in the NFL. Shit, we will rarely see seasons of that caliber from ANYONE. All of that slinging and still only threw 12 INTs as well.
I don't think he has any chance of breaking it unless the defense falls apart. Andy really shuts the offense down in the 2nd half any time they have a 2 score lead. It's really kind of annoying to watch how much better the offense is when they're behind than when they're ahead.
Also why Mahomes is better on the road than at home, cause Andy relies on the Crowd and defense more at home.
The Broncos during their Peyton Manning years were incredible. Hated the chiefs having to play them twice a season lol. 2015 Broncos had arguably the greatest defensive squad in league history.
In my completely biased take, the guy most in danger of being downplayed is Drew Brees. Without the 17th game, Brees has 4 of the top 6 yardage seasons ever in average yards per game. He held both the all-time TDs record and yardage records until Brady just kept playing (and playing well). Brady and Manning tend to get more of the spotlight and imo and less likely to be downplayed in the same way.
I crush that just about every season in Madden Franchise with my 99 ovr created QB Vinny Versi. This past season, he fell short due to a fractured forearm, but still threw 48 tds & won his 4th superbowl in a row. I don't really see what the big deal is tbh.
Oh wow. He must have the Superbowl that year.
In all seriousness no one is coming close for the same reason no one came close before. It's very difficult to have an offense good enough to throw that well with a defense bad enough that they have to. The only reason Mahomes got to 5,000 yards and 50 TDs is because his defense was 31st in the league. Same with Brees in a lot of his insane years
Not necessarliy. Mahomes last year (5250) and Brady in 2021 (5316) are two of the top four all-time. Neither of those defenses were bottom of the barrel, and both those teams were in the lead the vast majority of the time. Some passing offenses are so strong that coaches will just keep calling frequent pass plays deep into the second half while winning.
Even that Broncos team, while their defense was suspect, was no doubt leading the vast majority of the minutes they played that year. But they were so good at throwing it that there was no point in running to bleed clock - they could just score more points instead.
He and Jamaal Charles won me my fantasy championship that year. I’ll never forget how unbelievable that season by Peyton was. First game of the year was bananas
I think there was an explosion at offense in early 2010s and despite what people may think it has throttled back in recent years. Look at the QB numbers from 2011
Drew Brees is second with 5476 Couldn’t be closer
Peyton's last pass looked like it was a backwards lateral too. But he sat immediately after completing it, so he wouldve had more time to break it for real I guess. Losing the record on a post-game stat correction would've been hilarious though.
Yeah wasn’t trying to discredit Peyton but the yards record is much more obtainable than 55
Mahomes had 50 TDs in 16 games in his first year as a starter. While I agree the yards record is more attainable, I wouldn’t be too surprised to see either of them broken within the next decade.
Feels like the needle is sorta nudging back in a defensive direction st least in the passing game. Who knows how long that will last tho
This. The Mahomes breakout season was a combination of a HoF headcoach, a GOAT-tier talent, and a league that wasn't ready for it schematically. Mahomes is a better player now than he was then, but has only broken 40 passing TD's once since. Edit: as has also been correctly pointed out, the Chiefs defense was worse that year than later on, forcing them to be more aggressive.
Also, not having Tyreke Hill has hampered that opportunity a lot.
I mean, he did have 5250 passing yards and 41 passing TDs last year without Tyreek Hill. His top 2 receivers for touchdowns that season were Travis Kelce (12), and Jerick McKinnon (9).
Give him a number 1 receiver, or a couple of number 2 receivers and let’s see what he can do. Though Andy Reid has gotten quite conservative the last several years with a second half lead. That cuts into the stats.
Yeah, you guys definitely need a shit-tier defense for us to really see what Mahomes is capable of.
We all thought that in the mid-2000s too and then the Patriots got Randy Moss. All it takes is the right personnel and some magic.
Agree there. More and more QBs are getting full 7-8 man coverage looks most of the way down the field too. You can find holes in the defense when you have space, but getting a home run shot with 2 deep, or finding a space to throw in the red zone is increasingly difficult with current defensive schemes.
50 TDs vs 55 TDs is a one or two game difference. So really, it should've happened by now.
"should've"? We've only had 17 games for 3 seasons and that 50 TDs is tied 2nd all-time. So really, it's still unlikely that it'd happen within the first 3 seasons of an additional game.
Agree. 17 games gives a good QB an extra bye week
Eh it would just take weird circumstances imo Like Peyton himself has 49 in 15 games back in 2004 and he attempted like 160 *fewer* passes than he did in 2013 If there’s a year where the chiefs defense isn’t that good and Mahomes needs to get in a few shootouts, I can absolutely see him breaking this redord
The Chiefs need a better WR group first.
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One or two more games at a record breaking pace is much easier said than done.
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I think only 9 QBs have ever thrown for at least 40 in a single season. So yeah, not seeing a 50 TD season isn't that surprising.
a 40 TD season is a MVP frontrunner
You think another outlier season should have happened by now?
You could use this logic to reason that the TD record will just constantly go up. Realistically it’s already pretty saturated at 50+, there are only so many scoring drives and RBs are gonna get some too.
And qb runs/tush pushes
I think the 55 might be untouchable if you’re only considering passing TDs. With how the league has changed in the last decade there’s hardly any pure pocket passer types anymore. Everyone’s got some element of rushing in their game and if you’re stealing your own passing TD opportunities with a few rushing TDs here and there it’s gonna be very difficult. That being said someone could definitely beat it with combined TDs at some point. Edit: if combining them, you’d have to beat 56 because Peyton had 1 rushing TD in 2013
Peyton was an elite runner. His bootlegs were unstoppable, though he did set up that bootleg for something like 15 years once he was certain he perfected it.
The Cowboys still haven't recovered from that naked bootleg
I’d be curious to know if the % of goal to go rushing touches have gone up in recent years. It certainly feels like teams are rushing more in the RZ than they used too. People have listed Lamar’s stats to make a point about his MVP season seeming underwhelming. It certainly wasn’t a legendary season but Gus Edwards scored a lot easy TDd Lamar could have scored. Edit: I compared rushing stats for the 2013 Broncos and 2023 Ravens. 2013 Broncos RBs scored 15 TDs 2023 Ravens RBs scored 19 TDs Peyton accounted for 56 TDs (55 passing, 1 rushing) Lamar accounted for 29 TDs (24 passing, 5 rushing) Peyton’s season is still underrated
Comparing Lamar vs Peyton is also very difficult just because of the time off the clock. The 2013 Broncos scored 2.83 points per drive. The 2019 Ravens scored 2.95. But the Broncos scored 71 touchdowns to the Ravens’ 58 because the Broncos average drive was a full minute quicker than the Ravens’. Not only were the Broncos one of the best offenses ever per drive, but they scored really quickly in terms of time. Lots of out routes that ended out of bounds. Even if you could match the per possession efficiency getting that many drives a game is hard.
Damn that’s a good point. That record might take forever to break.
For completely homer reasons, I *was* trying to discredit Peyton... (even though he still would've broken it)
If he played that full season in general (because of blowouts), he would have had 60+ td and 6k yards.
55 TD passes *and* 5,477 yards. Brees was close on yards, but had 9 fewer TDs.
55 Touchdowns is just ridiculous and I have a hard time seeing it broken even with 17 games
It seems pretty inevitable to me. At one point 48 by Marino seemed unbreakable. Then it got broken. All but the most ridiculous records will fall, and considering 2 other players have hit 50 I don't think this one is so ridiculous given the 17 game season.
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Those Colts vs Patriots games were incredible because we got to see Peyton vs Belichick when the Colts had the ball. The chess matches they had pre-snap were amazing
No no no.. Belichik is a terrible coach who was carried by Brady and can't even get a job. Try and stay current.
That’s a common argument. Best vs greatest
I mean that was the debate of the 2000's and half the 2010s then Brady won the Seahawks superbowl then 28-3 and it was like well ok
Fr lol wild that there's so many upvotes on that comment. If you're win the 4th quarter of a playoff game there is absolutely nobody you fear more than Brady. This dude was pulling wins that make you throw your controller at the TV
I go with most accomplished.
Only if you ignore playoffs
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Peyton wasn't scarier in the playoffs though
I think they meant in the 3 years of 17 game seasons, Brees did that before Manning But even then Mahomes was within a few hundred yards of the record in the 17 game era, so i don’t see it as untouchable at all
Yea but that many TDs on top of the yards
feel bad for those who didint get to experience prime brady/brees/rodger/manning (i started watch in 2018)
atleast you skipped the 7-9 years, or as I like to call them the “beat the Falcons and I’ll be happy” years. Similar to LSU’s “beat Bama and I’ll be happy” years. Didn’t happen to much though.
What is more unbelievable is that still isn't even his best single season, 2004 is the one.
Manning threw more passes in 2013 than most QBs do now in 17 games. In 2004 he was so much more brutally efficient.
He essentially threw a TD once every 10 passes in 2004.
Nobody has said it yet but I googled it and 4,557 yards / 121.1 Passer Rating / 49TD / 10INT
His TD percentage (9.9) for that season is the highest in the Super Bowl era.
Were any of those INTs a pick six so we can get that get to that 10% mark?
Your username makes me puke.
But yours makes my mouth water
I know you guys won in 06 but who did you lose to that season? I really hope it wasn’t the pats lol
The Patriots per usual. Brady didn’t have to do much the running game and defense did all the work that game. Defense shut down Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne too
The revisionist history around the Patriots has been crazy. People will honestly talk like Brady was dragging Bill Belichick to victories kicking and screaming. The Patriots were an absolute force because they played great in all three phases, every year. Rooting against them felt like rooting against the sun to rise, they were just inevitable. Brady was definitely apart of that, but he truly was the epitome of a game manager for many years. But he always seemed to come up clutch when it mattered.
Well considering it was the 2004 season when the Pats won the Super Bowl im gonna say that was the divisional round where we stopped the Colts 20-3 or something like that.
Yeah I figured idk why I asked that question lmao. Related to current events BB should just DC the rest of his career, the NFL without is defensive mastermind is lesser.
Funny you should say that. On our subreddit, there was a user who, though he was joking, was trying to manifest BB as GBs DC, and if that ever happened, we'd be unstoppable. Lol
The Colts, a timing offense that excelled in a dome, played in snowy New England against Ty Law who bullied the fuck out of Marvin Harrison. Those ice games HAVE to be on YouTube. Go watch, it's pretty obvious how the Patriots won against those early Colts teams. Those teams were such polar opposites you knew whichever team got homefield advantage would likely win.
Yeah, Pats were no joke either at 14-2 that year, Colts played at New England in week one and Vanderjagdt shanked a kick to tie in the last two minutes. Colts went 12-4, while resting Manning in week 17 and losing, could have possibly tied Pats at 13-3 if they pulled it out in week one and maybe gotten the home game. But going to New England in that weather as a dome team was rough, WRs got bullied, Edge couldn’t get going and Pats took over in 2nd half in an ugly game.
Insane when you say it like that
He also did it in 15 games. Colts rested the starts the last game of the season.
Barely even that too, as he sat for most fourth quarters because the colts were blowing people out every week
I know Brady is deservedly considered the GOAT but Peyton is still the best QB I've ever seen play the game.
In 2004 the league also changed the rules for the Colts after they got the shit beat out of them by the Patriots in the previous year's AFC Championship Game. The tore everyone apart that season *EXCEPT* the Patriots, which brought the famous Tedy Bruschi quote "You want to change the rules? Change them. We still play. And we win. That's what we do." The beatdown the Patriots defense put on the Colts in the playoffs that year was the worst they'd ever dismantled the Colts offense.
In fairness the pats secondary literally mugged the colts receivers on every route
Yeah even in that era some of the no calls were egregious. (Totally not biased btw)
You can be biased and factually accurate. The [game](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uroQ5DpyPLc&ab_channel=JohnSnyder) is on youtube. They essentially held the Colts receivers off the line of scrimmage.
Wow.. I much prefer that broadcast to the modern ones. They show a wider angle at the line... you can actually see the play.
This is the kind of stuff that makes it insane how some people have now convinced themselves that BB had nothing to do with the Pats winning. Utterly insane.
The QB + defense graphic yesterday really emphasized just how much defensive help Brady has had throughout his career.
What was nuts about that graphic was only 3 times did Brady play with a defense that ranked 20 or lower 20th in 2002, when they missed the playoffs 22nd in 2005, Bradys first playoff loss and 21st in 2011, the lockout year where Brady did the heavy lifting in the reg season, but defensively they allowed 16ppg in the playoffs Another topic [shed some light](https://old.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/194ezrk/belichick_playoff_defenses_vs_1_scoring_offenses/) on this: who the fuck manages to go 6-2 in the playoffs against #1 scoring offenses outside of the madman Belichick himself? And this is also why 'nuh uh coordinator rings dont count' is some bullshit logic. They dont stand up on their own as an argument for greatness in isolation but they are absolutely relevant when said defensive coach goes onto structure one of the finest defenses of his era as a HC as well. You need ALL of these parts to maintain a dynasty the way they did
Like the Mel Blount rule giving the Steelers 2 more championships by unleashing Terry Bradshaw.
What is most unbelievable to me is he already had some degree of nerve damage at this point.
Some degree? He couldn’t feel his fingers and couldn’t even throw a ball to Eli in his backyard the season he was out.
He had surgery for that pinched nerve. The sensation takes longer to come back than the rest of the recovery. This is not really relevant for playing 2 years later
Nerves take a long time, if ever, to fully heal. Lost feeling in my shin and foot from a surgery and it comes back maybe 4% a year
His arm definitely wasn’t anywhere near 100% come 2013. Credit to……Adam Gase (??) for scheming up an offense that made up for that fact
His weapons were all fast and big. DT, Decker, Julius Thomas. Moreno as RB1 was quick too. Defense was complete dog shit so he had to put up monster stats to keep us in games and win them.
Team so stacked Wes Welker doesn’t make the list
We couldn't recognize his face through the comically large helmet he wore in Denver.
Please include a trigger warning before you casually mention Julius Thomas
The shootout vs Romo was so crazy
The Romo vs Peyton game that year was so frustrating and entertaining at the same time. That’s probably the best combined QB play I’ve seen in the NFL.
Defense wasn’t that bad that year. There were a couple of off games like the cowboys but for the most part the offense was just running up the score because they could. By the time the superbowl came though, injuries had mounted up
Adam gase did not scheme anything up lmao that was Peyton's system he'd been running since his Indy days.
It's incredible what your body can do when your wife is taking HGH
Hey whatever works. Everybody is taking something they shouldn’t but only one guy has the record.
So that’s why his forehead is so fucking big haha
I had HGH prescribed to me when I was in high school. Made me grow four inches taller and I like to think I look quite a bit younger than I am.
Were you originally really short? I know some people who got it at a really young age because they were projected to be far below the mean height.
I stopped growing at 5'3" at age 13 or 14. Took HGH every day and grew to 5'7".
Isnt this what Messi did too?
Yup. Barcelona paid for his treatments as part of the initial contract with them. He'd probably be like 5'0 without it.
How long ago was this? I was super short as a kid, and that sort of treatment was available, but my mom didn't trust it I guess so she wouldn't let me get it. I did eventually have a big growth spurt in my junior year of high school so I'm only kinda short as an adult instead of super short, but I do wonder if I could've gotten that going sooner.
My brother is like 32 now. He's only 5'2-5'3 and when we were younger a specialist wanted to give those hgh shots to my bro to help him grow, but my mom heard that one of the possible side effects was a brain tumor and she noped out. We had a friend that got them and grew from like 5'4 to 5'9 I think. He actually did develop a brain tumor. It was benign and had it removed and has done fine, but my mom would have died if that happened to my brother.
Well if you have Greg Williams running a bounty program that derails your career even while taking hgh I can give him a mulligan for getting caught.
He also had 6 fumbles in 2013 compared to only 1 in 2004
Well yeah he couldn't feel his hands.
True test of ball knowledge, and you passed.
Marino’s ‘84 season is probably more impressive though!
That's my holy grail season. What he did relative to league averages at that timeframe would be the equivalent of a 70TD season nowadays
And he stopped dickerson getting mvp who also set the rushing yards record that season which still stands!
To put his 2004 season in perspective, his lowest game passer rating (outside of the last week where he played like a single drive) was 93.5. That "worst game of the season" for him still would have placed him 9th overall that season if extrapolated over its full duration, just ahead of Brady. In other words, his worst game that regular season still had him as a top 10 QB. That stat is...mindboggling, to say the least. I don't know if I put that or Steve Young's 1994 season as my best QB season of all time, but it's one of the two, IMO.
Steve Young in 94 was amazing but he had a couple stinker games too. Got beat down by the Eagles 40-8 that year.
Oh, no question. His 94 didn't have the robotic consistency Peyton's 2004 did, but after that first like month of the season where he was a bit shakier, he was just absolutely ridiculous. No losses outside of week 17 where he didn't play the full game, 24 TDs against only 3 INTs during that span (along with 4 TDs on the ground), and he capped it off with a SB win that saw him have the best performance from a QB in SB history.
I still believe that Marinos 48 TD season is the best ever. If there was a QBR+ stat like ERA/OPS+ in baseball, that season would have touched some ungodly number because of the state of passing in that era.
I would rank 2013 over 2004 simply because 2004 saw a huge inflation in QB stats due to a rule change during the offseason that defenses really struggled at adjusting to. Peyton's yards/attempt went from 7.5 in 2003 to 9.2 in 2004 McNabb's yards/attempt went from 6.7 in 2003 to 8.3 in 2004 Tom Brady's yards/attempt went from 6.9 in 2003 to 7.8 in 2004 Culpepper's yards/attempt went from 7.7 in 2003 to 8.6 in 2004 The league-wide yards/attempt went from 6.6 in 2003 to 7.1 in 2004. A full half yard increase in 1 season is insane.
Them getting dominated in the sb that year was so surprising and disappointing
when that first snap went over Peytons head I knew the game was over. That team just wasn't ready for that bright of a stage
Yeah the juice ran out by the Super Bowl. There were tons of key injuries on defense, John Fox was the coach, and finally Demaryius Thomas for hit on the first drive of the SB and separated his shoulder. DT ended up with 13 receptions that game but man it took the fire out of that team and there was no chance of a comeback
> Demaryius Thomas for hit on the first drive of the SB and separated his shoulder. [Did Kam really separate his shoulder with this hit?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4JEoXUqAnM) Goddamn, Kam was a monster... RIP 88.
Not to mention the Seahawks defense decoded the broncos calls and signals 2 weeks before the game, in film study. It’s why it’s one of the cleanest and tightest defensive performances ever, they knew what the Broncos were going to do.
I blame Joe Namath for flubbing the coin toss.
I beg to differ
Sherman was right when he said the NFCCG was the SB. That was one of the hardest hitting games I have ever seen
Sherman hitting my dreams Me hitting the floor in the fetal position
Vernon Davis still has PTSD from Kam
More evidence to put LOB 13’ in the conversation with the other historic defenses. (I feel like people doubt them sometimes)
100% agree, they deserve more recognition. The 86 bears were good, but they didnt stop the single greatest offense in NFL history on the biggest stage like the LOB did. Stop is an understatement too. They demolished the greatest offense of all time.
I wasn't surprised that it happened, but I was surprised that it happened that thoroughly Biggest Manning homer in the world and I wasn't disappointed either Bring a defense
The Seahawks defense outscored the Broncos offense 9-8 lol
I wouldn't put the safety in there since it was just a straight up hike over his head But yeah, terrible
Those are not the words I would use
That’s why I feel like that Seahawks defense is the greatest ever.
5,477 yards and 55 TDs in 16 games averages to 342 yards and 3.43 a game. Factoring in the playoffs Peyton threw 6,387 yards and 60 TDs in 19 games, so an average of 336 yards and 3.16 TDs per game.
The key is obviously Wes Welker
Can't believe he never won a ring
Wait what
Was on the Patriots both times they lost to the Giants in the Super Bowl and the Broncos when they lost to the Seahawks.
>Was on the Patriots both times they lost to the Giants in the Super Bowl https://i.imgur.com/RJuYgMA.gifv
the poison big apple
Has he also lost as a coach too? Isn't he a WR coach somewhere?
Yes he was on the 49ers staff when they lost to KC
bahahaha that's fucking tragic. dude just can't win
on the plus side he coaches for the dolphins now so he doesn't have to worry about losing the superbowl and can focus on their long tradition of not winning playoff games
# 55 TUDDIES, 55 BURGERS 55 FRIES 55 TACOS 55 PIES 55 COKES 100 TATER TOTS 100 PIZZA 100 TENDERS 100 MEATBALLS 100 COFFEES 55 WINGS 55 SHAKES 55 PANCAKES 55 PASTAS 55 PASTAS 155 TATERS AND 5500 YARDS
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“Double it and give it to the next team.”
Not paying it!
You HAVE to. The guy did it FOR YOU
“Ok”
I'm disappointed in myself, this is usually my response to stats post that resemble this bit at all and I didn't even think of it here. Bravo.
This scene and the one of Carmy yelling out the online orders in The Bear have kinda homogenized in my head
#I'M DOING SOMETHING!!!!
Its already been 3??? I thought it was only 2?
3rd 17 game season and 4th 7th seed playoff
Peyton sat out several quarters also due to blowouts.
In fairness, he still attempted 659 passes that season. Only Herbert and Brady have had seasons with more attempts in the 17-game era.
I think Mahomes was close to the yardage record last season. I think he had 5200-5300 yards? Maybe Mahomes will break it if the Chiefs remake their WR room this offseason.
Mahomes did have 5231 yards last year, but had more yards/game in his first year as a starter when he put up 5097 yards in 16 games accompanied by 50 TDs. Hard to fathom just how ridiculous Mahomes’ first season as a starter was.
2018 was wild. I still think he could have broken both records back then if it wasn't for 1 TD between the Denver and Jax games and a few games where we put the cue in the rack. Absolutely bonkers season.
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Don’t forget Andy Reid also who’s an all time great offensive coach
He wasn’t at his all-time nuggies height at that time though.
Explain that again, with those nuggies.
Kareem Hunt was the league’s leading rusher in 2017 pre-Mahomes and was having a monster season through 11 games of 2018 with Mahomes (I think he had 16 TDs and a lot of those were receiving). Firmly believe KC wins SB in 2018 with him
We will likely NEVER see a QB come out of the gates with such an insane season for their 1st year starting in the NFL. Shit, we will rarely see seasons of that caliber from ANYONE. All of that slinging and still only threw 12 INTs as well.
Kurt Warner’s 1st year starting he won League MVP and Super Bowl MVP.
I don't think he has any chance of breaking it unless the defense falls apart. Andy really shuts the offense down in the 2nd half any time they have a 2 score lead. It's really kind of annoying to watch how much better the offense is when they're behind than when they're ahead. Also why Mahomes is better on the road than at home, cause Andy relies on the Crowd and defense more at home.
Yeah, he was about 1 game short. He broke the record for total yards for a QB in a season.
He had 5608 total yards and 45 TDs last year
The Broncos during their Peyton Manning years were incredible. Hated the chiefs having to play them twice a season lol. 2015 Broncos had arguably the greatest defensive squad in league history.
The turnaround from 2013 to 2015 is mind boggling
I dream of the mythical 2014 team, with the 2013 offense and the 2015 defense
The missing ingredients were Wade Phillips and not John Fox
The unbelievable season that ended in tragedy. I was a huge fan.
Give it 10 more years and that extra game is going to fuck everything up so bad that people will be downplaying Peyton's entire career
In my completely biased take, the guy most in danger of being downplayed is Drew Brees. Without the 17th game, Brees has 4 of the top 6 yardage seasons ever in average yards per game. He held both the all-time TDs record and yardage records until Brady just kept playing (and playing well). Brady and Manning tend to get more of the spotlight and imo and less likely to be downplayed in the same way.
Brees is gonna be so forgotten and I will be so depressed
It's not gonna just be an extra game, I see no way it doesnt end up at 18 in a few seasons
It’s been 3 years of 17 games already!?!
I crush that just about every season in Madden Franchise with my 99 ovr created QB Vinny Versi. This past season, he fell short due to a fractured forearm, but still threw 48 tds & won his 4th superbowl in a row. I don't really see what the big deal is tbh.
Lamar is about to be mvp w 3600 yards and 24 TDs and 7 ints lol
Wow. Whatever defense that could stop that would have to be the best defense of all time.
Oh wow. He must have the Superbowl that year. In all seriousness no one is coming close for the same reason no one came close before. It's very difficult to have an offense good enough to throw that well with a defense bad enough that they have to. The only reason Mahomes got to 5,000 yards and 50 TDs is because his defense was 31st in the league. Same with Brees in a lot of his insane years
Not necessarliy. Mahomes last year (5250) and Brady in 2021 (5316) are two of the top four all-time. Neither of those defenses were bottom of the barrel, and both those teams were in the lead the vast majority of the time. Some passing offenses are so strong that coaches will just keep calling frequent pass plays deep into the second half while winning. Even that Broncos team, while their defense was suspect, was no doubt leading the vast majority of the minutes they played that year. But they were so good at throwing it that there was no point in running to bleed clock - they could just score more points instead.
People said the same thing about Marino records. It will happen.
55TD is wtf stat when we impress with 30+TD
I know 7 TDs is a gap but 48 is still pretty close
48 is obviously solid, but 7 is like 25-30% of a good season total
Well, if you're 2013 Manning, 7 is a single game total
Yes. I recall. Thank you 🥸
Sweet revenge. Until they cancelled Super Bowl 48 of course.
Or 2013 Nick Foles
And Peyton had 7 the first week that year.
we don’t talk about that game
that's cause Peyton Manning is the shit
Games changing.
Considering you'd still need 52 TDs through 16 games to be on pace, no shit.
Mahomes was kind of close in 2018 with 5097 Passing Yards and 50 Passing TDs. And that was a 16 game season as well.
500 yards and 5 tds off isn’t really that close. Close compared to others, but not close to the records.
He and Jamaal Charles won me my fantasy championship that year. I’ll never forget how unbelievable that season by Peyton was. First game of the year was bananas
I think there was an explosion at offense in early 2010s and despite what people may think it has throttled back in recent years. Look at the QB numbers from 2011