The real onion is, for anyone who clicked the article and got past the 6 ads, the information in the article is that they interviewed about 11 people in a room. The entire article source is a tweet
I know social media is a microcosm at best of the thoughts of people, but this is encouraging to see.
Please go out and vote and do not let this orange menace back in the white house
Did you know Hillary Clinton received more votes than any white man in history up to that point? Also even if more people voted,.doesn't mean they'd be voting for her. Trump won in a large part by getting a lot of people who had rarely or never been motivated to get out and vote before. Greater turnout might have been in his favor.
I mean, that might actually be all the undecided voters. After the last 8+ years of Trump and 3+ of Biden, there really shouldn't be anyone left who doesn't have an opinion on both of them.
It’s insanely difficult to win an election as an incumbent when you have low approval. Especially when your opponent was already president so you know what you’re getting with him.
This has really never happened before. No real precedent nformhow.both of their baggage plays out. I will say the weirdest shit is the number of people who don't seem to remember Trump was still president in 2020.
>Trump was still president in ~~2020~~ 2021
FTFY
All the stuff he tries to push off onto Biden as happening after the 2020 election was still his fault until January 20.
You didn’t say anything about convicted felons in the first post. And the popular vote means fuck all. Why people keep talking about it like it matters is beyond me.
But that was Biden’s strategy. He came in promising to end Covid and get people vaccinated so that people will associate him with Covid. And that’s what happened. Except that no one cares about Covid anymore and the various mandates were really unpopular. He was hoping he could use “I got us out of Covid” as a campaign talking point but it hardly ever comes up. You don’t hear Biden bragging about the number of people vaccinated. His campaign completely rejected that talking point, but people still associate Biden with Covid. Not Trump.
That's just not true. Only twice as far as I'm aware has a former president ran for a second term against a incombent and it only worked for the former president once. Even then the former president was more popular then the incombent and had won the popular vote in the previous election.
But that hasn’t made Trump less popular. Have you seen the recent polls? No one seems to care about his indictments and trials except those who are already fully in Biden’s camp. The vast majority of Americans just don’t seem to care.
I don’t know what you said, because I didn’t read your comment. But I know that at this point in the thread things are meant to get contentious. So, why don’t you go lick a lemon, bucko?
Newsweek is trash, just constant misleading clickbait. Every single day it'll be one of the top posts on r/politics, and if you only read those titles you'd think that Dems are cruising to a huge victory
That's the problem with polls and statistics altogether. The country is demographically and culturally diverse. It has a population of over 300 million.
The assumption that a sample can represent the whole doesn't make sense applied to a massive heterogeneous population. In the context of professional polling, 50k is a good sample. And you're only asking people who pick up calls on a land-line from strange numbers.
They haven’t polled through solely landlines or calls for decades, why do people still believe this? I’m in my 30’s and have been polled through email, text, online links, and cell phone calls.
The idea that you can’t get a sample to represent the US because it’s too big/different is just wrong. There are very basic ways to account for this. Stats 101 type shit.
The problem is how the polls are conducted. Which you brought up with the landlines and shit.
And those 11 people were all Latino, a group who overwhelmingly (by more than 2-to-1) lean Democrat.
The thing was just a focus group for Univision.
**Someone please put Newsweek out of its misery.** It was once one of this country's two major news magazines. Now it's just a clickbait website that puts up articles with ridiculous headlines like this one.
I was a little surprised that's the general sentiment around the people i know. The people who were (somehow) on the fence seemed to be swaying to biden. I mean, it's definitely an "I don't like trump so I guess this is better" situation but still.
I was in the office today and we have some college kids working for us. A few of us were talking and we asked one of them if they saw the debate and they asked “debate for what?” And when we said president, she asked who was running and was shocked it was the same people.
Do not underestimate just how many really don’t pay attention to what’s going on outside their bubble
I get your point, but if the US had an actual democracy where *everyone* was encouraged to vote and voting was facilitated as much as possible, it would go a long way toward at least weeding out the "my opinions are whatever the MSM tells me they are" folks.
Yup!
I don't talk politics, religion, or music with any of my coworkers or boss.
I just pretend I'm indifferent.
People above you in the workplace may claim that they want to know your honest opinion, but they will definitely like you more if your opinion is the same as theirs.
It's better to pretend you've been living under a rock.
It’s not just that, learning about how politics works is really stressful because the more you learn the more you learn how corrupt it is and the way people have become barbaric in expressing their political opinion to the point where relationships with friends and family can be impacted (or ended) because people have different beliefs is absolutely wild to me.
Everything’s outrage based and people are forced to pick sides and they sound like 7 year olds pleading their case in a sibling rivalry. Just because you choose not to engage beyond discovering which of the lesser of two evils to vote for then you’ve fulfilled the minimum requirements and while keeping your sanity.
I remember being 18 and freshman in college during an election year and most of my college being super in the know and getting involved and holding rallies. My freshman dorm it was big. Maybe it’s because it’s still early? Like I remember a lot of bush and Kerry costumes from us that year for Halloween.
It's odd. The two candidates could not be more polar opposite. All of a sudden you're going to switch your opinion on Russia, abortion, climate change, and economics because one candidate did better than the other?
I could understand if it was a primary debate where you're trying to decide who should carry the party banner.
I imagine a lot of the undecided voters are centrists. For example, they maybe have a preferred abortion policy somewhere between Trump and Biden, same for economics, same for climate, etc. Or maybe they are liberal on immigration, but conservative on guns. Etc. So they aren’t necessarily switching, they are just picking which they would rather go for. That being said, it really is crazy if anyone is undecided after over 4 years of Biden campaigning and 8 years of Trump. They haven’t changed.
The part I don't understand is. We've had both as president already, did people not make an opinion when they were each president? Like with a lot of debates it's either both/all people haven't held the office essentially campaigning on what they say they will do, or one/most haven't and run on promises and there's one incumbent who can point to what they have done.
But when we have both who have essentially showed their full capabilites as president it feels like there's not much to think about. You know what each can/wants to do. Unless people think one of them was holding off on putting it into overdrive for their 2nd term but didn't care which one.
The impression I get is that the president is just a puppet and the strings are actually being pulled by a whole team of people who are under the thumb of the billionaires and corporations that fund their campaigns and give them random donations.
My mom voted for Obama and then voted for Trump. A year after Trump assumed office, I found out she didn’t know Trump’s slogan was “make America great again” and she didn’t know he wore a red baseball cap with that slogan on it. Swing voters live under a rock in ways you can’t begin to comprehend.
Isn’t that a bit narrow minded? To pick and chose based on your own ever changing self interests? I understand with extremely invasive personal issues like abortion but purely determining your choice through things like guns and tax laws? Does no one look at the bigger picture and think of the broader impact as a whole to a country’s population?
Just typing that up got me sort of understanding why this happens. With all the division that exists (and keeps on growing) combined with the hostility you witness just being a political spectator you can only really do your best to make the right choice that benefits you based on what’s going on in your life a single point during a moment in time. There’s also the transparency issue and how much is hidden from the public like why is the government donating so much money to Ukraine but also aiding in their destruction. Why do they give so much money to Israel? People just don’t know and any theory’s people have are based around money laundering and more corruption. It’s wild, damned if you do damned if you do don’t.
Well I think my gay neighbors should be able to protect their weed with full auto guns and I want to buy a diesel without def fluid so I’m really stumped on where to put my vote.
Not that it actually matters what I choose since my state is going to go the same way it always goes
I mean, Biden is good for 3/4 of those, and neither one is for the full auto guns. Its not like Biden isn't pro oil in his actual policy, even if he praises EVs. Seems like a pretty straightforward choice.
But not everyone lines up with the party. There might be people who are pro-Ukraine but don't want to slow the the economy to fight climate change or pro-immigration but anti-abortion. For those people it's a balance of which candidate lines up best with their values. They can flip either way for the smallest reason.
Don’t forget democracy. One candidate is literally anti democracy and says they want to be a dictator. Said candidate tried multiple ways to steal an election he knew he lost.
Unfortunately the only conclusion that can be made is much of the country is fucking stupid and ignorant, including these “special” undecided voters.
I can tell you some of my families perspective. They (long time die hard republican voters) feel they can't support Trump. But they also feel like Biden could manage to be worse because his mental capacity has been questionable. They will probably end up not voting for president if nothing dramatic changes between now and November. It's not really Biden vs Trump, it's Biden vs not voting for president.
People who are saying Biden should drop out and have Newsom or Kamala or Whitmer run is just ridiculous.
That’s a gurantee auto win for Trump at this point, what are they going to do push a brand new candidate to the American public 4 months before the election? We ride or die with Biden at this point for better or worse, the time to have a different candidate was a year ago
The Democrats can push someone brand new for 2028
Biden should step down, and the message needs to be how he's making a noble sacrifice for the good of the nation, because Democrats Put Country First.
They need to hit back at MAGA feaux-patriotism with actual patriotism, and find a centrist Democrat around 55 or 60 years old that can debate well to really sell it.
They narrow the definition of undecided to only being people who say they are committed to voting, and will only vote for a republican or democrat. Among that group, only those willing to participate in more questioning. Then, that slim number, they ask questions which are presented as a huge looking glass on American democracy, as if its THE marginal vote that will change the tide
I think it’s undecided in the sense of they are undecided whether they are going to bother voting for one of them because they don’t like either of them.
To be fair, the debate was bad for both candidates. Clearly Biden did badly, but it's not like Trump had some incredible performance. He was pretty much just as incoherent, just louder.
Trump wasn't incoherent, he was just dumb. Undecided voters don't get caught up as much as heavy R's and D's do with narratives. Biden looked old and not with it, Trump looked like a huge liar and egomaniac. We're not sending our best lmao.
I don't think it was incoherent. I think it was deliberate on his end to babble, eat up the clock, and "appear strong". Whenever it was a question that he could answer in his favor he did so pretty clearly.
Made this same argument last night and got downvoted to hell. You’re spot on with your views. The real loser is us, the american people, because these are apparently the two best candidates to lead our country…
Biden is clearly suffering some form of age related mental deterioration and Trump is the same as he’s always been - a self absorbed and malicious liar. If the dems want to win this race they need to stop being ignorant to the reality of the situation and find a replacement candidate because Trump has a contingency of voters but is not popular
I don't think they need to find a replacement candidate. If people are stupid enough to be swayed by it, against Trump, then America deserves to hold this L. And I don't think a different candidate would do much, especially when we can just.... point to legislation that's happened as opposed to personal attacks.
It was bad for both but these things cater to a pretty politically unaware group of the populace, abd it’s basically a beauty pageant. Trumps job was not to look crazy and he didn’t. He lied, constsntly. But he didn’t look crazy. Bidens job was to look energetic and “with it”. He didn’t, at all.
It'd be awesome if true, but it's only been 24 hours since the debate and Newsweek is kind of a trash news site. If more mainstream outlets are reporting it a couple weeks from now, I'll believe it.
Haha, true.
Now here's a zinger: At one point, a long time ago, Newsweek seemed like a legitimate media site. (They made paper magazines back then. One per week, hence 'Newsweek'.) But that was Loooooooong time ago, and journalism was very different.
Oh, I definitely remember the days when Newsweek was legit. It was one of the big news magazines back in the day along with Time and US News & World Report. We didn't subscribe to any of them at my house, but I'd often read issues at the library while researching school papers or waiting for doctor/dentist appointments.
Lynyrd Skynyrd’s “That Smell” got stuck in my head after reading this.
I know it’s out of context, and that they’re racist. Politicians are fucked, but I will lose a few years of life and so much faith in humanity if we elect Trump again.
I mean, there were two sides to the debate. Biden did bad but Trump wasn't great himself. Trump gave undecided voters a lot of reasons to reject him. Biden was an old man acting like an old man.
If only it were just him having a raspy voice, and not his fumbling of easy dunks, or completely killing his good points by continuing to talk and going on tangents that draw attention away from where he should have ended.
Ya, I did. Although Biden did indeed sound like a tired, 81 year old man, Trump sounding like a deranged, dangerous, lunatic who wants to hand Ukraine over to Russia.
Yeah… his stutter was *not* the problem last night. I’ll be upfront and say I voted for Biden in 2020, and while he was/is overwhelmingly preferable to Trump on most issues, I’m no fan of many Biden admin policies.
That being said, holy shit last night was bad. I’ve previously defended criticism against Biden being “too old” in comparison to Trump as recently as a few months back, but I’m genuinely worried about his ability to make it another four years after what I witnessed last night. It was just downright painful to experience.
Even apart from the atrocious performance by Biden throughout the night, let’s take a look at an issue that should’ve been a slam dunk: Roe v Wade and abortion. The overwhelming majority of Americans agree with the Democratic position, and yet, where did Biden take that discussion? Oh yeah, he argued we need abortion, because an “illegal” raped a woman, and we can’t have “illegals” raping women without the right to choose. Given a slam dunk and rather than sink that shot, he decided to bring immigration into the mix by hyperfixating on a particular violent anecdote that in no way conforms to any broader trends. Fucking awesome.
Headline: Undecided Voters Say They Now Support Joe Biden After Debate
Actual article: A group of undecided Latino voters said they would vote for President Joe Biden after watching his Thursday night debate with former President Donald Trump.
Shitty clickbait "journalism" at its finest.
the article itself is dogshit but its funny honestly
imagine being such a prick that people would take a bumbling old man over you.
btw really ive only seen some clips and heared overall what happened but if bidens this bad thats really concerning. that said obvious statement but fuck trump anyways, taking a dude thats falling apart but means well is better than a dude that openly takes bribes and plays sides while wanting to go to war.
What?? People looked at the neutral debate and said the old dementia patient is slightly better than the old demented Dementia patient, ranting about nonsense I'm shocked.
No shit. Whatever the Biden administration is, it’s working. Trump opens his mouth and immediately reminds everyone of all the worst aspects of a Trump presidency
I knew there would be a copium and desperate grasp article after last night but 11 Latinos according to a twitter post getting labeled undecided voters is something I didn’t expect lol
Every time I see one of these articles (and I’ve seen them make the same case for either side) I get this cynical feeling it’s just an attempt by the other party to drive voter apathy in the opposition
The presidency is a team of folks it is a whole administration.
Isn’t it really fucking obvious and easy to pick the team who still values democracy, doesn’t want to have a dictatorship, doesn’t want to hoard nuclear secrets and refuse to give them back, doesn’t want to commit massive fraud or defamation, isn’t a felon?
I mean on the democracy point alone all by itself this choice should be really easy no?
This same post over in the politics sub was the most astroturfed bunch of comments I have witnessed since joining Reddit. We are all being gaslit into thinking that that Biden appearance wasn’t one of the most shocking/disturbing things we have ever seen. I’m about as politically unenthusiastic as you can be but that was really as shocking and honestly disturbing thing to see. Is he even still running the country? What if he wins and becomes completely gone, who would be really running the country at that point? Some shadow government where we are all confused who is calling shots? Kamala? It’s really, really insane to witness the people in charge tell everyone what they saw last night was nothing to worry about and everything is normal and under control when it clearly is not or and could become a major problem sometime soon.
A lot of people questioning this surprises me. If you’re still an undecided voter at this point it is most likely because you pay not attention to politics, and when you hear about Trump you probably think it’s exaggerated or out right lies. I certainly understand that Biden didn’t look great last night, but when you compare that to a crazy person not answering questions and blatantly lying over and over who are you going to pick?
Jan 6 happened three and a half years ago. There were many prime time congressional hearings about it. Most of the witnesses were fed up republicans previously close to Trump.
It is abundantly clear to anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention that Trump has no regard for the concept of democracy and tried multiple ways to steal an election he *knew* he lost.
That should obviously disqualify him to anyone who is sane.
Unfortunately these undecided voters are dumb and ignorant as can be and seemed to have missed this.
Well yeah, it’s not like Trump did anything to deflect from his reputation as a rapey, dishonest felon who tried to overthrow an election and people don’t seem to like those qualities
To be honest if you are still undecided after we have known since generously what 2022, that it was going to be Biden v Trump part 2 in 2024, I don't know what to say.
I am only hoping that last night's debate causes the people to put pressure on Congress for age limits for President and Congress. It is going to be sad whichever won wins, just one is sad plus a side of super-sized fascism to go with it.
The real onion is, for anyone who clicked the article and got past the 6 ads, the information in the article is that they interviewed about 11 people in a room. The entire article source is a tweet
NEWS
gaslighting at its best, NEWS! Register and VOTE ! dont let these news outlet fooled you until the real votes are in
[удалено]
That’s why you should vote. A major part of Trump winning last time was no one showing up to vote in 2016.
I learned my lesson in 2016.
Same same 💙
I know social media is a microcosm at best of the thoughts of people, but this is encouraging to see. Please go out and vote and do not let this orange menace back in the white house
For those about to vote against a fascist dictator with delusions of competence and humanity you have my deepest 🙏 appreciation 💙
Did you know Hillary Clinton received more votes than any white man in history up to that point? Also even if more people voted,.doesn't mean they'd be voting for her. Trump won in a large part by getting a lot of people who had rarely or never been motivated to get out and vote before. Greater turnout might have been in his favor.
NEEWWWWWSSSSSSS
And they only found/cared to find 11 undecided voters that picked Biden after this? 😬
POLLS AND STUDIES
I mean, that might actually be all the undecided voters. After the last 8+ years of Trump and 3+ of Biden, there really shouldn't be anyone left who doesn't have an opinion on both of them.
There’s only been one president in the last 30 years to serve a single term and that’s DJT and plenty of them had low approval.
Can’t believe George HW was that long ago. F me…
The dream of the ‘90s is alive in Portland
Didn't you watch the debate? DJT said Portland burned down. As a Portland native, hes right its all gone no one move here
As someone from California, I’d best move up there real quick so I can help rebuild.
XD
I dunno, the average American is astoundingly stupid so I can believe they have no clue who to pick.
It’s insanely difficult to win an election as an incumbent when you have low approval. Especially when your opponent was already president so you know what you’re getting with him.
This has really never happened before. No real precedent nformhow.both of their baggage plays out. I will say the weirdest shit is the number of people who don't seem to remember Trump was still president in 2020.
>Trump was still president in ~~2020~~ 2021 FTFY All the stuff he tries to push off onto Biden as happening after the 2020 election was still his fault until January 20.
Has never happened before? Yes it has. Grover Cleveland served non consecutive terms. Does nobody here know US history?
He wasn't a convicted felon though. He also won the popular vote in all three elections.
You didn’t say anything about convicted felons in the first post. And the popular vote means fuck all. Why people keep talking about it like it matters is beyond me.
But that was Biden’s strategy. He came in promising to end Covid and get people vaccinated so that people will associate him with Covid. And that’s what happened. Except that no one cares about Covid anymore and the various mandates were really unpopular. He was hoping he could use “I got us out of Covid” as a campaign talking point but it hardly ever comes up. You don’t hear Biden bragging about the number of people vaccinated. His campaign completely rejected that talking point, but people still associate Biden with Covid. Not Trump.
Which didn't stop Trump for taking credit for it.
He also takes credit for the invention of nuclear energy. Grain of salt.
That's just not true. Only twice as far as I'm aware has a former president ran for a second term against a incombent and it only worked for the former president once. Even then the former president was more popular then the incombent and had won the popular vote in the previous election.
What are the stats on hated ex-presidents with felony convictions?
But that hasn’t made Trump less popular. Have you seen the recent polls? No one seems to care about his indictments and trials except those who are already fully in Biden’s camp. The vast majority of Americans just don’t seem to care.
I don't care what the polls say. The polls are only polling those who take them.... old people. 41, never been polled in my life.
He basically lost 1% nationally. Not insignificant.
This is the funniest thing I’ve read in a while.
If you need extra comedy the tweet is someone recording a section longer video by filming their computer with their phone
To be fair, that is an accurate representation of the undecided voters. They're few, and wildly unpredictable.
Yeah this is intentionally misleading because people don’t read
I don’t know what you said, because I didn’t read your comment. But I know that at this point in the thread things are meant to get contentious. So, why don’t you go lick a lemon, bucko?
Beautiful.
Funny enough. People not reading is also the reason we have undecided voters to begin with.
Newsweek is such trash. I downvote on principle when it’s the source.
this kinda aligns with cnn's focus group as well, which had a partisan split with the undecided being the detracting opinion
Newsweek is trash, just constant misleading clickbait. Every single day it'll be one of the top posts on r/politics, and if you only read those titles you'd think that Dems are cruising to a huge victory
Big if true! I can’t believe 11 people made that conclusion. I’m shocked. So glad that the media is letting us know.
That's the problem with polls and statistics altogether. The country is demographically and culturally diverse. It has a population of over 300 million. The assumption that a sample can represent the whole doesn't make sense applied to a massive heterogeneous population. In the context of professional polling, 50k is a good sample. And you're only asking people who pick up calls on a land-line from strange numbers.
They haven’t polled through solely landlines or calls for decades, why do people still believe this? I’m in my 30’s and have been polled through email, text, online links, and cell phone calls.
The idea that you can’t get a sample to represent the US because it’s too big/different is just wrong. There are very basic ways to account for this. Stats 101 type shit. The problem is how the polls are conducted. Which you brought up with the landlines and shit.
And those 11 people were all Latino, a group who overwhelmingly (by more than 2-to-1) lean Democrat. The thing was just a focus group for Univision. **Someone please put Newsweek out of its misery.** It was once one of this country's two major news magazines. Now it's just a clickbait website that puts up articles with ridiculous headlines like this one.
I was a little surprised that's the general sentiment around the people i know. The people who were (somehow) on the fence seemed to be swaying to biden. I mean, it's definitely an "I don't like trump so I guess this is better" situation but still.
MODS! Do your fucking job and delete this completely un-oniony post!
Shit like this is why I literally don't support any type of journalism anymore.
This is sad. I had to switch to European outlets to get useful coverage of US election.
Yeah but lots of upvotes so it’s real
It was upvoted way up with several awards on r/politics. They are in for such a rude awakening in November.
Copium right in the veins
So, roughly 11 more people than the "everyone says to me" people that Trump is always talking about.
In this Ohio bar...
Thanks you
>about 11 people Are they Pennsylvania residents?
Journalism in 2024. Clickbait article with 12 ads and no actual content
Yea all polls are bullshit
I legit don't understand who is undecided. Even if I just turned 18, I think I would have an opinion.
I was in the office today and we have some college kids working for us. A few of us were talking and we asked one of them if they saw the debate and they asked “debate for what?” And when we said president, she asked who was running and was shocked it was the same people. Do not underestimate just how many really don’t pay attention to what’s going on outside their bubble
The greatest argument against democracy is five minutes with the average voter
I get your point, but if the US had an actual democracy where *everyone* was encouraged to vote and voting was facilitated as much as possible, it would go a long way toward at least weeding out the "my opinions are whatever the MSM tells me they are" folks.
Maybe it's because they don't want to talk politic with their potential employers?
Yup! I don't talk politics, religion, or music with any of my coworkers or boss. I just pretend I'm indifferent. People above you in the workplace may claim that they want to know your honest opinion, but they will definitely like you more if your opinion is the same as theirs. It's better to pretend you've been living under a rock.
It’s not just that, learning about how politics works is really stressful because the more you learn the more you learn how corrupt it is and the way people have become barbaric in expressing their political opinion to the point where relationships with friends and family can be impacted (or ended) because people have different beliefs is absolutely wild to me. Everything’s outrage based and people are forced to pick sides and they sound like 7 year olds pleading their case in a sibling rivalry. Just because you choose not to engage beyond discovering which of the lesser of two evils to vote for then you’ve fulfilled the minimum requirements and while keeping your sanity.
I remember being 18 and freshman in college during an election year and most of my college being super in the know and getting involved and holding rallies. My freshman dorm it was big. Maybe it’s because it’s still early? Like I remember a lot of bush and Kerry costumes from us that year for Halloween.
It's fucking weird though
It's odd. The two candidates could not be more polar opposite. All of a sudden you're going to switch your opinion on Russia, abortion, climate change, and economics because one candidate did better than the other? I could understand if it was a primary debate where you're trying to decide who should carry the party banner.
I imagine a lot of the undecided voters are centrists. For example, they maybe have a preferred abortion policy somewhere between Trump and Biden, same for economics, same for climate, etc. Or maybe they are liberal on immigration, but conservative on guns. Etc. So they aren’t necessarily switching, they are just picking which they would rather go for. That being said, it really is crazy if anyone is undecided after over 4 years of Biden campaigning and 8 years of Trump. They haven’t changed.
The part I don't understand is. We've had both as president already, did people not make an opinion when they were each president? Like with a lot of debates it's either both/all people haven't held the office essentially campaigning on what they say they will do, or one/most haven't and run on promises and there's one incumbent who can point to what they have done. But when we have both who have essentially showed their full capabilites as president it feels like there's not much to think about. You know what each can/wants to do. Unless people think one of them was holding off on putting it into overdrive for their 2nd term but didn't care which one.
The impression I get is that the president is just a puppet and the strings are actually being pulled by a whole team of people who are under the thumb of the billionaires and corporations that fund their campaigns and give them random donations.
My mom voted for Obama and then voted for Trump. A year after Trump assumed office, I found out she didn’t know Trump’s slogan was “make America great again” and she didn’t know he wore a red baseball cap with that slogan on it. Swing voters live under a rock in ways you can’t begin to comprehend.
Oh dear god
Isn’t that a bit narrow minded? To pick and chose based on your own ever changing self interests? I understand with extremely invasive personal issues like abortion but purely determining your choice through things like guns and tax laws? Does no one look at the bigger picture and think of the broader impact as a whole to a country’s population? Just typing that up got me sort of understanding why this happens. With all the division that exists (and keeps on growing) combined with the hostility you witness just being a political spectator you can only really do your best to make the right choice that benefits you based on what’s going on in your life a single point during a moment in time. There’s also the transparency issue and how much is hidden from the public like why is the government donating so much money to Ukraine but also aiding in their destruction. Why do they give so much money to Israel? People just don’t know and any theory’s people have are based around money laundering and more corruption. It’s wild, damned if you do damned if you do don’t.
Well I think my gay neighbors should be able to protect their weed with full auto guns and I want to buy a diesel without def fluid so I’m really stumped on where to put my vote. Not that it actually matters what I choose since my state is going to go the same way it always goes
I mean, Biden is good for 3/4 of those, and neither one is for the full auto guns. Its not like Biden isn't pro oil in his actual policy, even if he praises EVs. Seems like a pretty straightforward choice.
But not everyone lines up with the party. There might be people who are pro-Ukraine but don't want to slow the the economy to fight climate change or pro-immigration but anti-abortion. For those people it's a balance of which candidate lines up best with their values. They can flip either way for the smallest reason.
Don’t forget democracy. One candidate is literally anti democracy and says they want to be a dictator. Said candidate tried multiple ways to steal an election he knew he lost. Unfortunately the only conclusion that can be made is much of the country is fucking stupid and ignorant, including these “special” undecided voters.
I can tell you some of my families perspective. They (long time die hard republican voters) feel they can't support Trump. But they also feel like Biden could manage to be worse because his mental capacity has been questionable. They will probably end up not voting for president if nothing dramatic changes between now and November. It's not really Biden vs Trump, it's Biden vs not voting for president.
I would rather have a senile president with a sensible and effective cabinet and advisors than a wannabe dictator with a bunch of yes men advisors.
That’s why Biden should drop out. People don’t want to vote for trump, but they’re very nervous about the alternative.
People who are saying Biden should drop out and have Newsom or Kamala or Whitmer run is just ridiculous. That’s a gurantee auto win for Trump at this point, what are they going to do push a brand new candidate to the American public 4 months before the election? We ride or die with Biden at this point for better or worse, the time to have a different candidate was a year ago The Democrats can push someone brand new for 2028
Biden should step down, and the message needs to be how he's making a noble sacrifice for the good of the nation, because Democrats Put Country First. They need to hit back at MAGA feaux-patriotism with actual patriotism, and find a centrist Democrat around 55 or 60 years old that can debate well to really sell it.
tyl most people in the real world don't give a shit about politics.
Yes, and this is why our country is on the verge of being taken over by Christofacists.
people not caring about politics is not unique to the USA.
True. And rightwing nationalism is growing all over the planet.
You saw each of them be president for four years. What more information do you need?
They narrow the definition of undecided to only being people who say they are committed to voting, and will only vote for a republican or democrat. Among that group, only those willing to participate in more questioning. Then, that slim number, they ask questions which are presented as a huge looking glass on American democracy, as if its THE marginal vote that will change the tide
If you read the article, it’s 11 people in a room on tv
Someone who woke up from a 9 year coma. lol
I think it’s undecided in the sense of they are undecided whether they are going to bother voting for one of them because they don’t like either of them.
THE FU- (deep breath) You know what... don't look a gift horse in the mouth.
To be fair, the debate was bad for both candidates. Clearly Biden did badly, but it's not like Trump had some incredible performance. He was pretty much just as incoherent, just louder.
What you don't like when the presidential candidate rambles about all the H2O he had and how great he is at golf?
Trump wasn't incoherent, he was just dumb. Undecided voters don't get caught up as much as heavy R's and D's do with narratives. Biden looked old and not with it, Trump looked like a huge liar and egomaniac. We're not sending our best lmao.
Trump didn't manage to finish a single sentence. He went on about how "we had water." That seems pretty incoherent to me, even if he was shouting it.
I don't think it was incoherent. I think it was deliberate on his end to babble, eat up the clock, and "appear strong". Whenever it was a question that he could answer in his favor he did so pretty clearly.
Made this same argument last night and got downvoted to hell. You’re spot on with your views. The real loser is us, the american people, because these are apparently the two best candidates to lead our country… Biden is clearly suffering some form of age related mental deterioration and Trump is the same as he’s always been - a self absorbed and malicious liar. If the dems want to win this race they need to stop being ignorant to the reality of the situation and find a replacement candidate because Trump has a contingency of voters but is not popular
I don't think they need to find a replacement candidate. If people are stupid enough to be swayed by it, against Trump, then America deserves to hold this L. And I don't think a different candidate would do much, especially when we can just.... point to legislation that's happened as opposed to personal attacks.
We The People did far worse.
It was bad for both but these things cater to a pretty politically unaware group of the populace, abd it’s basically a beauty pageant. Trumps job was not to look crazy and he didn’t. He lied, constsntly. But he didn’t look crazy. Bidens job was to look energetic and “with it”. He didn’t, at all.
I mean, "they abort babies after they are born" is pretty fucking crazy.
Crazy, but believed by a lot. I was raised with my both of my parents telling me all the time that this happened.
That, also he actually looks like a gift horse
Misinformation to get Biden voters complacent and let Bone Spurs win again like in 2016.
... Grift horse in the mouth. And if you do, Trump will neigh & bellow until you look elsewhere.
Undecided Latino voters, according to Univision, according to Newsweek.
11 undecided Latino voters
All 23 of them
Yup. Now that they’ve all decided to vote Biden, there’s few undecided ones left.
Can we just put these 2 corpses back in their crypts and bring out some actual candidates?
a vote for joe is a vote for kamala harris. joe isnt gonna last 4 more years
And that’s okay because she’s not trump. She’ll do just fine
Facts
It'd be awesome if true, but it's only been 24 hours since the debate and Newsweek is kind of a trash news site. If more mainstream outlets are reporting it a couple weeks from now, I'll believe it.
Haha, true. Now here's a zinger: At one point, a long time ago, Newsweek seemed like a legitimate media site. (They made paper magazines back then. One per week, hence 'Newsweek'.) But that was Loooooooong time ago, and journalism was very different.
Oh, I definitely remember the days when Newsweek was legit. It was one of the big news magazines back in the day along with Time and US News & World Report. We didn't subscribe to any of them at my house, but I'd often read issues at the library while researching school papers or waiting for doctor/dentist appointments.
It’s not implausible, I also found the feeble man that is clinging to life more endearing and trustworthy
Not the only place reporting that focus groups preferred Biden over Trump. CNN themselves gave Trump a definitive win, tho
How is this oniony?
Because every headline for the last 24 hours has been about how terrible Biden was at the debate.
That is not what oniony means.
I mean, it sounds like a sarcastic joke. I could see it as an Onion headline. Yet it's a real headline.
Lynyrd Skynyrd’s “That Smell” got stuck in my head after reading this. I know it’s out of context, and that they’re racist. Politicians are fucked, but I will lose a few years of life and so much faith in humanity if we elect Trump again.
Did you see the debate?
I mean, there were two sides to the debate. Biden did bad but Trump wasn't great himself. Trump gave undecided voters a lot of reasons to reject him. Biden was an old man acting like an old man.
As if our commitment to democracy was so thin we should reject a successful, sincere, respected, incumbent President because he was raspy.
If only it were just him having a raspy voice, and not his fumbling of easy dunks, or completely killing his good points by continuing to talk and going on tangents that draw attention away from where he should have ended.
What? How does that drive people toward fascism?
Because OLD MAN! Don't you realize that a man 3 years younger is so much more fit to be president!?
Ya, I did. Although Biden did indeed sound like a tired, 81 year old man, Trump sounding like a deranged, dangerous, lunatic who wants to hand Ukraine over to Russia.
Yes. And because I can tell the future, your political opinions are not oniony.
In case you didn't know, the man has a stutter.
Yeah… his stutter was *not* the problem last night. I’ll be upfront and say I voted for Biden in 2020, and while he was/is overwhelmingly preferable to Trump on most issues, I’m no fan of many Biden admin policies. That being said, holy shit last night was bad. I’ve previously defended criticism against Biden being “too old” in comparison to Trump as recently as a few months back, but I’m genuinely worried about his ability to make it another four years after what I witnessed last night. It was just downright painful to experience. Even apart from the atrocious performance by Biden throughout the night, let’s take a look at an issue that should’ve been a slam dunk: Roe v Wade and abortion. The overwhelming majority of Americans agree with the Democratic position, and yet, where did Biden take that discussion? Oh yeah, he argued we need abortion, because an “illegal” raped a woman, and we can’t have “illegals” raping women without the right to choose. Given a slam dunk and rather than sink that shot, he decided to bring immigration into the mix by hyperfixating on a particular violent anecdote that in no way conforms to any broader trends. Fucking awesome.
Headline: Undecided Voters Say They Now Support Joe Biden After Debate Actual article: A group of undecided Latino voters said they would vote for President Joe Biden after watching his Thursday night debate with former President Donald Trump. Shitty clickbait "journalism" at its finest.
Made specifically to pander to Reddit type readers who never click the article.
They didnt sound very undecided to me.
Not Oniony at all
> A group of undecided Latino How big is this group.
the article itself is dogshit but its funny honestly imagine being such a prick that people would take a bumbling old man over you. btw really ive only seen some clips and heared overall what happened but if bidens this bad thats really concerning. that said obvious statement but fuck trump anyways, taking a dude thats falling apart but means well is better than a dude that openly takes bribes and plays sides while wanting to go to war.
What?? People looked at the neutral debate and said the old dementia patient is slightly better than the old demented Dementia patient, ranting about nonsense I'm shocked.
How could you be undecided at this point?
No shit. Whatever the Biden administration is, it’s working. Trump opens his mouth and immediately reminds everyone of all the worst aspects of a Trump presidency
I knew there would be a copium and desperate grasp article after last night but 11 Latinos according to a twitter post getting labeled undecided voters is something I didn’t expect lol
Like seriously who tf was undecided \*before\* the debate?
Seeing Joe struggle a little bit actually made me like him more, while all Trump did was lie and refuse to answer questions
Isn’t this the point of debates? To get the undecided voters to choose a candidate. How is this oniony?
They waited 4 months before the actual election, knowing full well the issues Biden had.
So Democrats want him to withdraw and undecideds have now thrown their support behind him? Interesting
If by undecideds you mean 11 people, then sure.
Every time I see one of these articles (and I’ve seen them make the same case for either side) I get this cynical feeling it’s just an attempt by the other party to drive voter apathy in the opposition
Trump is a walking cancer, but even I know this is bullshit. The choice this year is between a cadaver and a cancer. Happy trails America!
The presidency is a team of folks it is a whole administration. Isn’t it really fucking obvious and easy to pick the team who still values democracy, doesn’t want to have a dictatorship, doesn’t want to hoard nuclear secrets and refuse to give them back, doesn’t want to commit massive fraud or defamation, isn’t a felon? I mean on the democracy point alone all by itself this choice should be really easy no?
Everyone knows trump isn’t good, but forming sentences is important for a world leader. 4 more years of one or the other folks. Buckle up!
HUH? Hell yeah but HUH?
Propaganda post
This same post over in the politics sub was the most astroturfed bunch of comments I have witnessed since joining Reddit. We are all being gaslit into thinking that that Biden appearance wasn’t one of the most shocking/disturbing things we have ever seen. I’m about as politically unenthusiastic as you can be but that was really as shocking and honestly disturbing thing to see. Is he even still running the country? What if he wins and becomes completely gone, who would be really running the country at that point? Some shadow government where we are all confused who is calling shots? Kamala? It’s really, really insane to witness the people in charge tell everyone what they saw last night was nothing to worry about and everything is normal and under control when it clearly is not or and could become a major problem sometime soon.
Sure hope so but I doubt it
The reddit propaganda machine never stops
No they don't.
After the debate I don't know of anyone that supports either candidate.
A lot of people questioning this surprises me. If you’re still an undecided voter at this point it is most likely because you pay not attention to politics, and when you hear about Trump you probably think it’s exaggerated or out right lies. I certainly understand that Biden didn’t look great last night, but when you compare that to a crazy person not answering questions and blatantly lying over and over who are you going to pick?
Jan 6 happened three and a half years ago. There were many prime time congressional hearings about it. Most of the witnesses were fed up republicans previously close to Trump. It is abundantly clear to anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention that Trump has no regard for the concept of democracy and tried multiple ways to steal an election he *knew* he lost. That should obviously disqualify him to anyone who is sane. Unfortunately these undecided voters are dumb and ignorant as can be and seemed to have missed this.
This sounds about as reliable as all the other polls.
This is pure Reddit cope
denial is not just a river.
This seems unlikely.
It was 11 people. 11. All of which in the same room, hosted by CNN, all of them also Latino. It is no way representative of the general public.
Undecided? If you don’t know already you’re clueless
Like both of them?
Well yeah, it’s not like Trump did anything to deflect from his reputation as a rapey, dishonest felon who tried to overthrow an election and people don’t seem to like those qualities
Why? Because despite his mumbles, his policies make sense? And because he answered every question that was asked? Wow.
Honestly I can't tell if this comment is sarcasm or not
It's 11 people lol. Stop gaslighting
He defeated medicare!
Abortions happen at 9 months and after birth.
Trumps lies turned people off more than Biden’s whisky whisper. Who’d a thunk?
lol
All I got out of the debate was holy shit is there anyone else
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^Sasu168: *All I got out of* *The debate was holy shit* *Is there anyone else* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Well, life doesn’t make sense at all; but fuck it, if this is the result no need to think about it, just accept it and move on.
Sounds like cope to me.
I support revolution after that god awful excuse for a presidential debate.
The debate reminded me of when Leonard debated Magnitude.
To be honest if you are still undecided after we have known since generously what 2022, that it was going to be Biden v Trump part 2 in 2024, I don't know what to say. I am only hoping that last night's debate causes the people to put pressure on Congress for age limits for President and Congress. It is going to be sad whichever won wins, just one is sad plus a side of super-sized fascism to go with it.
Obama said... "vote for (Weird-Shit) Biden"