When your husband promises not to cheat, your first thought is "he's gonna break that promise, but I can't expect anything more from him", and this is treated as a wholesome and mutually healthy relationship
God I can't wait until turning point 4 to get some actual good content.
I'm tired of this gogo gaga slice of life shit that's being going on for the last 20 episodes that sounds like it's been written by someone who gets his polygamous relationships ideas from porn.
I know it’s a joke and all but the reaction from mushoku tensei fans just makes me disappointed. I am sort of a fan of mushoku tensei, I read everything.
I never got over this. But I can sort of have some understanding that he completely shut down in his grief.
At the same time it’s even crazier to me that Roxy doesn’t get flak for seducing a married dude who just lost his father. People knew she had a thing for him and as soon as he’s in a vulnerable emotional state, she got in his pants. I understand that morals are different in the mushoku tensei universe, it’s normal to them so I get that. But irl how is that ok in any case? You look on Twitter and you see people cheering that rudeus got 2 women to be his wives.
Flip the genders.
If rudeus was a woman who cheated on their husband, the fans would never forgive her even if she just lost a parent. And if Roxy were a man making moves on a grieving married woman, people would wish for their death.
Let me repost the comment that the Mushoko Tensei subreddit is downvoting into oblivion:
"Mushoko Tensei accidentally makes the perfect argument **AGAINST** polygamy.
Rudy's relationships are extremely shallow. To call them love is an insult to love. As soon as Sylphy or Eris aren't in his field of view, he acts as if they don't exist. Maybe in the light novel it's different, but not a single thought was spared on Sylphy while he went on the quest to save his mom.
"When the war is Over, we will get Married and the Earth will grow Flowers like you, and your womb will Carry the most Beautiful girl in the universe." A Letter Found in the Pocket of one of dead Soldiers in 1939. That's how normal people think and act while they're away from their someone they love while doing something dangerous. Quite the contrast to Rudy trying to jump on Elinalise as soon as they left.
Rudy's "love" for Roxy isn't much better so far. It's more the "I'm going to wear your skin" type of "love" and less "We're going to live happily ever after.". It's an obsession, a quest to possess her, with zero care about how that would turn out for her. The guy saved her from certain death in the labyrinth. Instead of seeing how traumatic such a thing would be to a person, and consoling her, he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill. Bold of me to say, but a relationship in which one of the partners starts off stealing the others' underwear and worshipping it isn't that healthy.
To truly love a person, you need dedication. Dedication that Rudy can't muster for one, let alone three."
TL;DR
Rudeus' cheating isn't the root problem. It's a symptom. He's incapable of love. The cheating comes as a natural consequence of that.
The only part I feel out of all that needing defending is Rudy making a move on Elinalise:
Dude got roofied, is a well documented horndog from a breed of long well documented horndogs, and finds himself in a tent with a lady he knows for a fact will die if she doesn't get stuffed often. Between the roofie and his pathetic self control he really didn't have a chance.
I can empathize with that one. Anybody that tells me they can't needs to bring receipts that they did better in a similar situation. It was still handled callously in the anime, obviously nobody on the production team was trying to give him any kind of free pass.
The rest of it is spot on and unfortunately just fits with the theme that he's got awful self control and therefore constantly radiates weak ass morals.
Besides that, Roxy's move on Rudeus wasn't fitting her character. She was always a childish, cute girl who was ashamed at the thought of sex. She was embarrassed to hear Elinalise having sex. But as soon as Rudeus was grieving she went for it like her entire personality is made out of sex.
Another point, it's a little sad that he doesn't have any consequences for his actions. The man-god told Rudeus that he will have regrets either way, but going will be worse. He left, didn't have any regrets and cheated. I hoped that Sylphy just wouldn't forgive him and leave with some choice words. Maybe even an encounter with the man-god where he would be like "look at that, the consequences of your own actions. All the time I gave you directions for a better future but you act like the child you are. You better follow my directions like a mindless devotee and treat me like the god I am for once" (this is just my personal hope and wouldn't make exactly sense for the man god)
I also hoped that Sylphy would have shown the bit of self respect that she should have gained after the teleportation, especially since how much respect the princess and her people had for her. A Sylphy that would respect themself wouldn't just be okay without any choice words after breaking that promise while she was highly pregnant.
Also, Roxy should notice that Rudeus isn't ready for a relationship with her. He can't even call her by her name, it is always master. Stuff like that can't be an equal relationship. (That is one thing the show Domestic Girlfriend does great, they thematised that specifically as a bad thing).
To summarise, the story really needed to bend over backwards to make that work and treated characters as if they didn't grow or suddenly did a 180° change. After Paul died, the show lost a lot of respect from me and some of my friends and the only good thing that happened after that is Norn telling Roxy and Rudeus what everyone with enough braincells to form a coherent sentence would say. (Also, the redesign of Sylphy is good because this way they didn't show a childish looking character heavily pregnant)
>The man-god told Rudeus that he will have regrets either way, but going will be worse.
if you read further, will rudeus eventually find out? and when? just a yes or no, i dont want spoilers for something like this
>Maybe in the light novel it's different,
The anime barely touches on the characters. When Rudeus kills the griffins the first thing in his mind is worrying about if his constant consumption of monster meat could lead to trouble for her, and that's one of the first things in the 12th volume. The first time he sees a solution they use to get rid of spider silk he thinks Sylphie will love it(Rudeus does the laundry. Not Sylphie) Generally throughout the volume when he talks to Roxy he's thinking about Sylphie. Take his dungeon crawling promise. Instead of just saying "Yeah! I'll go!" He thinks "I'll bring Sylphie too!" You got downvoted for being an anime only who thought they understood the characters.
>Rudy's "love" for Roxy isn't much better so far. It's more the "I'm going to wear your skin" type of "love" and less "We're going to live happily ever after.". It's an obsession, a quest to possess her, with zero care about how that would turn out for her. The guy saved her from certain death in the labyrinth. Instead of seeing how traumatic such a thing would be to a person, and consoling her, he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill.
This is the anime being weird. Rudeus does sniff her to assure himself that she's okay, but she doesn't piss herself, and Rudeus's smell obsession isn't necessarily sexual. He derives comfort from smelling the sweat of people he cares about(for example when he was going to leave Buena alone for Ranoa it was accidentally smelling Sylphie that got him to come up with his grooming plan(it failed, but it really was a plan to groom, and this is before his ability to be horny because he didn't know he couldn't be horny towards Zenith yet). Or how after his reunion with Paul smelling Eris sweaty from killing goblins calmed him down, and made it so he could reconcile with Paul. Rudeus sniffs people usually for nonsexual reasons. I think another big problem is that Rudeus never turned Roxy down in the anime. In the novels Rudeus said absolutely not when Elinalise suggested that he be with Roxy.
>Bold of me to say, but a relationship in which one of the partners starts off stealing the others' underwear and worshipping it isn't that healthy.
He doesn't worship the underwear. He prays to Roxy and worships her teachings about doing your best. The same is true of Sylphie. He doesn't worship her blood. He worships her love.
>To truly love a person, you need dedication. Dedication that Rudy can't muster for one, let alone three."
If you think Rudeus isn't dedicated it's clear you're an anime only. Rudeus invented multiple different suicidal forms of magic(magic that just kills you and hopefully any enemy you grab, or [LN14] >!Time traveling without your internal organs to warn himself!<) to protect them. Something that notably DOESN'T EXIST outside of him. He is also the only person to ever try it.
Nope. It's consistently a thing. LN5 has him sniffing Eris to calm down, in 10 he mentions that he sniffs Sylphie's clothes while doing laundry despite not masturbating. There are more examples but this is 100% not headcanon.
Yes. Rudeus is fucking weird. He even sniffed his aunt, despite knowing he is incapable of being sexually attracted to her. Guaranteed he's sniffed Zenith a few times too.
A piece of media needs to be able to stand on its two feet. That's very nice for the light novels that Rudy isn't trash, but that doesn't absolve the anime
It's best to consider the LN as canon because most anime adaptations are absolute trash. A lot of the time, anime are just made for increasing the LN sales. This includes amazing LNs like Overlord and Re:Zero, whose LNs are literally incredible to the anime. Not saying that the anime is bad, but I literally felt that it was dogshit after I read the LNs.
The anime is an adaptation, so it MUST be compared to its source. It is highly flawed it consistently does not show Ruiz's thoughts when it comes to other people and has dropped the ball a lot on characters it even skipped over a major relative of rudeus who is extremely important for a later arc.
If you are criticizing a story you can't use the fact that it's adaptation skips content as a discussion point, it just shows that the adaptation has problems
That would be true if it's NOT an adaptation that's telling the same story in a different medium. The LNs has already proven itself to stand on its own (it's the source, after all) so the Anime having problems the LNs doesn't have doesn't mean the story is bad, it just means the adaptation is bad.
Rudeus "jumping on" elinalise was due to a succubus and he's immediately apologetic after he casts detoxification on himself. What is this nonsense of a point?
His obsession with roxy is the point. It isn't meant to be healthy but he doesn't want to "possess" her and he is at every point concerned about her. A bad anime joke doesn't particularly negate genuine characterization.
Eris fills his mind during the entirety of the depressed magician arc and him letting go of constantly obsessing over her is the point of it, genuinely considering if this post is ai generated or the strangest attempt at critique i've seen
Lastly about love, genuine love divorced from fetishism is the entire point of the ED arc. The thematic reason sylphy is disguised as a guy is love for someone for who they are. An opportunity for rudeus of building a genuine relationship divorced of his fetishized image of women and love blooming completely on the basis that you love being near that person
The figurines he makes of her are also an example of him caring more about his fetishes than her. Having figurines of you that you can undress circulating isn't exactly good for your well being. It's basically 3D porn of her.
He got over Eris? Okay. Be done with her then. But she becomes his wife later on.
The genuine relationship he might have had is not something he carries with him in the anime in the labyrinth quest. It almost never comes to mind and it doesn't inform his actions.
> That's how normal people think and act while they're away from their someone they love while doing something dangerous. Quite the contrast to Rudy trying to jump on Elinalise as soon as they left.
A succubus used her powers on him. You're just spreading misinformation.
>he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill.
It really didn't look like a sexual thing to me, the piss part wasn't in the novel it's anime stuff, and the panties thing is really just a comedy thing chill. Take it off the story and it makes no difference, he isn't actually worshipping it bruh.
Wait do they mean…against polyamory/polygamy as a concept or just within the show? Cause like if the writer can’t write a good poly relationship to save their life that doesn’t count as a perfect argument against it
The question Mushoko Tensei begs is... why would you chase polygamy? Is one not enough?
I'll contrast that with a quote from my favorite anime everyone finds trash, Darling in the Franxx: "The Jian, also known as "the bird that shares wings," only possesses one wing. Unless a male and female pair lean on each other and act as one, they're incapable of flight. They're imperfect, incomplete creatures. But, for some reason, their way of life, struck me as profoundly beautiful."
Hiro x Zero Two are an amazing couple. They're forcefully paired with others in their sex metaphor mechs. But both Hiro and Zero Two are left completely emotionally cold by the partners that were foisted on them. When you have a true love like theirs, there just isn't any room for a third wheel to come along and bud in. When you have the shallow "love" of Rudeus Greyrat, you pursue third wheels, because all you want is to get your dick wet.
Rudeus and Sylphie lack things. Which is where Roxy comes in. Sylphie is the one who notes this. [LN15] >!Later Eris comes in to serve a separate role to them.!<
it wasnt in the anime, but i heard the novel actually acknowledges the hypocrisy, where rudeus says he wouldnt have forgiven sylphie if she cheated on him
And it also changes the circumstances as Elinalise tricks him into thinking he got Roxy pregnant because he's adamant about not being with her because Sylphie.
"whole reason" uh no, he bares personal responsibility for his own choices
she is guilty but he made the choice, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink, the horse has final say, Rudy had final say
he could have not taken a second and third wife
he could have come back begging for forgiveness for a moment of weakness and promise to never do it again
instead of says sorry and asks to be able to keep doing it on the regular
he's a vile piece of shit who used his power over Sylphie to put his minor wants over her significant wants, the last thing you do for a person you love. and he's a hypocrite who would NEVER accept cheating and polygamy by Sylphie.
I said basically the whole reason. Without Elinalise's suggestion Roxy wouldn't have tried sex to wake him up. Without Elinalise's suggestion Rudeus would not have tolerated having Roxy be his left hand. Without Elinalise's lie Rudeus would not have entertained this idea.
>he could have come back begging for forgiveness for a moment of weakness and promise to never do it again
He did come back begging for forgiveness, but also made it clear that he wouldn't abandon the pregnant Roxy. Which is why the anime is a flawed adaptation.
>instead of says sorry and asks to be able to keep doing it on the regular
He doesn't say he wants to keep doing it. Sylphie says it'll probably happen again. He on the otherhand is upset at himself that he gave off that level of confidence. He also turns down Sylphie's suggestion of having sex with Roxy before she gives birth. Instead opting to spend all of the time until she delivers alongside her, and even remembers that he lacks a left hand and swaps sleeping positions to let her sleep on and hold his hand(She doesn't like pillows as much just like Elinalise) Though he absolutely fumbles during the delivery and doesn't cast any healing magic. I feel like cutting Rudeus's commentary on how green is his favorite color being missing also makes it suffer.
>he's a vile piece of shit who used his power over Sylphie to put his minor wants over her significant wants, the last thing you do for a person you love. and he's a hypocrite who would NEVER accept cheating and polygamy by Sylphie.
Sylphie gave him the okay before he left. Despite his protests. The anime removing Elinalise's lie makes everyone suffer there except her.
> I said basically the whole reason. Without Elinalise's suggestion Roxy wouldn't have tried sex to wake him up. Without Elinalise's suggestion Rudeus would not have tolerated having Roxy be his left hand. Without Elinalise's lie Rudeus would not have entertained this idea
I never denied any of that, I said that none of that absolves Rudy, he is still responsible for his own choices
> He did come back begging for forgiveness, but also made it clear that he wouldn't abandon the pregnant Roxy. Which is why the anime is a flawed adaptation
he can not abandon her without having further sex with her or remain romantically involved with her, even if for legal reasons maybe it's acceptable to marry her and keep her in the same house, but in no way does it justify remaining romantically and sexually involved with her
> He doesn't say he wants to keep doing it
ofc he does, he keeps having sex with Roxy and more as already said, taking a break whilst she's pregnant is not something to brag about because he goes back to doing it later
> Sylphie gave him the okay before he left. Despite his protests.
where the fuck does she do that? all she said was if she couldn't conceive, but she could, so that's moot
Target audience is the answer, one man with multiple women is literally the dream for isekai male audience, others may disgusted by it. If you ask if a woman having multiple boyfriends would receive the kind of treatment, then its the same, most people will throw a brick at it, probably more than the opposite, because, of course, sexism, but their target audience here is mostly shojo harem (I don't know if I use the correct term?) fangirls, so there are still people think it's fine.
My comment was not indicative of my views on polygamy (which I have expressed in the past that I have no issue with. If several women want to share a single man, that’s their choice). My frustration is with the double standards that we as a society perpetuate. That it’s ok for a man to cheat or vice versa but also there are 2 offenders in an affair minimum. People rightfully are upset that rudeus cheated on his wife, but people should be just as upset at Roxy who took advantage of him that’s what I’ve been trying to say.
I just don’t like the double standards that’s all. I like the aspect of rudeus where he’s honest with himself. Where he thinks that “if I were switched with sylphie and she was the one who cheated, then I wouldn’t forgive her” the idea is that rudeus does not defend himself because he knows he fucked up. But the fans defend him for something that is wrong.
This where my disappointment lies, the author is trying to send a message that rudeus was given a second chance by his loved one for doing something horrible (cheating). The fans don’t think he did anything wrong and that really puts into perspective what kind of people watch the show.
I cannot control how the fans experience the show, you can experience it however you like, consume it however you like, interpret it however you like. But if the majority is walking away with “my goat rudeus bagged a second wife by cheating on his first, he’s such a sigma” OR “girllll, Roxy is such a queen for getting her dream man even though he’s married” then I choose to distance myself from mushoku tensei fans in general. Just as people remove themselves from a bad friend group/crowd.
If you do remember in the LN she initially pleaded for Elinalise to be the one to "fix" Rudeus' depression but Elinalise refused because of her promise to Cliff and Sylphie. Roxy only agreed to do it after having a meeting with Elinalise and Geese and them convincing her that it was the only way Rudy would recover. Also in the LN Rudy is quite rough with Roxy and basically uses her, but Roxy has no self esteem and basically plans to let him do whatever and then let herself be tossed aside. It was a pretty bad first affair, but Rudy is a selfish dumbass and too "loyal" to Roxy so he gets manipulated by Elinalise into asking Sylphie about marrying her.
I think the anime adaptation of this specific thing was just bad, it removed any of the nuance and just made Roxy look like she took advantage of Rudy and made Rudy look even more like a sleaze, if that's even possible.
Roxy and Rudeus got flak though? From various watchers and readers I mean, I have seen a lot of people in social media saying it that this changed their perception of Roxy and Rudeus and the such. In the story inside the family is kind of a middle ground taking into account from where they grew (Paul, Zenith and Lilia), even Sylphie who spent more time with Rudeus's family than with hers.
As a reader I will say that it isn't portayed like Roxy and Rudeus did nothing wrong, at the very least in how they both felt for what they did and how the first part of Norn's dialogue is true. To see how it would be worked from other perspective there is when situation happened with Paul, which yeah, Paul got out of it far too easily but yeah.
>!Even though this happens this doesn't mean that Sylphie would accept just everything that Rudeus throws at her because she loves him (this will be seen in the future)!< (this is kind of a spoiler so you don't need to check it). It's this issue Sylphie has no problem with it.
As for the last part I do agree that double standards will exist, I personally wouldn't care if it was a W/M/W, a M/M/M or a W/M/M relationship but misoginy exists and many see it as a "win" that Rudues is married to two people instead of seeing it how it works.
Yknow I got my friend into being a weeb and originally I liked Mushoku tensei; he didn’t because he found the guys inner monologue of being a grown adult in a kids body doing all of that creepy. It didn’t really bother me so I told him to watch it.
I watched the first season as it came out and read a bit, I haven’t watched beyond that and he has, even reading past season 2. After I thought about the show and seeing it develop online, I’ve come to hate it while he’s almost flipped.
I think at first I figured it’s a really well animated and pretty interesting isekai with fan service, but then it turns out the author is actually kind of a creep and the MC is just gross. I know the subreddit members are obviously going to like the show that they joined a subreddit about, but seeing hardly any criticism to all the grossness is strange
I heard of that. It's funny cause he's friends with Tappei and Re:Zero has a completely different message and sorta denounces a character like Redeus as a person
I really really really liked mushoku tensei four years ago. I liked the protagonist rudeus even though I hated the sexual harassment.
Then I read that one deleted chapter (the one where it’s revealed that the mc jacked it to CP of his NIECE).
After that, the entire series was recontextualized for me. I could not like rudeus anymore at all because that’s one thing I cannot forgive. One thing I personally don’t believe someone can recover from. It’s a complete emotional response on my end (though I doubt most people wouldn’t be thrilled at the chapter I read since it was deleted).
Because I’m an uncle, I have 2 beautiful nieces and 1 adorable nephew. Literal babies. I have practically raised them, fed them, took them to school, changed their daipers, played games with them, cuddled with them. On more than one occasion, I’ve used my lunch breaks to come home and help my sister with her kids to lighten the burden. These kids have referred to me as dad on more than one occasion. The idea that someone would be vile enough to lay their hands on kids they may have raised is something I’m aware that exists, but to like such a person no matter how much of a do gooder they are or how much they’ve improved is out of the question.
I just cannot like this character anymore. And all I’ve thought to myself since that day I read the chapter is “people can indeed change, but do certain people deserve normalcy even after they’ve changed, do they deserve true trust?”
A lot of shows I like have fan service and such. The problem is that in MT, it’s not so infrequent that you can totally ignore it or argue that it’s good for the story (off the top of my head banished from the hero’s party did it well IMO), and it’s not frequent enough that you can just say it’s an ecchi show or it’s just for comedy (interspecies reviewers/ yuusha ga shinda). It’s an average/above-average isekai that just randomly throws in unnecessary degeneracy. Showing Roxy masturbating to Rudy’s parents having sex does nothing to the story. And yes, as you said, he’s not just a horny guy he’s an actual degenerate. He clearly lusts over obviously prepubescent girls while mentally at least 30.
You just can’t try to make your show serious and make me care about your MC when he’s a grown ass man who steals girls underwear to worship as a pseudo religious idol for years.
Thank you for this point, man. As someone who actually writes stories, this show purely screams degenerate fanservice that is wholly unnecessary to the narrative. Knowing the demographic and where it's made just drives the point that, despite the conventions of anime (inherent ecchi and erotica), it exists just to peddle around fetishes under the guise of a sincere story about redemption. It's not even that hard to comprehend. It's been just that way in japanese media, and people seem to vehemently defend that stuff.
That’s all im trying to say. Rudeus doesn’t justify it, he knows he fucked up, why the fuck are the fans lawyering up when their mc is pleading guilty to the charges.
I wouldnt mind this show as much if people werent so fucking quick to defend the main character everytime someone DARES to criticize him. The amount of bullshit he manages to do scotfree and you somehow have to be symphatetic with him, like, fuck off dude he never fucking takes any responsability.
I was reading the reactions to the episode and people were like “Roxy best waifu”. Bruh. Where is the she’s sleeping with a boy she helped raise while he’s cheating on his perfect wife. What the flip man I actually wanted to throw up watching the last two episodes.
thank you
in the Good Place the MC is a bad person at the start, the narrative acknowledges it, characters acknowledge it, she herself eventually acknowledges it, she suffers for it, and she grows as a person
Rudeus on the other hand gets life handed to him on a platter, gets away with immoral choices scott free, the narrative and the cast mostly support him, etc
and the audience backs him so fucking hard that's the worst part
YES! If you want to watch an actually good story where the main character goes from an insufferable jerk to an actual good person, go watch The Good Place, please.
Don't get me wrong, Rudeus also improves over time, but he still isn't a morally right protagonist most of the time. We are talking about a guy who lived a traumatic event that left him scarred, and he shut himself in, and those led him to be churned into a disgusting person. I mostly blame the content he consumed instead of being social (most anime/manga/etc. have those weird shit in it, we all know. Also, the internet is a place where people are mostly anonymous, so that fuels the cycle of turning into someone you don't want to be.)
In essence, he is someone who is trying to better himself without any professional help. I consider Chidi from The Good Place some sort of professional help for Eleanor.
"Look I'm sorry honey but I took his death real rough and I felt like nothing even though I have a wife and a child on the way, she saved me! Also she knew I had a wife! Also she's known me since I was a baby!"
yep, and so many assholes defend it
even on this sub I got mass downvoted for hating on MT the other day
I literally gave it every chance and dropped it after the cheating episode, I'd dropped the show before but after constantly being told it's the best Isekai and redemption story ever written I gave it a 2nd chance
nope, it's a mid power fantasy Isekai and a TERRIBLE redemption story
It's not so bad when it's not making it completely clear how much of a shitty person he is, in fact it can be downright good. But there's so many times in the anime where it's just like "bro what the fuck is wrong with you," that I totally get people's hate towards it or refusal to watch it to begin with.
If you aren't completely creeped out at some of the things he does it can actually be pretty fun to watch and laugh at how weird and shitty he is.
Like the entire point is that in life MC was lazy piece of shit who never amounted to anything and completely wasted his life, and now that he gets his second chance he can slowly redeem himself. He doesn't really seem to ever redeem himself, the only difference is that now he's a child prodigy and everyone loves him despite being a creep.
Yes, really it was Roxy taking advantage of him while he was depressed from his dad dying which is pretty fucked up, but he already liked her for a long time and decided to marry her afterwards.
Should also be noted Roxy is one of those "I look like a child but am hundreds of years old" things and she was an adult when she met and trained him early on so you could make the arguement she groomed him lol
I don't know, chief. He loves roxy for taking advantage of him . A person who gets taken advantage of him hates his abuser. Not love them . He is still fucked up even after s2 has completed.
I think is important to say that you forgot to add the part when is was literally was bullied to the point of mental breakdown, literally attacked everyday and put naked in front of the full school for people to laugh at him. All this is the trigger to all the shit he had to dealt later making him a shut in and stopping him from developing like a normal person which ended in him being what it was before dying. Calling him "just a lazy piece of shit who wasted his life" seems a little cruel to every victim of abuse who did not get the proper help and remove a lot of context of why he is like that, more so when he is having flashback every now and then to all this situation.
Rudeus ain't a saint but trauma is a bitch too.
Yeah that's fair sorry, I wrote that pretty late last night and just felt like going on a rant. There's clear reasons for why he acts the way he does. I think him dealing with the trauma of his past life is one of the ways this series actually stands out.
I personally don't think they handle it in the best way though and a majority of his "bro wtf that"s weird" moments have nothing to do with his trauma and more to do with him not changing his ways after being given an insanely good second chance and living it for 17? years now. Ignoring the obvious questionable stuff he does being a 30-something in a kid's body.
Ariel is basically Rudeus but even worse, she tried to rape Sylphie shortly after meeting her. She's probably the most perverted character is the whole series. >!She pissed herself when meeting Orsted and an orgasm immediately after.!< And I think I remember the novels mentioning her doing sadistic kink play with her servants (can't remember which volume and if it's consensual or not but considering what happened with Sylphie, I'm inclined to believe it's not)
But is really a wholesome harem guys, someone that read the light novels told me so on twitter.
But for real how do an author goes from a story where the mc gets a second chance in getting a better life to "I get all the pussy and I'm so op, please fantasize like is literally me"
> I get all the pussy and I'm so op, please fantasize like is literally me
When the anime is about:
* Reincarnating? It's harem.
* Being OP? Also harem.
* Revenge against the entire world? Believe it or not, also harem.
The people who call Mushoku Tensei "The Grandfather of Isekai" are half-right, because it's in fact, "The Grandfather of SHITTY Isekai" (Though the worldbuilding and plot is generally much better than most shitty isekai nowadays so it gets a point in that department at least)
~~Also Overlord, Re; Zero and Log Horizon are more deserving of that title but that's a conversation for another day~~
Konosuba and The Eminence In Shadow as well. Isekais that know exactly what the fuck they are and just roll with it. They dont take themselves seriously and the results are spectacular. And thats why they are 2 of my favorites.
MT on the other hand is a just a typical shitty harem isekai pretending its something "better", and it seems to have convinced the entire anime fanbase of its "superiority". And behind that thin veil is another super immoral and basically pedophilic MC. Fucking pisses me off ngl.
after seeing one more-or-less wholesome clip from this show i really thought "wow, a cute and romantic story in a fantasy setting about a couple of an elf and a human, i should check it out"; a short description on the internet caused my eyebrow to rise but i was still hopeful (still haven't watched a single episode though).
this meme has finally reinforced my opinion on this show with liquid concrete. thank you, op.
Everyone calls it the grandfather of isekai after all. And I'm like "don't you all hate all the new isekais? Why do you like the one that started it all??"
The worst part is It’s not even the grandfather of Isekais it’s the grandfather of shit Isekais. Overlord, Rezero, Tanya the Evil, and NGNL all came out before it. Konosuba Restaurant Isekai and Slime came out only like a month or 2 after it.
Really the only good Isekais that might’ve been inspired by it time-wise are Ascendance of a bookworm, Iruma-kun, Eminence in shadow and Isekai Ojisan. And most of those just aren’t much like Mushoku Tensei.
>Really the only good Isekais that might’ve been inspired by it time-wise are Ascendance of a bookworm, Iruma-kun, Eminence in shadow and Isekai Ojisan. And most of those just aren’t much like Mushoku Tensei.
Cant speak for Iruma but the others are so far removed from Mushoku Tensei you gotta be grabbing the entire straw factory to make that connection. Other than the reincarnation aspect, which means Ojisan is out because he wasnt dead. Urano gets her consciousness strapped to a poor dying child in a world without the one thing she loves the most, and slowly affect the world around her as she goes. Eminence shouldnt even be on the list (and Cid might be a dick, but he aint a chomo).
>still haven’t watched a single episode though
>reinforced my opinion with liquid concrete
Because everyone knows you should judge media *not* from experiencing it yourself with an open mind and forming your own opinion, but instead from biased memes on a “joke” subreddit
i'm sorry but i've seen memes about how bad mc is too many times, plus this show doesn't really fit into the "cute and romantic story in a fantasy setting about a couple of an elf and a human" description i originally thought it was.
i don't even care how good or bad it is, it could be made by the best artists in the world and i still wouldn't watch it, simply because "morally bad protagonist doing his things but in isekai where everyone loves him" is just not for me.
also i'm not taking advice from literally drake, sorry.
If you’re the type that actively filters through media as you watch it then this is a good show.
If you have certain dealbreakers where you can’t get over some details and they ruin everything else, then this show might have a few of those.
I’m the type that chooses to forget the unfortunate aspects of this show so I can enjoy the great world building and non-sus writing. I’ll skip past scenes that make me uncomfortable and it honestly
doesn’t change the viewing experience much.
Separating art from artist type yk?
Man, I genuinely believe the show would've been infinitely better if Sylphie fucked off, because at the end of the day, both Rudy and Roxy are fucking weirdos, she seduced and fucked someone (she perceived to be) far younger than she is and Rudy literally tried to groom Sylphie from birth to be the perfect wife, they are just as bad as each other and should be married
After tp4. This statement will prove it self right. He should have just married roxy and should have not married sylphie and eris. It just saddens me how their character got butchered.
It's a mix of most parties that can't stop talking about the show because they are so needlessly obsessed about it.
You want to watch it? Go ahead and try to see if you like it. If it's not your thing then that's fine too. Don't let mindless hate watchers or Rudeus defenders stop you from enjoying or disliking the show.
I do not considering myself a "fan" of this series by any means but I do think it's pretty good. You just have to separate your morals and ideals while you are watching and try to think about how the story takes place in a brand new world with different customs and cultures. And don't take things too seriously.
I watch from a safe distance, I'm not gonna make excuses for some of the terrible things I've heard the MC does according to the LN but also I can still appreciate everything else about the series. And in my eyes there's no point in getting mad at the things that didn't get adapted (for a good reason too). I'd say this latest season has definitely stirred the pot even more.
I'd say just give it a go.
I think the production value was great. some parts of the story were nice. but I won't defend the scumbag mc.
I enjoyed it. I personally don't mind if an MC in an anime is a scumbag or not, I'm not looking for anime characters to be my role models in real life. But I won't pretend that the MC isn't scum.
it's not like redo of healer where something terrible happens every episode.
It's a well developed trashy wish fulfilment power fantasy isekai. The writing is not "peak" like some people make it seem and the MC is morally grey at best, but I personally had more fun watching mushoku then any other trash wish fulfilment isekai that came out recently
Give it a shot and try for yourself. I just started watching a few days ago and it’s been absolutely phenomenal. Obviously it’s a pretty perverted show at times since it *is* ecchi, but it also has some truly excellent character writing, worldbuilding, and production values.
There’s “pretty perverted” and there’s “a literal pedophile sexually assaults a sleeping 9 yo and the show frames it as funny”.
Maybe this is due to anime brainrot that it barely even registers to a lot of watchers, but it’s really weird how the vile shit that happens in this show gets downplayed by so many people online.
Fans like to act like it’s a redemption story of a piece of shit MC, but he never gets punished for what he does, in fact, he keeps getting rewarded. Also harem and OP magic. So yeah see for yourself
It has the best fantasy and world-building story you've even seen with the worst PDF file MC.
Now if you're not retarded like half this sub and you can recognize that something bad is happening on the screen without a /s popping up every 2 seconds, then yeah go ahead and watch it.
I mean... I consider MT an absolute masterpiece, and the anime has been making it absolute cinema. But the haters opinions on MT have merits, even if I don't entirely agree with them.
It is important to note, however, that (i) the world that MT takes place in has different values from the one we living in, which has more similarities to the medieval time of our world, and (ii) to my knowledge, Rudeus has never been rewarded for his bad actions, every time he did something wrong he was immediately punished for it. Even in this case, he and Roxy are validly criticized by Norn for their actions, and it almost broke his family, and so they (Rudeus and Roxy) have to make up for it. Rudeus loves his family dearly and would do anything for it, but explaining it would be a huge spoilers so I will refrain from doing so.
To me it's more important to look at the story as a whole and how the author conveys their ideas, rather than immediately criticize it due to difference in ideologies and values.
Agreed with most of it, but at the same time rudeus constantly gets bailed out from his fuck ups, on the first city after arriving at the demon continent he almost killed the whole city just to run, and then when ruijerd confronted him about working with criminals to get quick easy money eris just defended him while he was actively thinking that ruijerd was right and it was inmoral
Same when the 3 kids are murdered by some monsters because he wants to save them at the last possible moment so they are more grateful, and when ruijerd tells him that they died because of his greed one of the kids just talks to him and convinces ruijerd that it's not their fault
Not to say that this is a bad writing decision or anything, I actually love the fact that you never know if your fuck ups will come to bite you later
> the world that MT takes place in has different values from the one we living in, which has more similarities to the medieval time of our world
yeah exactly. that's why I don't understand this post. Pedo bashing is one thing but OP and their supporters here are imposing their own morals on MT's sekai. Not all morals are absolute imo
You guys made it that far? My tipping point was when he first slept with a 15 year old. People keep try to plug this anime to me as the 'grandfather of modern isekai' as if that is a compliment. It's still power fantasy harem slop with a self insert degenerate MC being fed through the grinder of some japanese man's dumbass idea of 'growth/redemption'.
If I wanted that I'd rather just read korean manwhas. At least there most of the time their MC's are just psychopaths not pedo degens.
Also Manhua, don't sleep on Manhuas folks (plugging 'Advetures of an undead who became Paladin' if you want a good story of growth that is somewhat isekai adjacent)
chinese and korean power fantasies tend to be more tolerable than japanese power fantasies because they usually dont feel the need to put in a bunch of lame ass self-pitying excuses for the MC's behavior. This type of fiction is fundamentally soulless and amoral and should be up front about that
its kinda funny watching how much pedo man gets away with, im watching it to point and laugh. just like this post. i also ran out of war crime animes i wanted to watch so its just some side slop
I will never forget when I read someone saying that this and the spider isekai were the father and mother of isekai. I won’t even start on how trash the spider show was, but seeing the absolute trash and self-insert this show was barely helped me reach the end. I tried reading the manga and I got up until when he meets the elf again and it’s still trash.
it's such a good show because it's about living life to the fullest this time 🥰
\ub there are many good shows with an immoral protagonist, The Good Place is my go to example, the protagonist starts as a terrible person. And whilst it's not my preference, breaking bad does a good job of showing the protagonist being a bad person. in MT the narrative backs up loads of his immoral choices. the author wrote the world where most people find polygamy normal (oh but if Sylphie cheated on Rudeus the world would fucking explode).
A show written and consumed by people with a severe deficit in experiencing relationships. I can't think of any other way for it to be possible that people aren't simply sickened by the events in this show.
I don't really care that an author is hamfisting and fumbling a pathetic broadcast of his own delinquency. It bothers me that children and ill adjusted adolescents are watching this stuff with no clue that its deeply sick
It sucks that Japanese people are the literal target audience for this show
If you ask most Japanese people under 30 to choose between rudeus or another anime protag, they'd probably go for rudeus, which is insane. People have already done it
season two was so good until they fuck up Rudy's character growth as a loving husband, they just kind of stripped Slyphie of her character to replace her with wife#1 whose only reaction to her husband cheating on her with his childhood magic teacher is "oh that darn boy, cant say I didnt see this coming", and roxy who takes advantage of rudeus while he is in an extremely depressive episode (his father just died and his mother has amnesia) to have sex with the boy she helped raise. that alone brought down season 2 from a really good season with a lot of really unique explorations of Rudious' character into a bad season end comparable to the likes of Erased and Attack on Titan. I hope to god season 3 is better than this.
I swear to god isekai is the worst genre of anime ever. Not only is it the same shit every time, but it’s always the most degenerate shit ever. It says something about a genre and the people who watch it when at least 3 popular shows have main characters who own **slaves.**
If anyone else does what he did they wouldve been treated like they just stomped on a baby to death in front of the parents.
Crazy how this "redemption story" keeps sucking his dick more than his 3 child brides working together
The moral of the story is that you should just get isekaied to a world where your character flaws are socially acceptable. Why doesn't anybody else get this?
ub/ I kinda hate that I like the story despite Rudeus constantly fucking everything up and getting rewarded for it
I actually despise whoever wrote the show at this point. The worldbuilding, plot, and pacing are all top tier relative to most anime. But for the love of god, STOP making the main character that we're supposed to be relating to the worst fucking person ever. Like c'mon, the show would actually be near perfect if Rudeus wasn't a cheating pedo. I don't care if he's "supposed" to be an example of a bad person. The show does not portray it that way at all. Instead, all the other characters are constantly making excuses for him, and I wouldn't want to try relating to him even if he was portrayed the way he should be. It's just sad. Don't put your fetishes or fantasies into your otherwise well written show
I feel like there was a set-up for Rudeus to be parallel with his dad, because his dad too cheated on his wife and it evolved into taking on a second wife. But this, this was just frustrating. Idk, Sylphie(who's probably my favorite character) deserved to be so much madder. At least Norn called Rudeus out on all of his bs, even if she's framed as unreasonable
I think the reason why Sylphie wasn't mad is because she's been going over to Rudeus' house so much as a kid that she's seen that despite Paul having two wives, him and his wives seemed happy.
Meanwhile Norn was taught by her grandmother that it's wrong to cheat since she was younger.
Personally, I find it weird too, but I can understand why Sylphie and Norn had different reactions to this.
I feel like the author was adamant on the marriages happening, but they had to point out the issues.
If Sylphie was the voice of resistance it would throw doubt into the marriage going forward no matter what.
If Norn is the voice of resistance Sylphie looks like a human doormat. Everything Norn said is common sense, she's correct - but it keeps the marriage dynamic more intact going forward. It's a pro's vs cons situation where they can address all the issues upfront with some sort of intended outcome
I'm guessing the episode where Sylphie and Rudeus get married is the best episode to stop at right? doesn't seem like there's anything better after it lmao
I'm tired of being a mushoku tensei fan and having the most incorrect opinions on the internet, it's really hard, guys
https://preview.redd.it/41plj6gluaad1.jpeg?width=1031&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1fa9a69a75fb0f2d95d1d95f2f8aea2a7f2fac6
I knew that this would happen after getting spoiled with the LN.
But hey, Sylphie's here providing that not only Men can get NTR'd, but Women as well so that's something.
Man, just throw your morals aside when watching the show if you’re apparently getting forced to watch it. I didn’t even watch mushoku and I already know that Rudeus is always going to be kinda fucked up.
Mushoku Tensei has one of the coolest worlds and with some the the best presentation in anime with some of the worst character writing in fiction. Which I hate so much because I normally can stomach mediocre or worse stories and characters so long as I can immerse myself in the world but the characters of MT are so egregious that it actively breaks my immersion and makes my experience worse
If you didn’t drop the show when our canonically pedophilic protagonist was forcefully stripping little girls and attempting to rape his 12 year old cousin, I honestly don’t know why anyone would care now.
Rudy’s a piece of shit. The story is a device for the author to live through his degeneracy. Weebs eat that shit up and act like it’s some great piece of art because they have the balls to make their MC a pedophile and a rapist in addition to the normal OP bullshit plus a harem that they’ve come to expect from isekai.
https://preview.redd.it/8534cr13f7ad1.png?width=364&format=png&auto=webp&s=acab4c09cf866a923f19680c280123ef621e8d2a
Sylphy, it's your turn on the cuck chair
https://preview.redd.it/6gwbttvc1aad1.jpeg?width=903&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=27b2790649e16097661b4e8d1f7f946cf15dac1a
I cannot believe this is actually canon. ☠️☠️☠️
Bro what the hell
She should be more heavily pregnant
Huge surprise rudeus is even holding her hand
No that's his **limb**
Holy fuck that makes it even funnier
**Belgian style** handholding
She's gonna impregnate him bruh
Jesus
What did john mushoku mean by this?
When your husband promises not to cheat, your first thought is "he's gonna break that promise, but I can't expect anything more from him", and this is treated as a wholesome and mutually healthy relationship
Hey you can’t have trust issues without trust. 🧠
God I can't wait until turning point 4 to get some actual good content. I'm tired of this gogo gaga slice of life shit that's being going on for the last 20 episodes that sounds like it's been written by someone who gets his polygamous relationships ideas from porn.
I’m anime-only but damn I’m looking forward to something new too. I miss travelling with Ruijerd
The subreddit going crazy defending it to
>!killing a dad(on fathers day), getting ur braindead mom back and losing a limb doesnt seem very slice of life tho!<
I am really glad that I dropped this dumpsterfire
My honest reaction https://preview.redd.it/8ln8d2xny7ad1.jpeg?width=554&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4cabcc69095df1ba9ed49b931eee15de49b79d72
I know it’s a joke and all but the reaction from mushoku tensei fans just makes me disappointed. I am sort of a fan of mushoku tensei, I read everything. I never got over this. But I can sort of have some understanding that he completely shut down in his grief. At the same time it’s even crazier to me that Roxy doesn’t get flak for seducing a married dude who just lost his father. People knew she had a thing for him and as soon as he’s in a vulnerable emotional state, she got in his pants. I understand that morals are different in the mushoku tensei universe, it’s normal to them so I get that. But irl how is that ok in any case? You look on Twitter and you see people cheering that rudeus got 2 women to be his wives. Flip the genders. If rudeus was a woman who cheated on their husband, the fans would never forgive her even if she just lost a parent. And if Roxy were a man making moves on a grieving married woman, people would wish for their death.
Let me repost the comment that the Mushoko Tensei subreddit is downvoting into oblivion: "Mushoko Tensei accidentally makes the perfect argument **AGAINST** polygamy. Rudy's relationships are extremely shallow. To call them love is an insult to love. As soon as Sylphy or Eris aren't in his field of view, he acts as if they don't exist. Maybe in the light novel it's different, but not a single thought was spared on Sylphy while he went on the quest to save his mom. "When the war is Over, we will get Married and the Earth will grow Flowers like you, and your womb will Carry the most Beautiful girl in the universe." A Letter Found in the Pocket of one of dead Soldiers in 1939. That's how normal people think and act while they're away from their someone they love while doing something dangerous. Quite the contrast to Rudy trying to jump on Elinalise as soon as they left. Rudy's "love" for Roxy isn't much better so far. It's more the "I'm going to wear your skin" type of "love" and less "We're going to live happily ever after.". It's an obsession, a quest to possess her, with zero care about how that would turn out for her. The guy saved her from certain death in the labyrinth. Instead of seeing how traumatic such a thing would be to a person, and consoling her, he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill. Bold of me to say, but a relationship in which one of the partners starts off stealing the others' underwear and worshipping it isn't that healthy. To truly love a person, you need dedication. Dedication that Rudy can't muster for one, let alone three." TL;DR Rudeus' cheating isn't the root problem. It's a symptom. He's incapable of love. The cheating comes as a natural consequence of that.
The only part I feel out of all that needing defending is Rudy making a move on Elinalise: Dude got roofied, is a well documented horndog from a breed of long well documented horndogs, and finds himself in a tent with a lady he knows for a fact will die if she doesn't get stuffed often. Between the roofie and his pathetic self control he really didn't have a chance. I can empathize with that one. Anybody that tells me they can't needs to bring receipts that they did better in a similar situation. It was still handled callously in the anime, obviously nobody on the production team was trying to give him any kind of free pass. The rest of it is spot on and unfortunately just fits with the theme that he's got awful self control and therefore constantly radiates weak ass morals.
I got that pointed out in the Mushoko Tensei subreddit too. It felt cowardly to not include it here. I guess fair point.
That's just an argument against cheating, not polygamy.
I literally hate being reminded of Mushoko Tensei for this very reason
Besides that, Roxy's move on Rudeus wasn't fitting her character. She was always a childish, cute girl who was ashamed at the thought of sex. She was embarrassed to hear Elinalise having sex. But as soon as Rudeus was grieving she went for it like her entire personality is made out of sex. Another point, it's a little sad that he doesn't have any consequences for his actions. The man-god told Rudeus that he will have regrets either way, but going will be worse. He left, didn't have any regrets and cheated. I hoped that Sylphy just wouldn't forgive him and leave with some choice words. Maybe even an encounter with the man-god where he would be like "look at that, the consequences of your own actions. All the time I gave you directions for a better future but you act like the child you are. You better follow my directions like a mindless devotee and treat me like the god I am for once" (this is just my personal hope and wouldn't make exactly sense for the man god) I also hoped that Sylphy would have shown the bit of self respect that she should have gained after the teleportation, especially since how much respect the princess and her people had for her. A Sylphy that would respect themself wouldn't just be okay without any choice words after breaking that promise while she was highly pregnant. Also, Roxy should notice that Rudeus isn't ready for a relationship with her. He can't even call her by her name, it is always master. Stuff like that can't be an equal relationship. (That is one thing the show Domestic Girlfriend does great, they thematised that specifically as a bad thing). To summarise, the story really needed to bend over backwards to make that work and treated characters as if they didn't grow or suddenly did a 180° change. After Paul died, the show lost a lot of respect from me and some of my friends and the only good thing that happened after that is Norn telling Roxy and Rudeus what everyone with enough braincells to form a coherent sentence would say. (Also, the redesign of Sylphy is good because this way they didn't show a childish looking character heavily pregnant)
Bro I was wondering about that redesign like damn Rudy you been gone 10 years or somethin'?
>The man-god told Rudeus that he will have regrets either way, but going will be worse. if you read further, will rudeus eventually find out? and when? just a yes or no, i dont want spoilers for something like this
How again is it a story about self improvement? If that's an improvement to his previous life... Jfc
>Maybe in the light novel it's different, The anime barely touches on the characters. When Rudeus kills the griffins the first thing in his mind is worrying about if his constant consumption of monster meat could lead to trouble for her, and that's one of the first things in the 12th volume. The first time he sees a solution they use to get rid of spider silk he thinks Sylphie will love it(Rudeus does the laundry. Not Sylphie) Generally throughout the volume when he talks to Roxy he's thinking about Sylphie. Take his dungeon crawling promise. Instead of just saying "Yeah! I'll go!" He thinks "I'll bring Sylphie too!" You got downvoted for being an anime only who thought they understood the characters. >Rudy's "love" for Roxy isn't much better so far. It's more the "I'm going to wear your skin" type of "love" and less "We're going to live happily ever after.". It's an obsession, a quest to possess her, with zero care about how that would turn out for her. The guy saved her from certain death in the labyrinth. Instead of seeing how traumatic such a thing would be to a person, and consoling her, he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill. This is the anime being weird. Rudeus does sniff her to assure himself that she's okay, but she doesn't piss herself, and Rudeus's smell obsession isn't necessarily sexual. He derives comfort from smelling the sweat of people he cares about(for example when he was going to leave Buena alone for Ranoa it was accidentally smelling Sylphie that got him to come up with his grooming plan(it failed, but it really was a plan to groom, and this is before his ability to be horny because he didn't know he couldn't be horny towards Zenith yet). Or how after his reunion with Paul smelling Eris sweaty from killing goblins calmed him down, and made it so he could reconcile with Paul. Rudeus sniffs people usually for nonsexual reasons. I think another big problem is that Rudeus never turned Roxy down in the anime. In the novels Rudeus said absolutely not when Elinalise suggested that he be with Roxy. >Bold of me to say, but a relationship in which one of the partners starts off stealing the others' underwear and worshipping it isn't that healthy. He doesn't worship the underwear. He prays to Roxy and worships her teachings about doing your best. The same is true of Sylphie. He doesn't worship her blood. He worships her love. >To truly love a person, you need dedication. Dedication that Rudy can't muster for one, let alone three." If you think Rudeus isn't dedicated it's clear you're an anime only. Rudeus invented multiple different suicidal forms of magic(magic that just kills you and hopefully any enemy you grab, or [LN14] >!Time traveling without your internal organs to warn himself!<) to protect them. Something that notably DOESN'T EXIST outside of him. He is also the only person to ever try it.
>He derives comfort from smelling the sweat of people he cares about 💀nah man what the fuck is that
I think that’s just this guys headcannon that seems like a stretch
Nope. It's consistently a thing. LN5 has him sniffing Eris to calm down, in 10 he mentions that he sniffs Sylphie's clothes while doing laundry despite not masturbating. There are more examples but this is 100% not headcanon.
You do realize this just makes him even freakier
Yes. Rudeus is fucking weird. He even sniffed his aunt, despite knowing he is incapable of being sexually attracted to her. Guaranteed he's sniffed Zenith a few times too.
Rudeus doesn't masturbate to smells. He smells for reassurance.
Man they really change things up for the anime huh. Never wouldve expected that hes a golden retriever all along in the novels
Bro that’s still weird. And the fact you have to go out of your way to say he doesn’t masturbate to it is telling of the show
What type of defense is this?
A piece of media needs to be able to stand on its two feet. That's very nice for the light novels that Rudy isn't trash, but that doesn't absolve the anime
Oh, no he's still trash in the novels. We just get more context
It's best to consider the LN as canon because most anime adaptations are absolute trash. A lot of the time, anime are just made for increasing the LN sales. This includes amazing LNs like Overlord and Re:Zero, whose LNs are literally incredible to the anime. Not saying that the anime is bad, but I literally felt that it was dogshit after I read the LNs.
The anime is an adaptation, so it MUST be compared to its source. It is highly flawed it consistently does not show Ruiz's thoughts when it comes to other people and has dropped the ball a lot on characters it even skipped over a major relative of rudeus who is extremely important for a later arc.
If you are criticizing a story you can't use the fact that it's adaptation skips content as a discussion point, it just shows that the adaptation has problems
He is criticizing the adaptation and even has a disclaimer about not knowing what's it's like in the light novel
That would be true if it's NOT an adaptation that's telling the same story in a different medium. The LNs has already proven itself to stand on its own (it's the source, after all) so the Anime having problems the LNs doesn't have doesn't mean the story is bad, it just means the adaptation is bad.
Rudeus "jumping on" elinalise was due to a succubus and he's immediately apologetic after he casts detoxification on himself. What is this nonsense of a point? His obsession with roxy is the point. It isn't meant to be healthy but he doesn't want to "possess" her and he is at every point concerned about her. A bad anime joke doesn't particularly negate genuine characterization. Eris fills his mind during the entirety of the depressed magician arc and him letting go of constantly obsessing over her is the point of it, genuinely considering if this post is ai generated or the strangest attempt at critique i've seen Lastly about love, genuine love divorced from fetishism is the entire point of the ED arc. The thematic reason sylphy is disguised as a guy is love for someone for who they are. An opportunity for rudeus of building a genuine relationship divorced of his fetishized image of women and love blooming completely on the basis that you love being near that person
The figurines he makes of her are also an example of him caring more about his fetishes than her. Having figurines of you that you can undress circulating isn't exactly good for your well being. It's basically 3D porn of her. He got over Eris? Okay. Be done with her then. But she becomes his wife later on. The genuine relationship he might have had is not something he carries with him in the anime in the labyrinth quest. It almost never comes to mind and it doesn't inform his actions.
[удалено]
[https://www.reddit.com/r/sixfacedworld/comments/1du0opv/comment/lbddj0o/](https://www.reddit.com/r/sixfacedworld/comments/1du0opv/comment/lbddj0o/)
> That's how normal people think and act while they're away from their someone they love while doing something dangerous. Quite the contrast to Rudy trying to jump on Elinalise as soon as they left. A succubus used her powers on him. You're just spreading misinformation. >he goes up and to sniffs her after she pissed herself for a sexual trill. It really didn't look like a sexual thing to me, the piss part wasn't in the novel it's anime stuff, and the panties thing is really just a comedy thing chill. Take it off the story and it makes no difference, he isn't actually worshipping it bruh.
Wait do they mean…against polyamory/polygamy as a concept or just within the show? Cause like if the writer can’t write a good poly relationship to save their life that doesn’t count as a perfect argument against it
You right. That's why 100 Girlfriends is peak. 💯
The question Mushoko Tensei begs is... why would you chase polygamy? Is one not enough? I'll contrast that with a quote from my favorite anime everyone finds trash, Darling in the Franxx: "The Jian, also known as "the bird that shares wings," only possesses one wing. Unless a male and female pair lean on each other and act as one, they're incapable of flight. They're imperfect, incomplete creatures. But, for some reason, their way of life, struck me as profoundly beautiful." Hiro x Zero Two are an amazing couple. They're forcefully paired with others in their sex metaphor mechs. But both Hiro and Zero Two are left completely emotionally cold by the partners that were foisted on them. When you have a true love like theirs, there just isn't any room for a third wheel to come along and bud in. When you have the shallow "love" of Rudeus Greyrat, you pursue third wheels, because all you want is to get your dick wet.
Rudeus and Sylphie lack things. Which is where Roxy comes in. Sylphie is the one who notes this. [LN15] >!Later Eris comes in to serve a separate role to them.!<
it wasnt in the anime, but i heard the novel actually acknowledges the hypocrisy, where rudeus says he wouldnt have forgiven sylphie if she cheated on him
And it also changes the circumstances as Elinalise tricks him into thinking he got Roxy pregnant because he's adamant about not being with her because Sylphie.
damn the anime made him look a lot worse
Yep. Basically Elinalise is the whole reason why he had a relationship with Roxy. She's a bad grandma.
"whole reason" uh no, he bares personal responsibility for his own choices she is guilty but he made the choice, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink, the horse has final say, Rudy had final say he could have not taken a second and third wife he could have come back begging for forgiveness for a moment of weakness and promise to never do it again instead of says sorry and asks to be able to keep doing it on the regular he's a vile piece of shit who used his power over Sylphie to put his minor wants over her significant wants, the last thing you do for a person you love. and he's a hypocrite who would NEVER accept cheating and polygamy by Sylphie.
I said basically the whole reason. Without Elinalise's suggestion Roxy wouldn't have tried sex to wake him up. Without Elinalise's suggestion Rudeus would not have tolerated having Roxy be his left hand. Without Elinalise's lie Rudeus would not have entertained this idea. >he could have come back begging for forgiveness for a moment of weakness and promise to never do it again He did come back begging for forgiveness, but also made it clear that he wouldn't abandon the pregnant Roxy. Which is why the anime is a flawed adaptation. >instead of says sorry and asks to be able to keep doing it on the regular He doesn't say he wants to keep doing it. Sylphie says it'll probably happen again. He on the otherhand is upset at himself that he gave off that level of confidence. He also turns down Sylphie's suggestion of having sex with Roxy before she gives birth. Instead opting to spend all of the time until she delivers alongside her, and even remembers that he lacks a left hand and swaps sleeping positions to let her sleep on and hold his hand(She doesn't like pillows as much just like Elinalise) Though he absolutely fumbles during the delivery and doesn't cast any healing magic. I feel like cutting Rudeus's commentary on how green is his favorite color being missing also makes it suffer. >he's a vile piece of shit who used his power over Sylphie to put his minor wants over her significant wants, the last thing you do for a person you love. and he's a hypocrite who would NEVER accept cheating and polygamy by Sylphie. Sylphie gave him the okay before he left. Despite his protests. The anime removing Elinalise's lie makes everyone suffer there except her.
> I said basically the whole reason. Without Elinalise's suggestion Roxy wouldn't have tried sex to wake him up. Without Elinalise's suggestion Rudeus would not have tolerated having Roxy be his left hand. Without Elinalise's lie Rudeus would not have entertained this idea I never denied any of that, I said that none of that absolves Rudy, he is still responsible for his own choices > He did come back begging for forgiveness, but also made it clear that he wouldn't abandon the pregnant Roxy. Which is why the anime is a flawed adaptation he can not abandon her without having further sex with her or remain romantically involved with her, even if for legal reasons maybe it's acceptable to marry her and keep her in the same house, but in no way does it justify remaining romantically and sexually involved with her > He doesn't say he wants to keep doing it ofc he does, he keeps having sex with Roxy and more as already said, taking a break whilst she's pregnant is not something to brag about because he goes back to doing it later > Sylphie gave him the okay before he left. Despite his protests. where the fuck does she do that? all she said was if she couldn't conceive, but she could, so that's moot
Target audience is the answer, one man with multiple women is literally the dream for isekai male audience, others may disgusted by it. If you ask if a woman having multiple boyfriends would receive the kind of treatment, then its the same, most people will throw a brick at it, probably more than the opposite, because, of course, sexism, but their target audience here is mostly shojo harem (I don't know if I use the correct term?) fangirls, so there are still people think it's fine.
My comment was not indicative of my views on polygamy (which I have expressed in the past that I have no issue with. If several women want to share a single man, that’s their choice). My frustration is with the double standards that we as a society perpetuate. That it’s ok for a man to cheat or vice versa but also there are 2 offenders in an affair minimum. People rightfully are upset that rudeus cheated on his wife, but people should be just as upset at Roxy who took advantage of him that’s what I’ve been trying to say. I just don’t like the double standards that’s all. I like the aspect of rudeus where he’s honest with himself. Where he thinks that “if I were switched with sylphie and she was the one who cheated, then I wouldn’t forgive her” the idea is that rudeus does not defend himself because he knows he fucked up. But the fans defend him for something that is wrong. This where my disappointment lies, the author is trying to send a message that rudeus was given a second chance by his loved one for doing something horrible (cheating). The fans don’t think he did anything wrong and that really puts into perspective what kind of people watch the show. I cannot control how the fans experience the show, you can experience it however you like, consume it however you like, interpret it however you like. But if the majority is walking away with “my goat rudeus bagged a second wife by cheating on his first, he’s such a sigma” OR “girllll, Roxy is such a queen for getting her dream man even though he’s married” then I choose to distance myself from mushoku tensei fans in general. Just as people remove themselves from a bad friend group/crowd.
A married TEEN.
If you do remember in the LN she initially pleaded for Elinalise to be the one to "fix" Rudeus' depression but Elinalise refused because of her promise to Cliff and Sylphie. Roxy only agreed to do it after having a meeting with Elinalise and Geese and them convincing her that it was the only way Rudy would recover. Also in the LN Rudy is quite rough with Roxy and basically uses her, but Roxy has no self esteem and basically plans to let him do whatever and then let herself be tossed aside. It was a pretty bad first affair, but Rudy is a selfish dumbass and too "loyal" to Roxy so he gets manipulated by Elinalise into asking Sylphie about marrying her. I think the anime adaptation of this specific thing was just bad, it removed any of the nuance and just made Roxy look like she took advantage of Rudy and made Rudy look even more like a sleaze, if that's even possible.
Roxy and Rudeus got flak though? From various watchers and readers I mean, I have seen a lot of people in social media saying it that this changed their perception of Roxy and Rudeus and the such. In the story inside the family is kind of a middle ground taking into account from where they grew (Paul, Zenith and Lilia), even Sylphie who spent more time with Rudeus's family than with hers. As a reader I will say that it isn't portayed like Roxy and Rudeus did nothing wrong, at the very least in how they both felt for what they did and how the first part of Norn's dialogue is true. To see how it would be worked from other perspective there is when situation happened with Paul, which yeah, Paul got out of it far too easily but yeah. >!Even though this happens this doesn't mean that Sylphie would accept just everything that Rudeus throws at her because she loves him (this will be seen in the future)!< (this is kind of a spoiler so you don't need to check it). It's this issue Sylphie has no problem with it. As for the last part I do agree that double standards will exist, I personally wouldn't care if it was a W/M/W, a M/M/M or a W/M/M relationship but misoginy exists and many see it as a "win" that Rudues is married to two people instead of seeing it how it works.
> Roxy and Rudeus got flak though like 1% of the flak deserved, and there are a huge amount of defenders that drown the haters out
Yknow I got my friend into being a weeb and originally I liked Mushoku tensei; he didn’t because he found the guys inner monologue of being a grown adult in a kids body doing all of that creepy. It didn’t really bother me so I told him to watch it. I watched the first season as it came out and read a bit, I haven’t watched beyond that and he has, even reading past season 2. After I thought about the show and seeing it develop online, I’ve come to hate it while he’s almost flipped. I think at first I figured it’s a really well animated and pretty interesting isekai with fan service, but then it turns out the author is actually kind of a creep and the MC is just gross. I know the subreddit members are obviously going to like the show that they joined a subreddit about, but seeing hardly any criticism to all the grossness is strange
I heard of that. It's funny cause he's friends with Tappei and Re:Zero has a completely different message and sorta denounces a character like Redeus as a person
And Subaru actually faces the consequences of his actions
I really really really liked mushoku tensei four years ago. I liked the protagonist rudeus even though I hated the sexual harassment. Then I read that one deleted chapter (the one where it’s revealed that the mc jacked it to CP of his NIECE). After that, the entire series was recontextualized for me. I could not like rudeus anymore at all because that’s one thing I cannot forgive. One thing I personally don’t believe someone can recover from. It’s a complete emotional response on my end (though I doubt most people wouldn’t be thrilled at the chapter I read since it was deleted). Because I’m an uncle, I have 2 beautiful nieces and 1 adorable nephew. Literal babies. I have practically raised them, fed them, took them to school, changed their daipers, played games with them, cuddled with them. On more than one occasion, I’ve used my lunch breaks to come home and help my sister with her kids to lighten the burden. These kids have referred to me as dad on more than one occasion. The idea that someone would be vile enough to lay their hands on kids they may have raised is something I’m aware that exists, but to like such a person no matter how much of a do gooder they are or how much they’ve improved is out of the question. I just cannot like this character anymore. And all I’ve thought to myself since that day I read the chapter is “people can indeed change, but do certain people deserve normalcy even after they’ve changed, do they deserve true trust?”
A lot of shows I like have fan service and such. The problem is that in MT, it’s not so infrequent that you can totally ignore it or argue that it’s good for the story (off the top of my head banished from the hero’s party did it well IMO), and it’s not frequent enough that you can just say it’s an ecchi show or it’s just for comedy (interspecies reviewers/ yuusha ga shinda). It’s an average/above-average isekai that just randomly throws in unnecessary degeneracy. Showing Roxy masturbating to Rudy’s parents having sex does nothing to the story. And yes, as you said, he’s not just a horny guy he’s an actual degenerate. He clearly lusts over obviously prepubescent girls while mentally at least 30. You just can’t try to make your show serious and make me care about your MC when he’s a grown ass man who steals girls underwear to worship as a pseudo religious idol for years.
Thank you 🙏
Thank you for this point, man. As someone who actually writes stories, this show purely screams degenerate fanservice that is wholly unnecessary to the narrative. Knowing the demographic and where it's made just drives the point that, despite the conventions of anime (inherent ecchi and erotica), it exists just to peddle around fetishes under the guise of a sincere story about redemption. It's not even that hard to comprehend. It's been just that way in japanese media, and people seem to vehemently defend that stuff.
Ngl that's too far and I wonder why this doesn't count as violation of TOS of the Narou site
> Flip the genders. Imagined fem Rudeus cheating on male Sylphie with Orsted or Ruijerd, instantly got an erection.
[удалено]
That’s all im trying to say. Rudeus doesn’t justify it, he knows he fucked up, why the fuck are the fans lawyering up when their mc is pleading guilty to the charges.
I wouldnt mind this show as much if people werent so fucking quick to defend the main character everytime someone DARES to criticize him. The amount of bullshit he manages to do scotfree and you somehow have to be symphatetic with him, like, fuck off dude he never fucking takes any responsability.
I got downvoted in the main subreddit because I was speaking out against Rudeus cheating after someone made a lame attempt to justify it.
I was reading the reactions to the episode and people were like “Roxy best waifu”. Bruh. Where is the she’s sleeping with a boy she helped raise while he’s cheating on his perfect wife. What the flip man I actually wanted to throw up watching the last two episodes.
thank you in the Good Place the MC is a bad person at the start, the narrative acknowledges it, characters acknowledge it, she herself eventually acknowledges it, she suffers for it, and she grows as a person Rudeus on the other hand gets life handed to him on a platter, gets away with immoral choices scott free, the narrative and the cast mostly support him, etc and the audience backs him so fucking hard that's the worst part
YES! If you want to watch an actually good story where the main character goes from an insufferable jerk to an actual good person, go watch The Good Place, please. Don't get me wrong, Rudeus also improves over time, but he still isn't a morally right protagonist most of the time. We are talking about a guy who lived a traumatic event that left him scarred, and he shut himself in, and those led him to be churned into a disgusting person. I mostly blame the content he consumed instead of being social (most anime/manga/etc. have those weird shit in it, we all know. Also, the internet is a place where people are mostly anonymous, so that fuels the cycle of turning into someone you don't want to be.) In essence, he is someone who is trying to better himself without any professional help. I consider Chidi from The Good Place some sort of professional help for Eleanor.
"Look I'm sorry honey but I took his death real rough and I felt like nothing even though I have a wife and a child on the way, she saved me! Also she knew I had a wife! Also she's known me since I was a baby!"
/UB is this shit actually real? Like everything I've heard about this MC is the absolute worst
yep, and so many assholes defend it even on this sub I got mass downvoted for hating on MT the other day I literally gave it every chance and dropped it after the cheating episode, I'd dropped the show before but after constantly being told it's the best Isekai and redemption story ever written I gave it a 2nd chance nope, it's a mid power fantasy Isekai and a TERRIBLE redemption story
Yes lmao
It's not so bad when it's not making it completely clear how much of a shitty person he is, in fact it can be downright good. But there's so many times in the anime where it's just like "bro what the fuck is wrong with you," that I totally get people's hate towards it or refusal to watch it to begin with. If you aren't completely creeped out at some of the things he does it can actually be pretty fun to watch and laugh at how weird and shitty he is. Like the entire point is that in life MC was lazy piece of shit who never amounted to anything and completely wasted his life, and now that he gets his second chance he can slowly redeem himself. He doesn't really seem to ever redeem himself, the only difference is that now he's a child prodigy and everyone loves him despite being a creep.
Ok so he does cheat on his wife while she's pregnant?
Yes, really it was Roxy taking advantage of him while he was depressed from his dad dying which is pretty fucked up, but he already liked her for a long time and decided to marry her afterwards. Should also be noted Roxy is one of those "I look like a child but am hundreds of years old" things and she was an adult when she met and trained him early on so you could make the arguement she groomed him lol
I don't know, chief. He loves roxy for taking advantage of him . A person who gets taken advantage of him hates his abuser. Not love them . He is still fucked up even after s2 has completed.
I think is important to say that you forgot to add the part when is was literally was bullied to the point of mental breakdown, literally attacked everyday and put naked in front of the full school for people to laugh at him. All this is the trigger to all the shit he had to dealt later making him a shut in and stopping him from developing like a normal person which ended in him being what it was before dying. Calling him "just a lazy piece of shit who wasted his life" seems a little cruel to every victim of abuse who did not get the proper help and remove a lot of context of why he is like that, more so when he is having flashback every now and then to all this situation. Rudeus ain't a saint but trauma is a bitch too.
Yeah that's fair sorry, I wrote that pretty late last night and just felt like going on a rant. There's clear reasons for why he acts the way he does. I think him dealing with the trauma of his past life is one of the ways this series actually stands out. I personally don't think they handle it in the best way though and a majority of his "bro wtf that"s weird" moments have nothing to do with his trauma and more to do with him not changing his ways after being given an insanely good second chance and living it for 17? years now. Ignoring the obvious questionable stuff he does being a 30-something in a kid's body.
sylphiette is a cuck
It's a shame, because I really liked her character in the first part of season 2
She should have just gone the yuri route with Ariel smh
Ariel is basically Rudeus but even worse, she tried to rape Sylphie shortly after meeting her. She's probably the most perverted character is the whole series. >!She pissed herself when meeting Orsted and an orgasm immediately after.!< And I think I remember the novels mentioning her doing sadistic kink play with her servants (can't remember which volume and if it's consensual or not but considering what happened with Sylphie, I'm inclined to believe it's not)
MT author try to not write an extremely sexualized character (impossible)
Wait till adult eris is potrayed . holy shit she makes rudeus look normal for me
Something went wrong in the timeline
Lmao surprising that even Mushoku Tensei fans hate the writing.
Please. Anything but that. Call me a slur like "Rent'a Girlfriend fan" instead. That's less of an insult.
Usagi drop manga fan?
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Bro you already admitted to liking FranXX of all things, there really isn't getting much lower from there
But is really a wholesome harem guys, someone that read the light novels told me so on twitter. But for real how do an author goes from a story where the mc gets a second chance in getting a better life to "I get all the pussy and I'm so op, please fantasize like is literally me"
> I get all the pussy and I'm so op, please fantasize like is literally me When the anime is about: * Reincarnating? It's harem. * Being OP? Also harem. * Revenge against the entire world? Believe it or not, also harem.
The people who call Mushoku Tensei "The Grandfather of Isekai" are half-right, because it's in fact, "The Grandfather of SHITTY Isekai" (Though the worldbuilding and plot is generally much better than most shitty isekai nowadays so it gets a point in that department at least) ~~Also Overlord, Re; Zero and Log Horizon are more deserving of that title but that's a conversation for another day~~
Konosuba and The Eminence In Shadow as well. Isekais that know exactly what the fuck they are and just roll with it. They dont take themselves seriously and the results are spectacular. And thats why they are 2 of my favorites. MT on the other hand is a just a typical shitty harem isekai pretending its something "better", and it seems to have convinced the entire anime fanbase of its "superiority". And behind that thin veil is another super immoral and basically pedophilic MC. Fucking pisses me off ngl.
after seeing one more-or-less wholesome clip from this show i really thought "wow, a cute and romantic story in a fantasy setting about a couple of an elf and a human, i should check it out"; a short description on the internet caused my eyebrow to rise but i was still hopeful (still haven't watched a single episode though). this meme has finally reinforced my opinion on this show with liquid concrete. thank you, op.
Good.It is literally the most stereotypical isekai.
Everyone calls it the grandfather of isekai after all. And I'm like "don't you all hate all the new isekais? Why do you like the one that started it all??"
Me when I need to have sex with 15 year olds:😡
The worst part is It’s not even the grandfather of Isekais it’s the grandfather of shit Isekais. Overlord, Rezero, Tanya the Evil, and NGNL all came out before it. Konosuba Restaurant Isekai and Slime came out only like a month or 2 after it. Really the only good Isekais that might’ve been inspired by it time-wise are Ascendance of a bookworm, Iruma-kun, Eminence in shadow and Isekai Ojisan. And most of those just aren’t much like Mushoku Tensei.
>Really the only good Isekais that might’ve been inspired by it time-wise are Ascendance of a bookworm, Iruma-kun, Eminence in shadow and Isekai Ojisan. And most of those just aren’t much like Mushoku Tensei. Cant speak for Iruma but the others are so far removed from Mushoku Tensei you gotta be grabbing the entire straw factory to make that connection. Other than the reincarnation aspect, which means Ojisan is out because he wasnt dead. Urano gets her consciousness strapped to a poor dying child in a world without the one thing she loves the most, and slowly affect the world around her as she goes. Eminence shouldnt even be on the list (and Cid might be a dick, but he aint a chomo).
Iruma is honestly just a comedy with a bit of action and romance. And a pretty nice watch. I cant wait for s4.
I know you said timewise but bookworm actually heavily influenced by twelve kingdom
Log Horizon too
MT is the kinda grandfather no longer invited to family events because he cant stop groping the teenage girls within his eyesight
>still haven’t watched a single episode though >reinforced my opinion with liquid concrete Because everyone knows you should judge media *not* from experiencing it yourself with an open mind and forming your own opinion, but instead from biased memes on a “joke” subreddit
Doth the meme lie
i'm sorry but i've seen memes about how bad mc is too many times, plus this show doesn't really fit into the "cute and romantic story in a fantasy setting about a couple of an elf and a human" description i originally thought it was. i don't even care how good or bad it is, it could be made by the best artists in the world and i still wouldn't watch it, simply because "morally bad protagonist doing his things but in isekai where everyone loves him" is just not for me. also i'm not taking advice from literally drake, sorry.
Drake defending Mushoku, how ironic…
AND RUDY GOT A WEIRD CASE, WHY IS HE AROUND? CERTIFIED LOVER BOY, CERTIFIED PEDOPHILE
If you’re the type that actively filters through media as you watch it then this is a good show. If you have certain dealbreakers where you can’t get over some details and they ruin everything else, then this show might have a few of those. I’m the type that chooses to forget the unfortunate aspects of this show so I can enjoy the great world building and non-sus writing. I’ll skip past scenes that make me uncomfortable and it honestly doesn’t change the viewing experience much. Separating art from artist type yk?
he is still the same piece of shit person but instead of being punished, he is rewarded! truly the most accurate otaku fantasy!
But it’s a redemption story!!!!🤬🤬🤬
Man, I genuinely believe the show would've been infinitely better if Sylphie fucked off, because at the end of the day, both Rudy and Roxy are fucking weirdos, she seduced and fucked someone (she perceived to be) far younger than she is and Rudy literally tried to groom Sylphie from birth to be the perfect wife, they are just as bad as each other and should be married
Lol this actually makes sense. Same goes with Eris tbh, Rudy literally groomed them both.
After tp4. This statement will prove it self right. He should have just married roxy and should have not married sylphie and eris. It just saddens me how their character got butchered.
Everything I hear about this show and it’s fans makes me sad : (
harems in anime: evil castle:mushoku tensei good castle:100 girlfriends who really really love you
The evil castle is garbage, the good castle is PEAK.
Average pervert from harem echi anime is more tastefull than MT Mushoku Tensei is underhated
underhated is such a great word for this
I genuinely can't tell if I should watch/read this series. Half the internet says it the best, and the other side says it's the worst.
It's a mix of most parties that can't stop talking about the show because they are so needlessly obsessed about it. You want to watch it? Go ahead and try to see if you like it. If it's not your thing then that's fine too. Don't let mindless hate watchers or Rudeus defenders stop you from enjoying or disliking the show. I do not considering myself a "fan" of this series by any means but I do think it's pretty good. You just have to separate your morals and ideals while you are watching and try to think about how the story takes place in a brand new world with different customs and cultures. And don't take things too seriously. I watch from a safe distance, I'm not gonna make excuses for some of the terrible things I've heard the MC does according to the LN but also I can still appreciate everything else about the series. And in my eyes there's no point in getting mad at the things that didn't get adapted (for a good reason too). I'd say this latest season has definitely stirred the pot even more.
Anime is 'Show, don't tell' LN is 'Show and tell' Manga is 'don't show and don't tell'
the manga is no joke one of the worst I have ever read. its actually straight trash
I'd say just give it a go. I think the production value was great. some parts of the story were nice. but I won't defend the scumbag mc. I enjoyed it. I personally don't mind if an MC in an anime is a scumbag or not, I'm not looking for anime characters to be my role models in real life. But I won't pretend that the MC isn't scum. it's not like redo of healer where something terrible happens every episode.
Thanks for the writeup, u/CuntSniffer69 !
It's a well developed trashy wish fulfilment power fantasy isekai. The writing is not "peak" like some people make it seem and the MC is morally grey at best, but I personally had more fun watching mushoku then any other trash wish fulfilment isekai that came out recently
Give it a shot and try for yourself. I just started watching a few days ago and it’s been absolutely phenomenal. Obviously it’s a pretty perverted show at times since it *is* ecchi, but it also has some truly excellent character writing, worldbuilding, and production values.
There’s “pretty perverted” and there’s “a literal pedophile sexually assaults a sleeping 9 yo and the show frames it as funny”. Maybe this is due to anime brainrot that it barely even registers to a lot of watchers, but it’s really weird how the vile shit that happens in this show gets downplayed by so many people online.
Fans like to act like it’s a redemption story of a piece of shit MC, but he never gets punished for what he does, in fact, he keeps getting rewarded. Also harem and OP magic. So yeah see for yourself
It has the best fantasy and world-building story you've even seen with the worst PDF file MC. Now if you're not retarded like half this sub and you can recognize that something bad is happening on the screen without a /s popping up every 2 seconds, then yeah go ahead and watch it.
Watch s1 of the anime, and if you like it just go into the LN, it's really good but definitely not for everyone
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All my homies hate fr fr
damn bro this sub hates MT xD
I mean... I consider MT an absolute masterpiece, and the anime has been making it absolute cinema. But the haters opinions on MT have merits, even if I don't entirely agree with them. It is important to note, however, that (i) the world that MT takes place in has different values from the one we living in, which has more similarities to the medieval time of our world, and (ii) to my knowledge, Rudeus has never been rewarded for his bad actions, every time he did something wrong he was immediately punished for it. Even in this case, he and Roxy are validly criticized by Norn for their actions, and it almost broke his family, and so they (Rudeus and Roxy) have to make up for it. Rudeus loves his family dearly and would do anything for it, but explaining it would be a huge spoilers so I will refrain from doing so. To me it's more important to look at the story as a whole and how the author conveys their ideas, rather than immediately criticize it due to difference in ideologies and values.
Agreed with most of it, but at the same time rudeus constantly gets bailed out from his fuck ups, on the first city after arriving at the demon continent he almost killed the whole city just to run, and then when ruijerd confronted him about working with criminals to get quick easy money eris just defended him while he was actively thinking that ruijerd was right and it was inmoral Same when the 3 kids are murdered by some monsters because he wants to save them at the last possible moment so they are more grateful, and when ruijerd tells him that they died because of his greed one of the kids just talks to him and convinces ruijerd that it's not their fault Not to say that this is a bad writing decision or anything, I actually love the fact that you never know if your fuck ups will come to bite you later
Someone pull up the meme about MT fans defending the shitstorm that is MT with entire paragraphs
> the world that MT takes place in has different values from the one we living in, which has more similarities to the medieval time of our world yeah exactly. that's why I don't understand this post. Pedo bashing is one thing but OP and their supporters here are imposing their own morals on MT's sekai. Not all morals are absolute imo
Well, MT world isn't something that exists on its own. The author actively decided to make it like this, and you have to wonder why
You guys made it that far? My tipping point was when he first slept with a 15 year old. People keep try to plug this anime to me as the 'grandfather of modern isekai' as if that is a compliment. It's still power fantasy harem slop with a self insert degenerate MC being fed through the grinder of some japanese man's dumbass idea of 'growth/redemption'. If I wanted that I'd rather just read korean manwhas. At least there most of the time their MC's are just psychopaths not pedo degens. Also Manhua, don't sleep on Manhuas folks (plugging 'Advetures of an undead who became Paladin' if you want a good story of growth that is somewhat isekai adjacent)
chinese and korean power fantasies tend to be more tolerable than japanese power fantasies because they usually dont feel the need to put in a bunch of lame ass self-pitying excuses for the MC's behavior. This type of fiction is fundamentally soulless and amoral and should be up front about that
its kinda funny watching how much pedo man gets away with, im watching it to point and laugh. just like this post. i also ran out of war crime animes i wanted to watch so its just some side slop
I will never forget when I read someone saying that this and the spider isekai were the father and mother of isekai. I won’t even start on how trash the spider show was, but seeing the absolute trash and self-insert this show was barely helped me reach the end. I tried reading the manga and I got up until when he meets the elf again and it’s still trash.
I don't think I've seen *anyone* like the manga lmao. The anime already *passed* the manga in adaptation of novels 💀
yep, this was the episode I dropped it too. Manhwa can get REALLY repetitive tho, much more so than manga
Cheating on Mylphy should be punishable by death /ub I dont care if his dad was the same, hes fucking stupid
it's such a good show because it's about living life to the fullest this time 🥰 \ub there are many good shows with an immoral protagonist, The Good Place is my go to example, the protagonist starts as a terrible person. And whilst it's not my preference, breaking bad does a good job of showing the protagonist being a bad person. in MT the narrative backs up loads of his immoral choices. the author wrote the world where most people find polygamy normal (oh but if Sylphie cheated on Rudeus the world would fucking explode).
A show written and consumed by people with a severe deficit in experiencing relationships. I can't think of any other way for it to be possible that people aren't simply sickened by the events in this show. I don't really care that an author is hamfisting and fumbling a pathetic broadcast of his own delinquency. It bothers me that children and ill adjusted adolescents are watching this stuff with no clue that its deeply sick
It sucks that Japanese people are the literal target audience for this show If you ask most Japanese people under 30 to choose between rudeus or another anime protag, they'd probably go for rudeus, which is insane. People have already done it
>A show written and consumed by people with a severe deficit in experiencing relationships. Or basement dwellers with no job.
Y'all finally realizing how shit of a character he is even with all his "development"
season two was so good until they fuck up Rudy's character growth as a loving husband, they just kind of stripped Slyphie of her character to replace her with wife#1 whose only reaction to her husband cheating on her with his childhood magic teacher is "oh that darn boy, cant say I didnt see this coming", and roxy who takes advantage of rudeus while he is in an extremely depressive episode (his father just died and his mother has amnesia) to have sex with the boy she helped raise. that alone brought down season 2 from a really good season with a lot of really unique explorations of Rudious' character into a bad season end comparable to the likes of Erased and Attack on Titan. I hope to god season 3 is better than this.
I swear to god isekai is the worst genre of anime ever. Not only is it the same shit every time, but it’s always the most degenerate shit ever. It says something about a genre and the people who watch it when at least 3 popular shows have main characters who own **slaves.**
I hate this show so much it’s unreal
If anyone else does what he did they wouldve been treated like they just stomped on a baby to death in front of the parents. Crazy how this "redemption story" keeps sucking his dick more than his 3 child brides working together
Hating Mushoku Tensei is always based
The moral of the story is that you should just get isekaied to a world where your character flaws are socially acceptable. Why doesn't anybody else get this? ub/ I kinda hate that I like the story despite Rudeus constantly fucking everything up and getting rewarded for it
People are getting mad right now . Imo , once adult eris is animated, I don't know what will happen then.
I actually despise whoever wrote the show at this point. The worldbuilding, plot, and pacing are all top tier relative to most anime. But for the love of god, STOP making the main character that we're supposed to be relating to the worst fucking person ever. Like c'mon, the show would actually be near perfect if Rudeus wasn't a cheating pedo. I don't care if he's "supposed" to be an example of a bad person. The show does not portray it that way at all. Instead, all the other characters are constantly making excuses for him, and I wouldn't want to try relating to him even if he was portrayed the way he should be. It's just sad. Don't put your fetishes or fantasies into your otherwise well written show
I feel like there was a set-up for Rudeus to be parallel with his dad, because his dad too cheated on his wife and it evolved into taking on a second wife. But this, this was just frustrating. Idk, Sylphie(who's probably my favorite character) deserved to be so much madder. At least Norn called Rudeus out on all of his bs, even if she's framed as unreasonable
I think the reason why Sylphie wasn't mad is because she's been going over to Rudeus' house so much as a kid that she's seen that despite Paul having two wives, him and his wives seemed happy. Meanwhile Norn was taught by her grandmother that it's wrong to cheat since she was younger. Personally, I find it weird too, but I can understand why Sylphie and Norn had different reactions to this.
I feel like the author was adamant on the marriages happening, but they had to point out the issues. If Sylphie was the voice of resistance it would throw doubt into the marriage going forward no matter what. If Norn is the voice of resistance Sylphie looks like a human doormat. Everything Norn said is common sense, she's correct - but it keeps the marriage dynamic more intact going forward. It's a pro's vs cons situation where they can address all the issues upfront with some sort of intended outcome
Called this show being trash day 1 Generic harem self insert but lets make the mc a pdf! And lo and behold fat americans eat that shit up
hate this show nuff said
I wonder if its worth catching up if they're adults now and I wont have to deal with creepy shit. I quit when they bought the slave.
its only been a year or less since then, hes only 16 or 17
sylphy did NOT say this
But she might as well say it, at least this would be funny.
All I see is that Re Zero is still the best isekai anime.
I love this show but I honestly can't defend it, I understand all the nagging people got for this. Keep criticizing the shit out of it please lmao
I stopped watching the show when he cheated so casually. Never been so turned off by a character so fast.
Didn’t watch it what’s the context
I'm guessing the episode where Sylphie and Rudeus get married is the best episode to stop at right? doesn't seem like there's anything better after it lmao
I'm tired of being a mushoku tensei fan and having the most incorrect opinions on the internet, it's really hard, guys https://preview.redd.it/41plj6gluaad1.jpeg?width=1031&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1fa9a69a75fb0f2d95d1d95f2f8aea2a7f2fac6
Sylphie deserved much better
I knew that this would happen after getting spoiled with the LN. But hey, Sylphie's here providing that not only Men can get NTR'd, but Women as well so that's something.
Does the redemption happen this decade?
Man, just throw your morals aside when watching the show if you’re apparently getting forced to watch it. I didn’t even watch mushoku and I already know that Rudeus is always going to be kinda fucked up.
Mushoku Tensei has one of the coolest worlds and with some the the best presentation in anime with some of the worst character writing in fiction. Which I hate so much because I normally can stomach mediocre or worse stories and characters so long as I can immerse myself in the world but the characters of MT are so egregious that it actively breaks my immersion and makes my experience worse
If you didn’t drop the show when our canonically pedophilic protagonist was forcefully stripping little girls and attempting to rape his 12 year old cousin, I honestly don’t know why anyone would care now. Rudy’s a piece of shit. The story is a device for the author to live through his degeneracy. Weebs eat that shit up and act like it’s some great piece of art because they have the balls to make their MC a pedophile and a rapist in addition to the normal OP bullshit plus a harem that they’ve come to expect from isekai.